yourself and let's meet serhiy rudenko together, because the verdict program is starting, and it's definitely worth watching. good evening, we are from ukraine. today in the verdict program with serhiy rudenko, he wants to learn how to shoot. lukashenko confirmed that belarus will take part in russian... exercises on the use of non-strategic nuclear weapons. why did putin pull out his nuclear stick again. one of the pillars of the new world order. xi jinping met with the full support of the so-called chinese peace plan for ukraine from the prime minister of hungary viktor orban. results of the european tour leader of the prc. fair guarantees. of peace, zelensky

told why he is gathering world leaders at a global forum in switzerland, whether putin is really afraid of the upcoming peace summit. glory to ukraine, this is the verdict program, my name is serhii rudenko, i congratulate everyone and wish everyone good health. for the next two hours, we will talk about ukraine, the world, our victory, as well as what... actually happened during the last week in foreign policy, well, first of all, what happened in moscow, the so-called inauguration the so-called president, the so-called putin, sidney pini with the first european tour in the last five years, and in the role of china during the upcoming global peace summit, which is to be held in switzerland on june 15.16. we will talk about all this during our program, and here. there will be two programs, the first program

is with the diplomat and extraordinary plenipotentiary ambassador of ukraine valery chalymi, the second part is a journalist club, in which kateryna nekrecha and andriy yanitskyi, my colleagues, will be present, and it will start at 21:15. however, before how to start our conversation, let's see how our troops try to destroy with american grenades. russian occupiers, another enchanting video, let's watch it right now.

well, by the way, the m67 grenade, which was dropped on... a fighter from a drone, led to such an enchanting result: glory to the armed forces of ukraine, and death to the russian occupiers. friends, during this broadcast, we are working not only on the live broadcast of the tv channel, but also on our youtube and facebook platforms. for those who are watching us live there right now, so be it please subscribe to our pages on these platforms and take part in our survey. today we ask you the following: do you agree that democracy is more important for ukraine than the soviet union? i will explain a little

later, actually, what we meant by asking you about this and, because there is a survey of the kyiv international institute of sociology from the present and from four years ago, and there are certain numbers, we are interested to see what you think now about whether democracy more important for ukraine than a strong leader, yes, no, na youtube, it's quite simple, if you have your own opinion, you can leave it in... in the comments under this video, if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphone or phone and vote if you think democracy is more important for ukraine , than a strong leader, 0800 211 381, no 0800 211 382, ​​all calls to these numbers are free, vote, at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote, it will be interesting to see the ratio of votes, yes, no, i want to present today. of our

guest, who performed live in the kyiv studio, this valery chaly, diplomat, former ambassador of ukraine to the united states of america, chairman of the board of the ukrainian crisis media center, i congratulate you, mr. valery, congratulations, glory to ukraine, glory to the heroes. let's start our conversation with the so-called inauguration of the so -called president putin. on may 7 , 2024, for the next six years, putin takes the post of the leader of russia, and the most impressive thing in this whole story is that for the first time he becomes, in the fifth year he becomes president, but for the first time he becomes the holder of an international order criminal court, for the first time a person who... is accused of war crimes, and a person who held elections in the occupied territories of the ukrainian state, becomes the president of the russian federation, and the majority of the world agrees that he is the president, why no one asks the question, apart from

the european parliament, it was officially adopted in the resolution, why is no one talking about the fact that from now on we will call putin, as well as lukashenko, the self-proclaimed president of russia. there is another side to the question of what happened, well, the inauguration is not necessary democratic regimes, yes, that is, it can be an authoritarian regime, historically, you know, this is the transfer of some such divine anointing for the official, for the one who rules, exactly rules, exactly with the subjects, so what is different about this period of power, putin now , as he is in... and his entourage forever, it is not about six years, it is already about the kingdom, if it were not arranged in a certain framework, that is why we have two situations of two parallel worlds, one is fixed, as it were, on paper there and some formal measures are taken ,

are called elections, and the other is real, in which, of course, there are no credible elections, they know everything about it, and the fact that they are held in the occupied territory is the reason. also consider them invalid, therefore, in principle, there is today a complete non-recognition that the elections were held as legitimate, there is no such thing, yes, and then an absolutely correct question arises, if there are no real elections, then who is this person, well, they recognize him in their country, such people, as a rule, are kings, a king who comes by divine will or there not through elections, not through democracy, by heredity or, for example, there in... they have some kind of fifth blood group flowing there in patrushev, there putin and sechin and everyone, well, they come according to this principle, that is why it is strange, of course, that is why there is a question, the ministry of foreign affairs of ukraine reacted correctly about non-recognition in general, his legitimacy,

european politicians did the same, it is correct from my point of view, if we speak legally, from the international point of view, then it is correct to call him self-proclaimed... well, i don't know if he is a president, maybe a president, if they consider such a word in their right, self -proclaimed li, it's not a leader, it's not a leader, i have been calling a leader for a long time, i have been calling leaders for a long time, if i do not call others an epithet, that is, a person who is under, well, a person who is just a criminal and there is a warrant for him, this is the story, everything is fine in this situation, everything is fine they call it, well, a citizen , yes. there, but in this case he has been the leader for a long time, because his status, he does not correspond to any procedures, you could call him a tsar, if zhirinovsky had carried out this idea of ​​​​an emperor to the end, they wanted to make putin already, so that putin would come to rule the great

space, they planned so that it would be russia, ukraine, and belarus, and he would come to the restored soviet. the union, possibly without the baltic countries, will move on to kazakhstan, but it didn’t work out, that is, they broke down in ukraine, so now it’s such a bad king, well, let’s be the head of such a, well, essentially racist regime, i think that the term should be invented, by the way, it is very important that this terminology, even not only from the point of view of international law, but from the point of view of using historical analogies, so that it is somehow clear... because it turns out very it is strange, someone calls for correct grammar, whether to write with a capital letter, well , okay, there are no questions, you can write, but this will not make a criminal a righteous person, this will not make a fascist or his follower of goebbels a brainiac, will not suddenly become

a diplomat, you understand , that is, the problem, as the world looked at it, is now political, those who want a fair solution. western countries, ukraine, they still, well , the self-proclaimed president uses this terminology, and those who think that it is possible to somehow live so that it it happened somehow and imperceptibly, well... they try to continue to behave as if nothing is happening, well, but the fact that mr. valery did not put a full stop on legitimacy, does this mean that the world legitimized putin, right, no, if the world legitimized completely putin, he would not have such shame during the celebration of may 9, the victory, well, we can repeat, it is not easy, it is not easy as for ukrainians, yes, victory over na...tsm, but tragically with huge losses, with huge tragedies, how many people died, we do not

we can submit it anyway, that’s why we have this day on the eighth, well, which is fair from a historical point of view, but now the second, who came to him, well, it’s a shame, just look, he buried eurozes there, that’s four presidents, kelvizia . physically or politically, but this one is simple he is still holding on and they cost him 26 million dollars, which is a huge amount of money for them. fertilizers were given now after the moscow visit, that is, for survival and for

the preservation of power, so that guinea bessau, yes, maybe i am speaking so theoretically, maybe they talked about a naval base, because russia once wanted to build this base in gambia and did not they managed to twist the story there, and loos, and belarus, and you know that belarus was kind of strange this time, so that... with lukashenka, i don't know, they didn't take him to dinner, well, he was there ceremonial dinner, he was not there, they say that his shaygu at that time was bothering him, that come on, what are we going to do there in terms of the military, well , once again, but he did not have time to run after the other participants, because he has such an electric car there , now, well, he is no longer in such good health that he can talk so beautifully on camera, but in fact we know that he is seriously ill, so... to say that lukashenko was once again negotiating there, i i don't

know, because you know, even bilateral meetings like this are not pathetic there was, well, there was also a cuban, well, cuba, we know the history, that is, all of them had nothing to do with victory day at all, because victory day is, in principle, you rightly said that it is victory day, when they say, we can repeat, well, what a nation that lost many people in the second world... war can repeat, we can repeat, ukrainians can never say this, because they lost many, destroyed many cities, villages, german fascists and say, we now we can repeat when the ground is burning under our feet from the russian occupiers, that is , only people who do not know what war is, or have forgotten what war is, can say and support it, lukashenko says that he remembers something, well, i think he is completely inadequate now. evaluates, although perhaps from the point of view of his regime, he is adequate from the point of view of his interests, because just like

african countries, he is sitting on russian loans, and of course, he has nowhere to turn, well, he is afraid, he is afraid, because it is clear that he is afraid, he understands that , as in ukraine, he will not be able to, and he will not never planned, that's why he is building himself a palace somewhere near sochi, smaller than putin's, but i can see it for him. he already has the impression that lukashenko has nowhere to go in the world, remember, he used to go there looking for something for himself, where he could hang out, and now he has the impression that only in russia, well, that is, he is already everything, he is already he has already been taken into custody very seriously and will not be released, but i think that putin will be forever, well, until his death, until his physical, i don't think that in such a situation it is possible to get out politically. without consequences, no, it is either a physical story like this, or a gag, that is, here

already, they drag him on as much as possible, and the paradox is that, well, the paradox is not a paradox, but a real situation, which is not very favorable, that the longer the war goes on, on the one hand, he it is more difficult to keep the country, i mean the population, because it is like that, you know, they made an agreement, we are big, as long as they feed us there... we have something to eat and a minimum package of some kind, but if this is not there, we will immediately, well, what kind of king , the king can only be good, kind, successful, boyars can change there royal as soon as this agreement between the people and the tsar disappears, then a pickaxe flies to your head, that is, a revolutionary situation, in russia it will not end peacefully, we are suffering, because of their fools, sorry for this undiplomatic word, well, this top, well , they will cover them in such a way that i don’t know when it will be, for the fact that they will be covered hard, this purely black

swan will still fly in, there is no black swan, there will be, there will be, if it will be... to linger further , then a scenario that seemed unlikely becomes more and more, well at least possible for discussion, the defragmentation of russia, although putin and his entourage believe that they will, will not repeat the mistakes of the soviet union, they will already repeat them, the military budget, when the soviet union collapsed, there was 14.5% for military purposes, now already somewhere... they say six, but actually count eight, 8%, that is, what does this mean, it is from the gross domestic product, it means 30 percent of the budget, at least, this is only the open part, we also have, as we know, 50% plus, yes, we understand, war, well, that's what they are they hide in their citizens, and this will have to be taken from somewhere, someone has to work

in some professional high-tech products there. that's it, it will all end, it's forever, and russia shows itself to be much stronger than it actually is. there is a very important thing here, so that we do not make a mistake, because this is their approach, they will lie to the last, about the greatness, do you remember the tempest, when they launched, yes, yes, when everything was already falling, no, the tempest was flying, the countermeasure was strategic defense us, and the us a little they were bluffing, they didn't spend like that. which they talked about, that is, they think that we will not get into this whole story now, but they are dragging themselves there, if it was not our war with them, if it was somewhere, and russia behaved like this, it is probably us sat, if we were honest and watched, well, at this decline and where it will all lead, if everything did not concern us here closely, look, this is what putin

has been doing regularly for the past two years, he constantly... pulls out a nuclear card, with on the eve of the big invasion, macron flew to moscow, and putin said: "well, we are there literally in a week or two , the french president was there, he was already there rubbing his hands and saying that we can solve this issue in principle, because we have nuclear weapons, and he was completely satisfied that macron looked at him with horror then. now again putin takes out this nuclear map and again says that we will now conduct exercises and..." of nuclear non-strategic forces, that is, tactical nuclear weapons, lukashenko, you mentioned, it is obvious that gu also discussed these exercises that should take place on the territory of belarus, and what the belarusian dictator said, let's listen now, because he is already ready to get involved in this nuclear hysteria, he got involved partly by providing some places for the deployment

of these tactical nuclear weapons on the territory of belarus, and now he is also ready to train. to carry out, let's listen to what lukashenko said, in order for the machine gun to shoot, in order for the machine gun to shoot, it must be kept in normal condition, checked, lubricated and do other things, and in order to be able to use it and shoot accurately, you need to train, in our it the third training, i already said about it today, the russians can't count why we did it publicly, you see what... the escalation of tension continues, primarily from ukraine. lukashenko says something like that, he wants to practice how to use something with a pitchfork, or how to work with a scythe, you see, he says that, so what, he got a nuclear weapon, he practiced how to use tactical nuclear weapons, this is from a lack of understanding of the fact that what is going on, is he

also bluffing like putin, only in this bluff he is, shall we say, trying to... look to be more sincere and say, well, it’s like a machine gun, you just need to take it, reload it and see if it works or not, well, for the sake of fairness, it must be said that such training is conducted regularly, and for the component, including the nuclear component, that’s for sure , and if it were not a war now, then there would be no such respect for this, the problem is that now it is all less controlled. because russia came out of the regime of control, it must be said that the usa also at one time, well, they tore up, tore up a bunch of treaties, and now it is cracking at the seams, the entire system of international law. in the context of non-proliferation, today , when the treaty on the non-proliferation of nuclear weapons was joined, when ukraine was forced, they twisted their hands, well, we too, well, or so

the circumstances turned out, and we joined there, as a non-nuclear state, but this is all breaking down, and the countries of the whole world are looking at this, so there are two aspects here, the first aspect, are these exercises constantly carried out, or are they always taken out, for example, tactical ammunition with a nuclear charge, well, not always, as far as i know i know, both in soviet times and now, sometimes it is taken out, sometimes it is not, but this is a normal practice, which is not normal, that when it starts to be used from the outside and they start talking about it publicly, they start hinting at its use, this is what russia is doing, yes this falls under everything, under the nuclear convention, which cannot be threatened with nuclear weapons. that is , they violate all these things, which is important to understand here, firstly, from the point of view of the perception of all this in the international plan

, there is no difference whether it is a tactical ammunition or strategic, it is called a weapon of mass destruction, and from a military point of view, these are different things in terms of, well, primarily in terms of means of delivery and power. charge, so no one will consider now from the point of view of power, yes, all this will be considered from the point of view of the red line of the use of nuclear weapons, and the russians know very well that they have already been told this, and in china, well, beijing said it and washington , what will happen after that, that is, i will say this, an attempt to use any charge of nuclear weapons there, it is a loss. china for russia immediately, the loss of china is a chain, isolation, and this is the end of the war with a loss, they understand this perfectly, that is why now

they react to these threats in a different way than before, but what is important to understand for all of us, and perhaps for us, ukrainians, because i remember i see, when everyone was looking for some spies there, something else, and now they are reacting more calmly and quite rightly, so... until the first test, the test of nuclear weapons, and they haven't been for 30 years, to talk about in the future, it will be used somewhere, even at trainings will they try, it will not happen, that is, the first sign, it will be a test, russia has now withdrawn, as far as i understand, the ratification or signature already under this test ban project, that is, this... will be a moment from which it will be possible to talk about some difficult intentions, for the time being, for the time being, as kirby said in a state in the white house, he said

something like this, that when he solves this issue, withdraw the troops from ukraine and there will be no more threats from you, that's all. but where is mr. valery, this is the border that the russians are bluffing, and the border where they they can do it, because before the beginning of the great war in ukraine. we also perceived this as the 21st year , and you remember the training in april, when zelensky flew to qatar and no one even suspected that this could happen. i am from the amount of information that i have now, and in the 22nd year i immediately said this back in march, if you remember, it is also from the press that russia will not use strategic nuclear weapons, that is. well, there you can explain the arguments why with smaller charges, that is what is called a tactical nuclear weapon, well, it is different, it can be quite powerful, but

for example, it can be a depth bomb, a depth mine, or it can be 155 mm or, well , rather 203 mm, these are the pion howitzers that we have, by the way, they are just in the soviet union were for that and are used, as it is used, it was an absolutely real military design, that is, it is attacked with nuclear charges, and after two hours the troops enter there, so imagine what will happen if russia does this, well, i cannot rule it out, the charge is small in terms of power, russia is somewhere it is being undermined, yes, on his territory, on the territory of belarus, by the way, lukashenko can do... with this, too, or over the black sea somewhere, what will happen in the world after that, the first shock, yes, that nuclear weapons, because none since

japan. nagasaki, no one saw this, and then the second shock will come: the world remains, yes, that is, everyone is in a panic there in ukraine, in rostov in russia or further, even in moscow, in america, everything is calm in washington, or there even in madrid, and so on it will simply be a disaster, immediately there will be a whole cascade of statements about nuclear weapons, this is a race, it will be 20 plus countries with nuclear. will immediately legalize, i think, israel will legalize, name what it has and so on, pakistan, india and the middle east, and germany, by the way, will start talking about it, as they will already discuss, that is, this is such a scenario that, well , to no one, in principle, if you think about his benefit, then he is not suitable for anyone, but no one, and the paradox is that, i am sure,

if he is subject to... on this absolutely, well, terrible story, but stupid from the point of view of the act, as you say, i do not exclude, because the person is sick, just how ill, there are such people, well, in russia, 30%, according to data that existed even before the war, 30% of the population have to one degree or another degree of illness, psychological disorders, and therefore this is definitely one of them, well, in us too yes, let 's be honest. more stressed now, it ’s practice, but this disease, it’s clearly ba, we see its elements, uh, but there is a chain, even tactical nuclear weapons, i asked those who used them in training during their time in the soviet union , so they say that according to those rules it was five people, for strategic weapons and four , there can be four or five chains of command

for, well, there, if it's messed up, yes, either... they use it in the fleet, or it's a missile from an airplane, it's not just like that, it's not just like that, there will be specific people who will do it, there will be intermediate people who will directly give putin or shaigu the command, theoretically it is possible, theoretically, so i simply claim, if analyzed in this way, it will be an attempt to use weapons of mass destruction, well, nuclear in this case case by... chemical russia is already trying to use it, it will immediately raise a surge of escalation, confrontation and discussion, and end the war immediately, because then everyone will be afraid, and what will happen next, there will be nothing immediately, the b-2 bombers will fly in, they will destroy all the russian positions are in jeopardy, because no one wants to let a fool go with a club later, that is, they are

the way they are now, while ukraine holds back, and god forbid a nuclear... you will see the explosion, there will be nothing left of all these warehouses, putin knows this very well, so it is still a probability such a scenario, it is small. why did he start doing this now, as if he had some advantages on the front, yes, that is, now these months. this is an interesting story, perhaps it coincides with some ideas this year , sometime in the fall, there is pressure from all sides to achieve capitulation. that is , the chinese envoy is traveling now with such ideas, he will freeze everything and stop it, that is , it must have been a plan, where all this must be coordinated, and plus, plus there are also threats not to provide weapons, for example, they say, f- 16 can carry nuclear weapons, i already said that peons can also use nuclear weapons, even from the old american m-110, well, i'm not an expert in this, but it's not... they

manipulate it, so i think that's all the words about the nuclear component, we will always hear, it is not addressed to us, not to the ukrainians, it is addressed to those who provide us with weapons, and we will always hear when russia is getting worse, when they see that they have another resource running out, another resource is great and the influence in the world has china, and of course, nuclear potential has china and... pins is now finishing his tour of europe, he came to france for the first time in 5 years, today or yesterday he met with orbán, and orbán said during a joint press conference with sidzimpin that china is one of the pillars of the new world order and that hungary supports peaceful.