therefore, it is very important that now, that now we do everything to ensure that these elections in october of this year are competitive, fair and open, and this is also, perhaps, the goal of the georgian dream, by applying this law, it will strengthen its influence on information space and do. more comfortable conditions for our own possible victory in october, therefore, unfortunately, a very difficult, very difficult period is ahead of us, but georgian society will fight for the european aspirations and prospects of ukraine and for our our cooperation and our friendship with our. first of all, with ukraine, i want

to clarify, i understand so correctly that this law will interfere, let's say with a grant of some kind of financing, of independent media that still remain in the cargo, not only, not only independent media, the fact is that we have very, very such a powerful non-governmental organization that oversees the election process, for example,

the benefit of the georgian dream, because, as i have already said, the information space will be completely different, of a different quality, and the control of the georgian dreams will be very, very powerful over this space, and it will be very easy for them to control this process and use it. the same administrative and financial resources that they have. thank you, thank you, mr. valerie. valery chichilashvili, a georgian diplomat, the former ambassador of georgia to ukraine, russia, and the republic of moldova was in touch with us. we 're going to break for just a few minutes, but please stay with us. tired of heavy and bulky saws, then strong saws from unpack tv are just for you. they will easily cut trees and

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from now on, you can immerse yourself in the atmosphere of football every monday at 22:00. professional analysis of matches, exclusive interviews, goals, saves, emotions, project, both for experienced fans and just for people who appreciate a non-committed view of football. football format every monday at 22:00 on the tv channel espresso. vasyl zima's big broadcast. two hours of airtime, two hours of your time, two hours to learn about the war and what the world is like, two hours to keep up with economic and sports news, two hours in the company of your favorite presenters, presenters who have become familiar to many, and as well as distinguished

guests of the studio, the events of the day in two hours, vasyl zima's big broadcast, a project for smart and caring people, espresso in the evening. the premium sponsor of the national team represents. united by football, stronger together. from now on, in a new two-hour format about ukraine, the world, front, society. you can express your opinion on the bad day with a phone survey. verdict with serhii rudenko. daily. weekdays from 20 to 22. we continue the politklum program on the espresso tv channel and from georgia to moldova. vladyslav kulmynskyi, former vice-prime minister for reintegration of moldova, executive director of the institute of strategic strategies,

political expert in nask. congratulations mr. vladyslav. good evening, vitaly. thank you for the invitation. so, we see that another one is unfolding around moldova. i would say with with russian participation, and the very fact that a new anti-such a democratic , anti-european, pro-russian bloc is being created right in moscow, so that there are no longer any doubts under the name of victory in the russian capital with the participation of ilan shor and political forces, all of which are essentially financed by this businessman, for what is it anyway, what does it look like? well, first of all, it was quite expected, because now the situation in moldova is turning into such a proxy conflict, it is not a proxy war, but it is such a proxy conflict. well, what is the main goal now russia in moldova? this is, first of all, the creation of a satellite country in its own sphere of influence.

russia cannot achieve this through military means, and it achieves this through its proxy forces. that is the main purpose of this. forces is to prevent moldova from joining the european union and leave moldova in its own sphere of russian influence and create another threat for ukraine and romania. let me remind you that moldova has two neighbors - ukraine and romania. if we talk about the real influence of this bloc, to what extent can it really be a serious force during the parliamentary elections? very great question, because you know, no matter how strange it is, the fact that this block was created in moscow, yes, i am also good news for moldova, because you know, i think that moscow in general now very poorly

understands the social, political, economic processes in the so-called post-soviet countries, or rather, maybe she understands them, but she refuses. to recognize them, it refuses to recognize that other political nations were formed in these countries, there are other views, there is another political class, and so on and so forth and the like, and well, moscow, since this is a project of moscow, it practically determines the program of this bloc by itself, well, relatively speaking, what they are offering now for moldova is a moldovan gypsy woman and katyusha, or else... the same practically, it is the entry into the eurasian union or the geopolitical wing of russia, all this has not worked for a long time, because we will all understand very well that in our countries there are already other political nations, already other socio-political processes, you can at least

sing the katyusha there naked, but it won't help much, that's it it seems to me that all these slogans with which this political bloc comes to the moldovan language. domestic political scene, this is probably the main goal - to get as much money as possible from moscow, but it will not have these, these... kerosene and this program, it will not have such a powerful influence on moldova. for example, i could tell you, because these are different examples, but for example, what was the influence of medvedchuk on ukraine, how much money did he take from moscow in order to promote geopolitical goals in ukraine, the whole of moscow, and what? so, and you know, if these, this ideological program, if it were built by local people, it would probably turn out much better than what happened in moscow.

it's not about, i think it's more about the fact that this bloc, it's different from what was built before, in that it's more ready to destabilize, it's more ready to take radical steps that may be the main goal of russia in this sense. but what is happening around? authorities in gagauz, because we saw this story from with the arrival of bashkan, this autonomous, this autonomous, how to say, autonomous entity, probably in the pockets of evgenia hutsul, an associate of ilan shooro, her foreign passport was taken away, there are even real such stories around her with possible detention, which she talks about all the time, such the impression that moscow has decided that gagauzia is... much more realistically activated in terms of influencing the situation in the country than in

transnistria? yes, it is, it is, because the authorities have been working for several years to, well, settle, to maintain the situation in transnistria, and the authorities have succeeded in this way, because now, now, no one expects that... transnistria may face some kind of threat, but the situation with gagauzia is different, and there they can, well, there is some, there there is a threat, there are problems, but we must say that there are no common borders, i.e. destabilization, it makes sense when, codes, when what will be done there, it is possible to support it, and if it cannot be supported, then what that makes sense, huh? that is, well, the situation is generally under control, but, well, you know how, russia

no one will agree with the fact that moldova practically says that we are leaving your, your sphere of influence, and we are no longer interested in this, here is russia with this, i think that she does not agree with this, and in moldova now there is such an expectation that you know, after that, how it goes, how it is ideological. if the invasion does not work, then these proxy forces can move to destabilizing actions, and the institutions of power must be ready for this, and it will be such a very serious challenge that will practically, well, demonstrate how capable the institutions of power are years before that, so the referendum on moldova's accession to the european union is simply, let's say, another important one. the government's step, which should ensure that sanda has support in the presidential elections, because she will

be identified, obviously, with this course, or is this still such an important part, if you will, of opposition to these pro-russian forces? both one and the other, because yes, this is a very important part of the pre-election program of the president, and it is a way, well somehow... to finally enshrine this path to the european union in the constitution of moldova. well, you know, russia very much it is important to show that masandu does not control the situation, that masandu is war. and you, you imagine, if, for example, in moldova, the vast majority of people say no to this referendum, what a good propaganda video it will be: the people of moldova choose russia. the people of moldova said no to the european union, the people of moldova refused the eu and so on and so forth, but i am now

sure that this will not happen, because probably somewhere around 65-70% of the population of moldova are in favor of this path, they understand very well, what the government does makes a lot of mistakes, but what as for the path to the european union, almost no one encouraged him. but the fact that moldova has actually now become independent of russian gas supply, how could this happen at all, you remember that at the beginning of mrs. sandu's rule, when she... was elected president of moldova, when the first pro-european governments were formed, then it seemed that moldova is simply in such an energy trap from which there is no way out, how did the government of moldova manage to achieve this energy independence? circumstances are the first, and the second is, well, practically politics moscow, because somewhere in the middle of last year, or

not, two years ago, practically moscow. put moldova in impossible conditions, because they, because they did not supply half of the gas supply, so moldova was forced to look for other sources of gas supply, and they found, found, that is, we can, we can say that russia because they tried to force moldova there to some, i don't know what, due to the fact that they limited the volume of gas supplies, they practically gave moldova a gift to moldova, because moldova yes, it became practically independent from supply of gas from plants, but transnistria, where does it get gas from, now from russia, from the russian federation, yes, that is, they

get free gas, but what will happen when ukraine stops supplying this gas through its pipeline, is that possible? yes, this is a very , very, very serious issue now, and the government is currently working on it, and there are many different options for how this could happen, but stopping this supply would be a very serious challenge for moldova and and for the entire region. if we talk about the development of events on to the transnistrian track, that is the moment when this congress of deputies at this level in transnistria, many feared destabilization of the situation from this side, can we now say that it does not exist? it can be said that the government in this sense worked very professionally, this is what the government did in the sense of, well, somehow this threat

was practically uh through negotiations, negotiations, it is no longer there. for moldova, but this does not mean that destabilization is impossible in moldova, as i told you, gagauzia, internal political struggle, all this will be very, very difficult for the government this year and next year, well, it turns out that it is even possible to negotiate with teraspol, not taking into account the influence of moscow today, not necessarily, no, it is possible, possibly to negotiate. about not escalating, about management, about managing the conflict, this does not mean that it is possible to talk about the settlement of the conflict, because these are two different things, because now neither teraspol, nor kisheniv, nor kyiv are interested in something exploded there, that's it, if you, if you look at

what, what the ministry of foreign affairs said affairs of ukraine, they emphasized that... the only way to resolve the conflict or to the management of this conflict is the way of negotiations, it is the way of diplomacy, and they generally called on kisheniv and teraspol to increase the number of their contacts and , in general, all negotiations about to maintain the situation at a different level. if we talk about the presidential elections, ms. sando has an undeniable chance of winning, will there be any candidate who... can really be a competitor? yes, they, they have not decided yet, these competitors may still be, but, there is not much time left before these presidential elections, i will remind you that they will be on october 20, and it is already so very, very little time, time for this, i

would like to emphasize once again what the expectation of destabilization is. and this is the biggest threat, yes, because if there are any protests, clashes, then russia and all the proxy forces of russia in moldova, they will try to say that moldova, that the government does not control the situation, that it is a bloody government, well, you know all this whole development, the development of events, which you are maybe, so there is nothing new here either, because we have seen other empires. which have been disintegrating for a very long time, if you take the british empire, the french empire, in algeria, the dutch empire, portugal in angola, belgium in the congo, there are very, very many things. or something like that happened there, and it is very important for young people now that the institutions of power work professionally, so that they find an answer to these security challenges that

will certainly arise. thank you, mr. vladyslav, vladyslav kulmynskyi, former deputy prime minister on issues of integration of the republic of moldova, executive director of the institute of strategic initiatives, political scientist, we are in touch. thank you for this conversation, and we're going to take a break just for a few minutes to give back. to the dialogue in the studio after the commercial has passed. more in the joints it is so piercing, it does not allow me to move, i bought a yellow dolgit cream at the pharmacy, it saves me from the pain of rheumatism. dolgit - the only yellow cream for pain in the joints and back. there are discounts on vizyn, 20% in psyllanyk, bam and oskad pharmacies. we will not die in paris, now i... legend of the ukrainian rock with an exclusive program kyiv meet the dead rooster band accompanied by a string quartet of the best selected

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the points of sale. there are discounts on zipellor of 15% in psyllanyk, pam and oskad pharmacies. what to do when there is a liver? alohol, but what for bile? alohol, he and the liver. with care and respect for the liver and bile premium, the sponsor of the national team represents united by football, together we are stronger, we continue the political club program on the espresso tv channel, our guest is vadym prystaiko, diplomat, former minister of foreign affairs of ukraine. ambassador of ukraine to great britain. congratulations, mr. vadim. good evening. well, today is the president says that the majority of countries in the world should force russia to make peace,

this summit is to be held in switzerland, at which, by the way, not only president zelenskyi and president biden are expected, so it really is a representative summit from a diplomatic point of view, but the question arises, to what extent the world can really force russia to do something, what is needed for this from a diplomatic point of view? i am afraid. to disappoint our listeners and surely the solution to this question does not lie in, you know, in the plane, let's gather 60 plus countries and suggested something to putin that he will be forced by the pressure of our authority or the pressure of these large numbers of people, big bosses like that and biden and all the others will come and he will say: you know that i was really wrong, now i understand everything and the war is over , thank you all, goodbye, because what he's doing, well, it's really... what he's doing is for himself, not for us, not for the united states. at one time, remember, there was such an idea that all he wanted was respect. and so, if this respect is shown to him at the level of the greatest

bosses, then entering this club. in two or three he will calm down and then everything will be normal, obviously this is absolutely not enough for russia to calm down, not only putin, in this context surkova is very interesting, i wonder if you have seen the article putinism as a method of governing russia for the next 100 years, but it is no longer unmanaged democracy, it is already putinism putinism, yes, he says that even after putin as such, the very concept of putinism as a method of managing the state will exist and this is our future, our management, he is obviously trying to return. very, very carefully, understanding that her arrival is a certain resource that should be spent by biden, he must bring a result, because the second arrival may not happen, what type of result, well, of course it happens that when the leaders gather, they immediately expect that

they will come will mean something, yes, as i recall, there was a huge scandal in the state department when the us president went to the bukharev summit, and despite ukraine's support for the nato map, this was not done, and here is the showdown that happened, how did our great leader come, and the decision we wanted was not made, i would also calculate what will happen now, something like this must happen so that biden does not leave disappointed, well, more so from a diplomatic point of view. a tough resolution, well, i understand your tone in your voice, because the military will probably not make any significant changes until june, i hope that it will not happen in favor of russia, i would like it to be in our favor, but until june we will not even receive income new weapons, which are already our partners proposed, so it should be expected that there will be some kind of political dancing with a tambourine around the fire

and... appeals to the parties and so on and so forth and so on, but i would like to ask about the appeals to the parties, now we see that china is playing absolutely independent political game, by the way, he did not play such a game, this is a completely new trend, when they say that we want to hold a conference ourselves, we are ready to provide a platform, let russia and ukraine talk on our platform, while lavrov says that switzerland is no non-playing country, this is generally an enemy country, by the way, this is also a new word in world diplomacy, so about switzerland. no one named, and this despite the fact that they are afraid to give us even cartridges from those german installations that were once bought and written off by them, well, they do not sell weapons to ukraine and do not allow weapons of their own production to be sold, well, i also see that china, well, you remember, this was a very interesting insult of china, when china called on its partners in the west not, relatively speaking, not to criticize china for intervention, and let's say on one side

we will not allow with such a harsh... that china he is doing everything it can to reduce tensions in the whole world, for the sake of everything good, against everything bad, but we do not see a clear chinese position, and those positions that were expressed in the program and with which the special envoy went around around the world, well, obviously these were pen tests, because none of the countries bit, and in principle the continuation of this dialogue did not take place, but from the point of view of china, chinese diplomacy is a normal course, they traveled around, they demonstrated their presence in process that, that there was no result, it was done , it is normal for them, they have a longer planning horizon, they will wait, well, here is the question in general, maybe we live in a non-standard world, where diplomacy no longer plays such an obvious role, because diplomacy is important when there is no force as an instrument of the main one, and when in fact the bet is on force from all sides, what role can diplomacy play at all, i apologize, this may sound ironic again, i remember that once upon a time we had a minister of economy there in the 90s,

it was absolutely not... they understood what he was for we need it, and now i have the impression that we will not need a foreign minister soon, because we have allies supporting us, and in any case this is not some diplomatic achievement, it is simply their reaction to aggressive affairs of russia, and russia does not want to go to any diplomatic solutions, and what are diplomats to do, you know, i agree with you, how unpleasant it sounds to me, for my entire career, i just have to put a stop to it, i often i speak when meeting with students, for example, who are going to become diplomats, that... it's too late the profession is not only dying, it's already dead, in particular because the leaders communicate with each other, but also the decisions that are made, they don't need these negotiators, who we were from the very beginning and remained there, i don't know 16 of the 15th century, when the profession was more or less formed, and indeed from the moment of the negotiations, well, let's say, minsk ended, this era of minsks, when they were last under diplomacy, and in fact more and more...