and join the verdict with serhii rudenko every weekday from 20:00 to 22:00 at espresso. about different colors, psychedelic lines, red and not only, we will now talk with the director of the initiative center european stability, german political scientist serhiy sumlenny in connection with our studio. mr. serhiy, we congratulate you. good morning, good afternoon, i congratulate you, well, it was unexpected, of course, to hear from scholz that the use of german weapons, which become ukrainian when they are transferred to the armed forces, will not lead to escalation, but actually, in the heroine yesterday, for ukrainians, there is maria agnes straktzimerman, who logically answered ayai's question, what will happen if a russian plane is shot down with german weapons. one plane will be

less, how many people in the political class of germany now share the absolutely logical position of marie agnes strack zimmerman, well, it is difficult to say, but first of all, it is necessary to understand that what is the current situation of mariak zimmerman, she is a leader in european electoral list of the party. of the democrats, which is part of the government in germany, that's it now is going to the elections to the european parliament, which will be held on june 9, and the situation of the free democrats in germany is quite bad, they have less than 5% of the rating now, that is , if there were elections in budapest now, they would not get there, and this leads to the fact that , in fact, maria gneshtrak zyberman, who in... in

principle, has traditionally held quite such a position as a hawk, is now putting even more pressure on it, because she sees that there is dissatisfaction in society with this apathy of scholz, and therefore she absolutely consciously allows himself a much sharper and correct statement, of course, in our opinion, but this is precisely because it should be shown to the voters as much as possible. the fact that it is she who must be elected, her party must be elected to the european parliament in order to achieve results, even though other parties are not doing enough, so in order to achieve this, regarding scholz, regarding scholze , then the situation here is like this, because 16 hours before he gave permission for ukrainians, ukrainian women to beat with

weapons of german origin, in russia, he said that in he was directly asked, that is, in an interview, he said 16 hours before, he said that the question is absurd, the discussion is absurd, nothing like this will ever happen and that's it. the only thing that has changed scholtz is this permission from the united states, which actually means that scholtz has no strategic vision, and that he will slow down everything until some tectonic changes occur from the outside. well, if it is to radicalize this assessment, then... you can say that why do we need such a chancellor, who does not have his own strategy, and who is solely dependent on what others are doing, that's the last thing, yes please go on, well yes, the last thing is what is in the political environment that really decides what germany does, and that is, unfortunately, the social democratic party of germany , scholtz's party, the opinion there has not changed, and if you look at, say, the statement of the leader of the social democrats faction there.

the rhetoric is the same there: don't let's not annoy putin, because something terrible will happen, and here we see a big disparity between such apathy in the spd and the effectively blocked german government and very the pro-ukrainian position of the population of germany, which stands for 2/3 of the german population are in favor of further military aid to ukraine, and a third of the ministries are in favor of increasing it. and we see such, such an imbalance, on which, in fact, i am appealing to strak zimmerman, that is why her statements went down very well in germany. did germany shake when journalists discovered and published excerpts from secret documents related to the nord stream that merkel and scholz, despite her, were fighting for this the northern stream, we understand that even a few years ago, even before... a full-scale

invasion, the germans were still more guided by their own interests, because the issue of energy resources, gas and so on was very important, now a little. the worldview is changing, but what was the reaction to these materials? well, in fact, there was no big scandal, although it is strange, because it is obvious that these documents testify that the decision on the northern stream, it was made with full understanding of the risks that he carried with him brings, because before this the official position was... because ah, we were deceived, so we believed, that is, in russia, and they took advantage of this faith of ours and themes that we are naive, but in fact not naive, in fact everything it was obvious, in fact it was clear that this

is a military and economic project of russia, and not an economic one, and the decision was made anyway, well, i worked for 15 from 15 to 21 years in kyiv as the head of... the representative office of the heindrich biel foundation, this is a green political fund, i remember how absolutely impossible it was to explain to the delegations from germany that came, even those who were in opposition to the nord stream, that this is exactly a military project of russia, that is, they believed there officially, as in official statements, that, well , there will be economic problems in ukraine, but that’s the way it is life... but you can’t always have only soldiers, that’s when ukrainian representatives, representatives of economic bodies, energy bodies there said back in 16-17 years that as soon as the russians build the second northern stream, they will launch a full-scale offensive , and what actually happened, well, that's it

the german delegations demonstrated their complete disagreement with this and the fact that, well , they are ukrainians, so they are paranoid, they are too emotional and that's it. and now we see that they understood everything, well, in the government, to say the least, there was no scandal, why? because in principle , in germany , something very strange has happened in the last five years with german political political morals, because before people resigned much easier, much easier, now we see what the head of the mecklenburg region will say there dying, this is... the northeastern region, where exactly the northern stream comes , said shvezih, she burned some documents on the fund that her region was testing together with gosprom, and nothing happened to her, so, mr. serhiy, no

the only one, but you say that such a transformation is taking place in the highest circles of germany, it is very important to understand what transformations are taking place at the level of society. because we look there, for example, how milk yields and the percentage of fat in butter are growing in alternative feuchland, and we have many different questions, i wanted to show you a little thing, a video from hamburg from hamerpark, it is from the second - from june 2, eh, we protect the psyche of our viewers, so we do not turn on the sound, this crunch of pobidobesia and others. we won't include russian spiritual scraps, but let's put it this way, in the city in broad daylight , such pobiedomisis take place, moreover, these are people who have long since put a pilot's license or a german passport in their back pocket, well, no one reacts to this in any way, a free democratic

country , if you want, you support putin, but when you shout zik hal and throw zig, then the police will probably come right away, there are absolutely similar actions here. don't ignore, i.e. the concentration of putin-fersteiers is increasing among ordinary germans, who do not know much about the european elections and your geopolitics, as they say? you know, here i would say that the situation is not so bad, that is, it is bad, but not so much, that is , the fate of these people who are on the side of russia is directly mediocre or without... average, it is not actually growing significantly, that is, it as it is there at the level of 30%, 32-33 percent, it is there, of course it is there some fluctuations, but they are not trivial, what you have shown are other manifestations of something else, these are

manifestations of the fact that there is a--this radical, absolutely radicalized layers, this one means a layer, which is just there already... . one cannot talk about anything, these people are absolutely lost for the democratic process and for any discussions, but there are not so many of them, the problem is that in... let's say, in german, political circles, russia is still not an enemy, but russia is not a terrorist state for them, so, let's say, there is a flag, a flag, there, in islamic the state cannot be demonstrated on the streets, even though the islamists find options there, so they come out there with slightly modified flags, but formally it is not possible, but the russian tricolor is possible, that means the national slogans, that is, the national socialists, it is not possible, absolutely fair

, they cannot be demonstrated, but the slogans of the new russian national socialism can be displayed there, because they are not prohibited, and even, therefore, when they try to limit them, at least there, when we expect an increase in the number such manifestation, there, well, there on... there is may 9, here are all these holidays of theirs, even there there is a discussion such as whether it is not too much, or whether it is not a restriction on freedom of speech and so on, here and here, here and there, you understand, about this last step, that is, two years ago, 87% of germans there considered russia a threat, now it is less than 67%, because everyone there is already used to it, but still 2/3 consider russia a threat, but the threat is not... at the level that it is an absolutely evil and terrorist state, but the threat is at the level, well, something must be done about it,

but this last step has not been taken, therefore, when, when the percentage of those who consider russia a threat has decreased, the german media in general talk about it, that in fact, every evening on the federal channels, absolutely official factors, deputies, everyone else come and tell how they will nuclear bomb berlin, solovyov agreed yesterday that we will take it. berlin5 and we will not even go to the reporters, that is, we are occupying germany, they talk about such and such, they somehow reflect on it, do they not pay attention to this white noise, they think that this is propaganda exclusively for russians within the federal borders tv channels, well, you know, this is my organization, let’s say, myself and my colleagues, female colleagues, we try to emphasize exactly this and say, listen, as it were, you think that you and russia can come to an agreement, and russia everything about you is already you. and the plans for you have already been written, which concentration camp have you been taken to, and they

openly talk about it, and the problem is that these plans, they look too wild, that is, it does not fit in the head, that is, it is not on the head common people have what can really be done every day on the biggest ones on state channels, to say such things, firstly, secondly, er, well, constantly, if it is about this, why, let’s say, the number has changed, there 82%, there was a threat to russia, now 67, because that many people think that the war is more or less over, if they don't talk about it, then it's as if there's nothing there, and people, if they don't have to constantly follow what's happening, there against, that it's so, that's the biggest a threat to the security, security of europe and the world, but all the same people should not do this... well, who was interested there 10 years ago, the way putin trained in syria, to destroy cities, that means, in fact

, all these situations with bakhmut, avdiivka, marinka, etc., he trained there, but no one was interested in it, well, they are bombing something there and bombed, well, something so far away, it is difficult to understand, the same is the case here with ukraine from the side of ordinary germans, if something like this is really happening, that is beyond the limits. of this daily level of violence, well, there are strikes on kharkiv, let's say, the discussion immediately increases, but this is a tragedy, what conditionally saying, putin is torturing 10 prisoners over there, and it doesn't even make it into the tenth column of the newspaper as a small, small piece of news, that is, putin has managed to normalize it completely, precisely because of the amount of this violence, and this is our task, to talk about the fact that it is nowhere has not gone away and that it will come to everyone if it is not stopped. of course.

thank you, mr. sergey, for the professional analysis. serhii sumleny, german political scientist and director of the initiative center european sustainability , about certain transformations, which are also in the political class, and in german society take place. if everything is standard in the political class, kickbacks and schlöder are now becoming standard, no one now resigns in case of... geopolitical or other scandals, then with ordinary germans, i am not sure, as our enemy says, tomorrow, june 6, and this the year a huge tragedy, i am talking now about how the russians blew up the dam of the kakhovsky reservoir, tomorrow we will talk about it a lot, but already today we want to raise this topic somewhat, and we are in touch with olga lyashchuk, a specialist in adaptation to climate change of the ecoclub, ms. olga, we welcome you, good afternoon, we saw footage from

the kakhovsky reservoir, how it grows, in fact behind... it becomes like such forests, last year, so last year, people planted potatoes there, now weavers are there, and experts tell us that in fact the roots are very good there, the trees, those that have grown taller, they are simply growing at a crazy pace, and this, of course, has its effect on the entire ecosystem, are we going to return to the process that took place before before the creation of a reservoir, that's what what is happening there now? from the point of view of ecology, first of all, this area is still very close to the conduct of combat zones, so such thorough scientific research is still a matter of the future, but a significant part, well, there is a certain part of scientists and public figures who really conduct there research, so, for example, according to the estimates of the ukrainian nature protection group,

according to optimistic forecasts, this area of ​​young forest that you mentioned can be more than 890 km, now there are really willows and poplars growing there, and this is good, so that these breeds are well adapted to climate change, the fact is that we are already feeling the effects of climate change in ukraine right now, we can see it from the heavy downpours that covered the whole of ukraine literally days ago, and similar... similar adverse climatic phenomena will only intensify, so we must prepare and take into account during reconstruction, including when we think about the kakhovskaya hydroelectric power station, what to do with it, we must take into account these consequences of climate change, and here is this young forest, willow and topol, he is just right can play a very significant role, a positive

role, in how this region will recover. the problem is: the fact that the government has already made a decision to rebuild the kakhovsko kakhovskaya hydroelectric power plant. from the point of view of both scientists and conservation organizations, this is a slightly premature decision. it is necessary to carry out, at least, an assessment of the impact on the environment of this reconstruction, in order to really assess whether it is worth rebuilding. it is huge complex, huge. dream question, perhaps, after evaluations, this is the most adult, in the future, forest in the steppe zone of ukraine will bring much more benefit than a reservoir, which will lose, for example, a lot of water due to evaporation. mrs. olga,

you also understand that by the time the verbologists grow up and by the time the war ends, this... government simply will not exist, it will even be forgotten, which means that such decisions can still be made to revise it, according to its biological and climatic expediency, and not some industrial one, to build this stalinist miracle of cascades on the dnieper, to flood cossack villages, and to solve the issue of security in in the form of a transit zone there in case of nuclear war and so on, but what to do with those territories, which - well, if it is difficult to tie to the consequences of military operations, we were told yesterday about penguins that should not be in the sea of ​​azov, but which ones are there, which are thrown away, or about dolphins, about dolphins, they are thrown away, dolphins are thrown ashore, they say that the sea has become very salty, it is related to the climate, or

to the war, it is difficult to understand, but what about such changes do, eh? it is connected with the war, with climate change, which is intensifying, in that including for the introduction of hostilities. what shall i do? in fact, we can do a lot already, we can first reduce the emissions of gingerbread gases. the easiest way to do this is through energy saving measures and the construction of renewable energy sources. in addition, it will help us in our energy. independence and will help to survive the coming difficult energy years, is to increase the number of nature-reserved objects, which is also something we can do. now. we can adapt to climate change. these words sound strange and, well, difficult, but in fact, we can do a lot of

simple actions, even in those cities and communities, well, right now and within the limits of the existing budgets. for example, there, laying tiles, instead of completely asphalting walkways, sidewalks. this will allow water to seep in and not be lost. we will not lose it, and it will nourish green areas, and you see, you talk about ecological thinking in sufficiently local projects, and i ask you sufficiently global ones, because the salinization of the sea of ​​azov is a change in fact in general of the entire fauna and flora in principle and even the cycle of fishing as well, which was part of the culture and history of azov and we do not have access now. to the azov coast, it is now temporary, so what to do with such global changes? look, all global changes, they

consist of a bunch of small local changes, it is clear that the consequences of our small actions, they are supposedly imperceptible, but if we really do it all, or at least the majority, then we will have an impact on global changes as well , on... unfortunately, or fortunately, hospitality is such a question where you can't go there to take and do something huge so that it leads to some global changes immediately. these are small steps, and it is precisely because of this that i emphasize that every community, for example, when it plans reconstruction, and now many communities are developing reconstruction plans, they must take into account both the consequences of conducting hostilities and the consequences that they will have have. from climate change and take it into account already in reconstruction plans, and not, likharadichna, simply

overcome the consequences that they will inevitably face. and to what extent we have irreversible ecological losses, in particular due to the occupation, well whenever askania nova falls under occupation, and then we learn that there, on an industrial scale, animals are exported somewhere to russia. i cannot give a specific figure right now, but a huge number of objects of the nature reserve fund are really under occupation and their condition is either unknown or deplorable, some of them have been destroyed either completely or to a large extent, precisely because in addition , a number of public organizations are calling for the creation of new objects of the nature reserve fund, including, if we started talking about the kakhovskaya hpp, including here... the territory of the newly created forest, it can in some way compensate for the actually destroyed objects of the nature reserve fund,

we observed with the chernobyl zone, remember, the same effect will also be the same, unfortunately, we don't have time anymore, but it would be interesting, we could talk for hours. olha lyashchuk, an expert on adaptation to climate change at the ecoclub, was in touch with us and the espresso audience. it's time for us to say goodbye. yes, we will actually continue this topic tomorrow. we will celebrate the anniversary of the dam blow-up, we say goodbye for today, a peaceful and safe day for you, take care, in a few minutes do not miss the news, about the most important things, khrystyna parubiy will tell you, until tomorrow, attention, total sale, garden. with a discount of only 799 uah, only 799 for a reliable tool, high power, ease of use, very profitable,

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we summarize the informative morning in ukraine on the air of zpress news. khrystyna parubiy works in the studio. in the morning, during the delivery of humanitarian aid, the russians attacked the village of ingulets in the kherson region. wound. two men aged 58 and 47 were found and hospitalized, the regional military administration reported. one person died, five were injured due to the morning shelling of donetsk region. the russians killed a resident of the northern village. four local people were injured, the head of the region vadim said filashkin. two controlled avi'