even to this day, i am already silent about the countries there in latin america, africa, for example, there is a large part of asia, eh, what is happening in ukraine, it is happening in their opinion, well, almost in the sphere of influence, by and large the russian federation , they still live in this stereotype that this is some former soviet union, and accordingly, the fact that there are some wars between them, it is inside the so-called soviet union, russia as a great nuclear power. the state, well, not the one that has the right, but it can afford it to do such things. unfortunately, there is such an opinion, i will say more, i met it even in completely academic scientific articles, it certainly did not sound as straightforward as i say about it, but its essence was, by and large , just like that, and this is what people talk about , who studied russia in detail, researched russia, and they shift responsibility to a large extent for this war partly on ukraine and even more on the west, which invaded the sphere of influence. of the russian federation, and

russia reacted accordingly. and the third reason, she the most banal, it is very simple, but it is also the most terrifying at the same time. in the west, you know, the democratic west, today there is no understanding of how to defeat russia in general and what to do with russia, this is the key point, what must be done so that the spread of this racism, this model that i am talking about mentioned, which is popular where. which other countries were not in the future in principle, they do not know, they are not that they are confused, they are working on various scenarios now, but they do not know which the scenario will be implemented, and if at first they were able to find an answer somewhere to the question of how to prevent ukraine from losing, well, they never found an answer to the question of how to allow ukraine to win, and accordingly, how to lose to russia and what to do with russia afterwards, which will lose, because, unfortunately, the parallel with nazi germany in 1945 will not work. because no one is occupying russia now,

plus nuclear weapons, plus completely different territories there, a completely different size, well, the geopolitical situation in general, it is very different 45th year is different, and here are all three factors, they in their totality lead to the fact that the world very often tries to avoid altogether the question of what to do with the russian federation, they will certainly support us, we do not need to doubt it, and they it is demonstrated. but will they take the next step, will they decide among themselves that russia should be, uh, well, held, let's say, responsible for what it has done, and that efforts should be made to destroy, from the outside, that doesn't mean some kind of intervention or war, that regime which was built in russia, but western countries do not have an answer to this question to date, and the problem here is that i would very much like to be wrong, but i do not yet have facts that would... indicate the opposite, i am afraid , that

even we do not have such a plan, that is , to understand, and what to do there in a year, two, five-10, if the war ends, when the war ends, we will win there, but what will happen to the russian federation, what will happen to the regime, which is currently built there, we already have a very thorough analysis, and recently they presented a very thorough study there, the scientists of the kuros institute did it about current russia, about the regime, but well, predictions. well, in fact, it is not enough, these forecasts must be developed at the state level, and we must act as initiators in order to attract the attention of western countries, as churchill, by the way, once did at the first stage, whose country was already at war, and the united states was still no, who was already making certain plans and thinking about what to do with nazi germany, and he was able to attract attention and then unite around it other allies, who also entered this war later, that's the world for now. thinks while our

western partners are thinking about what to do with the russian federation, but at the same time they support putin, the fact that representatives of six european states were at the so-called inauguration of the so-called president of the russian federation shows that despite everything, despite the elections, which took place, or putin's pseudo-elections, which took place in a neighboring territory, a neighboring state, in temporarily occupied territories in... ukrainian states, and this is already an excuse to say that the legitimacy of these elections cannot be confirmed, but representatives of six european countries appeared at this inauguration, the united states of america said that they do not recognize the results, or do not believe that these were free elections, but he says he agrees with the fact that putin is the leader of modern russia, why the members of the european union, in particular the united states of america, the legitimacy

of putin and how it threatens the world, that is , what will happen as a result of this, when he comes to power brought again? it is a dictator who has a warrant from the international criminal court, who is a war criminal, and the whole world says: well , listen, there is no other, but putin, well , no way, but somehow they were crowned or elected there, that is, he is the vassals, the vassalage, or and they come to this compromise, what does this such a painful compromise bring for the world in the future and in the near future? in the future, mr. oleg, well, this is a classic dilemma of choosing between war and shame, it is clear that the world is moving along the path closer to shame, but not falling there, but definitely not to be ready, not being ready to walk on the edge of the knife called war, and

this is a certain worldview choice, this is a certain model of response, i think that it appeared for a reason now and is articulated in this way, first of all, it is certain.. . has become a tradition that a whole series of regimes with which the same united states cooperates in one way or another, not formally recognizing their leaders, not recognizing the election processes and saying that they are dictators, but nevertheless, because in on the african continent, in asia, in latin america there were such examples, the united states nevertheless interacted with even nominally humanitarian regimes there. secondly, there are moments of negativity. inoculation of the situation in belarus and venezuela, in which cases not only the elections, but also the dictators elected in quotation marks in these elections were not recognized, and accordingly, after that they did not know what to do, because they de facto

remain in power , they actually de facto concentrate this power in their hands, they make decisions, but it is impossible to talk to them, accordingly, you have to use the services of... through third parties parties and those who maintain communications with them capitalize on this, that is , to say that it hits these dictators so critically that after that they perish these regimes, no, it does not hit, and therefore after, especially venezuela, to a lesser extent belarus, but nevertheless, most likely, conclusions were made that contradict the declared values, but lie in the plane of pragmatism and understanding. or ineffectiveness of such a mechanism at the moment, and the third point is that it is a minimization of the risks that putin will develop mechanisms and plans to force him to talk to himself, that is, by raising the stakes, to force

western leaders to take a step to call him, or meet, or send some messages, etc., understanding that russia still has certain escalation mechanisms, reaching to... a nuclear warhead, which russia immediately decided to get and shake, that is to shake with it, this nuclear voyeurism, of course, it annoys the world, first of all, by the way, it causes serious concern irritation in china, to a lesser extent in europe , in the united states we also saw that the situation with the reaction is more calm and more mature, which is pleasantly impressive, but nevertheless, such factors still remain in russia, which can hurt it and , accordingly, they do not want to give ground. putin is not at all surprised by this, regarding the six european countries. france also wants to preserve the possibility of communication with russia, not to recognize putin, not to recognize the elections, but nevertheless to keep the embassy and diplomatic relations. for them , this is necessary in order to sit on equal footing communicate with beijing, with delhi, with

washington, who have contacts with russia, and accordingly, so that france is not in a more vulnerable position and is not less subject in part. conversations about russia and in the part where certain communications may be needed, to transmit some messages to the kremlin, or from the kremlin to the elysee palace, on the contrary, and accordingly the presence of the ambassador here is important. of course, in france they tried to refrain a little, but then, when it became clear that it was resonant, that their ambassador was taking part, it was done communiqué, which clearly states that the participation of the ambassador does not mean that they recognize putin, it does not mean that they recognize the election. process, it only means that they have an embassy in moscow, and their ambassador took part in the protocol event. by the way, the spokesman of the foreign policy service of the european union , peterstano, says that the participation of several eu diplomats in the so-called inauguration of putin on tuesday does not call into question

the position of the european union on supporting ukraine. he also explained that the european union did not refuse to recognize vladimir putin as the president russia, since they could not reach a consensus on this issue in this country. members of the european union, but we know that the european parliament adopted a resolution questioning putin's legitimacy, and we know that the resolution has recommendations. nature, that is, it is a declaration, a recommendation nature, mr. igor, what do you think, can putin get the status of a self-proclaimed president in the near future, or will anyone dare to do it, except for ukraine, of course, because it immediately puts all the emphasis on the status putin and as to whether it is possible to negotiate with him at all, whether it is necessary to negotiate... and in general, do

putin, who was crowned yesterday in the kremlin, have any prospects? look, i'm afraid that he will not receive the status of self-proclaimed president, and this will continue, well, at least until the end of the war in ukraine. here one could try to draw some parallels between him and lukashenka, but there is one nuance that is very important and which is well understood in the west: putin's. unlike lukashenko , there is no competitor who would say that he or she won the election, and the answer, but these, well this victory was stolen, putin did it more cunningly here, and the elections were held almost without competition, some candidates there gained something, but he won by a landslide, and even today many countries do not have a formal reason to say that he is a self-proclaimed president, because he at least followed some sort of procedure there, and the history of these statements, both on the part of the united states and on the part of

many other democratic countries, is simply a recognition of the actual state of affairs. here as, to things, putin doesn't need to be very excited that someone there came to his inauguration, or some countries, the same united states, said that we there, well, like, recognize him as the de facto president, because in fact, they expected a completely different presence , to a completely different representation at the same inauguration. and here piskov's irritated statement, which he made on the same day regarding many embassies and ambassadors who did not come to this inauguration, was very revealing, it was clear that they hoped that they will appear at this protocol event, well, at this protocol event, they did not do it, therefore, in fact, putin received such a serious blow to his ambitions and to his ego, even during this inauguration, that is, they expected that it would pass anyway still better with a larger representation than it actually was, but due to the fact that he,

well, at least the external image of these elections created, due to the fact that he is the head of the country that has the largest, well, or second in the world, there looking, how to count nuclear potential, it is clear that they will keep this gap with him for conducting some kind of negotiations, so that there would be an opportunity to pick up the phone and solve some issue there, well , god forbid, nuclear or some other... escalation, but look, we, on the other hand, do not it is necessary to look for some huge betrayal, why, because such an actual recognition, ukraine, i just want to say right away that ukraine did absolutely the right thing, we simply had no other choice, and our position is correct from the point of view of not recognizing it, since it has not been recognized for a long time recognizes ukraine, the president of ukraine and so on, but we don't have to worry about the fact that western countries will be ready to talk about something with putin on our behalf. no, for now, this actually indicates one thing, that if there is an urgent need,

they will talk to him about something, but on the other hand, something tells me that if some document is ever signed, which will concern russian-ukrainian relations, the russian-ukrainian war, the end, the suspension of this war there, we do not yet know in what format all this will be, then something tells me that there will be no putin as a signatory of these documents, putin would sign only one document that would guarantee him what he wants in principle, he will never get it in ukraine, and that is why here there is nothing to worry about, completely different people will sign something, and the negotiations will most likely be conducted on behalf of putin by other people, but not specifically putin himself, but for now we hope that putin will not sign and predict that he will not sign any ... documents, well maybe you meant a single document, he could sign, an act of capitulation of russia,

capitulation of ukraine, yes, yes, of course, this is a single document, or that he accepts half of ukraine as part of russia, and all this is recognized by the world community, he will sign this , everything else, well, this is not the story under which he will put his signature, but look, in moscow, hope that zelenskyi will not sign any documents on the part of ukraine either, because they are now dispelling zelenskyi's illegitimacy on this topic. after 20-20 on may 24, 5 years since president zelenska was sworn in, they are talking about the fact that, after this term, we generally, we generally... do not know who to talk to in ukraine, and whether it is necessary to talk, that , that russia is now trying so hard to turn this topic of illegitimacy or putin into the illegitimacy of zelensky, does this mean that in russia, russia is not going to negotiate with anyone at all, and it has only one goal, which is to destroy the ukrainian state,

mr. olezh, well you absolutely right, russia is instrumentalizing for... everything, look, russia replaced diplomacy with special services, and russian diplomacy today is nothing more than a ministry of external, foreign policy war, it is a kind of ministry of foreign policy attack, and if we talk about the church, russia long ago instrumentalized it, spying on it with agents and using the church accordingly as a ministry of religious warfare, the same is happening to all of us. directions, and instrumentalization, including information, transformation of mass media into mass media disinformation, the de facto propaganda ministry, and therefore they try to instrumentalize any information, and if there is none, then create it in order to subjugate it to the war, including statements, negotiations, diplomatic statements,

top officials, one of the interesting things, that in the western tradition, leaders of states usually do not lie, there are full-time people who, according to their obligations, can, say, tell half-truths, can misinform, can something later be attributed to mistakes or unprofessionalism or resign, but if something is said official representatives of the state in the international arena, then this is usually true, the words can be chosen in any way, and one of the surprises of many western...politicians about russia was that putin would come out and lie to his face, not only in front of the cameras, but behind closed doors, we can recall the same memories of mr. hollande or retellings of, say, merkel's words after a series of rounds in the norman format, and therefore

putin's words should not be taken as real thoughts, because here the west very often makes this mistake continuing this logic that, well, maybe putin takes it, well, but in general, if they sat down and stated their positions, then russia declares its position? no, russia never declares. russia keeps its own mind, everything that has been said, it is already happening within the framework of the introduction of total war. all that is said is to introduce the opponent's vomana. they play tricks, and cheat all the time. and that's why the thesis about the illegitimacy of president zelensky is an effort. play the game that they will not sit down at the negotiating table with zelenskyi, accordingly, it is necessary to change, accordingly, it is necessary to have elections, but here we had elections, but there they did not, and this whole story is the inflation of information bubbles of this lie in order to capitalize on it. in fact, the russian federation has only one goal, it is the destruction of ukraine, they have repeatedly voiced it, then tried to mask it, then they are pushing it again, we

saw it in buch, we saw it in mariupol, we see it in many other places, what is russia and what is russian interest. that's why it's precisely to be deceived by the fact that precisely because of the fact that in in ukraine, according to russia, the term of office of the president of ukraine has expired and because of this they will not talk now, so how many times before that they said that zelensky is illegitimate, how many times they called the post-maidan government in russia, they said that president poroshenko is illegitimate, and what did they say about turchynov acting as president at one time, yanukovych is still legitimate in them, so we listen less to russia. we are more concerned with what ukraine needs now in order to survive and win this war. russia will now be on abroad and in the middle of ukraine, of course, to expand this thesis as much as possible, to spread it as much as possible, regarding the illegitimacy of the ukrainian government, which is absolutely false. well, italian president sergio mattarella said at the un general assembly that peace in

ukraine is possible only when peace is restored. territorial integrity of the country, and will not reward russia for aggression. let's listen to what he said from the rostrum of the un general assembly. no state, no matter how powerful or equipped with a threatening nuclear arsenal, is not may even consider violating principles including the sovereignty, territorial integrity and independence of another country without facing sanctions. the position of the president of italy is quite clear,

although it seemed to me that the italians were trying to somehow maneuver in the russian-ukrainian war, and more so to putin, italy, well, made some curtseys, but we see that the president of italy is clearly saying that not should, should not be fenced off or. reward russia for aggression, but no leader and none of our western partners, leaders of the free world, really, as you say, mr. igor, it does not mean that we need to put an end to putin’s russia, or putin’s russia is spilling over there, and there is no such thing, putin is going to rule for another 20 or 25 years, well, at least under the current medical technologies, it may well be, that is, in general , he has some plans for the 30th or 35th year, i even start counting how old i will be at that time, and i think, my god, he is going

to live, well, considering the fact that gundyaev told him that he would rule until the end of the century maybe there in the other world too, it seems to me that it is not clear why, why the world cannot say, listen, this is russia, it poses a threat not only to russia, but also... to the whole planet earth in general, mr. igor, well, i think there are two reasons here: the first reason is nuclear weapons, well, they are objective, understand, no matter how we try to postpone them, they are there, but, but the second reason is more important, it seems to me, today in the world, in the democratic world, there is no leader, that is , there is no country or leader of any country who could take, or who could take responsibility, and then say: what you are absolutely right about, at the end, well , somewhere in the 70s and 80s, there were such leaders , the democratic world had a leader at that time, and they

in principle, the same reagan and partially thatcher and others, they just finished the soviet union, but then the leadership of the united states did not cause doubts, for example, and they used the tool of sanctions, they used the tool of mass culture, they used some others... tools and all this led to the fact that the soviet union collapsed and the cold war was lost by the soviet union. now, by and large , it was possible to use the same tools that were once used by western countries in opposition to the soviet union, the same sanctions, but in a slightly different format, not as they are today. then the same rate applies to the younger generation, especially since there is a certain category of russians who are older. about democracy, even if it was short-lived, it is, and it is is big enough, and these people, they remember the 90s not only as some kind of pregnant 90s in a negative way, which

putin constantly tries to talk about, for example, but they also remember it as a period of maximum freedom, the opportunity to say that they consider it necessary to discuss any topics, but this requires leadership, that is , someone must unite others not just from the rostrum of the united nations organization, but through specific actions. countries to take them with them and make it so that the russian federation, the regime that exists in the russian federation, it sooner or later ceased to exist, because this nuclear deterrence, which existed during the cold war, is largely preserved to this day, but other mechanisms have not yet been included and have not been brought to the level of it was, for example, in the 80s, maybe, well, something will change, and here, well, it just so happened that ukraine did not of its own free will, so... that we were attacked, we became the trigger for certain of these changes, but considering there are current circumstances, it is taking a little longer than we would like, and the margin of safety is

of the russian federation, well, in fact , it turns out to be larger than it was, for example, at that time in the soviet union. thank you, mr. igor, mr. oleg, literally a minute and a half has been on the air, how do you think putin's russia will end and when? the collapse of the system, and it can happen at any moment, even this year, even in a few years, they have a margin of strength, there is a margin of adaptability, but problems are accumulating and black swans are flying in, from where they are not expected, they say that by secret decree in ukraine, one of the russian rivers, the urals, was promoted to the status of a strait to a river, because a special water operation, in my opinion, did. russia is no less a disaster than a certain ukrainian unit, and such disasters are accumulating in russia, sometimes forests are burning, sometimes with the hospital system, they have problems everywhere, as

soon as it reaches the power block. it is he who is the only scraper on which russia is holding on, the square-nest method of placing security forces in russia, then we can see the collapse of the middle of the system, judging by everything, it must crumble to the very the end, and it can happen at any moment, an ear of corn on clay feet. thank you, on this optimistic note we will put an end to our wonderful conversation today oleg sahakyan, igor reiterovych were guests of our program today. thank you gentlemen for participating in the program. throughout our broadcast, we conducted polls. friends asked about this, do you see direct parallels between putin's and hitler's regimes, these are the results of a television poll, 95% yes 5% no, on youtube we have the following ratio, 93% yes, 7% no. that's it, my friends i put a full stop, it was serhii rudenko's verdict of provia program, i say goodbye to you until tomorrow at 20:00, take care of yourself and your loved ones. goodbye.

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there is a liver? alohol, but what for bile? alohol, it protects the liver and gall bladder, alohol with care and respect for the liver and gall bladder. it's 2 p.m. in ukraine. for your attention, a news release on the spresso tv channel. in the studio of iryna koval. greetings to all viewers. president of the european parliament roberta metsola came to kyiv on europe day. the visit was not announced in advance. so its details are still unknown. it is noted that mytsola's trip to ukraine is probably the last.