americans, today i welcomed volodymyr karamurza and his family to the white house to celebrate his return to america. volodymyr spent 2.5 years of unjust imprisonment in russia for speaking out against russia's war in ukraine, today his family is whole again. how do you perceive, mr. volodymyr, the efforts of the united states of america to find good russian and... according to tradition , probably since the time of the soviet union, to create or try to maintain this image of some group of people who can return to homeland and change everything there, this is such a soviet mythology, i have the impression that biden supports a certain such, well, the phantom of sovietism and soviet dissidence, because... he sees that putin lives by this, and

biden creates a mirror for him, such a mirror, in which putin would see himself, so to speak, on the one hand as the successor of the sovka, sovka traditions, and on the other hand, well , he felt powerful, just like the soviet party bonzas, but we perfectly understand that the current russian federation - it's... it's quite not the soviet union, secondly, if we warm dissidents, or even create such a network of dissidents, we vividly recall the dissident solzhenitsyn or the dissident malinkovich, who carried such nonsense and such chauvinistic, so to speak, heresy that it was not stretched to the head, but in in principle , it is important for democracy to support any... any opponents

of the current such a fascist russian regime in the hope that something democratic will grow from these seeds, i doubt it, mr. vladimir, but the united states of america is trying to flirt and constantly flirt and to show this pseudo-russian opposition, and this is also, well, the creation of some... false world, because as long as joseph biden will show whether there is kamala harris or, donald trump, as long as they will show russian oppositionists and say: look, these are the people who can stand up to putin, until the world will believe that putin, it is impossible to remove putin, well, how impossible, to connect with the entire people and carry out denazification.

de-rasification, deputization, because putin is bad, and there are good russians, isn't washington now sending wrong messages to the whole world? well, it's not really creating an alternative to putin, it's just trying to protect those who challenge putin, it's, it's a little bit of a different logic, the united states basically uh, well... understands russia today, and they, they think like her encapsulate, and this regime, how to balance this regime so that it does not finally dissolve into the chinese regime, so that it remains at least semi-subjective, because china, china sees, looks at russia as an instrument of competition with the united states , but... no states, but in

the united states there is one, well, it is cultivated the opinion that if russia is pulled out of the mouth of the chinese dragon, then sooner or later russia will democratize. first of all, russia cannot democratize, because for 30 years of the, well, spam that was sent to rnizky russians, they simply reformatted their population, and this population does not think, uh, in democratic categories, it is, by the way, very , it is very soviet-style, paternalistic dependent, that is, it looks at the state as the only regulator and feeder of them, that is, this population in its mass is not independent, it needs paternalistic accompaniment, and because of this it cannot but put a price on its own life, putin must go and... die for putin,

they go because they can get money for it, they think that this is a lottery game, someone died , and i, and i will slip, and i will survive and be. to have 2,000 dollars in an account there or something else, this is such an absolutely infantile way of thinking, but so is russian, this is a racist fascist elite, it also thinks with such infantile categories, mr. volodymyr, let’s go back to ukraine, because zelenskyi made several statements, in particular, regarding the fact that decisions should be made on the spiritual independence of ukraine from russia, and apparently he is talking about... the draft law that will ban the activities of russian religious organizations on the territory of ukraine, mykola knyazhytskyi, people's deputy of ukraine, wrote today about the fact that the committee on humanitarian and information policy supported the amendments to the final version

of the government bill on the banning of the uocp, and, as knyazhytskyi writes, the committee unanimously voted for the latest amendments, sought compromises, but not retreat. drank from fundamental issues. we will begin the next plenary session of the verkhovna rada with consideration of this issue. well, zelenskyi also announced that among the urgent bills with which president zelenskyi addressed the verkhovna rada, there is a demand to deprive traitors and collaborators of state titles and awards. let's listen to what zelentsky said. everyone who serves putin or excuses him. war or helps evil, does not deserve to keep everything that was celebrated by the ukrainian state, traitors who fled to russia after february 24, collaborators working for the war, all criminals who served the russian state, they should

be deprived of any ranks and awards in ukraine. is it correct, mr. volodymyr, i understand that on the eve of another day of independence... ukraine will meet this day with a decision to ban religious organizations that are connected to russia and annul the titles of hero of ukraine, yuriy boyk, and people's artists, anna lorak, taisi povaliy, well , other people who fled outside of ukraine. boyka did not escape, but he is a hero of ukraine. perhaps after all, will he fall under the category that will allow him to be deprived of this title? i will remind you that on the day of the great russian aggression , february 24, the mentioned boyko was on the air before solov'ov. already, already in kyiv

, houses were bombed, people died, and boyko for some reason decided that he would talk about the peoples of the brothers on the russian airwaves. so... in fact, if the government had been consistent, then the opzh faction, or rather, even the vestiges of the opzh faction, would no longer exist either in the verkhovna rada or in the councils of various levels, in particular the councils of the otg and in the councils of the district and regional and city. but we see that only in ukraine, in general, these groups of deputies in the councils of various levels were not even disbanded, but removed from the vote. even in the kyiv city council, the opz faction remains and it votes in the same way along with its servants, well , all over ukraine, i will interrupt you, sorry, more than 400 opz deputies were elected throughout ukraine in 2020, and they remained, that is, they

were only repainted, well, they did not always remain, if they remained, then in many councils they were, well, deprived of them. voice, that is, they formally remain, because, well, let's put it this way, the authorities took a strange line of behavior in relation to banned parties, some, some smaller parties, for example, sharia, they were almost expelled from the councils, but opzh remains, in many councils, in the kyiv region, the first fastist voted to deprive them of the right to vote , well... and so they remain in the councils of all levels, so if the government is consistent, it should also give such a gift to ukrainians. do you think that the decision on the ocp will be resolved next week, briefly if possible.

the problem is that with this law the speaker stefanchuk has cheated the opposition several times already . and by the way, and well, in those cases too, the committee. correctly voted for the introduction of this law, and then stefanchuk found an excuse not to introduce it. well, it's interesting, because , by the way, they publicly promised europeans in front of the whole of ukraine. solidarity to start a new meeting with this draft law, this is an intrigue, let's see if they will deceive the ukrainians or not? thank you, mr. volodymyr, it was volodymyr tsybulko, political expert, people's deputy of ukraine of the fourth convocation, friends, we continue to work live on the tv channel, let's look at the interim results of our television poll, today we ask you about the following: can the ukrainian orthodox church become independent from the russian orthodox church, what? 51% think so, 49% no, well, that is 50 to 50. when you sleep on

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the qr code and order right now. there are discounts until independence day at eden. 25% in psarynyk, bam and oskad pharmacies. there are discounts until independence day on detoxyl tablets 15% in plantain bam and oskad pharmacies. an unusual look at the news. good health, ladies and gentlemen, my name is mykola veresin, sharp presentation of facts and competent opinions. for example, if mykola veresin had done so, he would have gone to prison. a special look at the events in ukraine, so it is not necessary to say that the fish is rotting from the head. no, not off the top of my head. but beyond it. and then who is china? me, my heart hurts. all this in an informational marathon with mykola veresny. saturday 17:10, sunday. 18:15 at espresso. hundreds of thousands of square meters of damaged property,

apartments, houses that need to be rebuilt, about the situation with reconstruction in different regions of ukraine, about people's rights, opportunities and personal experience. this is what olga's house looked like last year, and this is what it looks like now. i am not spending money at the moment. however, how to unite the country in the process of recovery in the project program of reconstruction and development of cities, every saturday. at 18:30 for espresso. congratulations, friends, live on the espresso tv channel. the second part of the verdict program. my name is serhii rudenko, and in this part we will talk about the following. kursk a nightmare for putin. the armed forces of ukraine in... are successfully developing an offensive operation on the territory of russia, which will lead to

the desacralization of the kremlin dictator. an attack on the northern stream. american journalists accuse the ukrainian side of sabotage. who benefits from the spread of anti-ukrainian hysteria in the world? unpacking kyrylenka, the head of the antimonopoly committee, who used to manage donetsk region. accused of illegal enrichment, how do officials manage to acquire wealth during the war? we will talk about all this in the next 45 minutes i remind you that we work not only on the live air of the tv channel, but also on our platforms in youtube and facebook, for those who are currently watching us there live, subscribe to our pages, take part in our survey, today we ask you about the following, can the ukrainian orthodox church and the ukrainian orthodox church become independent from the russian orthodox church, because we are all waiting for a decision, and

president zelenskyi has already announced that there will be spiritual independence of ukraine from russia, we hope that it will be so, that is why we are asking. you: can the uoc become independent from the russian orthodox church? yes, no, everything is quite simple on youtube, if you have a different opinion, please write it in the comments, if you are watching us on tv, pick up your smartphone or phone and vote on 0800 211 3801. if you think that the ukrainian orthodox church can become independent from the russian orthodox church, no, 0800 211 382. all calls to these numbers are free, vote. at the end of the program, we will sum up the results of this vote. today we have a traditional journalism club and i would like to introduce my colleagues, this is olga len, a political viewer, espresso presenter, author and host of the war information chronicles program. olga, hello. congratulations. and bohdan butkevich, journalist, radio host, author and host of two youtube channels, cernet and showbiz. bohdan, i congratulate you, thank you for joining

the conversation. we have some communication problems, i hope. that we will have a connection with bohdan, please check it is for sound engineers, maybe there are some problems on the line, well, as colleagues, we ask our tv viewers whether the ukrainian orthodox church can become independent from the russian orthodox church, let's in the format of a blitz poll, we will go through this question and ask you and hear your thoughts about what do you think can the opc become independent from the russian orthodox church? olga? question? well, they had for this, well, i don't know, six years, yes, since receiving tomos. and somehow it hasn't been possible until now, so, i don't know, i think it's just somehow time to admit that this is a systemic,

systemic organization that is, well, subordinate to another country, that's all. well, i understand. that it may be that the uoc will have no other option than to become independent from the russian orthodox church, or at least to join the ocu. bohdan, you hear us, okay, i hope you join in. i hear, i see, everything great, great, great, everything, it's already much better, because they had some problems with the sound at the entrance. in your opinion, can the opc become independent from the russian orthodox church? well, this... how is it possible, how can it become independent from the body, for example, the right hand, well, that is, it is impossible, in principle, it is exactly the same story here, you understand, and well, by the way, i would pay attention, that really, if there are people left in the uoc who, for example, well, let's say so, until now, i don't know for what reason they are still there, frankly speaking, that is, before there could be an argument that they didn't understand

something there, something else, now actually, well, i honestly don't know, well, let's imagine that there are such people, well... yesterday, it seems, epiphanius made a wonderful appeal to the head of this structure, frankly speaking, i simply do not understand what else can be said, that is, everyone understands everything perfectly, all masks have long been removed, and therefore it seems to me that if these people want to continue to be in the orthodox church, the ukrainian orthodox church , then they just need to unite with peciu, actually stupidity of moscow, i don't even want bad words. you say that monetization on youtube should not be spoiled for you and that help does not come to you, but okay, look, the stupidity of muscovites lies in the fact that they could, for example, take some very dangerous step, well , just imagine, but they take, for example, the moscow roc church and give their tomos, it would be absolutely illegitimate, they had no right to give it, but imagine, they take and give their tomos to the uoc type, well

, imagine such a step, that was would it's not really dangerous, but it would be a situation in which, well, i would say. for some morons there would be some choice, but moscow is so stupid that it cannot come up with anything, except for what it is doing now, so except for wasting time, so i am sure that of course no uoc will exist in this form , the one who wants to continue to be a priest, the one who, if he passes the sieve of boron and purification, will enter the ocu, but the one who wants to be a part of the russian orthodox church, well, he will continue to be one, i have no doubt that there somewhere at home in some crazy person's apartment. to the moron, they will gather there, i don't know, tell that they are a catacomb church, like the first christians, i don't doubt it, but i'll repeat myself, i 'm sure i'll repeat myself, thank god, you know that our... enemy , he is very cruel, merciless, cynical, but , fortunately , there is no misogyny or strategic thinking in him, and this is very good, so they should simply be banned and forgotten as terrible, let's

hope that next week the verkhovna rada of ukraine will vote in the second reading the draft law, which has been lying around for a long time, and this is basically the political will of the current government, it is clear that no matter how much president zelenskyy says that we will now vote for spiritual independence or declare it from russia, but this spiritual independence... it would have been possible a long time ago was to announce and then nod in the direction of the parliament and say that it is not a good parliament that does not do this, well, this is very strange, despite the fact that ruslan stefanchuk is an associate of zelenskyi, the servant of the people is the parliamentary majority, well, who is there to complain about, if the mirrors are still zelenskyi, that is, he looks at stefanchuk, but he sees himself there, well , that's about it, colleagues, let's move on to the main topic, probably the last one... 11 days is the offensive on the kurshchyna of the armed forces of ukraine. there are a lot of comments with the beginning of this special operation, or operation, military

operation of ukraine. at first, ukraine did not comment at all, mainly the rashists and their propaganda channels and z-channels in telegram very actively covered this event, but ukraine has already completely legitimized this whole information. history, is it possible to believe that with this operation a completely different story began for putin, for putin in the world context, in the context of how he is perceived, how russia is perceived, perhaps it was a discovery for someone that the boots of ukrainian soldiers can walk on the territory of the russian federation , and it is obvious that putin himself... did not know that this could happen, but this is a desire to show that we are stronger here and we are so formidable, we will give it to everyone now, and god forbid, someone will come to our

territory, or will bite these territories that we already occupied, well, i mean the russians, that this story is already over, that there is nothing to make this propaganda out of nothing, when a foreign army enters your country and there is nothing to say. and there is nothing to be done, but it is simply necessary to admit that the myth of the omnipotence of the russians and their army has simply been destroyed, olga, well , it does not happen all at once, of course, i would say this is one more step, you know, for the decentralization of the russian government and putin and russia as such, but it is obvious that it is far away. we are from the moment that we can say, yes, everything happened, no, it did not happen, because for this to happen, the process must be long, er, what was formed even there in the cities

of the world elite there and in general, there are some various international organizations about the fact that russia has some special status, it was not formed in one day, well, accordingly , it will not disappear in one day, that is why this operation is needed. to be both longer and definitely successful, and you have to make efforts for this, that is, it is not that bad some kind of thing happened, and besides , to say that after that putin's power there will collapse, no, it won't collapse, well, it won't collapse like that, it didn't collapse after prigozhin and after that it won't collapse at one moment, that's undermines, of course, his personal power, this... and reduces its possibilities, and this leads us, perhaps most likely, to some form of coup d'état in russia, but such, you know, a palace coup. i do

not absolutely believe that it will be some kind of uprising of the masses, because if you look, well, there are the latest polls, well as much as we can generally assume that there may be some polls in russia, but it was conducted on august 9, 11 by the foundation. public opinion, it was issued literally on the 15th, that is, just about, and what do you think, after everything that happened, only 25% of russians there said that yes, they began to behave worse there, they believe that something somehow the authorities russia is doing something wrong, 25%, what can i tell you, it's nothing in the grand scheme of things, that is , it's not so much like that, at the same time, you need to understand that, for example,... they are generally interested in the war and everything that is happening, every fifth russian, up to four , it was indifferent, and remains

indifferent. well, that is, what is the russian government based on in general, it is, firstly, on total and absolute learned helplessness, we have seen this, if we look at the inclusion of all the judges that were made by ukrainian tv channels, where they are sitting in the basement, i say, well, i guess putin does not know, what is happening, that the local authorities abandoned us, well, you understand, but at the same time they just lie to our eyes, that is exactly, you know, the most disgusting thing happened there when they they say: you are aware that ukraine was shelled from your territory there, the war is going on against ukraine, you invaded ukraine, they, well, i don’t know, i can’t hear well there, or something else like that, we didn’t know anything there, well, well, of course, it's all full-blown, but it must be understood that this passivity of the population, in principle, allows the russian authorities to hold on long enough, well, for a long time, and accordingly,

in order to break it. the process should be longer and i would say the invasion deeper, so that's my impression, thank you olga, bohdan, well, against the background of what is happening in kurshchyna, we see how, after all, our western partners are talking about the fact that, well, what did you expect? put an end to history. putin's russia, and to help us put this point more actively, because they , after all, probably hope that in some format putin will still step down from power or withdraw troops from the territory of the ukrainian state, here they also brought oppositionists to the west , biden meets with volodymyr karamburza and his family, and

you see, there is a horo. or russians, why do ukrainians and ukraine have enough strength and opportunities to begin the end of putin's russia already on the territory of the russian federation, while our western partners do not. well, it seems to me that it is a little more complicated here, well, the easiest thing now is to publish another filipica on the subject of a weak west there, which lacks eggs and everything else, but everything is a little more complicated, i would say, you understand, well, that is, on the one hand, yes. definitely no eggs in any sense because well, in a certain sense, they can even be understood, you know, people decided that they would fight more, you know, full conflicts after two world wars and a completely destroyed europe, in the second world war, they just don’t want to, but for us it’s very it's unpleasant, but on the other hand, imagine the third generation of people there, which lives without big warriors, and when they go to war, there are only some,

you know, small ones. determined by place and desire, and actually only those who want to go to her go, well, that's ok, but, now the second point, we have to understand one more thing, well, of course there is the fear of a certain nuclear confrontation, plus don’t forget that russia has always invested very, i would say, effectively in creating the image of such a scarecrow, and putin himself does it all the time, but i will tell you that there is a third moment, which is actually also in my opinion very. look, they actually think to themselves that well, first of all, yes, look, let's just understand one important thing for ourselves, that western civilization has worked out for itself after the second world war and the first world war such a simple history, why do we constantly shout de-escalation, fu-fu-fu, what kind of crap is this and so on, but you understand, here they are twice, the first world war in general, as the researchers wrote there, really no one wanted war, but it it happened, yes, why, because no one wanted to stop this escalation, and everything ended, of course, with what it ended, the second

world war. well, we tried, like, too , no, well, we tried to de-escalate incorrectly, but in fact, you still need to de-escalate so that there is no big bin, that is, you understand, well from their point of view, they may be right, of course, it is another matter that if they also perceive russia as a great enemy, here we are approaching the most, probably unpleasant story, and this is primarily what we are talking about, for sure, about the americans, although also about europeans and the same germans, first of all, who lived with the russians for 50 years according to the principle of vandel durhandel, i.e. let's trade and that's why no one is for... wants to fight, that was the policy, starting from around the end of the 60s years of the last century, and the americans, they have a slightly different phobia, they well, how can i say, they also believe that, like, this is how they won the cold war, no direct clashes with the soviet union, only some peripheral stories, or stories where it is possible to act through some, well , let's say this, spacers , yes, then it will be ok, and then this is the result, they are basically repeating the same story now.