larry: hello, folks. welcome to kudlow, i'm

l arry kudlow. all about tiktok. battle brewing, ceo on the hill, hillary vaughn with a yarn to spin of her adventures, and brian kilmeade is here, setting rand paul straight, and trump trade expert bob light lighthizer wants tariffs. and kevin hassett and motomike faulkender has manage to say about that and robert o'brien on joe biden's shrinking u.s. military and liz peek and caroline downey will watch bernie sanders go ballistic on capitol hill, but first hillary vaughn live on capitol hill, slugging it out with all of the powers that be, how are you doing? reporter: larry. i'm still out of breath from the chasing, right now

senators are really waiting for leader chuck schumer to figure out when and how he will brin the tiktok bill to senate floor, tiktok ceo shou chew is not waiting, he has been here on capitol hill today to take advantage of this limbo to lobby lawmakers his way, he met with senator fetterman today, and he talked with aishah hasnie and said it not possible to do about what the house bill asks in time frame it wants, he says. tiktok will be banned ultimately. >> the bill is 12 pages long, we have looked at it, it not fees feasible. >> to divest the company? >> this bill, in all details. this is will lead to the banning of the app. reporter: even though chew had a one-on-one with senator fetterman he did not win him over, he needs a

guarantee that app is completely separated from chinese government, that say question that a lot of lawmakers have on their minds, also something that the chinese government has downplayed and called a conspiracy, i tried to give mr. chew a chance to tell us, does the ccp have influence over tiktok? >> mr. chew, you can say 100% that chinese government does not have any influence over tiktok? mr. chew, does chinese government have influence over tiktok yes or no? >> a mr. chew, you can promise the american people that the chinese government does not have influence over tiktok, mr. chew, doesn't it say that you cannot promise american people that chinese government does not have influence over tiktok it should be a simple easy answer. >> excuse me, thank you. reporter: i tried 9 times to ask mr. chew that, i didn't

get an answer between senator fetterman's office and his car he did answer several questions he did not want to answer my question that says everything. larry: hillary, you always ask the best questions. the fact that he won't answer, he is wrong you are right. we'll see you in just a few moments later on . we have the great brian k kilmeade to talk tiktok but before that, i want to say a couple words. about democratic insanity regarding israel and middle east. another problem of the first, chuck schumer who is jewish senate leader from brooklyn. just called for regime change in israel. that is right. in case you missed, he is inter interfering in israel's politics calling for mr. netanyahu to do sketch step down -- this is

insanity. they will see netanyahu and idf and whole of israel is handling winning the war against hamas, and if u.s. politics would leave them alone they would finish the war and southern gaza, including rafah in next few months but joe biden and chuck schumer and an antony blinken keep criticizing israel, hamas killed 1200 people on october 7. in an awful massacre. israel will finish the war and they will annihilate hamas, calling are in netanyahu to resign is s stupid tity. and called by president biden 'humanitarian aid misses the point, samantha power, administrative for usaid she criticize netanyahu to his face about

noncompliance with international humanitarian rule of law, whatever that means. hamas, controls nearly all of the distribution in gaza of aid they hoard it for themselves and sell the rest on black market. that palestinians and others cannot afford to pay, instead of nagging israel to submit a detailed war plan that will not injury one single civilian, why not let them do what they do best, aannihilate hamas, and what happened to the joe biden ramadan ceasefire, it did not happen, why not, because hamas would not sign it and biden administration reactor proved, a sanction waiver, this about letting

iran get paid for selling electric, money is. >> to lift the the sanctions imposed by the trump administration, then they allowed iran to accumulate oil revenue and foreign exchange reserving that gave them resourcing to back up hamas and october 7 massacre of 1200 people. then there is another story, a bunch of democratic senators want to withhold military weapons from israel, have to ask yourselves, which side are the democrats on? this is simple. to this day, the biden say nothing to china, the ccp is financing two wars against the u.s. by buying russian and iranian oil. and biden administration still seeks some kind of nuclear peace deal with

iran. insanity. you know, there is no reason to make this israel story any harder or more complicated than it needs to be lit israeli administration and idf do what it knows how do best, crush hamas, and the rest of gaza. and one guy who would benefit from it would be joe biden, but he and his crew don't understand how wonderful i y simple life can be. now, to tiktok and brian kilmeade, thank you for doing this. let me dial up your conversation with senator rand paul this morning on fox and friends. >> who owns the algorithm. >> tiktok. >> who owns arithmetic. algoritd

who owns bytedance the chinese government. >> they don't, you told a lie, you can't tell a lie 'a company hark is an out and outly. >> what is a lie. >> they are not owned by chinese government. >> to be clear, every entity. alibaba, jack ma thought he had problem with chinese government, he is now i think working in soup kitchens and alibaba belongs to month el, they have to answer to the chinese government. i watched that ceo on capitol hill. he did not say that backdoor was closed to chinese government, everyone knows that access to americans, i would get different things to me that you would get, goes who is collecting that data, tiktok. that data is acceptable to the chinese government. if you are comfortable and i don't think you are, but if

rand paul is c comfortable with sift million americans, their likes and dislikes and emotions chronicled and given to chinese government, have at it. keep the app, i am more in india's camp what banned 59 apps en c including tick totiktok, they are concerned about access that susceptible of their citizens to the chinese government. larry: couple things on this. this is one of those stories, we should not have to make it harder then it needs to be, tiktok and bytedance there is a national security risk. fbi director said that, and other experts. i negotiated with china for

years on trade. one things you learn as a matter of law in china, and common practice, these chinese companies are instrumentalities of chinese communist party, they are not independent, ownership may not be the ccp, but they do what they are told to do, and inside the constitution in the documents for these companies, any time the ccp or chinese government wants information from the company, they must give it to them. >> they don't have a choice. larry: there is no choice. this -- you are right. i rand paul is a friend, and a smart guy, most of the time i agree with him, but i don't understand his point this time. >> a couple things. we watched the hearings, i hospital to c-span and watched intelligence hearing our heads said tiktok is a huge problem. leaves americans susceptible

and america susceptible, if they are not killing us with fentanyl, which may make with the pills on down through mexico, if they are going to now go at america and shape what we think. given example. look hard for anything positive about taiwan. think about some things on the app. if there is one -- one story pro about israel, there is 100 negative about israel, pro palestinian, pro hamas, if you want to know why americans next generation is exercised against israel, and caught so many people by surprise, look at 170 million, between 16 and 24 that choose tiktok at source of news, that is america realizes our allies are not necessarily allies of the next generation, because of what china has allowed to shape their minds with through the app, that came to this country rally in

2016. larry: what is wrong? steve mnuchin on a network this morning. and he said, he is trying to put a group together to buy it he said a national security risk. with bytedance ownership, okay, then. he said it should be a u.s. business owned business. what is wrong with that. >> that is right. no one said okay. . in our country, we should not allow russia, china or north korea or iran, the parade of enemies again america, to control our news outlets. you know, would not be allowed to buy cbs or nbc but they can put tiktok in and dominate our news feed and shape what we see and learn that makes no sense. >> do you think that ccp would let fox news or another company go in. >> >> facebook is not allowed and gram instagram or snapchat, a communist

country has different rules, there is warfare, you get hit with bombs could then right now. subtlety china is doing what they can to weaken us and circle our divisions, whether something in ethnicity or trans-situation or we're looking at -- >> bad information to kids. >> right. larry: getting them depressed. >> you know what candidate does china want. larry: right, cyber hacking, spying, surveillance, we know this. >> right. larry: i don't know what is so hard about this story, best principle we could have to get bytedance out and make tiktok a u.s. company. >> you know the answer to this, the answer is there is a lot of powerful people lobbyist, and a lot of young people who may or may not voice but have their voices heard, a lot of great people making a lot of money. i get it. but also you pay joe crowley

and you pay the former politicians to be lobbyists they say, buddy, don't vote for this, don't be a parts of it let others worry about it, get the next generation of americans to vote for us, don't do, that we're -- you should at there are certain times in life do the right thing. larry: make it a u.s. business. >> but if they don't sell it, it dies. larry: it will, that is we have to protect ourselves. you have these guys saying a national security risk. they are not wrong there, they are correct. >> yeah. larry: i'll give biden some credit. >> he is wrong to have his campaign on it and hop on it on super bowl, that sens a bad message. barack obama sitting indian child in the oval office talking with a guy with a nose ring, talking about need it to whatever, he know a lot of people on ti

tiktok might vote for him, where are your values. larry: i will give him a half credit. >> brian kilmeade, you are so right, rand paul, good guy, i agree with him most of the time. >> will schumer bring it to the floor. larry: i believe he has to. >> right. larry: all these stories and stuff you are doing on network and helping and all these stories, they are cascading, they will vote on the floor, i believe it will pass, brian kilmeade the best of the best, one nation, thank you a million. >> we'll have mike gallagher talking about it. >> co coming up, inflation is rising and retail sales are falling, not what joe biden dreamed about we have kevin hassett and mike faulkender making sense of it, and more inflation, and let's get america right on tiktok. i am kudlow we'll be right

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high in 6 months, price that companies pay to buy the goods, they need to make goods they sell to us. 1.6% year-over-year, and . 6% month over month, more than expected. also putting pressure on inflation, looking at rising gas prices, they are up 2 cents overnight, almost to levels they were a year ago, average ourly earnings up, this keeps pressure on prices higher. causing more americans to resort to credit cards, treasury secretary telling me, she is not concerned about credit card delinquencies increasing. >> overtime we have spent some of that buffer of savings and particularly lowering income households are borrowing again on credit cards, i see that as a normalization rather than a disturbing new trend. reporter: market expert like

stephanie, say what you adjust retail sales for inflation they have been flat for 24 months, people are not buying more, they are payings more for same items, treasury secretary holding to fact that prices of some goods have come down within the the last 6 months. >> americans are seeing the cost of some goods that are important to them like rent, having increased. many prices are well off their highs. gasoline, eggs. other things tvs, used cars and trucking that people buy are well off their highs. reporter: she is talking about a shorter time frame, we know that prices since month president biden came to office up 18.5%, real average hourly earning are down 2.5% in the same time frame, this is what americans feel, and what white house is having you

trouble messages. larry: thank you edward, weekly earnings down almost 5 percentage points, under mr. biden. >> talk about this with mike faulkender, and now chief economist at afpi, and kevin hassett. a fellow at hoover institution, and author of the drift, stopping america's slide toward socialism, kevin, getting inflation down is not that easy when you are running budget that are sewing continues spend -- showing continued spending increases like this is no tomorrow. what do you make of these reports. not what joe biden dreamed of. >> right, it is obvious it was going to happen, you -- one thing i disagreed, you covered it unexpected increase we talked about how inflation is not u uncontrol, there is simple

math and janet yellen denial, means she does not know, if gdp government spinning about 25% of gdp and goes up by 10%, if supply does not go up, prices go up by who . 5% to offset that. -- 2. 5% to offset that. i have been getting inflation right, the last couple of years with that simple numonic, the fact they are so denial in budget, they call for spending going up 70% search -- 7% this year, it is not going down. larry: mike faulkender, another problem that is developing for consumers and businesses, is energy prices are going back up. at edward lawrence mentioned gasoline over $3.40, less

than at the worst of 5 bucks. it is creeping up again, wheel sale energy prices, crude prices. those are all going up. often, that permeates the economy with price increasing, what do they do about that. >> that is the problem, looking at cpi and ppi, the signif-- biggest contribution was rise in energy prices, this is comes if that could we're not expanding refining capacity here in u.s., you had shut down in midwest of refineries, and we saw gas prices have to take off to clear that market with their less supply on-line. this comes back-to-back that biden administration is doing all it can to try to move us away from fossil fuels despite fact it

permeates our economy. and when you consider that we get about 80% of our electricity from fossil fuels, and that renewables like wind and solar comprise about 4% of our energy mix there is no plan to get y us off fossil fuels yet there is no investment in refinding want it. larry: kevin, atlanta fed gdp tracker, started quarter about 3 1/2. about what edward lawrence mentioned is interesting. real retail sales, real, adjusted for anonymouses in, they have been flat for two years, this economy is probably soggier than some of recent gd f reports might -- gdp reports might suggest. >> you are right, in end they come back and revised numbers for gdp numbers for biden administration they

will go down, inflation measures have not correctly measured it. we have talked about it interest costs are in the cpi . the monthly payment for your cargos up that does not inflation, but that affects your life, i filled up my car today that cost me 80, it would have been 40, 3 years ago, that is what everyone is going through. that is not measures in inflation measure it is too low. larry: faulkender. biden talks about shrinkplation, i think it is in his polls, the last word. >> they are. the american people know those numbers, that edward lawrence talked about with regard to how far their wages go t compared to price increases, american people are 2.5% behind in teterms of hourly wages

are for them. they know what kind of economy they get under each president. larry: thank you kevin hassett and mike faulkender. >> next up bob lighthizer will argue that president trump is right, and that we need more tariffs, we will explore that. >> then former national security adviser robert o'brien on biden' shrinking military and giving, iran more money, i am kudlow, we'll be right back. it's all day and into the night. it's all the things that keep this world turning. it's the go-tos that keep us going. the places we cheer. trust.

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larry: in the economist magazine donald trump former trade chief makes case for more tariffs that me person is joining us my

friend robert lighthizer. bob, welcome back. so i'm going to read a couple things, my favorite line in your article, i read carefully. tariffs are a tool that should be used in con junction with a pro growth tack policy, a reduction in unnecessary regulation and use of subsidies to develop key sectors. i want to read something flu. prestrump said -- trump said, i think that taxes could be cut, and other things could have more than adjust that i'm a big believer in tariffs. so, bob lighthizer, we could have tax cuts to offset tariffs does that make sense with a 10% import tariff?

>> so, let's me step back. the one thing to add, i talked about tariffs one tool of capitalism, we need sense inpro growth taxes and less regulation, and subsidies in some cases and energy policy po that hops people, like to go to basics. president trump ran for president among maybe this most serious reason was he wanted to help working people. and working people had been treated very badly in this country, if you look at what happened to the communities across america. working men and women have really not had a pay raise with exception of a bump in trump years for 25 or 30 years. so something has to be done to help. at the same take, the country the rich are getting richer and middle class is disappearing, first time,

top 1% has more wealth than 60% in the middle. there is a lot of reasons for this, a big reason is trade policies. the president proposed that we start a reindustrialization together. and a good part of that should be to have tariffs across the board. i say this is necessary because the current program has failed. we have run-up 17 trillion in trade deficits, in last 24 years, we have shifted our wealth overseas including to communist china that that huge amount, we have not seen wage increases we lost job and we lost our edge in manufacturing, we have a large trade deficit in high-tech manufacturing, the direction we're going in are bad, people with high school education live 9 years less than a person with a college education. and that is the result in

some extent of a bad trade policy and fact they don't have good jobs to support their communities, and their families. one last thing for the first time in history since 2000, a young person growing up cannot expect to live longer or be wealthier than their parents that is first time in american history, since this policy. larry: your point. i think this is important point. when luke at trade policy -- a look at traded policy from how it is impacting middle class, also people that make things, manufacturing and related items, i think that is a fair point. i think pure free traders have overlooked that. having said that, you know i still think that the trump policy of reciprocity, that idea, if you could have a world where look if one side if china is raising tariffs

we have to be tough and raise them took the same for europe, i agree with that. but on other hand, you make trade deals with both sides lower tariffs, that would be a good thing. and only other thing to add, you know with mr. trump's idea of a 10% ring around the collar, that is a campaign idea, not total formulated. it sounds to me like he would offset any impacts here domestically with the tax cut. might be a middle class tax cut for example or might be a border adjustment tax cut or tax credit. the way others have it. so, we would be you know protecting our areas that need protects, but tax cuts could offset it, and the net would be a nit plus on economic growth. is there anything problem with that concept? >> well, i would say first, these tariffs will be will

have little or no impact on inflation, there is not a lot to payback, let's start with that, we had tariffs, countries that have most intervention in their economy, and whole world, companies like china, have deflation. so, these things are not inflationary, there is not a lot to payback, the real payback s the real pack back is your mom and your dad going to work in a factory, making a good wage, and giving h hope to their children, making their kids proud. that is the payback the jobs giving a pay raise to american workers, there is no way it will be inflationary. even some of the people who hate tariffs say, that the affect of our tariffs was less than a quarter of a percent. they are not anonymouses inary, we have -- inflationary.

in practice they have not been. and what the president wants to do, i think with this money is generate the kind of industry that will create millions of high paying jobs. and if we do that we'll restore our communities and the greatness of america. and i think that is important part much one other thing he talks about. is he wants much higher tariffs on china, he realizes that kind of geopolitical threat they are to our country. so, i would say, -- there is a moral an economic and a geopolitical reason for this. larry: all right, we'll leave it there your phone is ringing, i have to take a break. >> yeah i apologize. larry: don't, i hear you, your piece on the economist is good, i like the balanced approach, hoping that fossil fuel spigot and cut taxes

and deregulate, keep the dollar and have our tariffs too, a weapon, we'll leave it there robert lighthizer th thank you you bob. >> great. larry: from one former president trump official to other, robert o'brien. welcome to you. i don't know you may have just heard light lighthizer discoursing about tariffs. >> let me say something, i fell like i was in oval office watching you and bob advise the president. if american people are concerned about getting this economy back on track, they just watched you and bob, they want that back in government this is they should vote for president trump in fall, get advisers like you and bob back. that is terrific you. >> are kind. >> "wall street journal" editorial page, writing a great biden shrinks u.s. military, this is so troublesome. today 3.1% of gdp for

military spending that is low. by the end of the budget horizon it will go down to 2.4%. and army is short, navy is short, nuclear submarine building is short, this stuff -- they are peaceniks dealing with a world that does not exist, i have blow ups in the gloib the globe and united states is sometimes just a bystander, why are we shrink our military. >> this is a ti democrat playbook since president clinton, they think they want to spend it on butter and domestic programs. you just talked about it, with hassett, inflation rate is higher than we see. it say cut in defense spending, at a time world is most truss it dangerous it -- dangerous it has been since 1938.

we have a war in ukraine, and a war in israel that iran is subsidizing, and these people are cutting military and gutting it this is crazy this weakness is provocative. we'll have more afghanistan, and more invasions. if we don't go back to a peace through strength policy quickly america is in trouble and the free world. larry: back to tiktok. you are the one that taught me, these big chinese companies like bytedance are essentiallyi instrumental teities of the chinese communist party it is truer today than before, that is why we have to sell-off tiktok. >> 100%. tiktok is collecting geo location data on our people. it is dividing america. with their propaganda coming through the app. also, sucking up the data

and inning on everyone's phones, they have 170 million senors in country. and this is taking place when you talk about reciprocity with bob, this taking place in environmental where facebook, google, apple, those companies are not allowed to operate their apps in china, but china is operating biggest espionage tool that has ever been invinvented in america, we have to pass this bill. president trump's plan. this is what president trump talked about in office, and we need to get back to that. larry: you think that -- is there a reason to think that we would ban tiktok, if bytedance won't sell or ccp won't let themselve if algorithms cannot be changed we will have a ban, would support it? >> i would support it 100%, we have to do it otherwise they will keep -- our data, they have every phone with

tiktok on it your financial data and healthcare date and and text-message its all goes on the cloud, chinese communist party has access to it they know where you are and what you are doing, they will have social credit 64ou scores on you, this is a dangerous weapon, we need to get it in american hands, if that does not happen we need to ban it. larry: all right, robert o'brien thank you, sir. >> we'll take a quick break, we'll talk to hillary vaughn. again, why did d'e bernie sanders go ball ballistic on capitol hill, and hillary had a heck of a day, i'm kudlow, and we'll be right back.

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larry: right back to hillary vaughn, who had quite the day on capitol hill.. reporter: we tried to catch up with senator bernie sanders to ask about his ideas of workers working 32 hour workweek but get paid the same so businesses would pay them for 8 hours they are not working, we tried to ask him, how businesses are supposed to survive the progressive proposals that include raising taxes on businesses, and asking them to pay their workers more, and lowering prices to fight

inflation and pay people not to work. >> can i talk to you about 32 hour workweek.. >> you are with who. >> fox business. >> democrats want businesses to be tacked more. >> really is that what you think. >> i didn't get to ask the question. >> excuse me. >> thank you. >> senator. >> hold it -- okay. >> we held a hearing on a 32 your workweek. because what we have seen is that over last 50 years, despite a huge increase in worker productivity almost all of the new wealth has gone to top 1%, and 60% of people living paycheck to paycheck, many of the people are exhausted we work longest hours of any people in centralized work, i think time for a short workweek. >> let me ask you a question, democrats wants to pay taxes more and pay people not to work. >> you know what i would

like to see -- how are businesses doing to survive that, that is the question, how do businesses survive. >> mr. bezos pays a tax rate lower than average worker we have a real problem in our tax system, billionaires have to start paying their fair share of taxes. reporter: we hear a lot about jeff bezos on the bill, -- hill, he is the billionaire poster child, but the policies would affect more than just him. we tried to get clarification how ern el would deal with it. larry: hillary, glad you are in one piece. >> for more on this liz peek. and caroline downey. liz, 32 hour work -- maybe democrats should work less and the rest of us harder. >> a great idea, one day a week. for democrats on the hill. this is just more of the war

on work. i cannot understand how he thinks that a 32 hour workweek will improve productivity, if you keep this up, you will have less productivity, less profitability that is what feeds wage increases, you can't have higher wages unless companies are doing well, hillary vaughn is right, she is lambasting him for wanting higher taxes and higher wages, they will make companies do worse, employees do better when companies do better. that is straight forward. larry: i thought he was doing to punch her out, i am glad it stopped. this -- i think people should be working harder myself. not less, more. >> a wise man once said, that our work ethic is a positive aspect of our national character that separates us from europe that is why we're eel. >> i think bernie sanders is

a corporate shell why not stop at 32 hour, why not a two hour workweek, slippery slope he is setting out does not make sense. larry: why is it about jeff be bezos. this is almost irrelevant. the wealthiest people the top 1% they past of the taxes, for heaven's sake, they make a quarter of ininequincome and pay half. >> they lie and have no basis of what they are talking about and the lie from joe biden that billionaires don't pay enough if taxes or a lower rate, that implies a we wealth tax what is not the law of the land. europe has country after country imposed a w wealth tax then a rescind it because people move away. larry: to be continued. >> we're out of time. >> we're always out of

time. liliz peek and caroline downey, appreciate it we'll about workin g harder more hours. an. let's find the right investments for your goals okay, great. j.p. morgan wealth management.

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