our target at 1250 but if you look at amazon, there is tremendous earnings upside from can youing costs. now they have professional management. so you don't have the founder. cutting costs adding advertising. they have the a.i. boom. we think that is lower risk way. not that nvidia might not outperform because it has tremendous momentum right now but less appreciative of playing the a.i. boom. morgan stanley and goldman sachs have done really well. we think they will benefit from ipos. you saw the private placement, that will go public at some point. >> good stuff, jay hatfield, always great to have you here. [closing bell rings] holiday shortened trading week kicks off mostly in the red but the nasdaq we call this the second straight record close. dow is losing session in the last four. that will do it for us. "kudlow" is next.

larry: david: hello, folks, welcome to a special edition of "kudlow," i'm david asman in for larry today. the prosecution is making their final pitch to the. >> in alvin bragg's criminal trial against donald trump. former president's defense delivered their own closing arguments a little earlier today, telling the court that the prosecution's lead witness, michael cohen lied on the stand and that there is no underlying felony crime, even charged in the case. we have carrie urban breaking down what will happen next. first, lydia hu who is live outside of the courthouse with the very latest. lydia, i love your notes you've been sending to the fox crew. thanks. what's the latest. >> reporter: good. yeah, hey there, david. well the latest is that the prosecution has been presenting their closing arguments for about two hours. we still expect several hours to go, so we're probably right in the middle what they are presenting as their final take on the case they have built against the former president.

joshua stein glass is the prosecutor who is friending these oral arguments, oral arguments in the jury there are some issues we could highlight from what they're saying inside of the courtroom but i will leave you with just one example of what a wide birth the judge seems to give the prosecution when they make the final pitch to the jurors. one of the issues come up is michael key hen's guilty plea from back in 2018 when he pled guilty to tax crimes and also the federal election violation and in the closing arguments over defense objection the judge is allowing prosecutors steinglass to argue cohen was angry after he pled guilty, because he was quote, the openly person to pay a price. really meaning that this guilty plea was one that cohen thought that donald trump should have to have been charged and would have had to reckon with as well. that's a really prejudicial implication because it is basically saying cohen was guilty of this federal election violation. trump is therefore too.

during the actual trial, there was testimony being presented by both sides the judge would sustain defense objections around this issue because it is so prejudicial. he would instructed the jury at that time during testimony that information is there for you to consider michael cohen's credibility and not to consider whether trump is guilty of the 34 charges in this particular indictment. very interesting to see now judge mershon allowing the prosecutors to wade into this territory, drawing conclusions from what was michael cohen's own guilty plea back in 2018, not donald trump's. like i said several hours to go, yet still from the prosecutors, the defense attorneys, presented their closing arguments this morning. we heard from todd blanch. he spoke for just under three hours. i thought the most powerful moments came from todd blanch early on in his closing remarks he explained to the jurors, this case is really quite simple t

boils down to whether documents were falsified. he reminded the jurors, and walked them through the documents, pointed to michael cohen's own testimony provided plausible explanations why the documents were labeled as legal services as michael cohen was an attorney, was holding himself out as personal counsel for trump in the public eye, to clients and also members of the news media. so it would make perfect sense while his invoices would say please pay me for services rendered. seems plenty of room to find reasonable doubt. he had powerful moment at the end, a good reminder to us all from todd blanch. he told the jurors, this case is not about politics. it does not matter what your personal opinion of the former president was or is. it does not matter whether you plan to vote for donald trump or president biden in the upcoming election. what matters is the evidence as presented in this case and soon

enough, when closing arguments are done and the jury members get this case tomorrow, to begin deliberations, it will be a real test as to whether they heed that advice. david, i will send it back to you. david: prejudice is supposed to be kept out of our courtrooms. that is what makes america different. it is that simple. lydia, thank you very much, all your reporting is great. for more on all of this, let's bring in kerri urbahn, fox news legal editor, former trump doj counselor and another eye and ear inside the courtroom. we have embarassment of riches, you, trey, andy mccarthy, et cetera. kerri, what do you believe about that, that prejudice has been kept out of this courtroom or has it been allowed in? >> oh, it's been allowed in. just the fact that stormy daniels was allowed to testify pretty much unimpeded what donald trump had in his hotel bathroom or her tour that she did that i won't repeat the name of the tour on air because it

was so crass, the things she did as a porn star. we all listened to that for hours. none of that has anything to do, as lydia just reported the crime itself, the alleged crime itself, which is falsifying business recordses. david: but does the jury know that? forgive me, kerri, does the jury know what is legal and what does directly deal with what donald trump has been charged with? or have they not been told that by the judge? >> reporter: the judge along the way has stricken some things from the record including some stuff from stormy daniels he has but overall your question gets to i think the heart of this case in a lot of ways which is that the prosecution here has been determined for weeks now to conflate dirty with illegal in the minds of the jury. of course as we know that is simply not the case. david, i ran into this a lot believe it or not when i was at the doj people frustrated with then attorney general bill barr for not prosecuting certain

shall we say fan favorites. i would often have to defend our decisions in the court of public opinion. just because something didn't feel right, or dirty or sleazy it doesn't make it illegal. it may feel like it is. we deal in evidence. there are things that have to be established. here the prosecution has responsibility of proving these crimes beyond a reasonable doubt, that is their burden to bear. what it feels like they're searching through the new york state code for something they can fit to donald trump's behavior which is an abuse of the office. even beyond that, the fact that the former number three justice official is alvin bragg's right hand. david: we'll get to that. >> if anyone knows better it would be someone from the department of justice. i think that is particularly disgraceful. david: we'll get to that business. i've been on juries. a lot of people on there been on juries adjudicate cases where you're dealing with pretty bad

characters. i would always rely on the judge to tell me, you know, you might not like this guy, you might not like what he represents, you might not like his attitude, you might not even like the evidence that is against him but that cannot prejudice you against the final charge. he has to be found without a shadow of a doubt guilty of what he has been charged with. in this case, by the way, we're not really sure what, what elevated those, that one expired misdemeanor into 34 felony charges. that particular charge still hasn't been mentioned. i want to play a sound bite from andy mccarthy about that point which he made earlier on our show. listen. >> the most extraordinary thing i've ever seen in watching or trying criminal cases for decades is we're on the precipice of having summations here and we still don't have

definite about what the crime is. we have a five-week trial, five weeks of testimony, after opening statements, we're right on the verge of summations and it's still not clear what they say he did. it's like, they're making up a crime as they go along. david: if crimes can be made up in this country, in courts around the country, crimes within which the trial focuses on prejudice rather than evidence, that can, what's happening to trump can happen to anybody? >> oh, totally and you know, taking a step back for a minute, if you, if the government, whether it's the state government or the federal government is going to bring a case against the former president of the united states and possibly the future president of the united states, that case better be a slam dunk, airtight, the witnesses are credible, everyone knows why they are there, the accused knows what they're being accused of which is constitutional right that everyone is entitled to,

and yet this trial has been the exact opposite of all of that. instead it is coming down to the words of somebody who is obsessed with trump. he once was obsessed in love with him. he has on ses tiff hatred of him. he is known liar. even misled us on the stand several weeks ago he casually talked about the reimbursement plan he was working out with alan weisselberg, the ceo at the time. you got the feeling from michael cohen sitting in the courtroom, he just wanted his money back and just wanted his christmas bonus. in fact we learn on cross-examination, that. david: that he stole it. >> he was padding his own pockets doing it, he was stealing. this is who the state of new york wants everyone to rely on, depend on to believe in order to imprison the president of the united states. that is remarkable when you think about it. david: what the jury relies on,

i mentioned it before when i relied on a jury is the judge himself. my question, obviously michael cohen is a terrible witness. he is a proved liar, admitted to stealing in the cross-examination this week. you lie on the judge in this courtroom you can't. the reason why they haven't mentioned clearly what elevates the expired misdemeanor in 34 felonies because they have no right to ajude case a election interference that has to be fec or federal court. that is why they're not mentioning it, right? >> it is not their jurisdiction and the department of justice declined to bring it. so how in the world are we you now sitting here in manhattan in state court where they're bringing this? it is mind-boggling. as far as the question where the judge is concerned, most troubling aspect with respect to the judge throughout this trial the fact he imposed a gag order throughout the duration against donald trump yet michael cohen,

stormy daniels, these other characters were able to say whatever they had to say to make money off of it. fundamentally that is not fair. he could have done himself with a lot of favors with his own credibility in the eyes of public not imposing a gag order against donald trump. i know better than anyone. what is the purpose to a gag order? to prevent harm to a case that otherwise can't be done. does anyone not on this planet not know what donald trump thinks about all this, including the jurors before they took their seats. david: yes. >> of course. these are the kinds of things i think really put question marks in peoples' minds about the credibility of the judge. david: kerri, very quickly because we have to go. has the judge at least told the jury ndas are not illegal? that hush money payments is not illegal? >> we certainly heard that come out during testimony, from both the prosecution and the defense, as far as if the judge himself spelled that out yet, i don't

recall him doing so. i don't think the jury at this point cowalk away thinking anything it was but legal. that point has been made, including, including by the prosecution's own witnesses. david: if they come to that conclusion then donald trump is innocent, right, in the eyes of the jury? >> right. one would think so but the prosecution's convoluted theory, even though that was legal, they would like the jury not to think it is based on how they approached this case, even though it is legal there was this attempt to cover it up and that's a violation of new york state election law because they were unlawfully conspiring to promote a candidate for office even though of course the nda is legal, secondly, there are a lot of things that politicians can promise or leave out and it's not a crime later on if and when they become elected. david: that is the other thing, what kind of precedent does this set if donald trump is found guilty for other politicians who come out with promises not met

later on. >> right. david: we have to leave it at that. kerri urbahn, wonderful, wonderful analysis. thanks for being here. appreciate it. coming up the biden administration insists we would all be better off buying evs but americans don't agree. how will the administration go enforcing us to buy what we clearly don't want? we'll ask north dakota senator kevin cramer about that when "kudlow" continues.

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so you don't have to compromise. powering smarter savings. powering possibilities. david: so the biden administration continuing to push electric vehicles as demand for them grinds to a halt. joining us is north dakota senator kevin cramer, member of the senate environment and public works committee. senator, good to see you. thank you for being here. i just want you to listen for a second to pete buttigieg.

he was on one of the sunday talk shows. i assume he thought he would get softballs but he got a little pushback. let me play that, get your reaction. roll it. >> they're going crazy with the electric car, costing us a fortune. we're spending hundreds of billions of dollars subsidizing a car nobody wants and nobody is ever going to buy. >> he is not wrong. on the purchasing. >> he is. >> of the four million vehicles purchased, what, 269,000 electric vehicles were sold in the u.s. market. it is up 2%. larry: all right, the bottom line is, senator cramer, when you get pushback, when the bidens get pushback from the mainstream media they know they're in trouble, right? >> well that's for sure. the mainstream media knows what we all know, and that is there is not a demand. in fact their hope of a demand has obviously fallen flat and the idea that somehow you can create demand by creating more supply of course, you only

somebody who didn't take economics 101 would fall for that. the reality is, in fact when they try to subsidize any that type of product, the amount of the subsidy gets added to the price in this case the vehicle. you really never create a true market, going that route but what you do do is create a glut of the product itself and at the end of the day people are very comfortable with their, you know, gas vehicles and their combustion engines because they're reliable and, they know how to work on them. there is all kinds of benefits to combustion engines. david: there may be reasons. people i know who have electric cars are happy with them. not in chicago by the way after the last winter, you discovered the battery problem with cold weather. but politicians and bureaucrats when they spend our money they don't do it as effectively as we do or as the market does in

deciding what works and what doesn't, isn't it that simple? one other example the $7.5 billion that has been spent sending up these charging stations all over the country, they only have seven or eight of them. seven or eight. $7.5 billion. that doesn't add up. >> it doesn't add up very well, that's for sure. the goal was, the promise by joe biden was there would be half a million of these charging stations. you sort of touched on that point when you talked about chicago, the fact batteries don't last long. in fact when the temperature gets below 20 degrees below zero, they lose 40% of their battery life. if you live someplace 20 below, try north dakota. that is common to get to 20 below zero. that leaves half of the market out of market for electric vehicles. largely, wealthy people buy electric vehicles. they live in people, they can afford to have an extra car. they like the idea of an

electric. that doesn't talk about the fact we don't have the electric generation and transition that can support the electricity. we have a.i. eating up lot of electricity. cryptocurrency mining takes up a lot of electricity. it gets back to the fundamental point of the market. the market is simply not there. there is not a demand for it and you're seeing that not just in the united states you're seeing that, around the world see the same phenomenon. david: they can't create markets but they can destroy them. they're pushing in addition to all the subsidies taxpayers are paying for, they're creating new regulations very tough on gas-powered cars. is it conceivable they could force the same? doing the same thing in states by the way with regard to natural gas ovens. we have all the new regs for ovens to make it impossible to have gas ovens now, even if you have an electric oven, hey, somebody will pay for that extra electricity.

of course electricity also has to be created somehow. it is not always able to be created by sun when it is cloudy or wind when there is no wind? >> gas furnaces. we had a congressional review last week on gas furnaces. to get a gas furnace 95%, this by the way gets to your point of regulation, 95% efficient gas furnace ends up 4500 to $5,000 for a new furnace, 60% of the furnaces in the country would have to be replaced. electric furnace is cheap but cost of fuel is doubled. there is no rationale for free market system. david: it leads to distortions, not only markets but foreign policy distortions. because of now our foreign policy consideration we're letting iranians produce a lot more oil than they were under the donald trump administration. we're buying more oil from venezuela. they produce it much dirtier fashion than we do. if you want a clean environment,

you produce it here where we have the regs to make sure it is a clean environment. speaking of iran very quickly, we got the news over the weekend, shocking news that the biden administration is now pressing our allies, our european allies not to confront iran on their nuclear program which is advancing very quickly. when we are, are more liberal than you know, france and the uk, i start to get a little worried, do you? >> as do i but this is just the latest example of a projection of weakness by this president. they have coddled iran all along. look at the way they're treating our friend israel, withholding weapons, offensive weapons that could put an end to the war via iran with hamas. the fact we haven't sunk any iranian ships in the red sea when they are shooting at our sailors, it is mind-numbing to me. the whole iran nuclear deal is ridiculous.

it is not just the iranian deal, there are lots of areas where nato leadership is calling the united states lift restrictions on use of weapons by ukraine. ukraine is given weapons but not allowed to fire at the source of weapons coming back at them. it is absolute projects of weakness. it's philosophy most americans and frankly growing number of people around the world don't agree with. david: why donald trump is hitting on common sense as the issue of this campaign. >> that's right. david: in all areas, whether it is dealing with the border, foreign policy, economics, et cetera. senator, great to see you. thank you for being here. senator kevin cramer. >> thanks, david. david: joe biden claims he has nothing to do with the lawfare case against donald trump and is not interfering with hunter biden's own criminal cases but there is evidence that suggests otherwise. we're going to have all the details on that with house oversight chair james comer. that's coming up next on "kudlow". 5-well, that's not working.

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♪. david: well new reports that president biden plans to let loose on the trump trials once a verdict is finally reached in the former president's her money case. fox news's peter doocy is live from the white house with a lot more on this. i'm sure you've been watching every tick and tack what is going on up here? >> reporter: absolutely, here at the white house we were led to believe because of a "politico" article citing several sources close to the white house whether trump is found guilty or not guilty, when there is a result, president biden would come forward at the white house to talk about it and how the result needs to be respected because it is the product of the judicial process. today the press secretary in a briefing ran about an hour, not sure that is the plan, that president biden will talk about it. the schedule is kind of tricky. tomorrow he will go to pennsylvania and delaware for a couple days. he will be back here to celebrate chief's super bowl

victory. he is gone for the weekend and beginning of next week he is heading to europe. so it is very, very unlikely that president biden would be addressing a trump verdict from europe. so, we don't know exactly what is going to happen. it will probably depend a lot on how long it take as -- takes a jury based on all the legal analysis, it depends on how long it takes prosecutors there in new york. something else very interesting. over the weekend when president biden was in delaware he visited privately with one of the witnesses who the special counsel will call to testify against hunter biden, hallie biden. i asked karine jean-pierre about that, what were they doing? he said they were just visiting ahead of beau biden widow, ninth anniversary of his passing. she says they didn't talk about the testimony coming up, the optics are something that a lot of critics are pointing out are a little bit off.

>> they sure are, remember the tarmac case back in 2016, 2015? >> reporter: a lot like that. david: peter doocy, thank you very much on that, appreciate it. for more let's bring in kentucky congressman james comer, chair of the house oversight committee. congressman what i was describing remember when the tarmac case, then attorney general, was met on the tarmac by bill clinton talking about a case, he shouldn't have been talking to her about. it, he may say it had nothing to do with hunter biden's case but, kind of hard to believe that didn't enter into the conversation, right? >> it's very hard to believe. i have no reason to believe much of anything joe biden said after i've been investigating him for about a year-and-a-half now. the number of lies that he has told pertaining to his family is almost immeasurable. so, when you look at what happened with the clintons there, and obama, and, biden,

with respect to conflicts of interest, the rules don't apply to the ruling class. that is what it seems to me. rules only apply to republicans when it pertains to ethics and the rules of the judiciary. david: also reminds us how the doj has gotten involved in other cases or seemingly so. in the bragg case that we're trying now in new york you have the, i think it was the number three man in doj came down to new york to become an assistant prosecutor, which was a big step down for him in order to adjudicate the case. clearly he had the interests of the biden administration in his mind. then you have the fani willis assistant, assistant/lover who had several meetings with the white house about that case down in georgia. so, it seems that very often the white house directly is influencing the doj. that's what it looks like from here. >> it looks like that to most americans. that is what most americans see when they see all the conflicts

of interest with all these prosecutors going after joe biden's political opposition. there are so many conflicts of interest. we all know that, that, justice is supposed to be fair and balanced and the judge blindfolded, the jury listens and rules with their, their intent after hearing all the evidence but what you see with biden is, hand-picking the prosecutors, having media spin false narratives, having press conference to spin, intimidate, to obstruct. i think the americans are seeing through this. i think a lot of people in america that traditionally vote democrat felt like they have been victims of an unfair judicial process or members of their family have been victims in an unfair judiciary, i think they will vote for trump this time, because they see, they see joe biden abusing his power. david: i know the media hates this when people do it, conservatives do it but the fact is is if this was donald trump

interfering with cases outside the jurisdiction, the direct jurisdiction of doj, what do you think would happen? >> they would throw the book to trump. they would throw the book to anyone in trump's orbit. you look what we found with respect to the biden family. if that were the trump family, can you imagine, they would already be in prison. it is just, it is just not fair. we've seen this two-tiered system of justice but it is relating to average american. the average american feels they have been wronged in unfair judiciary. people are rising up. they will send the bidens, this whole attempt to try to jail their political opposition has backfired very badly on the biden re-election campaign. david: we'll talk about that with a panel but what about the bragg case in particular? you see a judge who clearly seems to be favoring the prosecution in this case over the defense. i mean you don't have to necessarily be from the other side of the political spectrum,

to see that, but do you think the jury will be aware of that? because they don't know what the law is like. if there are certain instructions who get a judge who is biased that could taint the decision of this jury? >> i mean let's hope the jury sees that. every american watching this trial sees that. every person i've spoke with, especially my colleagues who spent a day in court sitting behind donald trump, have said the same thing. it is just, it is very obvious to everyone in the room. and i know that there are a lot of people concerned about any republican, much less donald trump getting a fair trial in a city that a big democrat city as new york city but you know, i'm hoping for the best. i think that they have overplayed their hand. we still don't know what their prosecuting donald trump over, even cnn analysts are saying they have done a poor job making their case. hopefully the jury will see that. david: well the cnn crowd over the weekend, they knew the jury

was home during the long memorial day weekend they changed the tune about their skepticism. they were all in for judge mershon. i was watching. congressman, thank you so much for being here. appreciate it. good to see you again. >> thanks, david. david: how will trump trial play with the voters? joining me, alec lace, host of the alec lace show. liz peek, syndicated columnist fox news contributor, hope you both had a great weekend. lawfare is not helping president biden's push. his numbers are going down, trump's numbers are going up but there is still the a-list working for president biden, hollywood a-list. a couple of them showed up today at the trial. i want to play a little bit of robert de niro, get your reaction. roll the deniro tape. >> if trump returnses to the white house you can kiss these freedoms good-bye that we all take for granted.

elections, forget about it, that's over, that's done. if he gets in, i can tell you right now, he will never leave. he will never leave. you know that. he will never leave. larry: he said it tree times for emphasis. what do you think voters which think of that? >> i think these apocalyptic warnings about all the horrible things that donald trump is going to do are just falling flat. look, not only have they engaged in this lawfare as you call it, so, persistently, bringing cases that any normal person would think are just complete rubbish, during all of that, people just tuned out, david. they tuned out- david: or opposite, they have tuned in and realized that they're not in favor of this. that what happened to trump could happen to us. >> i agree. david: yet they keep sticking with it even as biden's numbers come down. >> look, it is not just all these trials going on, biden is

spending tens of millions of dollars advertising in states. you kind of go back to where all of that huge spending numbers began, and all of this, these trials and stuff began, biden is not prospering from either one of those things. he is not making ground up at all. david: then, alec, it is not all the fact that biden is making bad moves. trump is making some very good moves, as limited as he is. of course he spoke to that bronx crowd. there was a woman who was kind of warming up the bronx crowd last week. her name is madeline brame. she was on "varney & company." i want to play a sound bite. she talks about to whom it is donald trump is putting his message. roll that tape. >> trump is speaking our language. he has figured out a way to connect, all right, to connect with poor minorities. let's put it in perspective, poor minorities, meaning black, white, asian, jewish, hispanic. you know, russian, italian. anybody who is struggling right

now to make ends meet, who work every single day, okay? when they get paid, their paycheck lasts them two days, and refrigerator is still empty. david: working for the vote of the common man and it is working. >> donald trump said it, doesn't matter whether you're black or brown or white, or whatever the hell color you are, doesn't matter we're all americans. contrast that with joe biden if you don't vote for me you ain't black. you see the discourse. star after bronx tale down in new york. the real bronx tale was up in the little breakfast talk coast, showed up with maga gear and supported donald trump. joe biden sun electable. this guy i would be surprised if he makes it in the starting gate. going down in every single demographic. maybe the dead voters will not vote for him this time. that remains to be seen. he is losing ground, he is losing ground with young voters. voters under 30, 2020, they were

solidly for joe biden 61%. i think we have the numbers. we can put it up. they're tied at 49% a piece. biden has lost 25 points over the past four years. >> well, part of it is certainly the economy, david. a lot of younger people are in a position where they cannot buy a house. that is sort of the starter step for people wanting to invest in their future. and housing is the most unaffordable it has been since the earlier 1980s. that is really a tremendous blow. i think the next story you will read about, is kids coming out of college not being able to get good jobs. we've seen layoffs in awful lot of hot industries like tech and finance. guess what? this is going to resonate with young people who already are having a hard time. it is not that surprising he lost the vote of young people. decides, remember, in the emperor has no clothes it was a young girl who sounded the, sounded the alarm that the emperor was naked.

young people are looking at jobe, are you kidding? he is the guy who will lead this country for four more years? david: alec, you do see some democrats, maybe you don't see them as much, according to "politico" had this piece out i guess yesterday, saying they're in full-blown freakout on the democratic side. they may not say it on television. they may not say it on press gatherings, et cetera. they are freaking out what is happening. which leads me to wonder whether joe will make it to the election, whether they pull him before the convention. >> if he does run it will be the biggest loss in voter turnout for joe biden for a sitting president ever in history. he will lose more votes than any other the president in history. donald trump gained more votes any other president in history, second time he ran, 11 million more votes. the joes will plummet. wait a minute, this guy got 81 million votes. he can't get 50? something don't smell right. david: in fairness to what happened, the fact is we tried his policies and they didn't

work. i mean that's really the point, isn't it? the border is a mess. the economy is a mess. foreign policy is not doing well. >> interesting fact here too, david, vegas odds has donald trump heaviest favorite i've seen since the election cycle. second is biden. third is obama, ahead of rfk, jr. david: if she does it. thanks so much for being here. president biden he is said he is ready to let successful trump tax cuts expire. art laffer, steve moore will tell us what that means for the u.s. economy when "kudlow" continues. we are living with afib. and over 400,000 of us have left blood thinners behind... ...for life. we've cut our stroke risk and said goodbye to our bleeding worry. with the watchman implant. watchman. it's one time, for a lifetime. hi, i'm ben and i've lost 60 pounds on golo. (guitar music) with other programs i've tried in the past they were unsustainable, just too restrictive.

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david: as our national debt is about to pop over $35 trillion, president biden's advisors are telling us only answer is to raise more taxes to keep president biden's trillion dollar spending plans just flowing into our economy. of course no matter who is elected the trump tax code is due to expire next year. so what happens next with taxes and with our economy? who better to ask but the crem dela crem in tax strategists and a techs of several tax codes, former reagan and trump tax advisor art laffer and steve moore, trump advisor, creator of the indispensable website, committee to unleash prosperity

hotline which everybody should get. you can look it up on the internet. good to see you both, gentlemen, thank you for being here. art laffer, first to you, we know, art, what will happen if biden is elected. he will increase taxes, claim it will all affect the rich, won't affect normal people making under $400,000 a year but we also know it probably will. what i'm more interested in, what happens, if trump is elected and what kind of new tax code? will he re-up the old tax code from 2017 or will it be something new like maybe a flat tax? i'm just wondering? >> david, you will have to call him. if you would like his telephone number i'm sure steve has it right there, he will give it to you to call him. i don't speak for donald trump but let me just say if those tax cuts expire if they do, the inheritance tax will be raised up dramatically. it is the single most obnoxious tax there is on the planet.

seriously, david, you can earn the income, pay your taxes, fair and square. you can go to vegas, you can can rouse, can gamble, drink, smoke, as far as the federal government is concerned fine it is your money. give that money to your kids or someone ales else's kids you dirty rat, we'll tax the beejeebers out of you. it is terrible plan. how he can let that expire is beyond me. if you hear about the gaza relief pier, today? it sank. it cost $350 million and it zing. that is biden's economics perfectly said. he tries to do relief aid, it sinks in the mediterranean. he can't tie his shoes or chew gum. it is tragic. david: we'll throw it to steve, if he will answer that question. we heard the story what will happen if biden is elected. what happens if trump is elected? what kind of a new tax code or

re-upping of the old tax code will we get? >> certainly we'll keep the tax cuts that arthur laffer and larry kudlow and others had such a big impact in putting together. you know you've heard of something, you probably heard of this before, david, that there is a very fame must curve in economics called the laffer curve, right? david: yes. >> that curve says if you lower tax rates, are you ready for this, david, if you lower tax rates you can actually get more revenues -- david: but it never happens, steve. that has never happened, has it? >> you know what? it just happened the last few years. i was just looking at these numbers. david: i think we can put it up. hold on a second. we have a full screen. put up the tax receipt full screen we have. this is what happened. we ended up with 47% increase in tax revenues since the trump tax cuts were put in. >> that's right. so, in fact if you look at the original forecast, when the trump tax cuts passed, not openly did we get a lot more

revenues than they said we would with the tax cut but we got more revenues, arthur, even before the taxes were cut. in other words, i'm not saying the tax cuts paid for themselves. what i'm saying they did juice economic growth. they made america a more prosperous place. one other quick thing if i could. one of the unheralded features of the trump tax cut is we doubled the standard deduction. by doing that, arthur laffer, we took a big step getting to a flat tax. guess what all of the deductions, vast, vast majority of americans don't itemize their deductions anymore. that means only people that do are the rich. that gives us opportunity, get rid of all deductions, get the rate down to 20%, you're almost there for a flat tax. david: are you taking that art? >> i understand that, steve. write it up for me. the tax cuts paid for

themselves, more than paid for themselves. >> steve, i have loved working with you from the beginning, david, you too. you guys are the two greatest people on earth. i love you, love you, i don't know if you know, david, steve and i is doing a book. steve is doing the book, i'm tagging along with him on it. we have a new one called trumpnomics 2.0. steve, what's it called? david: go ahead. given an opportunity to sell a book. >> yeah. i'm going to tell you, david, we talked to donald trump about this. he said, no, don't call it that. call it the greatest economic expansion of all times. that's trump for you. david: the fact of the matter is we will have a change, steve, there goes art. he is back again. we will have a change and it may eventually be a flat tax, very quickly, you have got 10 seconds, steve? >> i'm all for it. i think, look, trump has learned the lesson. lower taxes more growth. david: gentlemen, wonderful to see you as always.

what a great couple. thank you very much. more "kudlow" right after this. ♪. (vo) sail through the heart of historic cities and unforgettable scenery with viking. unpack once and get closer to iconic landmarks, local life and cultural treasures. because when you experience europe on a viking longship, you'll spend less time getting there and more time being there. viking. exploring the world in comfort.

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thank you for watching special edition up above. tomorrow by mcdonald, congresswoman tony and will start. should be a great show. lucas coming up next, liz mcdonald to take you to the next hour. >> great job, david. that was terrific. ey