we are talking with pavel koval, the head of the committee on international affairs of the polish sejm and the head of the council for cooperation with ukraine. congratulations. good day. i am maria gurska, a journalist of a ukrainian tv channel and the editor-in-chief of the portal. in favor of ukraine. currently, it is about 2.5-3 billion euros. how important is this news, considering that the funds will be directed to the defense of ukraine. this is key news because it paves the way for, firstly, russia not to be able to use these funds. and secondly, that this money should be used not only for reconstruction, because some people tried to submit it, but also for... my position is that these

funds should be used now for the defense of ukraine, because now they are extremely necessary, and then as an application, direct them to reconstruction as well? but here we are talking not only about the funds that come from interest and profits, but also about the basic funds that the russian bank keeps abroad, this is where the decision is key. it is necessary to support the belgian government in this, because the ball is now in the court of the belgian government, but the chain was like this.

this will be the dominant theme during the meeting of the big seven, which will soon take place in italy. what are the prospects? the perspective is that a step has to be taken that western politicians have so far considered impossible. i think it's time to give a new legal definition and say that if a state behaves as aggressively and as clearly violates international law as russia, then it should face sanctions of this type. this is a serious sanction that has not been used on such a scale before, but in my opinion it is quite possible to implement it. and i'm just asking pay attention and understand these details. it's not just about percentages. it is also about significant funds that russia deposited before the invasion of ukraine. later. they can be

used for reconstruction, and now the main thing is for the russians to receive a signal that the money is being directed to the war, and the ukrainians can use it. what are we waiting for the adoption of this decision? bloomberg writes this decision at the beginning of the 25th. this decision goes down the chain, so it was important that someone influential in the world was the first to say, we are doing this. it was the united states, though they have there was not much of this money. one of the central topics in the ukrainian and world media this week is the beginning of changes on the accession of countries to the eu. brussels officials, quoted by the politician, say that the process of persuading the hungarian government to give consent to the launch is ongoing. the date when

negotiations can begin is constantly changing. at the moment, the deadline is june 25. what to expect? wait for the start of negotiations. it will not be negotiations in all directions at once, but it will be a formal launch of the negotiation process. and really, definitely good will on the part of hungary is needed. it is important that the next chairmanship of the eu council is hungarian. and here there may be some delays, but fortunately. i call it a shorter presidency, because the second part of the year is always shorter, there are holidays, so looking at the calendar, there may actually be less, and then the polish presidency will be next. poland will be the only major country in the eu that actually supports enlargement, i think so, and it's good that this start of both the ukrainian and moldovan negotiations, i hope, will happen de facto during the polish presidency, it is important that the belgians start it, i don't know what will happen with hungary, then there will be poland, i am convinced that we will speed it up, deep

negotiations are in our polish interests, they are probably not in everything will be easy for the ukrainian side, but since i have an idea of ​​what our partners in the west are saying, only... poland says: yes, negotiations and expansion. because others usually say, yes, negotiations and enlargement, but they add something else, they mention, for example, the additional conditions for making changes to the eu treaty, and if someone adds changes to the eu treaty, then it seems like such a trifle, not an essential condition, but in fact it turns out that everything is delayed, because everyone knows that today it is a matter of several years to make changes to the eu treaty, and this is actually today impossible, because there are no political conditions for this. that is, it is necessary to look at who is actually speaking, we start negotiations, even seriously and deeply on difficult topics, but do not set additional conditions, just say so, we conduct negotiations and expand, in the interests of poland, expansion, from which stages

these negotiations will take place and how long they may last. an important stage will be the discussion about these separate sections of the one. very important, but smaller, these heavy topics are less on its political horizon, for example, if it is located near the sea, then it has fishing, industry and two or three other important sections, it concentrates on these sections and closes the others quite quickly, but when such a large country as ukraine joins the eu, it has all the problems at once, so

there will be more problems there. countries, who say they support the talks, actually often slow them down, because many western countries hope that it will last longer, they can't say that today, but i'm somewhere quietly... i hear them saying, by the way, if we take the opportunity, we'll change contract. if they supply additional conditions, there will be problems plus individual countries. here i expect the most from hungary, but not only, not only. during the negotiations with the eu, they will add their various bilateral issues with ukraine, because they will see that in order to to proceed to the next stage of negotiations, ukraine will be ready to move forward on certain issues. sometimes the state may have some old claims, the easiest way to show it again is the example of hungary. for example, hungarians will imagine that they want to solve a certain issue of minorities, this does not apply to negotiations with the eu, but when they close the chapter, they will say, we will agree to the closure, but you have to do this, so the negotiation process will follow this formal trend, which is the most important and decisive, but will also

burdened by many external pressures, and this will also be a lot, before that, too, we need wieloma naciscami. how realistic does this plan for ukraine's accession to the eu look now, and how can it end in the conditions of war? i look at this plan in the same way as magdeburg law in the middle ages, if a country received magdeburg law, it received the entire legal system and way of thinking. what does this mean in the case of ukraine? first of all, i believe that the negotiation process itself will be great, it will be difficult, it will save ukrainians, but at the same time it will be adaptable. the issue of corruption, when i am told about corruption in ukraine in the west, because it is known that there is such a stereotype, i tell them: open the door to the eu. negotiations in the eu are the best way to fight corruption, there are well-known

methods, everyone knows them, an additional anti-corruption bureau and so on, all this is good, but the best is negotiations, because ukraine will inevitably adopt the system that already operates in the west, and this ... in itself will change the country and give space for changes to the citizens of ukraine, especially the middle class. even during the war? even during the war. during the war, it is also important politically, because it is known that war is also a psychological issue. war is a psychological issue, and therefore it is important that people who, for example, have relatives fighting, constantly receive a signal that the end is near, and we will be in a common european family, and this has a deep meaning. could it be that we will be accepted into the eu under an accelerated procedure if ukraine agrees to certain concessions regarding the territories? in what sense should ukraine give up part of the territory? this conversation

is constantly going on in the west. i have not heard of different peace plans and so on, seriously, i've been in a lot of conversations like this and i've never heard the question put that way. firstly, because it has an association agreement, few people know about it, even people who are involved in politics often do not know, because they forget, but this association agreement, it is already part of the membership, in many areas the association agreement is supplemented by an agreement on free trade, that is, to be precise about the expanded free trade zone, this means that from the point of view of trade, ukraine has been a partial member of the eu for several years, to this we add visa-free regime, that is, it already exists a little, as if in schengen, and to this we add even more. russia's headquarters attack on ukraine in the 22nd

year, therefore, in many areas, ukraine today fully uses the entire european market. i always explain it like this, galicians will understand me. let's imagine that someone is making shoes near the zabzydowska calvary near krakow. when it was a part of austria-hungary, it could produce an unknown amount of these shoes, because there was a big market that everyone could buy them without duty and without problems. and today, if... someone wants to produce something in ukraine, he has access to a large, as they used to say, an empire, well, the european union knows an empire in the political sense, but it covers a large territory, i think not everyone understands what happened. i would say yes, in ukraine there is a fast way much faster than in poland, this is not even taking into account the wars, i mean the 22nd year, this is putin's last attack, the biggest. ukraine already had better conditions than poland once had when it joined the eu. second.

accession of ukraine to nato, but on that part territories where there is no russian army. could something similar be proposed during eu accession. certain temporary solutions are a bit of a different story, because in the case of the eu it will be a matter of customs decisions and the arrival of goods, and yet there is no reason.

moldova will have a similar problem, for example, because it will be necessary to carefully consider the decision regarding transnistria, but this will in no way mean that someone will recognize russian encroachments on the territory of ukraine. maybe there will be some solutions, at least with trade considerations, probably ukraine itself will want, because it will be in the interests of ukraine to make these trade solutions work especially well, which will... the european union needs to be looked at as a business opportunity for people, and then we will see it in to another, because the eu will give the ukrainian middle class, which suffered terribly after the war, the opportunity to focus on creating personal success in the form of finances. it is inconvenient, but when

the war is over and the agreements have already been concluded, then the eu will open. but the war will last no more than 5-6 years, it will be incredible for those people who survived the war, who will look for some normal ways of development, like every society after the war. that is also an interesting statement. it is an interesting statement that the war will last no more than five to six years, i.e. another two to three years, why do you think so? i won't tell you that right away, because it took more time to present a serious forecast, but we have time to consider two or three existing scenarios. first scenario, let's not forget about him, we constantly talk about it, for example, that putin will die. putin's departure in the modern international system. almost automatically means the beginning of changes of some kind, because some negotiations

will definitely take place. there is a second option, which is the most negative, extreme option in this war, and this is the issue of the kharkiv moment, which we talked about in the previous program, this will happen if the russians manage to enter ukraine, go deeper, that is, break the front line and strengthen it there , political consequences it's actually hard to imagine how for... and it will also be able to defend itself from the air, because it will have the first aircraft, it's no secret, which will already be of the latest generation, and in addition, it will be able to attack targets on the territory of russia, because it will have missiles, plus will carry out

an effective mobilization, that is , what the western allies should do and what they should do will be done. we are starting negotiations, fighting, winning, but there are still many unknowns. we are talking about a positive scenario, but let's remember that you can't get excited and look for it in it psychological escape from war. sometimes it seems that everything will be fine, it will be different, but it won't be fine anyway, because something bad has already happened. and to think that everything will be bad and that everything will be good is equally meaningless, you need to be realistic. when we think that everything will be fine, we must not forget that there are already huge

population losses, population displacement, internal displacement due to russia's attack, the departure of people to the west, the destruction of infrastructure - a huge scale of problems. it is shocking, yes, some did take part in celebrations, for example, france. it is difficult for someone to understand that history is happening before our eyes, that putin is the same as hitler. we don't need 30, 40, 50 years, like after that war, to understand that after a certain point we can no longer shake hands with hitler. if someone does not realize this, then he will not do anything serious. and there were those too.

those who then expressed their condolences. let's recall this historical fact: ireland expressed condolences on hitler's death in 1945. there is always someone like that, perhaps this is a history lesson. although now they have declared that they will not express condolences in the event of putin's death. we can probably say that this should not be expected from us. the international criminal court has requested arrest warrants for israeli prime minister netanyahu and defense minister gallant for alleged for me, everything here is very simple, i can say it briefly: we, as poland, support the decision on the dissolution of two states, that is, israel and palestine, of palestinian autonomy. we can build a way of thinking focused on both

israel and palestine, but we never do let's put israel and hamas on the same level. israel, and this is another part. israel is our principal security ally and an important ally historically. israel is organically connected with the history of poland, as well as with the history of ukraine. many people from our territories, our citizens, jews or persons of jewish origin, once founded israel. israel is part of our political horizon. at the same time, we reserve the right to criticize. individual actions of the israeli government, and this does not mean that we will not criticize, for example, cruel actions or violations of international law during the war, however, we will never try, as some people are trying to do today, and this is reflected in the statements of the international court, to equate in any way the position of israel, as an internationally recognized state, and hamas, which is

a terrorist organization . the victim of the attacker. this would be against justice, common sense and our interests. these are important words. thank you for this program, close to politics, close to the world. pavel koval, maria gurska. see us in polish at pavel koval's youtube channel, in ukrainian on espresso every sunday at 3:30 p.m. and 10 p.m. and read the highlights of our conversations on eu sisters in both languages. thank you very much. gasoline trimmers are so heavy, loud and inconvenient, and that's what you want to have. a beautiful, well-kept plot. there is a solution. garden trimmer records from unpack tv. hurry up to order at a special price. only from uah 999. kors trimmers are compact,

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they are reporting from the city, now we can... on the footage we can show the fire, what is left, this is what is left of the huge shopping center, just yesterday the supermarket hypermarket was working , as recently as yesterday, people were walking there, and today this is all that remains, and, unfortunately, 15 people have already died, also our colleagues from the public sector report about the explosions that they heard in zaporizhzhia, before that, they reported about the missile danger for this settlement, but in the meantime, i would like to add... to the conversation political technologist taras zagorodny, whom we congratulate, glory to ukraine. good day, glory to the heroes. mr. taras, this whole long and multi-part game about the fact that from different sources, for some reason, from four, it has been confirmed that putin is very ready for negotiations on the right to freeze the front line, that is what they talked about, then they release him... in a word this whole game

is about peace negotiations, and at the same time an attempt to organize some alternative peace summit with all the chinese and brazilians, what are they playing and what does it mean? well, look, what they are trying, i was quite skeptical about this peace summit, to be honest, but what is starting... such a fuss among the chinese and russians around this issue, says that when especially the chinese are there trying their summit to create, they even signed something with the brazilians there, made some kind of statement, this indicates that they really do not like some of the framework points that will be announced there, and they find themselves in a losing position, because the name itself is the peace summit, it means who

does not come to the peace summit. that of course is for war, which china has always tried to avoid, russia is doing the same now, trying to do something there with the brics countries and so on, this is in the first way, or rather in the second point, regarding what the russians are in such a hurry to do, of course, the russians do not dream of any peace. we must clearly and distinctly understand that as long as putin is in power, the war will continue. they are considering the possibility negotiations as a further expansion against ukraine, what i see at this stage, what they want to do, they want to pull the trick that they managed to pull together with the us and the eu in the 14th year, when the embargo was announced against ukraine for the supply of weapons, that is, the approximate scheme is as follows: they seem to pretend that they are ready for some kind of negotiations, then in the west suddenly

appear... people who start saying, let's give peace a chance, and stop supplying weapons to the conflict zone, and then the russians are starting to increase their attacks further, i'm not i don't believe in any of these fables that putin will agree to fixing the current front line, this is an outright lie, because we know how russia will behave, but this is purely theoretical, if any negotiations start, let's fix it. right away , the questions will start there, and why, give it to the entire zaporizhzhia region, it is written in our constitution, give it to the whole kherson region, why mykolaiv, odesa, the left bank in general is ours, and why will you be tied up later under this question the reduction of the ukrainian army, the impossibility of having its own heavy weapons and the ability to make rockets and so on, that is, we understand what it will be and in the west, unfortunately

, there will be many such people who are willing to help russia in order to also solve their problems. mr. taras, but you just voiced a few points from the so-called istanbul drafts, do you remember, but in the 22nd year, in fact, that is, they and it is not for nothing that putin corresponds there in his statements, he all the time sends that ukraine was already ready, if it weren't for the angry johnson, then everything would already be in chocolate, well... let's face it, there were not only the istanbul agreements, there was also the plan of the drago, the italian prime minister, who had already stuffed all the hotels of russia, for three months western europe was persuading us to surrender, let's also be objective, there was also such a story, this plan , by the way, is still registered at the un and has not been revoked, actually fixing the annexation of territories, many other things, well, regarding the istanbul agreements, well, they were still not

signed. that's why putin and his huts wanted it.