well, that is, macron said that the offensive against russia will not be led by france, but i understand that he does not rule out the transfer of separate forces of the french army to ukraine. previously , information appeared that in the event that the russians will advance on kyiv or odesa, what is on macron's mind, on his tongue, we hear about what he says, and what he thinks? i believe that emmanuel macron has started a game, a political game for informal leadership in europe, a position similar to that which angela merkel once held during her chancellor, but angela merkel's position was primarily based on germany's economic power, and... this must be understood, and

emmanuel macron's position in this situation, in conditions where a large-scale russian invasion has been going on for almost 750 days, is a military-political one, it is logical , because the russian-ukrainian war is the biggest war in the world today, and it creates a certain background, and accordingly, macron is acting in the way that he is currently organizing for ... security, so i think that this discussion, it is fueled historical experience, because the french already landed in odessa a little more than 100 years ago, the presence of a foreign legion in the french armed forces, and the fact that, as i said, emmanuel macron is in, and...

on the footage, mr. yevgeny, very bad connection, please, we will redial you now, friends , we are working live on the espresso tv channel and on our youtube and facebook platforms, we are continuing the voting, we are asking you what you think about whether the west will dare to send to ukraine its troops, yes, no, if... you are in youtube everything quite simple, if you are sitting in front of the tv, pick up your phone or smartphone and vote if you think the west will dare to send its troops to ukraine, 0800-211-381, no, 0800 211-382, all calls to these numbers are free of charge, and at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote, we are waiting for the inclusion of yevhen magda, some unstable connection.

unfortunately for our guest today, evgeny mada has already mentioned that today macron, scholz and tusk met in berlin, this is the so-called weimar triangle. france, germany and poland has agreed that they will give the income received from russian assets in the european union to the purchase of weapons for ukraine, and this was announced by olaf scholz at a joint press conference with french president emmanuel macron and polish prime minister donald tusk, he says that today the leaders of the three countries have agreed that they will buy weapons for ukraine on the global market, and we will develop cooperation in the production of weapons, thanks to our cooperation with partners in ukraine , says macron, within the coalition.

ramstein was told by the leaders of weimar, the weimar triangle, they are going to create a coalition for the purchase of missiles and long-range artillery, and all revenues from frozen russian assets will be used to purchase weapons in ukraine. we already have yevhen magda in contact. mr. yevgeny, we are not done with ourselves. let's continue on macron's position and on why he articulates why he is so active now in european politics, i think among other things macron is not only because it is the second presidential term, not only because there is historical experience, but also because the united states lost a certain leadership in matters of support for ukraine, due to the crisis that currently exists in relations

between democrats and republicans, and which is unlikely to will be fast, well, i would say decided, because... the presidential campaign is only gaining momentum, therefore, accordingly , emmanuel macron has become an active foreign policy player, because this is a way through actions on the international arena to receive his own and political dividends in that number of we have already mentioned today's meeting of the weimar triangle of scholz, macron and tusk, and what do you say, mr. yevgeny, about this idea that the frozen assets will be used to purchase weapons for ukraine, why is there no worldwide support for this use of these frozen

assets, because we are talking somewhere around the world about the amount of 300 billion dollars, and maybe more. there are several reasons: first, there was no legal act that would record the defeat of russia in this war, that is, there was no analogue of nurberg or tokyo trial, respectively, of german , japanese war criminals, then after it, after the second world war, everything was quite clear, as well as a series of treaties after the first world war, here i think that the western establishment still ... thinks does not rule out for himself, and i would not begin to condemn so intensely, now i will explain why, he does not rule out for himself some kind of return of russia to international, well,

let's say, communication, more intensive , more civilized, there is also a superficial interest, russia directly says that once you start to use our... we will take yours, and that will mean, well, let's say, if for individual states, i will, i think, it will also mean a political crisis, because russian propaganda will actively promote it in these countries, well conditionally, some financial organization that works on the territory of russia, and russia takes it, takes all its assets. then i think that at the same time it will spread information in the country where the mother office of this organization is located, that we are taking everything from you, that everything is bad for you, and in general, well, it is not clear who you are here, that is, russia

skilfully plays on these things, we have to understand that, and that is why the world is looking for an acceptable way, that is... on the one hand, they want to help ukraine, and this, this desire is sincere enough, because the factor of empathy in helping ukraine should not be excluded, he is really present, but at the same time we have to realize that the west is trying to protect its own interests, and there is nothing unnatural in this, in my opinion. mr. yevgeny, over the past few days we have been watching the unfolding of hostilities on the territory of the russian federation. the so-called russian volunteers, whether former prisoners there are russian volunteers of the rdc, freedom of russia, the siberia battalion, all this is happening on the eve of the presidential, so-called presidential elections, pseudo-elections. why, in your opinion, did putin

play democracy at all in these elections, since there is already, well, complete autocracy, that is, there is no other candidate, it is clear that this is just an automatic prolongation. putin's powers, and won't this be the last election for putin in terms of any kind of democracy game at all, when he just becomes the tsar of russia or i don't i know he will gain some status there and will live until either he is killed or until he dies his own death. i think that the process of putin's re-election should prove to the russians that... everything is fine with them, that they are really not conducting a war, but a special military operation, and therefore putin's reaction to the actions of russian volunteers in the belgorod and kursk regions, it is quite indicative , he reacts to them, he says

that there are huge victims and so on, but he says that ukraine has not achieved success, he usually acts in an understandable, sufficiently obvious way. propaganda context, but at the same time it should be realized that putin, for example, does not comment on the attacks on russian oil refineries and... the attack on the export of gasoline, it is true, but on the attacks of russian volunteers, he is forced to comment, because they have too much resonance , that is , it affects those people who live in the border zone, and their evacuation or flight there also causes a certain public interest, these actions of russian volunteers, they definitely make sense for the reason that they allow you to shake things up. putin 's regime, we must be aware that putin's regime has taken root in russia

for a long time, and remove it quickly, you just know how to erase some pencil sketch on paper with an eraser, it will be extremely difficult, what is called putin's election, you can already talk today, i think there is a high probability that he will score more than 80%. i honestly thought it would be even more than 90 at first, but now i will do more a conservative forecast with your permission, more than 85, that is, it will definitely be the highest result in the entire history of putin's participation in the elections, and he will receive a mandate of trust and a mandate of the imaginary unity of russian citizens around the military leader. and so i suggest quite obviously that because of this mandate,

because of the fact that the russians are showing their own desire to be with putin, russia can attack one of the nato countries, attack with conventional weapons, but with their hand on the nuclear buttons, and talking about what or worth, well, as you know, the day before... howl talked about whether it is worth dying for danzeh, and now the question will be asked, whether it is worth dying for tallinn, whether it is worth dying there for lublin, and i do not exclude, by the way, that this attack may take place through the territory of belarus and with the support of belarusian troops, i i am very skeptical about the possible participation of belarusian troops in hostilities against ukraine, but it is possible against nato. to be, that is, russian propaganda in this direction and belarusian propaganda work in a sufficiently

coordinated manner, this is quite a likely option at the moment, and the western world, who is watching this, and i know , for example, that at the munich security conference the invasion of russia was considered as a likely scenario, should act more actively and should draw conclusions from the historical mistakes , first of all, of their own and their predecessors. remember the year 2008, georgia, i am not underestimating the fact that the position of the ukrainian authorities was the same, both yours and ours, that is, if it were not for viktor yushchenko, his visas to tbilisi, then we would have covered ourselves with shame as a country, because the verkhovna rada did not managed to condemn russia's aggression, i think you remember it, and accordingly, if so it happened, then now... after the large-scale aggression of russia, it would be much more difficult for us to seek the support

of the civilized world, but this happened more than 15 years ago, we will not go back to it in too much detail now, we will talk about the fact that such an escalation with on the part of russia, it must receive a consolidated response from the civilized world, and the more actively ... consultations within nato and the european union will now take place, the more actively ukraine will demonstrate its capacity for internal transformations, precisely the capacity for internal transformation rather than emotional diplomacy, the more chances we have that we can collectively fight back, we can stop, because as far as i understand, as far as i see the sociological research, i would say... like, that to the west of ukraine, the readiness to fight against russia is radically lower than in ukraine, it is true, and

if before the large-scale invasion of ukraine more than 90% of western experts and analysts said that ukraine would collapse, then i don’t even know what the forecasts will be, if russia starts playing with its muscles and really implements the creation of its two military new ones'. districts on the borders with nato countries. the west must act preventively, strengthen sanctions, shake russia from the inside, and ... we, ukraine, as a victim of aggression, have a full moral right to say that the dismantling of russia is the only possible way to ensure a safe world. living in a world without russia is normal. it's just that western politicians are afraid to imagine him. many of them

are comfortable living in the same world as russia. because there are a number of reasons. i won't go into the money and all that, but having a situational ally that you can scare someone with when needed is very beneficial, and it was very beneficial to play on the contradictions between the european union and the united states at the time, and russia for its part spared no money supporting, well, for example, in italy, romano prodi and silvio berlusconi, in the czech republic. vaclav klaus and milos zeman, while simultaneously supporting, you understand, and, for example, in the czech republic, russia was frightened only by vaclav havel, who was a man of firm democratic principles, and the more people in the western world will be inclined towards business as usual with russia, the more they will face the fact that the threat, which, excuse me, is already

worn underwear and was... russian soldiers will come to use washing machines , this threat will grow, and what they saw on tv, it can come to life, and in completely different realities, unlike ukrainian ones. russia, unfortunately, knows very well how the western world works, it knows how the principles of democracy work, and it actively works with it, and, for example, undermining trust in relations between poland and ukraine. this is quite an obvious prelude to possible aggression against poland and other nato countries. whether, for example, the desire to interfere in the elections, to one way or another shake up the situation in the united states, it is the same, or to promote russian, pro-russian parties in germany - these are also actions aimed at strengthening the role

of russia. russia skillfully uses hybrid instruments of influence. by the way, they have learned well that in this way you can achieve your goals much cheaper than using the armed forces, which have undergone heavy losses during the war in ukraine, which continues even now. yesterday, during a video address to ukrainians, president zelenskyi, mr. yevgeny, said that ukraine is stockpiling domestically produced long-range weapons. let's listen to what zelensky said. had the opportunity to thank the workers of our defense complex, the people who devoted their lives to the ukrainian force, who make our weapons that manifest themselves at the front, at sea in air strikes against the russian system of war. thank you for

ukrainian shells, guns, drones, for our missiles, for our reb systems, for everything that helps our soldiers fight, protects the lives of ukraine and ukrainians. there will be more of our weapons, shells, our drones, our reb systems, and every day we accumulate more and more of this power, such necessary power, such long-range power of ours. the third year of the great war, the president says that we are beginning to accumulate long-range weapons of domestic production, the president. says that we are starting to build fortifications at a distance of two 200 km, which necessary for us to protect ourselves from the russian occupiers, why do you think these decisions are being made with such a delay and are being discussed about these decisions, well, now they are being talked about, but obviously we will see some result, mr. sergey, i for ethical reasons

and for the reasons of a person who is thunder'. nom of the country that became a victim of aggression, i will not question the words of volodymyr zelenskyi, i would very much like them to be embodied directly on the battlefield, and then, i think, we will all be grateful, as well as the president, grateful ukrainian employees defense industrial complex. i am fully aware that it is not within our competence to discuss at this time what missiles may be... tomorrow or in what number, how they may appear, but when it is seen that over the last month the costs of... . attacks on fortifications, then the question arises, who and what thought further, before that, and what were the conclusions, despite

the fact that indeed, well, for these almost 700 already 50 days , there were different moments in our struggle with russia , there were also relative comfort, i don't want to talk about it now to speak, i want to return to something else, i think both you and our viewers... how the armed forces of ukraine sank the missile cruiser moscow with the help of ukrainian neptune missiles, right? tell me, you saw, you heard, that we communicated this with our nato partners, that we reminded about it, for example, in the turkish media, did something similar to such an information show and talked about it, because thanks. because moscow is at the bottom, turkey began to dominate completely in the black sea, russia ceased to be simply her a competitor, you know? that is, we should

speak with our partners in the language of our common interests. and the missile cruiser moscow is with russian vocabulary, the killer of aircraft carriers. the fact that the aircraft carrier crashed turned into a diving object. how is this treated in the american sixth? we were somehow interested in this, i just mean that we should not only thank our manufacturers for the fact that they support and strengthen our defense capability, this is quite natural, but we should communicate our victories, this should also raise the fighting spirit and speak about our future successes, we must create an atmosphere that allows us to be... convinced of further successes, and not just react to russia's attempts to sow despair and

doubts and various problems in ukraine. that's what , i think, our joint task actually consists of today. well, that is, the russians are much more effective in spreading their information than we are, because their state information machine is under control. on a single interest, to destroy our independence, in our state information the machine has different interests, and push the representatives of the opposition away, and simulate violent activity, and sometimes cover up some ineffective management actions, so they ee, you know, we have to remember one simple thing, that in russia, people who consider themselves ... the honor of serving the russian empire, which for some reason pretends to be the russian federation, is enough, and they do it consistently enough, that they will be very pleased

if the scalp of ukraine hangs on their wall, but i think it will never happen, as long as we exist and as long as there are the defense forces of ukraine, which from the first days, from the first hours destroyed the myth that russia... is capable of destroying ukraine, it was the defense forces of ukraine from the first days of the large-scale invasion that destroyed the illusion that russia could win , and we have for today to use this fact in our own common interests, for our independence, for us to feel more confident, and not just be, well, i don't know, strangers to it. on the occasion of the victory over russia, we have to talk about how to dismantle russia, in what way to do it and discuss it with our partners

as intensively as possible. thank you, mr. yevgeny, for the conversation, it was yevhen magda, executive director of the institute of world politics. friends, we work live on the espresso tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms, we conduct polls on youtube and on tv, today we ask you about this, if you dare. the event to send its troops to ukraine. let's look at the intermediate results of the poll on tv. so, 44% yes, 56% - no, according to ours tv viewers, on youtube we have a ratio of 46 to 54, well, almost, almost the same ratio. we will return to the studio, we will have a journalism club with the participation of kateryna nekrecha and oleksiy. mustafina, stay with us, it will be interesting. there are

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stronger together. events, events that are happening right now and affect our lives. of course, the news feed reports on them, but few know what is happening. need understand. antin borkovskii and invited experts soberly assess the events, analyze them, modeling our future. every saturday at 1:10 p.m. with a repeat at 8 p.m. 2:00 studio event with anton borkovsky on espresso. greetings, friends, the second part of the verdict program is live on the tv channel, my name is serhiy rudenko, today in the program: the fourth day of the war in russia, explosions are heard again in belgorod,

russian rebels. they promise to renew the humanitarian corridor for civilians. russian election roulette. vote don't vote, the result is known in advance. will the west recognize it? putin's legitimacy after the pseudo-elections? parliamentary crisis in ukraine. the monomajority in the verkhovna rada is under attack. what threatens the weakness of the ukrainian government in the conditions of war. we will talk about this and other things during the next 45 minutes, i remind you that in addition to the tv broadcast, we work on youtube and facebook, for those who are currently watching us live on youtube, please take part in our vote, today we ask you about such as, will the west dare to send its troops to ukraine, yes, no, if you have a special opinion, please leave it in in the comments below this video, if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphone or phone and vote if you think the west will dare to send its

troops to ukraine (0800-200). 11 381 no 0800 211382 vote, all calls to these numbers are free. at the end of the program, we will sum up the results of this vote. i would like to introduce the guests of today's studio, they are my colleagues, kateryna nekrecha, journalist of radio liberty. katerina, i congratulate you. oleksiy mustafin, historian, publicist, media manager. oleksiy, i congratulate you. thank you, that you are with us today well, since we are asking our tv viewers what they think about... the west, which dares or does not dare to send its troops to ukraine, i will ask in the blitz format and you, dear colleagues, katerina, what do you think, is the west all - still dare to send his troops to ukraine, well, i would expand the question, in which case it can happen? well, we have already heard that there are such thoughts that it can be there.