unfortunately, there is actually a greater demand for pop projects, especially if they are also focused on a youth audience, or on people who are not too familiar with a certain material, because we are dealing here with soft power, that is, we we are dealing here with soft with soft power, which means music, means dramatic. of dramatic art suggests something to us in a certain way, i.e. makes us a certain emotional image, an emotional attachment to this or that material, and if, say, certain words are used in this context, those, and not others, then we will have a corresponding impression from this text, which will be fixed emotionally for a long time, as it does, say, advertising, if in this context the game is

pale and pitiful, well, it is clear that it will look like , it will be remembered by anyone who will watch this project without critical guidance, without checking it somewhere in some other sources, this person will perceive the stem as exactly that pale, pitiful, and if there are theses about the stem, very strong, by the way, statements about that the blood is on his hands. that, accordingly, he is a wimp, that he is responsible for the fact that many people died because of him, that he betrayed someone, that is, these are very strong images, which in this situation should be approached very carefully, because it creates a negative impression about person without reinforcing it, it is very easy, then it will be much more difficult for us to whiten the stamen

and, let's say, it is projected onto the whole other culture, because the reader who remembers the stamen is exactly the one who sought to become at all costs minister of culture allegedly, as it looks from this, from this project, he will not actually buy a book of an anthology of poetry, which is called from techyna to zhadan, because he will understand that techyna is clearly not the one he is interested in, the same things and the same. inaccuracies there appear in the text and in relation to historical circumstances, you understand, when you actually take on the material that names, which refers to the shot revival, and this material is aimed at wide circles, an important point is to say then, at least to hint, who shot it revival, in this project, unfortunately, at this moment is precisely about who is to blame for the shooting.

revival , there is not even a hint, that is, a person who finds himself in front of this material, he receives information there that a civil war is going on, er, that is, ukrainians on one side are killing ukrainians on the other side, er, wave, as we later understand, with of one composition, fights with nationalists, he kills nationalism, accordingly whoever will watch it, i understand that... he can then dig deeper and start to find out for himself, but in fact this inaccuracy of nuances and that material that already appears there, it did not have to appear there, that is, before that, especially in the situation of material that appears during the war, one must be very, very careful, because creating a false impression, especially by such means, is very easy, and accordingly, when i analyzed many points there, i understand that there are people who do not orient themselves in

the material and want ease in everything, i met these comments that it is so stifling, which somehow taught us they are joking, but we just want to listen to music and to remember, yes galya, sorry, i will interrupt you , in fact there is such an opinion that ceromancy is actually a product for teenagers, and that when academic scientists or intellectuals... begin to analyze this product in full seriousness, then it is the same , so that we compare the magazine adviser with the edition of the critic, which they say does not need to be approached so seriously with such a magnifying glass to this rapper, on the contrary, if it is material for children or teenagers, it should be approached with much more attention, actually have to him a much more careful approach. because it does not mean

children's or teenage material does not mean that it is made simpler and more primitive, it means that it is made more thoughtfully and actually much more attentive to detail. just like psychologists actually proofread children's books before they come out, that's a normal approach and a normal practice, but to just decide that we're going to do it with a lot less effort because we're targeting a teenage-child audience is a misconception , because from this teenage, this teenage audience will perceive exactly what said in this, in this. a musical, let's call it that, even though it's not exactly a musical, she'll take it much more directly, and in many cases she won't check, unless she has someone extra to guide her, to explain the difficult points to her, so it's really

my job more than 20 years with young people, with students, with teenagers, she proves that in reality it will be just a false impression. galyu, i'm sorry, i understand correctly that you have, you have reservations about this phrase, this rain for a long time, which is actually called the war of the ukrainian people's republic against bolshevik russia, yes, and there is no clear definition, and it is simply called this rain for a long time. i understood correctly that it is precisely such formulations, precisely such formulations that you consider... with customs, yes, because there is no talk about the fact that there is a war between the ukrainian people's republic and soviet russia, that is , there is no mention of the second participant in this conflict, there it is mentioned as veiled as possible about some kind of ethnic cleansing, which

, in fact, into which this rain goes, that it is not about purity, but about ethnic cleansing, but nowhere is it said who is carrying out these cleansings, against whom they are towards khvylovoi , then for some reason this particular remark of khvylovoi was chosen for the final scene about the fact that he was a communist, that he, in fact, with whom he fought, with the nationalists, and it ends with the death of khvylovoi, and let's say, a person who is not too knowledgeable , which is building its identity now. and now there are quite a lot of such people who want to understand, it will be very difficult for her to understand what happened, and for me such moments as, for example, also the mention that the unr suppresses the uprising at the arsenal plant, that is, how to perceive this phrase , if you already are

you say, the january bolshevik uprising, which we all know, then we can actually name who started the uprising, but it turns out that we only have a case. with the unr , which is aggressively suppressing some kind of rebellion, that is , there are a lot of such misunderstandings, understatements in this text, of course, there are a lot of people who praised it, i understand that they did not always listen to all the details and all the details, but believe me , when i see all these reviews under the video saying i listened 10 times, i make all my students listen again, this is... the material, that is, in fact, this variant of some such extreme admiration , uncritical attitude towards this material , it conditions, it scares, because after this material, if we do not approach it critically, we will have a not quite correct

perception, if, say , fighting russian narratives abroad, i understand why they arose there, so when i... come across similar things in a ukrainian project made during the war, it scares me. galyu, you said about the teacher, well, i can’t help but pick up the topic, if possible, stay a while longer just a few minutes in contact with us, i will first ask lyuba, yakymovych, and then i will forward the same question to you, the actor yevhenii yanovych, who is part of this project, he took part in the teromantika project, he... here i read, that he worked in kvn, the kpi national team, and on the basis of this kpi national team, the studio was founded, my mother laughed, right? and here he, as a participant in the project, writes that you and i are critics of t-romance, but we are not critics, by

the way, we will also say about the big pluses of this project, these are naphthalene academic watchmen and dinosaurs, the criticism of which, this is what i am quoting, does not reach a wide audience, and we look postironically with you against the background of real work, what do you say about this, i am very interested. khomenka, also oleksandr, came to me in a comment in order to call me names and mix with dirt, then he deleted his comment, good people made a screenshot and did not apologize, he wrote such an enthusiastic comment, you see what it is, well, that is, it is a way, on the one hand, to defend yourself, but aggression is always a way to defend yourself. and here and or to attack instead of defense, here and with

the other is such an audacious attitude towards the community that really understands this situation professionally, they didn't say thank you, what they should have done, they should have said: "thank you for your comments, we will take them into account, for example, in the next projects, we will involve a scientist, this an adult approach, the approach we see here is an approach that is really adolescent , let's not give it up, they talk a lot about teenagers, this is an adolescent approach, immature people, even if they are mature in age, who perceive, react in this way, but in teenagers , i'm sorry, they have hormonal ones changes, it is difficult for them to control their emotions, they develop a cortex, a neocortex, and this, these are people who are already mature, who have already... formed, in particular, yanovych has a neocortex, i have it, i am sure of it, he looks like a healthy

person, and it's a very immature approach in my opinion, well, but they'll tell you to do better, look, we've got hundreds of thousands of views, we've got platforms, we've got a product that we've made, and you teachers, naptalinov, come and us... you teach us how to live, and here, by the way, i want to forward this question to galina kruk. galyu, i will ask you about the actual naftalin schools, but i will complicate the question a little more with a quote from oksana, forostina, a writer who says that these neophytes with their money and status ended up in this place because they did not let those who did not fit in into the moscow-centric model. and not only through language , but also aesthetically, and now, on the second day after their

conversion, they behave with the usual aplomb, as if nothing had happened, ignoring those who for 30 years prepared the ground so that they could see now, not even all of them remained alive, already not speaking in the profession of these people who prepared the soil. in your opinion, gal, isn't this evidence of a deeper split, in society itself, yes, among your own, yes, because it's all your own. so conditionally yours, and which one testifies to the fact that there is no communication between those who converted recently and those who were immersed in ukrainian culture for a long time, doesn't this testify to you about this split yet? yes, this is a sign of a much deeper problem, to which we have actually now reached and about which the latest scandals and the latest discussions in the ukrainian environment. chat really people who have been working in the field of ukrainian culture for a very long time, this

project was preceded by a whole series of projects that beautifully presented and worked with ukrainian literature, whether from the renaissance or later times. in fact, none of these, none of these projects had such a wide audience and such opportunities to reach the masses. how i got this project, here you can analyze why it happened, but it did not happen by itself, this is a topic for a separate conversation, and let's say, when in this situation people receive an information resource, and begin to displace, at least from the field of ukrainian culture of those who have worked there for a long time, by devaluing, by humiliating, then... in fact , the problem is that communication alone will not work, that is

, clear rules must be drawn up on how to deal with this, and the worst thing is me upset in this situation, actually the people who formed a very good advertisement for this project, that is, if in fact, this is it, by the way, a very big very big problem, the question, if you do not have the opportunity to see such a ... juicy project in its entirety, but you just listened to him a little bit for about 5 minutes and conclude that this is actually a very useful, high-quality and generally brilliant project, then... we doom ourselves to the fact that in some time we will all be pushed out of this field, because we are dealing with much more aggressive actants of culture with people who are used to working in a completely different segment, and i am speaking here not only as a person, as a teacher and as a person who is a writer myself, i am speaking here as a person who

was engaged in 20 years ago, defended a dissertation on the topic of mass culture, that is... i know how the mechanisms of this mass culture work, i know what are the requirements for this, in fact, what are the requirements for it, and what i advise, accordingly, in this situation, it is based on some, on some certain intellectual level, and therefore when i am tried simply thrown out of this process, it is natural that i interpret this as aggression in my direction, and the aggression, unfortunately, is not directed at me, onalno, at the segment of culture that we represent. and let's say, here i would draw attention to the fact that people who worked for a long time in ukrainian culture, but who worked and intended to work with mass culture, they are sometimes fascinated by this new, let's say, very active trend that appears, it seems to them

that they can just step there with one foot and everything at once. that's when all the fireworks will happen and everything will be revealed, immediately this shot revival can suddenly be taken with any hands and make a comedy out of it, unfortunately, it is shot, that is, it is very bloody material, and of course we can throw out all the bloody moments from it, but from it will not become a comedy, that is, for me this moment is very important, to realize that we... have to work with certain material very carefully, and we have to be careful that we do not perceive critically and advertise to a much wider circle of people, because it depends on it, control your words, as shakespeare said, because your future depends on it, in this situation we have, in a situation of war, our future depends a lot on it,

whether we will name the culprit in the war as ems. and soviet russia, or shall we say that civil war, are we to say that the waveman died because he was a committed communist and something went wrong, or do we say that the waveman died because that was his price for his approach and his illusions about communist ideology, and in fact, it surprises me, because the same material can be presented much better, it can be presented... through the prism, even the same wave, through the prism of the slogan away from moscow, it can be presented through the prism of the slogan that existed in the literary discussion for 25-28 years , you give europe, that is, these are the theses that we would like now were much more relevant, but in order to do it qualitatively, you need to be aware of this

material, and not read about it only some short excerpts at the general level. sound, that is, in fact, i'm just sorry that so many efforts and talented people did not read what is the essence of this project, the words on which or on which our future depends. i understand that it can be boring to talk about such things, about different points, but in fact, behind any easy material there is always the fact that this material is for us and what he brings... us, let's say, awakens, and here i would, in addition to this joyful perception that it is genius, i would think about what will remain from him in the dry residue. galya, thank you very much, galina kruk, poet, literary critic, teacher of literature at lviv franka university,

was in touch with us, and i, actually, the question about the split between. e new converts to ukraine and those who were already in ukraine. i will ask you if it is possible to communicate this in any way, how to deal with it, because one way or another we all have to understand each other, but it is worth it here it should be mentioned that this is not the first wave of conversion to ukrainianism, yes, but we previously had other waves, both during the language maidan, and during the orange revolution, and during the euro-maidan, or revolution... of dignity, that is, but - and i know that sashko khomenko, he says that he studied at a russian school, i also studied at a russian-language school in luhanchy, i also studied at a russian school in kyiv. i grew up in the luhansk region in a society where ukrainian was spoken only by pensioners, when they retired, my grandmother suddenly started speaking ukrainian

in the language, the local dialect, yes, which for some reason many people call surzhik, but it is not surzhik, there is a big difference, but does this justify someone or how, i don’t know, that is, many of us, even those who have been there for a long time in ukraine, he came there... it is known that he came after changing his language from russian to ukrainian, there are a lot of them, we can count on the hands and feet of our modern writers of my generation and younger ones who did it, but you have to understand that when you come to a new one, well, to some space for you, you need to understand what is here, what planets are there, what are the rules of the game here, what are the physical laws here, in the same way in literature you need to understand, in general, what was done here, judging by their interviews, they do not understand what was done here, they do not they know foxtrots from zhyden and gurzh, they don’t know, well, they don’t understand

, they tell us to do it yourself, they don’t know, let’s show foxtrots, so foxtrots are a project of 2021, that’s right, which was made as part of an exhibition in the art arsenal of photo novels, and this is the project of yuriy gurzha. serhiy zhadana, lyuba yakymchuk and everything was supervised by the beautiful oksana shchur, and actually, this is also, actually, this is a musical, musical-literary project, where what, where the voices of writers sound, the living voices of writers who managed to be found then, so oksana found where there is wonderful, wonderful animated clips, where there is great music, and where there is a great reading of poetry, let's listen to an excerpt here too. from foxtrots and this is also about mykhailo semenko, please let the blood out, take away all the prana, take away from my chest my

embarrassing bedhovim all night until i am wounded, take, take my breath, the energy of my ears, new the world, my body for destruction, the spirit of the unknown hello. i was so bored today, as if oles, vorony and choprinka had gathered together. it felt rainy and fall-like, in the rain the hairdresser played the guitar all day. sometimes i thought about her and made sketches of a letter that i did not think i would send to her . i remembered several forgotten french phrases, twice. looked at the image of christ, hummed banal waltzes silently, looking at the ceiling at the dirty cobwebs, no, i

was only sad, only sad, a melon was decaying in my heart, hello, hello, hey hey look here people who focus on views will tell you foxtrot views are 20-10 00 there and you romance in a week something 250,000 views on youtube, how do you explain that, what is your answer? well, it’s a different segment of culture, firstly, secondly, and... well-known stars such as zhenya yanovych, who has his own youtube channel and who is romantic, take part in

ti romanticism, that’s what he means , who had a podcast therapy with the sensational spartacus on saturday, as who legitimized him in principle with his participation, is certainly desirable, which is also in this project, here, but the main thing. that their product is a product of mass culture, i.e. our product, they also tried to make it easier and more popular, and serhiy wanted it, here, but still it is more to such a niche, still closer to high culture, and well the quality is completely different, and i think the musicians would tell you about the music, i heard a lot of feedback about these projects, but oksana is the akura rat. the author of this project says: foxtrots are a disco for a wide range of people who care, for you and me, for students, cultural figures, teachers and schoolchildren, but it did not become

so wide. as you and i would like , although i remember, i was at the premiere and we all danced in the art arsenal, so it's very cool, but still, for some reason, some projects are different, they get more views, pr pr, i think , which is primarily pr, of course, and people who are involved in pr, and here, and besides, after the full-scale invasion, the request for a shot revival, it increased, significantly increased. appeared in ukraine in this there are a lot of new people who are now learning about it, it was released very early , this project is now appearing, for example, the brand by me makes a line of clothing dedicated to the people of kurbas, the kurbas theater, that is, a lot of everything appears in such a to a broad understanding of culture, and besides, this is a very, very good time for such a thing, and when we criticize like this, it is not that we want

to close ourselves off and say: no, we will not let anyone into our ukrainianness, no new converts, no , we waited for you here for a long time, we came here ourselves, and that was it it is not so easy to change the language, to write in ukrainian, and when you did not understand anything at all, you also came to outer space, but a lot of our writers , including me, did it, so we waited for a new wave, we waited, after 22 we were also waiting for that , i understood that there would be this new one... and i am very glad that now there are big changes in stand-up and in blogging, there the stars are switching to ukrainian, and it hurts, yes, and they switch to their , they are criticized, and it hurts again, you have to understand that we are all traumatized, traumatized ukrainian speakers who were persecuted for using the ukrainian language in schools, traumatized russian speakers, because people who

speak russian, their... relatives did something bad in the past, this is what oksana zabushko voices very clearly, people transgenerational trauma and they are now coming to the ukrainian language and they are afraid, they are afraid in a new space, just like people who study a new language abroad, it is always not easy. dear, please tell me, we talked with you about the positives, about the pluses, this project certainly has pluses, and we see them from by you, so you are romantic, what is it? why did you like it? and i liked the crazy energy that they really have, their team the team has, and if they rethink their approaches and really think about whether they are not broadcasting russian narratives, but think about how to clearly place what galya was talking about, the accents , then they can turn out a really cool product and ideologically safe, ecological, now this product

may be fascinating. someone with its energy, but it is non-ecological and is very, very dangerous for ukrainians, unfortunately. dear, we are the last ones with my question, because there are 30 seconds left, you and i talked before the program about this understanding between new converts and old converts, so what about those who were born this way, here i am, who was born in this, this is the solution to this for me personally. a contradiction or a tension would be for the new converts to say to me: we understand your pain, we understand your language trauma of your childhood, we understand what you went through, for me it would be enough, and for you it would be like a solution, or at least weakening of this contradiction? and i could also tell them that i understand their pain, i understand how difficult it is for them in response to... this

apology, which you are talking about, is not an apology, but this thesis, yes, if they voiced it, and because in fact we have a common pain, and russia made it so that we ended up on different sides of the language, on different sides, but still in the ukrainian language, because even surzhik does not belong to the russian language, it is a ukrainian language, it is a phenomenon the ukrainian language, and books are written in cursive, that is, we and this transition from language to language... returning to your native language, the language that belonged to your relatives, your family, yes, the transition from your first language, your mother tongue, maybe yes, if your mother taught you this language, to your native language, it is always painful, and i understand that, and we are waiting for you here, i want to say, we have been waiting for you here, we are waiting for you and we are waiting for new projects, and we are also waiting for an understanding of...

what do we want to say,