quarters of all residential break ins in england and wales. d0 break ins in england and wales. do you have faith in the police and a new report on the bbc has accused the bbc of feeding viewers a steady diet of woke bias as they average more than one story a week on slavery. well, why wouldn't they .7 is the well, why wouldn't they? is the bbc now just one big woke joke and brexit campaigner and wetherspoons owner tim martin is

set to be knighted after kemi badenoch reportedly pushed for him to be honoured . but badenoch reportedly pushed for him to be honoured. but is this a good way of rewarding people or just a good way of rewarding people orjust a bit of outdated fancy or just a bit of outdated fancy nonsense these days? and finally, the royal mint have unveiled new designs for 2024, with one commemorating the birth of sir winston churchill. 150 years ago today. but given racism accusations , is he really racism accusations, is he really a war hero or a racist? zero. that's all to come and much more in the next hour. but first, the latest news headlines with polly middlehurst . dawn thank you and middlehurst. dawn thank you and good evening to you. >> well, police have revealed that reports of a fire at blackpool tower in lancashire were in fact a false alarm . what were in fact a false alarm. what was presumed to be flames was in

fact orange netting blowing in the wind in the upper reaches of the wind in the upper reaches of the tower. videos on social media appeared to show flames at the top of the landmark, and firefighters deployed fire engines to the scene responding to the fire with six appliances. but in a statement, lancashire police said their helicopter was flown over the tower and confirmed there was indeed no fire. one man was arrested on suspicion of a breach of the peace. rishi sunak is being urged to convene an emergency cobra meeting to deal with the aftermath of storm. garrett yesterday, the liberal democrats have said hundreds of people in greater manchester have been thrown into chaos following the suspected tornado, which damaged around 100 homes in stalybridge . around 100 homes in stalybridge. roofs were ripped from houses and many residents were forced to leave their homes. no injuries were reported. one home owner, gareth moody , described owner, gareth moody, described the moment his house was hit. >> my youngest son in the front bedroom , he was sat under his bedroom, he was sat under his cabin bed when the ceiling came

through, so the bed has saved his life and my, uh , my other his life and my, uh, my other son at the back, he was on a computer at the chimney stack from the neighbour's house has computer at the chimney stack from 1through1bour's house has computer at the chimney stack from 1through our|r's house has computer at the chimney stack from 1through our bathroom. 1as come through our bathroom. decimated uh, and it's decimated that, uh, and it's literally missed him by inches. and he's lucky be alive . and he's lucky to be alive. >> further north, >> well, further north, thousands of homes are still without in parts of without power in parts of scotland. strong winds and heavy snow damaged the electricity work in the network, rather in the highlands there yesterday . the highlands there yesterday. travel's also been disrupted, with rail services suspended or cancelled and roads closed because of the bad weather. the idf has expressed regret about civilian casualties sustained after an attack on gaza on christmas eve. an israeli airstrike allegedly killed 70 palestinians and wounded 55 more in rafah in the southern gaza strip. the number of casualties were, according to a gaza health ministry spokesman in the airstrike, allegedly hit gaza's maghazi refugee camp and was a

mistake , according to the mistake, according to the israeli defence force and the jerusalem post. we can tell you is reporting the type of weaponry used didn't match the nature of the mission. as a result , there was extensive result, there was extensive collateral damage that didn't need to occur and could have been avoided , he said. there are been avoided, he said. there are calls to reduce jail sentences to help ease pressure on britain's prisons. a house of lords committee says overcrowding has now reached crisis point , and ministers are crisis point, and ministers are being urged to make better use of community sentences . as the of community sentences. as the peers say. short prison terms are providing a universe education in crime for former met police detective peter bleksley told gb news the proposals just won't work. >> criminals turn up to take part in these sentences , be it part in these sentences, be it graffiti removal , litter picking graffiti removal, litter picking or something a bit more useful and creative . and what they do and creative. and what they do is they turn up late, they don't turn up at all, they are in

greater numbers than those people running the courses , and people running the courses, and they quite frankly, intimidate them. and they say, i'm here. you put a tick against my name and i'm off. and if those kind of things are not challenged , of things are not challenged, then these community sentences , then these community sentences, whilst looking good on paper in practice, are just a complete waste of time. >> peter bleksley three quarters of britain's fastest growing fraud is committed exclusively from overseas. figures show more than 400,000 advance fee offences were committed in 2022 to 23. that's when fraudsters promise a large sum of money to victims in return for a small upfront fee. it's almost seven fold up since before the pandemic . last month, the pandemic. last month, the government did announce a new onune government did announce a new online fraud charge to combat internet scams , but the shadow internet scams, but the shadow attorney general, emily thornberry, says international gangs are feasting on britain. >> we lose the equivalent of the amount of money we spend on the

national health service and another quarter when it comes to fraud, so it's a massive problem for 40% of crime at the moment is fraud, and it's expanding because nobody ever gets caught . because nobody ever gets caught. and three quarters of it comes from abroad . and people just the from abroad. and people just the government just shrugs its shoulders and says, there's nothing that done. nothing that can be done. >> emily thornberry now over the counter, cash withdrawals from the post office hit an all time high on the friday before christmas. more than £62 million was withdrawn on the 22nd of december, beating the previous record by more than £10 million on the last friday before christmas was also the busiest day of the year for atm withdrawals , with around £460 withdrawals, with around £460 million taken out, possibly as presents and commemorative coins celebrating sir winston churchill . celebrating sir winston churchill. buckingham celebrating sir winston churchill . buckingham palace and churchill. buckingham palace and the rnli will be launched next yeah the rnli will be launched next year. they're among five new designed designs unveiled by the royal mint, said creating key anniversaries with a £5 coin for

buckingham palace. the annual set will also celebrate future events like the 2024 paris olympics and the paralympic games . that's the news on gb games. that's the news on gb news across the uk, on tv, in your car, on digital radio and on your smart speaker by saying play on your smart speaker by saying play gb news. this is britain's news channel . news channel. >> thank you polly and welcome to dewbs& co with me dawn neesom. joining me until 7:00 tonight, my wonderful panel, alex dean political consultant and former chief of staff to who are you? former chief of staff. >> it's a very old credential, david cameron, but long time david cameron, but long time david cameron, but long time david cameron i thought so, yeah, absolutely. >> and aaron bastani, a co—founder of novara media. thank you very much for joining me on this weird time of year where i never quite know whether it's still christmas or new year or this very relaxed week. is

there a word for it? we said xmas yesterday and when i said that to the husband earlier on, he goes, what are you talking about? >> yeah, i called it the perineum recently. i got told off the what? the perineum. what? i think it's funny is that even never mind . crimbo even mean? never mind. crimbo limbo . thank you. polly, that's limbo. thank you. polly, that's a bit more savoury . a bit more savoury. >> polly. love it. right okay. um, if you've got another name for it, you can get in touch as well. in touch with us. well. get in touch with us. whatever you want to talk about. um, all that's coming up on um, on all that's coming up on the vaiews@gbnews.com or the show. vaiews@gbnews.com or on twitter at gb news. very very simple. now uh, i love this story. new national policing guidance has said that officers should prioritise attending the scene of a domestic break in. within an hour of the report , to within an hour of the report, to help increase the chance of solving the case i.e. turning up a week later isn't doing any good. really, is it? according to the most recent home office figures, no suspect is identified in three quarters of all residential break ins in england and wales , with someone

england and wales, with someone charged in less than 4% of cases . we've basically decriminalised it , haven't we? . we've basically decriminalised it, haven't we? but do you have faith in the police? i mean, not just burglary with everything. i mean some parts of the country in for london example, sexual assaults and rape attacks, i mean, , barely register mean, barely, we barely register with getting reported with prosecutions almost decriminalised. it's to me it's a mess. but what do you think? so let's go to my wonderful panellists. what they think of this. er i'm going to come to you first on this one. have you lost faith in the police? i mean, you know, this is the second headline in a year where we've had police told to do their shot. mhm. their job shot. mhm. >> absolutely theirjob shot. mhm. >> absolutely crazy isn't >> it's absolutely crazy isn't it. there's it. it's you know there's a conversation the left conversation within the left about abolition . and about police abolition. and what's is the what's interesting is in the uk that this voluntarily it in that this voluntarily done it in large parts of the country already. um it is fascinating. and stuff that and it's the little stuff that really on on really counts. so on on burglary, what's particularly interesting that burglary interesting is that burglary is much problem now than much less of a problem now than it 30, years ago. and my it was 30, 40 years ago. and my inference therefore from that is

the police have made an operational decision that it just doesn't really matter as much we won't really much anymore. so we won't really treat like a crime. but of treat it like a crime. but of course, if your house is burgled, that's not how you feel. pay taxes for the feel. you pay your taxes for the police to uphold the law. and so i this is really an open i think this is really an open admission that approach admission that that approach hasn't worked . the solving sort hasn't worked. the solving sort of crime being solved generally is incredibly low , particularly is incredibly low, particularly for burglary. however, there are some pilots which which suggest this approach works and i have zero confidence in the police. what i find fascinating is, you know, we've had a tory government for 13 years. they are, and i'm not blaming the tories, but we've had a tory government for 13 years who talk so tough on crime and keep so tough on crime and you keep on secretaries who on having home secretaries who come going to take this come in. i'm going to take this by scruff of the neck. by the scruff of the neck. nobody anything and it just nobody does anything and it just gets all talk and gets worse. it's all talk and i'm really curious as to what a political solution to that looks like. >> i think that's a very good point, isn't alex? i mean, point, isn't it, alex? i mean, it's like what what has gone wrong? our prisons are too soft. i wrong? our prisons are too soft. | , wrong? our prisons are too soft.

i , it a funding? is i mean, is it like a funding? is it like of officers? is it lack of organisation ? then of decent organisation? then where you even start with this? >> i think aaron is right to the extent that it's an operational decision to deprioritize burglary investigations. that's certainly part of it. when you certainly a part of it. when you get as 4% charging rates get as low as 4% charging rates for burglaries, of course, the conviction rate will be far lower that. yes um, so lower than that. yes um, so we're effectively in large parts of the country. um we're not being policed for burglary at all. my increasingly antique experience of prosecuting and defending criminal cases, i both prosecuted and defended some burglary cases . and in part, the burglary cases. and in part, the reason aaron is right, that, um, the funding rates have declined. is that the stuff you can get in someone's house has declined in value. a tv used to be worth stealing. now it's not, and so forth. there is a part of forth. so there is a part of that, but it is to vitally underplay the importance the underplay the importance of the sense of personal fear and violation of your home when it's broken into. >> this is the point. i think all of these statistics, you can

read the statistics out till you're blue in the face, but burglary is actually i mean many, many people watching this will been burgled and it's will have been burgled and it's absolutely horrific . you feel absolutely horrific. you do feel like being violated. like you're being violated. that's . that's correct. >> that's why i this >> and that's why i think this policy good idea, not least policy is a good idea, not least because up a week because if you do turn up a week later, anyone has seen later, anyone who has seen anything is likely to have forgotten who forgotten it. anyone who might have footage on their have had footage on their doorbell or wherever, have doorbell or wherever, may have lost have gone away, and lost it or have gone away, and families being as they are, you're going to move stuff around in your house given a week or two's passage of time, you're going to have left you're not going to have left everything ready for fingerprinting everything ready for firyou 3rinting everything ready for firyou get:ing everything ready for firyou get the opportunity to if you get the opportunity to have fingerprinting done a week or two later, there's no point . or two later, there's no point. so police attending within an hour vital investigative hour is vital for investigative purposes the purposes as well as for the moral purpose trying to solve moral purpose of trying to solve burglary. well, of course, i'm sorry, but this the annoying sorry, but this is the annoying thing with this. >> it's like, thing with this. >> know, it's like, thing with this. >> know, this it's like, thing with this. >> know, this is it's like, thing with this. >> know, this is it:'s like, thing with this. >> know, this is it is like, you know, this is it is like, you know, this is it is like, you know, this is it is like, you know, you will be there within an hour. but if they can't it because there's not can't do it because there's not enough or they're enough of them or they're they're busy sitting at the station out the piles of station filing out the piles of

paperwork. have paperwork. they seem to have these days. >> well, that's part it. >> well, that's part of it. there aren't enough police officers. obviously staffing officers. and obviously staffing cuts haven't helped cuts and whatnot haven't helped since have seen since 2010. we have seen a significant, with significant, um, issue with regards to crimes solved regards to crimes being solved since 2010. initially it wasn't so much of a problem, but after a certain period of cuts, it really did kick in. um, and i think, i think that's a big part of it, but also, look, i mean, i came on this show, i was speaking to martin daubney a few months ago. i got assaulted on in the street for my political views on my. yeah, where i live. and, um, fortunately, i could restrain guy, particularly restrain the guy, particularly because a bit a because i was a bit of a surprise. he tried, but whatever. >> they try and do? >> what did they try and do? punch me? literally walked punch me? just literally walked up in the street and up to you in the street and punched my name. >> used the c word rather rather impolite him. punch impolite of him. punch me. i managed sort of punch him managed to sort of punch him a few times, restrained him. another chap was there. very helpful. had him pinned on helpful. we had him pinned on the i said to people the floor. i said to some people over the street, call the police. police come. the police. the police come. the police. the police come. the police dawdling around police were dawdling around originally. one person comes booths this booths and i'm thinking if this was assaulting a woman or was a man assaulting a woman or if there weren't two men here,

this guy could just run off. yeah, then you know, yeah, yeah. and then you know, they he gets arrested. um, they come, he gets arrested. um, caution. was it. caution. and that was it. conditional so this conditional caution. and so this is on the road. live is literally on the road. i live on. he said my name. they said, well, doesn't know well, he said he doesn't know you. and it's just i'm not i don't want the guy to even be punished necessarily. but i want i contrition and i want, i want contrition and i want, i want to feel there's want to feel that there's a process where for somebody process there where for somebody who's something wrong, who's done something wrong, knows they've done something wrong, real time, wrong, and they're a real time, sort time consequences sort of real time consequences for and there let's be for them. and there are let's be real, there aren't. and that's for them. and there are let's be real, 1labouren't. and that's for them. and there are let's be real, 1labour tory and that's for them. and there are let's be real, 1labour tory issue. 1at's for them. and there are let's be real, 1labour tory issue. there not a labour tory issue. there aren't. major social aren't. this is a major social issue, i think. and it gets the very the very sort of fabric of who we are as a society. and that mean i'm hanging that doesn't mean i'm a hanging and type. i'm not. but and flogging type. i'm not. but you to think the police you need to think the police can. you need to think that the police address crime, police can address crime, because they don't, what's because if they don't, what's the there is the point of them? there is a real truth to that. >> because when the police should reassuring law should be reassuring to the law abiding terrifying to abiding and pretty terrifying to the breaking. and when you the law breaking. and when you are attacked you want are attacked like that, you want the police to attend very quickly they quickly and to look like they

could something about it. if quickly and to look like they cowas something about it. if quickly and to look like they cowas carryingthing about it. if quickly and to look like they cowas carrying on.g about it. if quickly and to look like they cowas carrying on. instead,t. if it was carrying on. instead, we've got policemen. i know both of you are much more active in the media than i am, so you may work publication. we've work for this publication. we've got swan got policemen who swan around looking that. looking like that. the paramilitary wing of the guardian, with of guardian, festooned with sort of paramilitary kit hands forever stuffed inside her for warmth, inside something . and a lot of inside something. and a lot of them look. and i would too. i'm not taking a high ground looking like they'd fail any fitness test. to take. test. you asked them to take. now of now there are plenty of long serving who are aghast serving coppers who are aghast at having a go at at that. i'm not having a go at the police force. there's plenty. broader plenty. in your broader question, do you have faith in the i have faith that the police? i have faith that the police? i have faith that the majority officers, the the majority of officers, the vast majority, join for the right to good right reasons, want to be good coppers, without coppers, want to police without fear or favour, right? and those policemen will look at the ineffectual we now ineffectual people we have now going door knocking because of something tweeted or something you tweeted or listening bosses listening to their their bosses saying the saying let's go and paint the squad in political rhetoric, squad car in political rhetoric, colours and think, what are we doing? we just surely all you want and when we say have you faith in the police, i mean, you know, obviously you're two chaps, woman , yeah, i

chaps, but as a woman, yeah, i mean, you know, your attack sounds a woman sounds awful, but as a woman being on the street, being attacked on the street, a lot of , heaven forbid, sexually lot of, heaven forbid, sexually assaulted a lot of the time, women will not report that because they're worried about being treated like they are in some way responsible for a man's behaviour. and why would you have faith in it being addressed properly? if the conviction statistics are so low? >> it is just horrendous . but >> it is just horrendous. but the thing is, is there a problem ? i mean, i don't want ? i mean, look, i don't want ordinary couples on the beat out there. you work damn hard and it's a really, really tough job. this not having a go at you. this is not having a go at you. but is there a problem with the way the force now is organised? and aaron, i mean, is it i mean, you know, alex has alluded to the fact that it can be a bit woke now, you know, they're going thought crime thought woke now, you know, they're going not ught crime thought woke now, you know, they're going not crime rime thought woke now, you know, they're going not crime , me thought woke now, you know, they're going not crime , is; thought woke now, you know, they're going not crime , is it?|ought woke now, you know, they're going not crime , is it? butht not was not crime, is it? but people thinking the wrong way, putting something on twitter when they're there when they're not out there getting burglars . getting burglars. >> yeah, i think that's definitely of it. i mean, definitely a part of it. i mean, i some guys, they they i saw some some guys, they they had mobile at a football

had a mobile phone at a football match and there was a young child, i think it was a sunderland fan who died and they were sunderland fans were taunting sunderland fans saw obviously saw that. yeah. awful. obviously awful that awful people. but the idea that i don't even know what they'd be arrested for, frankly, or charged , the fact charged with, um, but the fact that this is somehow being actioned the police is actioned by the police is something urgent, because it's on 2000 on social media with 2000 retweets. let's frank, retweets. let's be frank, somebody's being or somebody's being burgled or being street or being assaulted in the street or sexually is far more, sexually assaulted is far more, infinitely more serious. so i think there is something i think there big part of the there is a big part of the problem. whole problem. it's not the whole problem, which is that the police other institutions police and other institutions have become have just become twitter brained. if it's brained. they think if it's on twitter and it's got lots of retweets, must be really retweets, it must be really important. sometimes you important. and sometimes you have that and you have to have that filter and you say, actually it isn't. have to have that filter and you say, actually ally it isn't. have to have that filter and you say, actually it's it isn't. have to have that filter and you say, actually it's not;n't. have to have that filter and you say, actually it's not that big yeah, actually it's not that big a you were. a deal. you were. >> you asked aaron whether it's something with the way the something to do with the way the police organised. is police is organised. it is in part, i think, because we are increasingly the way we increasingly policing the way we seek address fires and in seek to address fires and in policing good to be policing it's very good to be proactive investigating and proactive of investigating and visible. putting visible. when you're putting out fires, for the call to fires, you wait for the call to come and then you go and deal with that's how we're

with it. that's how we're encouraging to encouraging our police force to work you do go work now. and when you do go out, you go in a car, generally speaking, not being seen on the street and being seen. well, street and not being seen. well, this the thing. this is the thing. >> i mean, i still remember the this is the thing. >> i rofan, i still remember the this is the thing. >> i rofan, ichild remember the this is the thing. >> i rofan, ichild ornember the this is the thing. >> i rofan, ichild or bobby. the this is the thing. >> i rofan, ichild or bobby. yeah, name of my child or bobby. yeah, me too, pc harding, if you're still not sure you still around, i'm not sure you are, but you did a good job. >> roger. depot in bury st edmunds, i remember him. >> i kids today. won't know >> i see kids today. won't know that, they? chance. that, will they? no chance. okay. chiefs are okay. um, police chiefs are telling officers they must attend within attend burglaries within an houn attend burglaries within an hour. seem to hour. but none of us seem to believe we? we have to believe that, do we? we have to move on, though. uh, coming up, the accused of feeding the bbc has accused of feeding viewers diet of woke viewers a steady diet of woke bias. perish the thought. as researchers, failed researchers, they have failed to uphold standards own uphold standards in their own impartiality i'm asking is impartiality plan. i'm asking is the a woke these the bbc just a woke joke these days

>> gb news radio . >> gb news radio. >> gb news radio. >> thank you very much. uh. welcome back. this is dewbs& co with me. dawn neesom keeping me company until 7:00. is alex dean

political consultant and aaron bastani, co—founder of novara media. uh, now , a few of your media. uh, now, a few of your reactions coming in on that debate about do you have any faith in the police? and sadly, not many of you do. uh, john, good evening, not many of you do. uh, john, good evening , john. thank you good evening, john. thank you for getting in touch. the police are an absolute woke joke . not are an absolute woke joke. not fit for purpose. there are too many criminals and undesirables in the police themselves. well, we a fairly horrific we have seen a fairly horrific cases of that, haven't we? and vetting is not fit for purpose. there are no officers on the beat. need to complete, review and reform . um, yes, indeed. and and reform. um, yes, indeed. and meanwhile gary says the reality isn't that the police are taking the knee or painting police stations with rainbows, but deaung stations with rainbows, but dealing with the shortfalls of other is a really other services. this is a really good point, actually. uh, chronic underfunding of the police in officers police would result in officers being burnt out. they they being burnt out. they can. they can't strike get better can't strike to get better conditions. they have do conditions. like they have to do a lot of their. and they have to do social care issues do a lot of social care issues as well, don't they? a lot of mental issues they have mental health issues they have to um, and

to deal with as now. um, and david says the police have a zero tolerance policy, zero chance of turning up and chance of police turning up and zero of catching the zero chance of catching the culprit. that kind culprit. and i think that kind of the truth, and so many of us now actually very rarely bother reporting things about a bike nicked do even bother. what's the get crime get the point? get crime number, get it insured. that's it. criminal gets with it. goes does gets away with it. goes and does it okay okay. so now we it again. okay okay. so now we move on. but if you've got any more views on this to get them coming at gb views, at gb coming in at gb views, at gb news, .uk or on twitter at gb news, .uk or on twitter at gb news, it's all about what you think, us. just here think, not us. we're just here to in front of the to look pretty in front of the trees. well, those look pretty well. >> just you back ish. >> just you back ish. >> yeah. thank you much. >> yeah. thank you very much. you can again. uh, write you can come again. uh, write a report by the campaign for common has accused the bbc common sense has accused the bbc of viewers checking of feeding viewers a checking notes. steady diet of woke notes. a steady diet of woke bias. a survey of their news and drama output has exposed bias in coverage of debates over race and gender. while the bbc news website has averaged more than one article per week on the slave trade. because obviously

that's what we're all talking about over breakfast every morning now. is the bbc just becoming one big woke joke ? i becoming one big woke joke? i mean, alex, i'm going to come to you on this one christmas day. it was nine out of the top ten programmes, but the top one was the king. yes >> um, which i thought was tremendous. the the, the headune tremendous. the the, the headline this , uh, headline piece with this, uh, common campaign for common sense or um, or whatever they're called. um, in the coverage i read was about the agatha christie, um, show . the agatha christie, um, show. >> yes. which was on last night, andifs >> yes. which was on last night, and it's a two parter. so it's on again tonight, isn't it? >> yeah, i, i if you're watching, i spoil the show. not at all for you by pointing out that the colonialism that's that the colonialism plot that's been doesn't been rammed into it doesn't exist in agatha christie's work at so, um, this so there at all. so, um, this so there are two reasons. the agatha christie piece, and then there's the broader woke piece on the agatha christie one, which i'm really more kind of huffy about. >> called murder. >> it's called murder. >> it's called murder. >> a big fan, by the way. >> i'm a big fan, by the way. yeah well there's not look, there are plenty race and, there are plenty of race and, um, class and type um, class and colonial type issues to have them issues if you want to have them with in agatha christie's work,

from titles to substance to the way that characters and behave and one another, there and talk to one another, there is need conjure up another is no need to conjure up another one to foster whatever political debate you want to take forward. agatha christie is actually a brilliant place to have a genuine start. a real discussion about some of this stuff, the unthinking that some of her unthinking way that some of her characters refer to people characters refer to other people of backgrounds, other of other backgrounds, other races, the unthinking way that her characters dismissive of her characters are dismissive of people from other places. and so forth. was real, um, forth. there was a real, um, sort unrecognised, completely sort of unrecognised, completely accepted racism in her culture that , if accepted racism in her culture that, if depicted, would accepted racism in her culture that , if depicted, would revolt that, if depicted, would revolt many people and would be a useful starting point for social conversation. you don't need to mess with her work to create it. >> um, aaron, i mean, it's this is also sort of like went on about doctor who, which is everyone's favourite. i mean, it was in the top ten as well. i thought it was brilliant on christmas day. but you know, it's of like, you know, it's sort of like, you know, discussing the pronouns of an auen discussing the pronouns of an alien the things alien is one of the things people taking issue with. people are taking issue with. i mean, that the christmas people are taking issue with. i meaissue,: the christmas people are taking issue with. i meaissue, by the christmas

people are taking issue with. i meaissue, by way. christmas people are taking issue with. i meaissue, by way. ihristmas people are taking issue with. i meaissue, by way. i thought day issue, by the way. i thought the christmas day was brilliant. uh, and lively fun. um, uh, nice and lively and fun. um, but do seem to sneak as but it they do seem to sneak as many lectures as they can into programmes, they? programmes, can't they? >> know, he's meant to >> i don't know, he's meant to be like a he's meant to be like a time lord. and if this is doctor who, i mean, this is the christmas day one. not christmas day one. i'm not a huge doctor fan, but, um, huge doctor who fan, but, um, the idea that he, you know, if he's a man or not, i found he's a gay man or not, i found a bit strange, i think. look, the problem for the bbc is that you're a public service broadcaster where broadcaster in an age where you have accustomed have people accustomed to narrowcasting, which is to say, 101 audiences expect 101 different and you're different products and you're meant it. meant to encapsulate all of it. and obviously people are and uh, obviously people are going angry about going to get very angry about that time to time. there's that from time to time. there's two points. firstly, on the politics i don't think politics side, i don't think it's bbc it's left wing. i think the bbc is institution. is a liberal institution. i think it supports social liberalism and economic liberalism. why it gets liberalism. that's why it gets attacked the left and attacked from both the left and the i think it's hard the right. i think it's hard to say it's less attacked by say that it's less attacked by the much. oh yeah. say that it's less attacked by the massively,1uch. oh yeah. say that it's less attacked by the massively, yes, oh yeah. say that it's less attacked by the massively, yes, a)h yeah. say that it's less attacked by the massively, yes, a lot. aah. say that it's less attacked by the massively, yes, a lot. plenty >> massively, yes, a lot. plenty of leftist. think it's a tory organisation. yeah, that's so much wrong. they much obviously wrong. but they do that. much obviously wrong. but they do well,that.

much obviously wrong. but they do well, i|at. much obviously wrong. but they do well, i think they're both >> well, i think they're both wrong both right. these wrong and both right. these criticisms. forinstance wrong and both right. these criticisms. for instance bbc criticisms. so for instance bbc question on question time, the person has on there more anybody else there more than anybody else nigel farage. and they should there more than anybody else nig he'srage. and they should there more than anybody else nig he's beenand they should there more than anybody else nig he's been and they should there more than anybody else nig he's been a massive hould do. he's been a massive political figure this political figure in this country. that it's country. but the claim that it's a wing organisation when a left wing organisation when farage or fraser nelson the farage or fraser nelson from the spectator there as much as spectator is on there as much as anybody else, not more so, anybody else, if not more so, i find hard to sort of swallow. then on the cultural i then on the cultural stuff. i think is a there is think there is a there is a tendency because it's a tendency again, because it's a pubuc tendency again, because it's a public broadcaster. trying tendency again, because it's a puset broadcaster. trying tendency again, because it's a pu set the adcaster. trying tendency again, because it's a pu set the political, trying to set the political, um, temperature whole bunch of temperature on a whole bunch of issues, is obviously going issues, which is obviously going to get some people's backs up. but there's balance but i think there's a balance here. know, if you're here. you know, if you're newsnight, bbc news, you do newsnight, your bbc news, you do want to take risks from time to time. worst thing you want time. the worst thing you want to is producing boring to be doing is producing boring tv, nobody about. tv, which nobody talks about. um, but i think on some this um, but i think on some of this other this agatha other stuff, this agatha christie for instance, or christie story for instance, or the stuff, mean, the slave trade stuff, i mean, look, hugely important , the look, it's hugely important, the slave trade, the history of the slave trade, the history of the slave it also this slave trade, but it also this country doing country stopped doing it. the best of centuries ago. best part of two centuries ago. >> actually were >> yeah. we actually were responsible for stopping in >> yeah. we actually were resrfirstble for stopping in >> yeah. we actually were resrfirst place' stopping in >> yeah. we actually were resrfirst place and)ping in >> yeah. we actually were resrfirst place and stoppedn >> yeah. we actually were resrfirst place and stopped it. the first place and stopped it. >> the slave trade, of course, is important news. it's

important in our national curriculum school so curriculum at school and so forth. the news, news, by forth. but in the news, news, by the slave trade is not news the way, slave trade is not news in every week seems in the news. every week seems ridiculous. just make ridiculous. but if i just make the about this common the point about this common sense, whatever called sense, um, whatever they called report seems to me on report and it seems to me on their broader point about wokester and using wokester life and using the agatha christie pieces and example, me that the example, it seems to me that the bbc specifically is the one broadcaster that shouldn't be doing is to say, doing this. that is to say, jamming new political line in jamming a new political line in because other because with any other broadcaster i can stop broadcaster i can just stop watching with the bbc as long as i want to receive any kind of television, i have to still pay for it. that is to say, pay for something. with. and something. i disagree with. and even not watching 157, even if i'm not watching 157, £159 and it's going up pretty close. >> but isn't there the worry then that it just becomes incredibly boring because it's news from nowhere? nothing for nobody. worry, nobody. and that's the worry, right? going to to right? you're going to have to take as take risks as a as a broadcaster. >> gb news does that. no, no, no. that's that logic implies that is to chase that there duty is to chase ratings and a public service broadcaster isn't for that. a pubuc broadcaster isn't for that. a public broadcaster, broadcaster isn't for that. a publicthe broadcaster, broadcaster isn't for that. a publicthe bbc:)roadcaster, broadcaster isn't for that. a publicthe bbc does:aster, broadcaster isn't for that. a publicthe bbc does:aspart which the bbc does in part very well, is to provide high brow

content, high well, is to provide high brow content news high well, is to provide high brow content news and high well, is to provide high brow contentnews and to high well, is to provide high brow content news and to provide quality news and to provide things that other people don't do. you if they go down do. so if you if they go down that line and they're honest about and open say, we about it and open and say, we don't about ratings, they don't care about ratings, they don't care about ratings, they do we don't care about do deeply, we don't care about ratings. we're to produce ratings. we're trying to produce better content that mind better quality content that mind that, view, would a that, in my view, would be a proper public service broadcaster. >> it's living proof that >> yeah, it's living proof that they because they care about ratings because they care about ratings because they of carol they they got rid of carol vorderman, who was saying things against government against the government on bbc radio, still support radio, but they still support gary lineker . at 1.35 million gary lineker. at 1.35 million for saying exactly same thing. >> a lot of licence people in the pulls in the ratings. yeah that's that is look that's unambiguously correct. >> especially they'd >> especially because they'd said their said he'd breached their guidelines. yeah uh, before and said it again. he did said don't do it again. he did it again. yeah. he briefly he didn't want spend he didn't want to spend it. he stepped back. stepped back and then back. yes. and was reintroduced and then was reintroduced because they obviously thought they him. yeah. >> this isn't a new >> but this isn't a new conversation. at, know, conversation. look at, you know, mark fowler and the first gay kiss tv between two men. kiss on tv between two men. i believe, on eastenders. >> remember that. >> oh, gosh. i remember that. >> oh, gosh. i remember that. >> yeah. that you know, that

>> yeah. that was you know, that was, that was risk taking risky tv. was such a great way tv. but it was such a great way of touching on important social issue also producing great issue and also producing great drama. i think it's not drama. and i do think it's not necessarily chasing necessarily about chasing ratings. that alex, ratings. it's partly that alex, of but i do think every of course, but i do think every single broadcaster, publisher, anybody out anybody in the media game out there sometimes to there says sometimes you have to take and worry is the take risks. and the worry is the bbc doing that. i think bbc stops doing that. i think park that for moment. park that for a moment. the issue vorderman gary issue of carol vorderman or gary lineker saying things on their own attacking own twitter feeds or attacking the think that's the government, i think that's it shouldn't happen. it shouldn't all. shouldn't be happening at all. they shouldn't attacking shouldn't be happening at all. theopposition,ldn't attacking shouldn't be happening at all. the opposition, by 't attacking shouldn't be happening at all. the opposition, by the attacking shouldn't be happening at all. the opposition, by the way, icking the opposition, by the way, whether tory or the whether that's tory or the labour party. yeah, that's that's correct. but i do think that's correct. but i do think that content. so for that with the content. so for instance, about instance, there was stuff about bbc to certain bbc news talking to certain people some zany points of people with some zany points of view. in this view. well look, people in this country have zany country sometimes have zany points of they should country sometimes have zany poin be if they should country sometimes have zany poin be represented should country sometimes have zany poin be represented in|ould country sometimes have zany poin be represented in|ouin a, still be represented in a, in a, in a, in a broadcast conversation on. so i think you want various want to disaggregate various points think the bbc points here. i think the bbc gets a lot right. i think radio fantastic. i think it's tv particularly current particularly it's current affairs very affairs journalism, not very good, to me it good, frankly. and to me it seems they constantly seems like they are constantly chasing the young market. >> yeah , but the actual facts

>> yeah, but the actual facts are that 35% of under 30 never watch the bbc. so are they in danger of, you know, ignoring the people that are watching it that don't want to discuss the elite? >> they're not in danger of it. >> they're not in danger of it. >> they're not in danger of it. >> they are doing that. they are ignonng >> they are doing that. they are ignoring their actual audience. and i think that's a dreadful shame. mean, newsnight, which shame. i mean, newsnight, which many watched many of us will have watched over the years, is now coming to an and many people will an end and many people will deplore honest and deplore that. but the honest and sad is almost nobody sad truth is almost nobody watches it. no this the thing. >> i mean, if you watch kids, if you watch the kids it's you watch the kids one, it's where were teaching them where they were teaching them how there were how many genders there were right? rather than just watching, them watching, letting them watch colourful cartoons. >> horrible histories one as >> the horrible histories one as well great, wasn't well was great, wasn't it? >> with the i'm >> recently, with the i'm half—iranian, i'm quite open to the fact that, you know, iranians been britain iranians haven't been in britain forever. know, that's that's forever. you know, that's that's just so, you know, just a fact. yes. so, you know, and learned to live with it. >> yeah. well, thank you very much. thank much for much. thank you very much for accepting me. so i mean, of accepting me. so i mean, sort of like, know, do you think like, you know, do you think though should defunded? do though it should be defunded? do you mean, there's, i

you think i mean, there's, i think a lot of people, the majority of people now think it should advertising. should be funded by advertising. so just scrap the so is it time to just scrap the licence fee? i don't think the licence fee? i don't think the licence fee? i don't think the licence fee is going to be sustainable a model, and sustainable as a model, and i don't it's actually in the don't think it's actually in the bbc's interests continue with bbc's interests to continue with the as more bbc's interests to continue with the more as more bbc's interests to continue with the more people as more bbc's interests to continue with the more people watch as more bbc's interests to continue with the more people watch moreiore bbc's interests to continue with the more people watch more and and more people watch more and more different things and as more different things and as more more people watch more and more people watch channels they've channels in ways that they've actively chosen to watch, it just increasingly obsolescent. think actually, if you were >> i think actually, if you were trying to defend the bbc you >> i think actually, if you were tryingbeingefend the bbc you >> i think actually, if you were tryingbeing radicalie bbc you >> i think actually, if you were tryingbeing radical about you >> i think actually, if you were tryingbeing radical about it, you >> i think actually, if you were tryingbeing radical about it, the>u were being radical about it, the first thing you'd do is get rid of the licence fee. aaron. one word. >> so tough. who's doing drama? well, that's not one word, is it? look at the attacks on it? well, look at the attacks on disney and iger. it's disney and bob iger. so it's a really i think long really tough gig i think long time you're right. they they can't survive with it. >> they're agreeing not >> they're agreeing they're not going >> they're agreeing they're not goiiyou always watch gb news >> you can always watch gb news in case much better right. in any case much better right. we move uh coming up we move on. uh coming up wetherspoons founder and brexit champion to champion tim martin is set to be knighted new year's champion tim martin is set to be knighteclist. new year's champion tim martin is set to be knighteclist. butiew year's champion tim martin is set to be knighteclist. but haveear's champion tim martin is set to be knighteclist. but have these honours list. but have these honours list. but have these honours become a bit outdated or are they an important to are they an important way to reward royal reward people? also, the royal mint unveiled new coins for

mint have unveiled new coins for 2020 for one commemorating the 150th birthday of sir winston churchill. but okay, i hate to say it, but is he someone we should be celebrating with? some branding him racist? don't go too far

radio. >> welcome back . this is dewbs& >> welcome back. this is dewbs& co with me. dawn neesom and keeping me company until 7:00 is alex dean, political consultant and aaron bastani, co—founder of novara media and you, of course, you're the important ones now. so let's talk goals, shall we? i'm not going to get one. i'm never going to be dame dawn. i don't think i think my i think that ship sailed. but whether spoons boss and prominent brexit campaign there be awarded campaign there will be awarded a knighthood kemi badenoch knighthood after kemi badenoch reportedly him be reportedly pushed for him to be honoured. but is this an appropriate way to wall people now, or is it just outdated

nonsense ? it's, um. aaron, what nonsense? it's, um. aaron, what do you think? it does seem a bit old fashioned. and are the right people even getting gongs? >> well, martin isn't >> well, tim martin isn't somebody agree somebody whose politics i agree with. don't you do with. um, and i don't you do surprise and i don't. but to surprise me, and i don't. but to be fair, he hasn't got this gong for, you know, services to whatever politics. um, but he has organisation has overseen an organisation which tens thousands which employs tens of thousands of people . um, provides of people. um, provides a product to millions of brits which they really value. yeah. cheap beer. yep as well as cheap curry and cheap english. >> we're with you on the cheap been >> we're with you on the cheap beer. yeah. >> and cheap coffee. um, the beerin >> and cheap coffee. um, the beer in particular. it feels like got more like it hasn't got more expensive about 15 years. expensive for about 15 years. sometimes so i this is a sometimes so i think this is a rare example somebody rare example of somebody deserving gong. you know, deserving the gong. you know, i think probably want to reform think we probably want to reform how honours this how we do honours in this country. i think far too often how we do honours in this cou paid i think far too often how we do honours in this cou paid to 1ink far too often how we do honours in this cou paid to politicaloo often how we do honours in this cou paid to political nepotism. it's paid to political nepotism. what in mind is david what sticks in my mind is david cameron's hairdresser getting an honour after he left office? yeah that shouldn't be happening. could been w0 i'se. woi'se. >> worse. >> could be boris johnson's hairdresser. yeah yeah, well, well, if he had one. >> right. um. but but in this

instance, it's somebody who's arguably served the public good. um, and i think that's, i think that's valuable. that's really, really valuable. um, there be reforms um, should there be reforms about how allocated and about how they're allocated and the role of the government of the role of the government of the that would be the day? i think that would be sensible but, know, i'm sensible. uh, but, you know, i'm i'm happy for him. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> in, uh, unfashionable , uh, >> in, uh, unfashionable, uh, suburbs in market towns up suburbs and in market towns up and down this country , there are and down this country, there are buildings, the old bank, the old court that have been rescued by tim martin and his chain. and he provides a place for people to go to and come together at remarkably reasonable prices. and i don't , so i'm completely and i don't, so i'm completely in favour of him getting an honoun in favour of him getting an honour. on your question about honours more generally. and i may differ a bit. i don't really care about the post—nominals and what people get to put on their name. uh it's a nice system to indicate somebody is contributing something to society . you can say if we've society. you can say if we've got right people, but as an got the right people, but as an idea, if makes people feel nice, then not? costs almost then why not? it costs almost nothing. what does stick in my craw the part of it that

craw is the one part of it that that has gone very wrong, in my view, which is making people up to the house of lords. uh, a system that has been so thoroughly by both thoroughly debased by both political government. political parties in government. i all. of course, the i should say all. of course, the lib 100 peers at lib dems had 100 peers at certainly until recently with a fraction of that. i didn't know there were that many lib dems ever tons tons. um ever as peers. tons and tons. um but point is, we have so but my point is, we have so thoroughly debased making up thoroughly debased by making up members our upper house so members of our upper house so rapidly that we the second rapidly that we had the second largest, um , legislative largest, um, legislative assembly in the world in the house of lords, after the people's republic china people's republic of china and the , i thought, the quality therein, i thought, was dubious and the was highly dubious and the nature of people going into it was really questionable, because nature of people going into it was reia y questionable, because nature of people going into it was reia peerage>nable, because nature of people going into it was reia peerage for)le, because nature of people going into it was reia peerage for life.)ecause nature of people going into it was reia peerage for life. butuse that is a peerage for life. but you have vote in our upper you have a vote in our upper house that is completely different something. different from something. i don't is from kbe don't care what it is from kbe to mbe, whatever it is, the to an mbe, whatever it is, the names doesn't matter . to an mbe, whatever it is, the names doesn't matter. being a peer that does matter . peer that does matter. >> yeah, it does matter. and even liz truss, who was in office for what, 49 days, 44 days, 44 days, call it 47, 47. let's split the difference. 47

not even she can remember. the latest lasted longer, though. i mean, even she was able to nominate people to go into the house of lords. >> yeah, think it's crazy, but >> yeah, i think it's crazy, but then there are lots things then there are lots of things about the british system are crazy. seems to have crazy. and it seems to have worked reasonably long worked for a reasonably long time. i think what has said time. i think what alex has said in having unelected in regards to having unelected life are legislators life peers who are legislators is just crazy. you know, i'm reminded this time reminded of this every time i see stupid alan sugar tweet on see a stupid alan sugar tweet on my think there's my timeline. i think there's shapps since the house shapps been since the house of lords. know, he's done lords. and, you know, he's done very business, but very well in business, but perhaps shouldn't be perhaps he shouldn't be legislature issues of legislature on 101 issues of which he probably doesn't have that a grasp. and that's that much of a grasp. and that's not to ridicule alan sugar. i think the many, think that's the case for many, many people the house of lords. >> well, michelle mone is another name that is very much on people's the moment. on people's lips at the moment. >> sugar is a great example >> alan sugar is a great example because he had the right honour. first sir alan same first time sir alan fine, same as sir martin. some people first time sir alan fine, same as sir i martin. some people first time sir alan fine, same as sir i don't n. some people first time sir alan fine, same as sir i don't like)me people first time sir alan fine, same as sir i don't like him people first time sir alan fine, same as sir i don't like him s0)ple may say i don't like him so what, you've a gong? yeah, what, you've got a gong? yeah, but have vote in the but he didn't have a vote in the house of lords. that's the issue. >> t- @ exactly. i mean, but >> yeah, exactly. i mean, but going to the honours going back to the honours system, the new year's honours

system, the new year's honours system, where does reward system, where it does reward people running people who are running charities, nice charities, it's really nice and things it has really nice. things and it has really nice. it things and it has really nice. h been things and it has really nice. it been going for a long it has been going for a long time now. the think, was time now. the 1890s i think, was the first one. can you name the first one. but can you name two of the people, the two biggest names were knighted biggest names who were knighted this off this time last year, off comfortable? the comfortable? so this is the problem it, it? you problem with it, isn't it? you can't remember it is. go and can't remember who it is. go and put us out of our misery. go on. okay, then. it's artist grayson perry. >> oh, yes, and queen guitarist bnan >> okay. >> okay. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> mhm. mhm. >> mhm. mhm. >> the bigger question is are they ever going to give one to becks. >> no i think he richly merits it. >> i mean it.- >> i mean i it.— >> i mean i do. we've it. >> i mean i do. we've made up people are far less significant uh sporting achievements david beckham literally played his heart out for us. i remember watching they decorously cut away from beckham after scoring away from beckham after scoring a england. said david a goal for england. i said david beckham taking a moment beckham was taking a moment to compose himself. vomiting compose himself. he was vomiting on the of the pitch. he on the side of the pitch. he played hard so long that played so hard and so long that and emotion high that and the emotion was so high that he keep his dinner down. >> why do you think? why do you? some people in public life and very as you say, very high profile as you say, you know, i mean, he is great

you know, i mean, he is a great footballer, dedicated footballer, a dedicated himself to do you think to that sport. why do you think some people never get it, never get a reward? >> i think i don't, i don't know how these things. it how these things. is it political? it's partly political? i think it's partly that he's too that maybe he's seen as too common. really that's common. i really think that's partly it. >> that's interesting. >> oh that's interesting. >> oh that's interesting. >> i really think that's partly. i say, well, tim i mean, you'd say, well, tim martin's but i think martin's got one, but i think the fact he's a pop icon, the fact that he's a pop icon, he's still quite young as well. right? they're probably right? i think they're probably thinking 60, 70, but he's thinking maybe 60, 70, but he's still a young he's still thinking maybe 60, 70, but he's still much1g he's still thinking maybe 60, 70, but he's still much out he's still thinking maybe 60, 70, but he's still much out there e's still thinking maybe 60, 70, but he's still much out there as still thinking maybe 60, 70, but he's still much out there as atill thinking maybe 60, 70, but he's still much out there as a as a very much out there as a as a figure in popular culture. the grades, the system somewhat. and i with that. but i don't agree with that. but i at least can. common is not the right phrase. i'm that right phrase. i'm saying that plus i that would the plus his age i that would be the explanation i think explanation given to me. i think that's deeply wrong that's obviously deeply wrong because done a great deal because he's done a great deal with his life already. >> i it's very hard. >> i think it's very hard. i don't know politics don't know about politics with beckham, hard to beckham, but it's very hard to say that politics isn't playing a part in the current environment as nigel environment because as nigel farage probably you farage is, probably whether you agree with him or not, one of the most consequential political figures i think figures of our lifetime, i think everyone that, yeah. everyone would agree that, yeah. so for not you know, so for him not to, you know, i imagine asked, he would serve

imagine if asked, he would serve right. and establishments, by the with the way, get a lot further with honey. think if you honey. uh and i think if you made up, you'd be quite made him up, you'd be quite likely to find nigel farage. um taking slightly critical taking a slightly less critical position. it position. sometimes i think it would everyone's interest. would be in everyone's interest. i richly deserves to go i mean, he richly deserves to go to, um, the house of lords for as long as we've got one. >> so it's a way of keeping people quiet, right? okay gentlemen, one point the. gentlemen, one point is the. >> sorry. go on. yeah. >> one last question. very quickly. if you were offered one, would accept it? one, would you accept it? >> knighthood yes. no. >> aaron? knighthood yes. no. >> aaron? knighthood yes. no. >> other gong obe, m.b.e. >> any other gong obe, m.b.e. any other bees? any of the other bees? >> no, no, just i'm a republican and people want to accept and i if people want to accept them, luck to them. i'm republican. >> that's that's just growing number of people are turning them the way. more them down. by the way. more people have turned down in the past two years than have ever done. >> i totally people want done. » l and, done. >> i tiand i people want done. >> i tiand i don't people want done. >> i tiand i don't in people want done. >> i tiand i don't in any3le want done. >> i tiand i don't in any wayvant them, and i don't in any way criticise them for it. >> i mean, we should i am a monarchist. i'm a proud supporter of the system. i would happily accept been happily accept one. i've been waiting time. yeah, waiting for some time. yeah, yeah, sir. >> alex. yeah, sir. >> sir�*x. yeah, sir. >> sir alex for alexandra, dame dawn. >> you can bring back my

>> and you can bring back my own. a commoner, right? that's it. right. thank you much. it. right. thank you very much. uh, dewbs & co uh, coming up next on dewbs& co the royal mint have revealed their new designs for 2024, one of is silver. winston of which is silver. winston churchill. but with accusations of which is silver. winston ch him ll. but with accusations of which is silver. winston ch him being: with accusations of which is silver. winston ch him being a/ith accusations of which is silver. winston ch him being a racist.:usations of which is silver. winston ch him being a racist. isations of which is silver. winston chhim being a racist. is this1s of him being a racist. is this the decision? i'm dawn the right decision? i'm dawn neesom on gb britain's neesom on gb news, britain's news channel but don't too news channel but don't go too far

uh. welcome back. this is dewbs& co with me. dawn neesom nick dawn neesom even keeping me company until 7:00. is alex dean, political colour consultant and former chief of staff to david cameron. no less. and bastani, co—founder of and aaron bastani, co—founder of novara and we could tell novara media and we could tell you what we've been talking aboutin you what we've been talking about in the break, but then we would have to kill you, or at least kill each other. so we're not but uh, now the not going to. but uh, now the royal mint has unveiled new designs for 2024, with the annual set including a buckingham palace £5 coin. hm

150 anniversary of the birth of sir winston churchill, £2 coin and a 200th anniversary of the national gallery £2 coin. there's a lot of figures in this. a 200th anniversary of the rnli , a £0.50 coin and a team gb rnli, a £0.50 coin and a team gb and paralympics gb £0.50 coin. but with claims that churchill was a racist and a war criminal. is it right that is, he even commemorated at all these days? i'm going to come to you first on this one. alex. what do you reckon? hero or zero hero? >> and he's already on the fiver. so, you know, if you had a problem with it, i wouldn't start from here. um, so he was our prime minister. our greatest prime minister. i actually think the one that may cause a bit of cause may cause a bit of concern. isn't that one? i think that that people, some that the issue that people, some people the rnli one, people may have is the rnli one, which is, you say some people, you mean you. >> no, i mean some people in >> no, no, i mean some people in this country because rnli this country because the rnli has from has gone from being a universally cherished institution institute and institution to an institute and

god the service god will you respect the service of who do to one of the people who do it to one who's leadership? >> pretty committed and >> are pretty committed and unrepentantly being unrepentantly committed to being a people coming a taxi service for people coming into country illegally, into this country illegally, and that some. the timing that will upset some. the timing of it's not nobody's fault, of it. it's not nobody's fault, it's anniversary, but it's the 200th anniversary, but the giving them this the timing of giving them this kind honour when that's the kind of honour when that's the policy they're policy debate that they're in, is affront some people is going to affront some people who meaningful who believe in meaningful borders. are just doing their who believe in meaningful bordetheyre just doing their who believe in meaningful bordethey can'tt doing their who believe in meaningful bordethey can't justng their who believe in meaningful bordethey can't just lettheir who believe in meaningful bordethey can't just let people drown. >> that's why i said that's why i said, the leadership has got this wrong. you hang they're this wrong. you hang on. they're actively out collecting actively going out collecting and boats full of and escorting back boats full of people risk of people and not at risk of drowning. in conditions drowning. and in conditions where go back to the where they should go back to the country safe country they country, the safe country they set france , basically. set out from france, basically. >> that's a bit >> well, that's a bit controversial, it, aaron? controversial, isn't it, aaron? um, reckon? two um, what do you reckon? two controversies now, then controversies here. now, then we've winston churchill, who we've got winston churchill, who was a racist. >> yeah, we like controversy . me >> yeah, we like controversy. me let me, let me , let me let me, let me, let me, let me stalk out a middle ground here. he commemorated. he he should be commemorated. he was man. he was was a remarkable man. he was also a racist. he was very much also a racist. he was very much a man of his time. he believed in racial hierarchy with white protestants very much the protestants very much at the top. attack on

top. and that's not an attack on him. simply repeating him. that's simply repeating historical fact . he should be historical fact. he should be commemorated . he should be on commemorated. he should be on the £5 note. and so on. he was a remarkable historical figure beyond politics as well . of beyond politics as well. of course, he was a journalist and a writer. he won a nobel a writer. um, he won a nobel prize for literature, which is pretty crazy when you think he was also such a successful politician. so of course he should be commemorated. of course, he's one of the most impressive figures to emerge from country as national from this country as national culture. for centuries . uh, but culture. for centuries. uh, but i don't think that means you therefore gloss over and deny things that he openly said . things that he openly said. >> are we being a bit harsh in the fact, as we are judged ing some of the language and terminology he used by the language and terminology that we have today? for instance, he referred to germans as a race. yeah.i referred to germans as a race. yeah. i mean, they're not obviously they're a nationality. so when he was using the word race, it's different to how we use it today. >> look, i'm not trying to condemn him. all i'm saying is if somebody says was churchill. no, like say, he was

no, because like you say, he was a his time. and there are a man of his time. and there are many people i deeply revere and respect the past who respect from the past who i think figures. think were incredible figures. and if they were alive and i'm sure if they were alive today, they would probably hold different different different views on different things. also it's things. but it's also it's disrespectful him a way to disrespectful to him in a way to make a modern figure. and make him a modern figure. and deny he said, which deny things that he said, which reflected culture from which reflected the culture from which he . know, aaron's view he came. you know, aaron's view is remarkably, um , welcome and is remarkably, um, welcome and different to that expressed by many people on the left. >> you get a group going on houston, get a bloody room. >> i say that because there's plenty of people who take this kind of view that we're in this glorious year. and anyone glorious year. zero. and anyone who would fail the standards of today absolutely today should be absolutely non—person. today should be absolutely non—perename the school, statue, rename the school, destroy any records of their contributing to public life. and i think aaron's position is much more emollient than that. but we should be aware that it's not universally held on your side of politics. >> i mean, the churchill statue in london was vandalised in anti capitalism protests 2000, capitalism protests in 2000, whereas aaron's an anti—capitalist. >> but he wouldn't do that. anti

student fee protests in 2010. >> you're not a student. that's fair enough. and black lives matter protests 2020. so matter protests in 2020. so people do have an issue with him don't they? can i can i say something a bit provocative here? >> uh oh. so in 2000, when he had the turf over his head and it was you know, vandalised in a way that's a compliment to him because it shows still, he's very politically . very much a live politically. vital figure in this country's national life. and people looked at that and it made them feel something. and i'm not trying to be contrarian here. there are so many statues people walk past. who the is that? don't know who the hell is that? don't know them. don't care. he's still arouses those kinds of feelings. >> i would like a bit >> i would i would like a bit more respect such things in more respect for such things in this country. i'd the this country. and i'd like the police police properly on police to police properly on such i think the such occasions. i think the moment you near moment you get, you go near taking, giving the senator off the i i'd like the police the side. i i'd like the police to put bit of stick about and to put a bit of stick about and anyone vandalising a memorial to anyone vandalising a memorial to anyone should have anyone vandalising a memorial to any0|collar should have anyone vandalising a memorial to any0|collar felt should have anyone vandalising a memorial to any0|collar felt inhould have anyone vandalising a memorial to any0|collar felt in 22,002, |ve their collar felt in 22,002, nationwide, bbc poll, very nationwide, bbc poll, the very woke bbc. >> then we've already

>> obviously then we've already talked them. um, he was talked about them. um, he was voted the greatest britain ahead of darwin or of shakespeare, darwin or elizabeth the first. >> didn't vote in that at the >> i didn't vote in that at the time, but if i had done, i would have voted that way. >> where would you vote for? no way. >> look, if aliens came to this planet tomorrow, the two human beings, they'd most impressed beings, they'd be most impressed by newton darwin by arguably newton and darwin discovering of discovering scientific laws of gravity evolutionary gravity and evolutionary adaptation would say adaptation. then they would say these literally universal these are literally universal laws. these are the people from this species who defined and discovered these how discovered these laws. how incredible we're very privileged, by the way. they both came from britain. so did those two people accomplish less than churchill? as remarkable as he think really don't. he was? i think we really don't. we talk enough about how we don't talk enough about how special darwin, newton, faraday and other scientific figures are that came from. >> wouldn't it rather depend on your aliens point of view? i mean, your aliens having managed interstellar flight, they might be rather less impressed by those scientific achievements. >> way, we've got to >> but by the way, we've got to ask the pronouns of the alien first. according the woke first. according to the woke bbc, see, obviously with their

doctor who thing. okay, now final quiz for final quick quiz question for you many biographies you both. how many biographies do there have been do you think there have been written winston churchill all 2000. >> oh, go on a couple of hundred 1600. >> wow . >> wow. >> wow. >> wasn't far off. >> wasn't far off. >> that's a lot, isn't it? so that proves the point that it's worth talking about, which we have done right. oh, we're running out time . god. have done right. oh, we're running out time. god. uh, up running out of time. god. uh, up next is two hours of farage, which , with richard tice. um, so which, with richard tice. um, so all i've got to do now is thank my wonderful panellist tonight who have been so lovely and agreed with each other on everything. so we're going off not quite well, almost so not quite to, well, almost so we're to the pub now we're going off to the pub now for a group and, and for a group hug and, and celebrate this weird time of yeah celebrate this weird time of year. so thank you. thank you very much, gentlemen, and a happy new year to both a happy new because we can start new year because we can start saying that can't yeah. saying that now, can't we? yeah. thank you very much for watching. um and i am back tomorrow at exactly the same time, being michelle dewberry foreign. thank you. and have a lovely you . lovely evening. thank you. >> a brighter outlook with boxt

solar . the sponsors of weather solar. the sponsors of weather on . gb news. on. gb news. >> good evening. i'm annie shuttleworth and this is your latest gb news weather update. there'll be some sunshine on friday, but it will be still quite breezy, but a little bit calmer than it has been recently . low pressure. still in charge though , and that will be pushing though, and that will be pushing through this weather front throughout the evening. that will bring a more persistent spell heavier to spell of heavier rain to southern areas. should southern areas. that should clear second part of southern areas. that should cleenight, second part of southern areas. that should cleenight, but second part of southern areas. that should cleenight, but it's second part of southern areas. that should cleenight, but it's furtherpart of the night, but it's further north where we see the most persistent rain. still some heavy, gusty and blustery showers to come through throughout of night . throughout much of the night. we've also got a northerly wind bringing colder air to the bringing in colder air to the far north of scotland , so we'll far north of scotland, so we'll see some over hills at see some snow over the hills at first, to lower levels first, but to lower levels across northeast tomorrow across the northeast by tomorrow morning south, though, morning. further south, though, it and dry, but it will stay clear and dry, but the will hold the breeze will hold temperatures mild temperatures up so another mild start tomorrow. could see start tomorrow. we could see some sunshine, mainly across central and eastern areas throughout morning on throughout the morning on friday, not a bad day to be

friday, so not a bad day to be getting out and about through the morning, but cloud will thicken by the afternoon as well as some heavy showers developing from be as some heavy showers developing from persistent be as some heavy showers developing from persistent across be as some heavy showers developing from persistent across coastal quite persistent across coastal areas as well as northern areas of england the north of of england and the far north of scotland. staying very cold. a cold feel tomorrow, particularly in the wind. i think it'll be a cold to saturday as well, cold start to saturday as well, but cloud will thicken through the the next spell of wet the day as the next spell of wet and windy weather arrives from the as that and the west and as that wet and windy weather pushes up into northern it bring northern scotland, it will bring some snow, some sleety snow some hill snow, some sleety snow for saturday. some for a time on saturday. so some more unsettled to weather come on a blustery on more unsettled to weather come on year's a blustery on more unsettled to weather come on year's eve.»lustery on more unsettled to weather come on year's eve. butery on more unsettled to weather come on year's eve. butery year's new year's eve. but new year's day looks a little bit drier but colder. see you later . colder. see you later. >> looks like things are heating up boxt boilers sponsors of weather on .

gb news. >> and a very, very good evening . compliments of the season. it's 7:00. it's gb news. this is a two hour farage special taking you through to patrick christys at 9:00. we have got an action packed two hours in the first houn packed two hours in the first hour. the big debate of the last few days. will they won't they? will they have it will they aboush will they have it will they abolish inheritance tax ? have we abolish inheritance tax? have we heard this all before? is it a bit a familiar debate we'll bit of a familiar debate we'll be getting into that with my special in the studio and special guest in the studio and getting to. here's getting your views to. here's another big topic prison sentencing. we have more sentencing. should we have more of less of it is community of it, less of it is community sentencing working or not? all of that big, big topic. another great guest . and yes, it's great guest. and yes, it's almost the new year, the new year ahead 2024. we'll be looking ahead . what to look looking ahead. what to look forward to, what to be sort of focussed on possibly what to be worried about. and we have got some extraordinary festive farages, but first of all,

before all of that,