er, the soviet union was provided with weapons by the same americans, but they did not say that you are not going to strike deep into the territory of germany. times are changing, so are the approaches to the issues of providing weapons to it, well, first of all, unfortunately, we don't have a lin-linz, we screwed it up thanks to the inaction of our diplomats, first of all, the ambassador of ukraine to the united states, who is more involved. after all, the restaurant business than the issues of providing weapons to ukraine. why is this being done, why are certain countries trying to give us weapons, but at the same time prohibiting them to apply, well, you can't be half pregnant, so from the point of view of our leaders, they have to ask questions harder and find arguments that would work in our favor. in the information space, in order to improve the situation on... this decision,

so far we are deaf and dumb, we are not heard, we are not seen, we are not heard because we speak quietly, we do not say anything in this direction at all, even if our politicians have learned, as the israelis do during the gaza war. thank you, mr. general, for your participation in program, it was serhiy krivonos, lieutenant general, major general of the reserve, the first deputy commander of the ssso forces in 2006-19. friends, we continue to work live on the tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms. for those who are currently watching us live on these platforms. please subscribe to our pages, and also take part in our survey, whether the responsibility for breaking the curfew should be strengthened . yes, no, everything is quite simple on youtube, either yes or no, if you have a personal one please leave your opinion in the comments under the video. if you watch us on tv.

take your smartphone or phone to hand and vote if you think that the responsibility for breaking the curfew should be increased , 0800 211 381 no 0800 211 382, ​​all calls to these numbers are free, vote, at the end of the program we will summarize this vote, and we have our next guest on the phone, this is oleksandr khara, a diplomat, an expert on foreign and security policy at the center for defense strategies, mr. oleksandr, i am you... thank you, that you are with us today good evening, mr. seriy, thank you for the invitation. let's start, mr. oleksandr, right away with the story that came out today that china is transferring weapons to russia, this was stated, in particular, by the minister of defense of great britain, grand chaps. and he says that american, british military intelligence has evidence that help in the form of lethal weapons is already coming or will come. to come from china to russia, he

stated this today at a security conference in london, i will quote mr. shabs. today i can to announce that we have evidence of cooperation between russia and china in the field of weapons used in ukraine. as we saw with putin's state visit to beijing and the 64% increase in trade between russia and china after the full-scale invasion, they have each other's backs. mr. alexander, what is this... the statement and statement of american and british military intelligence, what does this mean, that is, will there be increased pressure on china now, or is china warning that both the americans and the british know that their weapons is coming or will be to go to russia, this is a serious enough statement for today, yes, i think a serious statement, understood that some evidentiary things are needed. and of course, it will be

an escalation on the part of china, because until now it has helped the russian federation by buying minerals and selling dual -purpose goods, and by and large china has a lot to start with, literally three figures, last year russia and china traded on 227 billion dollars, with the united states, china's bilateral trade turnover is 575 billion, and with... the european union 626 billion, i.e. the further introduction of sanctions, there have already been sanctions against chinese companies that cooperated with russia, in particular in the supply of chemical elements and chemical weapons that were used on our territory, then this of course can hit the chinese economy, and in the conditions that at best the state the chinese economy is in, it might... it's going to hurt quite a bit,

so i hope china stops things like that if they were going to supply, because in what the british defense secretary said, they just don't... or china has already supplied , or he's going to deliver, so we're going to hope that the americans and the british and our other partners, they're going to put pressure on china so that it doesn't increase its fortunes in this war. and how would you, mr. oleksandr, characterize the position of sidzen pinn at the moment, for today, it is clear that he had a european tour, then there was a meeting with putin. in beijing, analyzing his statements and analyzing xi jinping's behavior, what can you say: china is inclined to negotiate with the civilized world, or he still takes the same position as

he has until now, talking again about this so -called peace plan, although it is not a peace plan at all, but the vision of official beijing. of the russian-ukrainian war, which was recorded as of february 24 , 2023, well, by and large, china is not going to receive the russian federation, and until now, with this information that it has either started or is going to designate weapons, there was a logical situation, that is, he supports the younger partner, gets the most from him, what can be obtained and access to markets and cheap goods that russia supplies. to china, i mean oil and that gas, and on the other hand, he's trying to maintain, let's say, pragmatic relations with the united states, they've barely started to improve, stabilize, the dialogue along military lines has resumed, and by and large it looked

so that the united states and china have found a certain formula for coexistence and not worsening relations, which is of course extremely important for... the whole world and confrontation is definitely not needed by anyone, but it is clear that the information that was made public, it did not come out of thin air, and i think that maybe in china they looked at what is more sensationalized by russia, maybe they know something more from the point of view of what is happening on the battlefield and the state of the russian agricultural and industrial complex and ability to continue is possible. this makes sense, and that is probably why such a large delegation was with putin, primarily representatives of the law enforcement agencies, well, also of business related to the ban, so let's hope that china will still refrain

from greater involvement in the conflict, especially since it relieves him of the thesis that he was not the cause of this conflict, and he does not throw up. , in particular on the basis of china's political position on the political settlement of the ukrainian crisis, as the document that the chinese released on the anniversary of the invasion is called. mr. oleksandr, this week the minister of foreign affairs of the federation visited kyiv. anna lena berbok and dmytro kuleba of germany during a joint briefing with her, he stated that there are no arguments against allies helping to shoot down russian missiles in the western part of ukraine, at least. let's listen to what mr. kuleba said. we really

ask our partners to consider the possibilities for russian missiles, not russian aircraft . pilots on board, and pieces of iron that carry death from russia to ukraine, to be intercepted from the territories of our partner countries, there is an alternative solution to this, just provide then, if you do not want to do this, then just provide us with all the ... necessary , all necessary means for this, we will place them on the territory of ukraine, and we will intercept these missiles ourselves. on this initiative, federal chancellor scholz said, bilt writes, that this plan is very dangerous

chatter of warmongers. he criticized nato's plan to create a no-fly zone in western ukraine and... in his opinion, this could turn germany into a war party and lead to unpredictable reactions from putin, what unpredictable reactions from putin does scholz fear? mr. oleksandr, if you allow me, i will start a little differently, literally a few days ago, a very good conference ended in tallinn, the lenand merry conference, and timothy snyder spoke there, and he basically said about one historical myth that is still in the minds of the germans, that the second world war, it was an unjust aggression of the germans against the russians, in fact, most of this war was fought on the territory of ukraine and... the civilian population suffered, well , you know history very well, i am not talking about

the fact that a large part of the red army consisted of ukrainians, but actually these myths in the heads, this is the first part , and the second part is that how russian nuclear deterrence works very well and proves in the minds of primarily scholz, as well as strategists in washington, they think that by shooting down russian missiles and absolutely. minister kuleba said clearly about this, no, we do not want russian planes to be shot down, it would not be a direct conflict between nato and the russian federation, and of course this led to escalation, but fear and paralysis from paralysis, more precisely from escalation, he in fact does not allow olokh sholts to take a step, to provide ukraine with the same torus missiles, or to help us protect, at least a part. of ukraine from russian missiles. this fear of the possibility of nuclear escalation, he is restraining scholz, but

also, you know, the russians are not only acting directly, so agreeing, it also means nuclear training, which was a tactical nuclear weapon, and what is happening now in the baltic sea, there, the situation was rolled back a bit, i mean, the territorial ones over the russian federation in the baltic sea, which would quite...significantly change and worsen the situation for the country, above all finland, and also, it seems, we are closer to poland, and moreover, it is not only about territorial waters, but about several horse islands, where the border has moved towards what international law considers to be the territory, the sovereign territory of finland, that is, all these things, they are primarily aimed at , in order to scare western partners, i will continue. a hybrid offensive against the west in order to test its readiness to defend both

its members and help ukraine, and unfortunately, in berlin and in washington, this test is so far passed with the smallest, worst by an assessment that can be imagined, they actually condone further predatory behavior of russia, well, the continuation of this war, because it is clear that the question is not to... protect ukrainian skies with the territory of nato member countries. the question is, first of all, that we review the strategic restrictions that were imposed on ukraine, first of all the large-scale invasion, that we cannot use western weapons on our own russian territory, destroying, first of all , the seeds of those missiles and bombs that fall on our heads, rather than trying to intercept with limited, good-natured missiles , the key problem is, and... how they see the conflict in washington in berlin and how they try to avoid

a direct confrontation with the russian federation, these warnings, redactions, they lead to such deplorable results, for which are paid primarily by us, i mean by ukrainian citizens, ukrainian military, and the ukrainian state. you have already mentioned, mr. oleksandr, about the claims of the russians for a part. of the sea, or rather, to part of the water area in the gulf of finland, and also near the cities of baltiysk and zelenograd in the kaliningrad region, there is a draft of the relevant resolution of the government of the russian federation, and this draft was prepared by the ministry of defense of russia, as it is believed in sweden, the master of the kremlin plans to gain control over the island of gotland, which... in order to control the baltic sea itself, it this island is in the middle of this baltic sea, whoever

controls gotland controls the baltic sea, it has always been believed that the commander in chief of the swedish armed forces, mikael beauden in an interview with r&d. yes, i am sure that putin even has both eyes on gotland. putin's goal is to gain control over the baltic sea, he probably also has his eye on... the åland islands. the russians closely monitor what is happening at the entrances and exits to the baltic sea. well , the baltic sea has always been of interest to russians, and has been for a long time. back in stalin's time, stalin quite often spoke about the fact that the main thing is the baltic sea, the black sea - something is not clear there, but this is the main baltic sea, from there we can give retort to the british and to all europeans, to what extent are these plans, which are being talked about in sweden and in general in western europe, regarding

putin's intentions regarding the baltic sea, how far can they be... implemented by putin, given that sweden, too, and finland are still members of the north atlantic alliance. well, in general, the entry of finland, sweden into nato, it was a strategic defeat for the russian federation, since the russian federation is actually limited in maneuvering in the baltic sea, and finland, which borders the polish peninsula, actually gives additional opportunities for nuclear. the russian federation, because there is a nuclear warhead on the kola peninsula, which gnaws primarily at the united states. and now russia is somehow trying to provoke nato, to show that it is hopeless, that there is no consensus, because once again olaf scholz will appear and say that it is not worth starting the third world war and destroying the world. but it seems to me

that it is necessary to look more broadly at the map, and not to separate the baltic sea from the northern seas, from the northern sea route, which is the so-called signature project, that is, such a favorite project of mr. putin, well , just as well on the black bridge, because what is happening, for example, in the black sea in the 14th year, certain approaches were developed there, are being developed, which are then applied in other seas, and that is precisely why it is very important that nato and our other partners reacted adequately to what is happening not only in the baltic sea, but also in the black and northern seas, only in this way can the implementation of the general strategy of the russian federation for expansion be stopped, expansion of its influence, most importantly aimed at undermining the unity of nato, because the fifth article of the washington treaty, this

is not, is not, you know, a question of faith or automatism, it is a question. consensus among the members, if at least a few nato members or one is not ready to go and defend every inch of nato territory, it will mean that in fact this whole structure does not work and the russian federation still won, so let's hope for an adequate reaction, very restrained was the reaction of the finns, they said they consider the situation, keep it under control. the russian federation did not make any requests regarding the revision of the borders, and of course they will watch how russia will proceed. mr. oleksandr, one more important question, in the context of these russian encroachments on part of the baltic sea, could ukraine in this situation help nato countries

with its naval drones, but the question immediately arises of how ukraine can integrate into the north atlantic alliance, use his experience of fighting in black sea ​​with the russian occupiers, is such use permissible at all and can it be? well, you know, this is absolutely correct, the correct line of thought, since we are in a de facto, that is, in a legal state of war with the russian federation, this means any means and forces of the russian federation, anywhere... anywhere can be a target, a legitimate target for attacks of ukraine. we remember very well how recently there was information that our special services worked very hard in sudan, and actually destroyed both the mercenaries and russian, employees of the russian central intelligence agency, and it is clear

that we can operate in other places as well. it is clear that in order to operate in the baltic sea, we have to... it is in cooperation, or at least with the permission of our partners, we cannot violate the airspace of our partners who help us, especially all the countries or poland, of course you can try strike through the territory of the russian federation, but of course, this option is complicated by pro systems and other things, i i understand that we do not have such a large number of rons. with a large radius, the same can be said about naval drones, they must somehow be sent to the sea, here, but in principle it seems to me the right thing to do and... this would be an additional contribution of ukraine to the security of the european continent, you know when we rejoice , that the next russian trough will be sent

to the black sea, this is not only the joy of ukrainians, it is meant that less platforms of seeds, calibers or other weapons will destroy the ukrainian one, this is also our contribution to the european security, since those calibers, they were designed from the very beginning as a means of ter. partners, and therefore it seems to me that such cooperation of ukraine with the baltic states would be in the interests of both the baltic states and the european one in general. mr. oleksandr, thank you for participating in the program. it was oleksandr hara, a diplomat, and i remind you, friends, that we are working live on the espresso tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms. for those who are currently watching us on these platforms, please subscribe to ours. pages as well take part in our survey, today we are asking you about whether it is necessary to increase the responsibility for breaking the curfew, yes, no, everything is quite simple on youtube,

if you have your own opinion, please leave it in the comments below this video , and if you watch us on tv, grab your smartphone or phone and vote if you think that the responsibility for breaking the curfew should be increased, 0800-211381, no, 0802 382 i want to introduce our next guest, this is ihor reiterovych, political scientist, head of political and legal programs of the ukrainian center for social development. mr. igor, i congratulate you, thank you for being with us today. congratulations! mr. igor, let's start with information that has been quite actively discussed over the past two days, and the situation that has developed in the verkhovna rada of ukraine, namely european solidarity. yesterday blocked the meeting of the verkhovna rada, demanding consideration of two issues, the creation of a temporary investigative commission regarding the certification of the provision

of the armed forces of ukraine and regarding consideration in the verkhovna rada asked the question about the ukrainian orthodox church, or rather, about the moscow churches working on the territory of ukraine, whether it is possible to accept this attempt of european solidarity. as an attempt to restore the subjectivity of the parliament, when people's deputies demonstrate that they are the very force that shapes the agenda in ukraine, appoints the government, and accordingly is a sufficiently proactive group that actually returns this subjectivity, about which i ask you, look. this story, oddly enough, is so, you know, ambivalent. on the one hand, certainly, this is an attempt to remind about a certain subjectivity, that is, there are representatives of the opposition who publicly, several days, at least before

this, they demanded consideration of certain issues, and these issues, they are extremely relevant, especially the issue that is related for example, there with the construction of fortifications in ukraine, but since they did not see any adequate reaction from the, well, monomajority, they resorted to such a mechanism, such a tool, which is used quite often in various parliaments in general in the world, that is, it is not only about there pro-ukrainian parliament, in this way the opposition can draw attention to a certain issue, and try to force, for example, a pro-government majority there, to bring it up for consideration, on the other hand, why did i say invalid, these events are essentially a statement of a long-term the parliamentary crisis that we have... today, as we see that the monomajority, it very rarely votes for any serious issues recently, and if it does vote, it requires a very serious

parliamentary mobilization, and why extremely rarely, because they simply do not have enough votes, that is, they have a certain problem, and apparently they do not coordinate these issues with the office of the president, because everyone understands very well that the decision today for a monomajority is definitely taken on the banks, and so it is an attempt at... the attention that was criticized there, i know, the representatives of the minority, but they are not very right, because they have no right to take away from their colleagues the opportunity to express their position on one or another issue, especially if these issues have relation to the national security and defense, so this attempt, well, it showed that in reality and the parliament as a whole , it is necessary to think about what is happening and what is the attitude of society towards the verkhovna rada, unfortunately, the verkhovna rada is currently the absolute leader in terms of pace. trust in it, if compared with other state institutions that exist in the country, and the second point, well, for the monomajority it could be a chance, well,

to consider some things there without looking back. actually to the bank, but judging by what we have seen and judging by the statements made by the speaker today she did it, well, she is not going to do it, so questions remain with subjectivity, the questions are very serious, the opposition, i am convinced, will still try to somehow change this situation, but objectively they just don't have enough strength for it yet , because according to tradition, and if you look at the entire previous history of ukrainian parliamentarism, certain changes took place when some rational core or some... constructive group actually appeared in the right-wing majority, when it started somewhere together to vote for certain decisions with the opposition, i unfortunately do not see such a group yet, with a few exceptions, those who are conscious deputies in a monomajority, they cannot create a numerical advantage so far, maybe the situation will change, it will change when the overwhelming majority of people's elected representatives , including from a monomajority, will understand that they either have a way to disappear altogether, or they will remember that they are people's deputies, and they

can... consider some decisions themselves, and not by coordinating them exclusively there, well, with the cabinet of ministers , this would have been a good story, rather than actually coordinating with the president's office. well, yes, the cabinet of ministers, they appoint and in principle can conduct some kind of discussion on equal terms, and the president's office, in fact, in this situation is not the one with the subject that can indicate something in the verkhovna rada of ukraine. on may 22, the rada did vote to create a temporary one. whose commission, the special commission, or rather the commission for the arrangement of fortifications and the purchase of drones, but the question is about the bill on the banning of the moscow patriarchate in ukraine, was never put to the vote. ruslan stefanchuk, the speaker of the parliament, says that this law must be passed without violations, so that later there is no possibility to cancel it through the constitutional court. let's listen to what the chairman of the verkhovna rada

of ukraine said. what our shouters instigated yesterday is a direct violation of regulatory norms, and i, as a lawyer, will tell you that this is a direct reason for the further cancellation of this law in the constitutional court of ukraine. that is why my colleagues and i gathered yesterday and discussed a very clear order. we must to see that the hall has the necessary number of votes as soon as these signatures are collected, immediately immediately. this bill will be introduced in the hall. mr. igor, is this caution of stefanchuk motivated in the matter with the moscow church, because this issue has been discussed and debated for so long , and it is clear that the ukrainian orthodox church of the moscow patriarchate has a choice either to switch to the light side, or to remain on the to the dark side, and parliament

can push. ukrainian orthodox church before this, but not this does, what is the motivation for this caution, that the constitutional court can review any issue or any bill that has been passed in the last two years, whether for violations or compliance with regulations, and by the way, i don't know , whence the confidence of the honorable speaker that the constitutional court would clearly interpret this issue not in favor of the law that would be adopted. or maybe the constitutional court would say, on the contrary, that there are no questions, and it corresponds to the constitution and should actually to be implemented in practice, but in the whole statement we saw how mr. stefanchuk, you know, is fighting two, well, two of his dishes, on the one hand, purely as a speaker, as a person who is the chairman of the verkhovna rada, a certain caution on his part, she understood, he wants there to be a guarantee that this law will be

voted on, that all deputies... will be present in the session hall, that there will not be any, well, there will not be any violations, procedural possible appeals and so on, you can understand it here , since the law is really important enough and so on, but you understand, this legal opinion of his is completely covered by the political one, he stated with this statement that we have just listened to, that the monomajority of the de facto restoration refuses to support this law, that is, there is not the necessary number. votes due to the position of the monomajority, which, in theory, should be the initiator and which should move this law and bring it to its logical conclusion, because the opposition, which advocates, well, it is simply not physically enough, moreover, let's not forget, there are a couple of deputies groups, there are former opzzniks, they, on the contrary , will be...