well, we are approaching the 9th, at the ninth minute of silence, let's honor the memory of those ukrainians whose lives were cut short by russian aggression. let's observe a moment of silence in memory of the ukrainian military and civilian citizens of ukraine who died in the war started by russia.

the verkhovna rada voted to ban the uoc -mp, at least that's how the authors and supporters of the law formulate it. during this night, we took a closer look at the document and analyzed who voted how. in fact, the law does not directly prohibit the activity of this or any other religious organization. so what did the people's deputies vote for? by the way, it took almost a year to find votes for this law. the opposition recently even blocked the podium to speed up the process. zelensky personally, according to zmi sources, joined the faction meeting via zoom and gave the task of banning the uocmp. conditionally, the majority were persuaded to vote for, but not everyone could be convinced. 10 servants never

voted, or abstained, or marked their absence, although they were in the hall. why even the presidential political forces are against it such changes, what will this law affect and what will happen to the uoc mp? this is svoboda ranok, my name is ka- kateryna nekrecha, join us, let 's get started. be sure to share your impressions of the adoption of this bill in the comments, what it may affect and write it. on the radio svoboda channel under our broadcast. so, the russian church was banned in ukraine, the day before the verkhovna rada of ukraine passed a law banning the activities of aggressor-religious organizations affiliated with the country. that is , in fact, it is about the activities of the ukrainian of the orthodox church, which until may 2002, 2022, i'm sorry, was called the church of the moscow patriarchate. in particular, the law stipulates that from now on the state will have the right to conduct a religious examination of the activities of such organizations. to

check whether they are not subject to, are not influenced by russia, if such violations are detected, the state will be able to stop their activities through the court. 265 people's deputies supported the law in the second, i.e., final reading, but four more people's elected representatives declared that they also voted for, but their cards did not work at the time of voting. the document will enter into force in a month, and religious organizations suspected of singing workers with the russian orthodox church will have another nine months to sever spiritual ties with moscow, says the chairman of the verkhovna rada of ukraine, ruslan stefanchuk. a number of politicians and public figures in ukraine welcomed the adoption of this law, calling it a historic event, but there are already those who see it as religious persecution. for example, boxer vasyl lumachenko said that those who voted for this law do not know what they do and... that he himself is happy to live in times

when true faith is tested. in the ukrainian orthodox church itself, the adoption of this law was also equated with the banning of the church in the soviet union, they say, this is exactly what lenin did when he came to power. i will remind you that until recently the ukrainian orthodox church was called the church of the moscow patriarchate. in may of the 22nd year, it abdicated from this prefix of the mp, and having adopted a new statute, announced its independence from... independence, however, in moscow at that time they declared that the unity between maintained by the russian orthodox church and the ukrainian orthodox church, at the beginning of 2023 the state service for ethnopolitics and freedom of conscience, after carrying out a religious examination based on the new statute of the uoc mp, confirmed that there was no real break between this church and the roc proper. i will also add that the security service of ukraine has informed. that since the beginning of the full-scale

invasion of the russian federation , criminal proceedings have been opened against more than a hundred clergymen of the uoc mp, almost 50 of them already reported even about... suspicion, and 26 of them received court sentences. mykyto potoraev, people's deputy, chairman of the committee of the verkhovna rada of ukraine on humanitarian and information policy, joins our broadcast. welcome to our broadcast, thank you for joining. good morning, thank you for the invitation. mr. mykyta, to begin with, let's clarify, this is a statement from the media headlines, from many posts about the fact that the uoc mp was banned, do i understand correctly? that it is not quite correct, because the adopted law, directly it does not prohibit the activity of this church, but it provides certain opportunities through the work of a special commission, through inspections and courts to make it impossible for the opcmp cells to operate. please explain this point. yes,

please, it is not completely correct, or almost completely incorrect, to say so, but this law is a logical continuation of the policy of separation. of all ties with the aggressor state, which policy ukraine has consistently pursued since 2014, since the beginning of russia's war against ukraine, and when it comes to europe, well, precisely in the last resolution of the parliamentary assembly the council of europe says that the russian orthodox church, the so-called russian orthodox church, actually disguises itself only as a... religious organization, it is part of the state russian totalitarian mechanism, so of course what should be tolerated is any presence, overt, hidden, actually hostile mechanism in our country,

which defends itself with all its might from this invasion, from this aggression, well, it is absolutely impossible and unacceptable, the president also spoke about it. zelenskyi, other ukrainian politicians spoke about it, the head of the office spoke about it of the president of ukraine, andriy yermak, and they stated absolutely everything clearly and correctly in their statements that this is not about faith, that it is not about religion, it is precisely about our struggle with the enemy, and the so-called russian orthodox church is obviously an enemy organization, part of the enemy state, and precisely. therefore, the law prohibits it, as for what the ukrainian orthodox church is, a new study will be conducted on this matter in accordance with the law, of course, what can be used there, i think that the examination that you reminded the viewers and listeners of now will be used , i want

only to emphasize that both from the point of view of the so-called roc itself, the ukrainian orthodox church is a part of it, and from the point of view of all other orthodox churches. i am a little surprised that our media has not yet appeared, let's say, an interview or some comments from other orthodox churches in the world, there are 14 of them, so from their point of view, the uoc is not an independent church. and the part of the russian orthodox church, i think that it should somehow lead us to certain thoughts and conclusions, so in fact, in fact, in these ten months , the russian orthodox church has to... decide what path it will take next is going to go to ukraine, what fate does she choose for herself and for her parishioners, because of course there is a path of confrontation, radicalization, already open, let's say, work and

support of the enemy, and there is a path, well, a more moderate one, there are two options, they can really break ties with moscow. with the kremlin, so they will have certain problems with their recognition in the world of international orthodoxy, but by the way, according to the conclusions of ukrainian religious scholars, they will not completely lose their canonicality, uh, and, for example, such sacraments as baptism or there church marriage, they will have the right to do and they will be recognized, and other things, well, let's not delve into it now, the main thing is that they are not in... respond to the call of metropolitan epiphany, head of the orthodox church of ukraine, to resume dialogue and start all over still the process of unification, of course, it would be in the interests

of the ukrainian people, whom they serve, as they say, if you are the church of the ukrainian people, then please, then it is in the interests of the people to be united in ukraine. autocephalous local church, well, so are they earlier they answered that you can go to us, we understand what the position is, we will continue to quote on the air, to them this means to the roc, mykyta, i just want to clarify when the ban sounds, that is, the churches, and the uoc mp, what does this mean, because it means that the locks on the doors of the temple and everything do not let these priests in there, in practice, it is not like that, nine months are given for what you said that they should break their ties ties, spiritual and any other with the russian orthodox church, yes, but in practice now during these nine months, the services will continue, the premises occupied by the clergy and representatives of the small church there in

ukraine, they will continue to work there and carry out their work, and during this time , as i understand, the commission will work, and if it detects certain violations , will address this to the court, and the court will then specifically ban specific uoc-mp representative offices there, do i understand correctly? look, we don't ban ukrainian religious organizations, we ban them from having connections with... the state aggressor, what are we doing, of course, they will serve, they will work, no one will prevent them from doing this, but if later, after nine months, it is discovered that this is not actually a ukrainian religious organization, but a part of russian, then according to the court, the court can make only one decision to terminate the activity of such an organization and then, according to the legislation of this law, our general legislation, the process of liquidation of such an organization will simply be launched. that is, it will simply cease to exist in the future, but again, this is not a ban, this

is what the russian orthodox church lobbyists in the united states are speculating, trying to speculate on, or there in europe, when they say that religious organizations are banned in ukraine, no, no, we banned an enemy foreign religious organization, banned, banned connections with it, banned being a part of an enemy foreign religious organization. if it is established that someone wants to remain a part of this pseudo-church called the roc, then yes, then, according to the court decision , such a sanction as termination of activity will be applied, everything is very simple, but not for faith, not for religion, but for connection with the enemy, well, in fact, we recorded, my colleague recorded an interview with kliment from the uoc and we we will show further. on the air, he also talks about what is called political persecution, that is, this is

an important point, but we will let the audience listen, that is, what we started with, that the title, relatively speaking, is prohibited by the uocp, it is not is quite correct, but these connections are prohibited, and there will be a commission, and the courts will find certain violations of this draft law. now let's talk about the political aspect, and because the adoption of this draft law was not an easy task, after its adoption in the first reading until the second almost... a year has passed and let's talk about the numbers, because you may have seen on social networks that they even make lists of who voted how from the people's deputies to know in their faces, so to speak, i saw such posts, and here are four of the servants of the people of your colleagues, they voted against, three abstained, 15 did not vote, 38 were absent, that is, a total of 60 servants the people did not vote for the adoption of this draft law, we know that a significant part of you... hesitated whether to vote at all, why this happened and whether they have,

in your opinion, do they have any valid arguments, or do they not share the vision of the president in this aspect , maybe they are parishioners of the orthodox church, what is the reason? there are handsome ones, there are directly clergymen in the rank of deacons, graduates of the seminary at the uocp, so there are people who simply haven't figured it out, unfortunately. in the essence of the law, who believe that this means somehow is connected with faith, with religion, eh, or they didn't want to accept, well, those are the explanations, i think that all your listeners and viewers are now, i think that, well, they accepted it normally when i explain it, that it's not about faith , not about religion, in the opc itself, i want to emphasize that everything is not so simple there, there is a radical group that does not recognize the ocu, it. does not even recognize the ecumenical patriarchate, well, they already broke relations with

the patriarch of constantinople, the ecumenical patriarch, bartholomew, in chorus with the russian orthodox church of their time, and here it is a radical group that is not only with moscow, they do not speak with moscow, they are deceiving, there is such a radical group in the servants of the people that is very attached to moscow, 60 deputies still did not say yes to this bill, i want you i'm talking about the situation in the ooc, i'm talking about the ooc and those of our deputies who focus on this and that group of radicals, there are considerations, uh, uh, and that's why, actually. these 175 votes, which the faction gave, are actually more, because in my opinion we had two or two statements about malfunctioning of the equipment, then this is absolutely normal the result, in principle, we do, well, we give no more than 200-210 votes, we usually do not give more than 200, but there will be some consequences

for these deputies, for those who did not vote, for example, danylo gotmantsev, he was as if absent. as i understand it, in the system, but he was in the hall, because after the adoption of this procurement project, he spoke even from the podium, will there be any consequences for your colleagues in the faction, because the president himself is in favor of this bill being adopted, he met with the faction there, even more so maybe in a modest format, but still, and he also probably presented some of his own arguments, look, well, the support of the president was one of those things that finally changed the situation in favor of this law, if it were not for his unconditional direct support, we would have would, well, more problems, much more, that is why this draft law was voted in the first place thanks to the direct support of the president of ukraine. as for the sanctions against those people, well, listen, i am in this sense, well,

a democratic person, yes, so i think that everyone has the right... to have their own political views, one cannot only betray the state, well, i fought for this law, starting with its appearance, even even i fought for the very idea of ​​such a law when there was no government law yet draft law, no, even mykola knyazhytskyi has not submitted his draft law yet, i always advocated for it to be done, especially, mr. mykyta, the more you advocated for it, you talk about the ideological component shared by many ukrainians, the fact that you said at the beginning of our conversations

someone just makes a mistake, and people have the right to make a mistake, and by the way, people who hesitated, you mentioned danylo hetmantsev, but he really didn’t come, it’s just that he wasn’t there, he spoke later, but no, he left, then, well, well, really, well, this is, you know, also a position that, yes, i understand that it is for many listeners and viewers now, well, irritation, maybe yes, but this is also a position, well, this is an eloquent position, let's say so, so that not a single person was sure, well, at least he didn't come, no pressed the yellow or red one, that's right, he just didn't come, that is, he's not sure, well, in his positions, by the way, he repeatedly emphasized that he is a parishioner of the ocu, and not, not the nopt, and yet with

all this, with to all this, he has such an attitude towards... this law, he believed, i spoke with him, he believed that , in his view, the state should not, in his view, hesitate, that, therefore, the sbu should deal with the treason of collusion , i explained to him, and it was not only him, but i and many other people who stand and still stood before yesterday, and they continue to stand in such positions, i explained that friends, this is not, look, this is again not about religion, it is not even about the uoc law. well, in this part, in this part, this law about the roc, well, how can you support gundyaev, well, how can you support tolerating gundyaev and his pseudo -church, a terrorist organization, well, not a terrorist, criminal, criminal organization, but no, after all, this is a question of faith, religion,

no, i say, no, it’s not about that, and in general, the russian orthodox church is not about faith, not about religion, well... you they also quoted, so the president, and andriy yermak even more sharply expressed himself about what it is, the so-called russian orthodox church, well , it is clear to everyone that it is not a church, that it is just a criminal organization masquerading as a church, well as well as the russian putin regime, this is not where, this is not the state, thank you, this is your position is clear, well , you see, you had conversations with some of your colleagues, they are obviously for... the result is that the law really approved nikita poturaev, people's deputy of ukraine, chairman of the committee svoboda ranok was a guest of the verkhovna rada of ukraine on humanitarian and information policy. thank you a few days before the adoption of this law in ukraine, the primate of the orthodox church of ukraine, epiphany , appealed to metropolitan onufry, the primate of the ukrainian orthodox church of the moscow patriarchate, and all believers of this

church with a call for a dialogue about unity. did anyone respond to the call and what will happen to the clergy and congregation of the ukrainian orthodox church? my colleague bohdan logunov talked about this with ankhendrite abraham lotysh, vicar of the holy assumption kyiv pechersk lavra, who himself... came from the uocp to the orthodox church of ukraine in 2023. let's listen. what will the orthodox church of ukraine do, what will happen to the dioceses, uoc, mp during the next nine months? the law will enter into force in almost a month. the government gives the opportunity for nine months to make up your own mind. of the moscow patriarchate, where they should be, although there was enough time for them to decide long ago, we understand that these people,

unfortunately, they still show their position, support for the moscow patriarchate, but this decision will be up to them, and i am sure that in nine months everything will be normalized in the church as well. life in ukraine, it will move in a completely different way, i.e. in another direction, and today is this historic day, which once again tells us that we are on the right path to unity and the unification of all orthodox churches. the next nine months, i understand, this is supposed to be a transition period or whatever it's called, what tasks the ukrainian church is now setting before itself what... it will do in the next period, to which next step in this long path to go, you know, the orthodox church of ukraine

even before the banning of this draft law, which was voted today, supported by the verkhovna rada of ukraine, she has already testified that she is ready to accept both parishes and parishioners who join, we know that during the war quite a few parishes joined the orthodox church of ukraine, of course, most of them without clergy, because the clergy, on pity, pro-russian, unfortunately, i always note that the security service of ukraine is constantly discovering new collaborators, which is evidenced by the results of this church and this activity. which they conduct on the territory of our state, and therefore the orthodox church of ukraine, its task, to really adjust, to define everything clearly and to accept all those

willing to serve, to really pray to god, the ukrainian church and the ukrainian people, no other way, why the clergy does not go together with people, so i will simplify the question very much, what is their argumentation, well, they have already started. let's say, to set up your parishioners, your clergy that these are difficult times for the church and everything else, but again i would like to point out that the limitation of the church is not christ's, but the church of the moscow patriarchate, which is quite closely connected with the aggressor country , and we can cite the example of the recently so -called metropolitan ianafan. were exchanged and who went to moscow to see cyril, that is, what else can be said, their holy synod did not deprive him of the diocese, that is, he will continue to be

the head of the tulshchyna diocese, but no longer in tulchyna, and already in moscow, what can we talk about? at the very end, i want to ask about the appeal that came from the head of the orthodox church of ukraine the day before. metropolitan epiphanius to metropolitan onuphrius, this call was a call to unity, actually, what did the orthodox church of ukraine want to say with this? yes, of course, was the appeal of our most blessed metropolitan epiphanius to metropolitan onuphrius, to the entire episcopate, the clergy, the marians, the ukrainian orthodox church of the moscow patriarchate with an appeal again and again to think it over and still come back. in the bosom of the canonical orthodox church, uh, but unfortunately, again we see only silence, unfortunately, we again observe only... their such

behavior, well, in principle inherent in them, why? well, because these people do not root for ukraine, these people, well, they don’t want to see ukraine, and metropolitan unufriy does not in any way try to build a dialogue, that is, higher, higher bishops from the uoc mp do not try to conduct a dialogue with the ocu in any way, that is, with ... there is no initiative on their side, i do i understand, no, this is out of the question, because i repeat, they will negotiate with anyone, they will negotiate with protestants, with catholics, but not with the orthodox church of ukraine, but you know, i always bring such for example, how their priests, ee being abroad,

ee... they perform divine services in churches, they perform divine services in prayer houses, that is, of other denominations, and it does not prevent them from doing so, but when something concerns the orthodox church of ukraine, then immediately such hatred, malice and everything else, therefore, here at the kyivocher lavra, we can also observe how aggressive they are towards us. and of course, at the moment, unfortunately, there is no understanding between us, why, because they don't want it. of course, we asked the representative of the uoc mp what they will do, what are the plans, my colleague spoke with the head of the information and educational department of the uoc, metropolitan kliment. let's listen: the ukrainian orthodox church views the law adopted by the verkhovna rada on...

banning the activities of religious organizations in ukraine organizations that have a center or are connected to russia. if we talk about the legal component of this law, i am not actually a lawyer, you can quote lawyers, and actually lawyers of the verkhovna rada, employees, employees of the legal department of the verkhovna rada, who emphasized that the text of this law grossly violates it. the fundamental constitutional principles that were active in ukraine before that, i don't know how it will be after that, whether they are canceled or not, and also violates a whole series of obligations that ukraine took as a democratic state in international treaties, conventions, including those obligations that it has during its

european progress on the way to... it is obvious that those who lobbied for these laws, they understood that the consequences would be not only purely spiritual and far from will only concern religious organizations, and it is obvious that this is such a gift in the pews from the proposal of the ruling coalition today, but you are journalists, you should investigate the situation objectively, of course, so you asked how many... proceedings or how many criminal cases there were concerning clergymen of the ukrainian orthodox church, have you wondered how many similar proceedings there are, or whether cases have been opened against clergymen of other denominations? you have such information as how the ukrainian orthodox church will operate for the next nine months, and there is also a period provided for in this law during which certain actions must take place from

the side. of the ukrainian orthodox church, in fact, how will the church continue to act, what will you do next? the church is the least of all legal organizations. the church is a community believing people, and the ukrainian orthodox church unites the largest community of practicing, believing people in ukraine, who visit the church every week, pray, have their own religious practices, you need to ask them how they will be in... the next nine months, respond to that, to the law-making that we just saw in the ukrainian parliament. the church is a legal organization, and in any case you have to fulfill or not fulfill the law in some way, that's why the question is, that's what it sounded like, well, i do it seems that this law does not involve our consent or disagreement to enforce or not enforce the law, i would just like to point out.