we really learned lessons . and we really learned lessons. and crucially, will anything change going forward? and did you see this morning rishi sunak give what i would say was quite a terse press conference, basically imploring his mps to get behind his rwanda plan . of get behind his rwanda plan. of course, off the back of the shock resignation of his immigration minister last night. is it all make or break now for rishi sunak and over in cornwall? they are literally turning off the lights to save money. yes more than half of their street lights will soon be off from midnight to 5 am. is this the future ? and are you this the future? and are you back? move and today has back? this move and today has been deemed a national day of school university strikes in school and university strikes in support and support of palestine. and according to a poll, many young

people regard hamas as freedom fighters rather than terrorists. what do you make to that . yes, what do you make to that. yes, indeed. all of that coming up over the next hour. and i can tell you now there'll be some robust debate between my panellists. but before we get stuck let's cross live to stuck in, let's cross live to polly middlehurst for tonight's latest headlines . latest news headlines. >> michelle, thank you. well, the top story this evening, russia's federal security service, the fsb, has hacked high profile mps in what the government says was a sustained effort to interfere in british politics. the deputy prime minister has said today, piers , minister has said today, piers, civil servants, journalists and non—governmental organisations have also been targeted . it's have also been targeted. it's understood politicians had their personal email accounts compromised . oliver dowden says compromised. oliver dowden says the cyber attack is a clear pattern of behaviour by russia

and he says those responsible will be held to account . will be held to account. >> i can tell you that a unit within the russian federal security service s known as centre 18, has been behind sustained hostile cyber operations , is aimed at operations, is aimed at interfere ing in parts of the uk's democratic processes . this uk's democratic processes. this has included targeting members of parliament so civil servants think tanks, journalists and ngos . ngos. >> well, another news today, the first vote on the new emergency rwanda legislation is going to be put through parliament on tuesday next week. the prime minister today has been busy defending the government's plan , defending the government's plan, describing it the country's describing it as the country's toughest anti—immigration law. rishi sunak acknowledging some disapprove of the bill, but saying it addresses concerns raised by the supreme court. he insists the government will get asylum flights off the ground this bill blocks every single

reason that has ever been used to prevent flights to rwanda from taking off as the rwandans themselves have made clear, if we go any further, the entire scheme will collapse and there is no point having a bill with nowhere to send people to . nowhere to send people to. >> but i am telling you now we have set the bar so high that it will be vanishingly rare for anyone to meet it . anyone to meet it. >> rishi sunak. now an external review has found itv made considerable efforts to uncover the truth about an alleged relationship between the television presenter phillip schofield and a junior member of staff . the report says the staff. the report says the broadcaster was made aware of rumours circulating in 2019, but was unable to uncover the relevant evidence until mr schofield himself made an admission in may last year, 48 people were interviewed, but the review author says the daytime tv presenter reluctantly declined to take part himself

because of the risk to his health. boris johnson has rejected claims that he didn't care about the suffering inflicted on the country during the coronavirus pandemic. inflicted on the country during the coronavirus pandemic . and a the coronavirus pandemic. and a warning there are some flashing images coming up. the former prime minister was answering questions at the covid inquiry today about parties at number 10 downing street during lockdown. and he said the idea of mass rule breaking within government was a million miles away from the truth. he also admitted that a trip to barnard castle, however, in 2020 by his former chief adviser, dominic cummings , chief adviser, dominic cummings, was indeed a bad moment at the foreign secretary, says unblocking ukraine aid would be a christmas present to vladimir putin and xi jinping . lord david putin and xi jinping. lord david cameron has sent a warning after senate republicans in the united states opposed a multi—billion dollar aid bill. he urged allies to rally around kyiv, describing the response to the conflict as the response to the conflict as

the greatest for test our generation. as he delivered a speech in washington . it comes speech in washington. it comes as the us congress failed to pass an £88 billion package of wartime funding for ukraine and israel . here wartime funding for ukraine and israel. here at wartime funding for ukraine and israel . here at home, the wartime funding for ukraine and israel. here at home, the bbc licence fee is increasing . to licence fee is increasing. to £169.50 annually next year. it follows a two year price freeze. it was due to rise in line with inflation, but instead will be based on september's consumer pnces based on september's consumer prices index . the national union prices index. the national union of journalists says it will leave the bbc with a £90 million funding gap . so the culture funding gap. so the culture secretary has also confirmed the launch of a review into the licence fee model itself , which licence fee model itself, which may help ease future price rises . prince harry has said his children can't feel at home in the uk if he can't keep them safe . the duke of sussex is safe. the duke of sussex is taking legal action against a decision in 2020 that he wouldn't get the same personal

security when visiting the uk. a court's been hearing that harry doesn't agree that it was a choice for him to have stopped being a full time working member of the royal family the home office argues his security arrangements changed when he stepped back in 2020. the british poet and writer benjamin zephaniah has died at the age of 65 on social media. his wife confirmed she was with him when he passed away. the birmingham born poet, described as a true pioneer and innovator, was diagnosed with a brain tumour just eight weeks ago . that's the just eight weeks ago. that's the news on gb news across the uk , news on gb news across the uk, on tv, in your car, on digital radio and on your smart speaker by saying play gb news. this is britain's news channel . britain's news channel. >> thanks for that, polly on michelle dewberry. i'm with you till 7:00 tonight alongside me. i've got the former editor of the sun newspaper, kelvin mackenzie, and the political

commentator. and i have to say, and the birthday boy, matthew stadlen. a treat . you're stadlen. what a treat. you're spending your birthday here with me birthday me and kelvin mackenzie birthday is. don't get any better than that. i've got a present you did from the host of the show and the production team and card. the production team and a card. yeah. don't tell everyone more than you got from the wife. yeah, tell anyone. people yeah, don't tell anyone. people will a nice will start to think i'm a nice person. mean, i don't want to person. i mean, i don't want to put paid all those rumours put paid to all those rumours that online about me. that are online about me. crikey. did. he got some crikey. but he did. he got some chocolates. nice innit? crikey. but he did. he got some cryou ates. nice innit? crikey. but he did. he got some cryou can't nice innit? crikey. but he did. he got some cryou can't celebratee innit? crikey. but he did. he got some cryou can't celebrate yourit? if you can't celebrate your birthday what can you do in life anyway? you know the drill on dewbs& in touch with all dewbs& co. get in touch with all your tonight. your thoughts tonight. vaiews@gbnews.com. you vaiews@gbnews.com. it's how you get you can tweet get hold of me. or you can tweet me at news. do not forget me at gb news. do not forget that we're on a mission. nigel farage king of the jungle. what do you make to that? everybody you know the drill on this by now. there's a qr code on the screen. whip out your telephones when it says scan to vote. by the way, people have been asking me, what do you how do you me, what do you mean? how do you scan well, just scan it? well, you just open your get mobile phone, open your get your mobile phone, open your get your mobile phone, open

your and basically just your camera, and basically just take picture. that's how you take a picture. that's how you do. your camera take a picture. that's how you do. it your camera take a picture. that's how you do. it and your camera take a picture. that's how you do. it and it your camera take a picture. that's how you do. it and it should camera take a picture. that's how you do. it and it should pop|era take a picture. that's how you do. it and it should pop upi over it and it should pop up with a link. and then you go from there. that's what you do. i just think it'd be absolutely hilarious, if hilarious, quite frankly, if won. imagine people won. can you imagine people would quite upset, some would be quite upset, some people there anyway. would be quite upset, some peowell, there anyway. would be quite upset, some peowell, if there anyway. would be quite upset, some peowell, if i there anyway. would be quite upset, some peowell, if i everhere anyway. would be quite upset, some peowell, if i ever goe anyway. would be quite upset, some peowell, if i ever go on nyway. would be quite upset, some peowell, if i ever go on the ay. >> well, if i ever go on the jungle, will you be recommending that gb viewers for me as that gb viewers vote for me as well? why not? well? yeah, why not? why not? >> matthew sadler >> would you have matthew sadler as king of jungle? was as the king of the jungle? was that what you want? yeah, i wouldn't. would on the jungle? >> i wouldn't want to eat the bugs >> you wouldn't mind the money, though, would you? >> no. who would? who would win the money? >> at one point, would >> would you at one point, would you go the jungle? you go on the jungle? >> i think i would, >> i don't think i would, actually, kelvin, if someone said you, give you a 1.5 said to you, i'll give you a 1.5 million, would be in there. million, you would be in there. >> you'd be like a one point, a 1.5 million. >> i'd do it. but the rest of the lot got 15 grand. and i'm not doing it for £15,000. >> they've got 15,000. >> they've got 15,000. >> course the >> exactly. but of course the fame associative sam fame associative your sam thompson the bloke thompson or something. the bloke i on apart i really like on there apart from who is turned out to from nigel who is turned out to be as anybody knows him,

thoughtful quite good guy thoughtful and quite a good guy is bel—air. i thought he is tony bel—air. i thought he had he had something about him had a he had something about him . the boxer . had a he had something about him . the boxer. yeah. . tony bel—air, the boxer. yeah. and i think he'll he'll come close to winning. >> anyway, this is not radio times or whatever. tv review magazines out there. this is magazines are out there. this is a program. so let's a news debate program. so let's get stuck in, shall we? boris johnson, he is facing his second day grilling at the day of grilling over at the covid. inquire why have you been following this? how interested in this are you? are you in this topic are you? are you one those people that sit one of those people that sit glued screen watching glued to the screen watching every single sentence is uttered, every single whatsapp message that is poured over while people start crying about it. the language used ? or are it. the language used? or are you someone that just says pack it in and move on? life has progressed since then anyway. bofis progressed since then anyway. boris johnson today basically denied ever saying that he wanted to let the virus rip. he called dominic cummings. wanted to let the virus rip. he called dominic cummings . you called dominic cummings. you remember that barnard castle trip? apparently to test the eyesight ? trip? apparently to test the eyesight? boris johnson admitted that was, i quote, a bad moment. and he said that he was desperate to keep schools open,

apparently, and said that mass rule breaking within downing street was a million miles away from the truth. what do you make this inquiry? i mean, this is a very long, drawn out, convoluted, very expensive lviv inquiry. are you a fan of it? >> no, a complete waste of money. waste of time. only money. waste of time. the only enjoyable aspects to it. i think, are the whatsapp messages in which you discover a real great, great treasure trove of history syrians when they write about it. but everybody believes the person is a c—word, the other person is a c—word, which of course is true actually in politics. and also , by the in politics. and also, by the way, in the executive suite, which is why it's called a c suite. but but so i think it's a complete waste of money. and actually, we probably be better off if we let other countries do their research and then compile it, our version of it at the it, our own version of it at the end of it without wasting everybody's time on this. i mean, the truth the matter mean, the truth about the matter is kc there sees his is that the kc there sees his role now as a as a minor sort of kind of tv celebrity. so he's he's, you know, lovely coiffured. but what i'd really

like to know is actually, if we did it a different way and got straight to it and said, anybody over 60 can't go out right ? over 60 can't go out right? everybody else can go about theirjob. and by the way, their job. and by the way, instead of spending 70 billion, if we'd only spent 10 billion, would we actually have the inflation we today, which inflation we have today, which causes trouble for so causes us so much trouble for so many lives? so i am massively hostile to it and actually , hostile to it and actually, boris, everybody thought they'd rip old boris apart. he's. he's too clever for this. all the politicians are too clever. nobody can remember what happened before. and actually, they're very grateful that life has moved on. >> all the politicians are too clever. i never thought i would hear that sentence during these political anyway , political times. but anyway, matthew, the thing that i really want to know from this inquiry, and i don't know whether it will be able to deliver this answer or deliver it convincingly, is whether lockdowns were the right approach to this crisis because there was huge disagreement. >> i think probably most people in the country broadly , as i as

in the country broadly, as i as i did, supported them. but were they justified , died, did more they justified, died, did more people die as or suffer as a consequence of the lockdowns than were saved because of them ? than were saved because of them? and what we're actually seeing at the moment is a he said she said, really, um , unseemly farce said, really, um, unseemly farce where you get one senior minister or adviser saying something terrible about another and then the same is said or similar is said in return. we all know what we think about bofis all know what we think about boris johnson by now, we all know whether we think he handled the pandemic well or badly. i thought he handled it very badly. i thought he was cavalier in those opening weeks. what i want to know is what happens next time. boris johnson, very unlikely to be prime minister next time. what should we do if we have something similar again ? we have something similar again? >> tell you one thing. >> yeah, i tell you one thing. we idea that this we won't do. the idea that this judge who reports next year and then in two years after that, then in two years after that, the full report i think in in in 26. right. what we won't be doing and then there's another

one. we 20 years time that one. we say 20 years time that that that report will be gathering dust somewhere and then we all start dying then suddenly we all start dying all over the place. and then we have another report after that. well, didn't we take any well, why didn't we take any nofice well, why didn't we take any notice of the last report? these reports cannot deal with the unexpected . and i mean, that is unexpected. and i mean, that is the of it. and agree the reality of it. and i agree with you. think in relation to with you. i think in relation to boris, you know, he didn't he was a he was a libertarian. he didn't want to he didn't want to do it. and it may in the first instance, have cost some lives. but what definitely has cost this country dramatically is the 70 billion that went on, people sitting on their fat backsides being paid 80% of their money and doing nothing for 18 months. part of our country has never recovered. other countries have economically done better. and yet and yet that's because. because boris turned out to be more of a socialite than a conservative. >> shocking part of what this inquiry is supposed to be looking into. one of its terms of reference is the economic

response and therefore surely the economic impact . and i think the economic impact. and i think it is really important for people like me who were supportive of those lockdowns to understand the full extent of the consequences. can this inquiry deliver a plausible answer to that? i'm not sure. i'll just say one other thing for those who lost loved ones in the pandemic, and there are many, many tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands perhaps in this country who did this is a very de serious thing . and we very de serious thing. and we can sort of be light hearted about it at times, but actually about it at times, but actually a lot of people will be glued to it because they will associate it because they will associate it with the trauma of losing a mother or losing a father or a grandparent and so forth. >> you see, i'm not light hearted about it. what i actually think is that the focus is in all of the wrong areas because , you know, talking about because, you know, talking about was number 10, a toxic workplace , you know, did he call you this word? who called who this where? none of those people will be in power again the next time

there's a pandemic. whether there's a pandemic. so whether or were shouty managers or not they were shouty managers or not they were shouty managers or managers hugged or decent managers and hugged each each each other or alienated each other frankly, utterly other is quite frankly, utterly irrelevant the next pandemic irrelevant to the next pandemic going forward. >> i think something >> and also, i think something a corollary that corollary of that is that i don't particularly blame boris johnson for road testing ideas . johnson for road testing ideas. we can all say things. i hope not. the c—word, but we can all say things or express views or test ideas out behind the scenes that we wouldn't want the public to know about. so if boris johnson was thinking johnson clearly was thinking different things through before he stood on the he then went and stood on the podium with government policy, i don't hold accountable to don't hold him accountable to what he was saying behind the scenes. what i hold him accountable for is actual accountable for is his actual policy. his actual decisions. and on that, think he failed and on that, i think he failed miserably. >> so of the problems you >> so one of the problems you face you this huge face when you have this huge thing happen, which had never happened before , is you're happened before, is you're getting all kinds of different forms which is forms of advice. so which is saying one thing, vallance is saying one thing, vallance is saying something else. hancock over there saying something else . something over . rab is saying something over there. the idea that he

there. actually the idea that he is prepared to be flexible, to move around actually , you'd want move around actually, you'd want somebody to be flexible . and so somebody to be flexible. and so i no criticism of when you i have no criticism of when you when you're when your feet are put to the fire that actually some times you are changing your mind over issues. and i don't see what the point is. and as for this kc, how much is he being paid? how much is this not costing us? why are we doing all this? and actually, do you know what? at the end of it, the report when it comes out, it'll say something like there were a few mistakes few few few mistakes and a few few thousand people died and that will kelvin has a point here. >> michelle and it is much >> michelle and that it is much easier all three of us and easier for all three of us and indeed people at home to say this is what should have done this is what he should have done or would have or this is what i would have done really . or this is what i would have done really. i'm or this is what i would have done really . i'm massive done really. i'm a massive critic of boris johnson, but being prime minister of this country at a time of a pandemic is not an easy thing to. >> i mean, i would say as >> yeah, i mean, i would say as well, mind the role well, i wouldn't mind the role of media evaluated as of the media being evaluated as part of this inquiry well. part of this inquiry as well. how media coverage how was the media coverage managed? said, you

managed? because you said, you know, people were know, most people were supporting and all supporting on lockdowns and all the it. think the rest of it. i think initially there was a cohort of people absolutely, people who absolutely, categorically support categorically didn't support lockdowns one. lockdowns right from day one. there a cohort of there was also a cohort of people that perhaps supported them initially started them initially and then started going, a second, someone going, hang on a second, someone didn't up. right. didn't stack up. right. something quite right yet didn't stack up. right. so and 1ing quite right yet didn't stack up. right. so and 1in�*you quite right yet didn't stack up. right. so and1in�*you started e right yet didn't stack up. right. so and1in�*you started to ight yet didn't stack up. right. so and1in�*you started to see yet didn't stack up. right. so and1in�*you started to see the or and or you started to see the consequences and effects of the of the consequences of the lockdowns didn't lockdowns and then didn't support problem many support them. my problem is many of those voices were completely alienated and down, mocked, alienated and shut down, mocked, ridiculed and almost cancelled . ridiculed and almost cancelled. if you dare to criticise the government, 100% right. >> actually, if you tried, if you tried to go on to either youtube or twitter under the old ownership , right, not under the ownership, right, not under the elon musk ownership , you went on elon musk ownership, you went on there with anything which indicated that this was madness. you would get banned , you'd get you would get banned, you'd get kicked out. you couldn't say anything like that. i think gb news would probably be one of the few areas where such a debate might take place. but anything else you were cancelled

and it could have a serious effect on your life and your career. >> of course, i would like to look as well about things like the vaccine mandates. don't forget all those care workers as well. they all lost their jobs, didn't they? about 40,000 of them. it that didn't want to them. was it that didn't want to have vaccines? that's the have those vaccines? that's the kind that i would like kind of thing that i would like to mixers. michelle to see explored mixers. michelle do what all those young do you know what all those young people in the background of the inquiry are inquiry with their laptops are doing? i don't. doing? i must confess, i don't. i also wondered that point i have also wondered that point myself. if after the break rishi sunaki myself. if after the break rishi sunak i want at him sunak i want to look at him tonight gave a press tonight because he gave a press conference morning. conference this morning. i would say quite terse actually, say it was quite terse actually, basically his to basically asking his mps to rally around and support this rwanda to the rwanda plan when it goes to the vote tuesday. is make or vote on tuesday. is it make or break for rishi sunak

that both parliamentarians and ministers have. >> you're listening to gb news radio and on oh, hello there, everybody . everybody. >> i am michelle dewberry and i'm with you until 7:00 tonight. alongside me, the former editor of the sun, kelvin mackenzie, alongside me as a political commentator, matthew stadlen. now lots to unpick tonight when

it comes to british politics, because you'll be familiar with the fact that last night, of course, we saw the resignation, didn't we, of the immigration minister, robert jenrick. well, today rishi sunak he held a press conference. i watched it and i have to say i thought it was quite tear. basically it was all in to promote his new all in a bid to promote his new rwanda plan. and i would say galvanised people, his mps, mainly to come together and support his plan. what a pickle this all is. i mean, there's a couple of areas i want to explore on this. i want to explore on this. i want to explore what an earth the tories are doing to themselves. and i'll come on to that in a second. but i also want to explore more, you know, do we are we at of a make or are we at kind of a make or break point for rishi sunak? >> i well, there is no >> i think well, there is no possibility of bill being possibility of the bill being voted down and there's a very good for that because if good reason for that because if that happened, he be that happened, he would be forced the country. and forced to go to the country. and if he to the country, we'll if he went to the country, we'll say, are we now? towards say, where are we now? towards the end january, the back end of january, february, talk about a 200 seat majority. it might be a 400 seat

majority. it might be a 400 seat majority. it might be a 400 seat majority. it would be for laboun majority. it would be for labour. would an absolute labour. it would be an absolute nightmare. these tory mps nightmare. and these tory mps may not be very good, but they aren't completely stupid, so they're not going to do that . they're not going to do that. however, the trouble now is that once this so rishi will expend a load of political energy forcing this thing through making various promises and all this to people right to get them to vote for him once he's done that for he is a dead duck for the rest of this. >> prime minister seems to be the most politically useless prime minister i can remember. at least liz truss believed in something kelvin, he something. kelvin, right. he doesn't whether he's coming doesn't know whether he's coming or he doesn't know how to or going. he doesn't know how to drive through his flagship policy. us at the policy. he told us at the beginning the year he was beginning of the year he was going to stop the boats this yeah going to stop the boats this year. it's december now, december seventh, he's year. it's december now, dece boasting seventh, he's year. it's december now, dece boasting thatznth, he's year. it's december now, dece boasting that he's he's year. it's december now, dece boasting that he's stopped; now boasting that he's stopped a third of boats. and he's third of the boats. and he's absolutely oh, right. third of the boats. and he's absithely oh, right. third of the boats. and he's absis he .y oh, right. third of the boats. and he's absis he as oh, right. third of the boats. and he's absis he as cluelessoh, right. third of the boats. and he's absis he as clueless as right. third of the boats. and he's absis he as clueless as starmer >> is he as clueless as starmer is when faced with the same questions about at what would labour do right over to you. you you're the spokesman for him.

>> yvette cooper. i'm not his spokesman at all. >> oh, you're not? >> oh, you're not? >> absolutely not. get that idea. i don't think he's. i think rishi sunak because he used his prime minister. think used his prime minister. i think the people. the majority of people. >> would labour what the majority of people. >> labour would labour what the majority of people. >> labour actually_abour what the majority of people. >> labour actually do. ur what the majority of people. >> labour actually do. no nhat would labour actually do. no tell what think it's going tell me what i think it's going to be. tell the viewers what labour would do. >> give it a go. so go on >> i'll give it a go. so go on then. so i think what starmer is. what i know he's saying is. well what i know he's saying is. well what i know he's saying is he's going down those is he's going to hunt down those gangs. know whether the gangs. i don't know whether the tories made a serious tories have made a serious effort to hunt those gangs. effort to hunt down those gangs. perhaps to more perhaps they need to have more cooperation french. why cooperation from the french. why don't they have good relations? i hunting down i am in favour of hunting down the gangs. >> i suggested to them that >> when i suggested to them that this is a war and that we should send the sas in and wish them well. right. that happened send the sas in and wish them well. rigieven that happened send the sas in and wish them well. rigieven gb at happened send the sas in and wish them well. rigieven gb at hapthrew then was even gb news threw their up the air. well, their hands up in the air. well, we do have you suggesting now that up in the air that starmer hands up in the air that starmer hands up in the air that suggestion. that starmer hands up in the air that thoughton. that starmer hands up in the air that thought it. that starmer hands up in the air that thought it was ridiculous. >> i thought it was ridiculous. i go on hunting down the gangs. >> mean them. >> i don't mean shooting them. i mean them. identify mean finding them. identify them. difficult could it them. how difficult could it really be? and then arresting them in jail, them and sticking them in jail, either or britain. either in france or in britain.

but do you need to have but to do that, you need to have some sort of cooperation with the we have that the french. do we have that cooperation? no, not at the moment. of course we do. let me finish. >> we're sending them tens of millions pounds and we are millions of pounds and we are they helping? millions of pounds and we are they don't1g? millions of pounds and we are they don't know. we brexited >> i don't know. we brexited they. >> e’- w the tories have >> i think the tories will have an advantage. >> will have an >> starmer will have an advantage in his relationship with european countries with those european countries because him as an because they treat him as an aduu because they treat him as an adult sort of sympathetic adult and as sort of sympathetic on some to european on some level to the european union. by the union. it doesn't mean, by the way, we're going go back in, way, we're going to go back in, but i just the other thing but can i just the other thing he's going he's going to do he's going to he's going to do with immigration. he's to with immigration. he's going to aboush with immigration. he's going to abolish discount. this abolish this 20% discount. this is immigration, 20% is for legal immigration, 20% discount workers from discount for workers coming from overseas. on overseas. labour is tougher on immigration. think immigration. you might think yvette cooper cooper is no softy. tougher on softy. she she's tougher on immigration on immigration than i would be. on the question sunak brings a the question of sunak brings a tear glass on this tear to a glass eye on this question of sunak. and it's a really important because he really important one because he is our prime minister is actually our prime minister our third year whatever our third in a year or whatever he he's come out with this he is, he's come out with this last desperation, last ditch desperation, desperate attempt to drive down immigration don't immigration numbers. don't forget, said 13 years forget, cameron said 13 years ago going to be tens of ago it was going to be tens of thousands, now 6 or 700,000 net.

he this he comes out with this new policy announced the policy announced earlier in the week by his new home secretary, james cleverly, own james cleverly, and his own immigration minister puts a massive great bomb under the policy resigns. i've got policy and resigns. i've got i've his resignation letter i've got his resignation letter here. is a this here. right. this is a this is a crumbled prime minister at the head of a crumbling administration. >> can't get to the >> what i can't get to the bottom of and this is going to be a great laugh come next november when labour come to power. right. the issues, the boats will treble, boats will double, treble, quadruple . it will be it will be quadruple. it will be it will be like the armada again. honestly labour have no solution. there is a solution. but what rishi says or sunak says . he says we says or sunak says. he says we can't deploy it because rwanda ridicules . we are suggesting ridicules. we are suggesting that in return for their 85 million they don't have to take anybody. frankly so they're not prepared to go the extra mile for. >> one of the things i thought was interesting robert jenrick resignation letter i've just been playing the screen been playing it on the screen there, too. sunak for there, he says, too. sunak for there, he says, too. sunak for the first time, we've developed a comprehensive upstream the first time, we've developed a compr

gangs, basically says it's gangs, he basically says it's made the united kingdom a partner of choice to those who share a determination to tackle illegal immigration. often it's led record numbers of small led to record numbers of small boat seizures and boat equipment, seizures and preventing more people preventing thousands more people making this crossing. i found that quite interesting because why would it be only for the first time that you'd set up that strategy in terms of going harder on the smugglers as words fail me when it comes to that one. i have to say now i want to just look at something that the tories have been doing themselves because the front page the mail caught my page of the daily mail caught my eye morning. i'll just pop eye this morning. i'll just pop it up on the screen in case you were it, because they were not across it, because they were not across it, because they were when are were basically asking when are the tories basically going to stop all their infighting , stop all of their infighting, saying, will the saying, look, when will the tories give fighting saying, look, when will the torie�*other give fighting saying, look, when will the torie�*otherande fighting saying, look, when will the torie�*other and startighting saying, look, when will the torie�*other and start fighting each other and start fighting against another against labour? now another thing that caught my eye again today is twitter. the today is on twitter. the conservative the conservative party the conservatives from their official account sent this tweet out. now, in case you're not familiar with what this is, i'll get it up on screen. but

basically bbc presenter she was messing around before they went live on air at the news and she she stuck her middle finger up right. a lot of being said about this, but what the conservatives then did is put picture up, then did is put that picture up, said labour. when you ask for their plans to tackle illegal migration this up, well, migration and put this up, well, look at what happened next right ? tobias ellwood so we'll be familiar with the mp familiar with him. he's the mp for bournemouth east. he then put a tweet up. look this for bournemouth east. he then put ilfweet up. look this for bournemouth east. he then put (if ieet up. look this for bournemouth east. he then put (if i caan. look this for bournemouth east. he then put (if i can showok this for bournemouth east. he then put (if i can show it this for bournemouth east. he then put (if i can show it where; for bournemouth east. he then put (if i can show it where he one. if i can show it where he was basically saying, take this down, please delete this post. what i found a little bit odd , what i found a little bit odd, though, i must say about tobias ellwood doing that was his previous tweet to that one was him retweet, tweeting the conservative i kid you not everybody. this is what i'm saying. those russians that have been hacking into our politicians recently, they must be scratching their head and bewildered going on. bewildered at what's going on. >> a very good point >> you've got a very good point that are doing that the tories are doing a brilliant job keir starmer. brilliant for job keir starmer. they tearing they are once again tearing themselves . gavin barwell, themselves apart. gavin barwell, who is a very senior figure in the administration .

the theresa may administration. he is also demanded that this be taken down. let's look at that picture again, though. you've actually had to blur out, pause everyone. you have had to blur out at a sort of campaign ad effective an attack ad by the governing party. it is unbelievably childish and it shows the conservatives to be unfit for office. having said that, i will caveat it with one thing. labour has also done similar sort of stuff. it's gone very low and i think this coming general election is going to be the dirtiest general election we have ever seen. excellent >> excellent. it always cheers me up everybody's vile to me up when everybody's vile to each other. that's the whole point of politics, isn't it? you're not supposed be you're not supposed to be sitting there making apple pie and saying, hello, how you? and saying, hello, how are you? >> margaret >> can you imagine margaret thatcher out if thatcher tweeting that out if she had? >> no, no, a mistake. but >> no, no, that's a mistake. but he does it matter what ellwood ellwood thinks? it does matter what conservative party what the conservative party thinks. would been thinks. and that would have been an would have an error. they would have thought quite thought that was quite funny. i mean, made laugh. mean, that made me laugh. >> it's still up kelvin.

>> it's still up kelvin. >> that made me laugh. i love seeing that were thing, seeing that you were a thing, son. and son. i know, i know. and actually a successful editor, which is word you were missing. >> you're saying that the point of politics to be vile of politics is to be vile to each other? i agree with each other? i don't agree with that. but if i just test your logic. yeah, to test your logic. yeah, surely to test your logic. yeah, surely to test your logic expand it. yeah, it's logic and expand it. yeah, it's not to be vile to your own party, your colleagues. oh yes. >> oh, yeah. >> oh, yeah. >> no, don't think tobias, >> no, i don't think tobias, remember? remember what? >> the first >> remember what the first rule of politics you're of politics is when you're sitting in the commons. the enemy you, right ? that enemy is behind you, right? that is the truth. >> i don't think, to be fair to ellwood, he was being vile to the i'm not. the tories. i'm not. >> i mean, i don't mean tobias ellwood. what i mean is, for example, so example, generic. so his resignation i've seen that called treacherous . i've seen called treacherous. i've seen the tory they are the tory party. they are literally other . i literally fighting each other. i want to get hold of them. i want to get hold of them, treat them like are. my three year old like they are. my three year old child. and say, child. sit them down and say, what you? what are you? >> why is this? why is this happening? it's partly happening because rishi sunak a weak because rishi sunak is a weak prime who blows through prime minister who blows through the extent. the wind. yes, to some extent. starmer, the same. he's starmer, does the same. he's

done but immigration. >> permanent >> immigration permanent the tories tories keep tories keep the tories keep telling us, don't they? >> that immigration is such an important issue. the british people about in people really care about it in the last few weeks they've had to sack their home secretary, who resign only a who herself had to resign only a year ago, just before liz truss had and now the had to resign. and now now the immigration minister himself has resigned. it's absolute chaos at the heart of so the i totally buy this. >> the conservative party are at war over this issue and the right want to go further and the left it doesn't really matter what the left is being beaten up by labour and they're beating beaten up. >> no, no they're not beating up by labour. labour are inconsequential in this debate and become and when they do become consequential, expect them and when they do become co be, juential, expect them and when they do become co be, honestly, expect them and when they do become co be, honestly, it expect them and when they do become co be, honestly, it will)ect them and when they do become co be, honestly, it will be: them and when they do become co be, honestly, it will be an em to be, honestly, it will be an absolute laugh watching them. you've stumbling about starmer. >> he's got an open goal. keir starmer some people might starmer who some people might assume a softie, is assume is a bit of a softie, is actually taking the tories actually taking down the tories on their own terms. >> they thought they were going down. were going down. they said they were going to immigration figures. >> they've up these figures. >> let's get them up on the

screen. i mean, these figures have been going up for a very, very, long time. this isn't very, very long time. this isn't just this kind of, oh, know, very, very long time. this isn't jlblinked (ind of, oh, know, very, very long time. this isn't jlblinked and of, oh, know, very, very long time. this isn't jlblinked and 10s)h, know, very, very long time. this isn't jlblinked and 10s ago know, very, very long time. this isn't jlblinked and 10s ago . know, very, very long time. this isn't jlblinked and 10s ago . lookyw, very, very long time. this isn't jlblinked and 10s ago . look at i blinked and 10s ago. look at this, everybody. immigration figures. hasn't as i figures. well that hasn't as i said michel, said earlier, michel, david cameron, started whole cameron, who started this whole thing 13, 14 years thing as this whole 13, 14 years of tory rule with bit of lib of tory rule with a bit of lib in at the beginning he wanted to drive down the figures to the tens of thousands in 2010. >> we've had 13 >> this is 2023. we've had 13 years of it and the figures are 6 or 700,000. >> one of the reasons why our numbers are going up all the time because the idle brits, time is because the idle brits, having been funded for a couple for 18 months to sit on their backsides, suddenly discover, oh, i rather like being paid for doing nothing. so they're not working. has to do the working. somebody has to do the work. end up having to give work. we end up having to give out visas to get these jobs done. it's absolutely shocking. so why don't we do the obvious thing, is literally say thing, which is literally say you you are on benefits now. you are you are on benefits now. we're cutting your benefits in half, and get a job. half, go and get a job. >> otherwise, i'm all for incentivising to work. incentivising people to work. >> not i'm not incentivising

>> i'm not i'm not incentivising britain a country like britain to become a country like india where you fly into mumbai and of people and there's sort of people sleeping, road from sleeping, lining the road from the absolutely the motorway. absolutely >> have you seen have you seen central london? have you been around central london? i've given people. around central london? i've giv> i've given people my jumper in past. is bad . we in the past. it is bad. we don't want to worse. what you want it to get worse. what you are to say is that we do are right to say is that we do need immigration. >> by the thanks very much. >> by the way, thanks very much. >> by the way, thanks very much. >> tories failing on >> the tories are failing on their own terms. it doesn't mean we don't need immigration. >> we need to cut benefits dramatically. >> tories watching >> well, any tories watching this, look in this, i'll tell you now look in the have a serious the mirror. i have a serious word with yourself and ask yourselves, on earth are yourselves, what on earth are yourselves, what on earth are you your selves? you're you doing to your selves? you're doing of destroying doing a betterjob of destroying yourselves than labour ever could do. and the just could do. and by the way, just a quick to update you with quick point to update you with the immigration robert the immigration minister, robert jenrick, resigned jenrick, of course resigned yesterday. was yesterday. i thought it was quite because quite interesting today because what rishi sunak did was basically rollout into basically split the rollout into two. now you've got someone two. so now you've got someone in charge of legal migration and someone of illegal someone now in charge of illegal migration separating those two. do was sensible do you think that was a sensible move the break, move or not? after the break, more than half of cornwall's street lights now will set to

street lights now will be set to be off between the be switched off between the hours midnight a.m. hours of midnight and 5 am. loads guys have in loads of you guys have been in touch it's just touch saying it's not just cornwall. michelle happens in cornwall. michelle it happens in our neck the woods, do our neck of the woods, too. do you this move? it's you agree with this move? it's all about saving money. it all about saving money. is it the right see you

are they right to laugh? is your policy a joke and your government a laughing stock on this matter? can i quickly ask second one reports today in . the second one reports today in. the hi there michelle dewberry with you till 7:00. >> former editor of the sun kelvin mackenzie alongside me as is the political commentator matthew stadlen. i have to say, many of you are getting in touch saying that you do feel the covid inquiry bit of a covid inquiry is a bit of a waste of time . um, stephen says, waste of time. um, stephen says, what do i think will come out of it all? absolutely not. perhaps perhaps. himars says if the government has much time to sort out covid as inquiry seems out covid as the inquiry seems to things might be to do, then things might be perhaps better in this country . perhaps better in this country. i'm interested. are you someone that lose a loved one during that did lose a loved one during covid? how do you feel about the inquiry ? richard says on rishi

inquiry? richard says on rishi sunak he needs to start changing the focus now and start becoming a dynamic tax cutting tory machine . forget the boats, he machine. forget the boats, he says. people have stopped listening. interesting richard. so he thinks you should just do what? let as many boats come. forget the whole thing, johnny says. rishi had his chance, is messed up, so it's time for him now to go. really? do you want another prime minister do you another prime minister or do you want another tory prime minister? do want minister? or do you want a general election or what? expand on let me know. alan on your point. let me know. alan says, surely michelle, you can get the of where people get to the root of where people are buying these inflated bills. these things. why these are no small things. why aren't them down at aren't we tracking them down at the heart of it? i hear you. let's talk street lights, though, shall because though, shall we? because cornwall. than half , cornwall. well, more than half, around of their around about half of their street switched street lights will be switched off. it'll be about 35,000 in all. many of you have been in touch with me already tonight saying it's not just cornwall. michelle. i live in suffolk. our our lights on the development are turned off at 1130 every night. dorset christine says

we've had lights out on residential roads for at least ten years. she says it's lovely because you can see the stars. dorset says chris again. yes dead of night, lights go off, he says. dead of night, lights go off, he says . nothing new. lots of you. says. nothing new. lots of you. west sussex , wales . what do you west sussex, wales. what do you think to this van—tam idea? >> save money. >> save money. >> nobody seems to be loving it as well. >> no, nobody around between 12 and 5, with the exception of burglars. so they don't they don't need to worry about that . don't need to worry about that. and not only that, the councils this is all a precursor. this is all a precursor to all the councils going out with their begging bowl directly. the socialist mob get in right and saying, we've got to have a massive increase in council tax and they will invent some top level ones so that somebody who has a house bigger than the size of a shoebox will end up be paying of a shoebox will end up be paying double the money they're making. council tax is going to go making. council tax is going to 9° up making. council tax is going to go up dramatically under the socialists. so if somebody likes to keep this and play it back to

me in a year's time, if i'm still alive, i'll claim my reward. you might be stretching it there. >> by the way, loads of people are out and about in the dark. not just burglars. you've got your workers, you've got your night workers, you've got your night workers, you've got your people or people your young people or your people that are and about going that are out and about going out. you've got people that just that are out and about going out. �*differentt people that just that are out and about going out. �*differentt peopdoingt just work different shifts doing whatever. there's loads of people out on about. i wouldn't want wandering the want to be wandering in the streets pitch black. streets and the pitch black. >> won't be wandering >> you won't be wandering the streets. why they streets. and that's why they know there's no more danger know that there's no more danger to the lights on than to you with the lights on than with lights off. so if you with the lights off. so if you if you've got any brains at all, you certainly know to go you certainly know how to go down the road with the lights on your so i wouldn't your car working. so i wouldn't worry. saving lot of worry. and it's saving a lot of money. the councils all money. and the councils all claim their skin. the reason their third the their skin is a third of the money getting goes in money they're getting goes in pension funds. should we pension funds. we should we should addressing that should start addressing that issue man issue as a strapping man wandering the streets at night. >> you might feel safe >> you might not feel safe necessarily. yeah, back in necessarily. well, yeah, back in the back the day, the day. back in the day, a little old man, little old fella. >> many women, for example, wouldn't feel comfortable walking dead wouldn't feel comfortable wa night, dead wouldn't feel comfortable

wanight, i dead wouldn't feel comfortable wanight, i can dead wouldn't feel comfortable wanight, i can tell dead wouldn't feel comfortable wanight, i can tell you. dead of night, i can tell you. >> matthew, where you on it? >> matthew, where are you on it? >> matthew, where are you on it? >> well, that's a very good point, because we're thinking >> well, that's a very good point, itacause we're thinking >> well, that's a very good point, it initiallyre're thinking >> well, that's a very good point, it initially ase thinking >> well, that's a very good point, it initially as far1inking >> well, that's a very good point, it initially as far as> a woman. >> if you were a woman. >> if you were a woman. >> michelle, you still would be you're still attractive me. you're still attractive to me. >> matthew, want of know you >> matthew, i want of know you to this the show. to do this after the show. >> go on. you can have your private time go on. private time then go on. >> no. think it's a >> no, no. i think it's a reasonable i think it's a reasonable i think it's a reasonable for women. i reasonable concern for women. i was actually endorse last was actually endorse it last weekend the beautiful town of weekend in the beautiful town of dorchester, there in the dorchester, driving there in the sort the lights sort of twilight with the lights coming on those coming towards you on those roads. quite dangerous roads. that is quite dangerous because a narrow road. once because it's a narrow road. once i got dorchester, i was i got to dorchester, i was interviewing vince cable. so i got to dorchester, i was interv cable vince cable. so i got to dorchester, i was interv cable useda cable. so i got to dorchester, i was interv cable used to able. so i got to dorchester, i was interv cable used to be e. so i got to dorchester, i was interv cable used to be theo vince cable used to be the leader of the lib dems. and importantly, business leader of the lib dems. and importantduring business leader of the lib dems. and importantduring the ;iness leader of the lib dems. and importantduring the coalition secretary during the coalition years years with secretary during the coalition years and years with secretary during the coalition years and osborne.h secretary during the coalition years and osborne. so he was cameron and osborne. so he was part of he takes collective responsibility and part of he takes collective res saidibility and part of he takes collective

res said to .ity and part of he takes collective ressaid to me, and part of he takes collective ressaid to me, if and part of he takes collective ressaid to me, if i'm and he said to me, if i'm remembering correctly, that there basically there is basically an existential facing existential crisis facing councils, as kelvin says, they're skint. they they're basically skint. they haven't enough haven't got nearly enough money. good. a mage going good. and this is a mage going to be a major problem for the new labour to address new labour government to address when it comes. >> are they how are they >> and how are they how are they going solve it? going to solve it? >> matthew would only be >> matthew they would only be you know, how they're going to solve you? solve it, don't you? >> think if we had brave >> i think if we had brave politicians think politicians and i don't think starmer brave politician, starmer is a brave politician, they'd suggesting raising taxes. >> well, they're going to. >> well, they're going to. >> you might say in >> you say that you might say in one sense looked at one way as a proportion of the economy or whatever. the highest whatever. we've got the highest tax but compared to tax burden ever. but compared to some other european countries, we taxed. we are relatively under taxed. it's here. you take it's not popular here. you take a brave petition to say a brave potted petition to say it, we go. it, but here we go. >> on the one hand, >> councils on the one hand, we're we've got real we're being skin. we've got real socialists attacking the socialists are attacking the tories a high tories because there's a high level tax and they're saying, level of tax and they're saying, however, are asking and however, we are asking and there's a load of people at the bottom need some money for bottom who need some money for doing bottom who need some money for doiiso we are. >> so here we are. >> we'll give you a socialist b i haven't i haven't attacked the tories on that basis. >> starmer, i >> i'm saying that starmer, i

don't >> i'm saying that starmer, i dont on >> i'm saying that starmer, i don't on this. don't think is strong on this. if we want better public services and if we want better council we're going council facilities, we're going to some of us. ideally, to have some of us. ideally, those broadest those with the broadest shoulders have to shoulders are going to have to pay shoulders are going to have to pay more money and you don't get anything for free council. >> weybridge on >> i live in weybridge right on bndge >> i live in weybridge right on bridge fire bridge council. you could fire a cannon the town hall and not cannon at the town hall and not kill anybody. is nobody kill anybody. there is nobody doing work in there. doing any work in there. >> all out lazy >> they have all gone out lazy anyway . if any of the lib dems anyway. if any of the lib dems or socialists like to come on to me, you could have said, you said the only people out late at night are burglars. >> as michelle rightly pointed out, sorts of out, there are all sorts of people working very hard at that time goodness me, time of night. goodness me, imagine sun readers imagine what the sun readers would think. >> right. apparently, >> get this right. apparently, according council in according to this council in cornwall, saying that cornwall, they're saying that their up their their prices went up for their energy 92% last october. they . energy 92% last october. they. reckon £1.3 million is the additional cost of this lighting. what are then found interesting, councillor stephen rushworth asked at a meeting of the council's customer services scrutiny committee . he sounds a scrutiny committee. he sounds a joy, scrutiny committee. he sounds a

joy, doesn't it? why is street lighting increasing . by £1.3 lighting increasing. by £1.3 million a year when the strategy is are to drop lighting and make it dimmer and save money? well what i found interesting was in response, the council's chief operating officer said she would go away and make report as to go away and make a report as to why couldn't you just answer it if it was such a simple answer, why do you need to go and do a massive. i think there is quite kind of things can i say this very quickly? why don't people in bigger houses pay higher council tax? >> don't want to know the answer. >> that's a short answer. what do you make? you live in do you make? do you live in a big house? do want to pay big house? do you want to pay more tax? i can hear you more council tax? i can hear you screaming. would you pay screaming. why would you pay more when more council tax when the services that you receive are currently substandard? tell currently substandard? you tell me today currently substandard? you tell me basically today currently substandard? you tell me basically a today currently substandard? you tell me basically a school today currently substandard? you tell me basically a school strikeday was basically a school strike day many places for day in many places for palestine. all ipso as well. many young people apparently , many young people apparently, according to poll, regard according to a poll, regard hamas as freedom fighters as opposed to terrorists. what do you make to all of that? see you

in two. hi there, michelle dewberry. till 7:00. former editor of the sun, kelvin mackenzie and political commentator matt stadlen keep me company. stop them talking over each other. tell them i've told them in the break they're going to behave much better or else they're going to get one of those. i've told them anyway. today there has a school strike for has been a school strike for palestine students up and down the country are striking. apparently in support them . apparently in support of them. also, something that caught my eye, new polling has apparently shown that gen z people's born after the year 2000 are more likely than older people to agree with the following statement that hamas are freedom fighters and not terrorists . fighters and not terrorists. kelvin alfred, to you on this one. what do you make to all of this? well first of all, i'd be very interested to see what the geographical split on the school strikes are.

>> does it mean that are they muslim areas? right of which i was told the other day that that 80 candy, it's likely to be put up 80 candy, it's likely to be put ”p by 80 candy, it's likely to be put up by muslim activists in the next general election. so it's no surprise that if you have a big area with, say, parts of bradford or other parts of the country that you're going to find that the schools which are dominated by the religion and are therefore or the war in in the middle east is something which they feel strongly about, then they're likely to go out on strike. i mean, it's shocking , strike. i mean, it's shocking, by the way. shocking, but but what's happening and is that is that the that the islamification of the nation over this issue means that there will be a lot of political fighting come the general election on this issue because labour, i suspect, are likely to lose ten seats or so

to two candidate outs put forward by an imam. it's a fascinating area. >> i don't want to say, as well this isn't just something that's only affecting the muslim community. so many people actually cross sector , you know, actually cross sector, you know, looking at imagery that they're seeing of some of the stuff that's going on to innocent people within gaza. and they are horrified . i mean, it's really horrified. i mean, it's really hard to see some of the footage that you see and not be moved by that, irrespective of who you are and what your religion is. >> but firstly, i would >> yeah, but firstly, i would respectfully say to kelvin that he talking nonsense and he is now talking nonsense and you're not allowed to talk over me. i make that me. kelvin so i can make that point. can come back later. point. you can come back later. but keir starmer by the way, i think my sense is has and i'm not spokesman has an iron not his spokesman has an iron grip over the candidates for for the election. so i the the next election. so i don't think you're going to get particularly people particularly radical people trying labour mps. so trying to become labour mps. so that's political point . i that's the political point. i also labour are also don't think labour are going lose seats the going to lose seats over the horrors that going on in horrors that are going on in gaza. talk muslims , gaza. you talk about muslims, i'm jewish, jewish, but you i'm jewish, half jewish, but you know, hitler wouldn't have

spared me and i'm horrified by what i'm seeing in gaza. i've said i've been on your show weeks not long after weeks ago, not long after october the 7th, and made the october the 7th, and i made the point i make it again, point then and i make it again, the medieval that we the medieval savagery that we saw on october 7, horrific , saw on october 7, horrific, absolutely disgusting, makes you shiver all over all over your body, unimaginable. what happened? people ripped out of their homes. terrible sexual violence, hostage taking of children, killing, murdering of children. >> yes. it's horrendous. everyone would agree that. >> yeah, but it doesn't justify israel destroying gaza taking a million plus people out of their homes, killing. we're led to believe thousands of children. did i say that as someone who's jewish, it is a war and i agree with netanyahu that we have got to destroy hamas and after all, the people of gaza supported hamas and it is a war i, i feel dreadful for them.

>> but but they did have a choice. they could have risen up against hamas on the other point that you make on the other point that you make on the other point that you make on the other point that you made, matthew, which you seem to misunderstand my point, it is muslim candidates will stand against labour. it's not that labour will import them right ? so muslim candidates will right? so muslim candidates will stand against labour. >> just very quickly to say the idea that you would have stood up and risen up against hamas. idea that you would have stood up and risen up against hamas . i up and risen up against hamas. i mean, is a death cult, mean, this is a death cult, right? they have a sort of iron grip in that territory. it's a tiny territory, four and a half miles wide, and it's in its narrowest. these are people who threw people threw off buildings, the people they elections in they beat in the elections in two seven or two thousand and seven or whatever is, these are whatever this is, these are very, very bad and very, very, very bad and dangerous people weapons. dangerous people with weapons. so the hamas so we cannot conflate the hamas terrorists, hamas terrorists, the hamas barbarians, innocence barbarians, with the innocence of so many of gaza, including so many children. about a million children. about a million children in gaza. and they should not be being bombed. bits is that no , i don't accept that is that no, i don't accept that israel all was was actually raped , tortured and murdered raped, tortured and murdered

into this war. >> right. the reason that it started at all is because of the actions of the people who control old gaza. the hamas , and control old gaza. the hamas, and therefore they pursue them and this will end. and when this ends, the chances of a two state solution are higher than in the 75 years since it started. seriously think that you can end hamas wipe out. >> you don't think i do breed more terrorists. it's not just it's going to be it is the argument has always been you can't wipe out an idea. >> yeah , well, tell that to the >> yeah, well, tell that to the people of isis who had the same idea, who have been wiped out. okay. >> so i don't accept different scenario. >> no, i don't accept that this is going to be something that carries on forever and a day and that the violence gets worse and worse. they are going to mow. they are going to kill every single member of die in the process. >> that's easy for you to say, isn't it? >> you're not even living out. >> you're not even living out. >> i'm asking you. >> i'm asking you. >> not living there. >> you're not living out there. you're not an israeli you're not you're not an israeli . you're not a jew who is

.you're not a jew who is sitting in. >> sorry. no, go you're not. >> sorry. no, go on. you're not. go on. >> okay. well, me let me finish. >> let me finish then. the answer to that is this. you are answer to that is this. you are a nation, a democratic nation surrounded by all your enemies . surrounded by all your enemies. right? one of your enemies decides to murder and murder. you're going to get back at them. i am in favour of that. >> and i'm not. >> and i'm not. >> well, there you go. we agree to disagree on this show. and robust debate is indeed what it's about . but andy says it's all about. but andy says that was a ridiculous, islamophobic rant from kelvin. not everyone who opposes the israeli government's response to the hamas atrocities is muslim. please, can you call that out? well, i thought i did. it's not just muslims that support innocent people in palestine . innocent people in palestine. anyone i would say that sees horrendous images of children being hurt in particular would being hurt in particular would be very moved by that. look, this conversation will continue another day . but for now, another day. but for now, matthew, kelvin, thank you for your company. matt have a good birthday guys. don't go anywhere. nigel farage up next

tonight , a anywhere. nigel farage up next tonight, a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on . gb news evening. on. gb news evening. >> alex deakin here with your latest weather update from the met office for gb news. today's rain slowly clearing away this evening. tomorrow a bit drier and brighter in east, but and brighter in the east, but there more heavy showers there will be more heavy showers and it stays pretty blustery. it's still very it's eastern areas still very soggy this evening still. met office yellow weather warnings in place. the rain does clear away but the far northeast. away all but the far northeast. some showers come into the west, many places having clear spells overnight, temperatures dropping to or 6 degrees in most to about 5 or 6 degrees in most towns and cities, maybe a little lower in 1 or 2 spots. could be some mist and fog around tomorrow morning. particular over areas. bit of a over eastern areas. a bit of a glum here, but eastern glum start here, but in eastern england, should brighten up. england, it should brighten up. and of the day will be and then most of the day will be dry here. elsewhere, expect dry here. but elsewhere, expect more day more showers. quite a wet day again ireland. again for northern ireland. frequent showers for wales, north—west and across north—west england and across much of scotland as well. in the

sunny spells in the south, 12, maybe 13 celsius, generally a little bit warmer than today, but not feeling all that warm when the showers come along and the winds, another spell the gusty winds, another spell of friday of rain then comes in friday night into saturday day that night and into saturday day that spreads north during saturday, lingering over parts of southern scotland and northern england, the will brighten up on the south will brighten up on saturday afternoon some saturday afternoon with some decent sunshine decent spells of sunshine staying across the staying mostly dry across the far north. staying quite chilly here, but in the south we should with a bit of sunshine, get into the by saturday. low the teens by saturday. low pressure systems continue to bnng pressure systems continue to bring more wet and windy weather. we're a close weather. we're keeping a close eye could bring eye on this one could bring another spell of and another spell of wet and very windy weather on sunday. >> it looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers as sponsors of weather on .

gb news and a very good evening. >> welcome to farage here on gb news. it's 7:00 and goodness me, another huge day. a lot to talk about. another huge day. a lot to talk about . more chaos in the whole about. more chaos in the whole rwanda debate will be getting into that . boris, of course, has into that. boris, of course, has been at the covid inquiry for his second day of evidence and a bunch more time and opportunity wasted some unbelievable still unbelievable scenes in the united states . anti—semitism united states. anti—semitism amongst some of the most the best universities in the states . best universities in the states. what is going on over there and of course, derek chisora will be in the studio at the back end of the show to talk about i'm a celebrity. you will not want to miss that out. loads of that. but first of all, of course, it's the news with polly middlehurst .

middlehurst. >> richard, thank you. the top story