a project for those who care and think politclub every sunday at 20:10 at espresso. the premium sponsor of the national team represents. united by football, stronger together. greetings, this is svoboda live on radio svoboda. we have already come to the snake itself. the following shots may shock you. news from the scene. live kamikaze drone attacks. political analysis objectively and

meaningfully, there is no political season, exclusive interviews, reports from the hottest points of the front. svoboda live, frankly and unbiased. you draw conclusions themselves. welcome to the channel. espresso. today , the topic of our program is war and weapons - where to get new forces and resources in the war against russia. and there are several components here. french president emmanuel macron caused a real storm this week, stumbling upon the possibility of introducing the troops of european states into ukraine. can kyiv count on such unexpected reserves, or is it simply unbelievable. although macron himself already after that high-profile meeting in paris with... the leaders of 20 countries that

help ukraine in the fight against russia, emphasized again that all his statements, including the dispatch of western troops, were carefully thought out, so what is behind it, we will talk about it in the first part of our program, and in the second part about internal reserves, which we do not take into account, but they still exist, i am talking about the fact that in fact each of our combat brigades is such a peculiar... concentration of information power that connects and mobilizes society, as an example of the third separate assault brigade, and this potential depends not only on weapons, so what is this phenomenon like his use, scale and what effect it can have. my name is serhii sgurets, i am the director of the defense express information and consulting company, which is currently working together with espresso channels to cover the most relevant events in the life of our military.

and the security dimension, and now we have the first guest joining us, this is oleksiy yezhak, an expert of the national institute of strategic studies, mr. oleksiy, i congratulate you, i am glad to see and hear you, in return, i am glad to see you, i congratulate you, of course, i would like to start by saying which i announced in the introduction to our program as macron's statement and his actions should be taken to discuss the issue of possibility. sending units of nato or the european union to ukraine and probing the positions of the leaders of european and alliance countries, because at first it looked like a certain absolute impossibility, but then the minister of foreign affairs of france spoke about the fact that nothing can be ruled out, and the prime minister of estonia also spoke about the fact that western leaders should not rule out the possibility of introducing land forces there troops to ukraine. that is,

it seems to me that this is such an interesting new trend in certain political currents, it has several components and layers, so that you can separate from these statements why it is important, and what consequences it can have? maybe it would be too loud, but i will still say, i believe that such conversations, such and such a discourse are actually the beginning of practical negotiations. terms of ukraine's membership in nato, but this is in the same vein as, for example, our discussions with our neighbors regarding farmer protests, this is actually the beginning of negotiations on ukraine's accession to the european union, about the conditions of this accession , under what conditions, what actually, well, how it will actually happen, what rights, obligations and all that, now regarding how realistic it is, it is real, it is... and i would say naturally every time we

see a situation where the united states changes its attitude towards europe for some reason, and now it is reflected like this. i the situation is now a conflict situation regarding aid to ukraine between ukraine between europe and the united states, always in such periods france takes political leadership, she has taken this kind of political leadership now in order to unite, unite europe for certain goals, and at the same time, why is it important, because in the leadership that is now in europe, in france and ... as always france and germany, in this leadership the roles are slightly different, in france it is political leadership, in germany it is financial leadership, and there is also the element that france would like to pool european resources in the vision

as it sees it, because well enough said , which, for example, the fund about which everyone knows, 100 billion, the german fund on modern. tion and the change of weapons, it is still basically the f-35, american, in france there is a different vision, that is, i want to say that in principle it is natural, what was said, how realistic it is from the point of view, and that it means for the security of ukraine, i would, it's clearly not about nato troops fighting instead of our troops, it's... not about replacing the law on mobilization and everything related to it, it's more about those agreements that now ukraine is concluding an agreement with europe about the automatic reaction of our partners in the event dangers for ukraine, this is the presence, we are talking about such and such forms of presence

that make reactions on the part of nato countries automatic, it is not only a military presence, it is also an industrial presence, it is also various fin'. and political presence, but here i will remind you that in order to fight for ukraine, you need, well, you need such a large presence, and the constitution of ukraine, article 17, item, paragraph 7, seems to say that it is impossible on the territory of ukraine the creation of foreign military bases, that is, it is impossible such forms now now such forms, when there is a certain territory, the flag of another hangs there. countries, military personnel live there under the laws of another country, and there is a special agreement on the status of foreign forces, no, i am not talking about that, it is about the fact that the military presence can be different, it can be special forces, it can be consultants,

advisors, it could be the crews that service the equipment we receive, it could be the engineering various divisions. all this can be, and from my point of view there is no, it is not enough that it is possible, it is already by and large , it is now about which countries are ready, ready to increase such a presence and are ready to take on such additional obligations regarding an automatic reaction in case of danger to ukraine and threats to ukraine, well, of course. this discourse is also for us, we also have to decide for ourselves, and whether we are ready , as a country, well, let's say, a nato country, whether we are ready to accept foreign troops on a permanent basis , essential such and such a presence that will be, with which, well, will be

built into our common defense, this is also an important question for us, i.e in fact, this is such a certain paradoxical situation that no... ukraine is joining nato, and nato is coming to ukraine, and then, in fact, our military-political leadership should probably then stimulate this process, identifying the most promising, most necessary directions and to create conditions so that changes in these areas really take place as quickly as possible, and this will be just the impetus for the activation of those areas that are currently stagnating, because what the french said there is the need to implement cyber measures. protection, demining, production of weapons on the ground, some of them may require a presence on ukrainian territory without crossing the border of hostilities, that is , in fact, this is what you said, explaining the possibilities of actions of nato countries, but what do we have

to do now to to activate this process , what can be the recommendations for our authorities, well, i would say here that what we are saying is, well, it is already from... in the baltic countries, what i mean, in general, our vision, our understanding , what is nato, what do we give units, or more, less, and we put under... the command of unified nato structures in the great war, it remains so, it remains on the agenda, but from the 14th year a different process began within nato, when they saw what was happening, which , as organized russian aggression, a slightly different process was launched in the baltic states, then the ministry of defense of the baltic states, they identified the resources they needed to strengthen their own national. defense even without the participation of nato as an organization, without article five, and then the mechanisms were launched

and the united states and the european allies launched those resources, placed, deployed in the baltic countries and built them into the own defense of these countries, that is, now there are nato units that should come under the command of other countries, which should come under the command of the baltic countries, if it starts . even article 5 is not included, but the russian aggression begins, i think for us, the main thing we can do and the fastest and most clear is to offer to our allies, namely, what resources do we currently lack in defense, well, in addition to human resources, to actually fight on the battlefield, what resources do we have, what are our weak points, where we need to strengthen from staff structures to engineers. of these divisions, where we would need such, well, such a quick,

well, quick inclusion, and accordingly tell our partners, and what we would like from macron’s proposal in practical terms, then in fact , president zelensky’s answer, which was so rather imprecise, probably is a consequence of the fact that we probably have this process going on now, we cannot clearly to say, but we are already considering it. we are looking for the most optimal versions, but then i would like to add that, relatively speaking, the transformation of the alliance there is one way or another connected with the transformation of the european defense industry, especially for the leading european countries, and where there may be new opportunities for ukraine, we have already this has been talked about many times, but the very process of the dynamics of the european defense industry, as it seems to me, creates new and new opportunities in certain aspects, why? should we not miss in this process? we must not miss

two two very important european processes that concern the defense industry. the first is when, when unified funds for purchases, joint purchases are created, when different countries combine their budgets in order to jointly purchase a certain weapon system. and a second parallel process to this when created. these international alliances, european defense enterprises, which these orders must fulfill, these are collective orders, yes, well, for example, yes, the a400 plane, that's how it buys planes, planes for helicopters nato 90, typhoons, eurofighters, because of such mechanisms, when a certain european fund is created, and an industrial alliance is created, on the other hand, which this... collective order fulfills, now we see, there is, for example, the european peace fund, there is

various other structures that unite, well actually what the french say, they say that in europe there are alliances that produce missiles, produce stormshadows, produce scalps, produce, well, taurus, it is more national like that, and and even sempti, means anti-missile defense, they are collectively. they are european, and if there is a good, well, such a mechanism to help ukraine, it is to create a european fund, not an american one, but a european fund, from which the creation of such, the creation of weapons for ukraine by european alliances will be financed, we must not miss it, and in the matter of attracting at the stage of financing and at the stage of attracting our defense forces. enterprises to this joint european production, well, by the way, as i

understand it, france is going this way, because kona talks there about a coalition about artillery or a coalition about long-range means of impression, in parallel it is said that a fund is being created that should use resources for the purchase of these samples, but there is somehow a certain bias in the french proposals for their samples, there this is a french rocket. the french have the impression that the french give a little less weapons to ukraine than to germany, but try to load their defense more, isn't there such a certain, well, dualism in their behavior. the french, there is, of course, that's why it is necessary to see in france what this country is , it is a european political leader, but in matters of money and all these matters, well , they have their own interests, of course, the germans have a lot of money, the french want to use this money to download, download

primarily of our own defense industry, and here we have a big dilemma, because the germans and... and ours and now the czech republic, well , in general, our partners are closer to us, eastern europe, they believe that european funds should be used immediately for , to get weapons for ukraine, where they are, if it is in the global south, it is necessary to buy it in the global south and supply it right now, because there is a shortage right now, the french proposal is that this european money should be used for production in europe itself, including for ukraine, but in europe itself, so it is necessary to combine , i do not think that there is such a universal solution, and it cannot be said that what france says is a universal solution, it is important and a very positive solution, but what is said regarding the defense industry in france, this is rather a joint

defense strategy in the perspective of 10 years, including against russia, and what... germany and the countries of eastern europe are saying is what needs to be done already this year. oleksiy, i would like to ask one more component of macron's proposal. isn't this happening, well finally the blurring of these red lines or i don't know what color the line is regarding the fact that nato should not get involved in hostilities there on the territory of ukraine, and this step of blurring these lines was probably one of the impetus for... these traditionally sharp statements by putin during a speech before the federal assembly, where he began to talk about the fact that if the troops there enter our territory there, realizing that hinting that ukraine is their territory, yes, then this will cause the use of nuclear weapons there and so on, but still, this moment of blurring the lines, does it not exist in macron's statement, or is it my assumptions? i think

it exists, it’s clear, it’s visible, it’s not only one... from the side of france it’s being blurred, maybe from the side of france there is such a political reasoning, well, if russian troops and mercenaries are in france , where, in africa, where french interests have their presence, well, they have the courage to say that they are ready to help ukraine with troops, near the borders of russia, this is an element, not only this element, there is also an industrial element regarding the fact that... unlike american missiles, french missiles can be used against targets in russia, this is political leadership, well, at least against legitimate targets such as iranian missiles, i think no one here will be to deny that ukraine can strike, and even stoltenberg said that, well, you can strike at certain targets, it blurs, that's for sure, and it must be said, this is the biggest

blurring of these red lines today. which putin crossed out 20 there in february 22nd year, the french, yes, it is in a political sense, it is a colossal simply blurring, even the destruction of these red lines, and therefore it is very important in a political sense, in another sense, other aspects we they said that there is a difficult situation with the defense as well industry and with specific weapons right now. but in a political sense, this is a huge step. mr. oleksiy, thank you very much for these important, specific accents related to macron's statement from france's position at the current stage. i think that it will acquire new capacities. thank you very much for the inclusion. let me remind our viewers that it was oleksiy yezhak, an expert of the national institute of strategic studies, where we talked

about the existence of certain external resources and reserves to support ukraine, apart from the russian federation. we see that these resources, well, are acquiring such new trends, extremely interesting from the point of view of the possibility of using the military of foreign countries, eu and nato countries on the territory of ukraine to perform certain functions that are not combat, but which significantly affect the increase of the potential of our armed forces, our defense capacity from the defense to specific tasks related to the provision of the front line, then we will talk about the resources inside. because in fact there are aspects that can also be certain force multipliers when the actions are separate brigades with correct information. accompanied, when even the brigades themselves act in such a way that they create an effect, an additional effect of forces that is perceived in society, we will talk about this in the second part of our program

after the advertising and information block. there are discounts on pulmopriz of 20% in travel, memory and savings pharmacies. premium sponsor of the national team represents united by football together stronger a separate set of unmanned aircraft complexes sapsan of the state special service of transport appeal to the viewers of the espresso tv channel with with a request to join the collection of bones. drones and technical equipment for our unit. thank you, glory to ukraine, heroes. every week

, maria gurska meets with the head of the committee on foreign affairs of the polish sejm, the representative of the polish government for the restoration of ukraine, pawel koval. as always, we talk about the most important things that happened this week in poland, ukraine, and europe. what is being said about ukraine in the eu, how? our accession to the eu will look like in the project to closely perceive the statements of european politicians and as politicians close to the world with maria gurska every sunday at 15:30 with a repeat at 22:00 in collaboration with seestre eu. an unusual look at the news. hello ladies and gentlemen, my name is mykola veresen. sharp presentation of facts and competent opinions. and in america they also say, let's have better roads , we will have even better ones. a special look at events in ukraine will be located on the border of kyiv. katsaps and beyond, what kind of world does mr. norman dream of, can we imagine it? all this in an informational marathon with mykola in september, saturday 5:10 p.m., sunday 6:15 p.m. at espresso. channel

espresso and ukrainian pen present the project of their own names with myroslava barchuk. a series of conversations with ukrainian and western intellectuals who analyze and comment on the most relevant social debates. what news will the guests of the project analyze? this week and actually who will be the guest of the studio, we will find out already this sunday, unequivocally, the topics will be relevant, the guests will be special, their own names with myroslava barchuk. sunday, 17:10 at espresso. we continue our "war and weapons" program. we are talking about external and internal resources, new resources in the fight against the russian federation, and now we will talk about something so unusual about the potential of combat brigades. usually we think that a brigade is personnel, equipment, training, and all of this together makes up, well, the combat potential that, well, we see on the battlefield, but now our brigades carry

another unique thing, they fight, they generate content, we see our boys and girls fighting on the battlefield, the war is closer, we even react to what is said the warriors themselves. we see how they fight with even more confidence than even the spokesmen of those or types or types of troops, this is in a certain way, well , a certain unique phenomenon, but what is also important is that the way the brigade fights, how it accompanies its actions, it creates an additional the effect of power that can cement and strengthen the whole society, for this there are certain markers, there is an understanding of these processes, and how it happens, how it can be scaled, we will talk with our next guest, we are joined by hryhoriy lyubovets, one with heads of the center for communication and content security, mr. grigory, i congratulate you, i am glad

to see and hear, i congratulate you, i congratulate the tv viewers. today we will try to take this one topic that you and i discussed literally on the eve of this program, that our separate brigades, in particular we will take only the third separate assault brigade, which demonstrates... a new approach not only to combat operations, because it is effective and efficient, but he creates such a whole informational field with his actions, and this field has such an impression on society itself, and maybe there are some things here, where the brigade itself correctly caught some existing trends, and this gives the effect of cumulative force multiplication, which we see now in the actions of the brigade, maybe something like this... well, i explain it in a confused way, i would like you to make these main points , what is important is happening around our combat brigades, which are showing the best performance on the

battlefield. you just mentioned the third stormtrooper and said about the novelty, and here i would say first of all that this novelty is essentially, that is , they have been engaged in this for a long time and professionally, it just happened that this legalized potential, and here it is necessary to give - we should also mention precisely that of our general. syrskyi , who supported this trend, because he already in his public generalization spoke about the third assault brigade and the 25th brigade, indicating that these units really did a very good job in a unique way and it worked, that is, what was declared was confirmed the third assault, really world-class, and

here... i would still like to note that for us, scientists, and in our center of communication and continental security and in the military institute, a window in our research center and management, er, we are talking about, first of all, the potential of modern publicity, because this aspect shows how much units can and already... in this example, active, important, and i would say , they are really unique, because the level of the assault brigade, which operates in the first mode and represents it itself, is the most valuable content of the world level, why world level, because we, just researching modern publicity, have reached and can claim that... this publicity,

based on actions under the hood, krasnogorivka and orlivka, this is precisely the level of attention of the world, we call it glo gllocality, that is, the combination of the local with the global, on the other hand, the question of content is precisely the question of the level or place of confrontation and... here we also insist on the fact that modern, the modern confrontation that we , that is, ukraine, is carrying out, it is exactly confronting genocidal aggression, not just a war, not just a conflict in legal language, but specifically genocidal aggression, and this is the complexity of this understanding and the term. show,

prove, indirectly at different levels content, so that our partners , so that the world understands how much the challenge of destruction, or total destruction, concerns not only ukraine, not only avdiivka, the settlements near avdiivka or krynka, and this is precisely the training ground for destroying everyone, why? because today the putinites, together with their practically accomplices in terrorist regimes, are forming a new economy of terrorism and fraud, we immediately rose to a sufficiently high level of perception of the problem, and i would like us not to deviate a little from the brigade, that's why the peculiarity of these m... content

or information things generated by the brigade, why is it the basis of the new army, and why is it , let's say, higher than, relatively speaking, the soviet scheme of management or information dissemination, because relatively speaking, when the brigade generates content, it does not fit into the habits of the soviet army at all, that is, we understand that we have a different coordinate system, so what is the difference between the coordinate systems, when the brigade acts in such conditions, acts, fights and talks about its own. she herself, it's just, well, let's talk, you me stopped, why did i say all this and at a very large high level, because this is this high level of glocality, it requires precisely new tools, i wanted to go exactly to this, that practically we have to produce content, we have it, it just needs to be legalized , it is necessary to systematically approach its presentation, again, why, not because

we are talking with you... does anyone think so, or have we investigated.