you tell me. also, bleeding control cabinets, acas stab cupboards have been added to the streets of britain . is this good streets of britain. is this good decent common sense or are we basically accepting defeat when it comes to the war against knife crime? and also it's been announced today that train fares in england will rise next year by just shy of 5. in scotland , by just shy of 5. in scotland, it's almost 9. what do you make to that? i wouldn't mind if you could even get a seat every time you get on a train. have you managed to, on your last few train journeys? you tell me. and of course, the home office have now u—turned on salary now u—turned on their salary thresholds migrants be thresholds for migrants to be able bring their loved ones. able to bring their loved ones. do not think policies do they not think these policies through they issue them through before they issue them in place? also, here in the first place? also, here in the first place? also, here in uk, got a declining in the uk, we've got a declining birth rate. does that bother you andifs birth rate. does that bother you and it's nearly christmas. yes are you going to be charging your relatives for their christmas dinner round at yours.

we're going to get stuck into all of that. but before we do, let's cross live for tonight's latest news headlines . latest news headlines. >> michelle. thank you. good evening, i'm sam francis. the headuneis evening, i'm sam francis. the headline is at six. well, as we've been hearing millions of train passengers are facing a hike in their fares of nearly 5. the department of transport has confirmed that regular rail fares in england will rise from the 3rd of march. the increase is based on inflation, but it's being capped at 4.9. passengers say it's just more financial pressure already. >> the trains are striking and that we pay enough and we don't get the service that they should be delivering. >> i mean, it makes sense because everything's going up, but, know, it's not good news. >> i think they've got to get their act together first before they thinking about they start thinking about putting yet again . putting prices up yet again. >> not looking forward to it because do use public because we do use public transport quite a lot and

trains, going to trains, so it's going to be a bit rough on the bank account. but you know, i guess we'll just have with it. it's how have to live with it. it's how things are going nowadays. >> well, the prime says >> well, the prime minister says that hike would have been that the hike would have been higher the government hadn't higher if the government hadn't intervened. >> increase that we're >> the increase that we're seeing i think, the seeing now, i think, strikes the right balance between raising the the railway the money that the railway ultimately run, ultimately needs to run, particularly apost—covid particularly in a post—covid environment, but also minimising the burden on hard working rail passengers and longer time. the best thing we can do is reform outdated working practices on the railroad so we can make them more financially sustainable, and we're committed to doing that and we're committed to doing tha well, the news comes as rail >> well, the news comes as rail passengers are facing yet more travel disruption as they try to get away for christmas. trains are running out of london, but there have been cancelled options, with paddington station closing from closing for four days from christmas eve on sunday and heathrow's also set to be exceptionally the exceptionally busy. the airport's expecting more than a quarter of a million passengers over the coming days, and motorists being affected by motorists are being affected by the delays as well, with the

port of dover saying takes port of dover saying it takes around 90 minutes the moment around 90 minutes at the moment to cars with pre—booked to process cars with pre—booked tickets . travel editor lisa tickets. travel editor lisa minot told gb news that travellers need to be patient. today's predicted to be the busiest day and that's because you've got normal commuters , you've got normal commuters, normal truck drivers on the roads . roads. >> at the same time, you've got all of those people that are starting to head away for christmas. so today is going to be the big point. they're also talking lunch crunch. talking about a lunch crunch. it's to be the point where it's going to be the point where actually lunch time is going to be the busiest day on all of the next three days. so between 12 be the busiest day on all of the next2,|ree days. so between 12 be the busiest day on all of the next2, that's|ys. so between 12 be the busiest day on all of the next2, that's really between 12 be the busiest day on all of the next2, that's really don'teen 12 be the busiest day on all of the next2, that's really don't want! and 2, that's really don't want to find yourself on any of the roads in the uk network. >> well, the uk has said that it's doing all it can to get more aid into gaza. that's with the. the foreign secretary rather lord cameron describing the latest united nations vote as good news. the un security council has passed a resolution to increase humanitarian support for civilians , but it stopped for civilians, but it stopped short of calling for an immediate ceasefire. the us and

russia have both abstained from that vote. it comes as the world food programme says gaza is at risk of famine within just six months. if the conflict between israel and hamas doesn't end. a criminal investigation has been launched into the alleged abduction of alex batty, the teenager , who'd been missing for teenager, who'd been missing for six years, returned to the uk last week after being found in france. he disappeared when he was just 11 years old after his mother, who wasn't his legal guardian, had taken him on a pre—arranged trip to spain. greater manchester police is investigating the case after interviewing the 17 year old. a british student who built a drone for the so—called islamic state terror group has been jailed for life with a minimum terms of 20 years. 27 year old mohammed al—barid used a 3d printer at his home in coventry to make the device, designed to carry a bomb or chemical weapons, on sentencing, the judge described him as a manipulative individual and a

committed extremist who built the drone to cause horror and destruction . the uk economy is destruction. the uk economy is at risk of falling into another recession after revised figures showed it performed worse than expected in the third quarter. rather than flatlining. the economy contracted by 0.1, and if the economy shrinks for a second consecutive quarter, it will enter what's known as a technical recession. shadow financial secretary to the treasury james murray blames the government. >> this is yet more evidence of failure from rishi sunak. he's already failed to cut waiting lists. he's failed to stop the boats . and now it's been boats. and now it's been confirmed that he's failed to grow the economy and grow the economy too. and actually is just the latest actually this is just the latest in of economic failure in 13 years of economic failure from conservatives which has from the conservatives which has left worse left people across britain worse off. worried about the off. i'm very worried about the economic for this economic forecasts for this country. look the country. if you look at the growth forecasts issued by the office responsibility office of budget responsibility earlier autumn, they've earlier in the autumn, they've cut growth forecast the cut the growth forecast for the next years. this is gb next three years. this is gb news across the uk. >> we're on your in your >> we're on your tv, in your car, digital radio and on your

smart speaker. now more smart speaker. now though. more from . michelle. from. michelle. >> thanks for that. i'm michelle dewberry and i'm with you until 7:00 tonight, right alongside, we've got my panel, the trade unionists, and broadcast de paul embery and conservative peer embery and the conservative peer and the former adviser boris and the former adviser to boris johnson, moylan. johnson, lord moylan. good evening both of you. it's my evening to both of you. it's my last show this year, so what a treat to have both. um, i'm treat to have you both. um, i'm very much in the christmas spirit. are you guys. >> we'll everywhere. >> we'll get you everywhere. i know into it. know i'm into it. >> properly into the >> i'm properly into the christmas spirit. and you know the drill, don't it's not the drill, don't you? it's not just us three. it's about just about us three. it's about you guys at home as well. it's your last chance well to give your last chance as well to give your last chance as well to give your his your christmas tree his 15 seconds fame. so you sit seconds of fame. so if you sit in been sending me in there, you've been sending me a christmas in. i do try a christmas trees in. i do try and show a couple if i can before end of the programme. before the end of the programme. so get a nice picture of it. get it in, tell me your name and where from. i'll and where you're from. i'll try and p0p where you're from. i'll try and pop it where you're from. i'll try and popit on where you're from. i'll try and pop it on the screen before pop it up on the screen before the the programme, but the end of the programme, but you get in touch with me all

you can get in touch with me all the usual ways. vaiews@gbnews.com is how you email me. or indeed can email me. or indeed you can tweet got tweet me at gb news. got a packed show coming up for you. i want to talk about quite a lot of stuff today. crime, law of stuff today. uh, crime, law and attitudes to crime as and order attitudes to crime as well. i want to talk to you well. i also want to talk to you about birth um, about birth rates. um, immigration, stuff immigration, lots of stuff and some nice christmassy festivities i do festivities as well. before i do say for the rest of the say farewell for the rest of the yean say farewell for the rest of the year, but for now, a new report from college policing has from the college of policing has basically that basically found that imprisonment resulted imprisonment apparently resulted in increased reoffending . when in increased reoffending. when you this to when people you compare this to when people were out in the community serving their sentence, i find this quite interesting because some people , daniel, are saying some people, daniel, are saying it's basically evidence of the fact that prison doesn't really work. do you think that's the case? >> oh, it doesn't work, does it? by >> oh, it doesn't work, does it? by what measure does it actually work? there's a small number of people who are violent and dangerous who may need to be locked up for the whole of their life, have whole life life, and we have whole life sentences that sentences for people like that or very, long sentences to or very, very long sentences to keep them locked up while they're still dangerous. um, but

that's a relatively small number of people. when you look at the rest of the prison population, most of them actually learn very little in prison apart from how to crimes cleverly. to commit crimes more cleverly. and not rehabilitated in and they're not rehabilitated in any sense . of course they're any sense. of course they're punished. but through loss of liberty. and that's it's right that they should be punished. but there are other ways of punishing and not just punishing people and not just through . and through imprisonment. and we've also problem. also also got the problem. we've also got the problem. >> how you punish >> how else would you punish them then? >> well, people, know, there >> well, people, you know, there are community sentences and other of restricting other ways of restricting people's tagging, other ways of restricting pec sorts tagging, other ways of restricting pec sorts of tagging, other ways of restricting pec sorts of other tagging, other ways of restricting pec sorts of other waystagging, other ways of restricting pec sorts of other ways in ging, other ways of restricting pec sorts of other ways in which all sorts of other ways in which your be made sort of your life can be made sort of pretty constrained and miserable without prison . and without being in prison. and we've also got the problem that we've also got the problem that we locking so many people we are locking so many people up, them. up, we can't accommodate them. so to end building so we have to end up building more which continue to more prisons, which continue to be badly run. i be badly, pretty badly run. i mean, all right, they're not that bad as they used to that bad. as bad as they used to be. have improved in the be. things have improved in the management prisons, but management of prisons, but nonetheless, management of prisons, but nonetshowcases for how ideal showcases for how something should be managed. and we can't afford it. we've got to face up to the fact we can't

afford it. i mean, prison works in the that when people in the sense that when people are there, they can't commit crimes. >> well, they do. they can't commit on the outside. commit crimes on the outside. the against the that the crimes against the that afflict their communities and affect the outside affect people in the outside world. so that sense, those world. so in that sense, those people are worried about those people are worried about those people incarcerated . and people are incarcerated. and that the average that means that the average citizen is protected from them for the period that they're. yeah. so inside so in that in that sense, it does work. >> so you protect someone from, say , an accountant who's been say, an accountant who's been locked up for fraud. quite rightly, fraud is a very serious offence . so somebody's been offence. so somebody's been locked fraud. he's not locked up for fraud. he's not being not protecting the being you're not protecting the pubuc being you're not protecting the public going public from him. he's not going to another job as an accountant. >> you protecting. you're protecting you're protecting people. you're protecting people who may be victims of further fraud. if that person were to , well, he's that person were to, well, he's not likely to get another job, is an accountant, you is he? as an accountant, you don't that. but what is don't know that. but what is wrong? but what? he's wrong. i mean, to sound like mean, i don't want to sound like a of hangum flogging sort a sort of hangum flogging sort of person, because i'm. you do. i but wrong with i am, but but what is wrong with the of punishment now?

the principle of punishment now? it shouldn't just it it shouldn't just be. it shouldn't just be about, well, prisons rehabilitate prisons should rehabilitate people. send people. we should only send people. we should only send people it's a people to prison if it's a serious um, the serious crime. um, if the general public needs protection, if the public aren't going to be protected for the period that the person is incarcerated, then they shouldn't give that. they shouldn't prison. but shouldn't be in prison. but actually, very principle of actually, the very principle of denying somebody freedom denying somebody their freedom because they have committed a serious crime, which is has got a victim or victims, is in itself not an ignoble, um , itself not an ignoble, um, proposition . proposition. >> i'm absolutely with you on punishment, but i'll just say the whole idea of locking people up in prison as a punishment is a relatively modern idea. it barely goes back 200 years, and it was invented by liberals who thought that if you lock them up in they would be in prison, they would be improved their character and improved in their character and they come out better. they would come out better. people. now that turned out to be pretty false impression. be a pretty false impression. what we know is they generally come out as worse behaved people with health with more mental health problems, less capable of managing themselves the managing themselves in the outside world. and it isn't

actually working like that. it's an experiment that hasn't worked. >> isn't the problem that by the time we send people to prison in this country, the law and i think data this, the think the data shows this, the law so late that law intervenes. so late that actually by the time people get sent, eventually gets sent to prison, invariably they're habitual criminals. they are career criminals who have become so kind of, uh, and meshed in that way of living. um that in the end they get sent to prison. if the law intervened sooner , if the law intervened sooner, then that wouldn't be an issue. >> one of my viewers, john, says, michelle, prisons are not working because they're like hotels. ultimate . you go to hotels. um, ultimate. you go to prison for punishment and it should reflect that it is not a rehabilitation centre, but a punishment centre. and the harder it is, essentially the more it will encourage you not to go back. i agree with him . to go back. i agree with him. yeah, well, you well we, you we used to have up until the 1950s, we used to have a prison that ran as punishment centres. >> so you'd be put on a

treadmill or you'd be set to doing debilitating work like , doing debilitating work like, um, what was it? um, what do they have to do? what was the name of it? they have to do? what was the narsewing’ they have to do? what was the narsewing mailbags. yeah. >> sewing mailbags. yeah. >> sewing mailbags. yeah. >> mailbags >> mailbags mailbags or threading cord with threading threading cord with their their fingernails their with their fingernails till the fingernails were gone and and and things like that. and we used do that quite used to do that quite deliberately. that's why it actually classes, if actually the middle classes, if the sent to the middle classes were sent to prison, it was virtually a death sentence, the sentence, practically in the 19th it's very 19th century, because it's very hard for them to survive it. and it was designed ed to, to really punish classes by punish the working classes by making cruel. i'm making life really cruel. i'm a great believer in we could great believer in the we could go back to that. i think go back to that. yeah, i think it'dyou've got a great workforce >> you've got a great workforce available to you in prisons. obviously, you'd have to for obviously, you'd have to pay for their not? their labour, but why not? what's with using that what's wrong with using that prison workforce to perform activities be activities that will be beneficial outside beneficial to the wider outside economy ? great idea . economy? great idea. >> i don't in principle object to that. if they're if they are properly remunerated . but you properly remunerated. but you can't have slave labour. >> no, i would pay i would pay him something. i'd pay him something. i wouldn't pay a

minimum market rate. >> no, i wouldn't pay them. the market rate because they're getting their board and lodgings and it for and all the rest of it paid for by the states. >> i'll take that. >> i'll take that. >> it's important that business isn't cheat isn't able to exploit, cheat cheap inside prisons. cheap labour inside prisons. >> the businesses >> i mean, the businesses would pay going >> i mean, the businesses would pay going rate to the pay the going rate to the prisons, the prisons would pay the going rate to the prisona the prisons would pay the going rate to the prisona deduction)risons would pay the going rate to the prisona deduction forons would pay the going rate to the prisona deduction for the would pay the going rate to the prisona deduction for the living make a deduction for the living costs rest of it, costs and all the rest of it, and then pay the rest to the worker. >> great idea. >> great idea. >> i'm not opposed. i'm not opposed to that all. if we opposed to that at all. if we could get people working productively a that helps productively in a way that helps them, integrate back them, you know, integrate back into society, may them into society, may give them better prospects they better job prospects when they come big wide world come out into the big wide world again, i'm not opposed that again, i'm not opposed to that at but as long as they get at all. but as long as they get decent treatment and decent rights workers rights as other workers would get, you oh, he get, what do you guys oh, he wants him to have, he'll want unions next. >> want, um, prisoner >> he'll want, um, prisoner unions. can it. unions. i can see it. >> who sells his labour >> anyone who sells his labour power entitled to in power is entitled to be in a union. >> there you go. right. tell >> oh, there you go. right. tell me what you guys think to that at home. want ask you as at home. i want to ask you as well about these things that some people calling stab some people are calling stab cupboards, yeah. cupboards, basically. yeah. they're starting to they're going to be starting to

p0p they're going to be starting to pop liverpool. yeah. pop up in liverpool. yeah. and um, are saying i can um, some people are saying i can bnng um, some people are saying i can bring up on the screen. bring one up on the screen. they're basically called like emergency bleeding kits. the emergency bleeding kits. so the thinking is apparently it takes about die out of about five minutes to die out of bleeding. get stabbed, it bleeding. if you get stabbed, it can often take much longer for that. for an ambulance come that. for an ambulance to come and you. is one of and help you. this is one of them. on the on the screen them. look on the on the screen now. they essentially look a little bit like you're little bit like if you're listening, watching, they listening, not watching, they essentially you listening, not watching, they essentthel you listening, not watching, they essentthel units. you listening, not watching, they essentthel units. do you listening, not watching, they essentthel units. do you u know, the defib units. do you think are a good idea ? think these are a good idea? yeah. do you, do you think. yeah. >> just like think defib units >> just like i think defib units are a good idea. i'm really pleased know that there pleased to know that there are defibrillator around the defibrillator units around the place where work, the place where i work, around the houses house of lords or the houses of house of lords or the house of commons. i'd like to know had a heart attack. know if i had a heart attack. somebody minimal somebody was with minimal training. actually help me training. could actually help me survive i think that's training. could actually help me survivand i think that's training. could actually help me surviv and same|ink that's training. could actually help me surviv and same if k that's training. could actually help me survivand same if i that's training. could actually help me survivand same if i was's training. could actually help me survivand same if i was stabbed. good. and same if i was stabbed. i expect be stabbed. i don't expect to be stabbed. i'm to have i'm probably more likely to have a heart attack, especially with paul going on and hope you've paul going on and i hope you've got one here. >> that's why i'm cranking up got one here. >> i've 's why i'm cranking up got one here. >> i've got hy i'm cranking up got one here. >> i've got them cranking up got one here. >> i've got them crayes,g up got one here. >> i've got them crayes, i'm the i've got them all. yes, i'm probably likely have probably more likely to have a heart attack be stabbed in heart attack than be stabbed in the house of lords, i have to admit.

>> but nonetheless, i think and it could not. it might not always be stabbing. it could be some other accident that some other genuine accident that leads it's leads the so in principle, it's a good thing. but the question you're slightly a good thing. but the question you're which slightly a good thing. but the question you're which sligwell, different, which is, well, i think asking is, are we think you're asking is, are we are too accepting of stabbing are we too accepting of stabbing as of a way life? and as part of a way of life? and i think we are probably too accepting of it, and we ought to be better at stamping out knife crime. >> i've got two concerns. >> i've got two concerns. >> i've got two concerns. >> i mean, principle, of >> i mean, so in principle, of course, agree. anything that course, i agree. anything that helps anybody's of helps save anybody's life, of course, you know, salute and course, you know, i salute and i support, there a part of support, but there is a part of me worries a little bit me that worries a little bit because firstly, we we just because firstly, we are we just accepting you know what? accepting now, you know what? that, kids are going to that, uh, kids are just going to wander carrying knives wander around carrying knives and going put and therefore we're going to put these up on all the street corners, point one and point two. it are almost letting two. is it are we almost letting the services off the the emergency services off the hook you category hook because you have category one times? you one response times? are you supposed hitting? but supposed to be hitting? but don't it. someone's don't worry about it. someone's being stabbed but being stabbed over there. but hey they've got kit on the hey they've got that kit on the street so can just street corner. so we can just chill go to a different chill out and go to a different call. are going to get that call. are we going to get that kind of slippage in response time potentially. kind of slippage in response time pothat'sly.

kind of slippage in response time pothat's a. kind of slippage in response time pothat's a danger. and >> and that's a danger. and i think we are becoming inured to it the that it's it actually. the fact that it's become now of become a feature now of our lives, our communities that lives, of our communities that these taking these stabbings are taking place, really bat place, that we don't really bat an eyelid when we hear that the next youngster, 13 years of age, 14 age, been 14 years of age, has been stabbed in london, we kind of wake the news and wake up and hear on the news and think, well, there's another one kind thing 20 or 30 years kind of thing and 20 or 30 years ago, i think there would have been serious public and been very serious public and political debates whenever, been very serious public and political d

youngsters? nowadays we tend not to bat an eyelid at it, and i find that really disturbing. >> well, there was that case, um, week actually, where um, this week actually, where a little four year old came out had stabbed as well. i had been stabbed as well. i mean, got say that one mean, i've got to say that one absolute. what you're absolute. i know what you're saying. becoming saying. people are becoming immune that immune to stabbings, but that one really did stop me my one really did stop me in my tracks. also people's tracks. and also people's attitude crimes as well, attitude to crimes as well, i think quite interesting. you think are quite interesting. you mentioned also in mentioned peckham. um, also in peckham don't know if peckham today. i don't know if you banksy, you know, you saw this banksy, you know, the artist, street artist the artist, the street artist banksy. this, uh, banksy. he created this, uh, piece artwork. i'll get up on piece of artwork. i'll get up on the screen if i can and show you it's basically a stop sign. it's basically like a stop sign. and it had drones built and it had some drones built into put it up on the into it. i've put it up on the screen anyway, banksy apparently went said, this went online and said, yeah, this is it's of is bonevardi. it's my piece of work about an hour or so later, some fella took it upon himself work about an hour or so later, so broad la took it upon himself work about an hour or so later, so broad daylightt upon himself work about an hour or so later, so broad daylight inpon himself work about an hour or so later, so broad daylight in front imself in broad daylight in front of everyone is on the screen. he goes over to props himself goes over to it, props himself up this bike, tries ripping up on this bike, tries ripping it off with his bare hands, unsuccessfully wanders off, returns a few minutes later with some bolt cutters, cuts it off in front of everybody, leaves the bolt cutters on the side,

wanders off with this artwork and makes me think people and it makes me think people don't seem to have a fear of other people intervening, but they have a lack of fear over authority intervening and other people, certainly. >> but most people who are doing this stuff, and we see it with the epidemic that we're seeing now in our in our shops with, you know, people brazenly shoplifting in a way that , you shoplifting in a way that, you know, happen a few years know, didn't happen a few years ago . they know the chances of ago. they know the chances of being apprehended. and even if they apprehended, then being they are apprehended, then being prosecuted and ending up in court are minimal. >> would you intervene? >> so would you intervene? >> so would you intervene? >> lord moylan , if you saw crime >> lord moylan, if you saw crime going on in front of you? >> um, i think very hard about doing so. >> why? for fear of being harmed, might be might harmed, somebody might be might wallop me or stab me. >> well, and i'm not sure i'm up for that. >> i do find this topic interesting. would you intervene if you saw a crime, one that shocked me the other day? you might familiar with a might be familiar with it. a fella got sent to prison or he got sentenced. at least. um, he

raped on the underground raped someone on the underground train. tube in broad train. the tube in broad daylight, and nobody intervened. i this world i mean, what is this world coming to? where a man can rape a woman on a train and people look on, and you tell me there was an appalling attack on a jewish woman a couple of weeks ago in stamford hill, which was captured on cctv, and you saw vehicles past it was vehicles driving past as it was going people, going on, and people, pedestrians was pedestrians walking past, it was going on. >> stopped to intervene >> nobody stopped to intervene when was being attacked, when a woman was being attacked, which i was appalling. which i thought was appalling. >> always used to like this? >> guys, you tell me at home, are things getting worse or do we have social media and we just have social media and a lot more awareness and knowledge of you tell me. of what goes on? you tell me. uh, break, i want to uh, after the break, i want to talk to about train fares. talk to you about train fares. they're going year. they're going up next year. nearly england, nearly 9% nearly 5% in england, nearly 9% in is that a good deal in scotland. is that a good deal or tell me .

radio. hi there.

>> michelle dewberry with you till 7:00 tonight. trade unionists and broadcaster paul embery, alongside me, as is the conservative peer and the former adviser to boris johnson , lord adviser to boris johnson, lord moylan. uh let your let me know your thoughts about that whole prison situation. and in particular as well, whether or not you would intervene if you saw crime unfolding under your saw a crime unfolding under your very eyes, or would you just be worried and think, what would the consequences be to me? or would you just think, yeah, i'm not in that. not getting involved in that. thank much. and off you thank you very much. and off you turn. uh, tell me your thoughts thank you very much. and off you turthat., tell me your thoughts thank you very much. and off you turthat., telfore your thoughts thank you very much. and off you turthat., telfore youthe oughts on that. but for now, the department for transport has announced that rail fares, they're going increase by they're going to increase by nearly yeah, nearly 5% in england. and yeah, next just about to next year i was just about to say next year. it felt like say next year. and it felt like such a long time away. but actually it's not that far away next year all, it. in next year at all, is it. in scotland. and uh, prices there next year at all, is it. in scotla rise and uh, prices there next year at all, is it. in scotla rise byi uh, prices there next year at all, is it. in scotla rise by nearly 'ices there next year at all, is it. in scotla rise by nearly 9. is there next year at all, is it. in scotla rise by nearly 9. what �*e next year at all, is it. in scotla rise by nearly 9. what do could rise by nearly 9. what do you think to this? is this good value for money? is it too high? too thoughts ? too low? what's your thoughts? >> um, well, what going >> um, well, what i'm going to say not to be popular. say is not going to be popular. um, because there's nothing new there. new are expensive there. new trains are expensive to and this is your background,

>> and this is your background, by do bit by the way, i do know a bit about train. >> trains are expensive to run and they need to be paid for. um, part of it is because the staff salaries are linked to inflation, so they go up with inflation, so they go up with inflation, costs go up with inflation. so you need to expect an inflationary rise. this is higher than inflation has been over the last know over the last year. i know inflation this inflation has come down this month this is higher. this month but this is higher. this is as high it's as as is not as high as it's as as inflation been. so it's inflation has been. so it's below inflation increase. the costs go up. somebody has to pay for it. now about 5% of journeys in this country are made by rail. the rest are made by other modes, mostly car. so the question is always going to be who pays for it? the taxpayer or the fare payer. and i think it's fair that the fare payer should pay fair that the fare payer should pay their whack and that's what's happening here. now, you could say, no, we won't do that. we'll put it all on the taxes. and everyone, whether they use the train not, make the train or not, will make their contribution that's their contribution on. that's a political choice. if you want to make it. i don't think make it. but i don't think that's choice i would make

that's the choice i would make to use at home. to use trains at home. >> and you do, tell me what >> and if you do, tell me what your experience because your experience is, because i used trains a lot and used to use trains a lot and i got fed up with last minute cancellations, my family to cancellations, my family came to see me other day on a 7:00 see me the other day on a 7:00 train. you get to the train station, the trains cancel. so there you stood 6:45 the there you stood at 6:45 in the morning. train's gone. now morning. your train's gone. now you're yourself, morning. your train's gone. now you're via yourself, morning. your train's gone. now you're via doncaster some diverting via doncaster on some random the random connection. you miss the connection there. sprint in connection there. you sprint in through train station. oh, through a train station. oh, thanks. rather drive. um, thanks. i'd rather drive. um, where you it? where are you on it? >> well, let's get to point >> well, let's get to the point the railway taken back the railway should be taken back into ownership. oh, what into public ownership. oh, what is its 6:25? >> everyone we've got there in the end. >> there you go. people. play a poll. bingo. >> you know that? yeah, but viewers. >> but i think you'll find a lot of a lot of your viewers will agree with me on this private privatisation. has privatisation. daniel has been a let me finish. let him privatisation, privatise. let me finish. let him privatisdaniel.�*ivatise. let me finish. let him privatisdaniel. daniel. on. daniel. daniel. daniel. hold on. privatisation a privatisation has been a complete scam . let's be honest complete scam. let's be honest about we've foreign about it. we've got foreign owned have who now owned companies who have who now owned companies who have who now own railways, repatriate the own our railways, repatriate the profits since privatisation , profits and since privatisation, then we've seen the service get dirtier, more expensive , more

dirtier, more expensive, more unreliable. we are still subsidising it as taxpayers to the tune of millions and millions of pounds a year. and there is there is well, indeed. and there is for me, a compelling argument to say that there should be renationalisation. we are paying we pay the highest rail fares in this country, in europe. good. we have good. yeah, it is good. i think it's a good thing. >> it is good because how on earth how on earth can it be good that we have the highest people in europe? >> the fairer that the people who the system coverage who use the system coverage they're for it, then the they're paying for it, then the general taxpayer and nationalising would nearly nationalising it would nearly all it's nationalised already all of it's nationalised already . it's purely train . it's purely the train operating companies that are not nationalised. >> quite big part of it. >> quite a big part of it. >> quite a big part of it. >> the track, the rails, all the costs that go into maintenance of rails and tracks, all the of the rails and tracks, all the costs that into building new costs that go into building new stuff, electrifying stuff, putting in new bridges, all that's nationalised, all that's on the taxpayer already. it's just the train operating companies are not companies that are not nationalised. you could nationalised. you could

nationalise tomorrow. nationalise them tomorrow. it wouldn't be any skin off my nose. you'd pay them nose. you'd have to pay them out. and by this, by the well, you wouldn't have actually, you wouldn't have to actually, you wouldn't have to actually, you wouldn't have to actually, you would actually. well you would. i think you'll find the human nationalise without compensation. >> don't support >> i'm not. i don't support nationalisation without compensation. but you know, there's it. there's an argument for it. >> wouldn't >> there is. but you wouldn't be allowed while you're allowed to do it while you're still the european convention still in the european convention on human rights. >> railway system an >> the railway system is an integral functioning integral part of the functioning of our country. of our of our country. >> you would still have to talk over each other. >> it's an integral part of the functioning of our country. daniel, privateers. daniel, why should privateers. sorry, a sorry, i've had such a fundamental, fundamentally integral part of our country and make one at a make huge profits out one at a time, right? >> go on. >> you go. go on. >> i've done you just the same. well, you go there. >> i'm saying a railway system is a fundamentally important part the functioning part of the of the functioning of country. like like water, of our country. like like water, for example , like a national for example, like a national health service for me, the idea when so many people rely on it to make the country function , to to make the country function, to get to see relatives get to work, to see relatives and so on, that that system which we built up and was once upon a time owned, upon a time publicly owned,

should have should have should have been, should have been off to privateers who been sold off to privateers who now make an enormous amount of money out of it system has and have not actually improved the system think that's i system at all. i think that's i think that's in contestable system been have not system hasn't been they have not improved the system at all. i don't see how you can say we should maintain quo should maintain the status quo when fares for example, under the i have to say daniel the tories. i have to say daniel fares have twice as fares have risen twice as quickly . and when you quickly as wages. and when you compare railway system that compare the railway system that we have to places like france and places like china , i mean it and places like china, i mean it is falling apart. and places like china, i mean it is falling apart . we've closed is falling apart. we've closed a huge number of stations and people in, for example, coastal communities and neglected regions . have we closed well, regions. have we closed well, well , i regions. have we closed well, well, i mean, i mean, since beeching, i mean, which stations have recently been closed for the last ten years or something since beeching? i mean, which stations have been. >> hold on, let him answer then. >> hold on, let him answer then. >> go on, give a huge number >> go on, give us a huge number of stations since since beeching, obviously a huge number even even in number of 70 years, even even in more years, we've we've more recent years, we've we've seen some seen branch lines in some stations closed as well.

>> well, i think we have actually. but but but the point is, you say, but the point is, as you say, but the point over the years we have. yeah, but the point it's not it's absolutely true. the absolutely true. and the point is are way when it is we are way behind when it comes to our infrastructure generally. but when it comes to our public transport system and, you know, we're trying to get people off the road because we're saying, you know, it pollutes the atmosphere. and in london the ulez london you've got the ulez charge congestion charge charge and the congestion charge and that. well, and things like that. well, okay, bringing those charges only you've got a decent, only once you've got a decent, functioning, cheap, reliable, integrated transport integrated public transport system, which includes a publicly owned railway system, we don't have that at the moment, and i think it's a mark of shame on this country, despite everything that's been done, are done, only 5% of journeys are made rail . done, only 5% of journeys are made rail. it's so done, only 5% of journeys are made rail . it's so expensive made by rail. it's so expensive though, daniel, that's people can't it more people can't afford it more people can't afford it more people can't afford it more people can't afford it. if you want to go or to liverpool go to birmingham or to liverpool and are of cheap and you, there are lots of cheap side day before to do it. it side the day before to do it. it could cost you hundreds of thousands. >> there and lots of >> there are lots and lots of cheap fares and there there cheap fares and there are there are routes to birmingham are several routes to birmingham and in competition. and

and they're in competition. and you can go marylebone on you can go from marylebone on the line. you can go the chiltern line. you can go from the line and from euston on the main line and they're competition and there they're in competition and there are cheap if you are lots of cheap fares if you want get to birmingham. i want to get to birmingham. i come from birmingham. go back come from birmingham. i go back there often. there quite often. >> tell you if you book >> i can tell you if you book about three years in advance, you possibly get a fairly you could possibly get a fairly cheap anyone who wants cheap one. but anyone who wants to a couple of days time to go in a couple of days time is going pay through. to go in a couple of days time is gyeah, pay through. to go in a couple of days time is gyeah, butay through. to go in a couple of days time is gyeah, but oneirough. to go in a couple of days time is gyeah, but one ofrgh. to go in a couple of days time is gyeah, but one of the reasons, >> yeah, but one of the reasons, one the reasons that fewer one of the reasons that fewer people the train, it's people are using the train, it's not because of the money. not always because of the money. >> it's because many strikes >> it's because so many strikes now have made it so, so almost impossible to in. right. impossible to factor in. right. you what? i'm going on this you know what? i'm going on this date going train date and i'm going on the train because. journeys are because. so many journeys are disrupted of strike disrupted because of strike action many people action that so many people now have you what, i'm have decided, you know what, i'm just make alternate just going to make alternate arrangements. so actually, i would it's been would say that it's been counterproductive. these constant relent, less incessant strikes, taken strikes, they've just taken customers i think if you >> so i would say i think if you attribute current state of attribute the current state of the railways and the state that it's for in years now, it's been for in years now, simply recent wave of simply to the recent wave of strike which of course strike action, which of course causes don't deny causes disruption. i don't deny that. me, the state of

that. but trust me, the state of the railways attributable to the railways is attributable to factors wider than the factors far, far wider than the railways are actually carrying. >> as many people now as >> twice as many people now as they were at the time of privatisation . leaving covid privatisation. leaving covid aside, dropped , of course, aside, it's dropped, of course, for covid, but up until the point of covid billion point of covid 1.8 billion journeys year were regularly. journeys a year were regularly. that was a statistic that went on year after year, was roughly double the number that were travelling. say that they travelling. to say that they failed to say that the trains are all dirty when so of are all dirty when so many of them are to new say, to say that a huge numbers of stations have been closed , to say that you been closed, to say that you have to pay hundreds of pounds to go to birmingham to buy it. if buy a ticket two days in if you buy a ticket two days in advance, just all made up . advance, is just all made up. >> it's not all made up. daniel. >> it's not all made up. daniel. >> sorry. just saying it >> i'm sorry. just saying it doesn't make true. >> i'm sorry. just saying it doemade|ake true. >> i'm sorry. just saying it doemade up; true. >> i'm sorry. just saying it doemade up if true. >> i'm sorry. just saying it doemade up if tru if you, for >> made up if you if you, for example, wanted to come for to, uh, in peak time in peak hours from norwich to london in peak time there and back, you're paying time there and back, you're paying about £100, you're paying over know that from over £100. and i know that from personal experience. so the idea that the all of that you know, all the all of these , all these fares are cheap

these, all these fares are cheap is simply not true. >> should be high, over >> fares should be high, over £100 to go from norwich to london. peak fares should be high you're trying to high because you're trying to deter travelling in deter people from travelling in the and you're trying to the peak and you're trying to encourage , why would want to encourage, why would you want to deter because the deter people? because the train is full. >> put, more trains, invest >> well put, more trains, invest in the system and provide more trains people will trains so that more people will be make the make be able to go and make the make the cheaper. but the the fares cheaper. but the private companies won't do that because the thing they're because the only thing they're interested bottom interested in is the bottom line and motive. that's and the profit motive. that's why be nationalised. why it should be nationalised. >> of my viewers are >> some of my viewers are getting touch, reminiscing getting in touch, reminiscing about of british rail, about the days of british rail, and don't really seem to have and i don't really seem to have many positive coming many positive stories coming through where. through from the days where. so, for leslie my for example, leslie says, my husband work for british husband used to work for british rail when it was state owned and when privatised. she when it was privatised. she describes work experience describes the work experience and his work experience was and says his work experience was absolutely so absolutely categoric so much better. it better. her words when it was privatised it was privatised and it was previously, um , sarah says previously, um, sarah says british rail, when it was run by the state, it was absolutely dreadful don't really feel dreadful. so i don't really feel that people are kind of reminiscing with the same kind

of rosy, happy memories perhaps, that you might have of i'll throw it open to you guys, though. do you agree with paul? because i can see a few people coming in saying that they do, and that you do think that nationalisation is the answer? do you trust government do do you trust this government to huge transport to run a huge transport infrastructure on a daily, ongoing hourly basis? what makes you think that they all of a sudden would excel in that department, get in touch? well, they do already. >> they're the ones running the tracks the railways. that's tracks and the railways. that's yes. >> but many people would argue that great that they're not having a great experience things they experience of things as they even the moment. me even stand at the moment. let me know you can have know your thoughts. you can have the final say on this one because i'm sure we could continue this conversation, but for to for now, we'll move on to a different conversation. so much. i to you about. i want to talk to you about. i want to ask you about the salary threshold for bringing your threshold for bringing in your loved have you seen that loved ones. have you seen that the government has u—turned on that also well? declining that one also as well? declining birth this country? birth rate in this country? does that you think that matter to you? do you think it's important or not? i'll see

radio. >> hi there. >> hi there. >> michelle dewberry with you till 7:00. paul embry and lord moylan still remain alongside me. um, talking about the pay rises, uh, that the fare increases on the trains , john increases on the trains, john says it's totally unfair . all of says it's totally unfair. all of these trains should be renationalised . and the fare renationalised. and the fare system is so complicated . and, system is so complicated. and, um, and you say you are an advocate of nationalising all the key industries, water, utilities , etc, etc. call blame. utilities, etc, etc. call blame. it won't surprise you to know that, uh, paul is, uh, chuntering along in the back. yeah, yeah, yeah. cheers yeah. agree? agree. he agrees with you . good man. um, kevin says michel . yes. you're right. michel. yes. you're right. pfices michel. yes. you're right. prices won't for the prices won't go up for the thousands of people that wouldn't even bother buying a ticket place. uh, ticket in the first place. uh, jones i completely agree jones says i completely agree with paul. private railways are a disaster, much of our a disaster, and too much of our money up abroad . she says. money ends up abroad. she says. um colin says we refuse to use the trains now because of the

strikes . you say that you feel strikes. you say that you feel that train drivers are greedy and overpaid . appeared called. and overpaid. appeared called. blimey, keep your thoughts coming in. let's talk then, shall we? you'll be familiar by now the story the now with the story about the thresholds comes to thresholds when it comes to immigration and and all immigration and visas and all the of and how much you the rest of it, and how much you had earn in order to bring had to earn in order to bring your loved ones in. well, uh, the know, the threshold, as you'll know, is currently £18,600. then it was going to increase to £38,700. was conversations £38,700. there was conversations about people taking legal action against that, basically saying it cruel and inhumane and it was cruel and inhumane and disrupted right to disrupted people's right to a family life and all the rest of it. anyway, long story short, it's now been announced that they're going to change the threshold back to threshold and cut it back to £29,000. makes me think, threshold and cut it back to £29,01don't makes me think, threshold and cut it back to £29,01don't the les me think, threshold and cut it back to £29,01don't the government right? don't the government think through their policies before announce them? think through their policies benyo. announce them? think through their policies benyo. all. ounce them? think through their policies benyo. all.ounce why|? >> no. not all. why? why >> no. not all. why? why >> because they do it so quickly . uh, that's the trouble. and because there's no real process for thrashing out, uh, complicated issues, and they rush out with them too often. but i'd like to say on the substance, that's my view on how government works these days. and it's not just this government.

it'll exactly same under it'll be exactly the same under starmer, we have a starmer, because we have a relatively dysfunctional system starmer, because we have a rela'a'ely dysfunctional system starmer, because we have a rela'a civilysfunctional system starmer, because we have a rela'a civil service onal system starmer, because we have a rela'a civil service that,;ystem starmer, because we have a rela'a civil service that, umem starmer, because we have a rela'a civil service that, um ,n and a civil service that, um, thatis and a civil service that, um, that is less professional in some ways than it used to be 20 or 30 years ago. but it's not just the civil. i don't primarily blame the civil service for this. it's the number 10 nexus where everything is run by a prime minister with a lot of young spads around him, and they don't think things through they come through properly, and they come out think this what's out and i think this is what's happened here. haven't happened here. they haven't thought what thought through properly what this i on the this means. could i on the substance, though, make substance, though, could i make a distinction people who a distinction between people who are here settled? yeah and who have families with them. have their families with them. yeah. and i think they should not should not be not there should not be significant them significant barriers to them bringing their spouses to join them. >> so you think, like new applicants and beyond. >> but but i think when it comes to somebody coming new to this country for the first time, i think this is fundamentally a distraction. the key question is how many people are we bringing

in who are getting the work visas? not how many people are coming in as their partners , coming in as their partners, because if they weren't coming in for the work visas, the partners wouldn't be following them. and think that's where them. and i think that's where them. and i think that's where the government needs to be focusing . and that's what most focusing. and that's what most people um, and that's people think. um, and that's really the core point. indeed. paul i'm open minded on the threshold, i think what this threshold, but i think what this shows government that is shows is a government that is actually favour of mass immigration. >> i mean, they've been promising for 13 years to cut it. they haven't stuck to those promises. i think that that has serious implications for democracy. when a government goes to the country time and time again at an election and makes it a clear part of its manifesto that we understand your on this, we are your concerns on this, we are going do it . you had the going to do it. you had the brexit referendum well where brexit referendum as well, where people expected that it would be deau people expected that it would be dealt and time dealt with and time and time again, whatever your view on immigration, if the government keeps its promises, keeps reneging on its promises, then think that has serious then i think that has serious ramifications for the whole principle of, you know, democratic accountability and democracy itself outside of the

control of the government. >> so, for example, the pandemic came along and then came up came along and then they came up with to pay everyone with this policy to pay everyone to at on their to sit at home on their backsides. a lot of people thought to themselves, well, why would sit london on my would i sit in london on my backside i can return home backside when i can return home to my is and stay to wherever my home is and stay there and work? a lot of people then return back into then didn't return back into the world quite like world of work. they quite like where was before, where there was before, or they've mental issues they've got mental health issues or was. so now or whatever it was. so now actually you do have the situation you've situation where you've got labour and you've labour shortage and you've got people millions. think people like millions. i think it's point some 8 it's five, five point some 8 million not doing we million now not doing what we should be though, michel. should be doing though, michel. >> got a million and >> we've got a million and a half people unemployed in this country. got serious country. we have got a serious skills and a serious skills shortage and a serious lack of vocational training and knowledge our own knowledge amongst our own people. can describe them people. if we can describe them in way, to address people. if we can describe them in is way, to address people. if we can describe them in is to ay, to address people. if we can describe them in is to upskill to address people. if we can describe them in is to upskill ourto address people. if we can describe them in is to upskill our domestic; that is to upskill our domestic workforce certain jobs workforce to make certain jobs that we think that british people would never want to go into social care and that kind of thing, make them more attractive by making the wages more attractive. you have more attractive. if you have a situation you deal with it situation where you deal with it through high taxes , then through so high taxes, then

well, necessarily well, not necessarily higher taxes, you know, by by more taxes, but you know, by by more attractive wages for particular jobs and, and, and upskilling the workforce . and then you can the workforce. and then you can put the domestic workforce, the potential domestic workforce that at the moment isn't working towards those jobs, rather than this constant reliance on cheap overseas labour, which, you know, may be a sticking plaster in the short tum but isn't going to resolve the problem in the long tum, because one point that people constantly miss is that it's a never ending treadmill. you people say, you know, because people say, well, we need them. we need, you know, people coming here to look after elderly generation. after our elderly generation. we've an ageing population after our elderly generation. we'yso an ageing population after our elderly generation. we'yso on.an ageing population after our elderly generation. we'yso on. but geing population after our elderly generation. we'yso on. but theig population after our elderly generation. we'yso on. but the point ulation after our elderly generation. we'yso on. but the point thaton and so on. but the point that people miss with that is that the themselves, who the immigrants themselves, who vast majority of whom are decent, hard working people, i have say, but they will reach have to say, but they will reach old at some point . and then old age at some point. and then when reach old age, we have when they reach old age, we have an larger number of people an even larger number of people who need, you know, social care and reliance on public services. so we then just continue to import more and more people so

it becomes a never ending treadmill. it's not the way to a declining birthrate as well. >> lot of people are >> so a lot of people are getting concerned about this. women are not having many women are not having as many children other people children as perhaps other people would have. you would like them to have. are you concerned by that or not? >> i am broad. i just >> yeah, i am broad. can ijust say, speaking, agree say, broadly speaking, i agree with everything just with nearly everything paul just said. blimey cor blimey, oh >> cor blimey cor blimey, oh bank that. >> do think bank that. but >> but i do think bank that. but as far as the birth rate is concerned . yeah, i mean i think concerned. yeah, i mean i think one the most notable one of the most notable developments at the developments was at the beginning when beginning of the 2000 when gordon chancellor of gordon brown was chancellor of the he set out the exchequer, and he set out policies deliberately to make it to, to basically to force women to, to basically to force women to join the workforce and, and, and that has become the norm . and that has become the norm. and what it set up is a huge cost of child care for them. um, it means they don't have always the time they postpone when they start having families , they have start having families, they have smaller families. there is a second issue, which of course is housing, which the government has failed to deliver on. i'm afraid . and that is you need a

afraid. and that is you need a decent house if you want to bnng decent house if you want to bring up a decent family or a decent home. at least you do, and that is harder and harder for younger couples. well, a lot of young women, they have been sold a bit of a pop, actually, because we have all been told you can have everything you could do whatever you want, you can can travel, you can work, you can travel, you can work, you can travel, you can have your kids all the can have your kids and all the rest it. rest of it. >> talks honestly, >> no one talks honestly, though, ticking time >> no one talks honestly, thougcalled ticking time >> no one talks honestly, thougcalled your ticking time >> no one talks honestly, thougcalled your biological me clock called your biological clock. a lot of women get to their 40s. go right, i've done this i'll start this now or now. i'll start settling having kids. settling down, having kids. and guess what out? guess what you find out? actually, it's a lot trickier than people actually let on in the let know the first place. let me know your thoughts that coming your thoughts about that coming up. what? it is last up. guess what? it is my last show of the year. my last show before christmas you before christmas as well. you guys been sending me your guys have been sending me your christmas to talk christmas trees. i want to talk to that. i want to to you about that. i want to talk to you about christmas number one. i want to get into christmas spirit. want

well i wish it could be christmas every day when the keir starmer stephen and anne begins to bark. keir starmer stephen and anne begins to bark . and i'm wishing begins to bark. and i'm wishing country christmas again this year. yeah >> yes. how awesome was that? >> yes. how awesome was that? >> everybody that was roy wood performing . i wish it could be performing. i wish it could be christmas every day. yes, live. did you see it last night? farage at large in birmingham. well anyway, look. cheers, everyone. cheers jubilee tavern is open for the final time this yeah is open for the final time this year. i can't , i was going to year. i can't, i was going to say i can't, i don't lean over and do a cheers. i might fall off and that's not going to end well, is it? but cheers everybody. everyone. and cheers to you guys at home. um the final time and cheers to simon jackson, 46 years old tonight. what a spring chicken. he said when open the jubilee when you open the jubilee tavern, please can you do me a

favour me a happy favour and wish me a happy birthday? us birthday? uh, he watches us often, likes the program. often, and he likes the program. didn't say too much about you two, not sure if two, though. i'm not sure if utah was his favourite. >> come to expect that. >> come to expect that. >> yeah, but anyway, there you go. well, if you're go. also as well, if you're wondering is nearly wondering of course it is nearly christmas. you're sitting christmas. if you're sitting there is christmas there thinking, who is christmas number a bit old number one? i'm a little bit old and a little bit uncool. i don't stop and think about who's christmas one. these christmas number one. these days, know? days, do you know? >> it did back in the >> not these. it did back in the day, the 80s. day, in the 80s. >> it was a big deal, wasn't it? >> it was a big deal, wasn't it? >> was a huge. it was a huge >> it was a huge. it was a huge thing. and everyone used to be vying for it. all the bands used to be vying christmas number to be vying for christmas number one, couldn't you. one, but i couldn't tell you. i couldn't tell you. recent years i've got no interest in it. >> well, i can tell um, the >> well, i can tell you, um, the number one christmas, number one, 20, 23. it's one. and last christmas. >> oh that's good. yes. >> oh that's good. yes. >> remember that one you just said know what said you didn't even know what that song was. >> oh, this is lord moylan. i'm in tune. in the tune. >> tune is around >> the tune is around everywhere, isn't it? and is everywhere, isn't it? and it is simply ghastly. and it's one of the fabulous. one of the the worst. fabulous. one of the worst of popular music.

worst pieces of popular music. when have had when you could have had something nice, like something from oratorio, from bach's christmas oratorio, something that. chair, something like that. the chair, everybody anti—working something like that. the chair, every culture. anti—working something like that. the chair, evedaniel,re. anti—working something like that. the chair, evedaniel,re. anyourorking something like that. the chair, evedaniel,re. anyourorkilbe honest. >> look how posh he is. look at how doesn't popular culture. >> this rubbish. i mean, god knows. >> well, this, um, last christmas, wham, it was 39 years ago. it was released, apparently. getting apparently. and it kept getting beaten off the top spot by band aid. band aid? yeah, it aid. was it band aid? yeah, it doesn't sound right, but that was not. >> producer popped in during >> the producer popped in during the that was the break and said that was true. don't with the producer. >> ruin it. i was trying to make british viewing public. >> all these facts off >> i know all these facts off the top of my head. the facade, i them underneath my i have them underneath my christmas hat. anyway, look, let's bring your christmas trees in, like in, shall we? i do like it. you've them as we you've been sharing them as we go let's have a look. go along. let's have a look. first one. uh, here we go. who's this one? paul, let's have a look at paul's christmas tree, shall oh, look. mind shall we? oh, look. never mind the christmas at that the christmas tree. look at that young lady on the screen. there >> are you? two is >> where are you? two is deliberately timed. it so you two it's you two want in? yeah, it's put you out. >> that's a nice christmas tree. >> that's a nice christmas tree. >> like that one. i like your >> we like that one. i like your

windows well. that windows as well. what's that called what's it called? >> uh, pass. >> uh, pass. >> oh, anyway, it looks nice. lisa and paul, this is theirs. i like it nice. i like your star at the top. let's have a look at the finnigan families. oh, yes, we're. we again. we're. there we are again. >> it's the same shot. it's the last one in. yeah. i haven't got. there's not a paula paul and, daniel not having any and, um. daniel not having any of it. >> if ofit. »|f >> if they if they put you above the fire to keep the kids away from the fire goes out. >> yes. >> yes. >> they're to stop all >> they're trying to stop all the robbing all those the burglars robbing all those presents there. presents by sticking me there. let's have a look. linda let's have a look at linda's. that's nice. also like the nice. oh, and i also like the love as well. i that, love heart as well. i like that, yeah. love heart. it's nice and classy. that one right classy. i like that one right before i for christmas. before i break for christmas. i can't not ask you all. do you charge your come and charge your family to come and join christmas dinner? paul >> well, if i thought it would keep them i might do, but keep them away, i might do, but oh, you wouldn't. keep them away, i might do, but oh, no, you wouldn't. keep them away, i might do, but oh, no, iou wouldn't. keep them away, i might do, but oh, no, i would ldn't. keep them away, i might do, but oh, no, i would never do that. >> no, i would never do that. >> no, i would never do that. >> family are coming to me >> my family are coming to me for christmas i'm for christmas day, and i'm really looking to. really looking forward to. i would not dream no matter. no would not dream of no matter. no matter poverty stricken i matter how poverty stricken i might wouldn't of might be, i wouldn't dream of charging come and eat charging people to come and eat my me,

my christmas dinner with me, would well, that in my christmas dinner with me, woul(well, well, that in my christmas dinner with me, woul(well, we quite that in my christmas dinner with me, woul(well, we quite tight,hat in actually. >> so if i was having my family were absolutely ginormous as loads us, so i probably would loads of us, so i probably would charge entrance or charge a £5 entrance fee or something to come in. >> a marvellous way >> i think it's a marvellous way of chipping together >> i think it's a marvellous way of a chipping together >> i think it's a marvellous way of a communalping together >> i think it's a marvellous way of a communalping event,ier >> i think it's a marvellous way of a communalping event, and at a communal family event, and quite and i'm going at a communal family event, and qurecommend and i'm going at a communal family event, and qurecommend it.nd i'm going at a communal family event, and qurecommend it to i'm going at a communal family event, and qurecommend it to my going at a communal family event, and qurecommend it to my sister and to recommend it to my sister and her family. the bromfields of saint that should her family. the bromfields of saidoing that should her family. the bromfields of saidoing it that should her family. the bromfields of saidoing it thisiat should her family. the bromfields of saidoing it this year. should be doing it this year. >> tori britain, tori >> tori britain, that's tori britain. >> interested in is >> all we're interested in is making fast buck even out of making a fast buck even out of christmas. fast christmas. let's make a fast buck christmas. buck out of christmas. >> think this lady's >> i don't think this lady's making profit. making a profit. >> um, michelle, >> uh, ron says, um, michelle, my wife and i brought up my late wife and i brought up our only child, and i have two lovely if my wife lovely grandsons. if my wife charged the in charged me for the once in a year christmas dinner , year homemade christmas dinner, i'd. i'd probably be changing my will. he says , um, i don't know, will. he says, um, i don't know, ezra says . i think it's only ezra says. i think it's only fair pay your way when fair that you pay your way when you're going round to your family members for christmas dinner. it's once a year. it should be seen a positive to should be seen as a positive to chip not a negative. chip in, not a negative. the reason we're is reason that we're asking is because there's a grandma in cardiff. her cardiff. she's charging her family for seventh year in a family for the seventh year in a row. says that she row. um, she says that she charges the adult relatives £15

for the christmas spread, and she charged . she's got an adult she charged. she's got an adult and a kids rear. i like this, she's put a lot of thought into this. the this. she charges the grandchildren £2.50 each. that's not a lot of money, actually. >> is it a lot? >> is it a lot? >> is it? no no. >> is it? no no. >> i mean, if you if you can't afford and no disrespect grandkids can eat a lot if you can't afford to host the event, then don't host the event. but to say people, you can to say to people, well, you can come dinner, but come for christmas dinner, but i'm charge um, i'm going to charge you. um, i just think they've turned up every year for seven years. >> must like they must >> they must like they must be. >> they must like they must be. >> people have got very >> a lot of people have got very hard actually. um, hard times, actually. um, and they want the company and they can't company. can't always afford the company. so i you what? so i say, you know what? do whatever for you. i do whatever works for you. i do just second, just want to take a second, actually, to actually, on that note, just to say thank very much to each say thank you very much to each and single you and every single one of you that's watched news this year that's watched gb news this year that's watched gb news this year that's channel, that's supported our channel, that's supported our channel, that's dewbs& that's watched dewbs& co. i absolutely love sharing my evenings guys at evenings with all of you guys at home. some of my panel are all right as well. not them, right as well. not all of them, but don't take you for but we don't take you for granted. we very much appreciate it. that our channel is it. you know that our channel is

still comes in for a bit of stick, and i know i hear you, you the adverts all you ask about the adverts all the there's still this the time. there's still this pressure uh, to pressure campaign, uh, trying to shut but, you know, shut us down, but, you know, we're here. not we're here. we're not going anywhere. important we're here. we're not going an us1ere. important we're here. we're not going an us all.. important we're here. we're not going an us all. and important we're here. we're not going an us all. and i important we're here. we're not going an us all. and i wish important we're here. we're not going an us all. and i wish you portant we're here. we're not going an us all. and i wish you all ant to us all. and i wish you all a very merry christmas. have a lovely time . please don't spend lovely time. please don't spend it alone. and i can't wait to see 2024. nana well, i'll see you in 2024. nana well, i'll wish it could be christmas every day . over the wish it could be christmas every day. over the keir wish it could be christmas every day . over the keir starmer day. over the keir starmer sandie vara begins to bal and, um. >> i wish it could be christmas every day . so let the bells ring every day. so let the bells ring out a lot. people . out a lot. people. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on . gb solar sponsors of weather on. gb news evening .

news evening. >> i'm alex deakin. this is your latest weather update from the met office for gb news most places, having another mild , places, having another mild, cloudy and very day cloudy and very windy day tomorrow, particularly wet though across parts of scotland where there warnings in where there are warnings in place, warning across place, a snow warning across shetland already, another shetland already, but another snow ice warning coming into snow and ice warning coming into play snow and ice warning coming into play over the play this evening over the northeast of scotland. some heavy here making for some heavy snow here making for some tncky heavy snow here making for some tricky conditions, tricky driving conditions, particularly for tomorrow morning. heavy rain then sets in across western scotland . across western scotland. elsewhere, it's just a generally cloudy breezy night cloudy night and a breezy night and mild night as well. and a very mild night as well. but start across scotland but a wet start across scotland tomorrow. rain in the west tomorrow. heavy rain in the west and some heavy snow for a time across the north—east. even down to lower levels for a time. so said that could cause some issues. the rain lasts all day in the west. that could also cause some disruption. patchy rain central rain for southern and central scotland for northern scotland later for northern ireland england, ireland and northern england, but part of england and but a good part of england and wales. just and cloudy. wales. just dry and cloudy. some brightness in the east could see temperatures the teens. it temperatures into the teens. it is 12 celsius even is mild, 11 or 12 celsius even where it's grey. quite blustery on christmas eve, gusty winds

over england later over northeast england and later northern mean we have northern scotland mean we have met office yellow warnings in place and a warning for the rain across parts wales that'll across parts of wales that'll probably through the probably sink south through the day. some brighter spells , but day. some brighter spells, but for christmas eve weather for many, christmas eve weather doesn't look brilliant again, though will be mild with though it will be mild with temperatures getting into the teens across of the east teens across parts of the east of england where we any of england where we see any sunny christmas then sunny spells. christmas then looking fairly mild but damp. there will be some colder weather across scotland where a bit snow is possible the bit of snow is possible on the big day across the north it looks are heating up looks like things are heating up boxt boiler hours. >> sponsors of weather on

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i >> welcome to lee anderson's real world. and tonight we're in ashfield at the world famous, award winning golden diamond club, a fantastic venue . tonight club, a fantastic venue. tonight we're going to be speaking to santa claus and his chief elf , santa claus and his chief elf, samantha, a local ashfield hero, with telling us upsetting story with telling us upsetting story with a happy ending about his childhood and going to adoption and the success he made of a of his life. plus we'll go back in the day with legendary former nottingham forest footballer nigel jemson. talk about that famous he scored in a cup famous goal he scored in a cup final. we'll also speaking to final. we'll also be speaking to many heroes on the show many other heroes on the show tonight, but first go to tonight, but first let's go to the . news the. news >> good evening, i'm sam francis in the gb newsroom . the in the gb newsroom. the headunes in the gb newsroom. the headlines at seven millions of train passengers are facing a

hike in fares