a decisive defeat, and not a half-defeat there in kharkiv, in chernihiv, partially, then in november in kherson, then the situation would be completely different, and russia would not have the strength to mobilize all its agents and supporters and mobilize its support in iran, in china, in north korea, and so on, and you will rebuild a new military economy and... then start this operation of sabotage in countries, that is, blowing up warehouses there, in our country, well , look, if in germany they regularly happen from the action of sabotage, which is obvious it can be connected to moscow to a lesser extent, well , last week explosives and detonators were accidentally found near the oil pipeline, which means near heidelberg, there is a huge nato base, there was something there, some explosives with detonators were there, which means eh... and this

happens regularly, that is, if we did not give moscow the opportunity to put pressure on us from all sides, to provoke estonia there by removing these border markings, it means to provoke sweden, by the fact that they published some of their demands there to change the fairway in the baltic sea, then it was withdrawn, then there was nothing to it, all these right radical parties, they have their influence only within the limits of... how much we allow them to use our problems of an economic and other nature, b, to what extent they have this connection of their own, as antaeus had a connection, that is, with gaia, with the earth, as far as they have a connection with moscow, if these two factors are not there, then there is no influence of them, adn would never have its 30 or so percent, if the chancellor of germany demonstrated that germany... can be

a leader in the world, in europe, like a sword and defeat a totalitarian regime. if germany were such a leader that poland, the czech republic, etc. would follow, then all those who want a great germany there, which they respect, which means that it can demonstrate leadership, would not have voted for the adn, but for the spd. so, now scholz is trying to intercept the votes of the adn by bending even more towards moscow, thinking that in this way he can intercept. votes of adn, this is completely false and unpromising, unpromising strategy. but are you not afraid that the ultra-right factions in the new european parliament will be so serious that they will change the very face of europe in this situation? well, the european parliament, fortunately, is a very neutered body, it does not have a legislative initiative, of course it has its powers, there, say, voting for the candidacy of the head of the european commission. there is

the confirmation of the commissioners, but even all of them, the parliament itself does not, therefore, does not propose, that is, what you say, of course, is an objective process, and it is not safe, indeed the voices of the radical parties are increasing in the world, and in europe in particular, but again, why they are increasing, people cannot find why they... can trust the traditional parties, the democratic parties, if you will, uh, let's say, i can speak for germany, in germany , the social contract between the state and its population is obviously destroyed, well, bearing in mind, of course, that the state is an instrument of the population, that is, the format of the existence of the german state, which was formed precisely by the population through 75 years old. german

democratic state, now on may 23 we celebrated the 75th anniversary of the german basic law, it is violated because the social contract was that we pay a lot of taxes, we delegate a lot of our rights in germany, the state, well, for example, there from the fact that a person cannot change his name freely, because the state does not allow you to manage this process, ending with the fact that on sundays you cannot... work there, or there are other points, that is, taxes are high, such liberalism in the form of lasifer, his too no, but a very safe life, a very large social insurance, and the government is so concerned and cares about you that you will never end up in poverty, nothing will ever happen to you, and now it turns out that it does not work, that poverty is real . is increasing, uh, the danger is increasing from

the level of hard drug use there, and you see it on the streets of berlin, when people, like, it's not san francisco yet, but... it 's moving in that direction, so the shootings and the knives turn into everyday life, and of course, that there is yellow media inflated, of course, that it is so little, you know, it is difficult to compare the level of danger in berlin with the level of danger in kharkiv, let's say this, but all the same people feel it, and they do not feel that the state institutions are working, that is, of course it sounds funny, but when a person cannot... for some time get an opportunity to issue a new passport there, or register for a residence address, then if this person does not have much of a strategic vision there, there are no moral restrictions on voting against the adn, then he votes for the adn just to otti

everyone up there so that they can see that she is not satisfied, that is, it is such a big ass, it means that they are showing these elites, well, it is me... trump was at one time and so on, and that is the problem that radicals, they really address their speeches to real problems, and despite the fact that, of course , their recipes will never work, but people see this only after they vote for the radicals. thank you, mr. serhiy, serhii sumlennyi, the german political scientist was in touch with us, and now to the lithuanian republic, the second round of presidential elections has just ended. you, gitanes nauseda, the current president and prime minister ingrid šemonite, fought for the post of president in the second round . congratulations, mr. viktor. congratulations. so, 49%

of lithuanian citizens, registered voters voted in this second round. there are no results yet, i think they will be soon. how do you generally perceive this? 83% of the votes were received by the president gitanesnoseda, 14% of the votes got ingrid chemonite, that's about 867 ballots, so to speak, polling stations since 1895, well, in principle, the trend is already clear, i can say, mr. victor, that hytenos will not be re-elected for a second term, taking into account this ratio, right? i wouldn't be in such a hurry, because... you know lithuania very well, and now, well, you can say that only small towns and villages have been counted, and large cities and medium-sized cities, there are not even any data yet, well, yes , i understand, but if you take into account, take into account

the trend, i am nothing, yes, yes, in some way to some extent, but this was a trend in the first round as well, during the first round, i... i don't think there will be any such intrigue or any, i don't know, surprise, everything is as planned, predicted, but after all, nausida will be the president for a second term, there was an intrigue in something else entirely, the fact that he accumulates forces that, to a certain extent, reflect somewhere. well, i don't know, half a million inhabitants of lithuania, and for lithuania, this is a lot, who look not to the west, but to the east, that is, they are sympathizers of russia, they are obvious, it was the first time in lithuania that such

candidates who were openly in favor of russia, yes, but these candidates, as far as i understand, they will not be, they are not partisans. these candidates are unlikely to have their own candidate in the second round, however, that's the problem, they said that their candidate is the one, well, that is, so as not to vote for a shomonite, as a representative of the conservatives, yes, yes, they will not vote for it , this is a fact, and therefore, well, with such people, there will still be unease, how important it is for the president to have such a part. well, we remember president zelenskyy in the 19th year too he could obviously count on that part of the electorate that voted for pro-russian candidates, but his position was also very different from the position of the same yury boyk, even the pre-election position, from the last statements on usidy, we immediately understood that

this part is still for him the electorate is very important, as he said, it is necessary to talk to them, and that was... there was a compliment in that direction, and i think that it is not only vaitkus who is such a zhimaitais, he is a more covered-up person. in my opinion, but it only looks like it, and i honestly don't i understand if you are talking about it like this is some kind of new phenomenon, it has never happened before, and again, well, i apologize, but viktor uspassky's labor party has always been a party that was one way or another connected with russian narratives, the president of lithuania roland spaksa lost his position, he was impeached, due to the fact that he had contacts with a dubious russian businessman, after which he resumed his... political career and even became a member of the european parliament, in the communist party of lithuania

the independent party, which later became the labor party, always found some people who were one way or another connected to moscow, if i look at the 30 years of lithuania's restored independence, i see it all the time from the first to the last day, what happened so new , many people, i think, such frank, no-no, vitaliy, such frank supporters of putin. after all, we did not have, there was no war, because the situation itself has completely changed, you know, you understand that lithuania is now one of the leaders, you can say, of europe union and nato, which is constantly pushing to support ukraine, the european union in one way, and nato in another, and those people do not. and we haven't had that before. well, look, after all, the candidate vaitkos in the first round received

votes primarily in, let's say, in the russian-speaking environment, so where specialists worked at the nuclear power plant, it was always a city with not even a russian-speaking, this is incorrect, definition with a russian population, with people who moved to lithuania already after 1900 in the 1940s, you do not have such a large population, it times, and the border with belarus, where the polish population lives, some call it the polish-speaking belarusian population, it is such a complex, i would say ethnic history, but it is an opportunity to play on the moods of national minorities or on the moods of people who watch russian television until now, well , russian sources of information, this is not such a serious split in... this electoral audience of lithuania, well, there is, there is

a split, you know, in what, what you just mentioned was added to visagines and shalchenenko , added current, such a region is very the big one is called, it is the whole of western lithuania, and they voted for people who are exactly against, oppose aid to ukraine. and there are more or less pro-russian ones, and why? this is news. žemaiti, by and large, is the cradle of lithuanian national identity, right? but this is a poor region compared to others. maybe it's economic, well, compared to vilnius, all regions are poor. i would say so. well, i wouldn't say so. well, listen, well, if you live in kaunas, you don't feel such a gap, if, like you live in šiauliai, well, no. well, he's not that poor i was joking, of course, well, i’m speaking conditionally

speaking, like the state of the people, well, they, well, there is a slight resentment towards vilnius, as one person there said one of the presidential candidates before the first round, he said that there there is such dissatisfaction that there is also vilnius and there is ... lithuania, well, here, here is this, i wanted to ask you, this is what they convey to people, about this story with the appearance on the website of the ministry of defense of russia, the russian government of the proposal of the ministry of defense of russia to change in the unilateral order of maritime borders with lithuania and finland, and to be honest, i was also surprised by how different the reaction was in vilnius and helsinki, because both prime minister shomonite and president nause spoke quite harshly about it in vilnius. and other political leaders, in helsinki they spoke very carefully,

they said that we have nothing to worry about, you know , i think they discussed it, after all , they discussed it in riga, recently seven countries, you know these seven countries, that is, from norway to ukraine , ukraine is also one of the seven countries bordering russia. and so do i it seems that we have, we are dealing with a provocation after all. er, and of course, it is not very good if near the shores of klaipeda appear, er, as they say now, that they can declare on such a basis, completely legal after their statements, some corvette there, this is such unpleasant news , but i think that

there is a reaction now, it is discussed in the offices, not so much in society, i... understand why, why, yes, i say why, you understand why society is not interested in it, well, i would be interested in a change maritime, maritime border, own state, let's say, well, they stole tanks, near the banks of the narva river, this is also my situation, i don't know. in a civilized country, this is impossible, but in russia everything is possible, they took the tanks and stole them. well, the same here, i say, maybe, but, in fact, i don’t know much about it, i only have such semi-official sources, that is, they are

official, but not allowed to be reported to a wide audience, but i know that ... this is being discussed in lithuania and other countries, well, vitaliy, i don't know what to say or add besides, but this word, i can repeat, is a provocation from russia, and everything they are doing is an attempt to take revenge, to order these countries that help ukraine, er, all absolutely, er, it's... and finland, and the baltic countries, and poland, and this will be done by russia, even no one has no doubt that they will take revenge. that is, you actually believe that this is such an attempt to take revenge, including for finland's accession to nato , absolutely, yes, you are right, yes, this is revenge, and in general, in your opinion, are the

baltic countries ready to respond to such actions, if some kind of hybrid war, preparing, but not ready. now we are talking a lot about this , discussing, debating, but we are not quite ready yet, we are not ready, we were not ready, just as we were not ready for disinformation, i think that here we should turn to ukraine, to ukrainian journalists with help, because no one has the experience that ukraine has in terms of disinformation, well, it seems to me that ukraine was also completely unprepared at one time , when this whole russian disinformation campaign was thrown at it, but now, but now such, unfortunately, such an experience is not good, so that it would not be better at all, but, well, it is there. thank you, mr. viktor,

viktor chernyshuk, lithuanian journalist, head of the ukrainian house in lithuania public organization. he and i discussed the results of the second round of the elections for the president of the republic of lithuania, while we were talking with mr. viktor, they count very quickly in lithuania, they counted more votes, 1102 electoral votes have already been counted, not ballots, 1102 elections of electoral precincts since 1895, the president of the republic of lithuania is the leader this race with the 80s... by almost two percent of the voters' votes, prime minister ingrid shumanita, who was his main opponent in these elections, and passed together with the current head of state to the second round, and less than 17% of the voters' votes

, the counting of votes will continue, but we are fine with you we understand that the trend will not change, mrs. shumanita can really... win votes in big cities of lithuania, but hyteresna useda will confidently remain for a second term as the president of the republic of lithuania, which was expected in principle before this, before these elections, now we will take a break for literally 5 minutes and continue our program, the verdict with serhiy rudenko, from now on in a new two-hour format, even more analytics, even more important topics, even more top guests: foreign experts, inclusion of border, about ukraine, the world. front society, and also feedback, you can express your opinion on a bad day with the help of a telephone survey, turn on and turn on, the verdict with serhiy rudenko, every day... weekdays from 20 to 22 at espresso. greetings, this is svoboda live on radio svoboda. we have already approached

the serpent himself. the following shots may shock you. news from the scene. live kamikaze drone attacks. political analytics. objectively and meaningfully. there is no political season. exclusive interviews, reports from the hottest points of the front. shot! freedom of life - frankly and impartially, you draw your own conclusions. congratulations once again, friends, we continue the politclub program, with you vitalia portnikova, our guest natalia pasichnyk, swedish-ukrainian pianist, director of the ukrainian institute sweden, congratulations ms. natalie, nice to see you, good afternoon, thank you very much for the invitation. you know, i want to start our conversation with this reasoning about a certain cultural schizophrenia in which we lived for decades and continue to live after the beginning of the great war, that is, for decades

ukrainian performers, ukrainian artists, ukrainian, i would say journalists, told the world about russian culture, about the connection between russian and ukrainian cultures, about tchaikovsky and prokofiev, who are related to ukraine, and actually did not talk about what is directly related to, i i would say to... ukrainian culture, i am not talking now about folklore, about any such things, but about what, in principle, is part of our cultural outlook, if we are talking about high culture, about opera, about ballet, about great literature , about poetry, etc., for 2.5 years ukrainian artists, instead of telling that we have all this, go everywhere and try to ban russian culture, that is, they are trying to fight against what they have propagated for ten years in a row, and on all my remarks can... let's talk about ours, we can't forever talking about russian either with a plus sign or a minus sign, i encounter complete misunderstanding, because i have the impression that people understood how they understood that you could make

a career in russian then, this is how they understand that you can make a career i am writing in russian right now, and ukraine is falling somewhere in tartarariphschizophrenia, you know, all the time, and here i have a simple question, how should we promote ukrainian, because how to fight with russian, i already understand for sure, there will be an army of people ready to do it for themselves. on this whole story, and how show the world that ukraine exists? you know, you just took all the words from me, i was able to do practically what i wanted, very well , nice wrong word, it really gives me hope in general, what you are discussing, what is wrong with me, the way i look and listen to the ukrainian information space , it seems to me that this topic in general is somewhat in the shadows, and i understand that we are now dealing with the survival of the nation, we are currently... er, missile attacks and the like, and talking about culture may not be timely, but here i am for 30 years , i have been living in the west for more than 30 years saw the transformation of this vision of ukraine

from the 1990s to our time, so to speak , a collective event from the 1990s, when it can be characterized best by the speech of george bush, who said that do not vote, because ukraine - it is part of russia, yes. in the 91st year, it was 2004, when for the first time we looked at ukraine as something so exotic, but still our own, and of course 2014, and 2022, and this transformation, i always ask myself the question, why they don't hear us, well, we say so much for now for for, well, that's it war is clearly unfair, that's how we talk about what we need, and we would be heard, but all the time for... and here i am, after so many years of being, i'm probably looking from my point of view, i still think , on a subconscious level in a collective event,

the perception of the country is built on knowledge of culture, and ukrainian culture, cultural heritage - it has always been such a white spot, and you absolutely correctly said that the russian cultural heritage is in them... that is, russia they are associated with high culture, no matter who you ask, this, this country, they will all name dostoyevsky, tchaikovsky, and the like, and we have helped them a lot in this all these years, just as you said that it is some kind of, well, i actually wanted you to ask a question, because i do not live in ukraine, it is very far away, how to explain this kind of stockholm syndrome, that even now, when we are bombed, there is, for example, such a narrative in society that it is okay, for example, even ours preserves... still has tchaikovsky's last name, and i think that without some strategy, it is probably

impossible to achieve this, the fact that... how this cultural diplomacy is done in our country now, i will tell you how the ukrainian institute, how it was founded, and what i am telling you in general, was always an impetus, i was on tour in paris and told my colleagues, and it was 2016 14, i told my colleagues about russia, about history, how they behaved with us, how crimea was seized at that time and the like, and they listened to me, looked at it, everyone says , well, what you are telling, this cannot be, what in they have tchaikovsky, they have dostoevsky, well, even more so... france, in general, they have such a great piety towards russia, and i just thought to myself, this is much stronger on a subconscious level than everything that is right, wrong, or something like that, that is, it is somehow formed in them, but they know nothing about ukraine, but they know about russia, and of course, uh, well, this became the impetus for creating this ukrainian institute, which in the end, immediately in 2014 we also appealed to

the ministry of culture of ukraine. and that's how they started talk about the creation of a ukrainian institute in ukraine, but of course competing with gazprom, money or their propaganda or something, it is very difficult for us, but for me so far in 2022 and after that , this great war actually did not understand a little, probably narrated some of my colleagues and such, as you continue to say, which... because look, i wanted to, maybe i will give such an example in the heads of the collective event, we were part of russia for so long, and i think that the cultural dimension in this played a very big role, well, even you perceived ukraine through russian culture, one might say, through tchaikovsky, through pushkin, and now, when this window

of opportunity seems to have appeared for ukraine, we are further ahead... all platforms are moving together with the russians, i am talking about my small or large puddle , so about high music, and always, when they give the opportunity to represent ukrainian music, they always add some tchaikovsky or shostakovich, and people who have a core, who refuse this, turn out to be some kind of radicals, in contrast to those people who, well then it seems that everything is okay, well, to us well, it is necessary to present to our ukrainians... this and here we have this platform, and this creates even more confusion in the minds of these collective events, or so to speak, listeners, spectators, and explain to them that it is not yes, it is much more difficult than if there was some specific such, no, well, we, we do not do this and we do not know this, so i do not know what this is ours, that is, i know from the western side, that i know,

ukrainian performers come, they want to... make a career, this entire cultural platform is permeated, one might say, with metastases russian money, they have to adapt, and that's the way it is, and, well, whoever has the rod, he, er, he goes against the wind, but it's a lot harder, but say, let's try to discuss a specific instrument, yes, we understand , that there are german operas on the stages of large opera houses, there are french operas, and finally there are russian operas, but also. there is so much, well, there is tchaikovsky, roman corsican, i will leave everything on this, stravinsky, but this is no longer a russian opera, so to speak, as what we often see in the repertoire, but here i am, but there is also a czech opera, true, and polish, people who go to european opera houses, they know who is a scumbag, who is a dvorak, who is a manyushka, they see it, opera houses are always looking for new material, because the same thing gets tired, show , i can already remember ballet for decades. and

the question arises, do we have a chance to show ukrainian opera on the stage of, say, the swedish opera house, and ukrainian ballet, we have all this, we have this, we did not always have a lot of this, because again, when there was a choice between ukrainian ballet and russian ballet, we always chose russian, well, it's very simple, we had, let's say this, as it was called, the night before stankovich's christmas. which was written specifically as a new year's ballet and it was not performed at the kyiv opera, because it was considered that loskunchyk was more promising, and it was renamed so as not to be shown for the new year, it is still going under a different name, but that's the way it is, it's the past, maybe it will change, but if we offer it to european opera and ballet theaters, what should we do to really stage it, because i believe that if a person at...