i do not trust the sbu, which listens to political opponents of the authorities and journalists. unfortunately, we have both the sbu and the sbu. these are the realities, and of course, it is very sad that at a time when some officers of the sbu are a large part of them, they have great respect for this, protect the homeland, risk their lives, others carry out criminal orders and engage in unacceptable activities in any normal country things. thank you, mr. oleksiy, ms. yevgenia. i trust the affairs of the security service of ukraine and the affairs that must be taken into account for that work, which, for which we must thank, and definitely since february 24 especially, a lot of things that the officers and employees of the sbu did and are doing, and by the way, the same department that we criticize, not without reason and really.

the behavior of these employees is shameful, but in the same department there are people who , for example, work on the topic of the moscow patriarchate, yes, this is the same department, and the security service is often called the service of god, for a reason, so you cannot devalue the work of those who works well, but of course, when there are such glaring violations, you can't be silent about it, and well , it seems to me... no one is silent. thank you, mr. oleksiy. what is sbu? this is the security service of ukraine. that is where they are engaged in protecting the security of ukraine, in accordance with the basic law, in accordance with the functional law, and with other regulatory and legal internal documents. of course i, well, i want to, i want to trust them. i hope they are really within the framework. their powers there to protect

the security of ukraine, but, unfortunately, for me, as in any country, for many of my colleagues and ordinary citizens, there are many other factors when saying, the sbu is not engaged in its main affairs, this certainly also applies to the scandal, which, well, well, another one, i personally was not surprised, the only thing that surprised me was that it was not professional, how unprofessional they acted, it was childish in general, it was refers, of course, to intervention. redistribution of business , raids on business, here is my advice for them, well, i don't want complaints now , advice, guys, mind your own business, thank you, mr. oleksiy, i have already mentioned this matter to the team, the journalist team bigusinfo, tracking the team, yesterday denys bigus and his team released a film about how 30 people tried to shoot.

illegal information about journalists , about operators, about those who were there at the training and corporate event of the journalist team, now the verkhovna rada of ukraine summons the head of the security service of ukraine vasyl malyuk to a report on the wiretapping of journalists of the bigusinfo project by the special service, malyuk himself has already announced the dismissal of the head of the protection department of national statehood, expressing outrage at the actions some of his employees (quoting malyuk). unfortunately, the implementation of measures to combat organized drug crime led not only to receiving information about the involvement of one of the newsroom operators in the distribution of narcotic substances, but also to the public distribution of video materials. i emphasize that such actions are unacceptable and have already caused a number of personnel decisions. among other things, i sent a request for the dismissal of the head of this department, and the president of ukraine signed accordingly on january 31.

decree. mr. oleksii, i am addressing oleksii honcharenko, in my memory there were many temporary investigative commissions, obviously this case can also end with the creation of a temporary investigative commission so that those who will be in this commission have access to secret materials in order to understand what actually happened with by this team of bigus, and why 30 people were engaged in this and quite unprofessionally, because the journalistic team took and laid out an entire department on the shelves about, well, simply. as children, excuse me, and in this situation, a completely logical question arises, in fact, who, who gave them instructions to do this, that is, it could not be that 30 people took off, came to install cameras, video cameras, state property, with state funds, apparently they rented these numbers, with state funds, there children were walked and carrots were bought for them. to whom the case of

these children did not reach, because they were part of this special operation, that is, why only one head of the department was dismissed, why why is there no answer to who is from the leadership of the sbu? authorized it, who gave instructions to the leadership of the sbu, and was there a court decision about this? well, it's a perfectly valid question , we have an investigation, the national police investigated there, and now, i understand, the prosecutor general's office has announced that the sbi is involved, let's hope that we will hear answers, although i am pessimistic here, because i have my own experience when two months ago... an obscure internet repairman came to my apartment in odessa, before that the internet didn't work for me for several days, and suddenly it was still sunday, a storm, a snow storm, there was a natural disaster in odessa. man calls and says: well, i want to come, i want to come, and such persistence surprised me, and

i called my provider and asked, did you send us a master, they say, but you didn’t leave an application, i say, i didn’t leave, they say , we did not refer anyone to you. ah, i called back a couple more times, clarified, in the end this person comes, behaves strangely with such a push-button phone for 100 hryvnias. all this is recorded on video, everything i say, any person can go to my youtube channel and see how i, i then everything i explained it, i called the police, then, by the way , it was very funny, at the moment when i called the police, i told this master that i was calling the police, then he takes another phone out of his pocket, a smartphone like this, calls somewhere and says, he calls the police and hangs up, i say, with whom, this is not a video, i say, but with whom did you talk, he says with his manager, well, i say, well, yes, well, this is a normal conversation with the manager, yes , that's how we imagine her, in general, he wasn't surprised at all, she kept coming the police discovered that he had a fake

id, just for a second, the national police opened a criminal case on the fact of illegal wiretapping, establishing, therefore, the relevant one, but so far two have already passed. months, well, there are no results yet, although everything is there, well, the person, everything , documents, videos, everything is recorded and so on, so unfortunately, this is not the only example, and when the sbu tells us: oh my god, what are you doing, they that's what they're doing, but i'm sorry, there's no need to make absolute fools of us, and to say that this means that they investigated, and here is the department for the protection of national statehood before the investigation of drug trafficking , as they say there, how did it get there to investigate drug trafficking, well, this... this is all a delusion, the sbu, unfortunately, in our country, during the war, is engaged and expends its energies and efforts to politically prosecute sisk for opponents of the authorities, oh, this is what you show, thank you, this is the internet overhaul master who came to me, so

this is exactly what he is saying, this fantastic conversation with the manager, it seems, yes, so he is engaged in collection of incriminating material on political opponents. the persecution of journalists who investigate corruption, well, this is the reality, is there a need for a temporary investigative commission, i think it would certainly not interfere, without a servant of the people it is impossible to create it, with us on the air the deputy head of the servant of the people faction, i would like to hear mrs. yevgenia, as a servant of the people, supports the creation of a temporary investigative commission to investigate the binfo case and not only the possible other use of the security service of ukraine for... political opponents and journalists, in fact, i wanted to ask this, ms. yevgenia , that is, put the dots in this story, how do you see how it can develop, well , to be honest, to this instrument, well, i do not

treat such, well, i have not seen such the tsk, which really proved or replaced... what the law enforcement agencies should do, here after all, if the sbi opened a case, this already indicates that it is an excess of official powers, that is, well, one of them and it will be necessary to ask, and in general, what should be the instrument for control, parliamentary control of the special services, then it should to be a separate committee, and in fact, well, i am sure that already in the next convocation of the verkhovna rada, such a committee will appear, i am not sure that according to the regulations there it is possible... to do it now, but it is possible and it is possible now, because it is such a standard, because in nato countries, that is, the special services, they are under the control of a separate committee, and not somewhere there is a law enforcement committee, somewhere a defense committee and so

on, and this is correct, and we really need to complete the reform of the sbu, because let's be honest , well, it started, so we voted there in the first reading. the law before the full-scale invasion, well, it is clear that during the full-scale invasion they already decided not to make any such big changes there, but it is obvious that yes, that... and all these economic crimes should not be in the security service, and it is obvious that well, what we hear there about drugs, well, maybe some, if they are drug cartels, there is some kind of smuggling on a large scale, but well, obviously it is not not this case, but really there should be consistency of the national police, but again we've got there are two committees that will actually continue to deal with the topic, this is the committee on freedom of speech and our humanitarian information committee. politicians, and we received the first answers to our requests, but it is obvious that we will continue this, and

in fact, i think that society will also be on this topic, and journalists will keep this topic under control, so it is better that the whole parliament will deal with it, than just inventing some other tool. by the way, not only journalists and society will be interested in this story, i said society, as well as our western partners, oleksandr kornienko is talking about how this case... will be perceived abroad, and what could happen as a result of this, let's listen. for our partners, it is not the events themselves that are decisive, but our reaction to these events, that is, when we, for example, from certain events that cause, well, questions in society and maybe in partners, although we do not know it to the end, just there we don't do anything, and no conclusions, that's for sure. bad when we draw conclusions, change legislation, or we make personnel decisions, or

both, it creates a better image for us as a country that draws conclusions from its problems, from its mistakes and learns from these mistakes, everyone made conclusions, there was complete communication, we saw it all and on the part of the sbu, it is quite serious, and of course we will wait for... the next steps on the part of the sbu on the internal adjustment of better quality work. well , oleksandr kornienko says everything correctly, only, well, i would like to hear today, for example, in the evening address from president zelensky, that he thinks about it, because he is the guarantor of the constitution and basic rights, including the right to freedom of speech and journalists, this is the marker, ms. evgenia, you mentioned that it is very... important for the countries of the european union, it is it is very important, and this control is important

over the power structures, but there it is impossible to imagine that 30 special agents are following some journalists in some complex where they are resting, spying on them, and the journalists are taken and simply taken by these special services, well, like children, i am different i can't to say, they just put them on the shelves, and this is probably a shame in general for those people who work in this department. mr. oleksiy , i am turning to kucherenko, mr. kucherenko , what do you say about the possible conclusion of this story, because we would like some conclusions to be drawn from these stories, some personnel conclusions to be drawn, so that in the end it did not happen again, because i have been working in journalism for 30 years, i observe the same thing, the sbu, journalists, surveillance. eavesdropping, eavesdropping, well, well, they go home they call, as they used to do to me

, you know, but we would like, excuse me, let's not simplify , we would like much more, but i personally, as a person who worked in the authorities, in the government, in the cabinet, in the parliament, as a majoritarian was and so on, as an adult, the father of five children, i would like to act professionally in my state of ukraine. precisely state institutions, so that they act within their competence, so that they do not depend on this or that phone call from some clerk, whose last name no one knows from some offices or other such structures, well , incomprehensible, you see, i am the state leaning on pillars, the pillars are institutions, namely the security service of ukraine, the prosecutor's office, the courts, the antimonopoly committee, ators, etc., these are the institutions that should not work under

telephone law , and according to the law, according to other normative legal acts. i reread it once more, the only thing is that i am addressing my colleagues, maybe i am not remembering something, i am reading in the law, i am not mistaken, article 13: the head of the security service is appointed and dismissed by the president of ukraine, that is, even without the approval of the verkhovna rada, if i'm wrong, i'm done. it's just what i'm getting at, well, it's absolutely clear that the one who appoints and dismisses, well , he has influence on the relevant institutions, and here he can aim. what a mistake that there really is an extremely limited space for parliamentary control here, extremely according to the security service of ukraine. and now with regard to tsk, you understand, tska was thinking, you understand what it was thinking there in the first and second reading, when there were completely different deputies, well

, patriotic, state, men, professionals, this very powerful indeed. an extraordinary body of parliamentary control, which , according to the law on temporary special and investigative commissions, has very powerful powers, and which, in its own words, is even more than law enforcement agencies, because it can , within its competence, conduct virtually anything there investigation, and if suspicions of a crime are found there to transfer all this, but this is a public procedure, well... remember how in the same united states, how the commissions of the united states operate there regarding that or some other potential crime, yes , by the same president, by trump or by someone else, remember how they act, this is an event of national importance, no one will even think of an official not coming to this tsk meeting, some dates are not false shows and so on. in our country, unfortunately, the tsk was really

reduced, this mechanism is extremely ineffective today and... there are already dozens of them working there, and you know, i constantly wonder why this is so. it is my belief that tsk, in the conditions of such monopolization of power as it is today in ukraine, the law needs to be changed so that this right to create a tsk is not for 226 deputies, but for 150, i.e. in the opposition, you understand, because today any tsk, and i headed the tsk, though i am not investigating, but specifically. commission, there will still be a majority of the servants of the people, they will vote for the agenda, they will vote for what requests to make, how to react, and accordingly, when the majority dominates in - that or a temporary investigative commission, it is absolutely clear that some effective parliamentary control

it will be, well, unfortunately, impossible, because this is, as the investigators say during the investigation, you ... wait, who will be presented to us as a victim, you understand, what scale, what rank of the responsible shooter will be appointed, well, i myself am interested, but once again i want to say who appoints, he controls , and the president of ukraine appoints, the president appoints, the verkhovna rada of ukraine at the proposal of the president and look, i remember that we

voted, do you remember that you voted, appointments, i then look the law is on the website of the verkhovna rada, i remember it exactly we voted, but at the proposal of the president , that is, then i apologize, i withdraw, so does the ministry of defense, the minister of defense is nominated by the president, well, there are certain positions or there, he specifically opened the law, you understand, article 13, but dismisses, but dismisses the head of the sbu, the president himself , yes, yes, yes, the president has the right to dismiss the head of the sbu, he does not need the verkhovna rada for this. country and released by the president of ukraine, that's right, thank you, well, i don't know, mrs. yevgenia, maybe you'll add, well , i'd just like to add that just the president when it came out, well, actually, this is it, well, the first video, do you remember, it was back in january, and it happened immediately, and he

caused a stir, well, it was immediately, i remember that the video was released in the evening, the next day. there was a reaction, there was also a reaction from the sbu , but we can check it, and i am convinced that it was there immediately the next day, well, that is , the night actually passed, and in the case of the dismissal of this director of the department, it happened on january 31, and here too exactly the procedure from the head of the service, but signs the decree to the president of ukraine, sir, can i say one word literally just right. it's very interesting, you know, when the head of this department was fired on january 31, i was honestly surprised, i thought, well, nothing, well, you and i all understand that he didn't come up with this himself, well, it's... absurd , that the director of this department was sitting and suddenly decided to arrange this whole thing just like that and all by himself, well, you and i do not believe in this, he received the appropriate instruction, the instruction to

the security service came from the office of the president and, in principle, about himself says bius himself, he is there even in his investigation, he directly mentions the surname yurmak, he says that i can't prove this, but they tell me this, we really can't prove it yet, but i want to draw your attention to the fact that he was just released. now everything is clear to me, and this is also emphasized in the investigation of bigus, that is, when the sbu realized that they had messed up a lot, and that in fact this whole story had already been raised by journalists and was being investigated, only then, yes, indeed, in advance, there was a decree about resignation of the director department, but not at all immediately the next day, after this information appeared, but quite a few days passed between the time it appeared. this video, how the reaction began, how it was immediately obvious to everyone that it was done by the special services, and it took days, days, days before the director of the department was fired, and now we understand how it was, that is, the sbu

just found out, it is clear that they burned , it was necessary to find a sniper, the director of this department was appointed as the sniper, they hope to pay it all off and further, which seems to mean no one there is nothing, but as for the high-profile dismissals, i will remind all of us of the dismissal of the previous chairman of the security council. ivan bakanov, ivan bakanov was released by the president of ukraine last year, it was the year before last summer, well, a long time ago, in general, he was released, after the beginning of a full-scale invasion under a very harsh article, involving inaction that led to great human casualties, well, that is, if it was the type of the south of ukraine, because the enemy passed there, and the sbu had a whole network of agents, as the sbu tells us, but i have a question, okay, they were released on a very tough article. and what we have bakanov in jail, there is a case, an investigation, recently we learned that bakanov has registered again in

the poltava region as a staff member, he is fine, we do not know anything about any criminal cases against bakanov, nor any punishment for bakanov. this is the person who was responsible for security in ukraine, and at the moment when it turned out that there was a whole nest of russian agents in the security service, and with the highest sabers, and that's all and... there are none, that is, well, or he , sorry, the russian agent himself, or he was so not unprofessional, that he saw through all this, but it really all led to terrible consequences, we have an occupied south, thousands of people died, millions lost their homes, but i do not know of any punishment for ivan bakanov, maybe someone knows, mrs. evgenia , please tell me that your faction will support the idea of ​​simply... regarding the investigation of this case, once again, well , just say clearly that you support the creation of a temporary investigative commission, you will demand that the security service of ukraine

still explain who gave instructions to follow journalists, because one director of the department simply cannot do without. well, today i personally supported the issue of inviting mr. malyuk to the verkhovna rada even without the votes of our faction. it would not be possible to vote with all due respect to my colleagues, and i cannot confirm one question about the tsk, because the head of the faction delegates or does not delegate the members of the faction to one or another investigative commission, as far as i am concerned, there are other instruments of the verkhovna rada for such control and there are various committees, our free speech committee, not even more the law enforcement... committee as well as the security and defense committee, they can exercise such

control within their powers, but i believe that a joint meeting of several committees is possible . law enforcement agencies, national security, freedom of speech, maybe in this format. with various committees, only i have one request: do not appoint marianna bezugula as the head of the temporary investigative commission, as was the case with wagnergate, you know because in principle, probably, mariana is insane, well , it won't last in the current situation, this is my wish, as a journalist who wants to know the truth about this, ladies and gentlemen, let's take a short break, after a short break, we'll return to our studio. there are discounts on helpex of 20% in the pharmacies psylansky, pam and oskad. there are 10% discounts on afida max. 10% in

podorozhnyk pam and oskad pharmacies. a separate platoon of the sapsan unmanned aerial systems of the state special service of transport. the viewers of the tv channel are asked to join the fund-raising about. and technical equipment for our unit , thank you, glory to ukraine, to the heroes, glory, vasyl zima's big air, this is the big ether, my name is vasyl zamai, we are starting, two hours of air time, two hours of your time, many important topics today we are with you let's discuss for two hours to learn about the war, right now we will

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estoy hoje friends, this is the verdict program, we are working live, my name is serhii rudenko, today we have as guests yevgenia kravchuk, oleksiy goncharenko and oleksiy kucherenko, people's deputies of ukraine. during this

broadcast, we are conducting a survey, friends, we... ask you about this, do you trust the security service of ukraine, if you watch us on youtube, vote yes or no, write your comment under this video, if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphones and vote, if you trust 0.800 211 381, no 0800 211 382, ​​all calls to these numbers are free, vote, at the end of the program we will tally up the results of the vote, reboot in... who leads from zelensky the president of ukraine announces that such a reset will take place, and he did this in an interview with italian journalists, when he was asked whether the resignation of the head of the armed forces of ukraine valery zaluzhny will take place. ms. yevgenia, do you know now what the personnel scale of this will be? the reset that the president is talking about, because we already saw yesterday the first resignation of yulia laputina, the minister.

of veterans affairs, that is, she has already written a letter of resignation, but obviously this is a large-scale reboot, probably this is not all, i understand correctly, well , when there will be official or decrees, obviously then the concept itself can be discussed, but it is so obvious that it will be some kind of comprehensive decision, not point changes, but regarding the cabinet of ministers, indeed, well, we will vote on this resignation. it will soon be here it is obvious that there will be an acting minister in the ministry for the time being, and it would be good if , well, there were such broad discussions as to who should head the ministry of veterans, because it is a very, well, let's put it this way, a position that, obviously , it should be.. .