of humanitarian and information policy, head of the parye committee on issues of culture, science, media and sports, ms. yevgenia, i congratulate you, thank you for joining the broadcast, yaroslav yurchyshyn, people's deputy of ukraine from golos, head of the parliamentary committee on freedom of speech, mr. yaroslav, i congratulate you, thank you for being with us today, good evening, well, since we are asking our viewers and tv viewers about diplomatic relations, does ukraine need diplomatic relations with belarus lukashenko? i will ask ladies and gentlemen and you, what do you think about this, let's start with ms. yevgenia? we do not have an ambassador in belarus, that is, there is only a representative office that performs certain functions to ensure contacts with ukrainian citizens who have found themselves on the territory of belarus, and in particular with, for example, our children who, whom we return in small numbers, they, in including moving across the territory. belarus with

the assistance of our embassy. thank you, ms. victoria. you know, i think that no one has any doubts that the lukashenko regime, in particular, is waging a war against ukraine, precisely from the territory of belarus, there was an entry of russian troops into the territory of kyiv region, and perhaps i will surprise someone, but when in the 22nd year, exactly somewhere exactly two years ago, we drove into the territory of kyiv region and talked with people, who survived the occupation, many of them suspected that the belarusian military was also there, people had such suspicions, in particular, they believed that, after all, according to all indications, they were not russians, so it is obvious that this is the side of the war, the regime itself lukashenka, i emphasize, i emphasize this thesis, that's it it is obvious that, well, certainly not to diplomatic etiquette backwards... and we have to be

clear here, thank you, mr. yaroslav, why diplomatic relations actually, after all, i will expand the question, because whether they are needed or not, but why, why these diplomatic relations still exist, they have not been canceled, well, we have to deal with it, we have to take a position that will protect the rights of our communities as much as possible. mrs. yevgenia explained why relations should remain at a certain level, we as a country did not recognize lukashenka, we do not consider him the president of belarus, we consider him a usurper. in principle, for humanitarian missions, we need a certain level of representation in belarus, because there really is a corridor through which, by what means, ukrainian citizens are returned, and here we can take a sharp position, but what to do... specifically with

children who are kidnapped on territories of ukraine that return through belarus proper, problems may arise, so in this case, of course, there are always feelings, there are emotions, there are desires, i don't know who is in ukraine, well, except for the former representative of the majority the expelled, alleged agent of the main directorate of intelligence, yevgeny shevchenko, has at least some relationship with the official. at the same time, again, no country recognized tykhanovsky as an official representative of belarus, that is, with whom to have relations, especially if we have a huge number of people who have relatives and acquaintances and the like, so here we have to proceed from banal logic, geopolitics is not emotions, it is only interests, if it is beneficial for us to have a representative there, not you, not recognizing this regime, then ... yes

and we must act, of course, purely emotionally , i would like to say, this is a country that actually surrendered its territory to russian aggression, but these are emotions, we need to protect citizens, and what is beneficial for ukrainian citizens should be the priority of our policy , well , you can also say that our citizens are also in the russian federation, and draw exactly such a parallel that we need to take care of the 3 million ukrainians who went there... went to work for money in russia, and some of them live there , by the way, mr. sergey, we have a policy regarding these citizens, and there is an address of the president regarding the field regarding these citizens, so we should take care of these citizens as well, is this why we need diplomatic relations with the aggressor country that declared war on us, the situation is a little different, we no longer have diplomatic relations , we broke off diplomatic relations with the russian federation, and... why

exactly we, why you, we actually ask about this, because today lukashenko again started talking about the fact that belarus is preparing for war, he constantly says, he left with the working . today to grodno, it's not far from the suwalsky corridor and started, well, closer to poland rather, and started talking about what we want, we don't want to fight, that we don't want to fight, but we are preparing for war, i'm talking about that i'm speaking frankly, you want peace, prepare for war, i didn't come up with it, it's very correctly said, well, it says a lot, and i said that while there on the perimeter... everyone is digging trenches, we're digging trenches here for in order to build hospitals, but lukashenko did not say anything about the fact that ukraine is digging up riya in this regard so that the territory of the republic of belarus

was not used for belarusian or russian troops to enter the territory of the ukrainian state, as it happened in 2022, and victoria syumar mentioned. about the fact that in the kyiv region they told her that belarusians were there, i heard from the military that some uh belarusians, or a certain number of belarusians were during the sunset from the north, or at least they from the south, from the south of belarus to the north of kyiv region, and finally, can mrs. yevgenia ask the world that... lukashenko was recognized as putin's co-aggressor, because last year it was said that lukashenko could receive an international warrant, an international criminal court, among other things, for the same crimes that putin committed in ukraine, that is

, taking ukrainian children and actually stealing them, but the warrant did not come, or those of the status of the self-proclaimed president, as he is called in the west. enough for our western partners to perceive lukashenka as putin's henchman and co-aggressor. it seems to me that we are blurring the focus of our conversation a little, because we can talk for another half an hour about lukashenka, and indeed neither ukraine nor western countries recognize him, except perhaps hungary, which handed over groman lukashenko and the ambassador of the only country of the european union, he works there as an ambassador, because pay attention, well, the majority lowered their representation, we also recalled the ambassador from belarus, and this is also a certain argument, but you know, if they ask me whether it is necessary to have representatives there who will help our

citizens return to ukraine, then i will say yes, it is necessary to have representatives there, because it saves our citizens , as for me anyway we must... concentrate on targeting the kremlin, because lukashenko is nobody without the kremlin, and we understand that, lukashenko understands that, and it is obvious that our common, our common task should be to defeat russia, of course, that belarus can provide its territory, and the next time for russian troops to cross. through this territory, and ukraine simply has to be ready from all territories, yes, which border either belarus or russia, but it is clear that the danger is much greater from russia. well, i agree with you on one more thing, that, well, in

lukashenko is not an independent figure, in fact, he is not the one who decides whether russian troops will enter the territory of the republic of belarus or not, the question is only before ukraine. and whether ukraine is somehow in contact with belarus there, and from the position of the ukrainians, why am i asking about this, because it worries me, i also have relatives there and relatives live on the territory of the republic of belarus, but i am in favor of diplomatic relations we had with the republic of belarus until that time, then we should count only on the red cross, which we, well, let's be honest, we don't fully trust, maybe... i am to the point that there should not be diplomatic relations with such a country that is part of the russian federation, if we were to admit, to say that it is not at all now, it is not independent country, and we don't have any relations, we don't have a diploma of relations, but let's talk

about the situation that consists of the aid of the united states of america to ukraine, the speaker of the house of representatives of the congress of the united states of america mike johnson said that he will bring to the vote a bill on aid ukraine immediately after the festive holidays, which will end on april 9. according to him, the document will contain important innovations, in particular, the provision of assistance to kyiv in the form of a loan or income from frozen russian assets is not excluded, this is the story about a loan or a loan, this is the same story that trump has been pushing for a long time, whether the united states of america, in particular, congress will leave of the united states of america in providing aid to ukraine, which we will need in some way to extinguish this. credit or pay off this loan, ms. victoria, how likely and possible it is under the current conditions, and will

this not become the main obstacle when considering the issue of providing ukraine with 61 billion us dollars? sergey, well, it's really about the survival of the country, and i understand that the loan sounds bad, but the lack of help is much worse, and that's why, well, in our team , we ... talk to different american politicians, and indeed, unfortunately, today it looks like trump, the republicans, will still draw this line and draw it the idea of ​​a loan, the provision of this assistance, i am not even sure that it will be 61 billion, they are talking about the amount of 48 billion, but in any case , first of all, military aid, military support for ukraine, support with weapons must be provided, this is critically important for the country today , and yes, maybe i repeat again, maybe

the loan does not sound too attractive, obviously, but you know, loans can be written off even after the war, it is obvious that the provision of the military aid package is critical, and here we would like to remain optimistic, our team remains by optimists, which, after all, is possible in a somewhat truncated form. perhaps in the form of a loan, but all the same, this aid will be voted to ukraine. in fact , all the nuances that were there were removed, except for, probably, the key, key problem, the problem of domestic american politics, unfortunately, ukraine has already become a hostage and has already become to some extent a map during the election campaign, this does not give us much optimism, of course , considering the really, well... significant aid that the united states provided to ukraine during these two years, from

which, i will say frankly, probably depends on the chances for ukraine in the course of the war with the russian federation, because it is obvious that the resources of russia, which, by the way, has reliable allies, unfortunately, in particular the same iran, as we can see, are already north korea, so we can... north korea is meant, so we also need a reliable alliance, and in any case, a positive vote, at least for a package of military aid, at least for a loan, it will still be a testimony of american alliance with ukraine in the course of this war, which was announced from the highest tribunes, the highest leaders, including the united states. mr. yaroslav, how do you perceive the prospects of the adoption of this law by the congress of the united states. what is the solution to this after the easter holidays, because we

have been watching this drama for four months or the fifth month already and we see that there are no concessions or any steps forward yet, yes, i completely agree here with victoria, in fact any assistance for the... survival of the country is critical, of course the priority is military assistance, actually that the most critical thing that is needed in order to at least restrain those russian plans for promotion, which are clearly there, but we will not speculate on coffee grounds, it would be very good if the decision was made and people took part in it. to their own republican trumpists in order to have co-responsibility for

providing aid, accordingly to be included in the process of helping ukraine, and here it is symbolic, of course, the quantity matters, of course the timing matters, but the very fact that the united states continues to provide a messenger help, and there is bipartisan support in this, because actually it is necessary to make any decision, much more in... important, yes, europe is forced to help more actively, yes, we now see the leadership of france, and very often it is that the aid goes to... it is not even mentioned, which by the way is not well if it is not typical of french politics, they actually used to brag about the aid, here we have another situation where the aid is not disclosed, but it cannot replace the key one on whose side the united states, regardless of the actual party

is currently setting the agenda, it's a shame that... unfortunately , moments were lost, in particular for the strengthening of interparliamentary democracy, when in fact my colleagues who are actively working in the united states should not have asked for a foreign mission there, but should have to be assigned to work simply in individual states, especially republican ones, first of all convincing society, which could put pressure on its politicians, at this time we have certain problems with communication with yes, mr. yaroslav, please, what problems were there in you finished us, because you interrupted again, unfortunately, the moment was actually lost for active parliamentary work, especially those people who actively, both in the majority and in

the minority, could actually work more positively'. on the decision, but we are in reality, the parliament has really started, the election campaign of the big elections and the presidential and a large part of politics, politicians of the united states has started. it is very important for us to get at least an interim solution before this phase gets even hotter, yes, the amount is important, the amount it is important, time is important, the most important thing is military aid, and it is positive that he is now the speaker of the parliament. the outspoken trumpiz still talks about the possibility of acceptance, let's hope that, as with many politicians , his words will not differ from reality, so we do get the help, at least, which the politicians of the united states will be able to get in the election struggle. thank you, mrs. evgenia, and what will happen if suddenly the congress of the united

states of america does not make this decision? well, i still hope congress passes. and just in april will show this ability, because if before this there was an absolutely, well, let's say this, legal answer, we are dealing with our affairs, our budget, i will remind you that we continued this temporary budget resolution for quite a long time and finally adopted a full-fledged budget, and in my conversations with congressmen as well, they said, well, i understand. we must first resolve our budget issues, and then immediately we will deal with voting for the ukrainian and not only the ukrainian package, because israel and taiwan are also there, which is also better, in my opinion to be in this joint package, because israel has quite a powerful lobby in washington. if we talk about this difference between

a loan and not a loan, then in fact most often we are talking about a possible loan. because no one has seen this text from johnson yet, there is only the senate text that was voted, there it is irreversible budget aid to the ukrainian budget, financial aid, then we are talking about a loan for the financial part, because if we talk about part of the weapons, in fact these money they stay in the united states, because it is manufacturing plants in the u.s. itself... the usa and these are patriots, heymars, and atakams, that is, all these names that we see in the ukrainian news, they are actually produced quite often, if not most often, if you look at the map, to things, in republican states, so this additional communication that it's

including american jobs, it also works, at least i use it when i'm... talking to an american uh audience, how it goes, we'll see, really with on the 9th, the lower house returns, they will work from april 9 to april 22, but in this interval we will understand how events will develop, our friends from both parties, well, at least they are giving such signals that there will be a vote and a decision will be made, because in fact the face of the united states depends on it . not only in fact our fate and our victory, but also the face of the states themselves. well, the face of ukraine depends on the continuation of anti-corruption reforms, and about it today. the special representative of the united states of america for the reconstruction of ukraine, peni prinskker, spoke in lviv, she says that these anti-corruption

reforms and, in general, what is happening with the fight against corruption in ukraine, in the future depends on the involvement of large foreign investors in the post-war reconstruction of ukraine. let's hear what penny pritzker said. first of all, i will note the progress in the anti-corruption reform, but it is important to maintain this momentum and continue to move in this direction, in particular for the possible accession to the eu. in order for ukraine to complete its recovery and be able to be a prosperous country that realizes its potential. to us and ukraine private sector investment is needed, which means that ukraine must resolutely eradicate corruption. mrs. victoria, how do you assess ukraine's steps to decisively eradicate corruption and what peni pritzker is talking about?

you know, it seems to me that in this matter we should divide the anti-corruption reform, the issues themselves, yes, and only then the efficiency, as it is reflected in practice, because on the one hand, we really fulfilled all the requirements of the european union, we voted very hard. requirements for both declaration and independence of the anti-corruption infrastructure and infra, sorry, anti-corruption bodies in general, such as the nazk, the sap, which today is already separated from the gpu, nabu, of course, which today, well, they announced suspicion to a rather serious official who, who is called close to the office. .. of the president, that is, in principle, we see certain results of this work, but the fight against corruption is

certainly a broader and more global concept, and therefore areas of control, areas of transparency, transparency tools, they should be maximal, because today we really exist at the expense of taxpayers in the countries of the european union, in the united states and in those countries that support ukraine today. and it is extremely important for us today to show that all these funds are really being spent transparently, and here, i think, we could do more work, i mean, there could be more of a role for the ukrainian parliament, it could be a bigger role , temporary investigative commissions, which we have a wonderful law about this, but we often do not create them with vital issues, here is one small example, we initiated a temporary investigative committee of the parliament regarding control, deputy control over the construction of fortification, this is an extremely important topic, 17 billion,

the first tranche was allocated in january, today another 5 billion of budget money was literally allocated, it's huge money, and you know, it's money, well, what is called both into concrete and into the forest, it's difficult to control, here it's difficult to display all this even in the system transparently, because they say that... it must be in some mysterious decision, because it is about national security, okay, let the deputies sign it, let them control this process, but no, we have blocked this topic, so it seems to me that in addition to the anti-corruption infrastructure itself, the anti-corruption bodies, there should also be the will of all institutions of the state and personally, in fact, of each official to this maximum accountability, to maximum transparency and to ri. various forms of control, including, for example, control by public organizations, well, there is no need to deal with it now, spare me the destruction there

image of anti-corruption public organizations, and this is exactly what we see, this is exactly what is happening now, attempts to undermine trust in these people, this is definitely the wrong way, in fact, increasing this field of transparency and control will lead to more. the trust , first of all, of ukrainian society and , of course, our international partners, so this practice must be spread, not narrowed down. well, since you already mentioned the detention or the fact that the suspicion was announced to the former freelance adviser to the office of the president of ukraine, we are talking about artem shilla, he was once a freelance adviser to president zelenskyi's office, in august 22 , he returned to the security service of ukraine. to the position of deputy director of the department of national statehood protection, well, now he is incriminated in the actual case of the 22nd year, we are talking about the seizure of almost 95% of hryvnias in

ukrzaliznytsia, yes, on the purchase of transformers during martial law, and well , in fact, this whole story, well smells so stupid against what penny pritzker is saying and how we look in the world in general, sir yaroslav, in what way, what is still missing so that ukraine does not look like a country of corrupt people and... a country of people where during the war they simply take and steal hundreds of millions of hryvnias. effective investigation of these cases, we are now mainly at the stage of serving suspicions, suspicions are served in our country to high-ranking officials, but we also have to understand that to effectively prove guilt in court, and to effectively investigate such cases, it actually takes

time, and that on... most positively, our international partners understand this, of course, we need to understand that the fact that so many cases are now being exposed is not proof that corruption has increased, it is proof that anti-corruption bodies have begun to work and produce results, a great deal of homework has been done to ensure their independence and efficiency , cards in hand, do, work, the main thing is really here... do not interfere, and i also agree with the fact that we need to show where it is appropriate, and where it is possible to ensure maximum openness, we somehow have time told about what was not it is possible to inform through the prozoro system about the purchases of the ministry of defense, it is not about weapons, it is about material support, the mechanism has been found, now in principle,

unfortunately, after the scandal, yes, although in fact it would be much more positive if the system was changed even without it, it is significantly gives its results, and here, by the way, here is an indicator of how the ukrainian authorities, regardless of political affiliations or any positions, should act when a problem is exposed, it is not necessary to turn your eyes and try to discredit journalists there or activists or there to oppose the investigation, in fact just to sit down. together and fix the problem, because it is not even that dangerous, but having a corrupt person in your team there, he can be brought to light, but broken rules that allow corruption to restore itself, it is much worse, because one awl will be replaced by another soap, therefore, in this case, it is very important to actually show the cases that will already be resolved, but it takes

time, but... but actually the dynamics are quite positive, the second is to change things attitude and do not immediately try to close the world of criticism and in the comfort of some information bubbles of your own there, but to respond to criticism and correct mistakes in advance, well, indeed, more transparency, more mechanisms, such as various kinds of controls, and public control of the public , and parliamentary control through special or investigators. commissions were created for that, so in this case, well, the dynamics are good, and sometimes we need to hear what our international partners tell us, they are much more positive perceive what is happening in our country in the fight against corruption than we sometimes perceive, well, we actually live in it, so it is logical that we live in a war, and of course we perceive it much more painfully, but there is progress, it is important here that to make it irreversible, well, besides corruption, we... understand that

russia is now working quite seriously in ukraine with various agent networks, various groups, through the church, through information resources, through messengers, in particular regarding the use of telegram , he said this week, or rather , at the end the head of the main intelligence department of the ministry of defense, general kyrylo, spoke last night. budanov, it is clear that the range of issues and problems facing ukraine is quite large, but russia was and remains the country that influences and tries to influence the internal situation in ukraine, and corruption is also a part of it of russian influence, because where it is sold and bought, of course there is

russian money in it.