military topics, we will start with the terrible shelling that took place today, and we will talk with the first guest, this is ihor romanenko, the founder of the charity fund "zakryye nebo ukraine", deputy chief of the general staff of the armed forces of ukraine in 2006-2010, lieutenant general, mr. igor, igor romanenko, mr. igor, good evening, if you can call it that, unfortunately, you can't. mr. igor, i have a question for you, in your opinion, was today's multi-pronged missile terrorist attack by the russian federation different on ukraine from, perhaps many previous ones, we understand that the genocidal practices of the terrorist country, it remains constant, nevertheless, today, i allow myself to assume, it was a special cynicism, it was... a solid

hit, in particular in a children's hospital, and this is not the only medical facility affected today. i agree with you on the characteristics, but i will characterize it from the point of view of military capabilities, first of all, and anti-aircraft, anti-missile defense. in its own way, the strike was planned uniquely, that is, well, they accumulated different ones types of rockets. used in fact from the point of view of a missile strike, first of all, everything they had, namely, they were airballistic missiles, which means that they were launched by iskander missiles, from the mik-31, then it was called, like a dagger, were also iskander missiles, which were launched from ground launchers, were cruise missiles, modern, hasto1, for example, which were launched from plates.

forms of air, and these were tu-95 ms, there were kh-22, heavy old missiles, but they have high, high speed, they are difficult to shoot down, so the tu-22 m3, perhaps from those that transmitted we at one time gave the russians time, and with the same rockets that were also given by the russians, and i say this so that we remember. what, who and how did and what is happening now, this should always be remembered in order to behave correctly for the current time and for the future. in addition, these were calibers, which means it has not been there for a long time, recently it was necessary and they are using them, and the kh-101 missile and calibers, they are modernizing, do not stand still, that is , they know that we have our anti- aircraft missile systems, which have thermal heads, guidance, that is, they

thermal bands are used on these missiles , which are already on the way, if our interceptors on proto-missiles are practical, then they carry radio electronic suppressors on the missiles, this is also an improvement, in addition, they launch in such a way that the missiles fly at a low altitude, it is very difficult to detect and destroy, and collectively this... increase the probability of achieving the goal, unfortunately, this also happened, besides, this is a technical schedule, if the components, and there is also a time schedule, i draw attention to the fact that the launches were carried out there first six rockets at night, if as usual, they are there at night and in the morning it will all be over, many of the residents probably thought so, but... strategic

bombers were also raised, it was clear, it became clear that everything else that we talked about with you will be applied, and that's it it happened that way, but they arrived in the morning, just when people were leaving for work and so on, and that's exactly what it's about, now it's appropriate to discuss the question of why this was done, that is, in my opinion, this is a military-political act of putin and... and his entourage, they grew up on the approaches, dates of the soviet, russian self conduct, therefore, to skip the nato summit, where the leadership of our allied countries and nato is gathering, so that everyone would understand that ukraine will not be allowed to join nato under any circumstances, which means that russia will not allow it, so it was necessary to commit and organize such a crime on a large scale. the scale

that they went to, and now it is important, therefore, the events, yes, the leadership, first of all the americans, but other leaders. nato countries, because, in my opinion, this summit will definitely mean that nothing will be done there, an invitation from any side of ukraine, and therefore they will walk around this house of natovsky again in circles, there they opened the door for us, opened this building of nato, which is there, and now we saw that we need to get to the door and we need to build bridges, over there across the moat or what they see there, we will build a bridge , and then we will get to that someday. mr. igor, in your opinion, is it appropriate to discuss whether russia targeted okhmadite, it is appropriate, because these are the technical characteristics, the records that are available show that, you yourself characterized it, i join this cynical approach, which takes place, and

this is very important, because the behavior of the russians is cynical, we see the characteristics, many facts that will be needed, i have hope in the garage. or to any legal international body, which must evaluate, but we must see what the allies are doing, but in the best case, the issue of anti-pollution defense will be solved there, it is not only the addition of seven and a half years, seven patriot batteries are being collected, but the americans do not have tens of 80 there somewhere, but it’s all european, the americans don’t do anything like that, it’s a battery, it’s time, secondly, it is necessary to remove the ban if it is from air defense. shoot on the f-16 and the gripens, this is artificially built by the americans, these are two, thirdly, the poles have already joined them, we talked about it for a long time, first, why is it called the closed sky of ukraine, because with the beginning of the war we talked about the thing is, give us the tools, you don't want it yourself, some

are afraid, some don't want to do it for various reasons, but let's give it, so what to give in six months, that means seven batteries, solutions for five, and well, they brought it from germany. not one battery, but we see a very strong one anti-cancer, anti-povid defense of the capital, it did not hold back such an influx, because the number is increasing, if we have been talking for months and years, and still in 16th the ban is not removed, then the russians will solve it quite quickly, and we can see it, here is the next step - it is jointly with its nato countries, it is a joint anti-missile defense, it is necessary to give permission from the americans. nothing is needed, we need to give permission to everyone, we know how to do it organizationally and how to do it technically, there is a lot for them to add at least from the point of view of anti-aircraft, anti-missile of defense at this summit. mr. igor, you said absolutely right, and khrystyna said absolutely right, that this is

a military-political act, in fact an act of terrorism, and let's take a look at these first minutes, the first hours, when the russians on... hit the largest children's hospital of our ohmadite country. let a person be brought. today we were supposed to take a bone marrow puncture to confirm the diagnosis at 11, which was supposed to be taken to anesthesia, but we don't know, we don't know what's there on our floor, our doctor said that we can't come back yet,

be where you are now, there are already some instructions or something, some news, literally in a matter of minutes, we just went down and there in a minute or two. and that they all fell under the ground, and the memory of them was lost in the ages, forever, that's what i thought when i saw it, when i came out of hiding. mr. igor, we have just seen, unfortunately, this terrible situation, this terrorist act, you mentioned the f-16. today we already have july 8 on our calendar, we were promised f-16s for june, unfortunately we still don't have them.

no matter how it sounds, it will encourage you today's attack is today's tragedy to the point that our western allies in the... will still dare to provide ukraine with f-16s, at least in the near future, at least some small number, because we're waiting, waiting. we are waiting, it is postponed from week to week, from month to month, but unfortunately, there is still no result. unfortunately, the americans have built such an algorithm, and if the crimes are russian, we characterized them as cynical, so i will not simply characterize them now, but we will see how it works, the algorithm of providing permission and assistance, let's say, for... some weapons and help, in principle, for ukraine, that is

, a summary question in some approach, well, for the same, for example, in the 16th, and it is in the queue, when russian crimes are getting bigger and deeper , more people, and so on, and when they reach some criteria that they set for the current time, then it works and is removed, for example, the ban on hope and... weapons from the borders for 100 km, yes, it worked for a week, russians removed their facilities 100 km away, but not further, and to the airfield su-34s are flying, and cabs are used in our cities, but kharkiv is not either, and the question arises, what can be called such behavior, that is, we have the biggest problems with cabs, it is cabs and that is there... stika and not only, that is the airstrikes they carry out, and that

won't solve the issue only batteries, patriots or the like, but as soon as they came in, all this time they were only the best, old in comparison, the very ones who are immobile, these patriots who need 90 people, and why are they beaten when they are scouted quickly, because they they can't move, you see, they themselves... 14 people, and there are 90, and while they will move, they are still old and not adapted to this, they are scouted and beaten, so it is still necessary that the patriots now have additional systems of covering the patriots , you understand, ladies, the truth must be shown, and therefore, it means that the issue of manpads and pf-16 must be resolved, and not again, f-16s are older than gripens and more demanding for a target. runways, which we do not have in this quality, why does all this move more, and the flues were not

developed so that, as soon as the war begins, fly to ground airfields, the swedes immediately built this plane, and the drelo planes, the swedes said two, the americans have already banned, let’s say, there is only one left, and i was on their american aircraft carriers, there is a hakai of the same kind, older , provide the hakai so that it is better... to be able to use the f-16 that you as patriots want to show america that it is the best, even though it is cheap i play, but what about the sites for all the planes, all the types of planes that you said , returning to the general topic of russian attacks on ours airfields, mykola olyschuk, commander of the air force, recently stated that the russian federation destroyed m iskanders, aircraft models and patriot air defense systems at the dolhintseve airfield. odesa, thank god, here in principle this is the story, but on the other hand, we remember

myrhorod, we understand what is happening in other places, these are different airfields, different facts, that is, there were both, there were airfields, where the dummies were located, and this is true, and they hit these dummies, and there were airfields, where there were planes that we cannot blow into underground storage, this... the required funds are large and the time, which time has not yet been used, and now we will not have time to build quickly, but we have soviet planes, you will travel on our roads and see, i will not say much there, as on the highway, more or less, who say there that everything is unclear, there are bullets, there are funds, and there are sections of the highway from which you need to take off, and the gripens are adapted for this, and we will adapt them in the 16th, so we will be for... only these european bans on the f-16 must be lifted, the americans still give nothing,

that is why we need to improve everything, it is necessary to achieve what to start, they can tell us for another year what should be done in order to accept these f16, but only the americans, and the swedish no-no, no, because as soon as they apply, then everyone will immediately see , that it is better, and this is advertising for the whole world, what are you talking about? and they have everything set up, they train thousands of pilots per year, and 12 ukrainian ones don't have time to train them, stand in line, please, ukrainians, that's the attitude. these are the approaches, and therefore it is difficult to tell our leadership that i understand this military diplomacy, but there is a society, they show it when they come to our square, they give us cookies, they play guitars, and their representatives are of a high level, they want to talk with older people, and maybe listen, because

the revolution of justice has already taught us the truth to speak, to defend it, but here we are'. tell the truth, not only that they are with us until the end of panego, today's second, no, it seems, the third or the second, went astray, and the attack and alarm in kyiv was connected, according to some information, to the work of the intelligence on the ukrainian capital, but as it turned out, it was an attack on another medical facility in the dnipro district of our capital, in general , the story of a raid with drones flying very deep into our rear. how big of a problem is it, what can we do? i am sure that the air force knows and is already working in this direction, nevertheless, it was the russians who built the reconnaissance-strike complexes, one of the important elements were their a50-ti and il-22 aircraft, that is, they are scouts, this

is what we used to talk about the swedish airplanes of the saab company, which could... give intelligence capabilities to enter and give target designation, that’s it, intelligence tools online detect targets, and then the means of destruction strikes, they strike with iskander batteries, but not only, strike with unmanned impact munitions, spread the lancet, and they work already hundreds of kilometers away , and therefore these strikes on our airfields are the last. they also used, as we know, uh, these reconnaissance drones at a relatively long distance , that is, before it was tens of kilometers from kardonov, now it is hundreds, where they first reconnoitre the situation, clarify the coordinates, convey to their means impressions of what iskanders,

missile weapons, various, not only iskander, missile weapons, what their long-range lancets may be. they are modernized, applied and then still take pictures of the results of the work, which means that it is difficult to work afterwards, and this can be added to exactly these swedish planes, which the swedes offered and included two, two such planes in the package, and it is clear that these swedish planes work better with , which the americans do not allow, and more than two planes, again, they reduced it so that there was only one, so that it was not so clear and not so effective on our part... these are the events of recent times. mr. igor, we thank you very much for your thoughts, for the fact that you have allocated your time for us. ihor romanenko, founder of the "close the sky of ukraine" charitable foundation. deputy chief of the general staff of the armed forces of ukraine in 2006-2010, lieutenant general. and we

remind you about our survey, it sounds as follows today: should we wait for sensationalism in favor of ukraine? at the nato summit in washington, if you think yes, then pick up your phones or smartphones and dial 0800-211-381, if you think no, then dial 0800-211-382, all calls are absolutely free, at the end of this hour we let's summarize the first results of our voting, and already we have the next guest, this is oleksandr khara, diplomat, expert. to the center for defense strategies on foreign and domestic policy, mr. oleksandr, welcome, good evening, congratulations, mr. oleksandr, we just talked about the attack, the terrible attack that took place on our country today, and we are talking about the washington summit, in general, do

you connect these two events, can they be politically connected in order to... demonstrate something actually during the summit, where they are supposed to support ukraine? yes, of course, since war is only one of the means of politics, and there are always political goals in war, and it is not for nothing that this attack took place after putin's failed french elections and before the day of the summit, on the one hand, putin naturally wanted not to spoil the results of marie lippin and others similar characters, on the other hand on the other hand, this is a clear signal to washington and its allies not to say, they are restrained, let's say, rather, i would say that the nuclear deterrence of the russian federation works much better than any strategies that washington has to support ukraine. well,

of course, this horror will not go unnoticed. i hope that there will be a reaction from our partners, and above all, to remove the ridiculous restrictions on the fact that we cannot destroy russian military facilities on russian territory, whether american or not. with other systems, because if you look at history, starting from the 14th year, only zhekhitya, they pushed our partners to do something, first apply more painful sanctions, it all started with the downing of the malaysian boeing mh-17, then what happened in buch and in irpin, it pushed to providing ukraine with more powerful weapons, of course, then there was mariupol, and all these things. constantly push our partners to abandon the red lines drawn in their own heads by themselves, which they are afraid to cross in order to avoid

god to cause the third world war, it is actually already going on because we have more than 50 countries that support us, behind the russian federation, unfortunately there is china, but also small harmful states like iran, north korea, and of course that ... maybe, if we look at history, the same thing can happen that actually happened before the day of the second world war, because putin's regime is clearly already fascist by all accounts, most likely it can also be called nazi because it denies the right to existence of the ukrainian people, and surely the methods of waging this war are no different from what the nazis used, sir? oleksandr, if we are already talking about today's tragedy, in the same way, is the reaction of the world adequate, how is the world reacting during today to one of

the largest shelling and the most terrorist shelling of our country, is this reaction sufficient, well, so far i have seen political statements on twitter and they are quite positive, and the closer they are to russia, the more they are tough and... correct and from the point of view of the us president's call to remove the nonsense restrictions on the use of weapons on russian territory and from the point of view that russia should answer for these crimes, although, you know, if we look again in history in the historical context, and the first and second chechen wars, there the civilian population was the target attacks, and i mean that not only putin and under him, and not only in ukraine he used such b... methods that are actually war crimes, but starting with yeltsin, that is, this is the modus operandi of the russian federation, and of course that we have to remember

also that when our children die, syrian children die on the same day, and assad and the russian air force are killing them there, and actually everyone is mad at the syrian children, we see neither the islamic peace, which opposes this, nor leftists in the united states... in europe, who would go to protests and call for something to be done with these two crooked tyrants, unfortunately, in ukraine as well, but the fact that it happened in kyiv with a children's hospital attracted attention , but in fact such things happen in ukraine, if not every day, then every other day, and on it's a pity, it already, let's put it this way, does not fall into this informational frenzy, does not fall into information. flow and become completely normal, i hope that these terrible images that we have seen, they will push our partners even further in supporting ukraine, and most importantly, they

will nullify all the so-called peace efforts, and mr. orbán, who shook hands with the military to the criminal putin, and the prime minister of india modi is there today, he didn't say a word about... this crime, he didn't turn his plane around, he left deepen into a special strategic partnership, here, but of course the world sees what is happening, i hope that this is another crime, it will bring to mind those who have forgotten, or who think that what is happening in ukraine has already been normalized, and that it is possible to somehow stop the genocidal war through some peaceful initiatives and negotiations with putin, mr. alexander, a little bit about... orban and the indian prime minister, orban recently met with putin, before that he met with zelensky, flew to beijing, which

looking east? actually mr. orbán, and if we are talking about india and the prime minister of this country, the visit to the russian federation, india is a democratic country, but it is definitely looking for certain profitable options for its existence and coexistence on the same continent with many key players. according to orban and the indian prime minister, what kind of visits are these and why they still remain a problem for the russian. president in order to penetrate somewhere in the backstage, but still civilized world? well, in foreign policy there is always a dilemma between values ​​and national interests. if we are talking about orbán, then he went there not just as a prime minister, but as the chairman of the eu. and the european union is primarily based on values. and in fact, he tried

to smear it like that. to show that there seems to be some desire, that is, of the european union , to push ukraine towards peace talks, the so -called peace talks with the russian federation, but there was a very good reaction from european factors and leaders of european states, that he left at his own discretion, did not inform anyone and there are none authority to speak on behalf of the eu, and of course, that they condemned him means a trip and an effort. receive certain dividends from the russian federation. you are absolutely right that there are shparinkas, and orban, and orban's hungary is a trojan horse of the russian federation and china. unlike other members of the european union, hungary is strengthening its cooperation and buying more gas, and signed a contract for the completion of a nuclear power unit. and so on, that is, orban is trying to use this tense situation between the eu and

russia. federation in order to get certain dividends, well , he actually had the same thing with china, orbán, or rather hungary is a hub for china's entry into the european market. the huawei corporation has the largest production in europe in hungary, and it is a corporation that produces equipment that is considered by the united states and a large number of european states to be a danger to nato, to the european union. if we talk about... modi, then there is a little longer history, they still remember soviet times, soviet times, when india was a country that did not join, and the soviet union helped quite a lot, the current moment, in fact, most of the indian armed forces are equipped with russian weapons, and they are reducing their dependence on russian weapons, because they saw that it is not a wunderwaffe in ukraine, that western weapons

are much ... and more effective , but this process is quite slow. the second is economic cooperation, and india bought a large amount of oil for its own use, and then, after processing, sold it to other countries, because of course, they simply wanted take advantage of the situation, since russia sells these energy carriers at a large discount. well, now india is trying to play between, well , actually three forces, the west. by the united states, europe, the russian federation, china, although, by and large, india's national interests are to strengthen itself and contain china in the indo-pacific region, and russia, as a weak partner of china, is helping china build its muscles and behave more aggressively in the region, well, there is a connection here, because what is happening in ukraine and the reaction of our

western partners in supporting us. and god forbid, the loss of ukraine, it will be a green light, a green light signal for china to take over taiwan, and precisely because of this , the hindus would do better to think that there are far-reaching interests of india and those countries that support it in the democratic camp, and there are short-term interests such as oil, as some kind of economic cooperation with the russian federation, and of course it would be better for them to consider this and choose a side. which is ideological, values-based, supports india, not just trying to use it against it of ukraine and the west as a whole. mr. oleksandr, what kind of light should nato show ukraine at this summit, because we understand that this summit is important, but ukraine will not be invited, even now.