friends, we work live on the tv channel, as well as on our platforms in youtube and facebook, please subscribe to our pages on these platforms, and also take part in our vote, today we ask you about whether a tax is needed in ukraine on childlessness, yes, no, everything is quite simple on youtube. if you have your opinion about such a possible tax, write in the comments, if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphone or phone and vote if you think ukraine needs a childlessness tax, 0800 211 381 no, 0800 211 382, ​​all calls to these numbers are free, vote, at the end of the program we will summarize the results of this vote, very briefly, for those who do not understand why it is about the tax on...

childlessness, i will explain, that people's deputy from servants of the people serhii hryvko registered a bill on improving the demographic situation in ukraine, in which he proposed to introduce a childlessness tax for people who have no children at all and a smaller demographic fee for those who have one or two children. after a flurry of criticism from the outside colleagues, hryvko withdrew his draft law, but this idea is obviously floating in the government offices, that's why we ask, what about you? think about it, friends. we are in touch with valery chaly, diplomat, politician, former ambassador of ukraine to the united states of america, chairman of the board of the ukrainian crisis media center. mr. valery, i congratulate you, thank you for joining our broadcast. i congratulate you, glory to ukraine. glory to heroes. let's start, mr. valery, our conversation on the issue of zelenskyi's legitimacy, because today is may 21, 2024 , and this one. actively torpedoed by the russians

about whether zelenskyi will be legitimate or illegitimate as president. of course, in ukraine, we all understand that the president in ukraine is volodymyr zelenskyi, he will be there until the next presidential elections, which will take place after the end of the war, after the end of hostilities. besides russia, who else in the world cares about zelenskyi's legitimacy? i would like to emphasize that from the point of view of international relations and as you asked, the enemies, russia, are really very concerned about spreading this topic, outwardly, i do not see any problems with recognition in this plan of the subjectivity of ukraine, well , the duration of power, that is, the minister of legal affairs also spoke about this. today, that is

, despite the attempt to pump up this topic, especially in such platforms where russia traditionally does it, the soviet union without the un, i think that it is obvious to everyone from the outside that during a war it is impossible to hold elections, in many constitutions of different countries it is everything is fixed and everyone understands everything perfectly, this does not mean that this topic will not be used. is that journalists will not write in foreign media, well, we need to find an answer here, because in principle, what is quite clear to us could be fixed by internal decisions, specialists and specialists in constitutional law know how to do it, i think that it would be correct, well, i mean an appeal to the constitutional court... .

because everything is equal, one way or another, we will not avoid such discussions and issues, but for our partners, in particular, for the preparation of the peace summit, it will not affect this situation in any way in the international aspect, and even today the european union and un leadership confirmed that they consider zelensky to be the legitimate president of ukraine, and there is no doubt about it, but here... against this background, of course, the russians are trying to blur the topic of the legitimacy of their so -called president putin, why do you think the world swallowed this issue and agreed with the fact that the leader of russia, who was elected on the occupied lands of the ukrainian state, and these votes of those people, or falsified votes, well , at least the votes of ukrainians were taken into account as

those that were given for putin, why, why does the world not continue this story, why don't they they are talking already after may 7, when the so-called president putin was inaugurated. well , of course, this is not a question for ukrainians, because we perfectly understand that this is a self-proclaimed, i don’t even know if it is a president, he formally sounds like a president, but in reality the regime is completely different there, that is why he is the self-proclaimed leader now, but de facto he is in charge war, gives orders for attacks on peaceful people, non-combatants, that is , he de facto controls further in... we understand that, that is why the usa took such a position that for illegal elections, and by the way, many took the position that such elections are illegal, but de facto the leader remained, well, this is the position, although from the point of view

of international evaluation, it is no different from the situation in belarus, when lukashenko was declared the leader after a completely illegal process as well... well for us, we have to come up with such a clear definition, because we have many epithets, different people talk about the russian leader, but from a legal point of view, well, for me it is the self-proclaimed leader of the country, that is , all the more so because a person who is under issued by the warrant of the international criminal court, a very difficult situation, you ask why, well, that's... that's why many other questions arise, fears of a nuclear russia, russia's use of all these threats of its own and the desire to leave some opportunities for the lines points of contact on strategic

issues, threats of using weapons of mass destruction should be left there, that is, in principle i understand them, but for ukrainians... mr. valery, president zelenskyi said in an interview with reuters that dialogue with russian dictator vladimir putin is currently impossible, because he is not an independent figure, but is in the system of hatred for ukraine under the control of big money and his entourage. let's listen to what the president of ukraine said. it's just that today he is not an independent figure. this is the problem. he is primarily brainwashed, he brainwashed people and they brainwashed him, he is in this information sphere, absolute, yes, and ah, well, and in such a desire to destroy us, that is, you

cannot sit down, talk to a person who is his only the goal is to destroy you, and you can't find a fair dialogue today, he not alone he is not alone, somewhere there is money, somewhere there he is afraid that china is here, first of all he is guided by money, big money that is around him, and he understands that he has to live until his death, and only with his front legs will he be taken out of the kremlin, well , this is the finalization of the so-called president putin , i like it with his feet forward from the kremlin, but this means that he er... can be the leader of russia, the self-proclaimed leader of russia for a long time, do you agree, mr. valeriu , with the president's conclusions that he is controlled by big money, which is behind putin, or in principle, putin does not need it, he is simply

a dictator, an authoritarian person and a person who actually chose the path of war, the path of aggression. not only with regard to ukraine, but with regard to the whole world, and this is his policy, which he will obviously not renounce until the moment when he is carried forward with his feet. here are a few questions about what kind of wealth putin owns. there were estimates even before the full-scale invasion that he was the richest man in the world, that is, if we take the wealth as actually stolen. radians of the russian people and what he possesses, through the tools already written for him, or through the mediation of campaigns, he wrote something directly to his relatives, something to the environment, the assessments were, i did hear,

a long time ago, the truth was that it was for this group , which surrounds him closely, and he himself is up to 300 billion dollars, i think at that time. they were more or less accurate, now it's certain that he's controlling the pain, that is, well, he's probably the richest man in the world, and his in that regard... really, here i can agree, it's worrying how to keep it all, how it is not paradoxically, although life is not eternal, but this is how he is in this context, power and money, but he is more concerned with the control of power, because really the loss of power for him means, well , such consequences, er, which he would not like to receive, i perhaps i am more optimistic about the fate of the head of russia than the president of ukraine volodymyr zelenskyi,

maybe i am wrong, but i would still like to see him on the dock and before the international criminal court, it is clear that it is not now, but there were also questions about some dictators, they thought they were they will avoid it, but they will not avoid it, i... you know, i think that there may be a scenario for him, such isolation, in one of his palaces, everything is also possible, but he has fewer and fewer opportunities to go somewhere outside of russia, that is i think he will really hold on to power and hold on as long as possible, but i wouldn't go for that approach, you. as a ukrainian, i share all these, our

desires, and i hope that someday the right messages will be sent, and something will fly in the right direction, black swans, but i would be satisfied and the stopping of the war, and a certain, i say, criminal investigation, or the isolation of this really person who committed so many war crimes, brought so much pain and tragedies not only to... ukrainians, but i think that in time russia will also realize , where he is leading these people, this country, so with the main, well, conclusions of the council, well, i think that we should do so as not to stretch this entire history of resistance against russian efforts to take control and destroy ukraine all the way there. the destruction of the entire regime, i would very much like to see us find formulas for how to do it earlier, to fence off,

to separate with a security umbrella from the russian territory on our borders, and for it to happen earlier than what god determines about putin. well, but what you say, mr. valeriu, that he is the richest man, that he has concentrated such power and such opportunities, financial resources, does that mean that... he, all of his threats and what he says the world there about nuclear weapons, about the use of these nuclear weapons, that all this is premeditated and is an element of intimidation of our western partners and ukraine, because if he has everything and is a man who loves life and loves to flaunt it, is he capable of what the west fears? look, you are asking questions for psychologists,

psychiatrists, that is, let me evaluate in my field, because there were really different statements regarding the state of health, that is, we can listen to other people, which i also listen to them, but regarding international events and international definition, then... i look carefully at these threats from the point of view, not so much from the point of view of statements today, but from the point of view of concrete actions, that is, i understand that without testing the existing ammunition of nuclear weapons, well, for example, technical tactical nuclear weapons, it is impossible to move forward, that is , first there must be a test that, in principle, can be carried out without... an explosion, well, i will not go into details here, but there is such an option , which the americans use recently,

as far as i understand, have used it, but the russians can really try to conduct some kind of test that has not already been conducted, if i am not mistaken, in 1996, without this it is impossible to move forward, that is, there are certain steps that precede the actual action . somehow threats, now we are at the stage of escalation of nuclear threats, violation of the deterrence system, violation of the international legal system, the withdrawal of the main players from the treaties, russia's withdrawal from the treaty or withdrawal of its position on the treaty on nuclear tests, what i said about, and well other strategic offensive weapons, the third three are not signed, that is, they came out of no. 2, but this and america also came out,

that is, we see that this, unfortunately, is pandora's box, which they have already opened, it... it is screwing up many countries quickly to escalate and to say that the countries do not think about it, i think, somewhere in those countries, somewhere around two dozen, which will be ready very quickly, or to legalize their nuclear status, i don't know how, india, pakistan or israel, that is, and some countries that have such an opportunity, today we... met with journalists from brazil, brazil at one time also made a decision not to produce nuclear weapons, but this country has opportunities, or the south african republic was also a situation, that is, technical opportunities, unfortunately, there are now more than two dozen countries, and this can be done very quickly, that is, i would

look at this situation, in terms of actions, so far, thank god, such ... attempts to either test nuclear weapons or, well , use them somewhere, so far there is no, i will tell you more, on my belief, here is today, er, if russia crosses this red line, the consequence will be very immediately such an explanant escalation, if you can say, well, a very sharp rise in the stakes and the end of russia's war. against ukraine, that's for sure, because then the usa and other countries will not be able to stand aside, they will be forced with conventional weapons to take part, to strike, because they will not allow further escalation on the part of russia, and the strategic nuclear weapons in the usa are now much more powerful and proven than in

russia, in fact, russia does not even know what to do with its warheads, i think... that they also think what will happen to them, so i don't think that we are right now in front of the implementation of such threats, but i can agree that , unfortunately, there is an escalation in this area. today, mr. valery, the minister of foreign affairs came to ukraine of germany, anna lena berbuk, and she said that thanks to the german initiative, it was possible to raise almost 1 billion euros for the strengthening of ukraine's air defense, and together with the minister of energy of ukraine herman holoshchenko, she visited one of the largest theses of ukraine, which was destroyed russia, and actually, well , berbok understands the importance of providing ukraine with air defense systems, how would you evaluate this period,

probably the last two months and the reaction. the world on what was happening when the russian federation was destroying objects of critical infrastructure, theses, and what is actually a part of the civilized world, when we are now forced to experience these blackouts, power outages, this is probably not the worst that can happen, but it is unpleasant enough, could the world do something and help more ukraine, than he did on... at this moment, first of all, what we have, we have strikes on civilian infrastructure, ukraine also, i understand, and agreed that some drone strikes there were also accurate, but at those enterprises where ours confirmed this use, it was definitely a facility where

fuel is produced, either for tanks or for missiles, i.e.... i cannot agree that from the point of view of humanitarian law , it is equivalent to an attack on ukrainian energy facilities, as you you can say that this or that station, which is not connected to any military unit, which is not used as an object for military personnel or equipment to be on it, but is being destroyed precisely so that combatants, that is, civilians to the population from... to create panic conditions or to press exactly in this way and exhaust them economically, that is, i believe, these are absolutely unequal conditions, and it cannot be put. on the same scales one situation and another, although this is a humanitarian law, or a military law is outdated during the war, it interprets this

history very strangely, moreover, it does not distinguish between the aggressor and the victim of aggression, therefore there are many such purely legal issues, from the point of view of the situation , well, i believe that, unfortunately, we have to hold out, because there are not enough... the existing measures and means of air defense. germany is the leader of the coalition providing ukraine with additional systems of air defense, and we are grateful to her for this, not only to the minister of legislative affairs, we know that the chancellor of germany has spoken about this on several occasions, although he is really still cautious and has not yet made a decision regarding taurus missiles, but regarding air defense systems, regarding additional . equipment, he is very consistent and active, i want to note that this is the official position, consolidated, the position of germany, and recently,

a lot has been done, and the ambassador here in ukraine, and the minister of foreign affairs, and kasra of germany, so we grateful for that, regarding i emphasize once again that our position, air defense means are important, but if we do not have these missiles in order to throw away the possibility of using all these attacking systems against us, then nothing will happen. you will not be able to close in any way, even if you want to close all the objects of the air defense system in ukraine, well, it is simply impossible to every station, if russia continues to do the same , it is simply technically impossible to close it, moreover, well, we need... there will be these systems for the purpose of deoccupation of the territory, well, how for example, what are some important objects, airfields not intended to cover, that is

, i think that the question should still be asked about taurus missiles, i will remind you that the usa has already given atakams, and germany once took the position that taurus missiles can be, but only after. yes, well, the usa has already taken a step, so it would be logical. now in terms of the facilities, we know that germany is also helping us with the support, if the stability or, let's say, countering these attacks in terms of the energy system, and there's a lot possibilities of interaction from the point of view of alternative, alternative... systems and those that are at the power plant, that is at the gas plant , there is fuel and so on, that is, there is

a lot to talk about, some ukrainian cities or even regions are already working very actively in this, and this the right approach, it is necessary to look for alternatives even during the war, the less it will be, in fact, the fragmentation of such objects makes it difficult for the enemy to use strikes by the enemy. and finally, what i want to say is that germany is really now number one in europe, continental europe, the supplier for ukraine of both weapons and aid, germany is number one, maybe together with poland, where our citizens are now, women, children, and that is very good, but still i would like to see germany as a leader, which is taking steps forward, well, for example, the way britain is doing it, declaring that ukraine can use british weapons for defense, including

for defense and strikes on the territory of russia, so psychologically, i really hope that germany is this barrier will pass, as she made huge changes in their approaches to russia in recent times, well, there is also an economic issue, of course, some other points for... the dependence of german business, both on russia and on russian partners, or, let's say, those who supply weapons, so i think that the continuation of the dialogue and such intensity of the dialogue, in particular at the level of the foreign ministers, and even the identification of role players, the presentation of the order, is also the right thing, the current level of our relations. allows us to talk about germany as close partners, well yesterday there was a meeting of the allies of our allies in the format of remstein and the secretary

of defense of the united states of america lloyd. after this meeting, he expressed confidence that ukrainian forces did not use american long-range weapons on the territory of the russian federation, in particular air defense systems. let's hear what loy dostin had to say. we have clearly stated about providing ukraine with opportunities to protect its sovereign territory. of course, the dynamics of aerial combat, i'll leave that up to the experts, but we expect them to continue to use it. weapons provided by us purposes on the territory of ukraine. aerodynamics are a bit different now, but i don't want to speculate on that subject from this podium. at the same time , president zelenskyi believes that nato's possible help in shooting down russian missiles on the territory of ukraine could compensate for the deficit of kyiv's air defense and would not mean the involvement of the alliance in the war. let's listen to what zelensky said. 300 aircraft

are used by the russians. on the territory of ukraine, we need at least 120, 130 planes to resist, resist in the sky, you cannot so far, okay, let's go back again, air defense, you can't yet, f-16, you can't yet, let's go back to the planes that you have on the territory of neighboring states, countries, nato, raise them, we've seen them, use them , shoot down targets, protect civilians, can i... they do that sure, so is this an offensive, an attack by a nato country, an engagement? no. mr. valery, the eternal question is whether our western partners are doing this so that ukraine not only does not lose, but also wins this war. that is, judging by president zelensky's rhetoric, he feels that ours

western partners... could give much more, and he expects it more, well, at least the shooting down of missiles over the sky of sovereign ukraine, well , you know, this is probably not the address of the question to me, what are western partners doing, because i myself have many ideas, how they should be more involved, i will start by saying that my position is as follows, i spoke against the violation of the territory of the sovereign... nato countries in the 22nd year with both planes and drones, this is all known history, that's why i raised this question a long time ago, they, well, i'll even tell you more, this everything was discussed with our partners, with poland itself, that joint measures should be taken, a joint air defense system on the border, and that these drones flying over the territory of poland and romania are not just legitimate targets.

moreover, they shouldn't do it according to their systems, they didn't even do it themselves, you know that the investigation in the polish prosecutor's office showed that some military and politicians should be held responsible for not doing it, so this has already been recognized, they are raised every time the russians launch on the territory of ukraine, but in direction, including poland, in the direction of nato countries. that is, both missiles and drones, they always now raise a couple or even more fighters in order to control this process, to prevent missiles or drones from flying into the territory of these countries, but there is one nuance. the russians take advantage of the fact that they really do not shoot down what is flying in...

directions, because the russians simply even launch the trajectories of the same drones, enter the border and then return to the lviv region, where it is more difficult for us to shoot down these drones from the western direction objects, yes that this issue has already matured, we have the entire bilateral basis for creating a joint air defense system, at least over the border, because the border is not only land, it is also... what is in the air, uh, that's why i it is very surprising why they act so carefully in this regard, we have, i will tell you, we also have an agreement with poland on defense, where it is written that polish specialists can be sent to our territories, for training missions, for support missions, i.e. we have all this, we just need...