today, 80 years have passed, but this pain will never be forgotten, and especially after the occupation of crimea in 2014, we see how the russian occupying power de facto continues the hybrid deportation of the crimean-tatar people. we will talk about this today with historian , journalist and... tv presenter gulnara abdulaeva, she is with us in the studio now, we congratulate you, silyam aleyka, alik silyam, congratulations, andriy, i will start then, and then you will continue and put your question, okay, you don't mind, yes, of course, of course, yes, gulnara hano, well, i would like to start with such a general question, how did the ussr prepare for the deportation of the crimean tatars and why exactly in 1944? stalin wanted to simply evict

the crimean tatar people from the peninsula, this is more than, if i am not mistaken, 200 thousand people at that time, and among them only the elderly, women and children, because the best sons of this people, the men of the majority, they already fought on the fronts of the second world war, and stalin simply had the opportunity to deport an entire people at this time, because they are just such... and of course this the deportation was being prepared for more than one year, and of course there had to be some reason behind it , in order to deport the crimean tatars, and we only know that there are documents, that in april a document was submitted for stalin's signature to deport the crimean tatars as an anti-soviet element, who is inhabited, who cooperated with the occupiers and so on and so on. but in fact it was simply the

same reason, that fear of this people, which is worth something because it is the indigenous people of this peninsula, stalin had, as we know our plans for the peninsula, but all this began, well, a long time ago, with the stalinist repressions of 1938, when slogans were already being heard that crimea without crimean tatars, that is , crimea, ugh, should be, was cleared of this soviet . moment, as they expressed themselves at the time, and we know that, for example, on april 17, 1938 , almost the entire crimean tatar intelligentsia had already been shot, and then already in 1939, as we know, the second world war began, and of course that this moment postponed, and because we know that already in 1941, at the end of 1941-1942, crimea was completely occupied by the germans, and then there were also partisans. the movement in the crimea itself, which

was led by makrausov and martynov, and they did not cope with this partisan movement, i will not go into the historical realities of how the germans entered the peninsula and that there was practically no one to defend it, how they very quickly occupied it , the partisan movement was a failure, but so that they did not recognize their right, and they wrote a report to the kremlin that... that the crimean tatars were to blame for everything, that is, they did not support, they cooperated with the germans and the like. and this report was taken into account, but of course they could not do anything because crimea was occupied. then already, when crimea was completely liberated by the second ukrainian front in the spring of 1944, the crimean tatars, like other peoples who inhabited the crimea, gave birth to victories, they did not see any difference. between the red army men,

yes, the red army men, and the nkvd soldiers, who later, after the second ukrainian front, they entered the crimea, because the deportation operation was already being prepared, and here are 32 nkvd soldiers, they started the same terrible terror. at first, as we know, there was a population census that they conducted, the crimean tatars , of course, did not suspect anything, like everyone else, because it was happening. in such cases, it is very secretive, well, that is, it is the tradition of the kremlin to keep it very secretive and not have any information, and i also want to emphasize that at that time, the fact that crimea was liberated was very important, and the crimean tatars, who just were in the war and who were nearby, they were given vacations, and they were in the crimea just at that time, they were on vacations, and we we know that such a historical figure as amitham... there he was also given three days to

be with his relatives on vacation at home, but all this was done on purpose so that really already... that terrible occupation was being prepared, and precisely the cynical thing about this deportation is that these soldiers, well, the crimean tatars, they didn’t count, they were soviet soldiers, the nkvd officer, they didn’t count this, and they often fed the same soldiers, and these same nkvd soldiers , who were supposed to come to their homes in the morning, had dinner with the crimeans in the evening tatars, because they invited them, they saw them as liberators from the germans. occupation, because it really was the horrors of the occupation, and on and on in the morning at four o'clock in the morning and almost every house can be said, because many people who survived the deportation at four o'clock in the morning testified that their houses were broken into and they simply

announced that they were collaborators in the name of the soviet union, and at that time the men were still at war, yes... and to children, yes, by the way, you can say that to in 1944, there was only the crimean-tatar language in the crimea, whoever inhabited the crimea, except the crimean tatars, they were russians, ukrainians, and other nationalities, they all understood the crimean-tatar language, and to that, you can imagine yourself, at four in the morning , some soldiers come to you, they say something in russian, which you do not understand at all, and you... accused you of something, and someone was told that they were being taken out to be shot, well, this is , for example, on the example of my family , who did not take anything at all, because they said that he would take you out for execution, others were given 15 minutes, someone would be lucky to have half an hour in their pubes, yes, what could these confused

people take with them, well, someone some trinket, someone something valuable, and that's how they took them all out of their homes, and it's not cynical, what... lendlis was already working and the same new studebakers and fords were coming to the ussr on lendlis, and crimean tatars were being taken to the nearest railway station on these studebakers and fords, and the same wagons were waiting for them there, and eyewitnesses say that these wagons are that's it only cattle were transported there, there was straw with manure, and then people were simply driven away. regardless of the people and there was just such a moment, as people also testify, that people who were not transportable were simply destroyed, physically destroyed, those who resisted were also destroyed, simply shot, and those soldiers who were given leave, who said, we

fought, we, we, we, what traitors we are, but they simply tore off the shoulder straps, and also said that the traitors and all this were made up, that is, they were also deported, who resisted? they were also shot, that is, they were really like that terrible conditions, and if you saw khaitarm's film there, yes, it really conveys such a small part of what was really happening, it was simply terrible, and in such cattle cars there were 67 echelons that were not beaten with a baton, that is, it was, that is, it is not very many, not very few, including these 67 echelons, they were sent a... to central asia and the urals, yes, to uzbekistan, mostly the majority of the percentages were resettled to uzbekistan, well, no one expected crimean tatars there, of course, we do not know the exact data and figures, how many died in general, because we know that this is a very large figure for, in the first years,

during the deportation, and in the first years of the veil , 46.2% of people died, these data of the national movement of the crimean tagus. who were still investigated, and there is also evidence that when, for example, they were brought to uzbekistan, of course no one was waiting for them there, but the local population, well, they did not know who the zaradniks were in general, yes, and that is why they were told that you go there in general, well , just terrible people, and they were told about it there by these legends, of course they were met as enemies, and of course they treated them like that, later they already understood that... and the language is somehow similar, and the faith is the same, and a little somehow it was adjusted like that, yes, but still, it is a different land, it is a different climate, people are very many died and perished, and these are the diseases that existed, and then there were also such certificates, there are, this is already once,

well, 80 years have passed, a lot of documents have already been declassified, and people who were admitted to hospitals, they, they just did not go there, well, did not leave there. because they just also did everything so that they would not recover, that's it a lot of things like that were done, and it's not for one broadcast, my colleague andriy has a question, andriy? if we are talking about the intentions of stalin's leadership, was this intention to destroy the truly crimean tatar nation, to dissolve it among other peoples and to mix it up so that the crimean tatars would forget who they are? such an intention was true, because there were not millions of crimean tatars, well, for example, i am with ukrainians, because in principle, ukrainians could also suffer the same fate, because ukrainians are lucky that there are... many of them, it was simply not possible to physically remove all of them, the crimean tatars could, because somewhere

more than 200,000 people lived on the peninsula at that time, because we know, as i have already said, there were many men on the fronts of the second world war, and of course it was done in order to destroy. moreover, when the crimean tatars were already in the cities of deportation, they were forbidden to use the crimean prefix at all, that is , they were equated with everyone, well, absolutely. tatars who lived at that time, well, first in the space of the russian empire, then in the rs fsr, i.e., there are also kazan, bashkir, siberian, astrakhan tatars, i.e. a lot, and the crimean tatars were forbidden to use the crimean prefix, that is , for 80 years, we, the crimean, crimean tatar people, practically disappeared from history, but at the same time, mrs. gulnar, the crimean tatars managed to preserve their identity, and i... heard different memories and knew that among themselves, for example, the crimean tatars even very carefully

mentioned the history of crimea, the history of deportation, deportation, they tried not to tell the children about it, many crimean tatars said, who grew up and were born in uzbekistan and or in tajikistan, that until a certain age they did not even suspect that there was a deportation, because their parents protected them in this way and tried to protect them from the repressive communist system. but nevertheless, the memory was preserved quite powerfully and in the 90s the process of mass return of the crimean tatars began . intellectuals who preserved this memory and who nurtured her. secrets to preserving identity? well, here i can say that our identity is very similar to that of ukrainians, because

when trouble or tragedy happens to us, we consolidate. also, the crimean tatars consolidated, they preserved their faith, language, they did not mix, well, in principle, something there, well, the uzbeks also yes, muslims, at least, yes, no, a lot of them consolidated here and there so that the peoples did not mix, so that they do not dissolve, if, for example, separately in... crimea until the year 44 there were three sub-ethnic groups of crimean tatars, and they are, so now, but they did not mix, these are the southern coastal regions, these mountain regions, the steppes, they did not mix with each other until the 44th year, already in deportation, when it was necessary to somehow preserve their people, they naturally already mixed, and i can say that the crimean tatar the nation is still in the stage of ethnogenesis, that is , formation, so we are here a little bit from the past. got mixed up with the grigoryans, but we are still crimean tatars, that's what

consolidated us, but i want to note that maybe these are really separate families, they didn't tell their children about such a tragedy, but i i can say, they still told more, and the crimean tatars literally from childhood, i can say that the guls, and i, we knew what deportation was when we were young, we survived, it was already given to us with mother's milk, that's how they gave all this, so what we knew about our... tragedy, and it was like that, you know, yes, it's really, maybe, as psychologists still say, that it's such a trauma, but you have to live this trauma in order to heal from it and move on, move on, therefore, as far as i understand, even in the 80s it was dangerous to talk about it, and to say that a criminal stalin's regime, even the stalinist regime , was already a cult of stalin, a cult of power. tried, but nevertheless it was dangerous to talk

about it and condemn the soviet authorities, that is why i said that not all children were told, because they were simply protecting them, not because they did not want this information to be preserved, probably already there in a more mature conscious age was told when the return started at 19, i wanted to ask about the return, how easy the process was. was it like that in 1991 with the collapse of the soviet union it is easy to get together and return to crimea, whether the procedure was completed. the return of property that was taken from the crimean tatars in the 1940s, we know that this happened in the baltic countries, but was this the case in ukraine, and were the crimean tatars allowed to return to sevastopol, to the southern coast of crimea, or not had to find a place in

the north of crimea and in the steppe part, well, of course, no one expected crimean tatars in crimea. of course, they said that, and where will you return, because we know that this has been the movement since the 60s and 70s, the national movement of the crimean tatars, and a lot of people already at that time were talking about the fact that we should return, and that we were accused of that, and that is, it was such that people were already leaving, some of them were brave, who came out with slogans, return their parents to the crimean tatars. and will return the crimean tatars to the motherland, but of course, those people, of course, it was already soviet times, and a lot of them came through the camps and prisons. of course, for the crimean tatars, the dream of returning to the crimea was always there, and from childhood we all knew that our parents, for example, they knew that they would definitely return, but such an upheaval was really the year 1987,

when there was such an agency, yes, during the soviet times... tars, which once issued such a certificate, where, where they said that the crimean tatars, they are really traitors, there were a lot of traitorous battalions that shot the civilian population, and mostly they were russians, ukrainians, jews, but it was intentional, and it was stated in that appeal that the crimean tatars are not the indigenous people of crimea , they have appeared there since the 13th century, well, you know that before... that's a lot a widespread myth, which, by the way, is still heard today, but it was such a ruse, it was such a trigger for the crimean tatars, the crimean tatars, and they began to leave en masse to moscow, at that time the center, and there were still soviet times , and they went to this red square, they were chased away, they went to other squares, and they were posters, they

wrote that return the crimean tatars to their homeland, that you accused us. these accusations are not, well, at least an apology is needed for these accusations against the crimean tatars. crimean tatars knocked on all doors a minute remains, i'm just warning that this was also, you know, a trigger for the crimean tatars to become after these events, the moscow events, they are like that, and they were already returning to the crimea, and of course no one was waiting for them, but still after all, water grinds stones and the crimean tatars achieved that. that they are still in their native land, and here, well, it was such an impulse, thank you very much, gulnara khanum choksano, for taking the time to come to our studio today, but i hope that in the next broadcasts of espresso and atr tv channel, we will meet with you in two or three weeks and we will talk about many more questions that i have and andriyuchok has, thank you

for being with us today, gulnara abdulaeva, historian, journalist and... the host was from us in the espresso studio, as well as the joint airing of the krymstotarsky television channel of the atp, i gursom khalilova and my colleague andriy yanitskyi worked for you. stay with us koroshkenja. see this week in the collaborators program. servants of the kremlin, not of god. which of the priests promotes. this conversation is like me said, it is desirable that it was not the last, and how a clergyman from kherson stole icons and ancient books. find, remove and return these church shrines. greetings, i'm olena kononenko, and this is a collaborator program about traitors who, following the call of their hearts and wallets , went to serve the rashi occupiers.

a priest from the dnipropetrovsk region received 5 years behind bars for supporting russia's aggression against ukraine. it's about... oleksandr liunagov from kryvyi rih, rector of the church of st. john the merciful, dnipropetrovsk parish uoc diocese. according to the sbu, during his sermons he justified the full-scale invasion of the russian federation and the seizure of part of the territory of ukraine. he called during personal conversations with people to go to russia or to the temporarily occupied regions of our country to help the russian troops, and he himself was waiting for the capture of dnipropetrovsk region. he was detained in september 2022. during the searches , mobile phones were seized, which the priest used to impose kremlin propaganda. and so on february 13, he received his sentence for worshiping the krem star. a... a today's program is about those who are serving russia in russia, but, unfortunately, are not yet in a ukrainian prison. the kremlin's

propaganda machine is very active in the temporarily occupied territories. television, newspapers, telegram channels, campaign leaflets. all this is now set up so that as many people as possible turn their backs on ukraine, so that pro-ukrainian sentiments disappear in the occupied territories and thoughts appear that russia is there for a long time, that there is a future with russia. the kremlin spends millions of dollars on this, but in addition to media the church and priests are also means, which the rashists actively use to impose the necessary narratives. sales pops, neophytes of raslug nanny perform the assigned tasks. during the service or personal communication with believers, using authority, they glorify the so-called army of liberators, call on the locals to go over to the side of the occupiers and help them. they emphasize that ukraine... has abandoned people, and russia is here and gives out humanitarian aid and some wooden rubles. meet, this is a slave of the kremlin, maxim tarasenko. before the full-scale absorption, he

was the secretary of the kherson diocese of the ukrainian orthodox church of the moscow patriarchate. he often acted as the official position of the church in various conflict situations. in such grief, the church should be with the people, and we try to do so in our ukrainian orthodox diocese of kherson. but when did it come to our land? russia began to shed ukrainian blood, this priest decided to be close to the invaders. with the occupation of the kherson region, maxim remained in kherson. quiet for several months sat out, and then began to appear frequently in the stories and headlines of washed-up russian media. today, the russian orthodox church honors the memory of the holy equal-to-the-apostles grand duke. with the occupation, maxim got a new hobby. to collect items of church use, in particular icons and old church books, the russians steal them from other churches or even from private collections of residents of the kherson region, and then take them to

tarasenko to the church. the little non-priest rubs his hands, smiles at the camera and thanks the occupying power. we thank you again employees of law enforcement agencies. for the fact that everything they get in the course of their search operations... hand over to the diocese, they should return to the church, and this is a huge thank you. let's call a spade a spade, for example, not a search operation, but a robbery, and return not to the church, but to father maxim's private collection. in the next video, he modestly talked about material value. law enforcement agencies were able to. remove and return, all this, both icons and books, they constitute

historical, spiritual, and certain material value. after the de-occupation of kherson, tarasenko disappeared and later appeared in crimea. instead of atoning for his sins of treason, viryan miska continues to wash away. i hope to... be able to see him again, but not on the screens of zombies, on the dock. mykola kanyuka, the abbot of the st. sergius church, openly promotes peace from the temporarily occupied skadovsky proteriary. in his peaceful life, he baptized ukrainian children, congratulated young couples, and prayed for peace. now his prayer is already for another peace - russian when russian tanks entered skadovsk and occupied the city, he decided to leave it to the beasts, so that in the future , peace, love and harmony would flourish in their prayers, our families, our relatives and our society.

pip began to appear more often in propaganda stories, here he tells that for him the clergyman is russian peace. russian peace, according to the holiest patriarch, is not some political entity, some bloc. and for us, churchmen, it is... first of all, holy russia. next, kanyuka promotes kremlin ideas to children. here video, where he gave a lecture for the seventh grade of school number one in skadovsk, in which he talked about human honor and loyalty. i wonder how he knows about all these qualities? this conversation, as i said, it is desirable that it not be the last, this time. and for this conversation to turn out to be... a lecture on treason

and a venal soul upon notification. dam zmi, together with the priest mykola, decided to betray ukraine and his son, taras kanyuka, who also serves in the church of st. sergius in skadovsk. here he is talking to the camera about the united people of ukraine and russia. we again we say, we are a single people, triune, i would even say, united by this kyiv baptismal font. father and son made their choice. now they will have to answer not only to god's judgment, but also to earthly judgment. and they are guaranteed years in prison for treason. he called for shelling of ukrainian cities, assured that kherson is russia forever, meet gennady shkil , born in 1966. before the full-scale invasion , he was an anti-priest, abbot of the saint seraphim church in the city of gola prystan , kherson region. as a priest he is led his t-tok, where he answered questions about what is a sin and what is not. when the great war began,

he... posted a video where he said he prayed for peace in our country. giving peaceful times to our country, let's pray for peaceful times to come soon. already later, the school will pray for another country, the one that kills, tortures and destroys. when the cities of the bare harbor were occupied, he stayed and at first called to help each other and keep good in the heart. he also emphasized that it was not ukrainians who started the war. we are still on the first day russian troops passed. we are now, as it were, in the rear, we did not start this war with you and we will not be able to finish it. but over time, the topic of the video priest changed, as did his position. in may 2022, the school celebrated victory day together with the occupiers. on this holiday, pip visited with his sons, who wore george ribbons and tricolors. later, at the forum we are together with russia, which was held in kherson, shkil said that in 30 years, ukraine

had been turned into a failure. project, and the layman called the occupation a positive phenomenon. allegedly russian troops freed the city of kherson from the west. before that, he urged believers to go to the church of the moscow patriarchate. you can always find a uoc temple and go there. if it is in a village or in western ukraine, then of course it is more difficult, because there many churches have been captured. if not by the uniates, then by the peceushniks. but it is better to come to a church where christ is present once a month than nothing... in the summer of the same year , the collaborator applied for a russian passport, and in october 2022 he fled the parish in the bare harbor of kherson region to russia. he posted a video confirmation of his departure on his social networks, explaining that he was leaving in connection with the evacuation to the territory of the russian federation. in addition, shkil assured that he did not betray anyone, because leaving the kherson region to the stavropol region is allegedly

a legal movement on the territory. the russian federation, so that our haters do not say that i ran away because an evacuation was announced. that's how he said that the ukrainian army would never enter kherson, that he was not always russian, he himself gave a drapak from our armed forces, because he understood that what he had said and made himself suspicious, and her the school will definitely be awarded. this was the collaborators program, and i, olena kononenko, if you have information about kremlin sellers, write to us at this email address or simply. on facebook , we will send all the traitors in pursuit of the russian ship together. see you in a week on espresso. greetings to all. there are many questions left for the last round, who will be relegated, who will enter the eurocups. usyk became the world boxing champion and the question is,

will he play in? oleksandr vashchuk and andriy malinovskyi will tell you all about this today. andrew, hello. yes, congratulations to all. in fact, the final intrigue of the season is who will win the cup, just this week we got the answer to that difficult question. it's a difficult question, it was a difficult match and vorskla poltava hosted, let's say, shakhtar-donetsk in rivne. and the scenario of the match was quite interesting, because vorskla had a chance ... in the first half, kane went one-on-one, didn't score, and maybe if he had scored, there would have been another winner of the cup. well , you see, now even if you take two recent matches of shakhtar and look purely at analytics, at numbers, at statistics, we see that kyiv dynamo also beat shakhtar in the championship match, but shakhtar won and became the champion. we see that vorskla also beat donetsk shakhtar by numbers, but they are the winners.