and the kuprin-liman grouping and the pokrovsky grouping. it's that simple. ugh. mr. oleksiu, thank you. i hope that we will have more opportunities and reasons to analyze what is happening now. a truly historic event. how not to cool. oleksiy hetman, a reserve major of the national guard of ukraine, a veteran of the russian-ukrainian war, joined the saturday political club, which continues and will definitely continue. with vitaly portnikov at the end of the current hour, and before that we will have a few more conversations with dear guests, igor eisenberg, professor of new york university from the states, and vadim polishchuk, historian, political observer, will talk about the situation in the middle east, don't switch. there are discounts until independence day on magne b6, 10% in pharmacies plantain bam. and

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the saturday political club continues, my name is khrystyna yatskiv, thank you for being with us and we continue to talk about the heart-breaking course of the russian-ukrainian war, events in kursk oblast, i emphasize once again that in the historical perspective since 1944, this is the first russian the federation is faced with the fact that it has problems of a military nature directly on its territory, and not, as they like to incite from time to time, incite military conflicts absolutely.

of an artificial nature on the territories of neighboring states, or states in general that can help them control a specific region. now i will be happy to join. to an important talk by ihor eisenberg, a professor at new york university, united states of america. mr. igor, i congratulate you, glory to ukraine. glory to the hero. greetings to you, ms. krystyna, greetings to all express viewers. already in a few days i wonder what has changed. we understand that for quite a long time, our key partner is the united states america, were very careful when it came to... the work of the defense forces of ukraine on the territory of the russian federation, at first this work was very veiled, that's how we talked about some incidents in bavovna, although we definitely understood what we were talking about. and then we began to insist that we need

to study the enemy's rear, because it is from there that they start their aggression, it is from russian territories that their planes take off, their convoys go from russian territories, and so on. and so on and had a cautious taboo from the united states on at least the application long-range weapons and weapons that can reach the locations we are interested in. now we are watching a real ground operation of the defense forces of ukraine in the kursk region, and we see a very, very, very restrained reaction of america to what is happening. i'll just quote the white house counsel. national security communications, john kirby, i think i'll leave room here to allow ukraine to talk one way or another about its military operations, we're in touch with our ukrainian counterparts, we're working to better understand what they're doing, what what are their goals their strategy. he refuses to characterize the situation in the kursk region,

explaining that it is worth waiting until washington has a better idea of ​​the events on the territory of the russian region, that is , even if we are not sure that we fully understand what is happening there. and this is a game, mr. igor, i.e. rhetorical figures, can you imagine a situation when this operation was planned without the agreement of a key partner. you know, i would add to what , say, the pentagon's deputy spokeswoman, sabrina singh, said, she just approved action of ukraine, said that ukraine has every right to defend itself, including what it is doing in the kursk region, as well as... it has problems with using american weapons for this, and the spokesman of the rain department said approximately the same thing matthew miller. i would say that it is not at all surprising to me, because you know, all the restrictions that the united states imposed, let's say, on

supplying ukraine with this or that weapon, or on the use of this or that weapon, they were due to the fact that what we all call there. escalation, such a euphemism, because in fact, of course, in the united states , escalation means an inadequate response from russia, that is, in the form of, say, the use of nuclear weapons against ukraine, and the united states, of course, always wants to avoid this, but i would, you know, i would mirror what your colleague vitaly bortnikov likes to call a tactic of peasants on the part of russia. that is, when russia thinks that it can cut off piece by piece of ukrainian territory from ukraine, but the west does practically the same, in particular the united states, constantly piece by piece, allowing ukraine to do more, sending ukraine more weapons, more types

of weapons, i think that the united states simply believes that by taking these steps gradually, and they are doing... they are achieving a very important thing, that is, that russia will not react inadequately, i am more than sure that this reaction of the united states to this operation of the armed forces in the kurt region, it testifies to this, that the american development is absolutely sure that there is no inadequate there won't be an answer, let's say, in the form of using nuclear weapons from russia, mr. igor, and we watched for a long time the transfer of specific weapons to ukraine, weapons that actually belong to, let's say, some european country, but the manufacturer of these weapons is the united states, then that country had to ask for permission from the united states to transfer these weapons to us.

now we are watching how in germany, accordingly, the head of the security committee declares that from the moment we handed over to ukraine tanks, even though they are of german production. these are already ukrainian tanks, then they can use them as they see fit, that is, this interesting moment is happening again, when, in principle, we don’t know, but they milk the good to... the good to what is happening, in your opinion, how will this affect the general situation, even of a political nature, in the united states itself, does it already have an appropriate response in the hearts of americans, who, besides all that, are also voters, they need to make appropriate decisions in the near future of an electoral nature this fall, in the united states it is an operation of the armed forces. oblast, it is very, yes, it is covered in the media, with details,

with very great details, there are many articles in the leading newspapers, and there are television reports , there are corresponding comments on television, there are articles on the websites of news tv channels, and where the key word is, here is humiliation putin, humiliating russia and condemning the actions of ukraine. that is, americans are accordingly perceived in this way, in terms of what this will mean for the american election campaign, then you know, foreign policy and generally everything that is done in the world is traditionally not the subject of a presidential election campaign in the united states, and this election campaign, well, it is practically no different from the previous ones, that is, it will also... revolve around internal affairs, around actually protecting democracy, or

opposing democracy around various social issues, around economic issues, economic policy, and this is what voters are most concerned about when they elect a new president, and there will be no changes here this year, i.e., say, the team of garis and tim walt. in recent days, they spoke in key states for elections, foreign policy matters were not discussed at all in their speeches, and this will be the case until the end of the election campaign, because the most important thing for americans is economic policy, social policy, and as long as there is such a confrontation between the forces led by trump and the liberal forces, then it is also a question of protecting democracy, or vice versa. not the defense of democracy, if you say what is meant by trump. ugh. mr. igor, we do

understand that we can expect a debate between donald trump and kamala harris in the near future, it may be a multi-stage debate. what are your expectations from this purely pre-election campaign, we understand that even without being official candidates from. of their parties, donald trump and joseph biden met at the debate, and this actually led to drastic, drastic changes in the situation, what can we expect now? debates in general, they have been held against the last 50 years by the national debate commission, and trump from the debate that this commission will organize , refused, a long time ago, that is, he said that he will not participate in such a debate, and the debate that was held between trump. and biden, which are also proposed to abc channels on september 10, now it will be

a debate between trump and caris, and this is a debate in a different format, that is, it is a debate without an audience in the hall, only with moderators, presenters and debaters, and will they be, i'm not sure, by the way, that they will be, because trump said just a week ago that he would not participate in any debate with harris, except just debate. possible on fox with audience participation, on thursday he said something diametrically opposed that he will participate in the sept. 10 debate hosted by abc. frankly speaking, i do not expect anything special, because the debate, actually, well, it is such a television product, which is well understood by television journalists, why such a television product is popular among viewers, and... voters, well, voters know their candidates anyway , and hardly a large number of voters thanks to the debate can

change your opinion about the candidates decide to vote for the wrong candidate that you planned to vote for, i think kamala harris has every chance to beat donald trump in a debate because you know, it 's going to be a debate, as kamalala herself suggests from a professional prosecutor with with... with a criminal who was convicted, no, not so, not too long ago, of 34 felonies by a jury, but i don't think that exactly... that could have any significant effect on voter sentiment, of course debate between trump and biden on june 27th, well they really had a big impact because joe biden blew that debate and it ultimately led to him dropping out, but in the

karis and trump debates, if they're going to happen, well that's not going to happen , that is, trump will be trump, he will... he will behave the way he always behaves, but if she prepares well for the debate, she will beat him, but, well, let's say hillary clinton also beat trump in the debate in the 16th year, but lost the election to, say, meath romney beat obama in the first debate in '12 but lost the election, ronald reagan definitely lost the debate in '84, walter mondale but won the election, well the debates don't decide the winners. after all , the winner is determined by the vote, it's interesting, you actually noticed and even slightly distinguished tv viewers and voters, as if they are two completely different categories that do not intersect, for me it is interesting from the point of view that in 2019 we are actually here in ukraine watched the elections in which television and actually the television activity

of our current president played a certain role and i'm sure... if it weren't for this plane, you could count on some high, high points there, but this is such a small remark, sorry, sorry if i can, i don't want to interrupt you, but i just want to add, the same thing is happening in the united states, but look, just on thursday , two events were happening at the same time: kamela harris was speaking at a meeting about the auto manufacturers' unions in detroit, and at the same time, trump was holding press conference, all tv channels broadcast live, what do you think trump's press conference, why? well, because it definitely allowed them to increase their rating, because many people, they, they willingly look at trump, even those who do not like him, but want to look, well, because they want to see something like this, unusual, and this ,

in my opinion, this is a problem, a big problem, because, well, people... watch tv, many people watch tv, but journalists should be responsible for that product, which they give out, and at least when the elections are held, still the tv channels should make sure that there is no advantage of one of the candidates on the tv airwaves, even if it brings ratings to the tv channels, i think that this is wrong, because it is necessary that tv channels positioned themselves as neutral as possible towards candidates for election positions. and finally, briefly, the united states and the situation in the middle east, the possibility of iran's response, in fact, to the events that took place last week, particularly in tehran, can we say that the united states is waiting and actually

knows, traditionally knows what to do in this situation, the united states, i think, is also waiting, and it is preparing for maybe a response from iran, but they are very active on the diplomatic front to prevent a major war, to prevent a possible response by iran, a possible attack by iran on israel, because the middle east is the kind of region where you can light a match and from that there will be such a fire that just, just it may turn into a third. world war, so of course the united states has absolutely no interest in it. and yes, the commander of the us central command, he, let's say, he was in israel, he discussed with the chief of the israeli general staff, the minister of defense, joint actions in the event of an iranian attack, but at the same time, the united states is making a lot of diplomatic efforts, they are doing, the united

states with iran does not have diplomatic relations, but through. intermediaries through countries that have relations with iran, the united states is trying to do everything possible to to prevent the flame of a very big war from breaking out there, which could absolutely have unpredictable consequences. mr. igor, thank you for joining the saturday political club, igor eisenberg, a professor at new york university from the united states, on the espresso tv channel, and continuing the topic. the development of events in the middle east and the possible response of iran, israel, to the events that took place in tehran, actually in the context of the inauguration. of the new president, so far there is information, in particular from telegraph, which refers to unnamed people assistants of the iranian president, the current

president of iran, massoud pazeshkian, offers less radical options in contrast to the islamic revolutionary guard corps, that is , there are certain differences in the events that will develop in the near future, if they will develop. queer tradition. sionally for more drastic actions, but the president has a more restrained view, about this and not only, we will talk now with vadym polishchuk, a historian, political commentator from israel, congratulations, mr. vadym, glory to ukraine, glory, good evening, yes, actually on which the way the situation is right now in israel, when we talk about on the one hand. hamas has been decapitated in a certain way, and on the other hand, we already understand that there are new contenders for leadership of a military and political nature, on the other

hand, hezbollah and the lebanese side, all this in the context of the threat from iran. i ask you to speak. well, the country, israel, is now waiting to see what iran and its proxy hizballah will dare to do. in this situation, or event, this persuasion on the part of the united states, to reduce intensity, maybe responses, and i also think that the idea of ​​persuading israel to reduce the intensity of the response to iran's response, because here, you know, the flywheel of responses can be spun, which, from the point of view of the united states, can lead to a major escalation, which for.. .the united states does not need to. from the point of view of hamas, there is already a leader, that is, the hamasites have decided on the direction of their movement, because the election

of sinvar as the head of the political wing that has united, that is, there used to be a political wing, there was a military wing, now all this happened in one person, and in fact it radicalized the situation. because sinwar is a man more drastic, more risky, more prone to some adventures and to hope that this will lead to a reduction in tension to the very agreement that the united states wants to reach on the hostages, and through this agreement to actually end the conflict in the gas and freeze. situation, israel does not agree to this, such a development, even if it goes to an agreement, but only on the conditions of a possible continuation in the gas liquidation

hamas as a structure, because only this can prevent a repetition of what happened on october 7. on the part of hizbollah, israel now understands that the existence of hizbollah in general threatens israel's investment, because of what we see. that such a security zone was created in the north, which was actually created by hezbollah, several large enough settlements were evacuated, a large number of israelis are now in temporary places, there with families, hotels, and this is unacceptable for israel, that this whole situation is preserved and even if achieved with hisbola there are no conditions, no... that these conditions will apply for a long time, and in this way these people will be able to return and feel safe , so in fact now israel

is interested in some kind of radical solution to the situation, and there are already discussions about this among experts and i i think so, that among the military and political leadership, and if our army had not actually acted as such a political party that... was not radical, but more, let's say, prone to compromises, i think it would have already started to be resolved in a more radical way . and when we talk about a more radical and version of the development of events, what is meant here , decipher, please, what it would look like, well, it would look like full-scale military operations in lebanon and the creation, well , not even up to the litani river, because the litani river is there , there from six to... 15 km, it is not enough for security, there would be more likely to come to beirut, as it was in the first lebanon war, and eliminate hizballah as well as

the military. structures, this is the weaponry that was brought there by iran in large quantities at that time quantities, all their caches are there, what they dug there and so on, well, just like that , now there is a window of opportunity to eliminate the iranian threat, including the iranian nuclear program, which managed to develop thanks to the policies of obama's democrats, biden for some kind of flirting with iran, and the impression is that they consider iran to be some kind of party that could, well, regulate some relations in the middle east, although in fact they actually radicalize and lead to such a flare-up of some conflicts, and this in my opinion, precisely the position of the united states, just as it behaved with russia, is wrong. this obama

reset and biden's appeasement of the aggressor, to prevent escalation, that is, they escalate as they want, and russia and iran, and their people , countries that oppose them, must constantly restrain themselves, and thus it inflames the situation even more. mr. vadim, as we understand, iran is looking for support, or at least it is currently enlisting the support of its allies and... the same goes for russia, because, frankly, why then may require visits of quite high-ranking, but already ex-russian military officials to iran, for example, and putin in general, let's recall, urged iran to limit its revenge against israel, reuters wrote about it. will russia openly support iran in any actions of this country in relation to

israel? at times, will she still be cautious, well, i don’t know how she can support even more, well, unless these military eyes, which are currently russian in syria, they will act as a party to the conflict on the side iran, this is the only possible involvement of russia is even greater than now, that is, they support them in all, let's say, international organizations, they support them militarily, just as iran supports russia, they are military allies, and if ... someone in israel still has doubts about this, then i don’t know what else russia should do, well, what should it do with its planes from syria, well, it’s good that they are weak compared to the israeli military, air force, that is , israel would repel this attack, and they understand it well, but they help with what they can, they teach iranians, iranians teach russians, that is, there is love in measure, as they

say. well, there is a lot of information of varying degrees of confirmation, but still there is information in the world media that russia is supplying iran, possibly s-400, and iran, for its part , is even insisting on receiving su-35 flanker fighters, yes, yes, these are those the su-35 itself, like the new fighters of the russian federation, with which, purely theoretically, the f-16 can meet in some aerial combat, well, but... another question, russia can provide iran weapons, this means that in the hands of the russian federation there are fewer weapons to attack ukraine, but in any case, as we understand it, it should not be too profitable for russia to escalate from iran right now, right? well, in principle, this is to be seen, first of all, if there is an escalation around iran, it will once again

divert attention from. russia's war with ukraine is good for putin in principle. on the other hand, thanks to this , oil prices, which have recently started to decrease, can jump, and this is also beneficial for russia. therefore, why is it not profitable, any is profitable aggravation in the middle east, it's normal for them. and if taiwan and china get involved, it is even more normal for russia. so she will do anything for... they can say anything, there, well, lie to them, it's, you know, a normal thing, just like with iran, but you have to look, you even see, they for them , this situation with the houthis actually turned out to be quite disadvantageous, including economically, due to the fact that they are forced now, due to the fact that the houthis fire at any ships that pass through the gulf of aden, through the red sea, in

russian, with russian... ships are now going around africa.