the majority will work on diesel generators, which will be refueled, which will produce energy, energy, i understand correctly, i will then repeat this thesis, because it is important, please, the absence, that is, that the government has removed the duty on or is removing , i am not sure that this resolution has already been adopted, but it was considered, the customs duty on the import of energy equipment and its components, generators, batteries means that the government understands that it will not be able to help, that... our energy stations will not be able to be rebuilt, so it gives an opportunity for every household to take care of itself, at least minimally independently, and for minimal money, that is, we do not have such a production in the country, we can only import it, the cost of operation of the generator is quite high, the smaller the generator, the higher the cost per kilowatt-hour , well , physics is like that, the bigger it is, the lower the cost of a kilowatt-hour will be, that is, it is an element of scale, an element... so if we are talking

about how we can get out of this situation, let me remind you that we have broken eight, at least to to on stage in april, we lost 8 m and 8 g, this is the volume of eight nuclear reactors, 8 g of maneuverable generation, that is, these are thermal power plants, hydroelectric power plants, and we are very short of them, these blockades, which are now there, are with us. broken thermal and hydroelectric power plants, because the nuclear units are also undergoing repairs to be ready for the winter heating season, but this means that i ask you to pay attention to the fact that the volume of our possible imports from the countries of the european union is 1.7 gw, this the maximum power we can take, if at all points entrance, everything would work, but we also understand shelling there, that is, we cannot replace 8 gv in any way. now i will give another

example so that we understand serious situations. the agency, the american agency of international aid usa, through one of its projects, over the past year installed about, there are more than 90 cogeneration systems throughout ukraine, it distributed them to different cities, to different enterprises. in general, it was free money for ukraine, it was provided simply directly by equipment, it was provided by people, they, they supported technical development. documentation, i.e. full support, nevertheless, in a year they, having money, specialists, the opportunity to attract, bring, buy equipment, they were able to install these generating capacities with a volume of somewhere around 100 megawatts, that is, it is an order of magnitude less, or even two orders of magnitude less than what we can import, despite the fact that it was free money and a whole agency and a sea of ​​people worked for it, it also means conversations with energy workers, which was recently, we are doing about it today.

talked to the energy workers on the webinar, all the power of the existing european energy industry, which is currently available for the production of cogeneration machines, if they stop everything, all the contracts with all the countries they have, and all the industry, most of the countries will work only for that , to produce these cogeneration machines for the ukrainian market, it will take them two years to close just to produce the number of machines, this means that firstly, without without... raising our thermal power plants, at least partially, we will not we will be able to close this hole that we have, this means that without partially rebuilding a share, at least of the maneuvering capacity of ukrhydroenergo, we will not be able to close this hole again, this means that we have entered the period of these interruptions, and they will be long and and they will, i.e. this is a phenomenon that does not occur, it means that in fact every apartment, i.e. in our planning, in our project will have

a plus-minus 5-7 kv battery in its composition, just as it has a washing machine, just as it has a sink, a stove, that is, we go to decentralized generation of electricity by solar panels, to maneuvering, to its accumulation at night during the day or on a day when we have a surplus of solar generation, that is , another device will appear in our everyday life, and we need to prepare for this, we need to postpone money and... it will be another expense, you have to be mentally prepared for it, it also applies to utility companies, it also applies to cities, it applies, but these problems can be solved, so we understand that, well, let's say yes, still to the beginning of the full-scale invasion of the russian federation, we realized that electricity is so unconditional, it just exists, and it must be, and now it is the service that every ukrainian should take extra care of, think about and how... how to survive, in we are just

klimkin, but we want you to summarize whether there will be trouble in the coming months, or whether we will somehow get out of the way, and there will be trouble, that is, there is no need to build illusions, let's put it this way. yes, that is me, i don't want to thicken the paint there and scare everyone, it will be easier in the summer, it will be in the winter it is more difficult, it is obvious that cities where there are smart mayors, where there are some plans, where, where they understand that this needs to be done, they will go through it easier, there are a lot of cities that already have, for example, full heat, well heat , they are fully equipped with generation, there may be no electricity, but there will be heat, and there are such cities, that is, i can name them there, this is koval, this is khmelnytsk, there is a little done in lviv. there are big problems with water, i would also like to talk about water in particular, because if we have a situation now, maybe then if you if you want to start mr. pavlo, then maybe with him, but i would like to return to that, because if we don’t have water yet in the absence of electricity, and there are all the prerequisites for us not to have it in the cities, because

the national regulator does not do its job and does not let normal tariffs be established below, because of which water utilities cannot buy electricity for the operation of pumps and cannot buy fuel for the operation of diesel engines. na na na for the reserve, and this is trouble, and no one sees this on the radar at all, i actually for example, that of our lviv vodokanal, where i have the pleasure of being the chairman of the supervisory board of the vodokanal, i would also like to draw attention to this, there is a problem in our country that we do not see coming, by the way, it is very important to talk about it in advance, and when you talk about it, we look and we mentioned today about germany, which has developed a plan for total defense, its internal one, and we simply opened it there and started to read it, but what is there? and everything that should happen in the country is written there in detail, and what should it look like if suddenly there is a war in them, if they have to live in it, and it is even written there that this defense plan regulates in detail the work of communal services, critical infrastructure, garbage must be removed, and so on points, everything has been prescribed, that is, society

is already preparing for this, they know it, this is a good example, in my opinion, we sometimes lack this, so that we know in advance what to do, pavlo klimkin is with us on skype , foreign minister. of ukraine in 2014-19, co-founder of the center national stability and development. mr. pavle, we congratulate you. glory to ukraine. however , we will move on to international topics and to what we can expect from those meetings that are currently taking place in france, in particular, italy will be next, then switzerland, and these are all the venues and places that we have as a country , how the state conveys its positions, i want to ask you how strong ours are now... well, so to speak, it is not that negotiations, although there will be negotiations, today zelensky and biden will talk, what can we convey to them, what should we as a state tell them, what to convince them of and to what extent are we capable of this in principle now?

glory to the heroes, congratulations to all, friends, i am glad to be with you, i would like to return for a moment to what mr. svyatoslav was saying, since this is also the topic of conversation with our... partners, and you talked about the defense plan, well, what is it called , that's another matter there, but we need a plan for national stability, because it is no less important than directly what is happening on the front lines, and we need to put all these things in the regime, in real-time mode, because if something works for us, and what doesn't, it always breaks... there is the weakest chain and water, or energy, well, we are used to energy, but water is so psychological, there is no water , there is no life, so we

need a plan like this, friends are helping us, but in real time it is actually very difficult, as far as the meetings that are going to be, and this is normandy, and this is such a correct symbolism ... and because it is a coalition of such good, which defeats the bad, and this is good optics, and understanding what to do next, but for me, if you like, the most important thing is the g7 summit, after the decision about the possibility of striking russian territories, albeit with great restrictions and with various... things, but still it is one of the widest, if you will, the reddest red lines, and this is from the moment when the decision on the planes was made, this is the number one issue, and now at the summit of the seven

, a decision must be made and work on the fact that this will still be the use of profits from russian assets. it will be for us accordingly, the ability to borrow money, for this it is important that the european union makes the sanctions permanent, rather than re-voting them every six months. and very important is the story that is being discussed so far, that this money can be applied not only to the resilience that we talked about, but also to weapons and to security things, and that to me will be another reddest red line that needs to be passed , well in the sense of actually raising the stakes, and you see that putin has already started to get nervous in his own way there, and that's good, in terms of strikes, i think i'm ... on the use assets will be even more, and the last thing i will say is, well, we understand very well that

the active phrase of the company begins in the states, and this is not the last, pala, he also warned us before the broadcast, there may be problems, but the last chance to agree, sir pavle, while we are setting up the floating connection, the sound is floating, still, well, that 's it... when you said that the sound was floating, it was no longer floating, but a second before that it was floating, well, you see, i can also control the sound, almost a thesis, if you can repeat it so that the audience understands, yes, the last thesis is, after all, the active phase of the company in the states begins already at 101%, and during this phase it will be super difficult to agree on any political decisions. uh, so it's very important, if we have any things that need to be pushed forward

by the end of the year, we have to get them all voiced and agreed now in normandy and during the seven, then it's going to be very, very difficult with the americans. mr. pavle, i wanted to ask you one more such thing, we saw that as soon as they started shelling kharkiv and destroying the civilian infrastructure. after all, both americans and europeans dared to take such an important step for them, permission for ukraine to fire american weapons and western weapons on the territory of the russian federation, we, well, probably first a full-scale invasion, we ask, beg, help close the sky, give more air defense systems, you cannot close the sky over the whole of ukraine, try to close the sky over at least western ukraine, and we can see to what... this led, this is precisely the topic that pavlyuk and i

discussed quite carefully and professionally, if we had better air defense, if some territories of our state were closed, well, we would not have endured this entire generation, perhaps, you know, as usual, a step later than it should have been, but still, we do not expect any breakthroughs in relation to air defense and... and it is worth emphasizing this, because really everything, that is, as of now , the state will not be able to restore its power generation capacity anyway, and if you finish what is there, well, then there may be very, very hard times indeed , we have to prepare for what mr svyatoslav, that our entire energy system, not only generation, but also what... is transmitted, must fundamentally change, we cannot return to the old, to

the status quo, we have already passed, we must plan with our partners a new, more extensive a system where there will be more cogeneration, where there will be new, new methods, where new, widespread, even elements of atomic generation will be possible. we really have to go to this, as well as to reboot organizationally, how our energy works, but i also talked a lot with the western military, experts, we find the idea very attractive that they should close it by their own means, militarily, technologically. this is a complicated story, we still need to hit on innovative solutions, for them

to get these air defense systems, and now such solutions are being discussed, they are difficult to implement, but they are possible, and here you need, well, if you want, to go beyond the limits of what is possible, some countries have already given us a lot, there the germans, you see, a very significant part of what they have, there are big problems with the production of... interceptors, and here the americans have also do more ourselves, and not only look for additional air defense systems, since we can usually get them. plus three four five more systems, but what is it worth if we don't have enough interceptors, so we need different systems with different ranges, with different rampages, but also their effective management, we need planes as soon as possible, because this is also , will unload, not

critically, but will unload the air defense, that is, the solution should actually be co... i know that the options are being discussed there, and i really hope that in the near future some of the discussed ones will will still be realized. thank you, pavlo klimkin, minister of foreign affairs of ukraine for 14-19 years, co-founder of the center for national stability and development. mrs. marryana, verhutura, you are a candidate of historical sciences and an internationalist, and then we will go to philosophy, and then to philosophy, it will be such a summary, and... today's meeting in normandy, well, it is like that, it is quite pathetic, it is a large number of people , such big tents are standing with tribunes, the leaders of many states that defeated nazism are speaking, and on the one hand, we want to believe that they are all here now will gather, and modern nazism, russism, and

russism, as dudayev said, or putinism, as we often say, will gather forces. and they will win, but we also understand the other side of the coin, that here, well, they need six months to allow the ukrainians to shoot their weapons at the russian federation, accordingly , their distance from a direct confrontation with the russian federation and their readiness to fight with the russian federation, in fact, is still obvious very far from the condition close to the action, sorry for such a complex wording as you... all these events, in the historical and political context, are we now standing on the verge of some changes, or in principle everything will continue to happen, as it has been happening, the ukrainians will fight with all their might, our western partners to the extent possible not always they will help in time. you know, in the second world war, two totalitarian regimes

showed themselves very clearly, but the geographical proximity of western europe, western... to germany in the second world war, somewhat dulled, perhaps, the alertness to the threat that the communist regime posed to the whole world, and today we see that the descendant, let's say, of the communist regime was reincarnated in modern russia, and this threat that stood in the second world war, perhaps not fully appreciated, has been reborn. with a new force carries a threat to the whole world against the background of such a union of russia, china, iran, and, well, we see that india is also becoming such, well, let's say so, a quiet, quiet support, at least on the economic front for the russian federation, i i think that the collective event, let's call it that, perfectly

understands the threat that is now facing us them, and i would like to highlight three such main... main, but not the only, fronts on which russia is currently pressing, of course, this is the military front, of course, it is energy and the internal situation in ukrainian society, believe me, kyiv is dark today , out of 24 hours, i had four hours of light at home three days ago, of which from one to three in the morning, one was on and the other was somewhere in the middle, and by putting pressure on the ukrainian socialist society in this way, russia is trying to destabilize us a lot, in the background of all these throws, which we often observe in terms of the mobilization of ukrainians there, how it all happens against the background of all these difficulties with the energy industry, against the background of economic difficulties, against the background of the onset of those offensives in the kharkiv region, i

am sure that the west now understands well how important ukraine is , important for the world. for world security, there is a strong ukraine, and all those diplomatic, big, significantly, well , events of such global importance, which we will observe now and will observe in the coming days, the coming weeks, will show after all, the readiness or unreadiness of the world is for such a unification of democratic forces as opposed to totalitarian regimes, and very, let's say, for ukraine, in my opinion, on time... there was this tragic anniversary of normandy against the background of the events that we observed in ukraine, and if our diplomacy, and i really want to believe in it now, will successfully use all its resources, and it is possible. i really hope that we will receive such significant signals in the future that the world is ready and sees ukraine

as part of a democratic society, a democratic part of the world, after all, no no there will be a concession, and maybe normandy, this is, you know, a subtle hint of how world history is moving, well, also this landing when it took place in june of 1944. less than a year before the end of the world war, yet it was already clear plus or minus, they were essentially finishing fascism with this, that is, i absolutely agree with you, because no matter how many human and military resources russia has, it is exhausted, and only by showing greater stability in all positions, it is possible to inflict such a powerful... gift for breaking this coalition, this enemy force. mr. andriy, let's continue with you exactly this topic, how

close we are to the third world, about which we talk so much, now again we heard statements from russia that they can hit back with weapons if they are hit, well, we have been for a long time we see how many bluffs putin's words contain, what can influence it, we see how european countries really are. are preparing for a probable war and they say they are already calling 2029, these are such specific years when it can become a reality, unfortunately. concerning putin's bluff, i think everyone remembers very well, what happened on the eve of a large-scale invasion, then the vast majority of experts claimed that it was a bluff, although there, of course, there is american intelligence and so on, i warn you, warned that it is quite real. there is the expulsion of embassies, this is also such a step, we can recall it, with regard to the third world war, it seems to me that it is a matter of concepts, that is, there are many classifications, some

believe that in general, perhaps the fourth world war is on the horizon, besides the first world war, the second world war, and the third world war there was a cold war, and between two blocs, so it is difficult here in terms of concepts, but... this threat, it is usually in the air, this tension and this kind of instability, it is in any part of world is very noticeable, it seems to me that in general with regard to the human world, which is actually related to human actions, from a philosophical point of view, for example, aristotle once claimed... that we cannot, we can predict a solar eclipse there, but we can't to predict a revolution, can we not predict such an event as a war, and in

this sense i would only say, continuing the argument of the predecessor, that unfortunately humanity did not learn the proper lessons from what happened there in the first half of the 20th century , when... there was the nuremberg trial, and when this nazi regime was recognized as criminal, when the criminals found a place on the dock, and the situation with the stalinist regime, not only the communist ideology, which has its own specific manner transformed, we we know that stalin is still the most popular politician of the past in russia, and this is understandable, nothing... this would not have happened if, at one time, in the same 90s of the 20th century

, a trial similar to nuremberg had not been held against the communist party there ideology of the communist regime, and nothing like that happened, and that's why we, as if it caught up with us, and this is very important, because in relation to russia, it's not only about the communist... party, but we are also talking about the special services, about the fsb, we we still understand that putin calls everything that is happening in ukraine a special operation, and this is the lexicon of a man of the special services, of course, and therefore it is definitely an extremely difficult issue, and we can only assume what can await us all, and here specialists talk about our internal threats, i would just draw attention to another point from what we discussed earlier today, which is the internal unity of western societies, because we constantly emphasize that ukraine is on the side of democracy, as opposed

to... authoritarian regimes, here regarding india, i would not completely agree, but these are already small things, but because india is still a democratic country, they simply buy russian energy carriers very cheaply, of course, this does not make it easier for us, here in fact there is this problem, which connected with our ally, well, in the broadest sense of the word, with a collective effort, and the things that happen in western society internally are very important. because western governments always react very sensitively to what the voter says, and this is what is happening in the near future, the elections to the european parliament and so on, this extremely important signals, and we must do everything in order for this society to continue, of course russia itself is there, well, it is doing terrible things that immediately spread there, what touches kharkiv and similar things, and

one more moment, the mayor of kyiv was mentioned , vitaliy klitschko, i know for sure, and this is very noticeable in the german media, by the way, we do not always adequately evaluate what germany does, germany is second in terms of, well, this is a known thing, in terms of economic, financial, support of ukraine in the world, and we very often we reduce everything. to some procrastination by scholz, which definitely also takes place, so the nickname brothers still need to be recognized and they need to be given credit, they do a lot to ensure that german society itself maintains this level of support for ukraine, this is an extremely important point, and they very often they perform there on german channels, and this also gives a huge effect, and this should not be underestimated, mr. andrii, i want

to clarify here... i also want to draw such a parallel historically and this, what do you think, well, you said about it and that we very often do not we are not only satisfied with the germans, we are dissatisfied with many people there, that they do not help us much and so on and so on, we very often draw parallels, including ours in our conversations with vitaly portnikov from the end of the 30s of the last century and we say that, well, very often, they did not support czechoslovakia enough, they did not support austria enough and... gave birth to this monster, but now, do you think, it is some kind of similar process, or is this support and understanding that the monster is one way or another will be born if ukraine is not supported with on the part of the collective event, it is this understanding, or again, a little bit, let's get together, let's say that we will support czechoslovakia, but we will give part of it to hitler, because he, he needs it more, but now are the conclusions

correct or not? movements, certain changes are positive in that they allow us to strike on russian territory, which we could not have predicted a few months ago, and that is, we are observing certain positive things for us, another thing is that these parallels are always any historical... have, have a certain flaw, and any comparison falters, as says the latin proverb, but in many ways, we see such similarities, and only the lazy do not talk about the similarities between putin and hitler, and this tactic, this deception and this intimidation, and these terrorist means, but still it seems to me that now...

a lot has changed in terms of technology, it was not by chance that yuval noiharari was mentioned, an israeli researcher who, of course, emphasizes a lot among other things on these technological points, and of course we live in a completely different world, at least he is transparent, and what happens in any part of the earth, it immediately becomes the property of the general public, and again, we are talking about the methods of waging war, here a person from the military sphere would better say this, but we understand that to carry out some kind of offensive there, but it is extremely difficult to be unnoticed now, this effect of novelty, surprise, it is usually lost, and the comparison with that situation or with czechoslovakia or with austria, it is in some sense not entirely correct.