this also creates problems for business, for determining what it should do, what will happen to the exchange rate, because it is actually determined manually in the network by the national bank, what it does with interest rates, and how it stimulates crediting even in wartime, its policy rather generally kills this field and so on, that is, the question of what needs to be done is more than enough, another matter is that i do not expect at the current level of professionalism, ethics and... and i do not know what experience and so on, those , who is at now at authorities, they are able to do it effectively. do those who manage the ukrainian economy today have an understanding of the real economic situation? i think not, because this is the so-called dinning kruger effect, that is, people , due to their incompetence, do not realize that they do not, that they do not... do not

understand what is happening, but they do, they they're absolutely sure they understand what's going on, but when they start talking, and that's when you realize that actually, the situation is dire, because these people well, they are talking outright delusion, and this applies to both the government, the national bank, and the office of the president, if we talk about the situation with the extent to which in... they can, can reforms take place now, but in the current conditions of war, they are already demanding reforms, to what extent are these realistic demands, let's decide that this is actually this mantra about reforms, you know, goebbels is credited with the phrase, when i hear the word culture, i grab my gun, you know, when i hear the word reform, i also have a desire to grab for a gun why because reforms are a tool. first you

have to understand what you want to do, you have to clearly define what you want to do, and then, based on that, you start to use certain tools, and reforms in this case are the very tool that you need to do in order to achieve the goals that you want, well , want to aim for, if you don't understand what to do, in fact, and that's not the case, well, i'm already in... i tried to give this example about it, but it's very eloquent the prime minister's statement about what ukraine should become raw materials center of europe, well, what do you want from a person with this level of understanding, to know what he needs to do in the country, well , definitely, and very unfortunately, this is not a problem of one person, it is a problem of those who were brought to power in 2019, despite the fact that i 've never been much of a fan there.

prime minister arseniy yatsenyuk and groysman, but they look like giants of the intellect against this background. from your point of view, what should be the measures to stabilize the wartime economy of this understanding? again this is what i was saying, we need a completely transparent monetary policy so that there is access to credit, completely transparent and clear for business... the situation with the exchange rate, what will the national bank do, because the exchange rate depends completely on 100% now from the national bank, well, it determines the exchange rate with which, excuse me, on which foot they will stand and what they will do with the exchange rate, because they are in such conditions, when it is not transparent, it creates huge problems for business, it is necessary, i repeat, it is necessary to be clear and understandable positions on the mechanism of mobilization and economic reservation, because again...

such a business must understand what you are doing, you need an adequate budget policy, you, excuse me, when in the conditions of war it is absolutely normal for us to continue to move tiles or build roads in at the time when the armed forces are in dire need of military equipment and everything related to war, this of course means that you are doing something wrong, you are not using the funds that you mobilize or that you have in this way. .. externally, therefore i emphasize, this is a set of actions that need to be done, well, here is an example, you know, there was a very demonstrative example, the other day we constantly shared it with khmelnytskyi, the city leadership over the past 8-10 years has been building a model of gas turbine power generating stations that provided the city with heat and electricity, she is not alone, there are six or seven of them, i don't remember how many, several pieces, in this way ... they will ensure the stable

functioning of the city, but this would be done for years, it is undeniable to say what you should do here and now, if you did not it is during for many years, for certain cities, then... you definitely have an answer that will give you the opportunity to breathe out and say: we did everything and everything will be fine, there is definitely no such answer, we will face problems that will have to decide in there in the mode in the fire mode, based on what we have now. thank you, mr. boris. boryskushny, an economist, head of the expert council of the ukrainian analytical center, was with us in... contact and we talked with him about what is happening with the ukrainian economy, and now from ukraine, from economic , we will move to the middle east, we will talk with vadym polishchuk, a historian, a political observer in israel, congratulations, mr. vadym,

good evening, i congratulate you, well, how do you think things are going at the moment with the probable end of the conflict, to what extent can it be considered that... they are coming to some kind of agreement, is there such a prospect at all? well , regarding the agreement with hamas, it somehow does not work out, and most analysts have the impression that hamas does not need this agreement at this stage, and they want it, the main thing their demand is to stop the war and then we will talk, and i want the guarantors to be political players, primarily connected. they called for the last time that china and russia would join, and some arab countries, and further, that they would have hostages left, because not all of the hostages in question are in their possession and in their hands, and then somehow they

will give someone there, someone will be kept for further conversations, trades, demands and so on, and that is why they drag them, the administration... will find some even bigger ones concessions, israel inclines to them, and then they refuse and wait when they are offered something even more interesting, or when a team from iran does not arrive to continue this conflict, or it can somehow turn around a little at a time, but the main goal is really for them to retain power in the gas sector, and it doesn't matter what the civilian casualties are in this struggle. but on the other hand, how realistic is the idea that it is possible to destroy hamas in gaza, given the level of its influence on the population, and in principle the attitude of the population precisely to force an option for solving problems, well, it can be destroyed

as a structure or significantly weakened so that it turns into some kind of partisan movement with power in the gas state, and although... the last one was a survey by a well-known arab sociologist, whom even israeli sociologists trust, the level of support for hamas, that in gaza, on the west bank of the jordan river, as they call it, or the judea of ​​samaria, well, somewhere it reaches 70-80%, so many are already saying that saying that we are fighting with hamas is such a thing, you know, actually by myself. well, in fact, the war goes on and on so-called palestinians, because they, with this long-standing propaganda, are actually, well , the base on which hamas is based, and this palestinian authority, which many hope will come to power and

rule there, has a level of support, well, there are somewhere around 20%, among all the so-called palestinian arabs, and the same thing... these hizballah, we see that, as it were, well , we pretend that we are fighting with hizballah, but now the lebanese parliament has made a decision to pay this to the families of the dead fighters of izbala, somewhere around a million dollars of support, and in fact it shows that the war is actually with lebanon and not with hezbollah, hezbollah is only the structure that directly takes part in this war. and to what extent can it be considered that there can be a real war with lebanon by the israeli state, that is, a real war with siran, and not with lebanon, and not with hezbollah militants as such, that there would be a war on the territory

of iran and so on, maybe, but this requires political will and an understanding that iran has already threatened to join this war. if there will be a full-scale war with lebanon, and one must understand that hezbollah is hamas at maximum speed, as they say, it has more weapons and a strategic situation. it is even better and til is more powerful, because behind it, behind it , in fact, the syrian regime, and iraq, and iran have access to lebanon and to the positions of hezbollah, and it will be much more difficult, although the south of lebanon is not as populated as gaza, and it may be somewhat easier to fight there, but the mountainous terrain, which also has no built fortifications, some kind of underground. there will be many surprises, but you see that israel

is trying to avoid this war by any means, and america is encouraging it to do so, but france has now joined, but still the position of hezbollah, it largely depends on the position of iran. what do you think iran is interested in now? well, iran is interested in weakening israel in any way, directly. in the war, you see, he would not really want to intervene, but he is playing on the fact that the united states does not want a full-scale war, primarily the biden administration, it is before its elections wants to come as a peacemaker who settled this middle eastern conflict, prevented a conflict between china and taiwan, maybe from ukraine, they would be happy to settle something, but you see, they have taken up such a bigger position now. position regarding the conflict with russia, i.e. they moved from peacemaking to actual economic and military pressure on russia,

here in the middle east they are still playing some kind of peacekeepers and they want to seal something with some kind of peace, there is a danger that israel is now losing international support first of all, well, he was losing all these months, well , that's how i say it, losing, losing, but... here, first of all, there is a danger of losing the support of the united states, first of all , the un security council, and well, because of the agreements that is between israel and the united states, and what would not interfere with ukraine is the status of the main ally outside nato, so it would be difficult to deprive any administration of military support, but to vote somehow not... so in the security council, that was b danger, indeed, and this

is very much feared in israel, and in the government, and you see, the government has now shrunk in israel, that is, the center-left left, this ganze ezinpod, who were such leaders of american policy, actually in the government, and the government has become more rigid in these matters, but less protected from any attacks from the side of the united states. those forces that want to force israel to come to peace at any cost. and in principle, to what extent does this government now allow any decisions to be made, because we know that there are right-wing government ministers, the ultra-right have already said that if netanyahu there agrees with the american plan, they will leave the coalition, the coalition will fall apart, there will be preparations for extraordinary elections, so the prime minister is in this state, on the one hand there is the united states, on the other hand there are far-right ministers, he cannot even discover his position, well, netanyahu's position has always been like this, you know, he somehow tried

to sweat this difficult situation, let's say, between reality and desire, and some kind of desire, whether he will succeed this time, it is very difficult to say, well, to lose the government, i it seems he doesn't want to, he understands that if elections are called now, then his party will have... not as good results as they were last time, and there is a danger of those people coming to power who resemble any plans in the united states, well , first of all, this is the same hans, this is a lapit, who, uh , he will be the leader of any policy, well , as we saw, how he was a football player gave gas, well, probable gas fields in the middle of the mediterranean sea, and said , what are we now... we agreed, we gave them some disputed territory, and everything will be fine with hezbollah, well, we they saw how everything is normal, the same

was said by the people who surrendered to the gas in their time, which southern lebanon was handed over from the control of israel, well, now we are all responding to it. and tell me, please, how you imagine the existence of israel in principle outside of this concept of peaceful coexistence with neighbors at the expense of territorial agreements in such a case. this has always been the essence of the security policy, which was celebrated by vegan monks and anwar saddat, well, agreement and opportunity by those countries that in principle recognize the existence. the state of israel, for example, managed to make such a condition with egypt that actually works, more or less the same, in jordan there is a royal dynasty that is half-conscious, in the same way with jordan, such agreements are possible, agreements are possible with arab countries that are somewhere far away , what are these territories in principle, you know, not for anything, but how to reach an agreement with people

who, in principle, do not recognize israel's right to exist. these are the latest polls from the palestinian arabs, well, they have the concept in their heads that even this concept is two state for two peoples, it finds 10-15 to 20% of supporters among them, no more, what can be agreed with them, that is, they imagine every agreement that right now we have taken a bite of something, and tomorrow we will have something else we'll bite off, we'll bite off something else, well... until there's nothing left of israel, look at the world map, well, there's not much to bite off here, it's not that small a country, well, almost microscopic, if we understand that from one the palestinians do not want an agreement with israel, but want to dominate

throughout the territory of the former mandatory palestine, right-wing tendencies are intensifying in israel, which is already visible there by the votes for... such parties as the party there and tamara bangwir and betsale shrodochka, which are considered such far-right politicians there, even from a classical european point of view, then this means that the conflict cannot be resolved in principle, we have to count on a war without end, well , for now, until the palestinians see a world in which the existence of israel is possible, an agreement with them is impossible, their you can to force some kind of temporary coexistence in some way, but realizing that again, that there will be war again after some time, yes, yes, well, that is , israeli society needs, perhaps, like the ukrainian one, to abandon this idea of ​​living in peace, as in the norm that has already prevailed

for the last decades, there, how can you live, support the idea of ​​living with people who want to destroy you, and this... concept, they, they do not give up on it, you see, well, if with russia this concept has become yes, well, obviously, only 10 years ago, when it began to manifest itself in the world, this idea of ​​israel with the arabs, well, the first pogroms on this land began somewhere in the 20s of the 20th century , quite so powerful, and then in the year 48 it broke out with new strength. figures, you can remember, sheikh ierus, well, the mufti of jerusalem, hussein, i think his name was, he was friends with hitler, they once discussed the idea of ​​extermination of the jews very lively there, and this idea fascinated him, and these ideas live and flourish in this environment, that's why

israel somehow managed to survive for so long years in this environment, but... you see, now it is being fueled, the main thing is that in these eyes the palestinian hamas and so on, what they are crediting themselves with now, and it is supported precisely by this poll, that they are this idea of ​​the palestinians, they they took it out of some kind of closet, removed a little bit of mold that had already covered it, and it played with new colors, you see, and they like it very much, they don’t even feel sorry for these victims, this... destroyed gauze, this, well they think that now they will be given money again, they will certainly steal most of it there, but something is there will restore it and went on, but the fact is that again they actually disrupted this agreement with saudi arabia, which was already almost at the stage of such implementation, and for china, for iran, for

turkey it is important that this trade project be disrupted.. . on the way from india through saudi arabia, israel to europe, that is , they actually destroyed the competitor, well, not that they destroyed, but actually this project is not at the time, it was just a very strong competition for this way from china to europe, so the big silk road, and see and china is in profit again, turkey is in profit again, because this road goes through it, iran is the same. well , some of the people of the marxist school, they always say that behind many political events there is always some kind of economy, some kind of money, well, looking at this... situation , you can believe it too. thank you, mr. vadim. vadym polishchuk, a historian and political commentator from israel was in touch with us and we

talked about the situation in the middle east. there has been a conflict in the region for 254 days. we know that by and large this conflict is now and distracts the attention of many countries from the russian-ukrainian war, in which vladimir putin is also interested there, and in this. of course, it is important to understand how this conflict can end, although we have already heard from israeli politicians that the conflict will at least continue until the end of this year, and many believe that this is an optimistic forecast, that in fact the conflict in israel and ukraine will coexist for a long time months, maybe years, and become the standard of existence for the residents of israel and ukraine for 20 years of the 21st century, this is such a conflict a situation that may, at best, be interrupted by something. periods, periods of peace, which we all continue to hope for, we're going on a commercial break now, and we'll be back later, so please don't switch, your seat

is waiting for you, the lights... stay on, what you love for dinner , a warm bed is made, there will be walks, swings and swimming, they are waiting for you on your street, at school, in your church, because in your house they see dreams about you, you are always in front of their eyes, they cry for you, they pray for you, we

we came, because we knew that you are already somewhere nearby, half the battle is to know how difficult victory is, and we will do everything to make it faster. to hug you, so when you're home, when we're together, we're more than a family, we're a nation united around you, we continue the program. on the politclub tv channel, we will talk with oleksiy garan, professor of political science at the kyiv-mygillan academy, scientific director of the democratic initiative foundation named after ilko kuchare. congratulations, mr. oleksiy.

i congratulate you. well, against the background of this peace summit, how do you see the position of the global south, does it have any common position at all? i would say that all is not lost. as for the common position, we saw a very contradictory position. yes, there is no common position in fact, that is, there is definitely the influence of russia and china, which worked fruitfully enough to eliminate the participation of the countries of the global south in this event, and, let's say, even such countries that were represented . the truth is not at the highest levels, well, let's say, the same mexico, indonesia, india, saudi arabia, they abstained,

thailand, they abstained after the signing of the final communiqué, but at the same time there are quite a few countries that supported it, and here we can talk about qatar, and this is very important, about... about jordan, about, yes, who else is there from bahrain, in latin america, there are a lot of countries, these are argentina, and chile, and ecuador, and guatemala, costa rica, which were on, and uruguay, by the way, if we let's look at africa, there are, say, countries like...

well, we can say that we failed to unite, let's say, the entire global south, and here it is obvious that there is actually a lot of work ahead, and frankly, it is difficult to imagine how we will manage to do this further, but that is the art of diplomacy, to do something that seems impossible at the moment, but do you understand the practical meaning? well, we united the global south, well, what's next? well , this is your question, which you traditionally ask, when you also said, i remember that we will get a second extended crimean platform, so what, well, we got it, what's next, yes of course, this is a good question, a good question, and in fact, in fact, there is no unequivocal answer to it, because the question arises, really, how will this work be ... further,

that is, now if there are three points on which we decided to continue working, that is, work delegations will work through them, but will russia go for it? well, again, a big question mark, well, it is written that ukraine has full sovereignty over the zaporizhia nuclear plant, but how russia will react to this, well, it's hard to say. yes, i think that most likely she will not leave there, because this is an attempt to blackmail her only ukraine, but also other other countries, i want to remind you that putin demands that ukrainian troops leave the entire territory of the zaporizhzhia region, even from the part that we control, which is zaporizhzhia nuclear, absolutely, absolutely fair, well, i think that, for example, it is possible that there will be more movement on the point of food security, yes, because

ours has already been restored. this grain corridor, there are really a lot of countries in the world that are interested in this, so i think that here, let's say, there are more chances, but imagine the exchange of captives and even the return of ukrainian deported children, we see how many countries are working on this, including the countries of the global south, and the same qatar, and aman, and other countries have been here and are doing it. the movements are coming back gradually, but very little, but very little, that is, this process is very, very long, so i would not like there to be, you know, inflated expectations, and well, the president says that now to prepare the second summit will be needed months and it's months to complete war, but it's hard for me to imagine how it's going to...

happen, you know what i'll tell you, we had, i think, overestimated expectations for and the first global peace summit, somewhere else, well , six months ago, and then , when, when it became clear that not everything is going so easily, and that we will reduce even the number of discussed issues from 10 to three, then thank god that... well, if we started at least not to build up these inflated expectations, yes and we experts have also played a role here, and so have you, mr. vitaly, and others, what can we do to be realistic about what we can achieve, what we can achieve, so i don't see any harm in holding these summits, that is, this is another if diplomatic and... initiative,

maybe something will come of it, we see that through the un, well it seems that 141 countries united there, voted for all the right things, but the aggressors are now there, well, let's try to use this track, as you can say now, in which, after all, not only western countries, but also non-western countries participate countries as well, but we should be... known for that it will be that it will also be very difficult. and again, if we say that the next global summit will be held in two months, then i think we need to clarify here what we expect from it, whether it will be a peace summit, whether it will be a meeting at the level of advisers, whether it will be to work working groups, so that once again , inflated expectations are not created, and

then we start... we have to be disappointed, and why did it not work out?