somewhere, they are constantly shooting, and this is simply not a federal, non-federal agenda, that is, they have already made a montage in their heads that they are happy here that they destroyed the ukrainian city of new york, well, they lost a little there, there is something else, well, somewhere it 's normal to shoot there in moscow, well, i hope that the drones of the main development department will fly to moscow more often, well, to solve it. there, the residents of russia were told: thank you, no, they will say yes, thank you, kirill budanov, because we cannot suffer alone, well, it will be said in russian, and these drunken muscovites or mono- yes, muscovites don’t feel war at night, well, that’s how they have it arranged, the state is big, everyone spits on each other, and that’s a fact, well.. that is

, what is happening in kurshchyna cannot disturb the neighboring region or two regions further there, in the depths of russia, that is, everyone lives the way he lives, and there is no feeling that the war is on the territory of the state anymore than just there in korshchyna , well, after all, this is the russian federation, the territory of the russian federation, well it turns out that way, but come on, we, we're not lazy, we'll do it again. let's just repeat that this is a consequence of russia's foreign military policy, military aggression, it's nato , get out, you're all stupid to us, there are some insults of a maniac about the alliance, all the statements that ukraine has something there, it has to enter somewhere, but it doesn't, and in general it has agreeing one's future with the russian nazis, it's all based on cartoons that...

showed rockets flying into the states, well , this is the result, and no one corrected it, you know, i have a friend in moscow, we still communicate with him a lot, and he says that in general putin is the kindest tsar in the world, because he does not force anything to be done, even now for money, when there was mobilization, everyone one of them could sit down, go to kazakhstan, to armenia, then it was generally simple, and now it is possible. no one kept you at the border, everyone who wanted to go and not take part in the war, they did, so it all started in the 14th year, when the russians, they simply supported the annexation of the ukrainian crimea, and it continued, it all goes from there, they supported it then, but now 10 years have passed, get a russian monster, a russian nazi, this is the bill, yes, it is terrible, and it is terrible for us, and it will be terrible for them, but ... we just need to stop

shooting, as one of the candidates for the presidency of ukraine, our presidential candidate, roman, said, another important issue and a very important topic, this is the reaction to what is currently happening on the territory of the russian federation from russia's allies, yes so-called allies of the countries of the post-soviet space, because there is the cis, the commonwealth of independent states, well there... of course, but there is this so-called military union, the csto, and accordingly, well, in the current situation, in principle, the csto would be enough, putin should turn to the csto and say: listen, we were attacked, we need to defend ourselves, well, at least some formal things should be done in order to show that this csto is alive, and not only that it exists there in the form of a russian contingent that will one day arrive... in kazakhstan, but thanks to of china

was very quickly expelled from kazakhstan, remember, in january of the 22nd year before the war in in ukraine, they landed there and very quickly got out of there, that is, all these structures, after what the ukrainian army did in kursk region, well, in fact, they are dead, they died, well, this situation proves that, well, let's just name the state by name. who participate in this, this is kazakhstan, yes, well, this state, well, let's say this, i think that in the matter of war, they are still more on our side than on the russian side, there even according to the vote in the un, there it is clear that they either vote neutrally, that is, they do not want this war support, and even i have on my channel according to the number of comments with kazakh flags, well, of course, this is not a representative story, but anyway, well, on... the president

of kazakhstan, he once gave an interview to a german at the very beginning of his arrival in their the main office and he had one there. phrase: well, what is this annexation, what kind of annexation is it? well , that’s it, i just wanted to say, well , let’s not talk about it, then their position in general is, well, publicly political, it’s pro-ukrainian, at least that’s how i saw it, well, maybe specialists will correct me, then there are kyrgyzstan and tajikistan, these countries, well , first of all, they have their own cinema there, they are far away, and something tells me that we will not have any contradictions, neither with the kazakhs, nor with the tajiks, nor with the kyrgyz. well, and... and they participate because they are small and so on, and they have their own problems, well, it just looks kind of absurd, and even, well, even political participation looks absurd, because they, again after all, they do not politically support

russia in this case, vermenia remains, well, armenia has de facto left, and so has belarus, alexander hryhorovych, he is trying to save the honor of the union state, if... here they don't rust, and actually everything there is chasing tanks, at least he declares that he is chasing tanks near the border, overturning aviation to the borders, i want to say, belarusians, look at russian airfields, on the contrary, tactical aviation should be taken away from the border, well, if you want to fight with us, and if you just want to smuggle planes into your own territory, then at least stand on your head, us it's not... walking, well, it's simple to the fact that here we are already trying to set fire to a deer, which is 1,800 km near finland, then to oleksandr grigoryovych, his khrinin, well , look at the theater of hostilities, and remember that

if you behave badly, you will be left without the moser oil refinery, well, if an obvious thing that no one really talks about with us officials, and we are not ashamed to say it out loud. so this story is about the csto, there is no csto, there is no cis, cis, there is no eurasian union, as it turned out, because in case of what, if i if he doesn't like something, he simply cuts down the trade barriers in manual mode and that's it, that's how it all started back when candy was banned in russia, somewhere in the 14th year, i'll just remind you that they said that candy bad, i don't know what kind of candies, i know, many people like them, the question is not their quality, the question is that it was a political movement, a political decision for and they began to break this free trade zone within the cis, yes, this is how they act everywhere, and in

these and that is, no matter what anyone says, in nato, anyway, there is this consensus, if it wasn't there, then we wouldn't be reading here. a lot of news about orbán and hungary as a whole, which blocked something again, and everyone there is thinking how to convince them to unblock it, here it is a completely different story, and when the dkb was created, it was an organization that recorded those countries that they are looking at moscow, but now at moscow, it seems to me that only hryhorych is looking, and he is maneuvering, well, he is looking at the same time. on russia and on china, so i think that it is more likely that china will play along with china more than putin, but in this situation, of course, the last 2.5 years have simply shown these cardboard structures that

do not solve anything in principle, which were part of putin's power in the post-soviet space, and they are also just, well, that fake who absolutely do not solve anything, cannot do anything, are unable to help anything, including russia, and russia cannot help them in anything, i.e. the situation in kurshchyna, it once again simply demonstrated that putin as such has support does not exist at all the post-soviet space, because this is the whole story, that the soviet union will be restored, but under such an administration it is impossible to restore anything at all. in general, what is the point of molding something and saying that it is a single whole, well , that's the end, we have one minute on the air, what could be the further scenario of putin's introduction of war? they will play a people's war, we must not relax for

a second, they wanted to kill us all, and they want to, and now plus bomb the kurdish region, so we must demand from the allies weapons... such pilots and negotiations, pilots and negotiations, bombs and negotiations, and look, look, we are somewhere in the middle in kursk region and we will come to an agreement, thank you roman for the conversation, i will remind our tv viewers that it was roman tsimbalyuk, my colleague, a blogger, a person who has 1,230,000 subscribers on his youtube channel, join roman tsymbalyuk's youtube channel, friends, during this broadcast of ours, we are conducting a survey, today we ask you about whether the moscow church threatens the security of ukraine, let's see on the interim results of the survey, 93% - yes, 7%, no, i remind you once again, we are on... we remind you on our broadcasts that until august 24 , espresso is preparing a special project bright people in dark

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congratulations, friends, the second part of the verdict program is live on the espresso tv channel. my name is serhiy rudenko, and for the next 45 minutes we will talk about the following. prohibition of the activities of the russian orthodox church in ukraine. the historic decision of the parliament requires decisive actions of the government. how will the ukrainian authorities continue to eradicate the moscow church? suja kursk and then moscow. can the ukrainian army attack? make putin leave ukraine, forecasts and scenarios of possible developments in the next few months. ratification of the rome statute. ukraine fully joined the international criminal court. how will it affect those who defend ukraine with weapons in their hands?

we will talk about this and more with our experts in the next 45 minutes. and let me remind you that we are working live on the tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms, for those who are currently watching us live on these platforms, please subscribe to our pages, participate in our survey, today we ask you about whether the moscow church is a threat to the security of ukraine, yes, no, everything is quite simple on youtube, either yes or no, if you have a separate opinion, please leave it in the comments below this video, if you are watching us on tv, pick up your smart phone or phone... and vote if you think the moscow church is a threat to the security of ukraine, 0800 211 381 or 0800 211382. all calls to these numbers are free, vote at the end program, we will sum up this vote. i want to introduce today's guest of our studio is viktor boberenko, an expert of the bureau of policy analysis.

mr. viktor, i congratulate you, thank you for being with us today. good health, i have no light, but the internet seems to be there, i am with you, thank god, we will watch you and communicate with you despite the lack of light. serhiy taran, political scientist, mr. serhiy, i congratulate you, thank you for joining the broadcast. i congratulate you. gentlemen, since we are asking our tv viewers whether the moscow church threatens the security of ukraine, it seems rhetorical question and... everyone should have the answer yes, but the preliminary survey in the previous program, the previous part, shows that 7% still do not think that the moscow church threatens national security, what do you think about this, let's start from mr. viktor, well, in fact, there is a threat, of course, and

we must react, although the threat is exaggerated. because the majority of the population is indifferent to matters of religion , they are actually believers, yes, the majority of ukrainians will say that they are orthodox, but a large part of which patriarchy will get confused, and they will also say that it doesn't matter which church you go to, if you go twice a year, you will be consecrated there as well, well, maybe i will recruit there or there... in sumy, i can see two churches from my window, so far to the left is the moscow church, far to the right is the ukrainian church, so it seems that it has changed and there are probably four times more churches in the ukrainian than in the moscow church, that is, the people

have reoriented themselves, well, at least in sumy, what you buy is what you sell for. so i watched today's study, which is actually true of the uoc-mp themselves almost 13% of the entire population believe that there are some, well, some, accordingly , they have a position, well, this is also there, which can be assumed to be like aristovych, he has his own national team there, and what for ukraine, but... like with pushkin and bulgakov, this is roughly this version, these are elderly people, young people, i say again, identiferous, well, in the majority, in western and central ukraine, where young people go to church, they go to the ukrainian church, these people, as a rule, do not pose a threat, but now, but, but

anyway, given that they don't do much damage. then i believe that they are exaggerating, it is a pity, and therefore it is very right, very right to ban the moscow church, that is, i am absolutely in favor. thank you, mr. viktor, mr. serhiy, does the moscow church threaten the security of ukraine? well, it must be said that we are not talking about that now. we are talking about a subdivision of the russian state, which they call the church. and which is used by the kremlin authorities to promote its narratives, to promote its influence, by the way, not only in ukraine, but also in ukraine in particular, but we understand perfectly well. that it is not exactly a church, precisely because it is an integral part of all state structures, representatives of this so-called church are always present at all events with

the participation of putin, they always sanctify everything that putin says, they support, well, in russia in general this church is a part of the state, so the question is whether the russian state threatens us now, the question is, of course, rhetorical, simply... that is, it is a huge strategic mistake to constantly call it a church and say that it is actually religious question, this is not a question of religion, this is a question of security, just as, for example, in the united states they would never allow the existence of al-qaeda or various extremist, ex-islamic movements there, although it is important that they are also religious, and in the same way in ukraine it would be strange if in general, it is strange that until now this structure still legally existed in ukraine, the whole western world... is fighting against terrorism, even if these terrorists use all kinds of religious slogans, because it is not about religion at all, it is about security, that's why this situation with russian yes

the so-called church, this is purely a matter of security, and what they call a church, well, yes, if we believe them, then let's call skabeeva a journalist, let's call it russian propaganda, which is not only in ukraine and europe, and that , by the way, it is already banned, russian channels and tv channels are banned in europe. call them freedom of speech, and not russian propaganda, then you can get to the point where terrorists in the east are called militiamen, and the russian army is said to be carrying out a liberation operation, instead of starting an aggression against ukraine, and it has been going on for the third year, so you don't just have to pay attention to this word of the church, you just have to understand what it is doing, and it is doing systematic, subversive work against the ukrainian state, it was doing it even before the war. she is doing it now, and the decision of the verkhovna rada is definitely late, but better late than never. well, beyond any doubt,

especially if you take into account the fact that for 2.5 years they tried to introduce and finally adopt a decision on the banning of religious organizations, which are related to the russian federation, there is such a decision, the verkhovna rada would pass and commenting on this law on the activities of religious organizations. the representative of the orthodox church of ukraine, metropolitan epiphany, called on all the orthodox of ukraine to dialogue and finally get out of the moscow yoke. let's listen to what metropolitan epiphany said. the law makes it possible for all religious structures that have not yet done so to truly now completely free themselves from moscow's control, and we, for our part, again and again for... repent to all orthodox in ukraine, which has not yet done so, should finally throw off this russian yoke. we are open to

dialogue without preconditions, and this was recently stated again in my address to metropolitan onufriy and those who are with him. mr. viktor, here is yesterday's vote for the law on religious organizations connected with russia. the banning of these religious organizations is called a historical decision, what historical actions does this historical law require now? well, all the insiders told me that that's why stefanchuk sent them on vacation, conditional leave, precisely because they did not have, there were not enough votes, they found these votes, it is clear that there are opzzhists, they tried to confuse it all in three pine trees, the votes were found, but now i think that the following will happen, that they, just as they had a party of regions, well, they banned

the party of regions, well, they banned the party of communists, but the communists of the regions did not divide anywhere, they reformed, the regions, we now see in the rank of opzzh some kind, yes, i think that now here are all the anfriivites. will create some kind of church opz for the sake of faith, yes , they will be carried away with it, so that only, well , roughly speaking, well, the sign will be removed, yes, but will anufriy become ukrainian, or will he become a patriot of ukraine, what do you believe in this, no, he all the same, there will be prayers for kirill putin, for putin, these people will come. will not change anything, and we must treat it like this, but, let's say this, i myself personally know one father who clings to...

the moscow patriarchate, which he, as he told me, that our bishop ordained me , i kiss his hand, he kisses me ordained, if i move with him, if he doesn't move, i won't move, although he sings the songs of ukrainian soldiers, he says patriotic things, i was at one of the funerals, he is very sincere, very correct, very cool says, but at the same time the servant of the moscow church there is to blame, i talked to him, well, there i say, why not go over, he says, well, i don’t know all the motives, all the motivations, all the fathers of those priests, here, but in everyone has their own opinion in their head, why they switch or not switch, again i repeat, again, again and again, many priests of the moscow patriarchate, they are patriots, they are together with their clergy, they are

together with their people, and... but their bishopric is serhiy rightly said, they are fsb colonels, they at least there are majors, fsb colonels, i remembered that in the 21st year i was in severodonetsk, there i attended training important for the press services of the military, yes, and i went to this place, well, holy mountains, i went there with my wife, then... she, not me, even, i already have my eye on all these kagibists, she says, she says, the guards are like that they look like, well, they are at least a lieutenant, and the nuns, monks are running around, young, yes, but correcting, there, you know, there, a field lieutenant of the fsb, at least, yes, they look 22-23 years old there, but they look they are like fsb lieutenants in ryas, that's what they look like, thank you, sir. viktor,

mr. serhiy, it was not for nothing that mr. viktor mentioned this whole story with the party of regions, and this is what we have observed, well, over the past 10 years, as this party of regions, they tried to stifle it, or at least somehow limit it, including politicians who joined the party regions, they were constantly reborn as opz, there, the opposition bloc, then some of them transformed there, probably went to... the sharia party on the ground, well, that is, it was a constant ongoing transformation, some parties were banned, other parties arose, if we recall the 20-year history, and what happened 20 years ago, we even had a party supporting vladimir putin, and it took part in the 2006 parliamentary elections, although they won a large percentage there, and that was in sevastopol, but that was also the case in ukraine, wasn't it? it will be the same as with the opz faction. in the verkhovna

rada, because they are already there for peace from life, not opzzh and they call themselves in a completely different way, will it not be the same with the ukrainian orthodox church of the moscow patriarchate, or in this case, well, since there is no mention of this in the law, we are talking about all organizations that can be affiliated with the russian federation in one way or another, well, it was different in the history of ukraine, it was like the communist party that disappeared, but, well, we have to understand that here only by laws, not business you will help, of course, that the verkhovna rada and its ukrainian officials must pass the right laws and make the right decisions so that those structures that work against the national interests of ukraine cannot operate in ukraine, and in ukraine it is necessary to separate where there is actual freedom of conscience and where is simple

the activities of an enemy state, but the fundamental issue is that the voters should never vote for this again, never again vote for those people who will literally continue to support this so-called moscow church in the verkhovna rada for the next few days, they will move on to other political projects, and they can vote for them again, so the key issue is that our voter has a better choice, so that voters going to the polling stations understand and know who they are voting for, so that they are interested in the biography of these people, and biographies of these structures, and i was interested in what they said three years ago, or five years ago, and what made them change their position, the position can be changed, but it is impossible to change the position in such a way that it contradicts the interests of ukraine, so it is necessary to understand it, and i think until ukrainian voters will finally not learn...

to reject the people they support