to the crimean theme, so that we do not have such cases as, for example, there, excuse me, there is some low-grade humor there, there is a diesel show or something else related to the crimeans, this is unacceptable. the second direction that i see, in particular, if we are talking about this, let's say, russian world, is to turn to the international telecommunication union, to turn to certain, to... appeals from the ukrainian side regarding the use of certain algorithms , which will allow influencing the russians' use of the radio frequency resource for their propaganda, that is, in the direction that it cannot be used, well, and the third very powerful mechanism, as i see it, is sanctions, it is to add these people who produce this equipment to this, and this er... project cannot

exist without equipment , add them to the list of sanctions, first in ukraine, then world sanctions. in fact, this is a very powerful mechanism, and the russians, well, they feel it, that's the main thing, when they take away your money, when they take away your market, and you can no longer exist there, it just ceases to exist and any technical support of this project, these are the three areas that at least need to be developed, mr. volodya. and maybe some additional mechanism will be involved here? you know, when we talk about countermeasures by enemy unmanned aerial vehicles, we are talking about means of radio-electronic warfare, that is, there is always countermeasures for any action, can we technologically, i don’t know, set up some equipment that would be able to intercept this russian signal harm at least, so deform, well, you know the idea, unfortunately here is more to the technical... letters, but from

the information that i saw from the guy, they can't influence this moment, why can't they, because the russians deleted, well, under this project, русский мир, they use their own satellite on which, on which they put a pool of these information channels, which are essentially propaganda channels, and this satellite, it's actually in the sky in a... a completely different direction from the satellites that the open access ukrainian channels, therefore, unfortunately, by technical means to somehow cover it with some kind of cap like this, well, a radio cap, unfortunately, there are no technical possibilities, in particular i don’t see them, ugh, you see, once the ukrainian scientist serhiy korolev together, by the way, with the crimean... who

helped him, took them into space , and now they use that space, including for propagandistic sabotage against ukraine, so we have to fix it somehow and in other ways, tell us what we can do, huh, i think that first of all, you know that , it's not my level, but ukraine needs its satellites, its relay satellites 100%. that lybit , which has not taken off in our country for many, many years , unfortunately, it did not take off thanks to our neighbor, the occupier, who, wherever this lybit remains, this should become , you know, very difficult, bitter, but a lesson in order to act not after the roast cock pecks, but before this cock does not happen. ugh. mr. volodymyr, one more question. which will concern, well

, actually those, once even representatives of ukrainian media of a local nature territories of the temporary crimea, which chose the russian peace for themselves, so to speak, and now they are washing the cities not only of the residents of the temporarily occupied crimea, but also actually carry out their propaganda activities on the territory of the temporarily occupied southern regions of our country in general. we speak. with the representatives of the prosecutor's office and the prosecutor ponochevny himself noted that each individual case will require additional study, that is, whether this or that journalist was aware of what he was doing, this or that anchor or anchor that with his mouth, through tv screen, she commits a crime there against the state of ukraine, or against her fellow citizens, in general, or in your opinion, as

a representative of the national council on television and radio broadcasting, we should somehow unify our approach to these people, because war, because war and participation. in the propaganda line on the side of the enemy, it would be the same as if the troops were to take direct part in the enemy? well , you understand, mr. panachovy, he spoke from his side, from the side of a person who deals with criminal proceedings, and there criminal proceedings are proceedings connected with the fate of a person, well, it so happened that even there, even if a person created or did something bad there. only the court can recognize her as a criminal, there is no other, and this is a principle, this is the principle of a civilized society, in our case, regarding unification, it is most likely impossible to do this, but i will note that the law on the media is about the media, in particular there is such a point , that if

it is established that in relation to a certain person or a certain media, a certain person related to the media, there will be either the initiation of ... criminal proceedings or a sentence passed, which has already gained legal force, this , let's say, figurehead, he will not be able to take any further part in the work of the media on the territory of ukraine, i can say that the national council is conducting some work in this direction, of course, that we let's not talk about it now, because if we tell about it, they will know about it, we don't need them to know about it yet. the people it affects, but it's a really long job. the only thing i want to remind those who do this in the crimea is that they should carefully review the materials of the nürnberg trial and will look at the number, let's say so, of those

propagandists who were sentenced, including to execution after this neuben trial, if they want to repeat their fate, well, that's their choice. mr. volodymyr, is it not worth it, in your opinion, at least to create, compile and publish a list of working propagandists, citizens of ukraine, including those working in the temporarily occupied territories, or it seems to me it's not impossible, uh, look, in fact, this list is made for you to understand, but i wouldn't make it public until a certain point, i'll explain, it's procedural. because while a person does not know that something is happening to him, it is quite simple to record his actions, if, as soon as a person finds out that something is happening to him, he begins to mask his actions, and this somehow

complicates the situation of attracting him to responsibility, so i wouldn't be in a hurry to make this list public, it will be made public when it is determined about this person... the evidence is collected, and there is already a certain, let's say, procedural moment which will allow her to be brought to justice, so that she cannot go abroad later and say that there is some kind of political persecution against her, you know, they already go abroad with ukrainian passports, for example, the former director of the racist propaganda channel millet, just in i forgot his name, i just can't remember now, he went... to the united states with a ukrainian passport, so i know this moment, it's actually one of those moments that are very difficult, because you know that unfortunately we there are no legal agreements with the united states on the extradition of criminals, but i can say that for a certain time he will

feel safe there, but the situation will change, i hope that this person will still get... to us and gets his sentence ugh. and literally at the end, a few words with your permission about the progress of the mental and cognitive de-occupation of crimea. when that time comes, we understand that preparatory work is already underway. the ministry of education and science of ukraine opens a curtain for us, as they will be to work with minor residents, in particular, in crimea in this direction. uh, what are the main points you would highlight here? in fact, cognitive de-occupation is not a specific moment, it is a very, very, in my opinion, a process stretched over time, and it is the beginning of cognitive de-occupation, as it may sound, it has already begun, because

now, what is cognitive de-occupation, this is a change in the consciousness of the population of ukraine regarding the events related to crimea, because let's be frank for... that part of ukrainians, crimea is the sun-sea, or bureks, i was relaxing there, for such people who were born there, especially for the representatives of the karvin people, the karvin peoples of ukraine, this... this is the only territory where they were formed as a people, and this moment is very important, that is, we need to understand that, for example, let's take crimean tatars, they are not some other people from another history, from another planet in general, they are part of the ukrainian nation, which has a common history with ukraine, with ukrainians, with ukraine, it was not always pleasant for us there and everything else, but it is a part of... the ukrainian nation, and therefore it is not possible say we and they, it's all us.

this is one of the moments of cognitive deoccupation, if we start to realize these moments now, then in the future it will, well, it will make it much easier, firstly, and secondly, this, this is the beginning, you know, when, how they say that the ice has melted , that is, and further, further on there will be such a large glacier and it will be easier for us, because the russians are using this very moment, they killed... with us a wedge, they show that we are historically completely different peoples there, that we there is one people with them, but it is completely different there the people who constantly have something like that, in fact , this is a problem that needs to be solved with the help of cognitive de-occupation, so it has already started, it is already happening, but this, but it has been working, mr. volodymyr, since the time of catherine ii, when we , have already begun to generalize with the tatars, who... live there, well, on the volga, by the way, earlier, many

peoples of the empire called tatars, simply as busurmans, that is, we have to say that we are crimeans and ukrainians, and this is our common history, and there was much more to her and to her good than bad, everything that was bad, it did not work in favor of either the crimeans or the ukrainians, and any disputes there, they were always used only by muscovy to... in order to destroy both those and others, mr. volodymyr , you are more like that, yes, moreover, i am literally repeating this, these disputes were not only used by moscow, they were actually always financed and tolerated by this moscow in ukrainian society, so we need, well, no matter how it looks, leave from muscovy, thank you, volodymyr lyashenko, a representative of the national council in the autonomous republic of crimea and in the city of sevastopol, joined our conversation, and what aydern said about, these are important, it seems, such

small moments, simply about how we perceive each other, as we call each other, not to make elementary mistakes in each other's languages, this is also extremely important, this is education, it's almost like saying that let's assume, not ukrainians, but ukrainian slavs, that's full of nonsense, that's how i perceive the name this, crimean. tatars, what kind of tatars, where are tatars from, yes, and right away after the break, we will definitely talk about what is happening in the educational system of our country, and why rationalization is not always good, in particular, when it comes to such sensitive points as relocated universities from temporarily occupied territories, why the merger of tavria national university with any other higher education institution of our country is a very debatable issue, and now it is under... it is happening at the highest level, all this in a moment. hello,

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we continue the joint project of the tv channel and the atr tv channel, together beraber, with you khrystyna yatskiv and ayder muzhdabayev. and as promised, now we will talk about the processes in the educational process in our country. and let's start, probably, with what is happening behind... a certain optimization in the context of higher education institutions, this is connected with the not the most pleasant, unfortunately, symptoms that arise from the war, that is, a smaller number of... applicants in general in ukraine, higher education seekers, this leads to the fact that some higher education institutions become ineffective, and their existence, well let's say, they impose an additional burden of the financial plan on the state, but here it is very important, you know, to separate the sinful from the righteous and understand where this optimization can really take place, and where this is a story

about the almost liquidation of one of... the oldest universities in our country, the higher education institution that was relocated from the temporarily occupied crimea is the tavri national university, which is currently under the idea of ​​merging with mogilian university, as far as we understand, but i don't know how much it is from a professional point of view, how it looks, like optimization , maybe people who came up with it there, they didn't mean anything bad, they wanted to do it as well as possible, but... it's just that i don't look at it as an educator, but as, what is the effect of this, well, let's say, counter-propaganda , ukraine, what will russia say to the residents of crimea, what will the propagandists say, here is your ukraine, and the only crimean university, which it, well, legally

and physically, partially evacuated and, therefore, will restore. his work in kyiv, it cancels it, destroys it, everything, no nothing, no one needs you, ukrainian patriots in crimea, that is, it is a signal to whom, to whom and what signal , that is, it didn’t work out, you know, it didn’t work out somehow with this, something went wrong with this university , well, let it, let it, let it be gone, that is, the only, eat, the only crimean higher, how is it possible to discuss this at all, you can make any reform, change there... i know the personnel there, change anything, but destroy the very idea of ​​the crimean university? well, i'm sorry, maybe i'm stupid, but somehow it doesn't sit well with me. but i want to tell you that the russians, before that to use the narrative that you just mentioned, they should probably think about what

they have already done to destroy tnu as such, they were there too, they also thought that they were. can arrange and unite a whole bunch of universities into some there, some there crimean academy, as it is called now, the word is not recognized anywhere, i do not know what weight these diplomas have in general, it is very unfortunate that such a story is happening, gigantmania, but you studied there, yes, you had such an experience, listen, how is it possible, how is it possible to close a university where christians studied.' it it's just some kind of illogical phenomenon. let's join in our conversation, try to put accents like this. nataliya pipa, people's deputy of ukraine and secretary of the verkhovna rada committee on education, science and innovation. contact us. ms. natalya, congratulations, glory to ukraine. glory to the heroes, have a good day. well, look, when we talk about tavri university, i first

of all, in principle, look at everything i do in education from the standpoint of the quality of education, yes, because it is from. above all, accordingly, it is necessary to look at the quality of education, which it will be in tavrivskyi, which it is at tavrivskyi university, as far as i know, it is planned to create a crimean church at the kyiv-moholyan university, which is one of the best universities in ukraine today, and the position of the crimean tatars was very important to me in this, and i believe that medzhelis is just one of the strongest representatives, as well as tamila tasheva, as the commissioner for crimea issues, in fact... all these people say that the creation of the crimean center in mohylianka, actually, and not in some mediocre university, actually has to raise the quality of education, first of all for the crimean tatars themselves. as of today, tabrid university, well, it is difficult for me to give evaluations, because i have not personally analyzed each program, but from what i know, there are only 14 or

16 students who are getting a degree, who are studying. the crimean tatar language and there is only one teacher who can teach in the language of the crimean tatars, and accordingly, there is a challenge in this, that is why i first of all take this position, i do not know what the final decision will be, i have heard different parties and delved into the details, the most important thing is what will happen to the quality of education in this institution and will there be a law, or is this actually what is planned for the crimean tserkovylad academy? rise, for example, will increase the number of people who will learn the crimean-tatar language, who will work to ensure that we in ukraine, the crimean tatars and the indigenous people, know at least 10 basic words. and whatever it was, if not in the primer, then i don’t know, teachers for the third or fourth grade, or at least with the study of the history of ukraine, mrs. natalya, it’s hard not to be with you agree, by the way, before the broadcast

, ayder and i were just exchanging ideas on the topic of transliteration, that is, we are currently on the path of liquidation of the only one, relocated from the crimea back in 2016, tavria national university, and not elementary things that... at the scientific, expert level, it is simple to do systematically, and the state should have paid attention to this all these years, and not allow a situation where oh okay, the university is not very effective, let's destroy it, the university has a hundred years of history, ms. natalie, i agree with you, me i understand that you are an expert, and so am i, i am against generalizing there somehow, accusing someone without any reason, but - what has brought this university in exile to such a state, it is definitely someone's fault, and it is definitely not the fault of the students, yes

and not people who want to learn, want to learn the crimean language, on the contrary, we have to develop this education, we have to encourage more people, students, teachers, ukrainians, ethnic crimeans, it does not matter, because i know that ukrainians learn ukrainian, the crimean language love it, right? we have, if any optimization is taking place, make it clear that this is temporary, that after the return of crimea, the university will be restored, and here are the following nuances, i also want to hear your opinion about it, maybe you have heard about it, maybe not, then it will be on benefit to everyone, including the audience, well, for example, this university must be preserved and used as a brand for its return, because the brand... it is part of the greek project of catherine ii, who introduced it to change all names in the occupied territories of southern ukraine and crimea , tavria, tavrida, tavriyskyi

department, tavri university , this, well then, it is, you know, it is approximately like little russia, it is of such, such an order, so the names, many people in power, in education, do not think about this either, so what, but one should think, and another, for example, elementary language reform has not yet been carried out. this is no more than a week of work by specialists. in our country, all transliteration from the crimean language into the ukrainian language goes through the russian language. the most vivid, most shameful example is bagchi-sarai. no bagcha-saray exists, there is a bagcha, there even the sound ge is the same as common ukrainian-crimean sound. garden shed. a garden is a garden. a barn is a palace. and, for some reason , it is still broadcast through the russian language in ukraine. bagchii sarai is another such and such a household example cheburek cheburek is not from the word cheburashka this translation is completely stolen from through the russian language transliteration or berrek or berrek berek is

a perig and chi is a sound when something is fried well , these are two excuses that we are so reduced to the fact that well, actually, all these discussions, all this work must be very systematic, and we really hope that against the background of kyiv, we... in this work will be carried out at the mogilian academy in a special center, but should we instead destroy the tavri national university, of course, in terms of the quality of its education, i am sure that many ukrainian universities are currently enrolling, but perhaps we could work on this, ms. natalya, and, well look, here, of course, you look at different indicators, specifically, in this case, so we talked about tavrivskyi, then i analyzed the situation, that it should go... actually to the benefit of the crimean studios, i would called the crimean tatar studies, because all these things that you say, they are actually, well, if they were to take place, and about

the transliteration, i completely agree with you, and about the fact that in fact we do not know basic things about the crimean tatars, and they should have known about it as one of the indigenous, the main , in fact, after the ukrainians, the indigenous people of ukraine, accordingly, i agree with this, and actually, if i were to say, it was not the kyiv-moholyan academy with a good one. school and academic, then it would cause much more discussion, but there is support here majelis, well, you have to understand that we as a state currently spend 48 billion hryvnias on higher education, 47 billion hryvnias on all universities combined, which is more than 200 universities and clearly one billion on the shevchenko university, which once managed to get itself apart from a separate column in the budget of ukraine, and accordingly, we as a state must distribute these 48 billion more efficiently, because money is actually very limited, and the effectiveness of higher education, well , makes us wish for better, so my first and foremost

goal is that people who want to... study and crimean studies, crimean tatar studies and this region of the south had a good base, and i think that over time, if this base is called a center today, but over time it will grow to the level of a university, then it is also possible to continue this scientific school, it just seems to me, what if it were just to change completely now and most of everything the university has will still be less effective than joining the kyiv-mohyla academy, i am certainly ready. to communicate, and i think that everyone who is a specialist, in particular on this issue, will be able to continue to teach at that center, and i am sure that the students will be able to complete their studies, well , that is, definitely get a diploma, and it will be guaranteed, so i looked at these criteria and then i would analyze the quality of education, panitali, i see that you are very such an initiative, caring person

, that is why i appeal to you and to all those involved to raise these issues, the crimean university, in principle, it should exist and can be, even there in advance some, we are already renaming some settlements that are de facto located under occupation, we can and to create some kind of prospects for crimea, for this crimean university , so that it does not look like a closed issue, a final solution, so that it does not look like that for anyone, neither for crimeans, nor for ukrainians for... one more thing, i am not a very great professor and teacher, but i can just give lectures for hours about crimea, about elementary things, there is nothing complicated, there is nothing too complicated, even we need to discuss and finish this issue in order to stop calling us tatars, i about this i've been saying this for several years, president zelenskyi, by the way, and poroshenko also called us crimeans, kremlins, it's correct, because tatars

are... it's a synonym for the word barbarians, in fact, it's of such colonial origin, thank you, you see, i haven't learned it yet specifically this statement, i will now know, thank you very much , you see, there were no crimean studies at the university either, unfortunately, well, you see, i even emphasize the crimean language, crimean people, crimeans, ukrainians, i do not use these narratives that russia brought the empire to us, because she called, for example, azerbaijanis tatars, caucasian tatars, baku tatars, but they got rid of it. i will, thank you, and i want to remind you that the second remark is constructive, and that is exactly how now the rector of tavria national university was a ukrainian naturalist scientist, volodymyr vernatskyi, who refused to emigrate, and in the 20s , when soviet power was finally established in crimea, actually reorganizes the institution into

the frunza university of crimea, liquidates de... faculties, reduces funding, resembles some processes, yes, that's what vernatskyi said about all this: "i believe that the university of tavria is the only free university in the entire territory of russia at that time, then such were the realities, because it fully embodied the principle of freedom and autonomy, which was always strived for universities. the policy pursued by the soviet government towards universities is the deprivation of their autonomy and their destruction. this is a quote by volodymyr vernatskyi, who is a genius, an absolute genius." i think it will be very appropriate, ms. natalie, we thank you very much for your participation in the work, for the opinions that were voiced, and we will carefully monitor how changes are taking place in the educational system of our country, we understand that it cannot be the way it was before, but the main thing is, you know, there is a grain here to separate from the chaff and not cause unnecessary damage, thank you, nataliya pipa, people's deputy of ukraine and secretary of the verkhovna rada committee on education, science and innovation. that's it

and we'll finish our good program, by the way, it was so enlightening, enlightening in part, we really hope that it will be useful for those people who are watching us in the temporarily occupied crimea, hold on, stay safe, this is the most important thing, and we believe in ukraine, see you again, that's all, thank you, i don't understand, i didn't see the conspiracy. video, as they come in, he was shot there already to the last, and we have already seen that he is being tied up, he is being put in a trench, we started actively with this one, you can say that the carousel is doing resets, the third russian attack aircraft is lying next to him, he is right next to we had him, the pilot kevin, he was given an order, he says that it is necessary to somehow get this prisoner out, somehow so that he understood and got out of there, he...