you understand that ee, if you look at it , 48% of all registered voters in france will vote ee according to polls in the european elections, this is even less than half, which in turn indicates that society does not consider these elections important for the country, and this is, in principle , a tradition, the turnout for european elections is always lower than international elections, if we talk about the possibility of... the prospects of the next french parliamentary elections, then it is still too early to talk and even hold any parallels, but it is worth noting that aid to ukraine is not the key issue that worries the voter, the voter is worried about the rise in prices, er, danger, but not in the sense of geopolitical danger, but danger in the country itself, voters are worried, for example, migration issues have not been resolved, and therefore voters. are trying to find

the easiest way to solve these issues, and the easiest way is provided, as a rule , by radical left or radical right parties, which give slogans and promise quick and easy solutions that we know usually don't work, mr. denis, we thank you for your thoughts and your analysis, denis kolesnyk, political commentator, france, was in direct contact with our studio. and what do we have next, then a short pause, so short, and literally in a few minutes we will return to the live broadcast and there will be an analyst with vitaly portnikov, wait, there are discounts presented, unbreakable discounts on eden, 20% in pharmacies plantain, bam and savings . there are

moments when the body quickly loses fluid, which can lead to dehydration when ordinary water is not enough. rheo - water for special medical purposes. allergy, no leo will overcome tsetrilev. cetrilev neo protects against the most common allergens. try flebodia 600. pink french pills for acute hemorrhoids. flepodia 600. treat hemorrhoids without any side effects. discounts represent unbreakable discounts on exodoril solution, 15% in pharmacies plantain to you and savings. vasyl zima's big broadcast. my name is vasyl zima, this is a big ether on the espresso tv channel. two hours of air time. two hours of your time. me and my colleagues let's talk about the most important thing. two hours to find out. about the war, about the military,

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to talk with vitaly portnikov on all the topics that are most important during this week. mr. vitaly, you know, i will probably ask you the same question that i asked ihor eisberg, regarding, eisenberg, regarding, regarding biden, his statements, this is what shook, very shook ukrainian society, everyone discussed it very violently, biden stated that, in fact, that ukraine may not necessarily join nato, or it does not necessarily have to join? in nato, about the fact that, in principle, it is possible to guarantee the security of our country even without participation in the north atlantic alliance, many experts, including respected ones, say that, well, how is it, how is it legally

possible, yes, why such a statement by biden , this is his personal opinion, whether it is inspired by some certain positions or something. certain, perhaps, as i have already said, perhaps a certain pass of russia, a demonstration of some political position, now, what was it? first, at the president's the united states does not have personal opinions, so if biden says that he does not see ukraine in nato as a condition for ending the war, it means that this is the position of the united states of america. second, president biden spoke to president zelensky during the ukrainian leader's last visit to washington. that the condition for ukraine's accession to nato should be ukrainian victory, but what is ukrainian victory is an abstract concept, as we know, in which everyone invests everything he wants, we know what ukrainian victory is victory, from the point of view of the majority of the ukrainian population, is an exit to the borders of 1991,

about which we have repeatedly said that this is not necessarily the end of the war, but it can be considered a victory, but again it is clear that if there is no end to the war, then there can be no accession to nato, so by and large , if you remember all these conditions and the fact that the condition of accession can be consensus, then by and large nothing has changed, if there is no consensus among the allies and there is no end war, then ukraine's chances of joining nato, they are quite conditional, it may be a signal to russia to some extent that you will never get control of ukraine, but we... you can be satisfied that ukraine will not join nato. the only problem is that russia will absolutely join nato regardless of ukraine or not. she wants to have it as part of her territory. and that's why when all the americans tell the russians that ukraine can remain neutral. and by the way, it is worth reminding that this is exactly what putin demanded from the west

on the eve of his attack. this does not stop putin at all, on the contrary, it increases his appetite. we show that he is doing everything right, that the west is gradually making concessions. and that by and large the real outcome of the situation may be a suspension of the war with guarantees that ukraine will not receive any real security guarantees when putin wants to end this war, because once again his behavior at the st. petersburg economic forum showed that he chose for himself the option of prolonging the war indefinitely. and now you and i need to make andriy understand that there are two options for the development of events. actually. in in the global sense of the word. the first option is that the war is suspended or not suspended, and ukraine receives some guarantees from nato, say there, or security guarantees in general in the case of a truce with russia, if this truce

can even take place, or a security guarantee for this territory , which at that time will be controlled by the legitimate ukrainian government, with the fact that the entire territorial unit will be able to join nato. there may be options here, or there is another option, also absolutely realistic, which, by the way, we talk about all the time we also speak indirectly when we say that ukraine is turning into a kind of european israel, what is european israel, well, from the security point of view, it is an effort to increase the periods of peace and reduce the periods of wars, i have repeatedly spoken about this, you know how to solve the middle east conflict, you have a prescription. i think almost no one has it, no one has it, every american president comes up with his own plan that dies with that president's career, and then a new president comes along and comes up with his own plan, and by the way, in president trump, when he was the head of the united states, had a very good plan, he was looking for opportunities to reconcile israel with

neighboring and non-neighboring arab states, and he achieved great success, the implementation of this plan, remember, several countries recognized israel. established diplomatic relations with them, among them such countries as the united arab emirates, and morocco returned from diplomatic relations with israel, and by the way, they now maintain these diplomatic relations, they did not even break them off. after the events in the sector gaza, and before these events israel was approaching diplomatic partners of saudi arabia, it was just, you know, such a jackpot, so what? it turned out that this did not solve the conflict, that is, it turned out that in fact the conflict is not between israel and the arab countries, as it might seem for several decades in a row, but the conflict between the israelis and the palestinians, which seemed to be a friend. yes, i will tell you now , it is unpleasant for ukrainians, something that they will have to face, if not today, then

tomorrow, we do not have a conflict with putin, we have conflict between the ukrainian and russian peoples, and as long as these two peoples exist, they are unlikely to be able to find a common language among themselves, so our task is either to obtain security guarantees, which so far seems unlikely, or to agree that our main goal - long periods of peace. and short periods of wars, that is, we need to get rid of the illusions that we are fighting here and leave this war to our children as something in the past, as some historical fact, as the last meeting, it can be if we join nato, because it is already be conflicts between the russian and ukrainian peoples, and between russia and the west, if we do not join nato, of course, the children of those who fight, and the grandchildren of those who fight, will fight, die in wars, will be soldiers. there will be fortresses, there will be spending on defense instead of social spending, it was everyday life,

absolutely so, i would say, trivial, so that even in our own information tapes, the death of some number of servicemen on some contact line there will not be noticed, that's all it will happen, i hope they will notice, because this is life, but it will not cause surprises, it can also happen, we are approaching this period... we are just approaching it, so we need such and such, such a period to shorten, so that we had a period of real peace, tranquility, a certain stability, the strengthening of our army, the strengthening of our state, so that we could withstand the next war, and that it would be shorter than this one, but i always say that we must think in terms of achievements, let's say, the first ukrainian independence there for two years, in fact, the second is already 30. three, this is an achievement,

this great war has been going on for 2 and a half years, it may be three, it may be five, it will be necessary to push back from its term, so that the next war, which, let's say, starts, let it be after 10 years, let it be in five, it was no longer 2.5 years, or three, i don't know how long it will be, but a year, and so on, step by step, this is the future of ukraine in the 21st century. well, an unpleasant future, but there is no other country, and again, we must always tell our western friends that they will have serious problems when such a ukraine will exist, because these are migrant crises, demographic issues, resettlement of people to other european countries, many people will want to live in such a country, some people will want to, they will think that this is their land and they have to protect it, but not all, the population of ireland, now it is... you know, the same as 100 years ago, it has not increased, but how many

irish people live around the world, so, so will the fate of the ukrainian people in such a situation, as far as europe is in this interested, i'm not sure, so we have continue to insist on ukrainian membership in nato, not because, as yury fedorenko told us, the russian army will come to a nato country, most likely it will not come, why not fight with nato, but it, its actions can. .. a serious internal crisis in europe, which may be no more dangerous than war. this must be understood. the question here is that, if we follow the option that you are talking about, the question here is that then, if we do not join nato, but we have these periods, we must understand that we they help and support on an ongoing basis. we understand that without the weapons of the united states of america, without european weapons. the countries of the european union, in fact, can not just build military factories, look

at the military-industrial complex of israel, it is not necessary to produce socks here, socks can be bought from ukraine of the global south, which will buy oil from russia, if for socks that will be produced in europe, we simply do not have money for the majority of the population, but the shells are not cars, but not tanks... but howitzers, i'm sorry, guns instead of oil, a bad slogan that many who watch us don't like, but they should understand that they already live in this and... and there's nowhere to go from there, more moreover, if it looks like this, then the whole of europe will be militarized, because they will feel danger all the time, but look again at the middle east, israel is in danger, although only it alone, egypt will be in danger, or saudi arabia arabia, or some other countries, but

how much money do they spend on the military-industrial complex, it's just that there is a lot of money in saudi arabia. but they are really occupied all the time by the army with local conflicts, they just left yemen, when there is even one country that is a security issue for the entire region, it is not easy to live in all other countries, and in european countries, these are our people who will live in european countries, they will serve in the army, when they will withhold citizenship, they will experience problems with social provision, they will not have a good life, there will not be, because it will be the existence of such ukraine. will destabilize europe and turn it into a militarized continent as well, i don't know, i can look for some addresses that can at least be recommended to people who would like to live out the years they have left before some big war in peace and tranquility, no, australia it is already allied with the united states militarily, it is there in

a very dangerous region of the asian pacific, well, maybe some thailand, but i am also not sure what it is. will be like this a simple point in the future, that is, you need to sit down and look for a place where you can gather those who would like to live peacefully, not without interest in political news and without fear of heart attacks, but there will be a lot of such places, here are the beautiful maldives, yes presidents , which now forbids the citizens of israel to enter the territory of his country, expels indian military personnel, invites the chinese, and soon the chinese from the maldives will burn somewhere, and they will burn the maldives and instead of a resort there will be one bloody banya, this can be... and by the way, i will interrupt you, the second question, i said about the first question, and now there is a second question, which is that how many, if we have such periods, war, peace, war, peace, well, conditional peace, how many people will remain in ukraine, this is also very important, why, because russia has one population, ukraine has a different

population, we are with you, we are with you last saturday, last saturday, they said that we have a catastrophic demographic crisis in ukraine. 28 places, 8 million people live in ukraine right now, i can tell you to say how many people will remain to live here, if it will be constant periods like this, somewhere up to 15-20 million, that much will remain, well, if we are in nato, the population will increase to 35, well, part of the people will return, part of the people will return, of course, and part of the people is not you who wants tacos... a less peaceful life will not leave, but even in the most destroyed countries there is a large number of people who left lebanon? no, many will stay, there are people who just want to live at home, even if they understand that a rocket will arrive tomorrow, there are many such people, so approximately 20 million people will remain here to work at military factories, serve in the army, train soldiers and so on,

they will definitely remain, and these people, to things, they will try to vote for politicians, how they will try to normalize. with russia, this is the most interesting thing: the diaspora will be pitted against russia, and the people who will be here will vote for parties of a pro-russian direction, not a pro-russian one, the direction of coexistence, but people, people who will be abroad, they will vote for the patriotic forces, and the people who will be here will be furious that some deputies are being imposed on them, who will again condemn them to a confrontation with russia, because they will believe that it is still possible to come to an agreement with russia. and it will also be a very interesting thing, when the fate of those people who will stay here will be decided by the people who will stay there, and those people will stand in queues at embassies to vote for those who will not be supported by those who are here will remain, so too maybe, it is absolutely real, i think pro-european forces will win in moldova, because people in

all the capitals of the world, citizens of moldova stand in queues for 20 hours to vote for my... sanda, and people living in moldova want to vote for a certain ihor dodon, and then they are very offended that their compatriots are imposing on them a government that they would never have chosen if they had been given to vote themselves. this is how hocus pocus can be. we must remember him. but there is another side of the coin, there are actually people who went abroad, but who treated russia in a complimentary manner, although they most likely will not vote. they will not vote, they will, they will go to russian consulates, people will look for russian passports. but there are also such people in reality, well, we, let's face the truth, we did not gather here to lie and to talk, different people live in ukraine, it's generally normal when we have business.

you will forget about this ukraine in a month after that you will leave there, well, we already see such people, the truth is, you saw that how many a huge number of people who left ukraine abroad, according to sociologists, in general, how many percent, 30% or 40, are not even interested in news from ukraine, do not know what is happening here, they simply left and forgot about it, and take their children to russian clubs and to russian schools, this is also a fact, a fact, because they did so when they were here... well, that is, but we are talking about voters, these people are not voters, but these people who patriotic and left, they are voters, because they will be very afraid that

their countrymen will bring to power those they don't like, and that's how it looks, and we're talking just now about the position of the united states of america, but there's actually not just the united states of america, there is, we know it well, a position. including other nato member states who also believe that ukraine should not be a member of the north atlantic alliance, there are those too. at the expense of such countries, is it possible to convince them in the future, will they not become, even if the position is the united states, will they not become another a stage of barriers for ukraine to be able or unable to... everything in nato depends on the leading states, these leading states are able to convince others, because these others depend on their support. hungary can

oppose ukraine in nato, but orbán knows perfectly well that the nuclear powers are protecting him, if there is a consensus of the nuclear powers, then of course they will not protest, they can postpone, negotiate, well, we have already seen how it works with sweden and finland. but turkey is a country much more influential than hungary and president rexep it can be said that tayyip erdoğan extracted everything he could from this acceptance of finland and sweden into nato, and he held negotiations and signed defense agreements and the legislation required them to be changed, but no one doubted, however, no one doubted that he will concede that this is just a cycle, no one in the united states, in sweden. in finland, had no doubt that these countries would become members of nato, no matter what he did, that it simply had to be such a political process that should actually convince his compatriots

that he was strong, independent, steadfast, international player, but he knows very well that he leads a country that is part of nato, he will not take risks, there is no question of orbán at all, orbán will block the meetings of the cabinet of ministers, that is... nato and ukraine, demand new concessions and this and that, but there always comes a moment when he has to give in. we saw that the hungarians were very unhappy that they had become the last country to vote for sweden in nato, that they hoped that the turks would at least announce their intentions, and they did not even notice them with all the friendship between erdogan and orban. well, here you go, this is already a very good illustration, so everything will depend on the position first of all. the united states and other nuclear powers, great britain, great britain and france, germany plays a big role, but it will listen to the american position, and now it listens,

they are together against it, so there are, there are certain points that must be realized, again , but i think the united states, as long as the war continues, they will not demand such a consensus because they don't really understand why they need such a consensus if they are talking. about the risk, the real risk of a nuclear attack, that's all, so they are not strongly motivated to ensure this consensus. another topic that is extremely intertwined with what we were talking about, we are talking about the global peace summit that will take place next week, that is , literally a few days, a week remains before its beginning, and here is the european truth. colleagues publish an article and say that ukraine may have gone for certain in vain concessions in the formula itself or in the adjustment

of the formula. of the ukrainian peace formula and left only three points, and actually for discussion, three points for discussion, yes, that is , three of the ten remained, actually, according to colleagues, this was done in order to involve a larger number of states, so that states close to the east, the far east, to attract, relatively speaking, the countries of the global south, and there are certain caveats here. which consist in the fact that ukraine can thus give a pass, give an opportunity to other players who offer their formulas peace, in particular to china itself, to promote its agenda, that is, a conditional freeze there, or other positions that china talks about. well, if we are talking about, or both about it, and about the peace summit, itself. what do we

expect from him, are there real grounds for such warnings? in my opinion, they are real, and what will be the final result with one week left or the final result of this summit? i don't think there will be any final outcome of this summit, i don't think it was expected, i don't think it at all, it will not be there at all, well, there will be some kind of solution. from the resolution, the more countries there are at the summit, the more the resolution will be for everything, and it was right to involve as many states as possible, if at all you want to hold such meetings with as many states as possible, then yes, and if you want to hold these meetings among the western allies, then it was possible not to start this process at all, but what are your thoughts on the fact that if there is some abbreviated formula to be discussed, what is it

will somehow interfere with the... position in the future? in principle, the ukrainian position in the future can be any, we understand it, because it is the ukrainian position, the question is simply whether we do not give the opportunity, for example, to certain players to promote their position, which will not completely coincide with the ukrainian one, promote, for example, to other states, won't other states say, well, listen, well , you see, ukraine came out of... with a shortened program , ukraine supposedly agrees to some compromises, let's talk about these compromises, maybe in is there a problem with this? i think the problem is different, the problem is that both we and the west are constantly waiting for russia to be interested in some negotiations, and i think i proceed from the fact that, er, russia will not be interested in any negotiations at all, even if in the fall there in saudi arabia, so they will, well, they can

come somewhere, no, well... again, negotiations on a ceasefire, as it is written in the chinese plan, may be, but this is not a peace formula and none of these there are conversations about security and the like, it's generally just us met and agreed that the fire will stop there from a certain hour along the line of contact, that's all, it's possible, it's possible, although i don't see any need for russia, i believe that once again russia clearly... demonstrates its desire to wear down ukraine in i would say in terms of infrastructure, not just military. why should russia cease fire if winter is ahead, and it is still possible to make ukrainians continue to leave the big cities. if it is possible to see whether there will be heating, whether there will be electricity, how many people will remain, how many business, you understand that if there is no opportunity to live, then a large number of people

will again go abroad. so. russia can also solve this problem, as a primary, demographic problem, it can end the war when there is simply no living population left here, not that it beats everyone, but simply forces them to leave the territory, and the longer the war lasts, all the more, this possibility exists, some more strikes on thermal power plants, some more strikes on infrastructure facilities, some more strikes on kharkiv, it's very good that we can do it to counteract now. this is an absolutely obvious point that we need to counteract this, but i want to ask you a simpler thing, what is the problem of the peace summit in principle, if it actually accepts even a few points in a situation where all these countries do not bother russia at all , don't worry, because there is also...