>> good evening. tonight our top story . it's the subpostmaster story. it's the subpostmaster scandal . should they all be scandal. should they all be exonerated . we'll look at the exonerated. we'll look at the oil and gas licences debate in the house of commons following the house of commons following the resignation of a conservative member of parliament. i will interview a banker who was sacked over using the n word in a diversity debate as to what was acceptable, what wasn't. we'll pay wasn't. and we'll also pay tribute to the last of the world war ii sas originals. but before all of that, let's get the . news

all of that, let's get the. news >> nigel, thank you and good evening to you. well, our top story from the gb newsroom is that the prime says he that the prime minister says he would strongly support a decision to revoke the former post office bosses. cbe paula vennells routinely denied there were problems with the horizon. it system, which made it look like money was missing from the post office itself. her hundreds of staff, as a result, were convicted, jailed, bankrupted and some even took their own lives after they were wrongly accused of theft. the government insists it is working to ensure compensation is paid to all those affected , and fresh ice those affected, and fresh ice warnings have been issued for parts of britain tonight as temperatures plummet and snow and sleet hit the country. the met office has issued yellow alerts for southern england and southern wales, effective until tomorrow morning. an amber cold health alert has also been issued for parts of england in line with the government's warning system, with the cold

snap set to continue throughout the rest of this week . sir keir the rest of this week. sir keir starmer visited flood hit east midlands regions today, promising that a labour government would do more to protect people's homes. that's after labour accused the government of being asleep at the wheel over flood warnings . the wheel over flood warnings. more than 160 flood warnings remain in place across the country, and over 1800 properties have been damaged by the german football legend franz beckenbauer has died at the age of 78. he captained germany to world cup victory in 1974, then won the tournament again as manager in 1990. he was nicknamed the kaiser and he helped guide bayern munich to three successive european cups . three successive european cups. his family say he died peacefully in his sleep . peacefully in his sleep. politics and chris skidmore has formally resigned as an mp, triggering another by—election. the government's former net zero tsar quit in protest over what he says are plans to prioritise

and politicise new oil and gas licences . that's as and politicise new oil and gas licences. that's as mps and politicise new oil and gas licences . that's as mps debate licences. that's as mps debate the offshore petroleum bill tonight in the house of commons. it's the second reading tonight and if it passes the legislation will mandate that licences for oil and gas projects in the nonh oil and gas projects in the north sea are awarded annually . north sea are awarded annually. now the actor idris elba has beenin now the actor idris elba has been in london today calling for an immediate ban on machetes and so—called zombie knives, as he launched his don't stop your future campaign. the hollywood star spoke to families of victims today , and folded sets victims today, and folded sets of clothes , each representing of clothes, each representing someone who died as a result of knife crime , were displayed in knife crime, were displayed in parliament square in central london last summer. the home office did say tougher measures on weapons would be introduced , on weapons would be introduced, but legislation hasn't yet been passed. idris elba says although some deterrents are working, much more needs to be done . much more needs to be done. that's the news on gb news

across the uk on tv, in your car, on digital radio and on your smart speaker. this is britain's news channel . good evening. >> one of the most extraordinary things about all miscarriages of justice is how long it takes to sort them out. and of course, i'm talking about the subpostmaster scandal and i'm talking about the fact that the whistle was actually blown as long ago as 2009. n yes, back in 2009, some serious doubts were put into the public's mind, into parliament's mind that actually the horizon computer system wasn't actually working and that innocent people were being convicted. and yet despite that, despite that, quite a lot of pubuchy despite that, quite a lot of publicity at the time, the prosecutions kept on coming up until 2015, 736 people were were

convicted of taking money from the post office. and it's an awful scandal for that. we know of have taken their lives . many of have taken their lives. many other people's lives were ruined and it looks to be the single biggest miscarriage of justice in british judicial history. biggest miscarriage of justice in british judicial history . and in british judicial history. and the odd thing is that whilst this story has kept on rumbling , this story has kept on rumbling, i didn't see any of it. as an mep, it wasn't deemed to be a european issue and indeed it wasn't. but suddenly mps are coming out of the woodwork saying yes, we had people in our constituency coming on us constituency coming on to us complaining, and constituency coming on to us complaining , and yet it takes complaining, and yet it takes a docudrama on itv to reignite pubuc docudrama on itv to reignite public debate in it. well, all i can say to that is better late than never. now a huge amount of media attention has been focusing on the leader of the liberal democrats, sir ed davey, because he was the competent minister from 2010 when the scandal was at its height . but i

scandal was at its height. but i raised a little question on this morning , you know, when keir morning, you know, when keir starmer or should i say sir keir starmer, because of course he was knighted for the five years that he acted as director of pubuc that he acted as director of public prosecutions, virtually every week, starmer boasts to us about his time at the dpp and the job that he did, but i asked a question this morning on social media, which was why are we not discussing keir starmer's role in this? why do i say that? well, because quite simply, the prosecution of offences act, which came in in 1985, allows allowed private prosecutions and what the post office did in every single one of these cases is they were able to bypass the police , they were able to bypass police, they were able to bypass the crown prosecution service and bring private prosecutions. but but the director of public prosecutions, the dpp , which prosecutions, the dpp, which starmer did, i repeat from 2008

until 2013, has power under section six two of the act to take over private prosecutions . take over private prosecutions. so actually start had the power to take over these prosecutions orindeed to take over these prosecutions or indeed to say enough and it's impossible to believe, given the hundreds of prosecutions that were happening, given the media commentary that was taking place at the time, that he wasn't aware of it. i'm not actually accusing him of anything. i'm just asking why, as dpp , he just asking why, as dpp, he didn't ask questions. he didn't intervene. and i'd like to know. i'd like to know from mps , you i'd like to know from mps, you know, did they at the time write , write to starmer when he was the dpp? and maybe some of this stuff will start to come out over the next few days. of course, as usual, whenever i say anything, it must be wrong. and everyone said i was wrong, including twitter or x as they're now called, who put up a

community notice to say beware of what i've said. well you might actually notice. now, if you look at x that that community notice has been taken down and a man called john hyde, he replied that i was wrong. funny enough , he's wrong. he's funny enough, he's wrong. he's the deputy news editor for the law society magazine , he says in law society magazine, he says in his bio . we should all try to be his bio. we should all try to be as nice as we can if possible. he hit back at me and he's now had to admit he was wrong. starmer as dpp could potentially have played a role in all of this. now the big question , i this. now the big question, i think, is what next? and given that it's taken us many , many that it's taken us many, many years to get to this point, i guess we have to ask ourselves a question. should all the convictions be overturned ? and convictions be overturned? and now , normally i wouldn't support now, normally i wouldn't support such a proposition. i'd say that it's wrong to blanket say everybody is guilty or everybody is innocent . but given the

is innocent. but given the passage of time and given the age of many of these people for them to actually physically be at a face going through their own appeals would be off putting to many . and frankly, if we go to many. and frankly, if we go through that process, many would have died. or by that stage be incapacitated through age. so for once , i think actually we for once, i think actually we should i'd say that everybody that was convicted in the honzon that was convicted in the horizon scandal has been exonerated, even if there were amongst the seven three, six, 1 or 2 bad apples, that's my take. that's my view . let me know what that's my view. let me know what you think . farage at gbnews.com. you think. farage at gbnews.com. now, a couple of years ago , nick now, a couple of years ago, nick wallace wrote a book, the great post office scandal. as a result of it, the horizon scandal fund was set up and i'm joined by trustee helen lacey. this evening, and by fellow trustee david chaplin . helen, all of

david chaplin. helen, all of this was written a couple of years ago . so are you frustrated years ago. so are you frustrated how long this has all taken? i'm terribly frustrated. >> absolutely. >> absolutely. >> i mean, three years ago we spoke to nick and he mentioned writing this book. we published it in november 2021, and it's taken until the itv drama to really get it into the public arena, which i think is really, you know, very, very disappointing for the subpostmasters that are still waiting but it is waiting for money. but it is better late than never, isn't it? well, 25 years for some people. >> i love time and a long time, but i mean, you're in the studio talking about it as we speak. the house of commons is debating it. yes it may have taken an itv drama, but what do we do? how do we get justice for these people ? we get justice for these people? >> well, i mean, we're trustees of the horizon scandal fund and what we do is we support subpostmasters with with i'm hoping stopgap money. this is what it was designed to do. this is why we set it up in the first place. we were thinking that the honzon place. we were thinking that the horizon scandal fund would only for two, maybe,

for last a year or two, maybe, and now two years and and it's now two years and there's sign that there's still no sign that they're going get proper they're going to get proper compensation. so this stopgap has been a stopgap. i mean, has not been a stopgap. i mean, this is now really this is this is now really helping to help helping or trying to help subpostmasters that really deserve better compensation. and proper from the proper compensation from the post and government. post office and the government. >> of them have been >> and a lot of them have been literally ruined literally financially ruined by this . this absolutely ruined. >> only this week we've >> i mean, only this week we've had several applications as people being threatened with eviction . paid rent to eviction. we paid their rent to stop being evicted. stop them being evicted. and we've that need we've got people that need counselling, desperately need counselling, desperately need counselling because they're absolutely and the absolutely traumatised and the list goes on. i mean, we've helped in so many ways and of course they're sort of in a way they're pillars of the local community, aren't they? >> trusted figures that >> they're trusted figures that people to. so for people of all ages go to. so for them, the public humiliation of all totally humiliating them, the public humiliation of all really totally humiliating them, the public humiliation of all really what.y humiliating them, the public humiliation of all really what i humiliating them, the public humiliation of all really what i want liating them, the public humiliation of all really what i want toting them, the public humiliation of all really what i want to say as and really what i want to say as well, that a lot people well, is that a lot of people are not coming forward for compensation. >> they're not coming forward to have their convictions quashed because absolutely because they are absolutely traumatised. do traumatised. and they just do not those wounds. not want to reopen those wounds. >> they face going through. >> they can't. they are also >> they can't. and they are also

not the charity not coming to the charity sometimes i know that sometimes because i know that they are proud and they they are proud people and they they are proud people and they they don't want to reopen they just don't want to reopen those completely those wounds. and we completely understand would understand that. so i would implore listening that implore anyone listening that needs approach us at the needs help to approach us at the horizon scandal fund, say what your is in a very, very your story is in a very, very short way. i'm not saying you've got to fill in a lengthy form or anything that, but please anything like that, but please come you come forward and will you respect the confidentiality? absolutely, that's absolutely, because that's key, isn't >> yes. >> yes. >> we've already helped about 35 people, we people, but my take is we shouldn't be we shouldn't be helping. we shouldn't be helping. we shouldn't need the charity, the government the post office government and the post office should them should be compensating them properly now. >> , they're going to have >> well, they're going to have to pushed a bit further to be pushed a bit further before they do that. david before they do that. and david chaplin, i mean, i, as i say, thinking about this thinking thinking about this and thinking what done and, and given what can be done and, and given that passage of time with many people we just talked about people that we just talked about is blanket exoneration on is the blanket exoneration on the with this? the way forward with this? >> , there's a couple of >> well, there's a couple of things about blanket things about the blanket exoneration. obviously, exoneration. one is obviously, yes, we want them. we want them to their names be cleared. to be their names to be cleared. and if and we've always said it's better that one guilty person goes free than hundreds.

yeah get our convicted when they're innocent. so that's one way forward which ironically we had we had a discussion between the trustees today would result in all of those people getting £600,000, because that's what the government has offered as and we must make this clear and i don't think we should sunak made this clear yet, is that the £600,000 they've been offered is a final payment. um, people keep referring it in government to an interim payment, which it isn't . interim payment, which it isn't. if you accept the £600,000, but you think you're owed more, which many of them should get, they won't get. why shouldn't they? because their lives have been completely ruined for 25 years. they've lost their house, they've lost their dignity, and they've lost their dignity, and they've . they've lost their they've lost. they've lost their opportunities earn . so opportunities to earn. so i think if you lost your opportunity to earn for 25 years, nigel, i think you'd be looking for more than £600,000, wouldn't no, no, wouldn't you? no no, no, no, i get that, that. that's why get that, i get that. that's why they be getting their they should be getting their money now. um, so, so the, the, our biggest thing though, as, as

the fund, as helen said, we're there stop gap while people there to stop gap while people haven't got money. so overturning the convictions if it did result in this rather unintended consequence of £600,000 for them all straight away . yeah. um, may be one way away. yeah. um, may be one way of going, but it would have to be an interim payment. um, but the thing is, it might the other thing is, it might just the important thing is just the more important thing is making sure they recompense. making sure they get recompense. they justice as well. um, they want justice as well. um, but they want justice and recompense. some some may not. some may just want to be able to draw line their, under draw a line under their, under this, whole episode, which this, this whole episode, which is uh , is is, um, you know, uh, is absolutely their choice . um, but absolutely their choice. um, but it the, the key thing is , is to, it the, the key thing is, is to, is also to get them that compensation as well as getting their name names cleared. how long, helen, before number 10 call you in, do you think how long before the prime minister calls you in and resolves this ? calls you in and resolves this? >> i mean, do you feel that you're now winning? >> i, i really do hope so. i really do hope so. but as i said before, i can't believe it takes

the itv drama to get this out. well, i mean, all the mps are now and down, but now jumping up and down, but they've about it for they've known about it for a long, long 15 years. nick long, long time. 15 years. nick wallace been reporting on wallace has been reporting on this 2010, has people this since 2010, as has people like tom witherow from the times, karl flinders from times, as has karl flinders from computer weekly. this has been going for long, long time, going on for a long, long time, and private eye course. and and private eye of course. and private eye, course. yes. private eye, of course. yes. sorry, i've forgotten. >> his been absolute private. >> i do deserve a mention in despatches here. >> they certainly do. >> they certainly do. >> but mps, they've >> but the mps, they've all known for ages, and. known about this for ages, and. and you know, and i can't believe you know, the this has over the publicity this has had over the publicity this has had over the week, is the last week, which is brilliant. i'm not knocking it. please, please don't get me wrong, but it should have happened ages and you know, happened ages ago and you know, and now all getting on and they're now all getting on the bandwagon, know, and the bandwagon, you know, and saying, oh yes, we need to do something it. why something about it. but why didn't it ages ago? didn't they do it ages ago? >> i understand your >> helen, i understand your frustration whole frustration with the whole system. take your point system. david, i take your point that lives have been ruined for up to quarter of a century. up to a quarter of a century. well for you've done. well done for what you've done. you've absolutely the you've been absolutely in the right think are right place. i think you are beginning don't think beginning to win. i don't think it'll happen overnight, but i

think you are actually going to win. think there a is win. i think there is a there is a moral case here that is absolutely over whelming, and there very there are people in very powerful senior positions, very, very worried. but they can't stop this tide . it's heading in stop this tide. it's heading in the right direction at very long. last but in a moment we'll discuss a former tory energy minister who dramatically resigns on friday to cause a by—election. well new oil and gas licences have been debated in second reading today in the house of commons. in a moment, we'll find out what's been said and how big is the rebellion within the conservative party .

news radio. >> well, your thoughts on the victims of the horizon scandal, lee says completely agree, nigel. >> these people need to be exonerated immediately . exonerated immediately.

compensation is a must as asap, one viewer says, i agree that all those convicted should be exonerated. michael says, hmm , exonerated. michael says, hmm, better that ten guilty men go free than one innocent man is found guilty . free than one innocent man is found guilty. i'm not free than one innocent man is found guilty . i'm not sure found guilty. i'm not sure everybody would agree with those odds, michael. i was suggesting they might be the other way round, that there might be a couple wrong'uns amongst the couple of wrong'uns amongst the seven, six. and finally, seven, three, six. and finally, ken says of people will ken says a lot of people will agree with this. the senior people the post office who people at the post office who showed gross negligence in the handung showed gross negligence in the handling the office handling of the post office scandal, face prosecution scandal, should face prosecution and possible custodial sentences. well, it isn't just gross negligence, ken. you know, they use their own investigators. they use their own prosecutors . they were able own prosecutors. they were able to bypass the police to bypass the cps , and they were left the cps, and they were left completely to their own devices. and there is a large element, i think, in what happened that was nothing less than utterly vindictive and nasty. so yes, people should ultimately be held

to account. and that's a lot more than losing an honour for one particular woman. even if a million people have signed that position, that that petition, it wasn't just down to her. now, the conservative party is constantly split . there are i constantly split. there are i don't know how many different families of conservative mps , families of conservative mps, but one of them, chris skidmore, was, of course, an energy minister, very committed to the net zero agenda. and dramatically on friday afternoon resigns as a member of parliament and says he wants to force a by—election even though his constituency is going to be abolished at the next election. for some, it's a principled move , for others, it's utterly cynical because they say he's heading to off get a job in the green lobby. but this afternoon, this debate on whether we should be pushing for new oil and gas licences in the north sea has been taking place in westminster. i'm joined by olivia utley gb news political

correspondent, the skidmore resignation came . i'm a resignation came. i'm a completely out of the blue. well exactly. >> and it utterly dashed rishi sunak hopes for a quiet start to 2024. to resign as an mp is a really radical move. it's a really radical move. it's a really big move. we often see ministers resign the whip because they disagree with the prime minister or the government on a particular issue, but actually stepping down as an mp and triggering a by—election when your party is 19 points behind in the polls , is a very behind in the polls, is a very big step to take. lots of people in the conservative party who i've to are angry i've been speaking to are angry with chris skidmore. they think that doing it because he that he's doing it because he wants as you mentioned, wants the job. as you mentioned, they're reduction the they're on the reduction in the green a lucrative green lobby. it's a lucrative place and he's been place to work. and he's been campaigning a long on campaigning for a long time on the cause i'm sure the net zero, cause i'm sure he'll snapped up straight he'll be snapped up straight away that green lobby. and away in that green lobby. and also, it's brought some other conservative out of conservative mps out of the woodwork. sharma , who was woodwork. alok sharma, who was the president of cop 26, has said that he disagrees with the

bill as well. he will probably be voting it down and there's a handful of other mps who might not rebel when the when the vote actually happens later this evening. but will could possibly abstain among them, theresa may. this is an emerging split in the conservative party over rishi sunak as titude towards net zero, and it'll be really interesting to see just how big that rebellion is. meanwhile, it's fascinating to see what labour are saying about all of this, because keir starmer has said that he wouldn't grant new oil and gas licences for projects in the north sea , but projects in the north sea, but he wouldn't abolish ones ones that are in place already . so that are in place already. so it's a little bit of a cheeky position that labour is taking. they are, uh , voting against the they are, uh, voting against the bill this evening, but if the bill this evening, but if the bill gets voted through, which it almost definitely will, because easy to the because easy to forget, the conservatives do a big conservatives do have a big majority then labour would majority dodi then labour would allow the projects are allow the projects which are decided tonight and in the decided on tonight and in the future, to go ahead. so they're sort having cake sort of having their cake and eating one argue. but eating it. one could argue. but this, this debate over net

this, this, this debate over net zero were only just seeing the beginnings of it. think beginnings of it. i think because we're only just beginning to see exactly how rishi sunak feels about the whole net zero project. and on this he's actually quite this issue, he's actually quite far right of the party. far to the right of the party. so i think this is something which is going to get bigger and bigger in the coming months. well, bigger in the coming months. weibut i mean, you know, if you >> but i mean, you know, if you actually go out and ask joe public, uh, you know, are you worried about climate change? yes you to a very yes do you want to have a very expensive boiler? no i mean, expensive new boiler? no i mean, he very interesting you get he very interesting when you get the what people the reactions of what people have pay, be it have actually got to pay, be it for electric cars or, or, you know, getting rid of the gas boiler, you suddenly get a very, very reaction. and very different reaction. and i think sunak is reacting to it. yeah. mean, just back to the yeah. i mean, just back to the by—election quickly, this kingswood constituency is being abolished election. abolished at the next election. so going to have so the taxpayer is going to have to fund a by—election for a new mp for six months, and then the seats abolished and that, i think, probably makes the public pretty angry. to labour, pretty angry. back to labour, because it's really interesting. you know , as i've mentioned,

you know, as i've mentioned, pubuc you know, as i've mentioned, public opinion , particularly in public opinion, particularly in the wall, these key red wall the red wall, these key red wall seats and i don't know, you know, we've been out with the farage at large shows all around those red wall seats and people do not want more expensive energy bills . they're pretty energy bills. they're pretty hacked they are hacked off where they are already. and this giving labour some issues too, isn't it? because this promised 28 billion a year that's going to be pumped into renewable energy and kind of almost taking a leaf out of biden's book with his so—called inflation reduction act in america. but signs i thought in the new year's speech that starmer gave in the middle of last week and questioning since that even maybe labour are beginning to row back on some of these commitments. >> well, i think that's true. the closer it gets to a general election and the closer the prospect actually becoming prospect of actually becoming prime for keir prime minister gets for keir starmer , the more he's having to starmer, the more he's having to look over all of the very many, very expensive promises he's made over the last few years and review them. labour has promised

that it would be, uh, sound with money, that it would be sort of economically sensible, that it would borrow for day to day would not borrow for day to day spending. wants to get, uh, spending. it wants to get, uh, debt as a proportion of gdp down. that's difficult to do, especially if you're promising 28 billion here and a couple more billion there on green issues. child care , whatever. issues. child care, whatever. rachel reeves next idea is. so i think, yeah, this is going to cause some problems for labour and keir starmers instincts on this. are i expect to go where the voting public are going . he the voting public are going. he what he wants is to rishi sunak to downing street, just as rishi is doing and i think what's really interesting about this is it is the red wall. you're absolutely right. but it's also the south uxbridge was a fascinating by—election to watch. had watch. that was the one had a majority. johnson had majority. boris johnson had a majority. boris johnson had a majority of only 3000. everyone thought that labour was going to snap it up. no problem at all. but turned into essentially a but it turned into essentially a referendum on ulez that ultra—low emissions charge and the conservatives are

campaigning on a on an anti ulez footing , actually managed to win footing, actually managed to win that seat . that seat. >> the only one they won, they lost all the others. >> they lost those some 24,000 majorities, an enormous majority . but they managed to cling to on uxbridge because they were fighting from, if you like, an anti green agenda . so both sunak anti green agenda. so both sunak and starmer will have seen that they will have taken it in and they'll be thinking about that in the months ahead. >> literally. fascinating thank in the months ahead. >> landlly. fascinating thank in the months ahead. >> land youzascinating thank in the months ahead. >> land you knowating thank in the months ahead. >> land you know the] thank in the months ahead. >> land you know the glorious you. and you know the glorious irony it's voting against irony that it's voting against ulez in uxbridge, despite the fact the previous mp had been the person who thought it was a great idea in the first place. in fact, looking at it all, we may well get two parties at the next election with almost identical manifest atos. you think joking? just you wait think i'm joking? just you wait and see in a moment. have you heard what's been happening in germany? have you heard about the farmers protests ? have you the farmers protests? have you heard that today the busiest motorway in europe was blocked for an hour after hour after houn for an hour after hour after hour. there is something of a

political and social rebellion taking place in germany right now that is going to have major electoral implications . i will electoral implications. i will tell you all about it because the other news channels won't. in just a moment

listening to tv, news, radio. >> what it feels a bit like 2016 in some countries, because the populist revolt is really happening in many parts of europe. and if you believe the opinion polls, it's certainly happening in america as well. perhaps to a lesser extent in our country. but in germany there really have been some remarkable events over the course of the last few days , course of the last few days, predominantly led by farmers . predominantly led by farmers. and that's because the government's proposing cutting subsidies on their diesel oil. and this has led to extraordinary protests. i mean, in munich alone , 5500 tractors in munich alone, 5500 tractors went in to the centre of the

city. i was told earlier on today, the a two, which is the busiest motorway in europe, was blocked for some period of time . blocked for some period of time. well, it's the sort of try and get some sense of how big this is and what it all means is i'm joined by a member alternative for deutschland, member of the european parliament joachim kurz, who joins me down the line. joachim. good evening. welcome to the show . welcome to the show. >> yes. good evening nigel, it's good to see you and we miss you in the european parliament. >> well, i thank you. i mean, i know the european parliament. >> mrs. may, uh, but apart from the fine company of some members , i got to tell you, i don't particularly miss it, but please give. i know, please. yeah. please give us. because actually , you know, traditional media in britain are not giving much coverage of the situation in germany . maybe give us some coverage of the situation in germany. maybe give us some idea

of how widespread this farmers protest has been. and who else has joined in. >> okay. thank you, nigel, to be here. um this is a good day for germany because for the first time since 50 years, um, the germans are waking up and they are going to the streets , which are going to the streets, which is normally not usual in germany. but today is really good because in all cities of germany , in all big cities, in germany, in all big cities, in small cities , in the on the small cities, in the on the crossroads , on the autobahns crossroads, on the autobahns everywhere, say as uh, coming with their tractors , their big, with their tractors, their big, big machines , and they are big machines, and they are blocking the circulation and so on.and blocking the circulation and so on. and but it's all peaceful. that's very important. it's peaceful and it's a protest. who will ring in the in the will ring in new, um, thing for germany, a new, uh, hopefully a new future for germany.

>> well, many are saying, of course, that these protests are playing into the hands of the much feared far right, which, of course, is how the afd is always characterised in germany and in the united kingdom . but there is the united kingdom. but there is something remarkable. the last opinion poll that i saw had your party on about 23% of the vote , party on about 23% of the vote, um, and the governing party, the governing party, um, of chancellor schulz , on about 14. chancellor schulz, on about 14. so as we look ahead , joachim, we so as we look ahead, joachim, we look ahead to 2024. and obviously you're going to put your case. and i get that. but we've got european elections. but there are also some quite significant provincial elections coming up in germany too. aren't there . there. >> that's that's right. we have three very important provincial elections in thuringia in saxony and in brandenburg and in all

three countries, the afd is a the leading in the leading in the leading in the leading in the polls with a big, big, um, difference to the next party. and that's really a strange thing. and because , um, we are thing. and because, um, we are still growing , it's, it's former still growing, it's, it's former times. it was normal that the, the, the government could as , the, the government could as, um, bring us into the right, far right . uh, um um, bring us into the right, far right. uh, um wing and said, oh, some afd is a is an unconstitutional and it's a, it's a danger for germany and so on. but the people are no longer believing that . and now the believing that. and now the farmers show that we are the protests are on the same line as our protest tests. we did in the last, uh, 5 or 10 years since since beginning and now now the farmers are , which are very farmers are, which are very

reliable and very, um , um, reliable and very, um, um, pleasurable for, for all the population in germany. the farmers are the heart, you know, of our country. when the farmers don't exist and don't produce food, we get hungry and therefore we need them. and everybody knows it. only the government doesn't know it. wow. they didn't . they are stupid to they didn't. they are stupid to do this. um, this cuts in, uh, for the farmers. >> i can't even, i can't even in winter. >> the farmers have time and they can go to the street and therefore it's so stupid to do it in winter, but i can't even imagine. >> i can't even imagine the beginning of the asparagus season in germany without the farmers and their their produce. i know what a huge cultural thing it is, joachim, because thank you very much indeed for joining us. and all right, folks, i gave you very much there. the afd view of what's going on. uh, but i'll tell you what. something extraordinary is happening in germany now. it is

of course, the senior service . of course, the senior service. it is the royal navy without which we would not have been a great nation. we would not have been the dominant global power that we were. and in line with that, we are sending another naval vessel, hms rich, and down to the gulf , down to where all to the gulf, down to where all the problems are at the moment. and yet stories coming out over the weekend and that we might have to mothball some of our vessels that perhaps even the future of the royal marines in their active role could be threatened , because we simply threatened, because we simply can't recruit enough people to join the royal navy . what an join the royal navy. what an earth is , is going on? who earth is, is going on? who better to ask ? the rear admiral better to ask? the rear admiral chris parry , former royal navy chris parry, former royal navy commander chris, help me. how are on the one hand, can we be committing the royal navy to more active service , whilst on more active service, whilst on the other we might be

mothballing vessels because we're short of manpower. what's going on? no actually it's simply down to the fact that when you have electoral politics, as they look to the next election , they don't look next election, they don't look far enough ahead and say , look, far enough ahead and say, look, we've got a crisis coming down the track against totalitarian powers like russia, china , iran powers like russia, china, iran and north korea and we're going to need a good navy to help the americans secure the international seaways. >> and i've always said, you and ihave >> and i've always said, you and i have discussed this before, nigel. you know, the sea is the physical equivalent of the world wide web. and if you don't have access to that, you can't guarantee free navigation throughout, that you ain't into globalisation. your prosperity , globalisation. your prosperity, your trade suffers. the prices of fuel at the pumps. go up. and i'm afraid to say that the conditions of service for the members of the royal navy have deteriorated over the last 20 years. it's not just this government. every single government. every single government has really treated life at sea as if it's just

another job life at sea as if it's just anotherjob and they don't make another job and they don't make any compensation for the fact. but i can tell you now, a qualified able seaman leading seaman, uh, basically is getting the same as somebody who's flipping burgers at mcdonald's and yet is expected to represent his country at international level to high standards in a really tough environment. you know, they're doing a great job. they're out at sea , and we treat they're out at sea, and we treat it just like another job. i was it just like anotherjob. i was challenged by the ceo, ceo of a leading store recently about it just being a job. like any other. and i said, well, you know , your employees aren't paid know, your employees aren't paid , are they? to defend the knickers counter and possibly get maimed and killed at the same time? it's not just another job. and i'm afraid politicians all of them. and i'm afraid civic society simply thinks it's just another job. it isn't as you say it. it's a leading sort of defence of our country. it's a civic duty . a civic duty. >> chris. um very powerful

words, very powerful words. and i fully understand what you're saying, and we really need a change of attitude of culture from our politicians . chris, from our politicians. chris, i want you to stay with me for this next little item. it was announced on friday. the death of the last sas original, mike sadler, who rose in the end to become major, was part of the long range desert group . and long range desert group. and they were the guys with the jeeps that at night would take the sas in to conduct the raids and then the next day try and get them out again. you can't think of a more dangerous job to do. and mike sadler was legendary for his skills of navigation across the desert. he was there at the first ever successful sas raid. he was there at the side of david stirling , the founder of the sas stirling, the founder of the sas , and he was something of a legend within in the regiment. and he's died aged 103. he's the last of the sas originals. and this year we're going to have a big event on the 6th of june. it'll be the 80th anniversary of

the normandy d—day landings. and, uh, it's kind of like we're beginning to lose the last of that generation in a different service to yours. chris parry. but he just thought i'd ask you for a comment on the passing of the last sas original. >> yeah. i mean , he's typical of >> yeah. i mean, he's typical of the sort of chap who hasn't done it for the pay. he's done it for, obviously his country, he's doneit for, obviously his country, he's done it for the sort of things that we really want people to do things like this again. now we've got to rediscover in generation z, duty, sacrifice , generation z, duty, sacrifice, um, doing something other than for the money. we're not in a transactional society. when we go to war, we have to make personal sacrifices, and we have to do what this guy has done . i to do what this guy has done. i mean, what's really interesting, nigel, is when you're in the desert, it's like being at sea. the navigation is incredibly difficult, and i think he must have had some sixth sense as well of being able to use the stars and everything else . i stars and everything else. i mean, we've really got to take

inspiration from these people and say, look, we may need these skills and these people again , skills and these people again, uh, as i said, in the face of a real challenge from fascists and communist regimes, we're looking at the 1930s again and the possibility of actually being in conflict with these totalitaire regimes. so he would have understood exactly what we're talking about . understood exactly what we're talking about. but we understood exactly what we're talking about . but we need to talking about. but we need to start reviving that attitude for today. >> we do. we've got to find some more. mike sadler's no question about chris parry, thank you very much indeed. now, in the past, i fought the banks and i fought their diversity and inclusion agenda. it's one of the reasons, of course , that the reasons, of course, that they wanted to debunk me and others wouldn't touch me. well, in a moment i'm going to talk to a banker, a man who was in senior position, who was sacked dunng senior position, who was sacked during diversity training during a diversity training exercise. just wait till you hear this story on patrick christys tonight. >> 9:00 to 11 pm. should the lib dem leader, ed davey resign after evidence emerges that he

dismissed victims of the post office scandal ? plus, is the office scandal? plus, is the serious issue of mental illness being exploited by some to game the welfare system? we'll also get the royal dispatch from lady colin campbell after harry and meghan were humbled at the golden globes and there's the most exciting paper review on telly patrick christys tonight, 9 to 11 pm. be there

>>i >> i think we all understand in the modern world that we shouldn't go out of our way to unnecessarily cause offence to anybody, but we should also be able to speak freely , and one of able to speak freely, and one of the places where you should, i would have thought, be able to speak freely is if you're undergoing diversity training or more specifically, race training , and having a free ranging discussion of what is and what

is not acceptable and how you might deal with it. well carl borg, neil was a former design authority manager at lloyds bank and he'd been there a number of years , and he was a senior years, and he was a senior manager , and he had to manager, and he had to participate in an online training special session entitled race education for line managers. but it all went horribly , horribly wrong . and horribly, horribly wrong. and carl borg, neil joins me . carl borg, neil joins me. >> thank you nigel. now i don't know whether you needed to be educated. >> and you know what you can and can't say , but, um, perhaps you can't say, but, um, perhaps you did. i don't know, or or maybe this was completely over the top . um, but i guess you went into it thinking i'll participate . it thinking i'll participate. and it all, it seemed to go wrong when and this is the account that i've got . and you account that i've got. and you are dyslexic , nick. and you are dyslexic, nick. and you accept that that can sometimes cause you to be clumsy . but i

cause you to be clumsy. but i don't think you were in this case. yes. when it comes to rap music, you asked a question as a line manager, how would you handle a situation where somebody from an ethnic minority used a word that might be considered offensive if used by a white person? and this was is the end? we're not we're not going to use it, but it's the n word . and the point you were word. and the point you were making, i think , is that in rap making, i think, is that in rap music, this word is quite commonly used. it's used by some as a self descriptor. so you were asking this as a question . were asking this as a question. >> yeah. so it's a very simple question john. um, as you pointed out. um, but i asked the question, um , without using the question, um, without using the n word . okay. the trainer didn't n word. okay. the trainer didn't seem to understand my question . seem to understand my question. um, and one of the things i've done with in terms of my dyslexia is that i've, um, developed some techniques to try and sort of mask it and help out those techniques vary from , um,

those techniques vary from, um, rephrasing the question or giving an example. well, in this case, um, the obvious thing was to give an example , um, and the to give an example, um, and the dyslexic, my brain . um, um, i'm dyslexic, my brain. um, um, i'm told by people that have tested me on very intelligent. um, uh, i don't really know how intelligent i really am , but intelligent i really am, but apparently the intelligent part of my brain. yeah. um wanted would want to get the example out and would have forced it through my processor, which is slow. this is a problem with dyslexic people. they're often very intelligent, but they have a in terms of a slow process in terms of communication and writing. um, it it out and out came it forced it out and out came the full end word. as an example. um, and that was which, after the trainer claimed after which the trainer claimed she was not only offended by your use of the word, but she was too sick to work and took five days off. >> yeah, i found this out much later on. >> um, that the trainer , um, had >> um, that the trainer, um, had apparently had to take five days off work . um, i did on several

off work. um, i did on several occasions ask for sort of details of, of a sickness and what support she got, but i never got anything back. um and i just had to accept it. i never got anything back. um and ijust had to accept it. i did i just had to accept it. i did offer to give her a face to face apology or a full written apology or a full written apology . um, apology or a full written apology. um, and i did actually apologise in the in the session , apologise in the in the session, um, for having upset her. um, but that was that was never done, you know, that was it. >> that was the end. you fought a lengthy legal action in. you've secured a bit of a victory. but i just wonder about all of this. well, i'm joined down the by alison malak, down the line by alison malak, director equality and director of equality and diversity uk, and alison, you've heard that case and i you know, ihave heard that case and i you know, i have no reason to think that carl isn't telling us the 100% truth. and that's perhaps backed up truth. and that's perhaps backed ”p by, by truth. and that's perhaps backed up by, by the award that the court has given him. where are we going wrong with all of this ? we going wrong with all of this? >> i think it's really down to the trainer . and when we do our

the trainer. and when we do our training sessions at the equality diversity uk , we have a equality diversity uk, we have a safe space contract and a safe space contract. talks about , um, space contract. talks about, um, listening to learn to understand, to empathise and not to minimise people's experiences . but we also give um include give nudges. so we say that there may be some language that is um unofficially out there. that's okay. but in a professional environment it's not. and we may use some of those terms ourselves , um, in those terms ourselves, um, in a way that people can understand what they are and what they shouldn't be saying . um, and shouldn't be saying. um, and therefore we say , you know, if therefore we say, you know, if somebody does upset at, um, someone or traumatised them by using inappropriate language, the way that we have to manage it is to say, when you said that, it made me feel this way and to have that dialogue and that that's part of the safe space. do you think someone like carl, you know, as an experienced bank manager, did he really to do race education

really need to do race education in i think that, um, we all do. i think that if you don't mix in those communities and you don't know those those groups, um, it's important to know about cultural diversity , the sorts of cultural diversity, the sorts of things that people , um, wouldn't things that people, um, wouldn't know necessarily . so, yes, even know necessarily. so, yes, even myself, i've, i've learnt a lot minded a lot in the year. the lockdown in terms of race because my background isn't how i look. so it's really important that we think through, um, what is appropriate , what's not is appropriate, what's not appropriate. and also over years things change. so language that was okay many, many decades ago are not is not okay now . are not is not okay now. >> no, i get that i get that things have always changed. i just i just wonder with this whole race debate, alison, whether what we might do is just treat everybody as equal regardless skin colour, regardless of skin colour, regardless of skin colour, regardless of skin colour, regardless of culture, be regardless of culture, and be fair my fair to everybody. that's my thought as we great, nigel, if that's what happened . that's what happened. >> the end of the day, we >> but at the end of the day, we have thing called imprint.

have this thing called imprint. and in a household and if we grow up in a household thatis and if we grow up in a household that is racist, sexist, homophobic, those things , homophobic, all of those things, that's what we take with us into the and we may use that's what we take with us into the workplace. and we may use language um and give language at home. um and give you classic example . there was you a classic example. there was a woman on the train the other day using really day who was using really offensive her child, offensive language to her child, and f—word . and you and it was the f—word. and you couldn't believe that child couldn't believe that this child was 3 and she was using was 2 or 3 and she was using this language, and i was one of the people had been the only people that had been given the choice child sweets and talking to her. i said and talking to her. and i said to why are you using that to her, why are you using that language? said, i grew to her, why are you using that lanwith e? said, i grew to her, why are you using that lanwith that. said, i grew to her, why are you using that lanwith that. well, said, i grew to her, why are you using that lanwith that. well, and , i grew to her, why are you using that lanwith that. well, and ii grew to her, why are you using that lanwith that. well, and i havev up with that. well, and i have to when . to say, when. >> well done you. if i was on that train, i'd have wanted you to that. so alison, thank you to do that. so alison, thank you for joining me quick thought on what alison had say . what alison had to say. >> to be honest, i >> um, carl, to be honest, i think agree quite a lot think i agree with quite a lot of i think. of it. i think. >> so she put it down to the trainer. >> i think, um, definitely a lot of people have said the trainer overreacted and in fact, there were comments by members of were some comments by members of staff anonymously . excuse staff made anonymously. excuse me. through the, um, the me. um, through the, um, the staff feedback that she did act

inappropriately . and i think inappropriately. and i think some of that is in the thing, you know what, five, five days off sick because of what you and you weren't it in a you weren't using it in a literal sense as an example . literal sense as an example. >> thank you for coming on >> carl, thank you for coming on and sharing your story with us. jacob rees—mogg is still a conservative member of parliament. there aren't many left. to be leaving an left. they seem to be leaving an incredibly rapid rate. happy new yean incredibly rapid rate. happy new year, happy new year. >> very good to see you. yes. we're hoping one day you'll come. member parliament. >> it's going so small . so >> it's going to be so small. so it's been a busy day. it's been a busy day. >> lots of statements in parliament. very important. one on the post office scandal, which i'm going to be talking about. this where the big about. this is where the big state at. its absolute worst. state is at. its absolute worst. not mistake in the first not the mistake in the first place though. that was heinous . place though. that was heinous. yes. but then in covering it up and refusing put it right. and refusing to put it right. and hope some and let's hope at last some efforts can be made to put it right though how you that, right though how you do that, when people gone to prison when people have gone to prison and they're standing in the community has destroyed and community has been destroyed and they've or died, they've been bankrupt or died, some taken

they've been bankrupt or died, someown taken they've been bankrupt or died, someown lives. taken they've been bankrupt or died, someown lives. so taken they've been bankrupt or died, someown lives. so it's taken they've been bankrupt or died, someown lives. so it's suchtaken their own lives. so it's such a wicked scandal. yeah. no, it really is. >> and a vote later on on oil and on oil and gas, where and gas, on oil and gas, where i shall be loyally supporting the government. >> i think they're absolutely right of course we should use our own resources. i'll be our own resources. and i'll be talking that as well. for talking about that as well. for once, was your position, once, if i was in your position, i would support the government, this one as well. >> makes a lovely change. >> it makes a lovely change. >> it makes a lovely change. >> you're coming back to the tories. >> you're coming back to the torino. might come to me. >> no. they might come to me. right. i'm back you live right. i'm back with you live tomorrow 7:00. but now let's tomorrow at 7:00. but now let's have a look at the cold weather. >> like things are heating >> looks like things are heating up. boiler dollars. up. boxt boiler dollars. sponsors on gb news sponsors of weather on gb news evening . evening. >> i'm alex deakin. this is your latest weather update from the met office for gb news. temperatures tumbling once more out there tonight could be a bit icy as well. have a few icy as well. we have seen a few snow flurries across parts of the south. high pressure is in control, keeping things pretty dry for most of this week, but with breeze we have with the easterly breeze we have seen a few showers across the south. as i said, some sleet and snow mixed in. no huge amounts,

but nevertheless you could see a covering in places and wherever we've showers could icy. we've got showers could be icy. so a met office ice so we do have a met office ice warning in place across the south. those slippery conditions into the early hours further north, stubborn fog patches north, some stubborn fog patches across scotland across northern scotland and many or below many places dipping two or below freezing parts of the east may just stay above freezing, where we keep a bit more cloud and some will start a bit grey. on tuesday. quite cloudy over north—east southeast north—east england, southeast scotland showers over scotland. any early showers over the southwest that should scoot away. and many it's a bright away. and for many it's a bright day tomorrow. fine day tomorrow. bright fine winter's feeling winter's day feeling chilly. temperatures starting off around freezing and only getting up to 3 or 4 degrees. feeling colder with wind across the south, with the wind across the south, particularly if you're stuck under across under that cloud across northeastern england . a northeastern parts of england. a bit cloud coming into bit more cloud coming into northeastern wednesday, northeastern areas by wednesday, and more showers likely, and a few more showers likely, although expected to be although these expected to be chiefly of rain. maybe some sleet snow on hills . a sunny sleet and snow on hills. a sunny day, generally across the south and coasts. again and many western coasts. again fine and sunny through wednesday. thanks to that area of high pressure temperatures just a touch, but just creeping up a touch, but

still average. and of still below average. and of course it feel colder once course it will feel colder once more in the wind. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on .

gb news. >> hello! good evening, it's me, jacob rees—mogg on state of the nafion jacob rees—mogg on state of the nation tonight. rishi sunak promises to make things right after calls for justice for the 700 subpostmasters and mistresses grow 50 new potential victims have contacted lawyers since the itv drama mr. bates versus the post office fired the scandal back into the public eye.the scandal back into the public eye. the prime minister, rishi sunak, promises that he will do everything in his power to put things right. changes to the licensing regime for oil and gas exploration contracts could be upon us, as parliament decides if licences for projects in the nonh if licences for projects in the north sea should be awarded

annually ,