the fact that malevich is part of the history of this academy, that malevich taught at them, that is , some of the teachers did not know this at all, how could this happen, why did this happen, how could this happen, by the way, these are the lectures of dmitri gorbachev that you mention , we also organized, i was a co-organizer then, and it was actually an attempt to return malevich to the walls of the academy, in fact, when malevich taught in the late 20s, it was a different... it was a different art academy, for a reason, for example, a european the journalist who came to kyiv called kyiv bauhaus, because it was an absolutely unique art school, where volodymyr tatlin, oleksandr bogomazov, mykhailo boychuk, malevich, and a lot of generally prominent artists who gathered within the same walls taught at the same time, and each of them had their own teaching method, it was the period, actually this... yes, it

is specifically 1924, 1930, we have clear dates for this period, when the rector was ivan vrona, he was actually appointed violinist there, and in fact even the appointment of malevich avron agreed with skrypnyk, as we know from the documents, that is, there were direct direct connections, and this is actually this story, which is bright, short and, but bright these six years, it ends in the 30th year, when this wave of repression against avant-garde art from moscow is actually rolling in to kyiv, and because these persecutions of avant-gardes actually began in russia, and from the mid-20s, after lenin died, stalin came to power, when revolutionary art was no longer needed, because the soviet union turned into an empire very quickly, and obviously a totalitarian regime does not need revolutionary art, it is dangerous for it. now we will talk about repressions, but also... i

understand correctly, you are now talking about the fact that these repressions, which were back then in the days of stalinism, are the consequence and inertia of this attitude towards avant-gardeism as well, being forgotten in the modern kyiv art academy, undoubtedly, that is, this is the policy of the 1930s that was introduced under stalin, it still has as a result oblivion and unwillingness to have anything to do with malevich at all, in my... experience, yes since the mid-1990s, we have been trying to convince the academy that malevich is worth at least hanging his portrait on the walls, next to other professors, and i know personally how many times i heard no from rectors, deputy rectors, and so on, as they say that, that is, why, that he is not a socialist realist, that is, like that, and actually, well, that is , they say that what is taught in the academy, that canon is socialist realist, which still seems to have gone nowhere, that's actually it. .. with this abracadabra, which they do not

understand, and for them malevich remains by an incomprehensible abracadabra, actually they renounce this, they do not want to have anything in common with it, yes, that is why it is yes, it is still hostile, it is quite alien in the institute, i cannot say that if there is not a single teacher there, who understands this, and it is worth mentioning that dmytro antonyuk is also in our film, he is an architecture teacher, and actually he is on his own in his office. reconstructed this presence of malevich, he even created a myth around it that it was precisely malevich's office, although it is not it's clear, isn't it, but he recreated the exhibition there, and actually this is his personal effort, yes, because he also had this moment when his foreign colleague from sweden, it seems, came there, and she embarrassed him by saying that she knew about what malevich taught in kyiv, he, while teaching in the same walls, knew nothing about it, had never heard of it, and yet this was actually his...

such a rather traumatic experience led to what he wanted to return this malevich, and actually, with him, we tried to somehow legitimize it within these walls, but on unfortunately, it is still not like that, and until now malevich is such a foreign element in the academy, the most influential ukrainian artist is as if alien to the main center of education and art. in kyiv , i interrupted you, you were talking about repressions, regarding malevich, they began when, because he initially identified himself with the revolution, yes, he also called himself a revolutionary, when the persecutions began, actually, well, that is, the revolution as such, and, she, not only was politically, but, here, happened, these ideas are revolutionary, they are first of all formed at the beginning. in the cultural

environment, because people understood that the old empires had to die, and artists, in particular avant-garde artists, tried to build themselves this, this future. without empires, where people are all free, where everyone has the same opportunities, can equally realize themselves, and in fact, these beautiful ideas about a bright future, they were formed among the avant-garde even before the 14th year, that is, in fact, the revolution was not the first, and art was the first, yes, yes, and when this political wave actually appeared, and bolshevism, they realized that they needed this support, and what... something that would visualize their idea of ​​this change for the broad masses, who were often even illiterate, and they needed some vivid images, and therefore, the bolsheviks adopted avant-garde art, they used it because it illustrated this radicalism and changes, but this

changed very quickly, despite the fact that the artists themselves, they very often did not identify themselves with bolshevism. malevich, in fact, according to his political preferences... he was more of an anarchist, and by the way , even before the 19th year, if i am not mistaken, an anarchist was published in the newspaper, that is, it also speaks of his identification and identification in a political sense, then obviously, when anarchism was defeated, it was a reality certain to which he adapted, so he cooperated with the bolshevik regime, he even had a fairly successful career, he, for example, carried out a reform of museums, he proposed to create a network of museums of modern... art in the soviet union, which was based on modern art, they bought works from artists and distributed them to all these museums in the soviet union, that is, in principle, the network of museums that we know, the soviet one, as it were, this is malevich’s idea, he is its manager, let’s say, cultural, came up

with it and succeeded, but malevich, if you read his memoirs and diaries carefully, he was very skeptical of the bolsheviks, he was never a supporter of these ideas, although he had very good connections. some very high-ranking bolsheviks periodically signed in for him when he was there were arrested or wanted to be released somewhere, or were not released from outside the soviet union, but in fact it all ended very tragically for the vanguard of avant-garde art in general and for specific people, for malevich, because when the government changed in the 1920s, they they begin to persecute the avant-garde, first it begins with the capital at that time, leningrad or petrograd... they actually close the institute of artistic culture, which malevich headed for three years, he is accused of killing all mortals and immortals sins, and they actually cut off his possibilities for any activity, and then kyiv appears in his life as the last hope, he is invited to kyiv, given

complete freedom, and even here skrypnyk still had the opportunity to restrain this wave for a certain time , which came from russia, a wave of repressions, a wave of persecutions and... for a few years , this atmosphere of freedom remained here, malevich actually planned to move to kyiv, to move his students, his family, but this opportunity closed in the 1930s year, this wave of repressions arrived, he was dismissed from the institute vrona, all these avant-garde preferences were banned, already in kyiv, although kyiv was not even then the capital, but already in kyiv , all these prohibitions came, malevich was arrested, while he was under... arrest, he was released with the institute, they threw out everything that was in his office, he had his own office at the institute, and that's actually how this story ended very sadly. tell me, please, but he went to berlin before that, he participated in the berlin exhibition, he drove through poland, he got to berlin, because he was

there for several months, and suddenly the soviet authorities order him to return, it was clear to him why. i will now say what i am basing it on, so that it was clear to malevich what would happen to him next, and why he was forced to return, because there is his will of the year 27, and as far as i understand, he was going to berlin and he took some things away, i understand that some texts, some of his own, some works to preserve, and he leaves such a kind of testament in berlin, this is the 27th year, this is the year he left this text in berlin: in in the event of my death, imagine, in the event of my death, or an indefinite imprisonment, and if the owner of these manuscripts wishes, wishes to publish them, then for this they need to be studied and then translated into another language, because being

under revolutionary influence at the time, they can there are strong contradictions with this defense, with the form of defense of art that i have now, that is, what it means is that... first, he understands that he will either be killed or he will be imprisoned, and he says about what he 's under, he's under pressure, i understand correctly, absolutely, why isn't he stayed in berlin when he, when he was called? well, in fact, malevich, when he went on this trip, he had a plan to somehow stay in europe, this trip was originally planned as a trip to warsaw, berlin and paris, paris was his dream, like every artist, modernist, but it was not destined malevich came to warsaw and there he submitted an application for a french visa, in this application he indicated himself as a pole, although he always... wrote about himself as a ukrainian, even at that time, he wrote about himself as a ukrainian, because after the soviet of the polish war of the 21st

year, and even if it was dangerous to be a pole in the soviet union, i suspect that this became known to the special services, so when he came to berlin, he just opened his exhibition in berlin, and literally the next day a telegram arrived, in which there was a demand to return to the soviet union after 24 hours, he was only in berlin for a few days. yes, well, that is, he managed to arrive, unpack the exhibition, hang it , there he also went to the bauhaus for a few days, that is, he was there in germany, well, not long, literally there for two weeks, and so he forced, literally the next day after the opening of the exhibition, was forced to return, that is, he failed, failed to stay in the west, yes, he failed to get a visa as a pole to go to france to get involved there, the poles were not actually there either are not sure whether he is... he works with the bolshevik regime and is not a spy , that is, he is caught, let's say, between two goals

, between fire and sword, yes, that is, between two such systems, and what's more, there is a suspicion that in this, in this telegram, there were threats from him loved ones, because he had a daughter, a mother, a wife, his students, who certainly, well, could have been victims of this blackmail, and he... returns to the soviet union, he is arrested, for what? eh, there are memories of the family that when he returned to moscow, he was immediately arrested and kept in lubyanka for several days, this is an unreliable, well, unconfirmed archival story, because first of all, russia never opened its archives, especially the archives of its special services , so it 's impossible to check it with the wall at the moment, it's based only in the memories of his family, maybe and maybe he was a few... actually under this arrest, but in fact, what such a significant

arrest that was in his life, it happened precisely in the 30th year, that is, 2.5 years after returning from germany, and the actual reason for this rest was a trip abroad, because he was accused of espionage for the benefit of germany, he had some stamps from that trip left with him, which, when he was arrested, were found and he was accused of espionage for the benefit. germany in espionage. and here is this country, what, what is it did, actually broke the man's fate, because he will die literally in five years from cancer, but in principle, obviously, the experience also in some way damaged his health. and here is this country after everything, says when, when he gains world recognition and world fame, she says: this is a russian artist, and everywhere... malevich is spelled russian, this is my introduction to that, to ukrainianness, malevich,

tell me , please, what are our arguments that this is a person of ukrainian cultural identity? well, we can talk about a number of, let's say, things that defined malevich, his personality, his views , his attitude to art, in addition to the very fact that in... in kyiv, and in kyiv on zhilyanska, this is important, because it was the environment of the old community, across the street from him lived the tragomanovs, the kosachis, that is, it was the environment of people who actually dreamed of ukraine, and actually lived this ukrainianness, ukrainian culture, and even despite the fact that it was a polish family, yes, if among the ukrainized such poles, impoverished nobility, it is obvious that there were connections, and that too everything would have been even if the environment, which... mixed with each other, then the malevich family lived until malevich was actually 18 years old in

the ukrainian villages, and this forever determined his attitude to life and, in general, some of his ideals in life. he writes in his autobiography at the end of his life that he admires the whole life of the peasants, he likes their life, their houses, their clothes, them, their food, their art and in general ukrainian peasant women were my first art teachers, this is his quote about... he imitates them in everything, he believes that actually this is a real life, a free life, he says that they live harmoniously according to nature, that they leave in the morning. singing there to the fields and working in the evening with the sun, he also returns home singing, that is, for him it is some kind of idyll, which he, being a man there and before his death, he knew that he was dying, he considered this to be such a paradise on earth, his own paradise, that is, this ukrainian childhood was for him the best thing that happened in his life, and

then he very quickly understands that he has this is the desire to be us... yes, he is very interested in it, his mother supports him, teaches him all kinds of crafts, he actually learns from ukrainians, from ukrainians as well, and he wants to master this profession, and it is also connected with kyiv , actually, first of all, the one where he sees the picture for the first time, it was a painted shop window, but he describes it like this, that it was a girl sitting on a donkey, peeling potatoes, and he was struck by how this is this... the thorniness of the artist, it was so realistic, yes, that it was possible to confuse and to think that this was a real, living girl, and it affects him for the rest of his life, yes, that is, he remembers this image all his life. in kyiv , his mother buys him his first set of professional paints. in kyiv, he enters the mykola murashko kyiv drawing school. in kyiv, for the first time, he enters the workshop of the professional

artist mykola pemonenko, to whom he will later appeal in his works, and actually the central theme of his... such, let 's say, not necessarily realistic, but objective painting, these are two peasant cycles , these are the 10s and then the late 20s years, that is, the peasant for him, the ukrainian peasant whom he saw in his childhood, is a certain, well, the main actor of his paintings, and, that is, he constantly turns to this theme, returns to it already mature, already after suprematism in this so-called supernaturalistic ... his period at the end of the 20s, because this topic does not let him go, and he believes that it remains relevant for him, the paradise, the ideal that he sees for himself, he sees precisely in the village. next, of course, that is , we are talking about those things now that have formed malevich, who influenced him. next , it is very important to what extent malevich influenced the ukrainian context, the ukrainian

environment. and here it is very important for us, actually these 20 years, when it is already formed. returns to kyiv, and he begins to teach at the kyiv art institute, he actually reformats education, because he is invited not only to teach, but also to give such methodological instructions, to help rebuild this system, because malevich, he was also a theorist, and he built his own pedagogical system in art, yes, that is, he gets into this kyiv environment, he communicates with the new generation, he publishes. in his series of articles on the latest in the new generation , explain what the new generation is? new generation was the main magazine in the 1920s, probably in the entire soviet union, which was devoted to contemporary art. it was published by mykhailo semenko, actually the leader of ukrainian futurism, who, being a young poet, already knew about

malevich's suprematism and dedicated to him a number of suprapoetry, it is as if suprematism in poetry, i.e., this connection between semenko and malevich... in general, it has lasted for decades, and in fact, at the end of the 20s , they are already communicating directly, and semenko invites malevich to be published in a new generation, here we are in this second book, which , which i want to show today, yaryna tsymbel actually publishes for the first time the proof that malevich had a direct connection with the new generation, here is malevich's letter to poltoratsky, in which malevich, for example, sends his regards to semenkov, yes, that is, if we we speak about a certain circle of friends, and that is, friendly communication, some kind of such interaction, there is actually a connection with lesya ukrainka, because malevich teaches at the institute together with svitozar drahomanov, svitozar drahomanov is the second cousin of lesya ukrainka, he has a camera, he photographs objects and things and malevich's objects

and paintings, actually there at malevich's request it is sent to certain magazines, yes, that is, this is an environment that... they communicate very closely, they have joint projects, they do something together, they dream of something there for the future, and , that is, it is very an important factor, when malevich was very closely inscribed in the ukrainian environment, again, his last lifetime personal exhibition took place in the kyiv art gallery in the 30th year, and it was such a wild success there that extending it for a month, and and then if malevich hopes that these paintings will be sold and remain here and in ukraine. for ukrainians actually, that is, there are a lot of topics that connect and leave malevaša actually embedded , if it sprouts in this, please tell me about this artillery of some kind in the village of verbivka, where this artillery was commanded by oleksandr exter, as i understand it, what kind of artillery was it

and what did malevich have to do with it , yes, thank you for mentioning this, it is also a very important plot, in fact, if when malevich, yes, he did not live in ukraine, but this connection would still be the same if it continued and continued. it is about the farm in the village of verbivka verbivka - it was natalia's estate. natalya davydova was actually the wife of the son of the decembrist, she herself was from an ancient cossack family gudym levkovich, and it is necessary to say that this ancient cossack family, it also has its durability and its history, in them, traditionally, this family was associated with the creation of textiles and various crafts, they had a workshop that was engaged in paintings even in ancient times. of the hetmanship, not with paintings, i apologize , with embroidery even during the times of the hetmanship, and here is natalya davydova, under the wave of such modern trends, as we would say, at that

time, decides to open an artil in her village and help the villagers, actually the inhabitants of this village, to find their own instrument earnings money, realization of some creative work, it was fashionable then, many landlords created it. artili, this is cherkasy, sorry , yes, yes, yes, this is now cherkasy, it is not far from smila, kamianka, these are beautiful places, i went there recently with research, and i highly advise everyone to go, see these places, they are incredible, and in fact, davydova herself is an artist, she is friends with oleksandra ekster, oleksandra ekster is another great figure of this time in kyiv, yes, because she actually lived most of her life in she implemented her projects in kyiv and in kyiv, and here... oleksandra ekster, she is the art director of this artiel, she forms the concept of this startup, as we would say, yes, of this startup, and she invites various

contemporary artists to cooperate, which she knows from various cities of the soviet union, already then, and from, no, even then, the russian empire, i apologize, because we are talking now about the 15th year, yes, that is, actually, when this russian empire was already shaking so much , but it still holds. buy and ekster invites malevich, whom she also invites knows, well, they communicate and meet at joint exhibitions, and malevich, creating his suprematism, first gives it as sketches for embroidery in the village of verbivka, that is, before showing it at the famous 010 exhibition in petrograd in december 15, he gives these sketches probably sometime in the late summer or early fall, because the exhibition. verbivka, it took place in october, that is, in a few months, and these peasant women in the village of verbivka are embroidering supremacist pillows, scarves, some

objects, just useful things, yes, useful things objects, and decorate them with these abstract forms, that is, in fact, if these peasant women were the first, the first audience, the first spectators of suprematism, and they actually began to interact with them right away, yes, they would transfigure them in the form of... embroideries in some certain objects and objects, that is, this connection, yes, it actually has such a multiplicity, i sit above, listening to you and think, lord, what could it be, yes, if not, if all this were not was destroyed, no matter how devolved culture developed, yes, we can only do this to guess, but in fact these are absolutely incredible things, and the exhibition itself, of willow, willow embroidery, it was super successful, it traveled around europe, it... even overseas and traveled and all these things were wildly successful, that is, it is the year 915 - it just what is called a leap, his

leap into objectlessness, i don't know who it belongs to, he or i would have seen it for the first time actually in jean-claude marcide, i don't know whose it is, whose saying it is, what it meant to him, how it , how he approached this, i know what he did all this in secret, yes, because he didn't... did you want to share this creative method at first, because there was a lot of competition in the environment, so you have to understand what time it was, it was such a window of opportunity , when artists could create something completely new in art, that is, it was a moment when realism as a single method had already outlived its usefulness, because new media appeared, a camera appeared, a video appeared that captures the real. as reliably, easily and quickly as possible, and painters, in fact, visual artists, they rethinking why painting then, what is its role, what does the artist do then, and here

they are... inventing each of your separate genres, their own separate direction, impressionism, surrealism, expressionism, fauvism, yes, that is , this period, as malevich calls it the period of the emergence of various isms, yes, futurism, cubofuturism, this is an attempt to find a new meaning of painting, and malevich understood that all these isms are one way or another temporary, that is , it is a kind of wave, yes, here we are working out the idea of ​​movement in painting, is there an impression in painting, so what? well, that's all , you just keep repeating it, malevich dreamed of reaching a new quality of art, he was absolutely convinced of his own mission, he knew that he would make that revolutionary leap in art that would leave him in history, he just lived by it, i don't know, he was convinced of this since childhood, and he did it right away, that is, he searched for a long time in fact, and you can say that in his last periods before the invention

of suprematism, he just... experimented, almost every month he there were some new ones approaches, there are februaryisms, cubofuturism , something else he, he was looking for, it was a huge intellectual work, yes, he tried to embody what he felt, what art should be in some concrete form, yes in some visual image, and then he e working on such an edition of sketches for the opera of the futuristic opera victory over the sun, which they did back in the 13th year, and it was such an extremely experiment, daring, how can you transform the most conservative art form of opera into something absolutely radical, avant-garde, yes, them it succeeded, and actually, i can spoil it here, the feature film that we are currently working on with colleagues, malevich, that's what it 's called, it will be released at the end of this year, and i hope that it will be widely distributed in ukraine, we are actually playing there this atmosphere, yes, this

absolutely no... possible bold breakthrough, yes, into the incomprehensible, and the readiness to encounter an absolute defeat and lack of understanding of the audience, but to make this artistic gesture, this radical and some radical, some difference from everything that was before, and here in one of the scenery, he used just black for a black curtain, it was just a black curtain that completely covered the stage and through it , it means there is penetration. the sun, and he in the 15th year, looking through these sketches, comes across this black square, and he realizes that this is it, that is, he even had a moment when he described what he experienced as such a mystical experience, that is, he he says, i just saw lightning in my eyes, i just something like that happened to me, i didn't understand what happened was happening to me, i couldn't not eat or drink for a week, i just thought about what i had done, that is, it just dawned on him at some point that this is it, this image, and

in fact suprematism. as ee certain certain certain such a series of his works, the one he exhibited in the 15th year, appears very quickly, there were even technological problems, because he did not have time to dry all these means, there is not enough soil, the primer has dried, then they cracked, and now they are looking for some additional meanings in this, although this he was just such a scumbag, he was a technological scumbag, because he didn't have time to dry it all, he just had it on fire. with his hands, he had to do it quickly, quickly, besides, there was competition, yes, he was not alone, there was also tatlin, there were other artists with whom they competed, it was as if this was such an intellectual and artistic environment, very it was bubbling, who will be the first, who will invent something that will impress everyone else, and yes, he hid it, he tried there so that no one knew about it, only two people there knew people, it seems, and his closest friends before the age of 15, and ukrainian peasant women from the village of

verbitka. but yes, speaking of what he actually did, which was this trans radical change, he broke the connection between art and reality, i.e. all art before malevich, it in one way or another appeals to reality, yes, even if it is conditional kandinsky's abstractions, they all equally appeal to reality, because they appeal to a certain psychological world of ours, how we experience something, what sensations, but these experiences, sensations are all equally certain in a way... caused or if they had some emotional impulse from reality, malovich speaks very coldly, mathematically, i would say, very abstractly: i don't even need emotions in order to create something new, color and form and a white canvas are enough for me , everything, i can endlessly create worlds because i have color and form, and on this he bases his system of suprematism, moreover, he...