being and those kind of things so listen. basic math, common common common sense ultimately prevail. here is the thing. if you hide out in a foxhole, waiting for the moment for things to fall apart, this is what i wrote to her. and the same thing that always stays in my head going back to 2009. so many people did not want to buy this market. they didn't care in 2009-2010 they were so afraid the next shoe was going to drop. it was the ultimate buying opportunity for a generation of investors and so many people missed it, so yeah, listen. there are going to be wars. there are going to be calamities things are rough and the fiscal stuff that we've done is outrageous but for me to go to 100% cash? no. we're in it to win it. liz claman taught me that. right, liz? liz: in it to win it. charles: that's right. liz: so original. that be me. charles, thank you. fox market alert. folks, talk about a delayed

reaction. 24 hours after apple's rollout of a lost of new a.i. features for the iphone, ipad and mac users, illicitted a yawn from investors and lock at the stock today. the peanut gallery morphed into a cheering section driving the stock into the first record of the year and market cap to $3.15 trillion. this gain, of about 6.5% that you see is pushing apple to the very top of the ceo jones industrials and the s&p. maybe investors are warming up to the fact that the new a.i. offerings which include a partnership with chatgpt and siri will only work on the most expensive and latest models of the iphone, ipad, and mac, meaning a fresh upgrade cycle might be on the way and with it new revenue. not if tesla ceo elon musk can help it. he tweet stormed after the announcement threatening to ban all apple devices from his companies if apple integrates open a.i. into its operating system, which he says would threaten users privacy.

then he retweeted a follower's prediction that x would team up with samsung to create a phone and then elon musk added, "it is not out of the question." none of it is helping elon musk stock, it's down two and one- third percent. it's the third-worst performer at the moment. to the heat map, not exactly heat map, it's luke warm although a few names just turned positive after languishing in the red but that's still only one-third of the blue chips in the green right now. apple we already said was at the top. go to the bottom here. we'll start with boeing which is the third-worst performer. it remains grounded after reporting 24 jet deliveries last month. boeing had said that it hoped by now that number be closer to 40, so big disappointment there. we've got boeing down $4.50 to 185 and change. you'll also note all three financials in the dow, jpmorgan, and amex are the worst performer s along with goldman sachs swooning on this first day of the federal reserve's two-day interest rate setting meeting.

so it's not a surprise that the overhang of the fed's announcement tomorrow about the future path of rate cuts, plus because you add to that the may consumer inflation report, also out tomorrow. it's not a surprise we're seeing a cap on gains at the moment. the dow, it's actually off the lows of the session still losing about 116 points, and after posting records yesterday, the s&p and the nasdaq are record territory again. any gain for either would mark new all-time highs at the close. russel 2,000 down 6 points so with the fed and inflation keeping a lid on gains i guess that's fair to say, let's get to the floor show to talk about it joining me now kate moore the head of thematic strategy for the blackrock global allocation fund and joe lavornia , chief economist at smbc nico securities america. all right, kate. if ever there were a week where the sentiment be tested regarding investor's taste for equities. it's this week, right? >> well i think it's this week. we've gotten through earnings. earnings were really quite good.

we had leadership from a.i. and tech giants that were putting up huge cash flow and now we're in kind of a show me moment which is what's going to happen in the path of policy going forward in the second half of this year and i think the inflation print tomorrow and fed commentary i think are going to be really important for equity sentiment as we go into what's traditional ly a lower liquidity period of the summer. liz: joe, why do you think names like jpmorgan, amex, and goldman , are swooning today, of all days. if the fed is going to leave rates unchanged tomorrow, which is widely expected, but maybe telegraphing at least one rate cut, maybe by the end of this year, i don't know what do you think? >> one problemly, more next year. liz: wouldn't you think if rates remain high that benefits the big financials? >> the concern i have broadly speaking with markets and to some extent the economy because the financial firms provide liquidity and the credit to keep the economy moving is this yield curve. we are now essentially all-time record inversion and that needs

to at some point normalize and we could argue about what the spread is but it's not negative. the two should be below the 10- year and the yield curve hasn't worked as a recession gauge and of a downturn perhaps in part because money moves into private credit but right now i'd say the curve needs to eventually normalize. we think it comes through fed easing, but if it comes through a increase in risk premium owing in part to perhaps more supply because 75% of all the issuance we've had in the last year has been in bills. that's a different story but i do think over time the yield curve will normalize. i mean it will steep en. short rates below long rates that generally be good for financials but today's price action i can't speak to. liz: well yeah the 10 year yield is down 6 basis points and that has helped equities move up off the floor, right, kate? >> yeah. liz: but that said, charles was just talking about harry dent saying the everything bubble has yet to burst. what everything bubble? yes the s&p is hitting all-time

highs same with the nasdaq but again, the more heavily-weighted names, apple, google, meme, microsoft, nvidia, are gabbard ing the oxygen. >> they are grabbing most of the oxygen and a couple points. yes we're hitting new all-time highs in the equity market and that makes people a little bit anxious spell as we've done it a number of times throughout the course of 2024 but the mark etiquette has been driven by companies fundamentally strong with high free cash flow and we have good visibility into future earnings. i can't call it a bubble if there's not a lot of speculation these are companies continuing to deliver and we have great expectations for the future so let me put that out there. the other thing is, you've seen under performance of sectors and segments of the market and small caps here, that are struggling more in this economy. that make sense. if we were inflating all parts of the market at the same time regardless of fundamentals, i would say okay, bubble. liz: it is not an everything bubble. let's just be clear about that but joe, when we look at a

market that is booming overall, that looks like it's booming, s&p and nasdaq have records right now, how does that affect real interest rates? what is the balance there and what can people interpret about where rates will go? >> well the interesting thing is if you look at the interest rates, real rates, inflation adjusted fed funds rate, it's up near 3% and yet financial conditions have eased because the equity rally we've been talking about has been so intense. i don't think it's a bubble. i agree with kate on that totally however the market is sort of front-run soft landing so if you have a soft landing it makes sense for the equity market to performance it has. however, the fed's in a tricky spot because they are trying to raise rates to cool the economy to bring inflation down, and also fighting at a cross purpose to all of this government spending but that rally in equities is impacting corporate behavior because you're less likely to stop capex and lay people off, creating a tremendous amount of household net worth upwards of $10 trillion in the last year, so you've got the high rates,

but financial conditions have eased. the question is how does it get resolved? do you actually have the soft landing or is there eventually the downturn? liz: would that shock anybody if we had a 5-10% correction in the stock market? its been a while. >> no, 5% corrections are good news. we like that for repositioning our portfolio and that is part of a normal-functioning market so i would expect we'll see a 5% pullback at some point. liz: both of you what's going to trigger something like that? >> something we're not expect ing. i don't think, kate, when is the last time we had a 2% correction in the market? liz: well october was a correction right? >> yeah, we had a bit of a pause that refreshes i would say >> but i should take that back. 2% on the day. liz: oh, on the day. >> on the day its been a long time which gets to the talk about bubbles and exuberance but liz it's going to be something that just surprises us. liz: so black swan? >> not necessarily black swan, just something we weren't anticipating a re-evaluation of the outlook, so back in february

of 2018 people weren't expecting just market positioning. liz: what if somebody comes out with hey, we're tightening our lending standards a lot more than we already have. >> i think one of the things that the could shake consumers and the investor sentiment could be the consumer a little bit further. we already are starting to see a two-speed consumer in this economy and we know that the low end consumer is facing a lot of pressures from higher rates but the fed may not be able to react to that because the average consumer is doing much better. i think we see further cracks there i'd say credit card data, retail data, that's not our expectation but i think that could shake some investor sentiment. liz: let's just finish up by getting both of your thoughts on the best areas for investment. i know joe, you're an economist but surely you can look at areas that the can holdup even if we don't get a rate cut this year. >> i actually think investment grade credit is a good place to be. certainly the front end, liz, is a place to hang out. you're earning over 5% so this isn't an investment but it's the place to be in cash. liz: three-month, five-month? >> yeah, you're earning a lot and by the way what might spark

that correction is if the fed actually was more symmetric in saying maybe the next move could be an interest rate hike. nobody's talking about that. it could be the fact that who wins in november and what next year's fiscal policy looks like. liz: and what tomorrow's cpi number looks like. kate i'm sure you're one of those people who thinks it's better to have money in the stock market. where? >> i would love to tell you, i'm very contrarian but technology and technology adjacent themes still make a ton of sense. i need to follow the cash flow. this is a theme i've been talking about to you today and staying in the high-quality fundamental companies makes the most sense, so a.i., i think there's some interesting opportunities in software, particularly some of them that have sold off more recently and there's more upside in the hardware. liz: great to have you both. kate, joe. >> thank you. liz: a big moment tomorrow by the way, so got to stay tuned to this hour. elon musk may not be happy with apple's a.i. play but artificial

intelligence is giving wall street new weaponry to generate wealth. well this one weapon is called bright wave and the ceo is here next to tell us how his a.i. platform could disrupt the $23 trillion financial services industry. this is a fox business exclusive you're only going to hear him here. wait until you hear what his a.i. can do. the biggest banks and berkshire hathaway makeup the financial holdings, ticker xlf, up f% over the past 52 weeks and the "clayman countdown" is coming right back. dow is still languishing in the red but the s&p and the nasdaq in the green. stay tuned we're coming right back.

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liz: fox business alert. you have heard the claims that artificial intelligence can save you up to 15 hours of work per- week but now morgan stanley ceo ted pick says he's got hard evidence. while speaking at an annual conference yesterday, pick said a.i.'s ability to do things like transcribe conversations and then categorize them into topics has helped save employees a huge swath of time. ten to 15 hours per-week. the version his employees are using is a.i.@morgan stanley which it introduced back in september and it's called "an enormous productivity quantum" but its already got competition. brightwave a.i. is a brand new research assistant for financial professionals. brightwave doesn't just save you work. it checks its work. the start-up announcing today it completed a $6 million seed funding round led by vc group backed by steve coen's .72 ventures. pretty exciting.

co-founder and ceo mike conover joins me now in a fox business exclusive. how does it work? that fascinated me, mike. >> well these systems are incredibly powerful, and we have created technology that is able to reflect on intermediate work products just like a human analyst would. it generates findings and research insights and then self- assesses. do i believe this? what else would i need to know in order to harden my conviction in this investment thesis? it's an incredible technology and we're excited to be building it and on a mission to transform the way humans understand the world around them. liz: industry-specific a.i. is really the next evolution in all of this , so you're specifically in the financial world for professionals in finance. what makes yours different? i mean, where do you source your information from because that, to me, is the most important thing. you're only as good as your source material. >> that's so true, and we

operate over a vast universe of content, so earnings call transcripts, high signal long- tail public internet content, breaking news to include user uploaded content like sell-side analysis or industry trend reports but i'd also say that the chat is not enough for finance and i would say that the way that these products behave is as important as the data sources that they consume, and our team has a deep background. my co-founder was the former cto of the federally derivatives exchange and i've built previous models in my language work and it is an incredibly complex technical challenge so i'd put the technology and product right up there with the data. liz: you weren't just at databricks, you were at linkedin , you were at workday, which gives you interesting perspective about saving hours of a work week versus the a.i. piece of all of this. >> absolutely. liz: so you mentioned something. you said you put in sec filings,

earnings caltrans represents. to me, then you get actual factual stuff from the ceo's themselves versus, i don't know, reddit chat groups which are not exactly as we saw with google's gemini, reliable. what should i do when my pizza isn't sticking to the pizza crust. oh, use glue. well that had been sifted by a.i. from a reddit room. do you include that kind of stuff? the reddit room stuff? >> no, no. well so it depends. listen, there are certainly alternative data sources that sell and transact on reddit. i think it's a matter about judgment and empowering finance professionals to select the sources that they trust and creating tools that allow them to identify information they wouldn't necessarily tend to otherwise. flexibility is the name of the game. liz: can it turn the source information into original writings, original work?

>> yeah, for sure. so we connect fact patterns across hundreds and thousands of documents so if you have, if you believe that semig.lutides are going to blow up the diet industry, i want to be the first person to know about a human clinical trial and understand the structure of a value chain and connect the dots that others might miss is a central part of what our tool is able to do. liz: you got the $6 million inside funding. what do you plan to do with the money? >> we hire incredible people. we're building a small team of exceptional humans. liz: let's say, how small? seven employees. folks, if that tells you anything about how a.i. can actually help you keep your headcount down, i mean, it's pretty interesting. >> well, to be fair, you hire people with an operator mindset and you can do a lot of damage so we've got talent from goldman

and meta, alongside award winning research engineers. it's an exceptionally stacked deck, and we're thrilled to be capitalized to execute on this vision. liz: well, we are going to watch it very closely, mike, and watch you and your small but mighty team. any chance you would expand this to the retail investor so they can have this type of tool? >> you know, we're focused on servicing financial services. we think there's a lot of value there and we have our eyes on this prize, but brightwave is on a mission to transform the way humans understand the world starting with the global financial system. we believe that there are diverse applications with technology potentially to include retail but that's not what we're doing right now. liz: thanks, mike. >> thank you. it was a pleasure. take care. liz: we'll watch it. on average a chatgpt query needs nearly 10 times as much power to process as a simple google

search. those queries fueling data centers need for power. goldman sachs now saying electricity demand will grow by 160% by 2030. how to meet that need? well the department of energy is turning to mothballed nuclear plants. we're about to take you live on a tour of one that's about to flip back on the lights. you've gotta stay with us to see it, next. you know, so much chatter about data center, reit, real estate investment trust being a hot investment. year-to-date, slumping more than 5% but iron mountain on the other hand has spiked 27% while digital realty is looking at an 11% gain. we are coming right back. (♪)

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[announcer] charles schwab is proud to support the independent financial advisors who are passionately dedicated to helping people achieve their financial goals. visit findyourindependentadvisor.com liz: powering the a.i. revolution has some utilities thinking outside the electrical box. the ceo of constellation energy group saying today he is considering restarting the three -mile island nuclear power facility. for those of you who don't know, three-mile island is the site of the largest nuclear accident in us history, when the reactor suffered a partial meltdown in march of 1979.

constellation ceo joe dominges telling reuters an uptick in large a.i.-focused data centers coming online in the next three years could drive an additional 10-20 gigawatts of demand and it could take them until early next decade for new small modular nuclear reactors to begin producing energy so would kind of make sense. now you look at constellation energy group stock has flipped from negative to positive right now up 1% at the moment. it is the largest operator of us nuclear plants, but it's not alone with the idea of restart ing old power plants that are run by nuclear power. kelly siveri joins us from cover t, michigan where the nuclear power plant will reopen, kelly? >> yeah, that's right. whole tech international acquired the plant when it closed in 2022, liz, and now it's being recommissioned thanks to a $1.5 billion loan from the department of energy. this isn't just in line with the white house's clean energy goals but it also is going to

help accommodate how much power we need with a.i., as you mentioned. i know before the break you were talking about just how much power a chatgpt search uses, but let's look at nvidia's h-100 chip, driving the a.i. boom, adding a $1 trillion value to nvidia. the max power needed for this chip is almost the same amount as it is to power an entire average us household for a year. in addition to recommissioning the plant, whole tech plans to add two smr's as you mentioned, small module reactors and these could be the first of their kind in north america. that would make the project about $2 billion. now, compare that to the newest plant built from the ground-up, in georgia, just a few months ago, it became a $32 billion undertaking by the time it was completed just a couple of months ago. so recommissioning plants is really the cheapest way to bring nuclear energy back up in the us it was once the leader and now it's trailing behind.

>> the whole community is watching. the whole country is watching and several parts of the world are watching to see what's mapping at pallisades. >> now smr's are already being used in china and russia. these are 300 megawatts of power compared to this plant which is 800 or so megawatts. it willpower 800,000 homes, but now we have big names like microsoft and open a.i. that are going to tap into this new technology. they've already been investing in start-ups that are trying to make a splash in the smr world. liz? liz: kelly, thank you very much. all right, fox business alert. the us has now been joined by another country in slapping tariffs on chinese-made electric vehicles. turkey has now imposed a 40% tariff on chinese imports and you can see chinese ev stocks are not responding well. you have lee auto down two and

one-third% nextio down 5.5%. well what is the big issue about turkey? it's not so much turkey. it's that turkey's tariffs raise concern that the european union might follow suit as soon as this week. the us increased import levies on chinese ev's to 100% from the previous 25% just last month morgan stanley calling ford its top pick in the us auto sector. famed analyst adam jonas believes that ford is demonstrating increasing understanding that its current ev strategies have to change materially. he cites ford's efforts to work with key chinese players, which of course has a lot of complaint from some members of congress so we'll see if that works out. it's not helping the stock ford is down 2.5%. general motors trimming expected sales in production of ev's this year as us adoption is slower than expected and the auto maker expects production of 200,000 to 250,000 ev's down from the range

of 200 to 300,000. gm also says it will buyback outstanding shares worth $6 billion as part of a new stock repurchasing program and that, of course, thrills investors. they're buying up the stock and it's up about 1.8%. let's look at spotify. it's on the move on a report that it plans to unveil a new higher-priced plan for the top end of its user base sometime later this year. the stock had been in the green. it's now dipping by about three- quarters of a percent. bloomberg says the new plan will cost at least $5 per month more and will provide users with better audio and new tools to create playlists. on average, works out to about 40% more in costs than the existing plans. has the fed lost the dot plot? it's an important and totally wonky and geeky question but we'll find out tomorrow when each fed voting member pinpoints where he or she thinks interest rates will be in the coming year will the fed signal two interest

rate cuts? one, or none? former atlanta fed president dennis lockheart has his finger on the pulse of the fed. he joins us next. iranian immigrant joe kiani, was just nine years old when he arrived in the us. at just 25 years old he started a medical technology company in his garage and eventually landed the patent for the first device that non-invasively checks your blood oxygen. after developing his pulse oximeter he and his company masi mo took on apple and apple watch for copying his oxygen monitoring watch technology and the international trade commission agreed with kia ni and banned apple from importing apple watches with that feature. today joe kiani holds more than 500 healthcare patents, employs hundreds at his southern california company. it's kind of tiny compared to apple so how did david take on goliath? he tells the both painful but also victorious story in the latest episode of my everyone talks to liz podcast.

it's on apple, google, spotify, iheartradio, wherever you hear your podcasts so throw me a question about the podcast. tweet me@talk to liz claman on x we're back in a minute. the dow losing about 172 points and i remind you the s&p is still at record levels although it's up now just by two points. the nasdaq up 100 points also at a record.

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—you got this. —thank you. vanguard's retirement solutions can help all your employees be well on their way to their financial goals. that's the value of ownership. liz: folks we need to get you some breaking news here with the closing bell ringing 22 minutes from now. look at the s&p and the nasdaq. they are at records right now. in fact if we look at the intra days you can see the price action here. high of the session for the s&p was a gain of 11 points. we are up six, but any gain means a record and then you look at the nasdaq. high of the session, a gain of 128 points. we're just off that, still up about 110 points. what is bringing the industry it sees along? apple. apple at a fresh record high.

the first of 2024. let me give you the high of the session. $206.03 right now it's at $ 205.62 and look whose coming along for the record party. microsoft, throw up the microsoft chart. you can see that mr. softey at the moment is at a record. we do have it at up about 4%, sorry up about 1% rather or $ 3.99, and this is a 25-year chart during which its gained 981% but microsoft at the moment , high of the session we've got it at about $432 a share and we're at 431 and change so fascinating moments as we run up to the closing bell but the clock is ticking toward tomorrow and this hour, when we will be right in the middle of federal reserve chair jay powell 's post interest rate decision news conference. investors are hoping it's during this hour that fed chair jerome powell will hint at easing monetary policy, meaning cutting

rates, sooner rather than later, so pretty much no chance for a cut tomorrow, but for the july meeting, fed fund futures that's the markets betting mechanism, they are pricing in an 8.9% odds of a rate cut, it's barely anything, right? but what was once a much-higher percentage bet on a cut coming in september, had been more than 70% is now at a measly 51.7%. now the question is will there be any rate cuts this year at all? a recent bloomberg poll shows 41 % of economists polled now believe the fed will only signal two rate cuts on the quarterly dot plot. well 41%, same number, predict it'll be one or none at all. former president of the federal reserve bank of atlanta dennis lockheart has been part of many a fed meeting joining us on the phone in a fox business exclusive. dennis, give me a sense. how many rate cuts are you anticipating for the rest of the year? two, one, or none? >> well, i think the dots will

show two, and i would say my opinion is we will not see a cut until the november meeting at the earliest, and i think there is a south korea scenario in which we end up with one or none. it just depends a lot on how the inflation data come in over the coming months. liz: ahead of the meeting. hours before, we get the consumer price index number for the month of may. cpi and the expectation is that the forecast will come in at at least about 3.5% year-over-year. it's not close enough to a 2% target rate of inflation that the fed truly wants, but can i ask you to bring yourself and my viewers into the room where it happens. there have been many a meeting i'm sure where you got data in the morning of the afternoon where the announcement was going to happen. how much does that data weigh?

especially an inflation report like this. >> in my experience, and of course i haven't been in the room now for some years, but in my experience, late-breaking data, unless it's really startl ing and unless it really diverges from expectations, really doesn't have that much influence. the momentum of the meeting, which of course started today, is really carries through. they will get at 8:30 tomorrow morning a handout that shows you exactly what the inflation cpi inflation data showed. liz: okay. >> but i doubt that it's going to have a major effect on the outcome of the meeting. liz: huh. the dot plot. so this is the visualization of where each of the voting members stands on where fed funds rate, the key interest rate, the benchmark, will be within a year, couple of years. i mean, there are different

levels here of that. where do you think the terminal rate should be, meaning when they're finally done fiddling around with rates and leave them for a while, where is that terminal rate? we're at 5.25 to 5.5% right now. >> i'm in the school that the terminal rate is probably higher than it has been for the decade from the financial crisis through let's say 2017 or later, so that would put the sort of resting rate, when everything has settled into between 3.5 and 4 in my opinion. that would suggest that the neutral rate of interest is higher than its been in the past liz: you know, it's pretty interesting that the fed keeps saying, and i understand it, we're data-dependent. we're data-depend", but there is that belief that there is a big risk of making a mistake or causing a so-called financial or monetary accident.

here is what the chief economist just said on our show a few days ago. listen and then you can react. >> monetary policy acts with a lag, so you are really targeting the economy of tomorrow, but if you do that based on yesterday's data, you're likely to get it wrong, but i understand why, you know, liz, they got 2021 so wrong when they decided it was transitory when people, including us, were telling it's not transitory, pay attention. liz: yes. >> they are afraid of making a major strategic call and i think that that is where we have the risk right now. liz: dennis, do you see risk in remaining data-dependent and sed the curve once again if you wait too long? >> there's always risk associated with the business of central banking and data dependents is a lot better than the alternative which is going by gut feel. you don't want 19 people in the room who are influenced by

the last conversation they had with the ceo or with a community leader or whatever you want people who are looking at the best evidence we have. it's not ideal. it's not perfect but it's the best we have, which is the data. unfortunately, mohammed is right it's backward-looking. what we will know tomorrow will be from the month of may and we're half way through the month of june and sometimes economies can adjust rather quickly to development, so it's the best we have to go on and in my opinion, we clearly want a fed that depends on data making their decisions. liz: dennis, the excitement kicks off tomorrow. for all of us business heads and investors which we love it. i mean fed day is fascinating. the markets often move on what is said during the news conference so i hope everybody tunes in. dennis lockhart, we appreciate

you coming on. thank you. dennis says one in november. probably that's it maybe but fox business, we're going to have it all complete second-by-second coverage of the fed's rate decision beginning 2:00 p.m. eastern on "making money" tomorrow so lock it in and then the real excitement happens at 2 :30 p.m. when the fed chair, jerome powell, faces the financial press for q&a. it spills over to the "clayman countdown", the 3:00 p.m. hour. usually anywhere from 12-14 or 15 minutes in. we're going to have all the post -game arm chair analysis of the rate decision and powell 's presser with our line- up of all-stars. grant thornton, chief economist, dianne swonk, former federal reserve vice chair randy quarrel s and cross mark global investments bob doll among our them only on fox business. when we come back we've got all kinds of competing headlines flying around at this hour on paramount. i'm talking like i'm looking at them right now.

they're hitting the tape. deal or no deal, to sell it. charlie gasparino up next on what is happening. (bell ringing) someone needs to customize and save hundreds with liberty mutual! (inaudible sounds) (elevator doors opening) wait, there's an elevator? only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, ♪ ♪ liberty. ♪ (vo) a law partner rediscovers her grandmother's artistry and establishes a charitable trust to keep the craft alive for generations to come. from preserving a cultural tradition to leaving a legacy, a raymond james financial advisor gets to know you, your passions, and the way you enrich your community. that's life well planned.

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liz: folks we have to look at

paramount shares. they are on a wild roller coaster ride over the last ten minutes. over a report in "the wall street journal" a contradict ad bloomberg report that popped up earlier. the bloomberg report said shari redstone had a deal. ready to sell her controlling stake to skydance for $2.25 billion. the journal came out with the opposite, ended discussion with david ellison's skydance media. she is likely to pursue a sale of just national amusements, her controlling share without merging paramount into other company. charlie gasparino, what do you say? >> these are good reporters. this is where i came down the middle of this s-storm. liz: last 53 minutes. >> just the whole saga we don't have to go through the sale has

been the most insane thing i've ever seen, covering corporate finance for 30 years. liz: can we see the stock? put that up. >> it was popping on notion it was, the bloomberg thing. when the bloomberg came out i checked with my source, because i was preparing to come on here talk about the update of the deal and my source said don't go with anything definitive. this is someone on the skydance side. don't go with definitive. we believe we are inching closer. then the journal and i tweeted that out obviously. then the journal, said it is not a done deal until you see the paper. very clear with that. who knows with this thing. i said that yesterday. i would be equally surprised no deal or deal today. the journal came out and sate it is off. she wants to sell it whatever it was. liz: 2.25. >> 2.25. i want to say all of us could an right here. could on be the fact she doesn't

want to change paramount's corporate structure. could be she wants to sell her stake and skydance might buy it, i don't know or someone else might. the money here, 2.25 billion, the names they throw around to spend that type of cash, does edgar bronfman have that type of money to burn on something like this? i don't know. does bain capital want to get involved in this? sounds like pie-in-the-sky. david ellison has larry ellison's net worth of 80 something billion dollars. so he has the money. he has backing from redbird and kkr. i would just say this is in flux. tomorrow we could be seeing different headlines. obviously this is an arb play. when you see that, the arb is, people --

liz: arbitragers. >> that is m&a arbitrage. as you see the headline your algorithm kicks in and starts selling. the only thing definitive, in the minutes before the journal came out, my guy who is pretty good, we've been on the money on this whole story, said, we believe we're inching closer and, but don't write anything definitive because this thing could blow up. you know shari redstone, i don't want to say peculiar, but this is a very bizarre. liz: hard to let go of something that has been sew very much a part of your genetic material. >> your father created the company. it is melting ice. liz: gets to go to the sun valley event. >> meanwhile her fortune is evaporating before our eyes. if they don't do a deal, watch the stock go into the digits at that point, single digits.

liz: like warner brothers/discovery? >> yeah. why wouldn't it? by the way in many ways it is more financially troubled company than they are. they have more, better cash flow. they have better programing, they have more scale. i mean this, this is a problematic company. liz: can you imagine what it's like to be an employee seeing this whole thing? >> funny you mentioned that. full disclosure, my wife used to work at showtime, now barely existing. it's gone. her friends are like, people there are just killing themselves. by the way they're laying people off. they're cutting every expense possible. there is no, like almost no marketing budget. it's, you know, it is really a horrible situation. for the people that worked at some of these properties that are owned by showtime was part of cbs, you know, it is like their legacy was great programing and it's gone.

they frittered it away. destruction of corporate wealth. you know who would be a great guy to get on the show? get matt blank on. amazing guy. he will give us good perspective. >> charlie, thank you very much. speaking of david ellison, son of the oracle founder, oracle shares are slightly lower ahead of the cloud computing company fiscal fourth quarter report comes after the closing bell. today's downdown closer says he has the name in the sector to take your portfolio into the clouds, a tech name. dan genter, give your thesis why that name should be in there? >> cisco is one that i'm looking at that you know i think is, you know, look, it is a legacy. it's something that you know, people have kind of brashed under the -- brushed under the rug. there are a lot of green shoots there. enterprise is one of the biggest

areas up 2%. they're seeing cloud computing up about 9% and sitting at a 12 pe you just have a chance you can get some more participation in the technology side and you're not really chasing the stars with these astronomical pes. you get a 3 1/2% dividend while you wait. it is a good place to hang out. good place to take money off the table with the "magnificent seven." go in there, get a good dividend while you wait. have something literally the potential for a double as you're looking at the next three to four years. liz: do you worry at all cisco or maybe intel gets booted out s&p and replaced by nvidia? obviously has a massive market cap, major earnings, and widely-held? the dow, rather, the dow? >> that is a real possibility, liz. nvidia deserves to be there. the fact of the matter the company is growing very strong levels. the p-e multiples for nvidia have not expanded very much.

the earnings, the story, frankly the hype is being realized. it is growing at those types of levels. can it continue to grow at that level is going to be the question. either way they are doing to continue to be the player. other companies get moved out but cisco will be a long-term player because they will be part of the next generation. nvidia is a major participate pant and they're major beneficiaries, they're doing all this buildout but then you will move more to the computing side, more to the cloud side. that is where a company like cisco will have a new life. liz: which got networking equipment, original business going strong. thank you very much, dan, good to have you. folks, new records for the s&p and the nasdaq. [closing bell rings] dow closing lower by 124 points. do not miss our coverage of the fed rate decision news conference. ♪. larry: hello, folks, welcome to "kudlow," i'