greetings, this is svoboda live, my name is vlasta lazur. the draft law on the mobilization of ukrainians has been submitted to the verkhovna rada, today it was considered by people's deputies, but it is already obvious that this law will not contain one of the key norms that thousands, if not millions , of ukrainians were expecting, this is no exaggeration. it is about determining the maximum terms of service, that is , about the demobilization of military personnel, but before starting a little sociology: the uncertainty of terms of service is among the main reasons that demotivate ukrainian men go to the army, these are the results of a survey by the research agency infosapience, conducted on the order of the data journalism agency teksty.ua in january of this year. at that time, more than 63% of respondents stated that...

the uncertainty of service terms is one of the main reasons why they do not want to join the armed forces. and this law was supposed to determine the terms of service. for example, in the initial version of the document , it was said that ukraine would introduce the demobilization of the military after 36 months of service. then, however, discussions continued, someone said that it was necessary to fix not 36, but 24 months, someone even talked about 18, which in principle looked completely unrealistic, but they allegedly stopped at the number 36. however, the day before. of the bill on mobilization, the specialized defense committee of the verkhovna rada removed the provision on demobilization and rotation of military personnel. these provisions were excluded at the initiative of the commander-in-chief of the armed forces oleksandr syrskyi, as evidenced by the extract from the letter of the commander-in-chief to the minister of defense rustem umerov, which we received at our disposal. this issue was discussed at the government meeting yesterday. the cabinet supported the decision after which the ministry of defense turned to the specialized committee, whose deputies also supported the decision. extremely fast. everything

happened, according to syrskyi's letter to umerov , the head asks to consider the issue of rotation and demobilization not in this, but in another separate bill. individual provisions of the draft law, in view of the significant number of parliamentary amendments, require a more detailed analysis and additional study, taking into account the above, the question of grounds for dismissal from military service, as well as introduction at the legislative level, is proposed rotations of military personnel in... to be regulated separately by consideration in another draft law. well, as for determining the maximum terms of service, some say that in a country where an aggressive and full-scale war is going on, there can be no demobilization, there can be vacations or rest, but not demobilization. others say that the military is so tired that some of them really need either early rotation or even demobilization. we asked people on the streets of kyiv, of course this is not sociology, but we asked them. about their moods, like them

feel that, as of now, the provision on demobilization has been removed from the law on mobilization, listen to their answers. the people who have been protecting us in the trenches for more than two years have the right and should, well, have the opportunity to return home to their families, and not to be given a short vacation for a couple of days as happiness. well, that's right. and i will not be surprised if there will be strong discontent already on the part of the soldiers, which is much worse than discontent. people who have a knack for it, and have to fight, and they can do it, they don't need demobilization, and those who were mobilized, and they don't have the knack for it, they need to be demobilized, so it's twofold, i can't you, i just take them there, i just know what it is, i don't have guys they ask for demobilization, they want leave, just leave, want to see their family and that's all, it's very difficult for us to talk about it, because... this is the first question to ask

the military who are at the front, because it affects them, and us civilians, well for now, but we must understand that they, every man, every military man has the right to rest, to return after some hard, so to speak, work, yes, and the fact that it is being postponed is this... well, it is alarming, because it needs to be decided, but in this very law, or in to another, it is difficult for me to say, i cannot answer, but this issue needs to be resolved, of course, so i know that it is very important, because i have girlfriends and a husband and a brother who are serving at the front, at ground zero, as they say, and i know how hard it is to be mentally and physically tired, so of course.

that it is very important, very important, to be honest, i walk around and see how many handsome young men there are who could replace our soldiers at the front, well, this is my personal opinion, of course. we all want victory, but someone has to bring it closer, right? sorry, such a topic is very difficult for me, that 's why yes, i believe that the law should be made more complex, stricter, more demanding, otherwise everything can be very bad. the latest news that the separate clause on demobilization has been postponed is actually a bit of me confusing, let's say so. and why can you tell in more detail? eh, well, i understand well the military, their position, they all went here a lot, not all of them, of course, someone was mobilized, many went as volunteers, and they just as much want to go home, they

just as much want to go on rotation, they want to know what sooner or later they're going to be replaced, and when they were, i'm sure, scrolling through this news feed and saw that the demobilization piece was shelved, they... they were very, very upset, and it's probably a huge disappointment to them, that point, it's nothing wouldn't changed radically, because it is necessary to approach the issue more comprehensively and still solve the issue by means of a draft law on demobilization, and not an item on demobilization, and currently the question has been raised about the development of a draft law that will comprehensively cover all issues of demobilization, rotation , and so on, ie you support to consider? it is separate, after all, as it is now, and i did it, i think that it is more still, it is probably more visible to the legislator, how to support or introduce it, so they do the best. what do you think about issues of demobilization, you can write in the chat

under this video, especially your opinion is valuable if you are in the army, or your loved ones, relatives, friends are in the army. maksym skubenko, junior sergeant of the fifth, joins our broadcast. of a separate kyiv assault brigade. maxim good evening. yes, good evening. how did you personally perceive the news that the rule on demobilization, this rule will not be in the draft law. absolutely, completely calm. let's, well, face it . very deep in the heart, probably everyone who has been fighting for a long time hopes that demobilization will be, but also. everyone who came to fight for his country, he also understands that demobilization during the war is a rather dubious story, and it is such an internal conflict, in fact , it is strong enough, and there is, unfortunately, no simple answer to this, i cannot say completely there is a simple recipe, i can say yes, indeed

, demobilization is not an item in the law, because we have a war going on in the country, of course, the rule is necessary... the rules are always needed, because they allow us to remain in the legal environment, they allow us to understand what awaits us in the future, to understand that we are not fighting for nothing, not to live, or rather not to survive, but to live in a future country that will develop, and therefore the legal field, those who are now says why they removed point one, well, let's return it. this point is some, no one knows which one, no one knows whether it will not conflict with some other points of the legislation, the legislation is a difficult story, i'm just maksym, i'm just , since you've already started talking about it, i'll remind you that it was assumed at the very beginning that after 36 months of service

a soldier could demobilize, and for those people who joined the army at the beginning of a full-scale invasion, that period would have expired there in march. february next year, and as i understand it, during that time those who wrote this rule from the beginning, or those who advised writing it, anticipated that during that time other military would be trained there, and it looks like it is very prompt out of the blue, right on the last day, someone i changed my mind, well, unfortunately, i don't know all the details. i don't know how the preparation was, i wasn't there, i'm not in kyiv, i can say yes, i came with many volunteers on the first day and there were very few of us left, and it's a lack of preparation, but on

the other hand i i see from those who have been preparing for a very long time, but the reality is different from what you are taught, there is also no simple recipe here, but i am not sure that we have these... trained people who are ready to come if the rest are demobilized, and here it appears then the natural question is if everyone is suddenly demobilized from... in 3-6 months, with the exception of some part who will sign contracts, who will want to continue fighting to defend their country, but let's say the majority is demobilized and people without experience will come, even those who have studied, and unfortunately, i think it will end very , very badly, well, this is my inner conviction and my experience in this war, it will end badly and... then it is logical that when the enemy feels it, when the muscovites march on kyiv, ugh

ugh -ugh, i don't know where to spit, so what will happen with these demobilized people, they will not leave, that's right, they will go to fight again, but in much worse conditions. maxim, please tell me, but i heard your attitude, you are quite calm about this, but what do your comrades say, these girls who serve with you, they are the same, they adhere to the same calm rhetoric, you must understand, that in the war in combat units, i speak calmly, because i have a lot of experience of speaking calmly in stressful conditions, but emotions always go overboard, and when i spoke about internal conflict, that is, in the majority of whom i personally... communicate with the majority of my brothers, with people who came with me and

are still alive, or who came after that, but are now fighting, they also do not have any unequivocal opinion or an unequivocal decision, it is always about the fact that it will either get worse, or we, or it will be bad now, for us, i do not say so bad. in general, but someone will feel bad, or those who come to replace us, or we will feel bad in the future, i want to go home, i really want to go home, you won’t tell me, i can tell you here, well many hours, how i want to finally go home, and at the same time, i am afraid to imagine what will happen even internally to me, if i go home and something... here will happen, well, this, unfortunately, is war - this is such a philosophical story

of internal conflict , unfortunately, and if we return to the draft law on mobilization, we talked about the fact that the provision on demobilization was removed from it, you personally, what do you expect from this law when it is adopted, what do you count on, what decisions are you waiting for, rather justice. you know, if we have clear confidence that we have trained rotational personnel who have passed the third line, the fourth, the fifth, then the third, then the second, then the first, and yes, they are ready, we are equipped, we have equipment, we have weapons, we are holding on and we go on the offensive, and then they tell us, look, in this law it will be, you can already demobilize, but in case... if there is an escalation, well, clearly written criteria are important for me, clearly written,

then you return, ugh, well, i just have to state here, maksym skubenko, junior sergeant of the fifth separate assault brigade of kyiv, i must state that maksym quite calmly accepts the news that demobilization, at least in this bill on mobilization, is not provided for, but we also looked, or rather, collected reactions in social networks other military personnel, including, and you can listen to other comments on this topic. there will be no demobilization, will everyone serve? no, let others live life, and you live, until there is nothing left of you. i don't care that you don't have health anymore, and even less of you. i i understand people who don't follow the summons, because there are no clear rules of the game, go for a year, or maybe five, as it happens, lose your business, your family. it doesn't matter, we turn into a savok, where the cadets in cleats paint the fence, and the main thing is

to get more traffic. the new law on mobilization, a brief summary. there will be no mobilization, no demobilization. without mobilization , there will be no dembel, this is natural, people are needed, no help from the west is worth anything without people, because someone has to shoot the tank with guns. to sit down, to say hello, etc., but obviously, with the new law on mobilization, the country is not going to recruit people, because there are no effective punishments for evasion in it, so, well... then we are preparing for significant concessions to the enemy. so, let's stop now. regarding mobilization, there are neither serious sanctions for whip dodgers nor serious preferences for newly mobilized gingerbread men in the draft law, so there will be no expected result of the influx of new fighters.

after demobilization, it will not be. therefore, there will be an unexpected result: an increase in the number of arbitrary abandonment of time. of purchased solutions vlk, do not return from vacations. the 777th day of a full-scale war and 777 days of being at war, i'm tired, that's why i'm writing to you from the beach, in the absence of a clause on demobilization, in the bill on mobilization, i don't see treason, everything's okay, i continue to sunbathe. and how can the army be demobilized if there is a war in the country? on the other hand, when there is a war, why does not everyone fight? in fact, i am also interested in how the authorities get out of the story about demobilization, because it is nonsense to abandon those who were the first to defend the country, and those whose contracts have expired. if if anyone dreamed of dembele this year, it is very naive. i will tell you more that

none of the politicians will make unpopular decisions about mobilization either, which means that we will serve and fight... as long as we can, one thing is not taken into account in the higher offices, that you will not get far on a driven horse, and that the flow of volunteers, as it came on 24.02.22, will continue to pour in. as for the exclusion of the draft law on demobilization, then what was bound to happen happened, today it is impossible to solve this issue within the term of 36 months of service, however unfortunate it may be, that's why... electoral dances in the parliament around this issue were notoriously empty chatter, they, at least, did not help to solve anything, in addition, they also harmed, because many who are fighting and their families formed some expectations , and now it will cause natural disappointment. dmytro martynenko,

a military serviceman and ato veteran, has already joined our broadcast. good evening. good evening. how are you personally? took the news that demobilization, at least for the time being, was being canceled, was negative, today the mood in the army is very difficult, the servicemen are very tired, those who are at the front, those who left, went to war in the 22nd year, and those who are mobilizing, they should be aware of the possibility of demobilization, not only because circumstances of death or very serious injury. and to what extent, can you explain in a little more detail, perhaps, how much, in principle, the issue of demobilization and rotation is acute in the army, very acute , today there are those, how to say, guys who today find 9-12 months are on combat duty, and this is not only

moral, it is also physically very difficult, and the fact that today there are such... the term guys on combat duty, this indicates the critical need for mobilization measures, that is, additional human resources, and not only . but do you understand the logic of such a decision, because i will remind you that from the very beginning, when this bill on mobilization was just being created, there were still discussions, there was a certain rule about demobilization after 36 months, and here it is literally a day before the vote on the amendment in the parliament this one the norm is allegedly there, well, not allegedly, but in reality, according to the request that syrsky stated in his letter, they are being canceled, do you understand the logic of why they did this? i don't really see the logic, that is, if mr. syrsky is not tired today, then those who directly perform combat tasks today, they

are really tired today and this, i'm saying that it's not normal in that there morally, physically there, but this is real fatigue toast uh, it’s like that in the way a person is, it’s just such a threshold, a person needs rehabilitation, at least, that is, every fighter today needs to rest, and for by some kind of special supervision, for example, rehabilitation measures. maxim, or maybe , maybe, dmitry, more precisely, or maybe the logic, i ’m just asking a question, is that the military or political leadership actually realized that... mobilization is not going as well as they would like, and the country , as needed, and as the military needs, and if it's there now in 36 months, in fact less than a year bare. front, then simply during this time they will not have time, they will not have time to train new recruits, train them qualitatively, and there are doubts whether, in principle, they will recruit the necessary amount, especially you heard against the background of these

statements from and from syrskyi and from shmygal that 500 thousand is allegedly not needed, that we did an audit there and everything is not so bad, and we can ensure rotation there thanks to those parts that are not were at the front, and so on, i don’t... i think so, well, today is 36 months, as practice has shown, yes, it’s the 22nd year, the mobilized can be trained in a short period of time, and today we still have, well, even though we have there is, i think, time to prepare necessary, necessary time to prepare new mobilized people for combat operations, and how about you do you think what will be the consequence of such a decision or today's decision to cancel for the time being. or the postponement of demobilization, i think that it will be even worse on the consequences of the front itself, today we see what is happening on

the front, it is very unfortunate, unfortunately, if it is easy to say, but in general, so good, do you think that it will be badly reflected on the front , you mean that tired people will get even more tired, there will be more and more of them, and there will be no replacement, well, we also see... as in practice, history, yes, the morale of a fighter - this is very important, and even when today our boys go through some kind of practice in training, they tell about it that the morale of a fighter must be at a height for the successful and effective performance of combat tasks, if there is no morale, then what are the successful performance of combat missions we can, please tell me, but now, if we talk about the bill on mobilization in general, there is a lot. everything is provided for and some certain punishment or restriction for people who evade, and it was promised that there will be provided some the motivational part for military personnel,

and it was about confiscation, well, in short, there are very, very many points, norms, provisions, it is not known in what form this law will be adopted in the end, but what do you personally expect from this law? well, honestly, i didn't see anything there from a real sanction for those who don't... going into the army today, i didn't see any real sanctions there, except there were fines, there was very little time to study realistically today's amendments, there what they introduced , and those, how to say, incentives for the mobilized, which are indicated there 150 00 for the purchase of a car, if the contract is signed for an unknown period, then this is a minor situation, i do not think that it really mobilizes society today. to go to the military, you know, i think that there should be a lot more candies, candies, so to speak, so to speak, for people who will be

mobilized into the army today, that is, they should know that their family and their future there is health, for example, if they are crippled or injured, so that it is protected today by the state, that is, it must be clearly spelled out and practically implemented. to the relevant state bodies, that is, if i understood correctly, you do not expect that this law will somehow strengthen, speed up or improve the mobilization, of course not, uh, but what, and what could be improved, you can detail, here is your idea, what could be improved, it probably won't be popular, but today it really can be... to improve it, i say the creation of some candies for payment , are you talking about payments or what do you call candies, i just pay it out, you know, to be

the narrative where to say that the servicemen first of all responded to their provision with satisfaction yes, that is, it did not happen , i will not detail, well, detail, no, you can tell in detail, it is very interesting, in fact , well, today, with medical, for example , provision, everything is very unfortunate, that is, many of my fellows go from office to office and they are just, well, sometimes you come across a doctor who tries to help from the heart, but most often it is probably so subjective to be a statistic, for 90% of cases such a situation occurs when a serviceman who is really injured or unable to perform combat tasks today comes to the doctor, and he says you are healthy, go, everything is fine with you, or when he goes to some institution for treatment, and this, well, a serviceman who does not have a law degree is faced with such through a bureaucratic machine to get

treatment, it's just horrible. well, it takes a lot of time to sort out these issues, and that is, we do, and if we go back, we can go back to the beginning, before our conversation about demobilization, you say that in the army your comrades, at least, because the experience is different, took this news negatively, what do you think, will there be some, i don't know, indignation in the army, or can it result in something concrete, and what kind of discontent is this? now it can be due to the lack of demobilization, yes, people can all go to prison, they will simply say, bye, we are enough, turn around and leave, they will say, we dare to serve time in prison, we will go to prison and sit, you have it as one of the m what examples of what can happen in the consequences, well, today we see on kharkiv, kharkiv region, suffers

every day and... if today we do not go to the front to defend and do it effectively, i.e. protect the country from the aggressor and our enemy, then this enemy will be everywhere, that is, the consequences of the same bakhmut there will simply take place all over the country, i think no one needs it, please tell me, recently even sociologists asked such a question, i will also ask you, judging by what you said, you are dissatisfied with how the mobilization is moving, you are dissatisfied with the motivational part mobi or do you think anyone is guilty of this? well, i, i can only, you know, we have, who is responsible for this, i will ask then, we have people, today in the state there, at any of the links there, there are people at one of the links who are responsible for state formation, mobilization there, well, all these law-making processes and so on, and those

who blocked this process, well, they are in this... to blame, it's the same as when i go on a combat mission, for example, and it's my fault, if i don't do it or if i don't do it well, it's my fault, and of course, the people who did it process, while we left in the 22nd year, today a lot of guys in the kyiv region died in the 22nd year, without even being mobilized and they cannot be given any status until now, that is, it also has a very bad effect today for this mobilization and so on, and we gave, so to speak , a loan... of the time that was necessary in order to create the necessary conditions for the mobilization of the population and for armed, so to speak, full-fledged resistance, but unfortunately, how much we already see for more than two years, yes the situation is happening and no, well, the question is sorry, dmitry, thank you very much for your comment, thank you very much, dmytro martynenko, ato veteran, military serviceman, we discussed

mobilization... and demobilization, thank you very much, well, what exactly will the law on mobilization in general look like in the end after its will be adopted, it is not known for sure at the moment, well, except that there will definitely not be a provision on demobilization, we know that for sure. i would like to remind you that during the consideration of the draft law by the committee , more than 400 deputies' amendments were submitted, some of them were taken into account, but they must will confirm more. by a separate vote in the verkhovna rada, you can see how these more than 400 amendments look clearly, deputy mar'ana bezugla showed about it, this is such a pile of papers, if the deputies work very quickly and pass the draft law, for example, tomorrow, then it is not means that it will enter into force immediately, then the president must sign it, after which it will become law in a month, the president can in theory sign for a long time, for example, the bill on lowering the mobilization

age, he signed it for 10 months, well... judging by zelensky's latest statements, he is interested in the speedy adoption of this very bill, and in his last interview the president even scolded the deputies, saying that they are delaying the process, and it will be surprising if, after such a statement, zelensky himself does not quickly sign the document, well at least zelenskyi has repeatedly said that he expects justice from the law. mobilization in ukraine is primarily a question of justice, he said in his january interview. listen to this fragment. question mobilization, first of all, i would still like to adhere to the very understanding of what it is for different layers of society. first of all, this is a question of justice, because there are people who have been at war since the first day, and the fact that they do not complain does not mean that there should not be an opportunity for people, ah,... to replace them from them.