in general, we have a deficit of the state budget, a new deficit of uah 500 billion, taking into account the fact that at the beginning of the year we had a deficit of usd 38 billion, which will be financed by our international partners, an additional uah 500 billion has arisen here. the government, the ministry of finance have repeatedly said why this arose, well, the need for additional financing, and so... i will express my personal point of view. on the one hand, all of us ukrainians understand that we need funds to finance the ukrainian army, because someone may have a question, well, why our foreign partners can't give us funds there? well, it turns out that during the great war, all the funds that come to our budget from international partners, they go to finance expenses there, for example, salaries of civil servants, education,

health care, partially cover the deficit of the pension fund, but not for financing salaries for military personnel, not for financing the military-industrial complex, and other issues related to the war. the war in ukraine is financed by the taxpayers of ukrainians - these are physical and legal entities, plus those borrowings that we take from the domestic market of ovdp, bonds of the domestic state loan, so-called military bonds, it is clear that there is... a huge gap of 500 billion today. and only at the expense of taxpayers, well, if we talk about this amount 500 billion, well, we heard the government's statements that they want to cover a little more than 120 billion this year. and here there is a tough discussion about how to do it, and business, the government, they are now, well , as far as i understand, they have not found such a coherent position so far, but also. i

i even heard there from the statements of some state officials that they, you know, during the discussion the truth is born, and they want to find this truth, find this golden mean, but i would like to say that if we are talking about raising taxes, again, this is my personal point of view, that is, if we are talking about what needs to be raised, then we must say frankly that let's raise them, for example, for a year or until the end of martial law, so that all ukrainians can do business. .. it was understood that precisely for this period, precisely for we agree to tighten our belts, this is the first, the second, we have a huge shadow economy in our country today, more than, well , look, there are different estimates, that is , i have not seen estimates during the great war, but before the great war even the official statistics showed that this figure was more than 30%, according to unofficial data this figure is even higher, which means that everyone should pay. financed

the ukrainian army, it looks like the proposals that are available today, well, the white business, the gray economy, is somehow shadows, in addition, to my personal point of view, that the clean economy, when you do not pay taxes during the war, and maybe even during the war, is a crime, and we should have worried and worked on this issue a long, long time ago, but it is necessary to bring, well , make such decisions, and what the decision can be, well, this is a matter of vat. value added tax, when everyone pays, i understand that there is a question of socially vulnerable segments of the population, and then, then, well, for example, medicine, eh, then, then make vat on medicine as it is today, do not increase it, or there bread, for example, those who buy, well, there, well, socially protected, that is, simple categories do not increase vat, on others, slightly raise, the second direction of funds, which is often talked about by business, says, well, let's... carry out the reform , we have huge

losses in other directions, customs is 100 more billions annually, well, losses, the tax is ineffective, by 100% and many, many other state bodies can, well, today, well , let’s put it this way, i understand that the funds are needed now, if we if we are talking about reforms, then this seems to be necessary, it is not a quick issue is being resolved, but on the other hand, i remember these reforms and many others, we have been talking, well... for more than 10 years, you understand, yes, and they are there, so our key task today is clearly that funds necessary, and we must find them, we must win back our independence, but look, mr. vasyl, you are right, and denys shmyhal is right, and it is clear that the army must be financed during the war, and the military must be paid salaries, because it is such a priority and a difficult enough priority now, well...

it is implied that it is necessary to invest in it, because it is the future of ukraine and a matter of life and death, but this is what the entrepreneurs i interviewed say. marketing group adventer group, that they say that raising taxes, ukrainians, raising entrepreneurs, that raising taxes in ukraine will first of all force businesses to raise prices for their goods and services, more than 72% of surveyed entrepreneurs said this. in addition, the business plans to try to optimize the payment of taxes and expenses, will look for new sales markets and reduce staff, i.e. exit. so all taxes that will be introduced in the case of mini-tax reform or, these special measures in the tax legislation, it will fall on the pockets of ordinary citizens, ukrainians, who will pay

more for goods and services, part of the business will generally go to those in shadow, you already mentioned about 40% of the shadow economy somewhere, and you mentioned it. about the reforms that are necessary in ukraine, about these reforms for the last five years , they talked about the fact that the customs office needs to be reformed, that there are a lot of holes, that there is a lot of money going into the pockets too, is there more now there is some alternative to fill the budget, besides raising taxes, because business is already working in extraordinary conditions, plus another part of business does not pay taxes at all or minimizes taxes and... part of business plans to minimize its taxes in case taxes are increased, there are other options for filling the budget. thank you for the question, once again, i saw a similar study, and it really deserves

attention, and i tried to explain this topic from different angles and find a compromise solution with the business once again and clearly carry out further reforms in order to be able to... fill the budget, are there still funds? look, and due to the fact that our revenue part of the budget is growing, well, if we are talking about last year, then the over-execution was more, well, for the whole whole year by more than 1 trillion hryvnias, and if we are talking about last year, then the revenue part was more than 50%, if you compare with the beginning of the year and the end of the year, well, when it was planned, because a lot of changes were made to the budget, well, increasing the revenue part, the same this year... in in principle, the revenue part is being exceeded at the expense of one or another source, and i am sure that the ministry of finance sees this, i am sure that during the meetings with business, when we saw there, high-ranking officials hold

meetings with business, and these issues were also raised , what decisions will be made in this matter, just finally, finally, i don't know, but i know unequivocally. what you said and i say again, financing the ukrainian army should be a priority, if we are talking about reducing some public expenditures, yes, they are needed to reduce, but believe me, it is not that big, let's say this, the opportunity to reduce them, because a lot has already been reduced, further, if we are talking about, for example, taking part of the funds from local budgets, well, let's raise them, for example , last year was huge... well, let's say that the decision there regarding the banks was very well, as it gave significant income, but was not popular among banks, when they introduced a 50% bank profit tax and took away from the banking systems there, well, these profits, this there was a decision for one year, they raised the rate on 50%, and for other years the rate was raised to

25%. let me remind you that business pays, well, in our country, the income tax is 18%, that is , banks already pay more than that. by 7%, so what are the other solutions, that is, and are there any, well, i think that the ministry of finance, if there were solutions, to quickly find money, this would probably be the issue, and it is very unpopular, you understand, it is an unpopular decision to raise taxes, that , that business does not support, are we there, well, the population, we understand this, because the increase in taxes means that you earn less, but on the other hand everyone understands that the army needs to be financed, so yes, we need to find funds, and maybe, maybe? mr. vasyl, we still need to talk about the fact that we need to transfer the funding of all government bodies to the state of emergency, martial law, because, for example, the salaries of people's deputies' assistants are being increased, and this

decision was passed in the verkhovna rada of ukraine, top managers there ukrposhta and other large companies receive large salaries. everything, that is, well, we have to live according to those incomes and those opportunities that there are us, not because some people will live like her. lived before the war, everyone else will pay this tax burden there, which will fall on business, and look, you raised again a very difficult question, and i personally, i do not support you on that side, on that part of the question, where, for example , well, let's make it so that the head of ukrposhta receives the minimum wage, and whether the other heads also receive a wage themselves, that is, i am categorically against such positions, therefore... precisely thanks to effective actions, if we we are talking about kirpochta, the leadership of kerpochta,

that is, we managed to turn one of the very, very corrupt backward such systems and structures into simple structures, and the company is reforming today, and yes, it is clear that a lot still needs to be done, but the very fact that moving in the right direction, and the same should be done with other state structures, and the salaries of managers should be market-based, because, well, conditionally, the same manager of ukrpochta. before taking the position of ukrpochta management, he worked abroad, he had a sufficiently high salary, and by and large, in fact, ukraine invited him to come and reform a large state structure, i will use an example, by the way, from the other side, for example, the structure, which has already been reformed and is showing its results, this is the national bank of ukraine, you remember the first stage of the war, 14, 15 years, which was with the banking system, they took more than 100 banks out of the market. do you remember what happened to the hryvnia, which flew into space during this period of time, do you remember what happened to 60% inflation, and now

yes, the period of the great war, the 22nd, 23rd, 24th years, how professional is the national bank, how stable is the banking system, thanks to the successful reforms carried out in the banking market, including the national bank of ukraine, for 9 years, starting essentially from the 15th year, and in the future we are reforming, and because a lot is needed... we are now taking seven steps towards the european union with that legislation, and we need to unify tens of thousands of regulatory and legal documents in order to to become in the short term, well , european, well, an equal member of the eu, but , look, again, we have a lot of inefficient state-owned enterprises today, and i read it, and i see it, and i'm with both hands for they should be reformed so that there would be less corruption there, so that they would be more profitable and so that... we could not then pay the profits to the state budget, and the state would not support them from

its budget, that is , we need to look in this direction, the shadow economy in different studios we talked for tens of years and what it just changed, we need to work in this direction, by the way, we discussed customs with you, it’s just that there is already a structural beacon there, that is, we are a structural beacon in front of the international monetary fund and we have to adopt a law by the end of october, which will... start , let's say, the start of the customs, and i am sure that we can really reform the customs and it will work as in the european union, and there are many, many other directions that need to be implemented. thank you, thank you, mr. vasyl, i would like to be the same optimist, like you, but i remember the year 2019, the month of july, when volodymyr oleksandrovich zelenskyy held numerous meetings with customs officers, asked what cars they drive, what phones they have. that he will restore order at the customs, i remember, it was 5 years ago, we again came to the point that

it is necessary to restore order at the customs, it is necessary to restore order in all state institutions, it is necessary to bring everyone to their senses, well, let's hope that it will happen sooner or later, it was vasyl furman, member of the council of the national bank of ukraine, doctor of economic sciences, thank you for participating in the program. let me remind you, friends, that we work live on the tv channel, as well as on our platforms. on youtube and facebook, for those who are watching us live now, please vote in our poll, we ask you this, do you expect gold medals from ukrainian olympians, yes no, on youtube everything is quite simple, yes no, or if you have a separate opinion, please leave it in the comments below this video, if you watch us on tv, vote for the corresponding numbers, if you expect gold medals from our olympians 08021381, no 0802138, all calls to these numbers are free, vote, at the end of the program we will sum up the results

of this vote. next, we have yevhen magda, executive director of the institute of world politics. mr. yevgeny, i congratulate you, thank you for joining our broadcast. congratulations, mr. serhiy, glory to ukraine. glory to heroes. mr. yevgeny, let's start our conversation with zelensky's already announced large personnel reserve and personnel changes. changes in the government, because zelensky is now talking about what there will be new resignations, why does the president, who has concentrated maximum power in his... hands and the hands of his closest entourage, continue to talk about personnel changes, what are they changing? actually, i don't know, because volodymyr zelenskyi has a law degree in the anamnesis, and he should know the basics of legislation, and yet , thank god, he has been the head of the state for five years,

he should already be legal, well, i don't i say legal education should improve, but there must be people who somehow... let his statements pass through a sieve expediency before going on the air, and well , there are only two ministers in the government, this is the sphere of powers of the president, the minister of defense and the minister of foreign affairs, it seems that no one encroaches on them, there are a third of vacancies in the government, that is, performing duties, they originally wanted.. . to type the prime minister, and then it turned out that you can't send the government, well, if they send the prime minister, then the government is out of office, we usually like to look for different variations, especially when such , there are legal monsters, like portnov, somewhere nearby, or something

similar, but, well, it should be... common sense. well, how can the same shmygal work when they say that he will soon be thrown out politically, although he is already a record holder, he practically headed the government for 4.5 years, and during this time he did not take a single step to form his own political image, remember, his yevgeny marchuk was sent to resign, that is, actually... i see that the ministers have finally changed into suits, well, even though they look more or less solid, this period of military communism in our government has already passed. only so far, the presidents cannot change their clothes to at least casual, because this military style seems to tire everyone, including our partners, but

judging by today's bloomberg publication, partners are more tired not so much as ... zelenskyi, and the fact that there is a head of the president's office in the power circle, who is taking on powers that are in no way inherent to him , by the way, mr. yevgeny, i will quote it to our tv viewers, because not everyone has already seen this publication on bloomberg about andrii yeremaka, i am quoting what bloomberg writes, he writes about that... and yermamak himself also does not deny his growing influence, i do not participate in every work, i only coordinate, so i am very proud that the president asks my opinion, but he asks my opinion because i get results, this is how yermak explains his influence in the president's entourage, what the publication itself actually says, that a person

for whom the ukrainians did not vote, but has very great powers and manages almost everything.' by the right-wing in the state, and this is probably the main thesis of this entire publication, well, that's it the most important thing is that in conditions where zelensky has already been in power for more than 5 years and his presidential term has already been extended, there is still this person who is constantly trying to move pieces on the chessboard with the guise of the president of ukraine. this publication, in your opinion, it is... a big greeting to volodymyr oleksandrovych from our western partners, because such publications would probably not appear in bloomberg just like that. well, i wouldn't look for some conspiracy theory, i think this post is evidence that our partners are completely aware of the situation that exists in ukraine, and well , they reckon with it to a certain extent, well, they

can't, it's only, you know, in the fantasies,... of our far-sighted citizens , there can be some kind of intervention, interference, and so on. actually, well, it's absolutely clear to me that nothing like that can happen, but i just think that for volodymyr zelensky, this should be a signal, because when you can, as they say, remember this saying, when it's over powers of volodymyr zelenskyi, there will be people who will accuse him. in that it is illegal delegated his powers, and i am not sure that andriy yermak will take responsibility in this situation. he is more likely to say: what about me, i was instructed by the president, and i carried it out, but here i am not a lawyer, i do not have a law degree, and i think that

the responsibility may be less here, it is not funny, but hey let's see, we still understand that there will be no elections in the near future, that the elections at the moment, well, they are... a serious challenge for ukraine to hold them, and these are all things that, at the moment, i would say, fix not a very good situation in ukraine. andriy yermak is one of those who prepared the second peace summit, the first peace summit and is preparing the second peace summit, yermak says that it will be very important for ukraine to ensure china's participation in the next peace summit, and in his opinion, beijing is a big player who is really able to influence russia, while, as evidenced by

sociology, which was published by the survey of the national democratic institute and the kyiv international institute of sociology. most ukrainians believe that ukraine should enter into negotiations with russia to try to achieve peace. 57% of respondents spoke in favor of negotiations. against 38. it is worth noting that a year ago the results were the opposite, only 33% were in favor of negotiations, 63% against. at the same time, 66% of respondents believe that ukraine should return the territory under its control by 2014, including donbass and crimea. there are much fewer options for an agreement involving certain territorial concessions. more than half of the surveyed ukrainians still, well

, mr. yevgeny, how can you explain what are in favor of negotiations with russia, although the negotiations with russia are about what, russia has issued an ultimatum to ukraine, what can be the subject of such negotiations? let's start with the first, with the first peace summit, which... its results give reason to count on the second, when africa remained for us like yanukovych, undiscovered, that is, we were supported by units, even though we tried african countries, representatives of african countries came and supported diplomatic efforts not only by ukraine. the communiqué of the peace summit, this is the first time, the second time, but why is it prepared by the head of the president's office, who does not have the authority to do so, and not by the minister of foreign affairs.

this is a simple question, in fact, we have a minister of foreign affairs who went through, well, together with the country, through quite difficult things, he is, well, he is called one of the favorites of volodymyr zelensky, even more so. why, well, that is, why the head of the office of the president, this seems to cause, well, some misunderstanding among our partners. third, you're absolutely right, and i've already noticed, look, now there is a situation, well, that is , putin's well-known ultimatum about four regions, yes, if we go to this ultimatum, then we will actually postpone it. just the defeat of ukraine in the war with russia, i deliberately say it in such a harsh way, because it is a reality, because if the russians

can cross the dnieper without a fight, then the further development of events, it can absolutely be negative for us, and why did we decide that russia will negotiate with someone when we see that they are east. keep pushing and do it hard enough, no counting the losses as large , much larger than in ukraine. why do we think that everything will be, well, our way, what grounds do we have for this? there are no grounds whatsoever, especially since piskov, putin's press secretary, says that there are legal nuances regarding the legitimacy of the ukrainian government when... he is asked about future negotiations or about zelensky's peace initiatives, and says that of course these legal nuances cannot be an obstacle to start.

serious negotiations, at the same time he added that no summit with the participation of russia is being prepared yet, still they constantly repeat, that, of course, we can, but with whom can we negotiate and conduct these negotiations, because zelensky, he is already the president whose powers have expired, but zelensky says that we are preparing a plan for november 24 peace, what do you think about it? of peace, these seven points, which were not in the first, will not be considered at the first peace summit, because i still cannot understand whether it will be a separate peace plan, whether it will be part of the first peace plan, or whether it will be part of a still new plan peace, and who has it to prepare, because zelenskyi says, we are with western partners, well, with western partners, and what is the peace plan or plan of action in

ukraine now? you know, mr. sergey, i have to confess that i only know about 10 points of zelenskyi, i am afraid that i do not belong to the majority in this matter, because i understand what these 10 points are and i consider them important from that point of view , that ukraine put them forward, but i don't know all the others, i'm sorry, i don't know these plans, i don't see a dialogue with society on how to end the war, i don't see public discussion about how we should act. and this is quite an unpleasant situation in my opinion, because we actually found ourselves, you know, well, here are the famous words of zelenskyi, that the citizens of ukraine should, so to speak, themselves come to the decision of whether territorial concessions are possible or not, we see from sociology that no, we have in this plan, sorry, i don't like to use

military terms, but this politico-medical schizophrenia, we believe that we have, we can go to negotiations, but we categorically against concessions, but the negotiations will involve concessions, i will tell you more that in world politics at the moment there is a practice of putting pressure on the weaker, not the stronger, if anyone does not know, this is a reality, and a reality that needs to be dealt with accordingly. but in the current situation, obviously the world also needs to understand what will happen next in russia's war against ukraine. the world is now watching what is happening in the middle east, which is where iran's announced hostilities are about to begin, announced in response to the destruction one of the leaders of hamas, and it is clear that everyone

is watching. what will happen in the united states of america, does this mean that the question, the ukrainian question of the future of peace or the end of the war in ukraine by russia, it is again postponed there until the spring of the 25th year, well, look, the question is not even that, the question is that , that the world saw that the united states is ready to negotiate with the current administration, the truth is with russia, but putin got who? their colleagues, yes, in fact, in exchange for ordinary people, well, hostages, let's say, hostages whom took yes, i agree, on hostages, and there may be 10, 20, new, 30 such hostages, well, belarus in general condemned absolutely, as somewhere someone from the belpol organization, belarusian police officers, said that absolutely, well...

none and well lost, you know, not the kind that doesn't understand, it's just clear that this exchange was made so that hamala harris and joseph biden could meet the americans, and we have rico krieger leading this german, well, i don't know, i'm far from to judge by appearance, but that propaganda film they showed... russians, you understand what the matter is, he is accused of hooliganism, and most likely it was the basis of the belarusian special services, that's the thing, spies are coming here, one, well, some classic, just illegal, classic, the killer krasikov, so , well what happens is actually just -