morning information project of radio liberty. top guests every day. this is the shipping district, kherson. turn on live. we are somewhere in the vicinity of bakhmut. we tell the main thing. on weekdays at 9:00. and now oleg rybachuk, ex-head of the secretariat of president viktor yushchenko, former vice-prime minister for european integration of ukraine and co-deputy will work on the air of the tv channel. the founder of the honest movement. glory to ukraine, mr. olezh, i congratulate you. glory to the heroes, congratulations. well, june is extremely busy, when we talk about public and non-public conversations, between the administration of president biden and the administration of president zelensky. the exchange of certain opinions in the public space, and of course, all this is happening on the eve of the big g7 meeting, which will smoothly move into the swiss format, where the peace formula will be discussed. talk publicly in your opinion

and what is the most important thing not talked about publicly when we talk about certain parameters of the security situation? it should be noted that there is indeed such a surge in international activity, in particular in the schedule of the president of ukraine, two meetings with president biden, further a representative forum is expected in switzerland, we can say how fateful it is there, what issues will be resolved there, that's another matter. question, but as they say about the elections, the turnout there will be quite high, and the key story, the swiss peace forum, what issues will be discussed, we understand that three key cases will be discussed there, yes, in particular, they will talk about nuclear security, well, in particular about the prospects of using or not using nuclear weapons by the enemy, the chinese will not be there, we understand that things are changing in india the prime minister, that is, the situation, as the classics said, is quite dynamic. yes, quite

dynamic, and the elections are starting, in my opinion, already today in the netherlands they start voting for the elections to the european parliament and changes in the european parliament almost predict an increase in the right of radical forces, not all of these forces are anti-european there, but it is clear that the situation of the european parliament can be quite difficult, and this should also be remembered, because it is extremely important for you and me. in europe, concerning switzerland, expectations from switzerland, i personally do not have any special expectations there. i understand that as we got closer to this summit, several factors played a role. for some reason, we in ukraine paid too much attention to china and china's participation. china, he felt it subtly, either directly or through allies from... significantly diluted our position at

this swiss forum, because at first ukraine clearly said that this is our war, we are fighting, this is our peace formula, and the forum is going to , to support the peace formula with zelenskyi, the position has been in recent days blurred, they are already talking about the fact that there may be other proposals from other countries, the same china or brazil or turkey, that is, already... the peace formula edited by zelenskyi is not the only document, then, we remember what was there 10 points in this peace formula, and we hoped that for each of the points , such interest groups would be created and certain solutions would be worked out, now in reality what you just mentioned, it is about three topics for discussions, three directions - this is nuclear security , food security and the exchange of prisoners of war. china in the end officially announced that he will not be at this forum, but... managed to influence, and ukraine

was forced to make certain concessions, which in principle do not help us very much, because we need to have a clear position, and china, the chinese there plans for the meeting, including the next one from the peace forum, and here too the question arises, well, if we can adopt some very vague resolution at this swiss peace forum. then this will not indicate a unified position of all participants, who are expected to be more than 100, and then literally through there for several months now we have been flying to some other forum, where russia should already be, because at first the logic was quite clear, we wanted to have such a consolidated position of the world, of democracy in the world, which would speak very clearly about the inadmissibility of border violations.

responsibility for aggression, where it was possible to formulate a position with which it would be possible to come to russia and say: look, the whole world over there, 100 countries of the world have this view, now you have to... think about how you will be russia lead in relation to to the vast majority of countries in the world, and now this is not happening, because most likely in switzerland we will not receive any very clear and understandable communique or statement, then the next meeting will be russia there, and russia is a master of breeding tereveni, well, that's basically the chinese platform, as well as the chinese... idea, that is, the chinese wanted to nullify or diminish the status of the global forum in switzerland dedicated to the peace formula and accordingly create some alternative structure, an alternative summit, where the aggressor state would be present, in particular, the russian federation, the chinese would like

to play a role in this whole affair, we understand correctly, they played the role quite successfully, now, thanks to their position, i am sure that countries such as brazil from... well, more and more often we hear explanations for the fact that there there will be no russia, well, except that today sziarto announced that he will make the forum happy with his presence and hungary will be represented at the level of his sziarto, such changes have taken place, well, it is from here, most of all , hungary has heard the call of belgium, which currently presides over the european union, about pra about that the right to vote should be taken away from hungary, because it is with... with the position of the european union, maybe this is a factor or something else, well, but i don't think that this is such a big event, whether it will add to the prospects or the success of the forum, i have the representation of hungary in the mouth, how such forums can affect the situation related

to the war, so we understand that the war is not only about, i don't know, combat operations, but also about the resources for their provision, we understand from the loan'. the united states, thank god, recovered, yes, in the amount of 61 billion dollars plus. on the other hand, the rather non-trivial opinion of the president of the united states, biden, was heard in one of the interviews. he said: well , in order to ensure ukrainian security, it is possible, in principle, not to join nato. this question will not be on the agenda of the washington summit either, some very strong signals will be found. well, yes, the position. biden is changing, well, he hinted, he even further said why, he said, as vice president, he had dozens of meetings there, visited ukraine, and he called it such a word corruption, as ukrainian president kuchma said, that he does not want

the word to be of ukrainian origin, but it is very well known in ukraine, and also remembering blinkin's statement before this, the last visit. we understand that here the ukrainian authorities must finally understand that this policy of emotional blackmail is working, and that it is necessary to demonstrate ukraine's readiness and, in fact, its ability to be a reliable partner of nato, well, because if we are talking about nato, in nato, in those allies who supply us with weapons are with them the biggest problem was... it was the effective use of funds for these weapons, i don't want to talk about embezzlement, let's say, the effective use of funds, and one of the requirements was an audit of how our department of defense, how effectively it used these funds, had to be audited, but the head of the audit, again,

who was elected, appointed, not elected, it is important to note, was appointed by the street bank through several. after an open appeal, the ambassadors of the big seven should not be appointed, but make a fair competition, and which, as they say, informed sources, just has one such important feature in her biography, or ribbon in her biography, that she is in close relations with the president's family, and and and she was appointed, and now she is saying that the accounting chamber cannot conduct an audit and not will conduct... an audit, so it is clear that such things are simply unacceptable, imagine that you are biden, and you understand very well what is going on here, and although our accounting chamber did not work, i am sure that the american intelligence and the intelligence of others countries of the world know for sure what is happening in

the situation, my acquaintances say that the same belligerent colonels or generals who sit on the streams have remained in the ministry of defense, and the change of the minister of defense has had little effect. schemes are practically preserved, and when all this is known, and when our president has been called so many times to remove the interference of his own office in the executive branch. all the same, there are no independent courts, because there is tatarov, some deputies have been dismissed there, but they are not the deputies whom we would like to dismiss, and civil society and the west, together in a word, when you set the bar so high, demanding that your allies fulfill their obligations, you must remember about yourself and the fact that with such and such tatarovs, with such, with such a ministry of... defense, with such purchases , with such accounting chambers, we will not win the war either, when we make

serious claims about the delay in aid to western partners, there to the united states, to other countries, it is very important to remember, not forget and pay attention to , that the structure of power that we have does not help us at all successfully conduct combat operations. mr. olezh, look, well then it means. that we will walk in a certain vicious circle, so we will not carry out certain personnel reshuffles, personnel decisions and implement those approaches that we would like to see in the white house, on the other hand, the americans will also look at this and say: ay- yay, all this will again, again, again twist the situation into the format of a circle on which we will walk, the war continues, and despite certain optimistic signals, well, i would like to have a very specific certainty, because certain security agreements have been signed, the washington summit is approaching, at which a palliative decision will most likely be adopted, and we understand that after

the swiss summit there will be another chinese-brazilian-russian summit, well, i added would still come here in june, we are expecting, i think, we are still expecting the start of negotiations on the acquisition of membership in the european union, all these things that we are talking about, this is not only the position of the americans, it is, in principle, the position and european of the union an independent court is a requirement of the european union and an obligation of the ukrainian authorities. effective governance is the same thing. that is, we will now have openings, if we start negotiations on acquiring membership, then we will have very clear tasks and very strict monitoring. and it all melted into one. therefore, it will not be possible to separate the americans and the european union separately here. and it will not succeed on this formula, that is, on this team of the president with

five or six advisers, it will not be possible to enter the european union, but to move from the place, and therefore it will have to be changed, our government wants it, it doesn't want it, our president likes yermak immensely, and yermak likes the tatars immensely, it is clear that we want to have support, a completely logical and... justifiable demand from the european union and from the west certain changes and reforms in governance, and therefore the west will not give more than the minimum amount of money needed for a country that does not know how to and does not want to govern properly, i am not saying that it will not give money at all, because it is clear , that now the event has counted and came to the logical conclusion that supporting ukraine now is better, better... and more effective from the point of view of the interests of the same europe, than giving

russia the opportunity to go to the border with the european union. and here we have common interests with the european union, but at the same time, if we look very pragmatically at what is happening in ukraine, it becomes clear that with such leadership, with such management, with such governance, with such, with lack of distribution of branches of power and dependence, in fact, of all branches. power from several people on bankova street, we are far away we will not stop by, so the question here is that we cannot, and it is clear, zelensky said about this that we cannot win this war without the west, and the west perfectly understands that aid can be ineffective if fundamental changes do not take place in ukraine , so these changes cannot be avoided, if we talk about a set of changes that should be, yes, well, let's now where... what would be specifically expected, for example, in the united states, the european union, yes, because, well, for to most of our

fellow citizens, it all remains a mystery, and certain things are evaluated purely through the prism of emotionality, that is, he said something, the reaction was like this, well, but people, well, sociology shows that people are not completely satisfied with the processes that are going on inside the country, and we understand that the war is a key story, but there is still economy, there is still energy and that's it. went, and people began to understand that power cannot be concentrated in the hands of the president, only that the number of ukrainians who think so has fallen many times, more and more ukrainians believe that the parliament should be much more powers, believe that the government should be effective, that is, ukrainians are beginning to understand that the problem lies in the structure of power that exists, when in fact all powers are concentrated in the office of the president, and the office of the president is just like this police

conductor on the street pointing with a stick , who is guilty of this or that. be it the parliament, be it the government, be it the west, well, whoever, but, well, not the government itself, ukrainians are beginning to understand this, and on the other hand, yes, if, what to do with that, if we cannot hold elections now , and which one should be the further fate of this ukrainian power structure, this too, worries ukrainians, because here one of the analysts wrote that putin can be there for another 10 years or more... be in power, and as long as he is in power, this war is profitable for him , because this war allows him to write off everything, blame everything on the world that is against russia, on economic difficulties, on failures in domestic politics, war always gathers people around its leader, and therefore it is beneficial for putin, and he will be interested to keep the war going

and we want to end it, we want to end it with victory, so we cannot afford to just... drag this process out to infinity, and under the current circumstances we don't have, we can't hang on to anything that would give us confidence in that , that we can end this war there next year, it is expected that we can be ready for another offensive, counteroffensive, we are waiting for aviation, for what will come after mobilization, after all, the ukrainian army will receive enough manpower for training and rotations, we all that's all, that's all... we expect that, but the size of our neighbor from deceville is not too incomparable, and from the point of view of the economic reserves there, they have these, as they said, they have these bombs, with which they convert the wings and drop them, there will be enough more there for two or three wars, they have them there, they have been there since the second world

war, even before that time they kept these bombs, they just recycle the wings, maybe half of them are defective... but they still kill ukrainians, so the russian state , she is ready for a long- range foray, and we can oppose it here only something modern, effective, we can do this only in a very honest alliance with the west, and with america, and with the european union, but what is happening in our country recently does not help us to be better understood there and they supported me more, well, i don't know which models... what to do in the current situation? we understand that we have a legitimate government, that is, a president who was elected by the ukrainian people without falsifications. it is about zelenskyi. the russians want to undermine his legitimacy, that's understandable. in we have a completely legitimate parliament, functional, with a majority, well, the number of deputies has decreased, but we have a cabinet that was appointed by the legitimate parliament, but in

fact we have a mix of three branches of government, we understand what is going on with our... supreme constitutional courts not everything is as stable as we would like, and accordingly something needs to be improved, we all like that ukrainians, everyone likes simple solutions, mr. olezh, let's now propose simple solutions, well , in fact, the office of simple solutions did not work for us, but the problem we have exactly such a one structures of power that we have, when there are several people from the office of the president, whom we did not elect, whom we do not dare to touch. there is no state security bureau or anti-corruption bureau to step in, these people are actually building schemes, and ukrainian journalists are already talking about it, they are crying about the fact that officials on the ground, here i am now hearing about the situation in kharkiv with the purchase of wood for defense structures, have chosen a kind of pilot

project, but this situation is repeated everywhere, due to the fact that law enforcement agencies depend... on the same office of the president, because tatarov stands above them, and every security officer knows who tatarov is, it is practically impossible to break out of this circle, and if we want changes, then we need to remove tatarov, and the president was told about this a million times, we need to make sure that the office does not influence, i think the president is the one, the president will understand it, he won't be able to maneuver much there, because the european embassies, diplomats they... see it perfectly, they know it, the ukrainian press writes about it, the european press writes about it, journalists cry about it, are being investigated, it becomes clear that you can't be silent about it, you can't explain why there aren't... changes are happening, and this pressure is growing, so i think that the easiest conclusion for or the easiest way out of this situation is to remove this

unlimited influence of the office of the president on the executive branch and on security forces and make the courts more, i 'm not saying completely independent, at least more independent so that for them the call from bankova street does not interrupt all ukrainian legislation, because if it doesn't. yes, that there are changes here, and they will talk about it, and talk about it, probably western companies trying to enter the ukrainian market, because whatever we take, whether it is the production of drones, or joint productions in the defense sector, or investors, which we really need in order to restore the energy system, it all rests on the guarantee of property rights , and what guarantees can there be if we do not have independent courts, there is nowhere for the investor to apply? in the case of conflict situations, that is why zelensky will have to understand and hear this sooner or later, and i am sure that even the all-powerful fair will not

be able to block all communication channels, so that the president communicates, including with the heads of western states, with representatives of the diplomatic corps, so there is simply no other way out here, if this is not changed, then we can call it simple solutions, super simple solutions. we can look for some people, but the situation will not change, because fundamentally it has this time mine that guarantees impunity for corrupt officials, if these officials are loyal and guided by what they are told on the mountain, and when we have a judicial system, which looks into the mouth of the same tatar and and and is waiting for instructions on how to act in this or that case, simply with such schedules the situation... and there cannot be any simple solution from it, the simplest, the simplest solution, but to do what we have been advised for many years, to do much more independent from

the banking street government, to strengthen the parliament, giving the parliament the opportunity to influence the ministers, to listen to the reports of the ministers, but at the same time try to explain to the potential candidates for ministerial positions that they will be able to implement what they ... intended, and not and, and they will not just anxiously wait for a call from the phone on their desk, where the coat of arms of the soviet union used to be, now there is the coat of arms of ukraine, well, maybe there will be some simple men's meetings between the president of ukraine, the president of the united states, yes, and biden will say, we have such an idea to somehow resuscitate, refresh the government and so on, and zelensky will say, very well, there is such an idea, and here we go, to build a government of national unity. well, to invite representatives of the homeland of european solidarity, or something what should a government of technocrats do in such a situation , i don't know, pull out from some secret

drawer our, i don't know, a graduate of advanced training courses named after dordl soros , who will ride around on a scooter, remember, we had such a revolutionary prime minister, well, at least as a first step, maybe even some members of the current one. government, i just don't know all of them, could be much more effective if they really, if their fate really did not depend on the calls on these on these turntables, if they understood that they have to make decisions, maybe not popular, but they will feel able to implement these decisions and bear not only responsibility, but have support, for this they need support, but now there is no dialogue with the parliament at all, all these ties have broken , and even if... in this matter with the parliament, i have no illusions about the quality of this parliament, but you can still find some deputies there who would also understand that they are responsible for something,

they should now allow journalists to work in the parliament, there may be some there partial resuscitation of this legislative body, which is very important, that is , even these conditions should be tried at the expense of only what people can feel, and zelensky should do this. there is no one else to do this, because again, the meeting of zelenskyi with his own faction, where he does not let anyone open his mouth, but only reads morals, just angry deputies come out of it, and it all takes away motivation, well, just in general, here are all the units of the government machine , they're all just stuck, they don't work, they need to be started because we can't right now to elect a new president, to elect a new verkhovna rada, to form a new government means that under these conditions one must try as much as possible. to reanimate some relationships, interaction between these authorities, because then everything will be better than it is now, because now everything has actually stopped, no one makes

any decisions... and there are a couple of advisers who form the president's opinion about the real state of affairs , and the president has an emotional breakdown and explains to the leaders of the western world how they should do their jobs, and at the same time the president forgets that it is his the obligation to improve the work of the government machine in ukraine, not to lead, not to put three, four , five advisers at the head of the government machine, but to make it realistic at least in some way... formally similar to the way the government and parliament interact in european countries , and i am sure about this, there will be a conversation during the start of the negotiations on the acquisition of membership, god forbid that these negotiations begin, because we have millions of questions there, but we can only move in this direction now. thank you very much, mr. oleg, for this meaningful and extremely interesting conversation , i want to remind our tv viewers that oleg rybachuk, former vice-prime minister for european integration, former head of the

presidential secretariat, was currently working on espresso. and viktor yushchenko, the founder of the chesno movement. thank you once again and kudos to ukraine. thank you, glory to the heroes, and we will win everything. well, the time of our program is over, stay with the espresso tv channel. my colleagues will inform you about all the most important events of this day. see espresso, take care of yourself and your loved ones. see you on air. we... for myself, belgrade, when it was not yet mainstream, the enemy, i call him a babayaga, but, well, for us he is a vampire, we fly into the rear, we fly into narrow places in the enemy's defense, well, five of us, the main thing is that there are caps were, and we shot at them, whether it is russia or ukraine, in principle there is no difference... i don’t

see, all its heavy weapons are on their side of the border, and from there they attack the lord, the lords, inflict fire defeat, and we cannot respond to them with all types of weapons, because we use some of our weapons we can do it, and somehow we are not allowed to do it, but we would like to receive from western partners... real systemic, expensive things that can be more effective in our current conditions. the appearance of a new hot section of the front raised the question of the need for strikes on the territory of russia even more acutely, this is the donbass reality, this time we will talk about why the armed forces of ukraine need permission to strike with western weapons

on... the vrf, are the partners able to make this decision quickly and why aren't drones alone enough for this kind of strike? windless a clear night is the time to take off a large drone, it is just one of those that the russian military calls a babayaga. if everything is prepared in advance, it will generally take a couple of minutes. carefully. the pretexts are set, now let's go after the bull, these are night drones, and in general just strike drones, this is perhaps the most important means of defeat for the ukrainian army in recent months. first, when there was no ammunition, and now, when hostilities, in particular in the kharkiv region, continue in the border areas. such copters are a fighter in a new direction for kharkiv took to the air more and more often. it's

not only that. night board, well, it was created as a night board, but we also use it during the day, and it is also effective, no less effective than at night, that is, it is a very big advantage in the air thanks to the bomber itself, it is a vampire, it is an enemy and i call it he's a babayagoy, but he's a vampire for us, and we throw him off. tm-62 tank mine, anti-tank mine. fab 800 fragmentation warhead. this is exactly what they hang on the uav, they say that this ammunition is no longer home-made, it comes from a factory. it more reliable than self-made, well, and self-made, that is, it depends on the sappers who make them. very powerful, works with

both large and small.