duty to fight, they do not do it, and because of that, the supreme court of bagaz passed such a resolution that ultra-orthodox people should join the army and serve. in addition, yeshevas, disheves, or those schools where religious people study, are deprived of some funding. and they went to rallies, went to protests, we don't want that, we will die, and... we will not go to the army, and at this time, when i was preparing for the broadcast, there were very, very many events in israel, in jerusalem a large demonstration, where a large part of ultra-orthodox jews came out, there are only men there, of course there are no women, and they already have completely different inscriptions, posters, and they were talking about something completely different, it is no longer just that we will not go to fight, we will die, but that the army protects the zionists, and not the jews, because they... do not associate themselves with

the zionists, it is here in israel that you need to understand a little more to understand who are the zionists and who are the jews? well, it is obvious that the zionists want to have a state, and the jew who wants to, who is ready to live under any conditions on this territory, absolutely everything is equal, whose ured, what what needs to be understood here is that there are ukrainians who want to have a state, and there are people who are ready to live under russia, this is how it goes here, and this is this, this is such a confrontation. some people and others, although both jews, both profess judaism, and everyone wants there to be, for there to be peace, and for there to be no terrorists who, alongside us, have caused such a terrible, terrible war that is in effect , you, you understand that we do not only have a front in the south, we still have a front in the north as well, because hezbollah is shelling the northern areas a lot, and the 150,000 jews who lived there, they for... we are also refugees in their own country, they

live sometimes in hotels, sometimes in rented apartments, sometimes with their relatives, and they do not know how long this will continue, it has already been going on for nine months, and we have very there is unrest in samaria and in judea, where there are also terrorists who from time to time, almost every day , go out and attack the jews, the settlers who live there, because of this israel now, i can say that israel now has in the army three... fronts, this is the south, the north and judea samaria. judea samaria is what is called from an international point of view, west bank of the jordan river? yes, yes, of course, it worries you that the acts of violence against the arab population living there are also increasing on the part of the jewish settlers in this territory. you know, due to my profession, and when, i worked for 17 years as an in-house correspondent of the national radio company of ukraine and had the opportunity to visit. there with

foreign correspondents, we were driven there, we were always accompanied by the police, the israel defense forces, and strangely enough , it was the first time that we were more protected from jewish settlements, they weren't very calm, they attacked us, well, they tried, that you don't spread biased information, absolutely right, absolutely right. and there were jeeps near the arab settlements, our soldiers were standing, and i was very surprised and asked why, they said, well, it is not calm here, well, due to my profession, i was in the settlements and i was in these in the arab settlements, there and i will honestly tell you that i was without security, so maybe i saw it differently, but it seemed to me that there was a very tense atmosphere, the situation was they practically do not perceive each other.

there is not even a chance for a compromise, and this question is how to solve this problem, because it will become the main one after the end of the conflict in the gas sector, of course, you know, going back to the topic of conscription of ultra-orthodox people into the army, there is a very big problem here, and the army ready to receive 300 this year, but how they should serve, where they should serve, this is also the place where they will live, where they will sleep, where they should pray, because they... should pray, this is their food, it has be kosher are they the first, are they the first religious jews who serve in the israel defense forces, this has always been resolved with the religious zionists, they also prayed, always ate kosher food, you are a little mistaken here, because there are simply jews who are very religious, they serve, they have knitted kippahs, uh, and these are the ultra-orthodox people that you already said, they don't perceive israel as a state at all, but they have the same menu with these people who... or not, it happens it’s the same, sometimes

not, but with them, the most important thing is that there should not be soldiers, women, girls, and we have women, girls are everywhere in all divisions, whatever they are. our women-girls still serve top secret there, but it is also very ugly for them that they will also be walking next to them there, well, in a word, there are a lot of problems with such people, because they do not treat women the way ordinary people do citizens of israel, well, they do not behave that way a little, well, it was a politically correct answer, listen, but what happened to the warrant of the international criminal court for the arrest of prime minister benjamin netanyahu and minister of defense yulant, i understand that he... somehow slowed down, he has slowed down so far, and i think that the reason here was great britain, which put forward its claims to this international, to this international criminal court, and to other countries, to other countries, they

appealed to the fact that they also have the opportunity until july 12 to express their claims to the international criminal court with the fact that they, well... wrongly want to issue an arrest and accuse israel of what they did, of committing a war crime against the residents of the sector gas, but sorry when you, you live, they come to you, they attack you, then you have to defend yourself and defend yourself so that you, well, enter the territory from where you were attacked, israel entered the gas four times, was in the center. in the south, in the north, and of course, peaceful people die, as we say, but how can you distinguish them, are they peaceful or not peaceful, and when schools, hospitals, you know, were located in underground tunnels, in those offices where there were

leaders of the terrorist organization hamas, how is it possible, you walk down the same street, gas, you're fine to meet a woman or a man or a boy, as you know, he is dressed in civilian clothes, although, what does he think, whose side is he on, who does he protect, we cannot know, there is nothing written on the eyes, although you know , it is very, very difficult to introduce the israel defense forces so that they are not accused of killing the civilian population, due to the fact that the palestinian authority and the gaza strip do not have their own army, and all those people... these people, i said so figuratively, belongs to the terrorist organization hamas, they are all civilians, and when the israel defense forces destroys them, kills them, so it turns out that they are committing a war crime against civilians, an interesting circumstance, yes. thank you, ms.

svitlana, svitlana glas, an israeli journalist was in touch with us. thank you for participating in this broadcast, for the clarification. just arrived. the results of the first round in the national assembly of the french republic were waiting for it, therefore the right, the radical national union party, led by marine le pen is the leader of this first round, according to exit polemics, she has 34% of the votes in the popular front, the new popular front, which united all the left-wing forces of france, 28% of the votes in... in the party of president emmanuel macron , 20.3% of the votes, in the republicans, the right of the conservative party that was created in support of former charles dagol 10% of votes, well, that's basically all, all the previous

results, we'll come back to them at the end of our program, and now we'll take a break for a couple of minutes and after this break, we'll start our conversation with the former minister of foreign affairs of ukraine, vadim. cheers to the thais we will have in the studio. anatomy of hate. putin and ukraine, the new book of espresso tv presenter serhiy rudenko. insight, first-hand information, behind the scenes of russian politics and events, which the author himself witnessed. unsuccessful attempts to change presidents, poisoning of political leaders of the ukrainian state, murder and bloody war. all this is in serhii rudenko's book, anatomy of hate, putin and ukraine, look for it in ukrainian bookstores. fm, galicia.

listen to yours. turn on well, that's it. how you want klatz and now you control the game, bird and you in the tv show, oh, what you need, megugo, turn on hundreds of channels, thousands of movies. and sports, mom, i threw up and i'm sick, the heat always just poisons me, dehydration can occur with intoxication, and it's important to restore the water-electrolyte balance. when ordinary water is not enough, i recommend reo to adults and children. we will save ourselves with reo water. reo saves. rheo - water for special medical purposes. in the latest edition of the magazine ukraine. exclusive interview with diplomat oleksandr khara. why does russia have the right to veto ukraine's entry into nato. more resonant. following the road to nowhere, how the construction of a forest road can destroy a historical monument, the unique vitaly

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vasyl zima's big broadcast. two hours of air time. two hours of your time. two hours to learn about war and how the world lives. two hours to keep up with economic and sports news. two hours in the company of favorite presenters, presenters who have become like family to many, as well as distinguished guests of the studio. events in two hours, vasyl zima's big broadcast, a project for the intelligent and those who care, in the evening on espresso, we continue the politclub program, vadym prysteiko, the former minister of foreign affairs of ukraine and the ambassador of ukraine to great britain, we are in touch in our studio, mr. vadym , greetings, good evening, let's start by searching from. to such a question, which i am a bit confused, why these days suddenly started such serious talks at

the official level about the models of transition with moscow, president volodymyr zelenskyi said that the only model is this, the grain agreement model, when they talk through intermediaries, it seems to me that there is logic in this, because if zelensky does not recognize putin as a negotiating partner by decree, and zelensky, and putin does not recognize zelensky as a legitimate president, how can they still talk, but there is still an expression of your legacy. in the position of minister of foreign affairs dmytro koleba, who says that he is ready to talk with sergey lavrov and that russia will be at the negotiating table in the future, well, in general , i do not see anything wrong with the fact that dmytro kuleba is ready to talk, for this, in principle, foreign ministers are paid from our taxes, no, i’m not asking about the bad, i’m asking about the model, you know, it’s a mystery to me why zelensky in principle adopted this decree, closing the door to possible negotiations in the future, maybe this is really what they’re telling me a diplomat who is always ready in principle. this is a reaction, this is a purely emotional reaction, and it was during the massacre, it could have been emotional , it is clear that it happened after the first stage,

which is this peace summit, the peace summit is over, another convincing victory has not been achieved, but it is still clear to everyone that it is necessary to move on, the normal step for our authorities to move on is to say that, well, it may not be perfect, but the next one will definitely be perfect, so what will it be next, everyone heard the signal, starting from the swiss, ending with this southern one global south that... we will have to talk to putin, it is extremely unpleasant for us and it did not fit into our plans, but it did not work as planned, that is why the authorities, in my opinion, are looking for an option, how to explain to the ukrainians that now maybe there is no solution, well , there will be next time, wait for the peace, i want to gather this year or the second, that this year put putin at the table, exactly what will he sit on? to be honest, i also don't see any particular reason for putin to sit down, especially if we are just entering summer, summer a normal period for big maneuvers, especially... heavy ones like the russians doing tanks and everything, and anyway, until the end of the war season, there's no point in them

negotiating much, and frankly, it's not a fact that it will be right after the end of the war war, in that it seems to me that it is becoming more and more obvious that both sides have reached an impasse, putin can talk there that he will release more and more, but both sides have reached an impasse, i do not believe in peace talks, i nevertheless, i believe in the suspension of this war, which is about it in principle spoke from the very beginning for years, well, this model, which... the president spoke, that this is a model through intermediaries, this is a realistic model, as far as it can be through intermediaries, sitting at the same table to talk, i was just conducting negotiations on minsk in our way from our i command and it was already difficult, obviously, each country thought that the intermediaries were a little on someone else's side, not on your side, but it is possible to work through intermediaries, as it was done in agreement with the grain agreement, but we must remember the result of the grain agreement, it ended simply voluntary decision, when we realized that it was not working, and in principle it was done correctly, it was a dead end and a step in all directions, before it led us to

the collapse of our export component of our economy, steps had to be taken, there was a certain risk, we did the right thing that we didn't... agreed to the continuation of these endless compromises and negotiations, something that, i'm afraid, awaits these peace talks in the end. when it comes to the changes in the political process that everyone is waiting for right now, that's what donald is proposing trump, as realistic as it gets. we need to see the plan proposed to trump by his advisers, and in general, i am sure that there will be more than one plan, more than one adviser, and you remember, we also had a lot of people representing before the election. advisors, there were many plans of all kinds of creative ideas, then i remember president zelenskyy saying that i don't know what they are talking about, i think that trump is the same, he basically, as they say, that the spaz nodded his head when he was presented with plans, maybe he was thinking, did he turn off the prazka at that moment at home or something, but seriously, i can't believe that such a simple

primitive one-liner has the right to exist at all, i don't even need to dig deep into the details, but the very idea ... that you sit down at the negotiating table, if you do not sit down, we will give weapons, and if you do not sit down, then we will not give weapons to ukraine, well, this is extremely, very primitive, there is no next step here, relatively speaking, sit down , and if nothing is accomplished, we get weapons, we don't get weapons, and so on so on and so on and so on, but if we talk about the washington nato summit, in principle, what, what can be expected realistically from this whole story, they say that it will be a bridge, not... not an invitation to membership, but a bridge which should lead to membership. what is it like in diplomatic practice to walk across this bridge? i don't know, i worked in diplomacy for a long time, but to talk about a bridge to some organization, you know, for a long time we talked to us about an action plan for membership, as the last yes, the way to nato, and it's true, because this document about expansion, which provided for the format

of the expansion, he introduced something called the map, in fact it was introduced to those eastern european countries that... could not immediately meet the high criteria, and as traditionally the decision in the alliance was made purely politically, no one in particular dug for a long time in the increase in standards and everything, such a way was invented, but for certain reasons, which are not completely clear to me, for example, we abandoned this plan to reach membership, we believed that in general there was just a door in front of us, not a road, but the door now in addition to the road, they offer us some other bridges, a bridge at which we have to reach, well, i don't know, we had to look and understand how this bridge will... look, but, to be honest, i'm not particularly optimistic about of this summit, it is simply not very clear how the west sees these security guarantees for ukraine, which should lead to the fact that russia will no longer fight, if on the one hand there is no desire to accept ukraine into nato, at least in the foreseeable future, and with on the other hand , i want to ensure some kind of peace in europe,

i'm not sure that they even see it, i 'm sure that these pro... positions on the agreements were signed under the pressure of the ukrainian side, and everyone sympathizing with us, just okay, well , good, agreements, you want agreements, there will be agreements, well conditionally, what guarantees can north macedonia, with its population of less than 2 million, and many other countries of the alliance give us, but i heard that the agreement with slovenia has now been postponed because the ukrainian side did not like the content, apparently there is simply nothing it was, it was purely ceremonial, so it was a thing. i i know that our delegation took as an example the two agreements that were granted in finland and sweden, but they were given security guarantees until the moment of physical entry into the alliance, that is , the alliance was afraid that they had already been declared members of nato, but the mechanism of the formal fifth there is no article, and that is why the fifth article was entered before the fifth, and the fifth article, yes, we liked this thing, well, cool, only

we have to say to ourselves, it concerns two countries that in a month, they will already find a place there. seats allies, because they are already there the chair is round, they need to be pushed apart, that is, they actually come in, they have offices created, they have a command there and so on, they have to hold out for a month in case russia, they held out for two years, sweden held out for two years, well, no one thought , that this would happen could be predicted, you are right with the turks, but no one saw it that way, as a result they were given a normal fifth article, which was simply introduced, by the way, in 2000, i think in the eighth year , we already tried to make such an agreement with ukraine with the united states, we just like we rewrote the ministry of legal affairs. treaty, replacing the word nato with the united states, and so even leaving the fifth article number five and so on and so forth. we proposed to the united states to conclude a bilateral security agreement with us. it did not happen, we were offered a strategic partnership commission in response, the ministers will meet once a year, we are now due to the fact that we did not know, that we often do not know what was done next, we are now trying to do

the same, but these agreements are good , well, whatever you tell us next, we will support you, the finances, which are already given to us separately from these agreements, will be given further, no less than the subsidiary reboot of the political systems in each of these countries, but the parliamentary elections are big. the question that will happen now is whether they will lead to such a complete reset of the government, but in any case it can be said that the new government will treat these security problems of ukraine in exactly the same way as the old one, or will there still be adjustments? in our such, you know, information space, britain took a specific position place, and it sometimes seems to us that it is an island, it really is an island, formal too, not only figurative, in which our interests are so protected, and we are really very grateful to our partners, they are the closest, everyone whom you and i called allies, well, maybe our baltic friends, but for completely different reasons, and we, frankly, miss this danger, which in principle comes with any

reset of power, despite the fact that our liberian partners and colleagues say all the right words, i'm sure that there will be some changes, now everything is said correctly, 3 billion pounds sterling per year are pledged, which is almost 4 billion dollars, almost this is the japanese norm, this is... not very good, we obviously understand that the stockpile of physical weapons is less and less, but britain was and remained for us the biggest partner of our accession to nato, i hope that these are a couple of things that were traditional and that we valued in communication with britain will remain, for this we must not give up, still work even with those who would seem and you already know, they say why preach to the converted, why call those who have already believed, no, in britain we need to work on... first of all, with the electorate now liberals, well, i understand that politicians have already appeared right in the establishment, who are against this aid to ukraine, such as nigel farage, this was also not in the taco, so loudly,

it was not, no one allowed themselves, i remember it from my time in britain, so they were so against of that social consensus that existed when even the crown said that russia must lose, and ukraine must win, which has not participated in political life there for 200 years, and nazhi farysh, well, we understand who he is, obviously we see that his... success will be very limited, but it is indicative, that someone allows themselves in a country that is our number one support partner, and the paris auto blues were all over britain, someone finds an audience that says: listen, well, maybe we'll think about it, maybe we don't have to, but at the same time, they don't talk about that they don't give up on principles, you know what bothers me about trump is that even when talking with biden, he talked about 61 billion, about something else, he didn't talk about principles, that's what really should stress us. well, this is trump’s logic in general, he always talks about the logic of such things, yes, transitionality, every time i agree, and no, he is not changing himself here, he

is not, but the republicans, who have always been a more ideological party in the sense that democrats could in principle, well, i won't say choose another leader, but definitely shape the agenda not only based on the expectations of one specific leader, after all, they have children. no one canceled, well right, but what can the republicans do now that they have no other candidate, the vast majority of supporters of this party want to see donald trump in white hats, amen, i agree with you, you know, when i was in the united states , worked in 2009-12, i remember my american partners who mocked us, me, said: well, how can you take such a president as yours, well, we are tried there twice for rape, in particular, what kind of shooting range caps, we generally have such it is impossible, we are a nation with a great political culture. everything else and the army and well , the elite, well, how about me then, well, i had to emotionally say, well, wait, don’t complain yet, who knows the first

president in the history of the united states to be accused of a criminal offense, and well, it doesn’t change anything , yes, for formally, it sounds funny to us we don't understand how he can command from prison, but theoretically he can, he can even pardon himself, well, only on federal charges, not on state charges , that's right, but for this it is possible there is already a lot thin as someone who takes decisions on specific cases, and this is not the last case, as well as the wonderful vice president of his time, whom i watched biden, who was under the young, active, bright such, you know, president obama, well, really , an experienced person who restrained, who directed, i looked and thought, well , will we ever have something like this, please, we have everything, a good model, but if we talk about... really about trump and in principle, we we can somehow influence now at least the republican elite, if any will cook any plans for trump to

have all these principles one way or another in the... their vision of reality, if trump wins, that's the question of trump winning, what is it, we're definitely missing there tentatively senator mccain, senator dorbin, senator, i i don't know, there are a couple more people like that who really were, i was in the mountain right now, i don't know, and they could direct all this traditional post-military elite, you know, baby boomers in power, and they are now republicans, they are so overburdened with the need to survive , to win and to save the party, what we need, we will have to, not what we need, we will have to give them a certain moment so that they can turn and figure it out, i only hope that this elite, this deep state that exists, the military elite, she still clearly understands who the enemy really is, he can say anything as the president, there is a congress, there is this deep esthete, there are all the people who work and understand where the enemy is and where their friend is, the question of money, well, combined state, well, it will print a little more, well, here is the question...

in the fact that trump is already saying that he is able to negotiate not only with russia, but also with china and with north korea, i honestly find it strange, because if we talk about china and north korea, there is a much tougher attitude to the united states than to russia, if, if you look at things realistically, maybe he just likes, you remember, he always liked strong and such charismatic leaders, and for some reason he thinks that it is in such an environment that he will be more comfortable exist, well, maybe you remember it was also his decision, the very first decision when he became president... last time, with one push of a button, 54 people flew to syria, completely destroyed this airfield, just as the russians were based, just as the syrians were based, shelling people with chemical weapons weapons, that is , the decision was made and implemented very quickly, he constantly reminds us that what obama was pulling even a javelin was not given to us by one decision, there were javelins, there was training, there was an exchange of intelligence, there was intelligence data, that is, maybe in fact, if to develop our strategy correctly and talk not only about ourselves, but about the interests of the united

states and trump, maybe... you are the common, common topic on which you need to promote. well, by the way, it's difficult for us, we always forget about other people's interests before our own. it may seem to us that they have no problems, but they also have problems. and in fact, with all due respect to our victims, they still have the very china you mentioned. well, trade from the united states is gradually shifting, even from its own close environment, canada and mexico, which they traditionally trade there for 2 billion dollars a day. monstrous sums there. well , grandiose, they are moving more and more into southeast asia, they understand where the future lies for their economy, and they must defend their interests there by military means, europe, what trump says, directly tells everyone, europe should trumpet itself, that is, it is not the center of their economic interests, no longer the center of interests at all, and moreover, in their opinion, europe itself has become on your feet, and some, by the way, in europe too,

will be happy to learn one day that... the military has become less, it is not a fact that this will lead to increased security, but you know, people do not always understand and do what is actually in their interests, well, then the question arises about the role of ukraine, you know, because in this situation, if you will, ukraine becomes one of those european countries that are clearly oriented towards the usa, but there are not many such countries in europe, well, who , well, maybe poland, well, we have to become poland, we have an endless number of problems with poland, but if we talk about where we... should make efforts in our immediate environment, it is obviously poland. we have now focused on orbán, but we will clearly understand who orbán was before that, he was like that for a long time, you remember, he blocked you in nato, the last decades, at least, precisely after that, nothing has changed even in terms of demands. change such a law, give access, such, there, let raise the flag over the village council, all the same. our task is to become poland, we are approximately the same countries in terms of power and future, if we are our future

let's show the same trump, well... i remember when trump was in power, they poles even planned to call the base fort trump, well, it was already too much, they refused, somehow it was called differently there, but they obviously went in the direction of this country, i want to remind you that the poles also followed the direction of germany, who was the closest partner in europe, germany, most of the money for poland and everything else to the government of the law and justice party, problems, problems are in agreement, but poland is simply well, she's brilliant. was able to get the maximum for the maximum help, the finances are all over the clock, we just need to become poland, but you understand that if we become such a country with very close relations with the united states, then all the wonderful chinese investments that many dream of in ukraine will have to be forgotten , very either there or here, well...