gb news way. >> good afternoon britain . it's >> good afternoon britain. it's 12:00 on friday the 2nd of february. >> brianna ghey killers named scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe , both aged 16, have ratcliffe, both aged 16, have been exposed as the twisted teenagers responsible for the sordid murder of brianna ghey . sordid murder of brianna ghey. we await the judge's sentence . s we await the judge's sentence. s >> manhunt continues as abdul ezedithe >> manhunt continues as abdul ezedi the refuge and convicted sex offender suspected of throwing chemicals over a mother and her two daughters, was granted asylum on his third attempt after converting to christianity. also, he said , christianity. also, he said, should convicted criminals ever

be given sanctuary in this country .7 country? >> no returns deal with turkey. rishi sunaks bid to stop the boats has suffered yet another blow after home office officials declared turkey was not a safe country amid human rights concerns . this despite turkey concerns. this despite turkey being a member of the echr and nato ally and an eu candidate country. >> and throughout all our leading stories today, it seems that there is one big theme law and order. have we got this sense of a breakdown in trust in society? and frankly , a growth society? and frankly, a growth in lawlessness ? in lawlessness? >> this manhunt for abdul azadi certainly has huge questions to answer , not least whether this answer, not least whether this is a symptom of a broken asylum system . why was this man who had

system. why was this man who had his asylum claim failed twice and then convicted of sexual assault and another offence, then granted asylum because he converted to christianity? doesn't seem right. >> turns out all you . need is >> turns out all you. need is a letter from your local vicar and you're in no questions asked, but also, it ties with this but also, it ties in with this sense that there was a particularly of these particularly one of these killers brianna ghey who was killers of brianna ghey who was found. we here in the in the courts discourse to have attempted to poison a fellow pupil at her school who was then expelled from that school and put in a unit with vulnerable people , including brianna ghey , people, including brianna ghey, who was there for her social anxiety . this is where the two anxiety. this is where the two individuals met. why why? >> where she became fixated on her? >> absolutely. why on earth was this dangerous? dangerous killer? this person who had tried to poison one of her

fellow pupils where she was previously, then placed with vulnerable individuals ? it vulnerable individuals? it boggles the mind. and to me it smacks of similar failings that we're seeing in the asylum system . we're seeing them in the system. we're seeing them in the education system, we're seeing them in law and order. >> i wonder what the judge will say in his sentencing remarks. what will that sentence for be those two teenage killers? they are 16 years old, are of course, 16 years old, which brings complexities. let us know what you think on all of that. gb views at gb news. com but let's get your headlines. >> emily, thank you and good afternoon. your top stories from the newsroom. the two teenagers who murdered brianna ghey have now been named as scarlett jenkinson eddie ratcliffe . jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe. the ban on the 16 year olds being identified as being lifted ahead sentencing , which ahead of their sentencing, which will to you live here on will bring to you live here on gb news. we've also heard scarlett jenkinson has admitted for the first time she did stab

brianna herself. prosecutors told manchester crown court she snatched the knife from eddie's hand and stabbed brianna repeatedly in victim statements read to the court. brianna's family have described both killers as two predators stalking their prey and called them pure evil . the home office them pure evil. the home office is facing growing pressure to carry out an urgent review into how a refugee, the main suspect in this week's chemical attack, was allowed to stay in the uk . was allowed to stay in the uk. abdul ezedi, a convict sex offender still on the run and was last seen in north london on wednesday evening. the sighting came after his attack on a 31 year old woman, believed to be known to yazidi, who was with her two young daughters. the crown prosecution service have confirmed this morning that yazidi previously pleaded guilty to one charge of sexual assault and one of indecent exposure . and one of indecent exposure. the former scotland yard detective, peter bleksley, told us earlier he should have never been allowed to stay in the country to carry out the crime .

country to carry out the crime. >> going to sugarcoat >> i'm not going to sugarcoat this at all. if anybody was , this at all. if anybody was, it's to appreciate the horrors that we have imported into this country , courtesy of governments country, courtesy of governments . courtesy of the home office. courtesy of failings of the border force. just how much criminal vermin we have imported into this country. criminal vermin we have imported into this country . then go criminal vermin we have imported into this country. then go on to the internet and simply search asylum seeker convicted. there are a litany of cases of people committing the most serious crimes as a potential deal to send migrants back to turkey, aimed at stopping small boat crossings seems unlikely to get the go ahead home office officials say. >> turkey isn't generally safe due to human rights concerns . due to human rights concerns. the setback follows the success of a similar deal with albania, praised by rishi sunak. the proportion of turkish nationals arriving by small boat surged from 2% in 2022 to over 10% last yeah from 2% in 2022 to over 10% last year. it comes as more than 1000

migrants have arrived in the uk, so far this year. after crossing the channel . now there are fresh the channel. now there are fresh warnings of potential human rights breaches on the bibby stockholm barge as asylum seekers face claustrophobic conditions . as the home affairs conditions. as the home affairs select committee says, cramped living conditions are contributing to a decline in mental health for some residents. it follows confirmation from the home office that the cost of housing asylum claimants on the barge is £120 per person per night. the committee's chair, dame diana johnson , also says there's very johnson, also says there's very limited access to religious services for muslim residents . services for muslim residents. the government's offering job seekers a £1,000 sign on bonus to join the childcare sector . to join the childcare sector. it's part of a £65 million recruitment scheme and comes just two months before the first phase of a flagship child care expansion. it follows the chancellor's announcement in march last year. eligible families of children as young as nine months will be able to

claim 30 hours of free childcare per week. children and families minister david johnson told us the government is giving working families the support they need when children are between 0 and 5 years old. >> a huge proportion of their brain development happens up to 80% of their brain development, and that has a big role on what happens to them as children. young people and then as adults. and so the biggest reason for people to look at this sector is the huge difference they can make to children at the earliest stage, we've already seen over 102,000 claim this new 102,000 parents claim this new offer, which is really strong demand, and it shows us that this is something that that people out there really want. and that's going to make a huge difference to their family finances . finances. >> travellers are facing more disruption today as rail services come to a standstill across some parts of the country . workers at greater anglia see2 and lner are walking out for 24 hours in their ongoing dispute over pay. strikes at other

companies will also be held tomorrow and on monday, union members at all english train operators involved in the dispute are also banning overtime until early next week, leading to further train cancellations . sir elton john, cancellations. sir elton john, former prime minister sir tony blair and tv presenter fiona phillips are among the guests attending the funeral of derek draper. good morning britain presenter kate garraway arrived earlier for her husband's service at the church in north london, where they married nearly two decades ago. draper, who battled long lasting covid 19 symptoms, died in january at the age of 56 after. some breaking news to bring you a philosophy student who ran over her fiance after she lost her temper has been sentenced to life imprisonment. 24 year old alice wood will serve a minimum tum of 18 years for the murder

of ryan watson. he was hit by the ford fiesta. alice was driving near their home in cheshire . in may 2022. for the cheshire. in may 2022. for the latest stories , sign up to gb latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen or go to gb news. com slash alerts. >> good afternoon britain . it's >> good afternoon britain. it's 12:09 and the teenage killers behind the murder of brianna ghey zahawi will soon be sentenced at manchester crown court this afternoon . court this afternoon. >> yes, 16 year old scarlett jenkinson and eddie radcliffe were named earlier today and had already been found guilty of murdering the transgender schoolgirl. the two teenagers were 15 when they lured brianna to her death and stabbed her 28 times in her victim impact statement, brianna's mother, esther , told the court she had esther, told the court she had failed her daughter. >> she felt she'd failed her

daughter by letting her meet up with scarlett . with scarlett. >> well, joining us now is criminal barrister gerry hayes. gerry, this is a particularly vicious, savage, brutal case of murder made distinctive by the fact that these two teenagers are teenagers . she's 16 years are teenagers. she's 16 years old. does this make it more complicated for the judge in terms out, in terms of dishing out punishment ? out punishment? >> well, no, not really. there are children . they are children are children. they are children and have to be treated as such, although they're 16. but you're not an adult until you're eight. so they will have to take into account one that they're children . secondly, they'll have children. secondly, they'll have to take into account their degree of maturity . they won't degree of maturity. they won't give be given a full murderous sentence, which means life, meaning life. i think it's highly unlikely. it's possible, but highly unlikely. but the minimum they can be given as children are 12 years before they're considered for parole. but this was planned. these

people, and i'm only talking about what i've read in the press. i mean, i wasn't there, um, at the trial , um, these um, at the trial, um, these people wanted to kill people. they had a thirst for killing people. they had a list of 4 or 5 people who they intended to kill. and this woman, this woman was, was, was lured to her death. and one of the barristers said this was the personification of evil. and they are right now normally most children, even 16 year olds, are given protection because, you know, there is an opportunity or atonement. however, in this case, the judge absolutely was right to use her discretion and said, no, this is so heinous , so said, no, this is so heinous, so wicked, so evil that these two people should be named . people should be named. >> and that is a particular point of unusualness. i suppose in this case, the naming of these 216 year olds, 15 year olds, when they committed their heinous crimes , would that heinous crimes, would that

indicate that perhaps the judge thinks there is a level of maturity , there is a level of maturity, there is a level of planning and potentially there is a level of more serious sentencing than were these perhaps more juvenile individuals . individuals. >> i think you're absolutely right . again, i haven't seen the right. again, i haven't seen the papers and the criminal papers. none of us have. but i think you've hit the nail on the head. the judge will look at all of this and just say, hang on, these these people had a thirst for killing. there were four people there intending to kill. if it wasn't her, it would have been someone else. it could have been someone else. it could have been stab wounds . been been more 28 stab wounds. these really, really what we would say in the business is aggravating. so i would expect, i don't know , a sentence of i don't know, a sentence of probably about 20 years. that's before they're considered for parole . if it was an adult, it parole. if it was an adult, it would probably be something like 27, 28 years . 27, 28 years. >> is 20 years the maximum then? >> is 20 years the maximum then? >> no no no no no. there is um,

the maximum is life. meaning life that you throw away the key. it's very, very rare. very, very rare that these sentences are actually given . i think the are actually given. i think the police killer was, was, was, was given one of those. it's unlikely to be given to a child, but anyone who says it's a let off, it won't be. this is an experience high court judge experienced in experience in sentencing and she will look at all fact . but it's going to be a all fact. but it's going to be a very hefty sentence before they're even considered for release. and yet, gerry, people will be looking at their ages now, be looking at potentially a 12 year minimum, a 20 year sentence. >> as you're suggesting. there may well be handed down 20 years sentence for these individuals mean they're 36 when they're let out into society, 36 years old is still a young individual. people not even reaching middle age at 36 years old. these two

people could be released back into society. and goodness me , into society. and goodness me, they seem intelligent. they seem calculated. it's reasonable to suspect that they could get away with good behaviour in prison and get out and kill again , so and get out and kill again, so it's possible . it's possible. >> but don't forget, just say and i don't know the sentence the judge is going to give, but just say it's 20 years. just say it's 25 years. one of those sentences, whatever it is, that is not when they're released , is not when they're released, but that is when they're considered for parole. and the parole board decides whether they are a danger to society . they are a danger to society. that's the key. that's the key. if they're 20 years, if they're given 20 years, it doesn't mean to say they're going to be released in 20 years. i think they're going to be in prison for very, very, very, very for a very, very, very, very long time. i hope so , because long time. i hope so, because they deserve it . they deserve it. >> well, thank you very much indeed, gerry hayes, criminal barrister. of course. appreciate your now joined by the >> well, we're now joined by the conservative mp for east worthing and shoreham, tim

loughton, also a member of the home select committee . home affairs select committee. and tim, just to start. home affairs select committee. and tim, just to start . with you and tim, just to start. with you on this issue, we're expecting that sentencing in the next few minutes . of course, we will minutes. of course, we will interrupt if we do get that news, but your thoughts on this act of total barbarism , act of total barbarism, something the likes of which we have not seen for decades in this country. >> well, it's a particularly brutal. >> well, it's a particularly brutal . um, >> well, it's a particularly brutal. um, murder. and i think what gerry hayes said and all the other commentators, is that it's the worst attack that many people have seen in a long, long time . it was premeditated. it time. it was premeditated. it was sadistic , completely, um, was sadistic, completely, um, excessive . these are two deeply excessive. these are two deeply troubled and deeply dangerous individuals . and i completely individuals. and i completely concur with gerry hayes that they need to be locked up away from the public for a very , very from the public for a very, very long time, whether that's a 20 year minimum before they're considered . and i'm not a considered. and i'm not a

lawyer, but it needs to be of that sort of order. >> and it's shocking to read the details of this case. one of the killers, one of the teenage killers, one of the teenage killers, scarlett, was expelled for trying to poison , uh, one of for trying to poison, uh, one of her fellow pupils at the school. and then was put in some kind of vulnerable unit for children with vulnerabilities. and that's where she became fixated on brianna ghey and then went on to kill her so brutally something was going wrong with that education system . education system. >> well, she she was not just the vulnerable one. it was the people around her who became vulnerable because she was she was dangerous. so i don't know the full details about her history and what examination , history and what examination, uh, or support services she was subject to. but it's not just the fixation with brenner drive , the fixation with brenner drive, which was absolutely tragic and endedin which was absolutely tragic and ended in this terrible, terrible way. it seems she had a list of other people who were on her target list, uh, as as well.

she's deeply , deeply dangerous . she's deeply, deeply dangerous. and that's why she needs to be locked away for a long, long time. >> and so the wider criminal justice aspect of this, to get to to, your specialisms, i suppose , sitting on the home suppose, sitting on the home affairs select committee , affairs select committee, there's a sense that there is this level of impunity that these two individuals felt . they these two individuals felt. they felt that the police were incompetent , they felt that. and incompetent, they felt that. and you could see the arrogance in their text messages to one another saying, we won't get caught. we won't get caught meticulously planning, writing down to in a level of degree of detail that we have not seen for any murder that i can remember in the history of this country. their game plan. they were arab , their game plan. they were arab, that they thought the police wouldn't catch them. what does that say about confidence in the police more widely ? well, police more widely? well, i don't think that's you can draw lessons from confidence in the police. >> i mean, these two individuals are exceptional, delusional and

dangerous . i are exceptional, delusional and dangerous. i need to think that having committed such a shocking, uh, murder in full view , that they could somehow view, that they could somehow get away with it and then work through their. their list is deeply delusional. we have, uh, fortunately deeply delusional. we have, uh, for tunately few deeply delusional. we have, uh, fortunately few murders in this, uh, in this country and in the vast majority of cases is, uh, the culprits are caught and prosecuted and locked away for a long, long time. so they're just completely deluding themselves if they thought they could get away with it. but they were obviously deeply and are deeply troubled . and there troubled individual. and there are question marks to whether are question marks as to whether there should have been interventions earlier on to take them circulation. if they them out of circulation. if they were considered possible were considered a possible danger as it's danger to other people, as it's now proved to be that they were. >> and we'll be bringing the judge's sentencing remarks to you and everyone at home when we hear but want to move on hear them. but i want to move on to the case of abdul azadi, the man who is on the run currently after that hideous corrosive

attack he suspected of committing that vile aukus crime. now we find out more details about him. he was refused. refused asylum twice. went on to commit a sexual assault. converted to christianity and was accepted for asylum on a third try. should this man have ever been in this country? >> no . >> no. >> no. >> and this is i mean, it's pretty gruesome news all around today. again, this is a this is horrific, um, attack . and we horrific, um, attack. and we need to know far more details about it, but this is somebody who came from afghanistan and he arrived here illegally in the back of a lorry before the taliban, uh, took back control of , uh, of taliban, uh, took back control of, uh, of afghanistan. so it was certainly not the dangerous place that it's deemed to be. um, now . so he shouldn't have um, now. so he shouldn't have remained in the uk after his first asylum claim was rejected. on what grounds? he applied for asylum. i don't know, but it was

rejected . so why then, was he rejected. so why then, was he allowed to stay on for a second asylum claim? and this is part of the problem with the system, which is what the government has been trying to clamp down on, that these almost limitless appeals that go on and then appeals that that go on and then appeals that that go on and then a third time and all of a sudden he's accepted because all of a sudden he's become a christian. well, i don't think many people would find that story very credible , but it's not the first credible, but it's not the first time has this has happened time this has this has happened and there have been cases going back several years now, which again, the home office have got wise trying to clamp wise to and are trying to clamp down where particularly down on where particularly people coming places like people coming from places like iran then claiming, oh, i'm iran were then claiming, oh, i'm a therefore, if i was a christian. therefore, if i was sent country, then my sent back to my country, then my life will be in danger. and there's cases of people having crucifixes and other religious symbols tattooed on them to try and show that they've now become and show that they've now become a christian. and therefore their lives are in in danger. it's a nonsense. it's taking advantage of the of the system . and these of the of the system. and these sorts of people just should not be in the country at all.

>> it seems like there's fraud on a mass scale going on here. there are stories upon stories of people pretending to be something they're not in order to gain entry into the system. but isn't that all a little bit irrelevant , whether he was irrelevant, whether he was a christian or not? the fact is, he was a convicted sex offender . he was a convicted sex offender. how on earth does our system allow any convicted sex offender to get through? >> well, there's a whole load of reasons for why this chap should not have been allowed to stay in the in the country . renee. um, the in the country. renee. um, and the fact that he had a criminal record of sex offences as well alone should have been grounds for him being deported from the country. now, the problem is that we do have, uh , problem is that we do have, uh, problems trying to deport people from certain countries where it's very difficult to get them back to those countries. iran is a case. eritrea and afghan is a case. afghanistan is certainly a

case. afghanistan is certainly a case. now, the taliban are in control now. that is why they the rwanda scheme , controversial the rwanda scheme, controversial though it is, is such an important part of the jigsaw to try and prevent those people getting into the country in the first place because it's so difficult to get them out of the country, even when they to country, even when they found to have credible asylum case. so have no credible asylum case. so we shouldn't . tim. tim shouldn't we shouldn't. tim. tim shouldn't have been here. he certainly shouldn't have been here when he had criminal. can had a criminal. uh, can conviction . and he certainly conviction. and he certainly shouldn't been given shouldn't have been given a third chance all of a sudden to say, well, a christian, say, well, i'm a christian, therefore i can't sent therefore i can't be sent back. it makes a nonsense of the system under the rwanda scheme, as currently constituted as it is currently constituted with going through with the bill going through parliament as it is currently going through parliament. >> would rwanda be compelled >> it would rwanda be compelled to take someone with a criminal record, or is this one of the many, many cases where rwanda could say, actually, that person looks a bit too dangerous for us? him? us? you keep him? >> well, that's up to the >> well, that's that's up to the negotiation what's in the negotiation of what's in the small of who we can small print of who we can actually send to , um, rwanda in actually send to, um, rwanda in

most cases, it's people who come to the uk usually using illegal people smugglers who just do not have a credible asylum case at all. these are the people who we need to deter from coming here. and those would be candidates to be sent to around if they still endeavoured to make that, to make that journey. but there are i mean, when many cases we can return convicted offenders to those countries and in many cases those people would then, if they are still serving a conviction, can serve those convictions in overseas jails. the problem is when you're deaung the problem is when you're dealing with countries, dysfunctional countries like afghanistan and others , it's afghanistan and others, it's really problematic as to whether physically you can actually return them to those, to those countries. but this person was clearly dangerous. um, he should have been monitored in, in some way. if there's no way of putting him in a, uh, in, in some secure institute station.

but i just don't understand hand how on a third attempt, third time lucky, he was granted leave to remain and his asylum case was upheld . apparently, some was upheld. apparently, some vicar vouching for him that he was a genuine christian. well, you know, how did that happen, tim? >> i want to be frank. are women and girls less safe in this country because of our broken asylum system? >> um, i don't want to generalise in that. not all people coming to this country, many of them who are legitimate asylum people , as seekers, we asylum people, as seekers, we cannot conflate them with all being , uh, cannot conflate them with all being, uh, criminals and villains like this chap. the vast majority are not. and the vast majority are not. and the vast majority are genuinely fleeing from persecution and danger , but a lot are not. and danger, but a lot are not. and within those there are some people who have very dodgy backgrounds and, uh . and dodgy backgrounds and, uh. and dodgy records as well . we were records as well. we were particularly concerned on the home affairs select committee about the very large number who

came across particularly a couple of years ago from albania. many of again albania. men many of whom again had no credible claim for fleeing albania and claiming asylum in the in the uk. but many of whom we know are involved in trafficking in drug gangs and others. that's not to write off. all of the albanian population. absolutely not. but disproportionately we have an awful lot of albanians in jail at the at the moment . at the at the moment. >> tim, i heard you were quizzing the home secretary and the home office officials the other day . um, and you were other day. um, and you were asking about the number of essentially migrants that the home office has lost contact with or disengaged with. i think were the words of the home secretary you suggested the number was as high as 33,000, if i remember correctly. this is very worrying for the general public. well it wasn't my figure. >> and actually the back in november we had the permanent secretary in front of us who i have to say, gave a rather

disastrous , um, interview with disastrous, um, interview with us where they had to admit at that stage that there were just over 17,000 people who had withdrawn their asylum applications or had their asylum applications or had their asylum applications withdrawn in the previous 12 months. and i asked them, so where are these people now? hopefully they've all been deported . and the answer then deported. and the answer then came back, well , we actually came back, well, we actually don't know . so since then, don't know. so since then, because of the pressure we've put on the on the home office, we've had some more detail about how many of those have actually been returned. and some of them are are reports to asylum service at the moment, but there's still a large chunk who we're not entirely sure where they are. and that's just not unacceptable. and then since then, we've had quite a lot of people coming across since the legal migration bill came in last july, which is absolutely to try and clamp down on the people who are still using people who are still using people smugglers. that's reduce that number, but it's still far too many who have therefore come too many who have therefore come to the uk illegally. they've

committed an offence and they have been put on bail pending how we deal with them and hopefully returning them out of the out of the country. what i'm concerned about is that quite a few of those do we really know where they all are? and we account for them. and that's what we were challenging. the permanent secretary to the home office and the home secretary about, i mean, the minister's take this incredibly seriously, about, i mean, the minister's take allis incredibly seriously, about, i mean, the minister's take all the credibly seriously, about, i mean, the minister's take all the time )ly seriously, about, i mean, the minister's take all the time we'veiously, about, i mean, the minister's take all the time we've got ly, but all the time we've got problems with returning people to their countries of origin. we don't have a rwanda type scheme which can actually take them out well. and tim, we find out that that turkey is not a goer ehhen >> we find out that this morning that turkey's no return deal more agreements like that. >> of course the had >> and of course the eu has had a very expensive agreement with with turkey , which we were with turkey, which we were originally part of, and that's prevented quite a few more people coming across the aegean. and into greece and into the eu , and into greece and into the eu, um, but it would be um, that way. but it would be helpful to have more returns, agreements with countries because it's worked with

albania. 13,000 albanians came across in small boats in 2022. last year. the figure was was barely . barely. >> finally, tim, a word from you on the home office. civil servants themselves, the home office officials who have themselves. this isn't about another country not agreeing with us. this is the british government deciding that turkey is not safe enough to have a return agreement with the eu, has a returns agreement with turkey. why can't we? >> well, that is a very good point. and this news has only just come out, uh, this morning. um is turkey an unsafe country ? um is turkey an unsafe country? well, i mean, turkey have got a few questionable issues around human rights and freedom of the press, but , human rights and freedom of the press, but, um, millions of brits go to turkey on on holiday. lots of people live in turkey from abroad . it's not turkey from abroad. it's not deemed to be an unsafe country by the eu because they've got this agreement. so again , i just this agreement. so again, i just don't buy this. and there are far too many reasons being put

in the way by the courts, who i think are extent and lawyers who are going beyond their, um, powers , who are more concerned powers, who are more concerned about individual that coming from abroad than they are about the safety and the well—being of people living in this country whose hospitality has been very generous to genuine asylum seekers over many, many years and long may it continue. well, tim, thank you so much for speaking with us. >> i'm afraid we do have to get to a break now, but thank you so much for your time, your expertise on these issues. really, really appreciate it. coming up stick with us. coming up next, stick with us. we'll bring you sentencing we'll bring you that sentencing of brianna guy's killers. of brianna ghey guy's killers.

entertained. the camilla tominey show sunday mornings from 930 on gb news. >> who's . good afternoon. >> who's. good afternoon. >> who's. good afternoon. >> your top stories from the gb newsroom. a student who ran over and killed her fiance after she lost her temper has been sentenced to life in prison. alice wood will serve a minimum tum of 18 years for the murder of ryan watson. the 24 year old was found guilty of killing ryan following a trial at chester crown court last month . he was crown court last month. he was hit by the ford fiesta that alice was driving near their home in cheshire, which she'd claimed was a tragic accident . claimed was a tragic accident. the two teenagers who murdered brianna ghey have been named as scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe, the ban on the 16 year olds being identified was lifted ahead of their sentencing

, which will bring you live here on gb news. we've also heard jenkinson has admitted she did stab rihanna herself. prosecutor told manchester crown court she snatched the knife from eddie's hand and stabbed brianna repeatedly in victim statements read in court. brianna's family have described both killers as two predators stalking their prey and called them pure evil . prey and called them pure evil. rishi sunak says foreign criminals should not be allowed to stay in the uk. following the manhunt for refugee and sex offender abdul yazidi, the home office is facing growing pressure to carry out an urgent review into how zeid, the main suspect in this week's chemical attack , was allowed to stay in attack, was allowed to stay in the uk . the crown prosecution the uk. the crown prosecution service confirmed . he service have confirmed. he previously pleaded guilty to one charge sexual assault charge of sexual assault in 2018, and one of indecent exposure , and there are fresh exposure, and there are fresh warnings of potential human rights breaches on the bibby stockholm barge as asylum seekers face what's being described as claustrophobic

conditions. the home affairs select committee says cramped living conditions are contributing to a decline in mental health for some residents . it follows confirmation from the home office that the cost of housing asylum claimants on the barge is £120 per person per night . for the latest stories, night. for the latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen, or go to gbnews.com. forward slash alerts . forward slash alerts. >> good afternoon britain. it's 12:35, will soon be bringing you the sentencing of the killers . the sentencing of the killers. brianna ghey of the killers of brianna ghey of the killers of brianna ghey of the killers of brianna ghey live here on gb news. >> yes . >> yes. >> yes. >> downing street said that rishi sunak's thoughts are with the family of brianna ghey . the the family of brianna ghey. the prime minister's official spokesperson said first and foremost, the prime minister's thoughts are with brianna's family , friends and ones . family, friends and loved ones. >> obviously the hurt that they

feel is unimaginable and the prime minister shares in the country's horror at this despicable and cowardly murder. so those are the words from the prime minister's spokesperson saying thoughts are with the families affected and impacted by this horrific, horrific murder. >> and of course, we're waiting for that sentencing as soon as it happens, we'll bring it to you. >> live here on good afternoon britain on gb news. >> and it's worth noting that from the court, scarlett jenkinson has admitted for the first time to stabbing brianna ghey. i'll be very interesting to the judge decides to see what the judge decides with this sentence. how harsh will it be? how long will it be? crucially >> but moving on, a deal to send illegal migrants back to turkey looks unlikely after home office officials declared that the nato member state is unsafe . yes. member state is unsafe. yes. >> so in a major blow to rishi sunak, stop the boats mission, civil servants said they have concerns about turkey's human rights record >> 3000 illegal migrants from turkey landed on british shores in 2023. well all joining us now

is katherine forster, our political correspondent , to political correspondent, to bnng political correspondent, to bring us the latest on this story . story. >> rory, we just spoke to tim loughton , who seemed as though loughton, who seemed as though he didn't agree . with turkey he didn't agree. with turkey being deemed an unsafe country. what do we know ? what do we know? >> yes, indeed. well this appears to have come not from another country involved , but another country involved, but from the home office itself. the officials there have declared that turkey is a, quote, a state that turkey is a, quote, a state that does not meet the criteria of being generally safe. now, this is yet another blow to rishi sunak's pledge to stop the boats. it's something that's very easy for the public to understand . three words stop the understand. three words stop the boats. he's running out of time before the next election , and before the next election, and they really had hoped to get a similar returns agreement going with turkey as they did very successfully last year with albania . now that worked

albania. now that worked brilliantly because there were large numbers of albanians crossing the channels, and as soon as that, um, returns agreement was put in place, the numbers dropped by 90. now the hope had been the similar would happen with turkey, but it sounds like it's not to be. now in terms of numbers as you said, 3000 people crossed the channel illegally from turkey last year. that's up 102, 162% from the year before . but the home office year before. but the home office are keen to stress that that is not all. all they had planned with turkey. they said there's various prongs to this. there was an agreement reached last year to share intelligence with turkey. they've got people from the national crime agency out there working on tackling the criminal gangs at source. um, most of the dinghies, the boats that are used for these illegal crossings are in fact

manufactured now in turkey. so they're working with the turks to try to crack down on those boats. so it's one strand they will say, but hugely damaging to rishi sunak's plans. it just feels like constant obstacles being thrown in his way. the battle, you know, in the house of lords, it's going to be heavily amended. the safety of rwanda bill, even when it gets through parliament in weeks and months, it's likely to be challenged in the courts. so rishi sunak saying he's going to stop the boats and do so by the next election. i mean, he's not promising that, is he? because i think we can safely say it's not going to happen, but, um, this all doesn't help. the conservatives poll rating and of course, part of the brexit vote was control of our borders is something which we manifest . we something which we manifest. we seem not to have . seem not to have. >> perhaps the bigger question is control of our own civil service of our own home office

officials, because ultimate . if officials, because ultimate. if turkey isn't deemed safe by the home office , turkey, an eu ally , home office, turkey, an eu ally, can't state a member of nato. a member of the echr. um, what on earth kind of country in the world wouldn't be deemed unsafe by our home office? frankly, is this a question of a lack of grip from this government on its own? officials as well? >> i think a lot of people will see it that way because turkey, of course, is part of europe. it's also part of asia. many of us go there on holiday , uh, us go there on holiday, uh, every year. i think most people would would be very surprised to hear that it's not considered a safe country. now, what the civil servants are saying is that , um, civil servants are saying is that, um, turkey civil servants are saying is that , um, turkey doesn't have that, um, turkey doesn't have a great track record in terms of complying with the european uh court convention on human rights that institution that we keep

heanng that institution that we keep hearing about that the house of lords to are very worried about us being in breach of international law. turkey they say, does not always do as it should by the echr. and so that is a grounds they feel for saying we shouldn't be sending people there. um so, so yes. also i think worth noting a lot of the people that are claiming asylum would say that they are political opponents to the regime. and so the government are now looking at some way around this. but yeah, more bad news for rishi sunak. well thank you very much indeed. >> katherine forster there. our political correspondent . but political correspondent. but joining us now is the barrister and writer stephen barrett . and writer stephen barrett. stephen, thank you very much for coming on the show. so what do you make of this home officials deciding home office officials , deciding home office officials, uh, deeming that turkey is not a safe enough country to have a returns deal with. >> well, when you when you

create an overly complicated legal system, you can find all sorts of excuses for not doing the thing that you didn't want to do in the first place. and really , we're going to have to really, we're going to have to start asking important questions about the home office and about what it's up to , because we've what it's up to, because we've had some odd statements about its own political views, how it believes that migrants should be able to come here freely, and it's almost adopting a policy position oppositional to the government and then finding an excuse because obviously large numbers of us go on holiday to turkey . if you want to say that turkey. if you want to say that a country is not safe because something bad happens, there , something bad happens, there, then you have to say that the united kingdom is not safe. mhm so there's been a rise in homophobic attacks in london. so let's and i'm bisexual. let's say that the uk is not safe for me. um it does seem to me that what we're doing is really abusing the legal system ,

abusing the legal system, abusing the legal system, abusing its technicality . in abusing its technicality. in order to get the policy outcome that civil servants want . that civil servants want. >> frankly, civil servants work for ministers. >> frankly, civil servants work for ministers . why on earth are for ministers. why on earth are ministers not able to get a grip on civil servants? or is it simply that the law for quote unquote has has a greater influence that civil servants are more likely to look to the words of, of people in your profession, stephen, than the ministers who are supposed to be in charge. >> well, they shouldn't that and the rule of law is not the rule of lawyers. okay we have democracy in this country . and democracy in this country. and you say, why is it ministers cannot get a grip? well i can answer that in two parts. firstly constitutionally, they can varne. but the second part is if they want to and they say there is a definite lack of political will to actually take control. and if they are being

defied control. and if they are being defied by civil servants, they have to say they have to tell the rest of us, we're all involved in this democracy. if something is going on at the heart of our government to clog up processes and policies that the want, then everybody the people want, then everybody needs to be told, and it doesn't. >> at the moment, the ministers sorry . and it doesn't help, of sorry. and it doesn't help, of course, that we have such a high turnover of home office ministers, does it? >> i mean, i'm sure it doesn't, but again, that is the government's choice. that is that it's the prime minister's choice. any prime minister's choice, whether they turn over ministers or don't turn over ministers, and perhaps those choices are not helping . but we choices are not helping. but we do have to admit or start facing up to the fact that we have real power in this country, because what's happening at the top, and we the we saw this with the metropolitan is that metropolitan police, is that people very top are being people at the very top are being performatively . and perform atively powerless. and it's not performatively powerless. and it's not constitutionally it's just not constitutionally accurate. they have masses of power if they want to , if they power if they want to, if they want to do it, ministers come . want to do it, ministers come. the home secretary can sack the

entire department. all the thousands of them today, and immediately recruit. we have masses of power that they could do. they could pass acts tomorrow to deal with this. you know, we saw with coronavirus that with that they admitted they had power there. there was no doubt in their ability to act. but but we seem to have returned again after after the pandemic this sort of eu pandemic to this sort of eu membership default of pretending that we don't govern ourselves, but we do govern ourselves. and the idea that turkey is not safe is obviously silly . is obviously silly. >> well, stephen barrett, never one to mince your words. thank you so much for your perspective this afternoon on good afternoon britain. really appreciate it. >> yes. coming something >> yes. coming up, something a bit different. we're asking if rugby is a form of child abuse. yes seriously. that's to come

>> the camilla tominey show sunday mornings from 930 on gb news . news. good afternoon britain. >> it's coming up to 10 to 1 and we're returning to our top story today. we're awaiting the sentencing of the killers of brianna ghey, the, uh, schoolgirl who was stabbed to death last year. >> there they are on the screen. the two teenagers we'll be finding out there sentence very, very soon indeed. we heard from a criminal barrister earlier who suggested it could be 20 years. he thought that was his guess of what we can expect . lots of you,

what we can expect. lots of you, of course, have been getting in touch, lester says. i think the parents of scarlett and eddie , parents of scarlett and eddie, those are the two teenage killers, should be named, and their upbringing should be put on public view. well, we do have some details about their upbringing honest, upbringing and to be honest, sounded quite , quite normal, sounded quite, quite normal, reasonably normal upbringing . so reasonably normal upbringing. so there you go. >> and it's worth remembering that both scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe are 16 now, but they were just 15 when they committed these heinous crimes , committed these heinous crimes, these crimes that they had planned , that they had written planned, that they had written down and indeed that they had discussed with one another for a long time before they did them. the amount of evidence that this trial has been able to hear on the meticulous planning, the kill list and the way in which it would be carried out has been astonishing thing. >> yes, sandra thinks , uh, some >> yes, sandra thinks, uh, some people are simply born evil . people are simply born evil. that's a that's a evergreen

debate , isn't it? can you be debate, isn't it? can you be born evil ? born evil? >> well, i think certainly some people can't be changed once they've carried out something quite so heinous. gavin has written in with an unusual and he says, controversial opinion release the killers and see how far they get until they're attacked. and hopefully sustain life threatening injuries. if not more. gavin wants mob justice. >> well, there you go. and robert says just as people are born with physical disabilities, why can't people be born with mental disabilities? like no conscious no empathy . so conscious sense, no empathy. so there you go. some of you think these two were just born to kill. >> and it does beg the question should they ever, ever be released ? released? >> hmm. released? >> but�*n. released? >> but reports have suggested that rugby could be classed as a form of child abuse. >> yes, some academics have claimed sporting organisations >> yes, some academics have claimeffectively] organisations >> yes, some academics have claimeffectively groomed|tions have effectively groomed children parents into children and parents into accepting brain injuries , accepting brain injuries, suggesting children playing from a young age in schools are more likely to risk brain trauma compared to those who take up

the sport later in life. yes, this all comes as the six nafions this all comes as the six nations kicks off today. nice to accompany that , isn't it? with accompany that, isn't it? with france taking on ireland? >> well, let's join now with professor john fairclough >> well, let's join now with professorjohn fairclough , the professor john fairclough, the professor of sport and exercise medicine at progressive rugby . medicine at progressive rugby. thank you so much for joining us, professor. i suppose the big question is rugby dangerous ? question is rugby dangerous? >> well, men , sports are >> well, men, sports are dangerous. i think the, um, the idea of a safe sport is, is one which is almost contradicts free if you're doing physical activity , you will get hurt. activity, you will get hurt. >> but when one of the oddest things is that the ones that you think are not particularly dangerous, like horse riding actually are, have more injuries. >> but i don't think we should underplay the fact that contact sports are problematic . sports are problematic. >> um, but i presented to the houses of parliament about concussion, and we do recognise that, um , impact sports do carry

that, um, impact sports do carry problems and it's the duty of all of us in rugby. i've been almost 50 years. um do have a responsibility of changing the rules so that the children are put at minimal risk at the age of contact. for example , must be of contact. for example, must be modified, but i think it's terribly unhelpful when we actually mix the injuries with, um, a research suggestion. this is an opinion piece which was performed not a piece of research . the important aspect research. the important aspect is parents should not be concerned and should not be bullied into thinking that they're doing wrong by letting their children play sport. we had enough control over children with locking them up in covid. you have to realise that sport is actually a benefit to children, not one that we should be at risk. we have to alter the rules, sure, but we must actually not feel that the

parents are guilty for letting their children play sport. >> just very briefly, what rule changes are there being suggested? just simply a later age of contact ? and if that's age of contact? and if that's the case, what's rough and tumble? >> tumble? you well, you you know, i don't know whether you have children or i've actually got grandchildren playing sport. >> and if you try and lock them in their bedrooms, they'll like to the top of the to jump off the top of the wardrobe . you know, you can't wardrobe. you know, you can't lock children well, you lock children up. well, no, you can't do. >> sorry. we're coming to the end of the hour, but really, really appreciate talking to you. professor john fairclough, you. professorjohn fairclough, who a professor of sport and who is a professor of sport and exercise medicine. gosh, calling it child abuse is absolutely ludicrous though, isn't it? i mean, you've got take risks mean, you've got to take risks at point in your life . at some point in your life. >> well, still to come, we're awaiting that sentencing the awaiting that sentencing of the killers we'll killers of brianna ghey. we'll bnng killers of brianna ghey. we'll bring it to you live as soon as it happens. don't go anywhere. this is good afternoon. britain. >> things are heating >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boiler oilers, sponsors of whether on . gb news.

of whether on. gb news. >> hello , i'm alex deakin. this >> hello, i'm alex deakin. this is your latest weather update from the met office for gb news. dry and drab for most places today. some gusty winds , today. some gusty winds, particularly over parts of the north and there is some wet weather around, especially in western scotland that is from this cold front that's been moving in high pressure , moving in high pressure, dominating to south. the dominating to the south. the isobars, squeezing isobars, though, are squeezing together lively gusts together and some lively gusts of over southeast scotland , of wind over southeast scotland, northeast england and northern and western scotland and western parts of scotland too, in western scotland, too, and in western scotland, we've got the rain trickling in. there will be some rain coming into the west of northern ireland also ireland this afternoon. also a bit over the hills of bit of drizzle over the hills of england and wales, but many places here dry if you breaks in the we could see some the cloud, so we could see some sunny spells and even though it's very mild it's windy it is very mild temperatures the temperatures getting into the teens, 14 in or 2 places teens, maybe 14 in 1 or 2 places through this evening and overnight bit more will overnight a bit more rain will push ireland push through northern ireland and of and spread into parts of northern england, and later into parts wales. the rain parts of wales. the rain clearing from central and eastern scotland . some good

eastern scotland. some good breaks in the cloud here. plenty of in to western of showers coming in to western scotland. much of the south will stay and cloudy and very stay dry and cloudy and very mild double overnight. mild double digits overnight. still quite breezy as well and it's a bit of a messy picture. then for saturday we'll start with thick cloud and some rain and drizzle over southwest england. that rain will pep up across wales during the day, turning wet in west wales, turning quite wet in west wales, but some breaks the cloud but some breaks in the cloud across northern england, eastern parts of england seeing some sunny for a time. bright sunny spells for a time. bright and blustery for eastern scotland showers to scotland with more showers to come northwest . come in the northwest. >> that warm feeling inside from boxt boilers , sponsors of boxt boilers, sponsors of weather on .

gb news. >> good afternoon britain. it is 1:00 on friday, the 2nd of february. >> brianna ghey killers named scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe, both aged 16, have been exposed as the twisted teenagers responsible for the sordid murder of brianna ghey . sordid murder of brianna ghey. we await the judge's sentence as manhunt continues. >> abdul ezedi, the refugee and convict and sex offender suspected of throwing chemicals over a mother and her two daughters, was granted asylum on his third attempt after converting to christianity. should convicted criminals ever be given sanctuary in this

country , no returns deal with country, no returns deal with turkey rishi sunaks bid to stop the boats has suffered yet another blow after home office officials declared turkey was not a safe country amid human rights concerns . rights concerns. >> this despite turkey being a member of the echr, a nato ally and an eu candidate country. >> ian's written in, he says what is this country coming to? it's unacceptable to have kids playing rugby, but perfectly acceptable to grant asylum to convicted sex offenders , sums up convicted sex offenders, sums up today's show. really, doesn't it ? >> and indeed acceptable to have a schoolgirl who was expelled for attempted poison of another pupil to then be put in a group with vulnerable students, including brianna ghey, who she then became obsessed with and

became accomplice to her murder or one of the two killers of brianna . we are still expecting brianna. we are still expecting this sentencing . it is going on this sentencing. it is going on for a little longer than we expected, but as soon as we get this sentence, we will bring that to you live. >> yes, we will, but first, let's get your headlines. >> emily. thank you. 1:02, your top stories from the gb newsroom . the two teenagers who murdered brianna ghey have been named as scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe . the ban on the 16 ratcliffe. the ban on the 16 year olds being identified was lifted ahead of their sentencing , which will bring you live here on gb news. we've also heard jenkinson has admitted she did stab brianna ghey herself . stab brianna ghey herself. prosecutors told manchester crown court she snatched the knife from eddie's hand and stabbed brianna repeatedly in victim statements read to the court. brianna's family have described both killers as two

predators stalking their prey and called them pure evil . and called them pure evil. a student who ran over and killed her fiance after she lost her temper has been sentenced to life in prison. alice wood will serve a minimum tum of 18 years for the murder of ryan watson, the 24 year old was found guilty of killing ryan following a trial at chester crown court last month . he was hit by the last month. he was hit by the ford fiesta . alice was driving ford fiesta. alice was driving near their home in cheshire , near their home in cheshire, which she claimed was which she had claimed was a tragic accident . rishi sunak tragic accident. rishi sunak says foreign criminals should not be allowed to stay in the uk following the manhunt for refugee and sex offender abdul ezedi . the home office is facing ezedi. the home office is facing growing pressure to carry out an urgent review into how eddie, the main suspect in this week's chemical attack , was allowed to chemical attack, was allowed to stay in the uk. chemical attack, was allowed to stay in the uk . the crown stay in the uk. the crown prosecution service have confirmed. he previously pleaded guilty to one charge of sexual assault in 2018, and one of indecent exposure . there are

indecent exposure. there are fresh warnings of potential human rights breaches on the bibby stockholm barge, as asylum seekers face what's being described as claustrophobic conditions . as the home affairs conditions. as the home affairs select committee says, cramped living conditions are contributing to a decline in mental health. for some residents, the cost of housing, asylum claimants on the barge is £120 per person per night. it comes as the home office has asked for an emergency £2.6 billion, after spending more than expected on asylum accommodation in a written statement, james cleverly made the request for a contingencies funded advance last year. the government spent around £8 million a day for migrant accommodation , with official accommodation, with official figures showing more than 50,000 were housed in hotel rooms . were housed in hotel rooms. meanwhile, a potential deal to send migrants back to turkey aimed at stopping small boat crossings seems unlikely to get the go ahead . home office the go ahead. home office officials say turkey isn't generally safe due to human rights concerns . the setback rights concerns. the setback follows the success of a similar

deal with albania, praised by rishi sunak. the proportion of turkish nationals arriving by small boats surged from 2% in 2022 to over 10% last year, downing street has denied that the potential returns agreement has fallen through . the has fallen through. the government's offering £1,000 sign on bonus for those to join the childcare sector. it's part of a £65 billion recruitment scheme and comes just two months before the first phase of a flagship childcare expansion. it follows the chancellor's announcement in march last year , announcement in march last year, eligible families of children as young as nine months will be able to claim 30 hours of free childcare per week . children and childcare per week. children and families minister david johnston told us. the government's giving working families the support they need when children are between 0 and 5 years old. >> a huge proportion of their brain development happens up to 80% of their brain development . 80% of their brain development. and that has a big role on what happens to them as children. young people and then as adults.

and so the biggest reason for people to look at this sector is the huge difference they can make at the earliest make to children at the earliest stage we've already over stage, we've already seen over 102,000 parents claim this new offer, which is really strong demand, and it shows that this is something that that people out there really want and that's going to make a huge difference to their family finances. >> travellers are facing more disruption today as rail services come to a standstill across some parts of the country . workers at greater anglia see2 and lner are walking out for 24 hours in their ongoing dispute over pay . strikes at other over pay. strikes at other companies will also be held tomorrow and on monday , union tomorrow and on monday, union members at all english train operators involved in the dispute are also banning overtime until early next week, leading to further train cancellations . sir elton john, cancellations. sir elton john, former prime minister sir tony blair and tv presenter fiona phillips are among the guests

attending the funeral of derek draper . the attending the funeral of derek draper. the good morning britain presenter kate garraway arrived earlier for her husband's service at the church in north london, where they married nearly two decades ago. draper who battled long lasting covid symptoms, died in january at the age of 56. trinkets of hope that he was he was getting . for all he was he was getting. for all the latest stories , sign up to the latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen or go to gbnews.com. forward slash alerts i >> -- >> good afternoon britain. it's 1:07 and the teenage killers who murdered brianna ghey will soon be sentenced at manchester crown court. >> yes, 16 year old scarlett jenkins and eddie ratcliffe were named earlier today and had already been found guilty of murdering the transgender schoolgirl . schoolgirl. >> the two teenagers were 15 when they lured brianna to her

death and stabbed her 28 times in her victim impact statement, breonna's mother esther, told the court she felt she'd failed her daughter by letting her meet up with scarlett . up with scarlett. >> well, joining us now is barrister rebecca butler . barrister rebecca butler. rebecca, thank you very much for joining us. of course, we're all waiting to sentence the judge's decision on this one. what will come ? what will be the come? what will be the difficulties for the judge here? >> well, the difficulties for the judge, i think primarily will be the defendant's ages. >> i think that will be a problem. um, um, and i but i have no hesitation that given the depravity of this killing, that the judge will be looking at life centre cases. but the more critical number, i think that people will be more interested in is the judge declaring when the earliest parole date will be that will be what will capture the public interest. most and what will

that mean? >> we hear that there's a 12 year minimum for these sorts of sentences , but it could go far, sentences, but it could go far, far higher. but of course, these individuals are just 16 years old. it's likely be they'll be out as young adults . yes, yes , out as young adults. yes, yes, they will be out as young adults. >> and of course, the story today is all about lifting the anonymity orders that were in place during the trial . and i place during the trial. and i think what the viewers need to know is that just because they've been named today, they would any event, have been, would in any event, have been, uh , open to being named by the uh, open to being named by the time they got to 18, they will be in custody then as well. but when they are released, like venables and thompson, the jamie bulger killers , um, the, uh , bulger killers, um, the, uh, anonymity lifting will be almost irrelevant because . because irrelevant because. because these two will be granted , uh, these two will be granted, uh, new identities when they are eventually released on parole, which is inevitably going to happen. >> rebecca, why can't they be

given a whole life order? well, they could be given a whole life order, but but, um, in any event , that, uh, the parole period would still apply . would still apply. >> and the of course. well, the trial judge can say there'd be a whole life in custody order, but sentencing singh for murder is life. but that doesn't mean you don't serve your sentence outside of prison. you do serve some of your life sentence in the community as you saw with the community as you saw with the venables and johnson. uh, the venables and johnson. uh, the venables, um , and robert the venables, um, and robert thompson cases that there have been recalls to prison because on licence they haven't, uh, complied with their conditions post release. >> so isn't this the concern for many, many people, particularly with someone like venables, so depraved at such a young age ? depraved at such a young age? clearly, prison did not fix him. clearly, prison did not fix him. clearly there are some people in

society who cannot be fixed, and reading the gruesome details, the obsession of these two, then 15 year olds, now 16 year olds, with a series of serial killers, their kill list, their meticulous, nicely planned attack . these were intelligent attack. these were intelligent children who planned to kill because they enjoyed it . i find because they enjoyed it. i find it very hard to believe and i would very much doubt that many people in this country would believe that these are people who could be reformed. they could be out in their 30s, they could be out in their 30s, they could kill again . could kill again. >> yes. i mean, there is no doubt reading the facts in this case that these are two sadistic, depraved individuals. but half of the purpose of putting people into custody is to fix them. and so it's only after the event that you can say somebody actually wasn't fixed by the system . you can't say by the system. you can't say that in ahead of the event. and they have to assume, um, that there's going to be significant

psychotherapy . and psychiatric psychotherapy. and psychiatric rehabilitate of these two young offenders. the other thing is, i mean, part of the reason behind and, uh, lifting the anonymity is so that i quote, lessons can be learned and we all know what happens when lessons are to be learned. they seldom are learned. they seldom are learned. and all of the risk factors that were ignored, all of the red flags that went up with both of these children will all be analysed in great detail, and i can reassure for your viewing public that absolutely nothing will change in the way the education system treats , uh, the education system treats, uh, children that really ought not to be in mainstream , um, school. to be in mainstream, um, school. uh, and no lessons are going to actually be learned here because these , these children, even these, these children, even though they have committed a horrendous, depraved , uh, horrendous, depraved, uh, attack, these children are also victims of a system that doesn't

not treat them for the problems they've got. and they are put back into mainstream school, which is the worst environment for them to be sometimes . and i for them to be sometimes. and i think that the lifting of the anonymity order was very , very anonymity order was very, very healthy thing for the high court judge to do because it means that there will be proper media scrutiny of the way in which these two children's cases were mishandled. they were children . mishandled. they were children. now, people might find it offensive that i call them that, but they actually are still children. now they are on the verge of becoming adults . verge of becoming adults. they're a different kettle of fish to the bulger killers who were significantly younger. these these are two individuals on the verge of adulthood and they are going to pose significant challenges to the rehabilitate ation services. uh, in the prison system. >> yeah. and it'll be very interesting to see if the judge decides to very different sentences , uh, to the girl and sentences, uh, to the girl and the boy perpetrator here. thank

you very much, rebecca butler, barrister. of course . barrister. of course. >> well, let's join now with paul scully mp , recently paul scully mp, recently minister for london, but also conservative vice chairman in days past . paul, conservative vice chairman in days past. paul, thank you so much for joining days past. paul, thank you so much forjoining us. uh, let's start of course, with our top story today. brianna ghey . we story today. brianna ghey. we haven't yet had the sentencing , haven't yet had the sentencing, but we are expecting it any minute . a truly depraved case. minute. a truly depraved case. do you agree with the fact that these names were released normally? of course, we don't see that for people under the age of 18. >> hi, tom. >> hi, tom. >> it's good to speak to you. and i do, i think for, you know, for the reasons that you've heard, i think it's, uh, the more information that gets out there, i think the, uh, the better. these people are nearly 18. um they've clearly been, um, uh, uh , probably uh, subjected, uh, probably brianna the most brianna ghey to the most horrendous um and i think horrendous death. um and i think we do need to look at the whole thing, not just for the sentencing, not just for the,

the those people themselves that are clearly going to go to prison for a long, long time. uh, uh, just how this is, uh, but, uh, just how this is, how this has happened because, you know, we always talk about knife crime london knife knife crime in london and knife crime country , but crime around the country, but this a whole nother scale. this is a whole nother scale. this a depraved attack. >> yes. and it looks like there's going to be an independent child safeguard review the, uh, brianna's review into the, uh, brianna's murder of course, but also the interactions of these two killers with, uh, the police, with social services, and crucially, with the schools . so crucially, with the schools. so we'll find out more details there of what went wrong and perhaps whether this horrible, horrific murder could have been prevented . and i also want to prevented. and i also want to talk to you today about the man who is on the run currently, uh, the convicted sex offender who was refused, refused asylum twice . com um committed a sexual twice. com um committed a sexual assault offence and then went on to convert to christianity and then was granted asylum in this country. i asked tim loughton

this question earlier, but do you think this man should have beenin you think this man should have been in this country? well i think clearly, you know, once you've been convicted of such a serious offence at that point, you've got to ask the question , you've got to ask the question, uh, what was the decision? >> how on earth did was that decision taken after after the offence? if you can understand if things happened afterwards, these things do happen. but at that particular point, when you've got a serious you've already got a serious conviction then we've really conviction, then we've really got a question why there, why he was to stay in this was allowed to stay in this country. >> t“ a g a sense w— g a sense that the >> people have a sense that the government wouldn't this to government wouldn't want this to happen. think we hear happen. i think we hear ministers , we hear your ministers, we hear your colleagues constantly talk about how asylum system needs to how the asylum system needs to be things shouldn't be tougher, how things shouldn't be tougher, how things shouldn't be way they are, and then be the way they are, and then the questions asked is your party really in control ? if party really in control? if these things all seem to be happening sort of against the wishes of the people we elect ? wishes of the people we elect? >> well, i think the party's in control as best it can be. but the home office and the border force are really massive, um, agencies that have, um, have

struggled to keep up with the situation in terms of processing, in terms of decision making over the last couple of decades. um, and, and it's never really caught up over that process. i remember , you know, process. i remember, you know, when, uh, the coalition . came in when, uh, the coalition. came in in 2010, it took over, i think, a legacy it set up a legacy unit to go through 250,000, uh, visa applications . so it's always applications. so it's always playing catch uh, and in playing catch up. uh, and in those then going to get decisions, you're always going to decisions to get some bad decisions amongst the hundreds of thousands every thousands that are taken every yeah thousands that are taken every year. need to get year. but we do need to get a better grip on the, on the, on the whole situation. better grip on the, on the, on the and le situation. better grip on the, on the, on the and pauluation. better grip on the, on the, on the and paul justyn. better grip on the, on the, on the and paul just lastly reading >> and paul just lastly reading this morning that, um, a returns deal essentially deal with turkey has essentially been ruled out by home office officials. they say that turkey is not a safe country. how big a blow is this? >> well, i think it's significant because, you know, there clearly, clearly there are clearly, clearly people coming through those channels . you know, that channels. um, you know, that route . uh, and so we've got to, route. uh, and so we've got to, uh , i think look again to see i uh, i think look again to see i haven't seen the detail yet

about why they, they believe that there um , that clearly there is um, um, some political difficulties in turkey at the moment, especially between turkey and kurdistan, for example. um but we just have to get a resolution with on this because it is one of the main routes into europe. >> it does seem bonkers that the eu has a returns deal with turkey, albeit a dysfunctional one, but we don't . but but paul, one, but we don't. but but paul, i'm afraid we have run out of time there. thank you so much for joining us here on good forjoining us here on good afternoon britain. i appreciate your . your time. >> let's return to that >> well, let's return to that sentencing, which is coming very shortly for the of 16 shortly for the killers of 16 year ghey. joining shortly for the killers of 16 ye'from ghey. joining shortly for the killers of 16 ye'from manchesterey. joining shortly for the killers of 16 ye'from manchester crown|ing shortly for the killers of 16 ye'from manchester crown court us from manchester crown court is our northwest reporter, sophie repor. sophie, tell us a little been little bit about what's been said in the court and when we might expect the sentence. s >> well, those . names scarlett >> well, those. names scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe now already know . this as the now already know. this as the murders of transgender teenager

brianna ghey. until today. we of course, have been able to report them only as girl x and boy y. that's due legal that's been due to legal restrictions, considering they're both still under 18. however, those restrictions have now that's why now been lifted and that's why we've to bring the we've been able to bring you the names faces . also, for names and their faces. also, for the first time today, we've heard that scarlett jenkinson has admitted her part in brianna's murder and that throughout the course of the trial , both she throughout the course of the trial, both she and eddie denied any involvement, instead blaming the other for brianna's death. but she has now admitted her part . she's but she has now admitted her part. she's given a couple of different accounts, the judge herself saying that she can't trust a word that scarlett has said, but in one version, scarlett has admitted that eddie threw brianna to the floor and then stabbed her 3 or 4 times. she said that. then eddie panicked and she instead took the knife and continued to stab brianna as she lay on the floor. now, one thing that remains the same in all of her accounts was that she was satisfied and excited as she stabbed brianna

jr . she lay there excited as she stabbed brianna jr. she lay there on excited as she stabbed brianna jr . she lay there on the floor, jr. she lay there on the floor, and when she was asked by counsellors and by social workers what her motivation was for this, she told them it was because brianna was her friend and she didn't want her to be able to leave her. she also admitted that she had planned on taking a token of brianna away with her. after carrying out that murder, so some really rather horrendous details we've been hearing here at manchester crown court today . we've also, crown court today. we've also, of heard those victim of course, heard those victim impact statements from brianna's family members, and i've taken just a couple of the really poignant moments. her father saying no amount of time spent in prison will be enough for these monsters. i cannot call them children, as makes them children, as that makes them children, as that makes them or vulnerable , them sound naive or vulnerable, which they are not. they are pure evil. brianna was the vulnerable one. her mother, who actually was too upset to speak in the court . actually was too upset to speak in the court. it was her intention initially to speak and read out her impact statement. but in the it was too much but in the end it was too much for her and that was read out for her and that was read out for her. she said. scarlett and eddie are a danger to society.

we never want to have we would never want them to have the opportunity to carry out their sick fantasies on another vulnerable now we will vulnerable person. now we will be shortly finding out about the sentencing . we're expecting that sentencing. we're expecting that to take place around quarter past two this afternoon . past two this afternoon. >> well, sophie will be back with you throughout the programme. of course , as we programme. of course, as we learn thank you so much learn more. thank you so much for bringing us that overview. >> 2:15. that's when we're >> so 2:15. that's when we're expecting the sentencing. but coming we will be debating if coming up we will be debating if convicted criminals should ever be allowed asylum. this is good afternoon britain on

want to keep you entertained. the camilla tominey show sunday mornings from 930 on gb news. >> good afternoon britain. it's 1:24 and the national manhunt for chemical attack suspect abdul azadi continues following a serious assault in south london on wednesday evening. >> yes, the 35 year old was last seen in a north london supermarket on the same night, and we now know he had been rejected for asylum twice and granted it the third time after after being convicted of a sexual offence back in 2018. well, joining us from north london, where mr azadi was last seen is our reporter, ray addison . addison. >> ray, what have we learned ? >> ray, what have we learned? >> ray, what have we learned? >> well, we know that azadi was last seen here at this tesco express on the caledonian road in north london. now that was

just about an hour after that horrific attack in clapham , in horrific attack in clapham, in which the 30. 31 year old woman and her two daughters, eight and three, were injured in that suspected chemical attack. azadi very much now a suspect in that. we know that he was inside this tesco express behind me. he bought a bottle of water. then he left and he turned right. now, if you turn right and then turn right again , it's about turn right again, it's about a five minute walk to king's cross. of course, king's cross very much the route to major locations across the united kingdom. if he'd gone a little bit further up the road, there, saint pancras international now that will get you to france and to holland , as well as other to holland, as well as other destinations . and so the police destinations. and so the police very much, i'm sure, looking at where he could have travelled to and what those potential destinations might have been now, the purpose of coming here to the tesco express, um, could be obviously on one aspect of that. it's risky because he may

have known, of course, that he was being hunted for. he's come in to get a bottle of water, perhaps we've all seen from that cctv footage taken inside the tesco express that damage to the right hand side of his face. it's hard to tell exactly the extent from the image, but it looks like it looks red. it looks like it looks red. it looks like it looks red. it looks like there could be blood there as well. from that injury to his eye and his cheek, the half of his face there, perhaps. could he have come in to get some water to try and clean himself off before then? travelling, moving on to king's cross and then travelling perhaps back to his hometown of newcastle. he'd driven down earlier in the day and perhaps police will suspect that he was on his way back home. >> thank you very much indeed. ray addison there in north london, outside that tesco express on caledonian road, where abdul ezedi was last seen. it's quite remarkable that a man with such a prominent injury on his wasn't stopped by any his face wasn't stopped by any police officer or any community,

um, you know, officer or whatever . whatever. >> and you'd think especially near these big stations, there's cctv, of course, across all of them, if he's going to hop on a train. king's cross is the way you get to newcastle, where he came from. you'd think someone might have seen him by now. >> yes. very curious indeed. we'll latest. if we'll bring you the latest. if there developments, but there are any developments, but we're be debating we're going to be debating whether should be whether asylum should ever be granted someone who's been granted to someone who's been convicted of a crime. joining us now to discuss that is director of the sanctuary foundation, doctor chris schneider. and phd, assistant professor of political science at webster vienna university, ralph schollhammer. thank you very much indeed . thank you very much indeed. let's start with you, doctor chris skudder. um, do you believe that someone who has committed a criminal criminal offence and has been convicted offence and has been convicted of it should be ever granted asylum in this country ? asylum in this country? >> well, it's nice to speak to you , and i'm so glad you're you, and i'm so glad you're covering this story. i really hope we can find mr azadi and bnng hope we can find mr azadi and bring him to justice. but in

answer to your question, imagine nelson mandela had been seeking asylum. uh, he was convicted of asylum. uh, he was convicted of a crime in south africa by an unjust, uh, judicial system. and it it's not beyond the realms of imagination that he might want to claim asylum in the uk. he has many friends and supporters here. so a blanket ban on people who have been convicted of crimes would not allow even someone of such international stature and undoubtable character, but what if you commit the crime in the country that you're trying to seek asylum ? yeah, that's a different asylum? yeah, that's a different question, and i'm glad you've clarified that. um, i think that the home office's rules say there are certain crimes that would exclude you from ever claiming asylum, but they, um, you know what constitutes a crime that would mean it would be impossible . and this one be impossible. and this one seemed to be his initial crime was some form of indecent exposure . um, and that could be exposure. um, and that could be due to some kind of medical or,

um, psychology condition. um, and a lot of the people that are travelling have experienced those kinds of trauma , things those kinds of trauma, things that would give them those kind of psychological damage. so again, a blanket ban would not be helpful . although in this be helpful. although in this case, i think if we had a system that was actually working that was able to safely and quickly assess people and there wasn't a hostile environment , so that hostile environment, so that people are then avoiding our, our public justice systems or our public justice systems or our public justice systems or our public health systems, we'd be able to give people the help they need early , the they need early, the psychological support they might need, to keep an eye on them need, and to keep an eye on them so we're aware of someone so that we're aware of someone that might danger of that might be in danger of committing genuinely serious crime. >> well, ralph, let's throw this over to you. how would you respond that ? respond to that? >> think valuable points >> no, i think valuable points were made , and i agree were made, and i would agree with the previous point. of course, solzhenitsyn with the previous point. of co nelson solzhenitsyn with the previous point. of co nelson mandela,)lzhenitsyn with the previous point. of co nelson mandela, who nitsyn with the previous point. of co nelson mandela, who were] or nelson mandela, who were convicted in their home countries illegitimate, convicted in their home countrieregime illegitimate, convicted in their home countrieregime thatgitimate, convicted in their home countrieregime that these te, convicted in their home countrieregime that these people corrupt regime that these people should be granted asylum. but i think not forget. and think we shall not forget. and i know different. but know legally it's different. but i the perception many i think the perception for many people is a privilege to

people is it is a privilege to be granted asylum or the potential for asylum. and uh, if then people commit such acts , then people commit such acts, uh, i would say in many ways then they abandon their rights to, have it. mean, we have to, to have it. i mean, we have this tendency say, well, this this tendency to say, well, this might be a psychological issue. this you know, this might be, uh, you know, some, some, you mental some, some, you know, mental issues. that's that's issues. and that's all that's all fine well, but the point all fine and well, but the point remains the same. is a little remains the same. it is a little bit odd if people flee persecution and violence persecution and fear of violence from country and then from their own country and then become and become perpetrate and persecutors the new country, persecutors in the new country, uh, i think the british uh, and i think the british public, is the next public, because this is the next thing, british is thing, the british public is very sensitive because very sensitive to this because there is a tendency, by the way, all over the that, uh, all over the west that, uh, people a sense that people have a sense that everything is policed except crime. look at crime. i mean, if we look at things, i think the things, uh, i think the gentleman question, was gentleman in question, uh, was already for sexual already convicted for a sexual offence. in great britain, offence. uh in great britain, i think only 10, less than 10% of rape prosecuted. rape cases are prosecuted. so there a sense to whom is there is a sense of to whom is there is a sense of to whom is the actually applied. and by the law actually applied. and by the law actually applied. and by the way, i did before the beginning the show, a little beginning of the show, a little bit of similar acts bit of research of similar acts all over europe. and very often these not so—called lone

these are not so—called lone wolves. wolves. wolves. they are known wolves. it's are it's always people that are known authorities , and known to the authorities, and somehow always remain in somehow they always remain in the countries, which think the new countries, which i think is both morally, legally is wrong, both morally, legally and security and also from a security perspective as well. >> going you just >> we're going to leave you just for moment. we want to for one moment. we want to please stay on the line for us. we'll be coming back to you very soon. kandiah soon. doctor krish kandiah and ralph will be back. ralph schollhammer will be back. but after your headlines, quickly . but after your headlines, quickly. emily. >> thank you. your top stories from the gb newsroom. the two teenagers who murdered brianna ghey have been named as scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe. the ban on the 16 year olds being identified was lifted ahead of their sentencing, which will bring to you life here on gb news prosecutors told manchester crown court. miss jenkinson snatched the knife from eddie's hand and stabbed brianna ghey repeatedly. her defence has denied this in victim statements read to the court brianna's family have described both killers as two predators stalking their prey

and called pure evil . a and called them pure evil. a student who ran over and killed her fiance after she lost her temper following an argument between them, has been sentenced to life in prison . alice wood to life in prison. alice wood will serve a minimum time of 18 years for the murder of ryan watson. the 20 year old was found guilty of killing ryan, also 24, following a trial at chester crown court last month . chester crown court last month. he was hit by the ford fiesta . he was hit by the ford fiesta. alice was driving near their home in cheshire , where she'd home in cheshire, where she'd claimed was a tragic accident . claimed was a tragic accident. rishi sunak says foreign criminals should not be allowed to stay in the uk following the manhunt for refugee and sex offender abdul ezedi . the home offender abdul ezedi. the home office is facing growing pressure to carry out an urgent review into how is ed the main suspect in this week's chemical attack was allowed to stay in the uk , say the crown the uk, say the crown prosecution service have confirmed. he previously pleaded guilty to one charge of sexual assault in 2018 and one of

indecent exposure . there are indecent exposure. there are fresh warnings of potential human rights breaches on the bibby stockholm barge as asylum seekers face what's being described as claustrophobic conditions. the home affairs select committee says cramped living conditions are contributing to a decline in mental health for some residents, as the cost of housing asylum claimants on the barge is £120 per person per night. it comes as the home office has asked for an emergency £2.6 billion, after spending more than expected on asylum accommodation in a written statement, james cleverly made the request for a contingency fund advance last yeah contingency fund advance last year. the government spent around £8 million a day for migrant accommodation on, with official figures showing more than 50,000 were housed in hotels . meanwhile, a potential hotels. meanwhile, a potential deal to send migrants back to turkey aimed at stopping small boat crossings seems unlikely to get the go ahead. home office officials say turkey isn't safe due to human rights concerns.

that's despite it being both a nato ally and a candidate to join the eu . former home join the eu. former home secretary suella braverman has posted on social media saying she's very concerned about the decision. downing street has denied that the potential returns agreement has fallen through. for the latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen or go to gbnews.com. forward slash alerts . forward slash alerts. >> for a valuable legacy your family can own, gold coins will always shine bright. rosalind gold proudly sponsors the gb news financial report . news financial report. >> here's a quick snapshot of today's markets. the pound will buy you $1.2762 and ,1.1727. the price of gold is £1,610.77 per ounce, and the ftse 100 is at 7657 points. rosalind gold

proudly sponsors the gb news financial report . financial report. >> right well thanks, tatiana. let's get straight back to our debate. joining us now is the director of the sanctuary foundation. doctor krish kandiah and assistant professor of political science at webster vienna university, ralf schollhammer. now we were debating whether convicted criminals should ever be granted asylum in this country. um, doctor krish, i guess the question for a lot of people watching this will be, it appears, is that public safety often comes second. add to the individual rights of in this case, this asylum seeker. in other cases of convicted criminals as well. can you see that ? that? >> i can see that. and we don't have to put one against the other. look i'm a foster parent. ihave other. look i'm a foster parent. i have six children that live in my home and we're always open. if we get an emergency call to receive another child. i want to be a hospitable person and offer care and support to children

that are in those most desperate of circumstances. but if a child then commits a crime in my house and puts other children in dangeh and puts other children in danger, that's not an appropriate place for that new child to be. and so i think you can be compassionate and kind to those people that are going to need to flee to safety and still protect those that are here in the uk. it's very rare for these kinds of attacks to happen from the refugee community and the immigration minister, former immigration minister, former immigration minister, former immigration minister was on the radio today saying the vast majority of refugees and asylum seekers are not, um, they're not criminals , they're people. criminals, they're people. >> that goes without saying. but that doesn't mean that there aren't too many cases like this . aren't too many cases like this. >> sure. but look, we're dealing with vulnerable people as a foster parent and many children who have experienced trauma in their past , sadly, um, have have their past, sadly, um, have have all sorts of ongoing challenges as a result. and that isn't true

for most children. but for some it is, and it's the same with asylum seekers. people that have had the worst things happen to them sometimes have psychological challenges that they then act out with other people . but it's the minority, people. but it's the minority, not the majority, to say no one should because we're should come because we're fearing, uh, fearful of some people committing crimes. is not appropriate. >> that's the point. the point that robert jenrick went on to make this morning is that it's a very small proportion of asylum seekers who do commit crimes. >> is, when they >> the problem is, when they come illegally, rather than come in illegally, rather than legally, know who they legally, we don't know who they are. throw their documents are. they throw their documents overboard and overboard on the boats and therefore we don't know to pick therefore we don't know to pick the people who are going to be law abiding from those who aren't. he made the case for the schemes that we've set up for people coming from hong kong or ukraine um, ukraine or even afghanistan. um, but to get round to but we need to get round to getting a chance we'll getting a chance here. we'll come to you in moment, come back to you in a moment, chris. ralph, your chris. but, ralph, just your response those points. well response to those points. well i very much commend doctor fish for what he's doing personally, i wonderful and

i find this is wonderful and it's to have people like that. >> but think the other point >> but i think the other point is that we tend to forget it's always just a minority. but if you look at the numbers, if you look know again from all look what we know again from all over is over europe, this is not a uniquely problem for the uk. it's just the crimes that it's not just the crimes that happen. first all, the happen. first of all, the connection between mass migration of migration from certain parts of the an increase the world and an increase in crime obvious, right? i think crime is obvious, right? i think denying longer is a denying this any longer is not a possibility. second possibility. and the second point people have a sense point is people have a sense that daily lives are that their daily lives are affected by this, meaning that they that their they have a sense that their surroundings, sense of surroundings, their sense of belonging communities, belonging to their communities, it's falling apart. you it's falling apart. it's, you know, breaking down, know, it's breaking down, whether schools, whether it's in schools, in other not just other areas. this is not just about crime that about the occasional crime that happens. it happens. it's the sense that it can happen. and this is if you talk to british people, do you feel now than you in feel safer now than you did in the past? answer is very the past? the answer is very often if you look at things often no. if you look at things that gb news has reported a lot on, things like the grooming gangs, this is gangs, for example, this is something that did not happen in the it know that the past. does it know that everyone comes to northern everyone who comes to northern areas is member grooming areas is a member of a grooming gang? a certain gang? no. but is there a certain connection to a migrant

background kinds background and these kinds of crimes absolutely and background and these kinds of crimis absolutely and background and these kinds of crimis the absolutely and background and these kinds of crimis the point. absolutely and background and these kinds of crimis the point. the)solutely and background and these kinds of crimis the point. the british .y and this is the point. the british government is primarily responsible primarily has to responsible and primarily has to answer british citizens answer to the british citizens and moral and they cannot, out of moral reasons, of try to save the reasons, kind of try to save the entire world. i know these are harsh words, but this is how most all over and most people all over europe and all over the west feel. and i think we have to face that reality. there is a very danger in saying, it's only in saying, well, if it's only a small number, basically, you know, nothing we can do about it. for many people, even that small enough make it. for many people, even that smallfeel enough make it. for many people, even that smallfeelthreatened|gh make it. for many people, even that smallfeel threatened ini make it. for many people, even that smallfeel threatened in theiriake them feel threatened in their daily chris last word to daily lives. chris last word to you. daily lives. chris last word to youlook, incident brought >> look, this incident brought out worst in humanity. this out the worst in humanity. this cowardly attack needs to be punished we to bring this punished. we need to bring this man justice as quickly as man to justice as quickly as possible. brought possible. but it also brought the best of our society. did the best out of our society. did you how many people ran to you see how many people ran to assist that woman and her assist that poor woman and her children putting themselves in danger? marks true danger? for me, that marks true british we're british hospitality. we're willing to offer support to those really need it, and those who really need it, and sometimes that puts us in dangeh >> well, there you go. thank you very much indeed, doctor krish kandiah, director of the sanctuary foundation , and ralph

sanctuary foundation, and ralph showell from vienna university. well, i thought i thought both put across a passionate , put across a passionate, passionate case. >> that was a very good debate, heanng >> that was a very good debate, hearing all sides of the issues as we do here on gb news well, stick with us here on good afternoon britain. we'll be leading up to that sentencing of the killers of brianna ghey and also much , much those also much, much more on those big stories of migration and indeed asylum. our panel is

tonight gb news, the people's channel tonight gb news, the people's channel, britain's news. channel

good afternoon britain. >> it's just coming good afternoon britain. >> it'sjust coming up good afternoon britain. >> it's just coming up to quarter to two and joining us today to cover the biggest stories are the former editor of the daily star , dom neeson, and the daily star, dom neeson, and political commentator benjamin butterworth. now, just to say it is in the next 30 minutes that we're expecting the sentencing of the killers of brianna ghey scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe were named this morning as those killers, formerly referred to as as girl y formerly referred to as as girl y and boy x, now known as scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe . their sentencing ratcliffe. their sentencing coming in the next 30 minutes. dawn >> and there's yes, it's unimaginable this type of crime really. and reading the sordid details of how it came about, uh, makes you need a strong stomach. it's savage , heinous, stomach. it's savage, heinous, brutal. it's horrific. >> and the fact that these these

people showed no emotion either. they didn't seem to comprehend what they'd done was wrong, and thatis what they'd done was wrong, and that is what i can't understand. i mean, surely no matter how old you are, even a ten year old knows that. so a 15 year old not not being not being shocked by their own behaviour. >> so their age doesn't matter to you and shouldn't matter in this decision. this sentencing decision. >> , uh, look, i think >> i think, uh, look, i think there were 15 and i think age always needs there's not one size fits all with this debate is there? it's not like it doesn't, you know, it various ages , various crimes and whether ages, various crimes and whether we name the children because that's what they were at the time . um. that's what they were at the fime.um.ws that's what they were at the time . um. it's not each case time. um. it's not each case needs to be taken on its merit. i think, in this one. but this is such a such a shocking crime that i think we've got to be careful not to do a knee jerk reaction, though i must admit. >> yeah. benjamin, should they have i think have been named, uh, i think they have, because first they should have, because first of all, they acted an adult of all, they acted with an adult level sophistication, of level of sophistication, of planning, intent. that

planning, of intent. that was evident from court case. evident from the court case. >> the mother said the >> but the mother said that the reason them to be reason she wanted them to be named now is because they would have they turned have been named when they turned 18, and clearly they're going to get a significant sentence , one get a significant sentence, one that that this will remain that means that this will remain in the headlines one way or in the headlines in one way or another years to come. another for years to come. >> and she wanted to have >> and so she wanted to have this over and done with, this ordeal over and done with, to names out there, to get these names out there, to have who these two have the expose of who these two people rather than spending people are rather than spending two knowing that the two years knowing that the intensity of public scrutiny was going back around to going to come back around to her. i think her. so for that reason, i think it sense. but there is it makes sense. but there is a dangerin it makes sense. but there is a danger in this that especially with terrorist attacks , that you with terrorist attacks, that you end up glorifying the attacker more than the victims. and so i appreciate that a lot of the coverage today has still focussed on brianna on her face, on pictures of the victim, rather than only these two people. and because this story has been around for a while, i don't think anyone's going to remember these two people's names like they do the victims names. and that's really important. >> yeah, that's true. uh, dawn, lots of people been lots of people have been

emailing whether emailing in, um, about whether these were evil . do you these two were born evil. do you think someone can be born evil? a big question , is it question? a big question, is it question? >> is it nature or nurture? is it nature or nurture? um, i uh gosh, what's the definition of evil? um, i think it's i think you can learn to be evil . i you can learn to be evil. i don't think children are born evil. i think there is something that happens in their lives that makes them this way. we know with the killers of little jamie bulger there. i mean , this is bulger there. i mean, this is not a defence, by the way. not in any way, shape or form, but the lifestyle they led as youngsters themselves was the parenting and inverted commas they received made , made them they received made, made them behave in a certain way. they were used to watching hardcore porn. they were used to watching the most horrific horror movies, etc. and yet john venables wasn't fixed by his time in prison. >> he got out of prison and he started committing offences again. and i wonder if whether it's nature or nurture, perhaps is irrelevant if it becomes

hardwired into someone. are there some people who simply can't be changed? >> yes, i think there are. i mean, i'm a firm believer in in prison being an opportunity to rehabilitate , rehabilitate rehabilitate, rehabilitate someone as well. but i think there are you give people one chance and as that case has proved, there are some people that are beyond help and they should never come out. should just never come out. >> yes. and of course, will >> yes. and we of course, will be these sentencing be bringing these sentencing remarks the when we remarks from the judge when we hear them . benjamin, can be hear them. benjamin, can you be born evil ? born evil? >> uh, i mean, the ultimate question of that is people often ask, you know, would you kill a baby hitler? now we that's baby hitler? right now we that's that's the example people give right now. we know, actually, that hitler had very that adolf hitler had a very abusive probably that adolf hitler had a very abusi'inbred. probably that adolf hitler had a very abusi'inbred. and probably that adolf hitler had a very abusi'inbred. and s0)robably that adolf hitler had a very abusi'inbred. and so there ly that adolf hitler had a very abusi'inbred. and so there is quite inbred. and so there is a person who did the ultimate, you know, evil in modern but know, evil in modern times. but we know he had a very we also know he had a very messed up childhood and i think the truth is that often it's what happens in people's early years can seriously mal years that can seriously mal wire brains to behave like wire their brains to behave like that. think question that. i think the real question isn't were they evil? it's isn't were they born evil? it's can you undo the programming

that to behave? that has led them to behave? >> thing is from >> this thing is from reading some of the descriptions, the details on this, it does seem like relatively like they had a relatively normal upbringing uh, parents normal upbringing. uh, parents jobs. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> and normal. >> and normal. >> and normal. >> and the mum has said, please, you know, we know the you know, now we know the identities don't go for the families because she said that the to her like the families seemed to her like very people who are very decent people who are horrified children horrified by what their children thisthis is a problem you've got >> this is a problem you've got with people this. with naming people like this. i mean, going back to the mary bell story, i mean, she was ten when she she murdered two children. think were children. i think there were three five. she kept three and five. but she was kept anonymous because. because or she identity. because she had no identity. because when she came out of prison at the of she then had the age of 23, she she then had a and she's now got a daughter and she's now got grandchildren so knew who grandchildren. so if we knew who she was, you could then target her children her her children and her grandchildren and there grandchildren. and i think there are families be taken into are families to be taken into account as well. account here as well. >> do we think was the >> what do we think was the point at which these people snapped changed? or perhaps there was something that was just differently wired about these individuals, as we say , these individuals, as we say, normal upbringings, normal

families, whatever the word normal means , these individuals normal means, these individuals were obsessed with serial killers and perhaps were obsessed with cases like this. and frankly, the media coverage they get, well, that is something that you see lots of evidence with, for example, mass shootings in the us. it's not uncommon that people that already have issues then get obsessed by things they've consumed in the media, in films. so maybe that's a part of it. i know that the head teacher of the school at has said the school they were at has said that they didn't pick on any that they didn't pick up on any evidence in their day to day behaviour for that, most of the correspondents indicated behaviour for that, most of the correwouldents indicated behaviour for that, most of the correwouldentsthis indicated behaviour for that, most of the correwouldentsthis wasicated behaviour for that, most of the correwouldentsthis was donei they would do this was done online, they were hiding online, so they were hiding it in life. the fact in day to day life. the fact that the girl was expelled for trying to poison another pupil, albeit that was only two months before she ended up killing brianna. dawn. should she brianna. uh dawn. should she have been in not placed in sort of an educational unit with brianna after the point at which she was expelled? >> well , i she was expelled? >> well, i don't she was expelled? >> well , i don't know the full >> well, i don't know the full stories of why she was expelled

and the gravity of what she did. so i don't really know whether that was a reason for, for keeping them apart. i do think, though, that it's we have to give children a chance . i think give children a chance. i think you can't condemn them for that . you can't condemn them for that. say one example, and then you have to punish them for that. but, i mean, the thing is, we don't know what what has triggered this. and i do wonder i always social i know we always blame social media. you can see online. media. what you can see online. and have to wonder how much of and i have to wonder how much of social media can warp youngsters minds. these days. >> what's quite interesting is the lawyers of eddie are seemingly portraying this as if scarlet was the ringleader. here she was the mastermind in all this. that may well be true, that he was almost an accomplice. that was taken by her obsession with murder and violence. be violence. so it'll be interesting see there is interesting to see if there is quite difference in the quite a difference in the sentencing depending eddie quite a difference in the sentscarletdepending eddie quite a difference in the sentscarlet .apending eddie and scarlet. >> but i mean, it will be interesting, but also , i think interesting, but also, i think ultimately, you know, any vaguely remotely normal, stable child would know right from

wrong long before being drawn into that kind of experience. and so i think, you know, they need to do serious psychological assessments on these on these people to work out how people to try and work out how they ended up i mean, we they ended up there. i mean, we know, example, some people know, for example, some people are susceptible to are far more susceptible to depression, life depression, not because of life events, but because their brains are built a certain in are built in a certain way in the is that what the first place. is that what happened something happened here? has something happened here? has something happened the happened outside of the household there been household that there hasn't been shared think you know, shared so far? i think you know, the temptation is to say, throw away the because it's so away the key because it's so evil. but actually we really need this happens need to know how this happens because not first because it's not the first time kids done something so kids have done something so heinous. to not heinous. well, we need to not have happen again. have it happen again. >> they will be for parole at >> they will be up for parole at some point. yes. so that decision to be made decision will have to be made again. yeah. again. yeah, yeah. >> think that the thing >> and i think that the thing is, with sort of cases, is, with these sort of cases, there always one blaming the there was always one blaming the other or their lawyers blaming the other. same happened the other. the same happened with killers jamie with the killers of jamie bulger. supposedly bulger. one was supposedly leading back leading the other and going back even know, myra even further, you know, myra hindley and ian brady, one blamed the other fred and blamed the other there. fred and rose blames the rose west. one always blames the other. i was scared of what they would did not go

would do to me if i did not go along it. so if i was along with it. so if i was a lawyer representing anyone, i would use that defence to be honest with you and yet the likelihood these were likelihood is these people were egging each other along. >> yeah. they were both >> yeah. and they were both influencing each other going >> yeah. and they were both influethisg each other going >> yeah. and they were both influethis dark h other going >> yeah. and they were both influethis dark spiral,�* going >> yeah. and they were both influethis dark spiral, watching|g down this dark spiral, watching these videos on these sort of killing videos on these sort of killing videos on the . the dark web. >> the thing is, tom, i love horror. i love serial killers. i mean, lots of people do. and i, you know, i watch them sort of like, you know, law and order. yeah, absolutely. watched the yeah, absolutely. i watched the documentary. them, documentary. i love them, but that mean i'm going to that doesn't mean i'm going to go and kill someone or think that what's happening? give me five um but that five minutes. um but that doesn't mean so there is something going rather something else going on rather than what they are watching. >> psychological problems ? >> psychological problems? certainly. very much. certainly. thank you very much. dawn benjamin dawn neesom and benjamin butterworth. they'll be back later on the show. and in the later on in the show. and in the next 20 minutes or so we will be live at manchester crown court for sentencing scarlett for the sentencing of scarlett jenkinson eddie radcliffe. jenkinson and eddie radcliffe. see you very shortly. >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boiler is sponsors of

whether on . gb news afternoon whether on. gb news afternoon i'm alex deakin. >> this is your latest weather update from the met office for gb news is a bright and blustery day. on saturday across the north, a mild day in the south and in between there will be some thicker cloud and outbreaks of rain, courtesy of this weather front, which is slicing between high pressure to the south and low pressure to the north, bringing thicker cloud and a bit of rain as it trickles south through northern ireland. southern northern southern scotland, northern england, still very england, overnight still very gusty at the moment over northeast england and southeast scotland. the winds will steadily staying very steadily ease but staying very windy in the far north, with more showers here far more showers here in the far south it stays very mild with temperatures remaining in double digits. in fact , most of england digits. in fact, most of england and wales will up at 9 or and wales will hold up at 9 or 10 celsius a little colder. further north, but still very blustery here on saturday. more showers across the showers to come across the highlands and the western isles, showers to come across the higisome. and the western isles, showers to come across the higisome sunshine western isles, showers to come across the higisome sunshine for;tern isles, showers to come across the higisome sunshine for southern ;, but some sunshine for southern and of and eastern scotland. much of northern and much of

northern ireland and much of northern england as well. quite dull and damp in west wales and dunng dull and damp in west wales and during the day some of that rain may spread back up parts may spread back up across parts of northern into east of northern england into east anglia. of the south, anglia. much of the south, though, dry but fairly though, just dry but fairly drab, mild. however, drab, might mild. however, temperatures the temperatures getting into the teens a colder feel further north sunday sees some patchy rain spreading from wales to northern ireland and turning damp in western parts of scotland, but probably not much rain. getting to the coast rain. getting to the east coast again. much the south just again. much of the south just dry and cloudy. it will be quite windy throughout the weekend but it's going to stay mild with temperatures again in the teens . temperatures again in the teens. >> that warm feeling inside from boxt boiler as sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> good afternoon britain. it's 2:00 on friday the 2nd of february. >> brianna ghey killers to be sentenced scarlett jenkinson and eddie radcliffe, both aged 16, were earlier named as the twisted teenagers responsible for the sordid murder of brianna ghey. for the sordid murder of brianna ghey . we will be live at ghey. we will be live at manchester crown court in the next 15 minutes for the sentencing . sentencing. >> a manhunt continues abdul ezedithe >> a manhunt continues abdul ezedi the refugee and convicted sex offender suspected of throwing chemicals over a mother and her two daughters, was granted asylum on his third attempt after converting to

christianity. should convicted criminals ever be given sanctuary in this country? >> no returns deal with turkey . >> no returns deal with turkey. rishi sunaks bid to stop the boats has suffered yet another blow, after home office officials declared turkey was not a safe country. that's amid human rights concerns. this despite turkey being a member of the echr , a nato ally, and an eu the echr, a nato ally, and an eu candidate country. >> law and order that's a theme, a thread running through our biggest stories today . we are biggest stories today. we are expecting the sentencing of the killers of brianna ghey in the next 10 to 15 minutes, and we'll bnng next 10 to 15 minutes, and we'll bring it to you live as we get it. but in parallel today, this story of a broken in asylum system, an asylum system that really could have ended with some pretty horrific scenes .

some pretty horrific scenes. >> yes. i mean, lots of you have been getting in touch, enraged, rightfully , in my view, about rightfully, in my view, about the fact that a convict sex offender could be granted asylum in this country because they converted to christianity . see, converted to christianity. see, this really is a massive issue. i do worry that our safety is being put at risk, fundamentally at risk because because our system, our asylum system is not functioning how it should. we can't deport people even if they are convicted criminals. and what else? >> it feels like our politicians who keep saying the right things are hopeless are powerless in the face of other institutions in the face of the officials at the home office, in the face of the home office, in the face of the legal system, in the face of activist lawyers, it seems that the elected government can't doesn't win. >> we can't even get a returns deal with turkey as it stands anyway, let us know what you think. vaiews@gbnews.com. but first, your headlines with tatiana .

tatiana. >> emily. thank you. 2:02. your top stories from the newsroom. the two teenagers who murdered brianna ghey have been named as scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe. the ban on the 16 year olds being identified was lifted ahead of their sentencing , which will bring to you live here on gb news news, prosecutors told manchester crown court miss jenkins then snatched the knife from eddie's hand and stabbed brianna repeatedly . her defence has repeatedly. her defence has denied this in victim statements read to the court. brianna's family have described both killers as two predators stalking their prey and called them evil . a student who them pure evil. a student who ran over and killed her fiance after she lost her temper following an argument between the two, has been sentenced to life in prison. alice wood will serve a minimum tum of 18 years for the murder of ryan watson, the 24 year old was found guilty of killing ryan, also 24, following a trial at chester crown court last month . he was

crown court last month. he was hit by the ford fiesta. alice was driving near their home in cheshire, for which she had claimed was a tragic accident . claimed was a tragic accident. rishi sunak says foreign criminals should not be allowed to stay in the uk following the manhunt for refugee and sex offender abdul yazidi. the home office is facing growing pressure to carry out an urgent review into how azt, the main suspect in this week's chemical attack , was allowed to stay in attack, was allowed to stay in the uk . the crown prosecution the uk. the crown prosecution service have confirmed. he previously pleaded guilty to one charge of sexual assault in 2018, and one of indecent exposure . now there are fresh exposure. now there are fresh warnings of potential human rights breaches on the bibby stockholm barge as asylum seekers face what's being described as claustrophobic conditions . the home affairs conditions. the home affairs select committee says cramped living conditions are contributing to a decline in mental health. for some residents, the cost of housing, asylum claimants on the barge is £120 per person, per night . it

£120 per person, per night. it comes as the home office has asked for an emergency £2.6 billion, after spending more than expected on asylum accommodation in a written statement, james cleverly made the request for a contingencies fund advance . last year, the fund advance. last year, the government spent around £8 million a day for migrant accommodation , with official accommodation, with official figures showing more than 50,000 were housed in hotels . meanwhile were housed in hotels. meanwhile a potential deal to send migrants back to turkey aimed at stopping small boat crossings seems unlikely to get the go ahead. home office officials say turkey isn't safe due to human rights concerns. that's despite it being both a nato ally and a candidate to join the eu. former home secretary suella braverman has posted on social media saying she's very concerned about the decision and downing street has denied that the potential returns agreement has fallen through . the government fallen through. the government is offering a £1,000 sign on bonus for those who choose to join the child care sector. it's part of a £65 million

recruitment scheme and comes just two months before the first phase of a flagship child care expansion. it follows the chancellor's announcement in march last that eligible march last year that eligible families of children as young as nine months will be able to claim 30 hours of free childcare a children and families a week. children and families minister david johnston told us the government's giving working families they need families the support they need when are between 0 and when children are between 0 and 5 years old. >> a huge proportion of their brain development happens up to 80% of their brain development , 80% of their brain development, and that has a big role on what happens to them as children. young people and then as adults. and so the biggest reason for people to look at this sector is the difference they can the huge difference they can make at the earliest make to children at the earliest stage, we've already seen over 102,000 parents claim , um, this 102,000 parents claim, um, this new offer, which is really strong demand and it shows that this is something that that people out there really want, and that's going to make a huge difference to their family finances . finances. >> travellers are facing more disruption today as rail services come to a standstill

across some parts of the country. workers at greater anglia, c—to—c and lner are walking out for 24 hours in their ongoing dispute over pay. strikes at other companies will also be held tomorrow and on monday, union members at all engush monday, union members at all english train operators involved in the dispute are also banning overtime until early next week, leading to further train cancellations throughout . and cancellations throughout. and john. former prime minister sir tony blair and tv presenter fiona phillips are among the guests attending the funeral of derek draper . good guests attending the funeral of derek draper. good morning britain presenter kate garraway arrived earlier for her husband's service at the church in north london, where they married nearly two decades ago. draper who battled long lasting covid symptoms, died in january at the age of 56. >> there are clips of hope that he was he was getting. >> for the latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen or go to gb news. com forward slash

alerts . alerts. >> good afternoon britain . it's >> good afternoon britain. it's 2:07 and the national manhunt for chemical attack suspect abdul ezedi continues following a serious assault on south london in south london on wednesday evening. yes, the 35 year old was last seen in a north london supermarket on the same night , north london supermarket on the same night, and we now know he had been rejected for asylum twice and granted it third twice and granted it the third time after being convicted of a sexual offence back in 2018. well, joining us from north london, outside that supermarket he was spotted at is our reporter ray addison, and ray looking at these pictures. this is a deeply distinctive man. it almost boggles the mind that no one has seen him since he was in that supermarket . that supermarket. >> well, absolutely. and police obviously very keen to get that image out there, that distinctive cctv still taken from the cameras here at this

tesco express on the caledonian roadin tesco express on the caledonian road in north london, just five minutes away from king's cross. and i've been inside and there's a number of staff in there and a security presence as well, and potentially therefore for the met police, a number of people who would have been able to describe what his demeanour would have been like, whether he made any particular comments or statements, and also potentially and quite importantly, the extent of those injuries to the right hand side of his face and that might help the police to have an idea of how quickly he might be looking to get himself some emergency medical treatment. now we know that he was here between around 830, possibly 9:00 on that wednesday night , five minutes away. got night, five minutes away. got kings cross, then you've got saint pancras international as well. routes across britain, routes across europe as well. and so they'll all be potential lines. however, it will be suspected that he's trying to

make his way back to his home town or his newly adopted hometown of newcastle. we know that he, the met, is working with northumbria police. he was living were understanding in a halfway house in the byker area, which is a small area not that far away from the city area. city centre, uh acquaintances who've met him describing him as a very persistent type of guy, a man who doesn't let things go easily , and met police when they easily, and met police when they issued those images. easily, and met police when they issued those images . and they issued those images. and they made that statement yesterday dunng made that statement yesterday during the press conference saying they believe that he is dangerous , and urging members of dangerous, and urging members of the public stay away. if you think that you come across him, but call 999 urgently. we've heard a bit about his background. we know that he is a refugee from afghanistan . he refugee from afghanistan. he travelled to the united kingdom on a lorry back in 2016. uh, ultimately made three claims for asylum. first to turn down, third was accepted. that's after

he'd been convicted of sexual assault and exposure in january of 2018. that at newcastle crown court. and he did, of course , court. and he did, of course, plead guilty. why then did he have his third application accepted ? because he converted accepted? because he converted to christianity ? we understand a to christianity? we understand a local priest there , um, speaking local priest there, um, speaking on his behalf and saying that he was wholly committed to his new religion . well, now the home religion. well, now the home office is under extreme pressure to launch a review. james cleverly describing this attack as appalling, but downing street, we understand , refusing street, we understand, refusing to confirm whether that review will take place and stressing and this is very important, obviously this is an ongoing investigation. it's not entirely clear what has happened at this stage . stage. >> of course, it doesn't sound particularly to christian throw a chemical substance over someone, but there we are. um, radisson . thank you so much. radisson. thank you so much. >> sexual assault . >> sexual assault. >> sexual assault. >> there you go. yeah. no, i

thought either or ray addison outside. >> uh, that supermarket in north london where abdul was lost. >> it does seem that we're just being taken for mugs. continue loosely. it continually . what loosely. it continually. what happens is people are advised that they must do this . they that they must do this. they pretend to be christian. they pretend to be christian. they pretend to be gay. they pretend to be whatever it is that will let them stay in the country. and it does seem that this is happening. mean, it might be happening. i mean, it might be isolated incidents, might be isolated incidents, it might be many but to deny that many incidents. but to deny that it's think is out it's happening, i think is out of order. >> people do, though . people do. >> people do, though. people do. but joining us now is the former detective chief inspector, mike neville. mike, great to speak to you have you the so you and have you on the show. so massive manhunt potentially covering the entirety of the country . why hasn't he been country. why hasn't he been found yet? he's got a massive cache across his face. >> yes, because of course . so >> yes, because of course. so greetings from. i'm in sunny spain at the moment, but, uh, he would be. you would think that the ultimate facial recognition with automatic number plates

readers . uh, there would be some readers. uh, there would be some way of finding him with all the cctv around the country. but of course , as if he's gone to course, as if he's gone to ground, if he's. he's holed up in some flat somewhere, then you can you can stay there for months. really without anybody knowing you. there if he's got an associate who's to prepared let in a stay somewhere , let him in a stay somewhere, then can stay there . um, but then he can stay there. um, but then he can stay there. um, but the police will be using all sorts of digital devices to track him. if he's got social media accounts, if he's got , uh, media accounts, if he's got, uh, uh, emails , uh, if he's using uh, emails, uh, if he's using a mobile phone , that can be, uh, mobile phone, that can be, uh, cell cell sites . uh, so there's cell cell sites. uh, so there's all manner of things that they can do, manage, use social, you know, i'd say social media accounts, bank accounts of everybody needs cash at some point . so that's what they'll be point. so that's what they'll be looking for. so as well as all the traditional things of putting out posters and tracking him, see if he went on the train, uh, up to northumbria or over to from on the over to europe from on the eurostar . they'll be using all eurostar. they'll be using all these digital techniques to try and him as in your and track him as well. in your

experience, people down experience, chasing people down are those are there those who are those are there those who are perhaps more cunning and those who are more lolloping and lumbering ? lumbering? >> uh, which category does this individual seem to fit into ? individual seem to fit into? after all, he's gone into a supermarket that people know his face. perhaps this isn't the brightest bulb that there is . brightest bulb that there is. >> yeah, absolutely. so this man doesn't seem like a career criminal. we know he's got convictions for sexual assault, but there's no real pattern of events there. it's not a character who's got lots of convictions, who's wily and experienced, but as i say, if he's got a friend who's prepared to put him up in a house, uh, you could literally stay there for months without anybody knowing you're there. if you're prepared to have mobile prepared not to have a mobile phone, prepared not to phone, if you're prepared not to go and just go on emails and just stay there, he be there there, then he could be there for months. i mean, one of the angles, course, the police angles, of course, the police will looking at has what's will be looking at is has what's happened him? has he decided, happened to him? has he decided, has he committed suicide? that's another for inquiry. another angle for this inquiry. because of course when people do

these attacks , that these emotional attacks, that could something that happens . could be something that happens. >> also, not very hard to >> also, it's not very hard to discern skies is it? discern skies yourself, is it? uh, put on a mask. uh, cover yourself up with an item of clothing. clothing >> well, i mean, these facial disfiguration looks so bad, i don't think even a mask would , don't think even a mask would, uh, hide that, uh, and he will be well aware that there's, uh, millions of cctv cameras in this country . uh, the police can use country. uh, the police can use what's called lfr live facial recognition tracking . uh, they recognition tracking. uh, they can also deploy human super recognisers to find him . and to recognisers to find him. and to be honest, if he's if he's out in public, they would have spotted him by now. so i imagine he's, uh, holed up somewhere. >> well, detective chief inspector mike neville, former detective chief inspector, thank you very much for your time and your expertise on this. really appreciate it. >> it's very , uh, >> well, it's very, uh, interesting how the police go about this type of thing. of course. yes. mobile phones, social accounts, sometimes social media accounts, sometimes criminals are so stupid that

they post their location on their on their social media as if they want to be found. >> it does seem extraordinary that not yet been found, that he has not yet been found, but of course, there is another big story to do with crime, justice, law order. today justice, law and order. today we're expecting imminently . the we're expecting imminently. the statement manchester crown statement from manchester crown court, the sentencing of the killers of brianna ghey , of killers of brianna ghey, of course, scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe. they're being sentenced and we're expecting that sentencing any moment now. >> yes, they've both been found guilty, but what will their sentence be? what will the judge have to say? we know they had lawyers who were putting up a defence. eddie eddie ratcliffe's lawyers saying , oh, it was lawyers saying, oh, it was scarlets. scarlets idea. >> and i think the most extra ordinary thing about all of this is how meticulously planned it was , what sort of level of was, what sort of level of detail we have been able to see. i don't think i can remember a trial where plainly there under one of the main perpetrators beds, was found a crumpled up note saying, this is who we're going to kill, and this is how

we're going to do it. frankly, the amount of evidence that there has been in this case has been nothing of been nothing short of extraordinary . and so perhaps extraordinary. and so perhaps what we'll be hearing in just a moment or two is a very significant sentence. >> there we are looking at the outside of manchester crown court , where this sentencing court, where this sentencing will be read out by the judge. there again, scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe are being sentenced for the brutal , sentenced for the brutal, savage, heinous murder of brianna gye. we'll be going to a break now, but we'll be back very shortly

the people's channel, britain's news channel . news channel. >> good afternoon. britain it's 2:20 and we're expecting imminently the sentencing of the killers of brianna ghey chai. now to remember those two individuals, 15 years old at the time of their crime , have been time of their crime, have been named today as scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe. >> yes, there they are on the screen. we're awaiting. what? the judge. what the judge will say in his sentencing remarks. how long will they be put away ? how long will they be put away? what will the sentence be? when would they be up for parole? lots of questions remain. lots of you have been getting in touch about this . we did earlier touch about this. we did earlier have a bit of a debate about whether one be born evil , whether one can be born evil, and sid's had quite a lot to

say, says it's amazing. you can even think of having this debate without having a christian perspective . the answer is yes. perspective. the answer is yes. we are all born evil. babies are inherently selfish and self—centred. well, there you go . he goes on to explain why john says 1516 year olds may not be classed as adults by law until they're 18. never the less, they knew what they were doing . i knew what they were doing. i suspect even if they were much older, they still would have committed murder. committed the murder. >> although john has written in to are young adults, to say these are young adults, not children, calling them not children, stop calling them children. legally , of children. although legally, of course, under the age of course, anyone under the age of 18 is a child, and no doubt that will have some effect, some impact sentencing . impact upon this sentencing. stephen has also written in discussing the idea that when they are let out as as they are expected to be let out after some sort of minimum service on parole. uh why should we have to pay parole. uh why should we have to pay out to give them new identities? and why should they ever be let out ? that's from ever be let out? that's from stephen, and i believe a lot of people would be in agreement

with that. >> and lynn all the way in cyprus. she has an idea they should get twice the age should each get twice the age they committed they were when they committed they were when they committed the brianna. plus the the murder of brianna. plus the anticipated average remaining length of brianna's life 30 years plus 50 years each to equal sentence they have equal the sentence they have given brianna's parents society does not need them, she says, and it just just must be said , and it just just must be said, the sort of quantity of messages that we've got saying that a 12 year minimum, um, would not be enough, that some people have been arguing in favour of the death penalty for these two individuals. >> of course, that is not not going to happen today, but one of the fascinating things that we will be hearing is not just the number of years that these individuals are put behind bars for , but precisely why the judge for, but precisely why the judge came to that conclusion . brian, came to that conclusion. brian, there will be a comprehensive summing up of the sordid details in this case, many of which have been heard and reported up until how. >> now. >> i mean, it's pretty grim

reading, reading and listening to the details around this case, how they lured brianna into a park in cheshire and brutally murdered her 28 times. they stabbed her. um, it's hard to imagine how at such a young age, 15 years old, you could even come up with the idea of doing something like that. but having read about them, they were very much obsessed with the act of murder, the act of torture , the murder, the act of torture, the act of killing. they were obsessed by it. >> and frankly , there's been >> and frankly, there's been some discussion in the media about the boys autism , about the about the boys autism, about the sense that perhaps are these individuals not entirely culpable? uh, dave has written in to admonish that idea, saying, just because scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe have been diagnosed with autism and adhd does not detract from their heinous nature of their crime, their iq will be high

enough to understand their actions , but their aek unfortu actions, but their aek unfortu he doesn't understand the devastating effects on brianna's and even their own families . and even their own families. their lack of remorse supports this and they should never be released . released. >> yes, and it's quite interesting because according to their background, they weren't, um, stupid . they probably were um, stupid. they probably were reasonably intelligent. judging by the fact they were eddie for example, was doing nine gcses, aspiring to go to university to study micro biology and of course, and went down this path . course, and went down this path. >> absolutely. please do get in touch with your thoughts. vaiews@gbnews.com. we'll be coming to them through the show and we of course will be returning to manchester crown court as soon as this sentence. see begins. sentencing begins. >> yes. well, a deal to send illegal migrants back to turkey looks unlikely. that's because the home office, well, the officials there have declared that the nato member state is unsafe. >> in a major blow to rishi sunak stop the boats mission ,

sunak stop the boats mission, civil servants they have civil servants said they have concerns about turkey's human rights record . rights record. >> and yes, so 3000 illegal migrants from turkey landed on british shores in 2023 alone. so they're one of the most represented , um, nationalities represented, um, nationalities for those crossing in small boats . catherine, can you bring boats. catherine, can you bring us katherine forster ? our us katherine forster? our political correspondent is here. catherine, thank you very much indeed. catherine, thank you very much indeed . so what do we know about indeed. so what do we know about the reasoning behind why these home office , home office home office, home office officials have said turkey is not safe enough for a returns deal ? well deal? well >> yes. so home office officials have said that turkey is, quote , have said that turkey is, quote, a state that does not meet the criteria of being generally safe. i think news to a lot of people, many brits go on holiday to turkey . it is, of course, to turkey. it is, of course, a country in europe, a member of nato , etc. but what they're nato, etc. but what they're saying is they have concerns overits saying is they have concerns over its human rights, specifically . uh, the echr are

specifically. uh, the echr are yes, we hear about it with rwanda and here we go again. they say that basically turkey do not always comply by, uh, with the echr in the way that they should. and also that the majority of turks who come illegally on small boats are claiming , illegally on small boats are claiming, um, asylum because they are political opponents of they are political opponents of the regime and would likely be jailed in turkey. now this is yet another battle on one of many fronts that rishi sunak is fighting, and apparently losing in his quest to stop the boats. i think there'll be a lot of surprise that one of those battles he's facing is with civil servants in his own home office, and the former home secretary suella braverman has been tweeting her astonishment. point out that turkey is a member of the council of europe , member of the council of europe, a nato ally and a candidate for

the eu accession . she's tweeted the eu accession. she's tweeted out concern of mp neil o'brien, who has screenshotted two articles and put them side by side, one of which is that the times report on this plan to send people back to turkey falling through the other is the manhunt , of falling through the other is the manhunt, of course, for falling through the other is the manhunt , of course, for the guy manhunt, of course, for the guy abdul azadi, who's being sought for those horrific, uh, al kaune for those horrific, uh, al kaline attacks. and he has put them together and he has said , them together and he has said, what about the safety of people in the united kingdom ? the in the united kingdom? the balance is all wrong. having a look at some of the views from gb viewers watching today . i gb viewers watching today. i think a lot of people would subscribe to that sentiment , think a lot of people would subscribe to that sentiment, but it does seem that this is going to be a question that many people across the country are asking. >> why does the government seem to not have a grip of these

situations ? why does it seem to situations? why does it seem to be that officials , rather than be that officials, rather than ministers , are calling the shots ministers, are calling the shots after all, it was robert jenrick who began these negotiations suggesting that turkey should be a partner to be able to have a returns agreement with and today, today we learned that it's officials who are saying that can't possibly happen. could ministers simply override these officials ? these officials? >> well , the thing is that this >> well, the thing is that this is what the home office have said, but it does seem to that turkey itself isn't entirely keen to take these people back. and i think it's worth bearing in mind that turkey did come to the aid of the european union back in 2016, when they had that huge migration crisis , ipsis huge migration crisis, ipsis people coming from syria , huge people coming from syria, huge numbers of people , um, coming in numbers of people, um, coming in and the eu did this big deal with turkey, paid them billions and billions of pounds , and and billions of pounds, and turkey already . have 3.6 million

turkey already. have 3.6 million syrian refugees . so in some ways syrian refugees. so in some ways i don't think turkey is that sad to be to be shot of a few of its own people that don't particularly like, um , the particularly like, um, the government. so it's difficult . government. so it's difficult. but the home office is very keen to say, oh, look, this is only one avenue and we're doing lots of other things with turkey . for of other things with turkey. for instance, last august they struck an agreement, um, to work very closely with turkish officials, officials cracking down on the smuggling gangs because in fact, a lot of these dinghy seas that are used to transport people across the channel are, in fact made in turkey. so national crime agency people from here going over there working with the turkish, uh, turkish officials , officials uh, turkish officials, officials there, so that that's what the home office say. but in terms of messaging , home office say. but in terms of messaging, it's a dreadful look, isn't it? again this is another of rishi sunak's plans, and it's going wrong. and we've got the

battle in the house of lords over the safety of rwanda. bill that's going to go for , for many that's going to go for, for many more weeks and then potentially a battle in the courts. no real prospect at the moment, it seems, of stopping the boats as well. >> thank you very much . >> thank you very much. katherine forster gb news political correspondent there now we're still waiting for the judgement for the sentencing of these killers of the 16 year old brianna ghey. >> we will be live at manchester crown court as soon as that starts . but in crown court as soon as that starts. but in the meantime, here are your latest headlines . here are your latest headlines. >> tom, thank you very much. your top stories from the gb newsroom. the two teenagers who murdered brianna ghey have been named as scarlett jenkinson and eddie ratcliffe, the ban on the 16 year olds being identified was lifted ahead of their sentencing , which will bring to sentencing, which will bring to you live here on gb news shortly, prosecutor has told manchester crown court. miss

jenkinson snatched the knife from eddie's hand and stabbed brianna repeatedly. her defence has denied this in victim statements read to the court brianna's family have described both killers as two predators stalking their prey and called them pure evil . a student who them pure evil. a student who ran over and killed her fiance after she lost her temper following an argument between the two, has been sentenced to life in prison . alice wood will life in prison. alice wood will serve a minimum time of 18 years for the murder of ryan watson . for the murder of ryan watson. the 24 year old was found guilty of killing ryan, also 24, following a trial at chester crown court last month . he was crown court last month. he was hit by the ford fiesta . alice hit by the ford fiesta. alice was driving near their home in cheshire, which she had claimed was a tragic accident . rishi was a tragic accident. rishi sunak says foreign criminals should not be allowed to stay in the uk following the manhunt for refugee and sex offender abdul ezedi , the home office is facing ezedi, the home office is facing growing pressure to carry out an urgent review into how ezidi,

the main suspect in this week's chemical attack, was allowed to stay in the uk. the crown prosecution service have confirmed . he previously pleaded confirmed. he previously pleaded guilty to one charge of sexual assault in 2018, and one of indecent exposure . in there are indecent exposure. in there are fresh warnings of potential human rights breaches on the bibby stockholm barge as asylum seekers face what's being described as claustrophobic conditions , the home affairs conditions, the home affairs select committee says cramped living conditions are contributing to a decline in mental for health some residents, the cost of housing asylum claimants on the barge is £120 per person, per night . it £120 per person, per night. it comes as the home office has asked for an emergency £2.6 billion, after spending more than expected on asylum accommodation. in a written statement, james cleverly made the request for a contingencies fund advance . last year, the fund advance. last year, the government spent around £8 million a day for migrant accommodation on, with official figures showing more than 50,000 were housed in hotels as.

meanwhile a potential deal to send migrants back to turkey aimed at stopping small boat crossings seems unlikely to get the go ahead home office officials say turkey isn't safe due to human rights concerns. that's despite it being both a nato ally and a candidate to join the eu . former home join the eu. former home secretary suella braverman has posted on social media saying she's very concerned about the decision , and downing street has decision, and downing street has denied that the potential returns agreement has fallen through . for the latest stories, through. for the latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen or go to gb news. com forward slash alerts

sunday mornings from 930 on gb news news . news news. >> welcome back . it's 238 in the >> welcome back. it's 238 in the afternoon. now we are of course, awaiting the sentencing of the two killers who murdered brianna . i will bring you that as we get it. but joining us now is the former editor at the daily star. dawn neesom and political commentator benjamin butterworth , to go through some of the other around, other top stories around, including, course , the man including, of course, the man abdul azadi, who is on the run now. i'm very concerned about what this says about our asylum system, dawn, that someone like this, a convicted sex offender , this, a convicted sex offender, could go on to be granted asylum in this country is our asylum system actually putting us at

risk at this point? >> i think women and women and girls, it absolutely will. women and children in general. i think it absolutely is. and i was horrified by this story. emily, the fact that he was turned down for asylum twice and then accepted despite having a conviction for a sexual assault , conviction for a sexual assault, he could have been deported. theni he could have been deported. then i think someone should should come forward and accept responsibility for the mess up that that poor woman and those children. just get so angry children. i just get so angry about this. yeah. i mean, the asylum system is completely broken and someone has responsibility . that baby, the responsibility. that baby, the three year old, was pulled out of the car, thrown on the floor, picked up and thrown back down again. this man should not have beenin again. this man should not have been in the country. it's just not human, is it? it's not human. and you know what really annoyed was the fact annoyed me as well was the fact we weren't given description we weren't given a description until it too late. it's like until it was too late. it's like we're looking man. well, we're looking for a man. well, okay, us a clue. and it's okay, give us a clue. and it's like, were not being. were we like, were we not being. were we not being what he looked not being told what he looked like there fear of like because there were fear of racial aggravation whatever? racial aggravation or whatever? i don't care. >> surely most distinctive

>> surely the most distinctive thing could have said is thing they could have said is he's got half a face. well, exactly. but exactly. if you've seen opera, he seen phantom of the opera, he must be covering half of you must be covering half of it. you know, half the face because it's covered mean, it's covered in scars. i mean, it's not going to be hard to spot. >> me laugh at >> you make me laugh at inappropriate moments. >> talking >> benjamin butterworth, talking about the opera. about a phantom of the opera. >> have gone batman >> i would have gone batman exactly.just bizarre. >> it's just bizarre. >> it's just bizarre. >> and also, he's clearly not. >> it's just bizarre. >> .mentionede's clearly not. >> it's just bizarre. >> .mentioned this learly not. >> it's just bizarre. >> .mentioned this earlier, ot. >> it's just bizarre. >> .mentioned this earlier, but you mentioned this earlier, but he's clearly not brain of britain because he went into a major supermarket, which obviously cameras obviously is covered in cameras in know, in every corner. so, you know, it's pretty concerning that they've not managed to track him down. >> but this is the worrying, the idea was asylum idea that he was given asylum when already had conviction. >> i can't even fathom. surely that was a significant bending of existing rules. can't of the existing rules. i can't imagine normal practice. imagine that is normal practice. and if he converted and the fact is, if he converted to christianity by the time of and the fact is, if he converted to (third anity by the time of and the fact is, if he converted to (third applicatione time of and the fact is, if he converted to (third applicatione tirasylum his third application for asylum , that evidently a different , that evidently is a different grounds to one which he grounds to the one on which he made he arrived here in made when he arrived here in 2016. and i'm afraid that just strikes me as dubious. strikes me as rather dubious. but this happens all the time, benjamin. hear people arrive benjamin. we hear people arrive say thing, rejected and

say one thing, get rejected and say one thing, get rejected and say a different thing. perhaps try three or 4 or 5 times until they finally get accepted. and we've got such a higher acceptance rate of refugees than many continental european countries . frankly. do we need countries. frankly. do we need to toughen up? i mean, in a way, i don't blame the individuals because they are desperate and they want any chance of a better life. but i do think that you know, you have to take into account the reason they give when they arrive for here the first time is probably the genuine reason. and if that fails , unless it is something, fails, unless it is something, for example, you know, a lot of these come from very these people come from very homophobic and maybe homophobic countries, and maybe they about being 93v- 9331- >> and there's evidence that's true. the other comment, there might where might be circumstances where that's might be circumstances where tha or example, country >> or for example, the country they're have they're coming from might have got, a much worse state got, uh, into a much worse state where the level of danger has got worse. >> but idea that you convert >> but the idea that you convert to christianity and therefore can't what, eight years can't go back, what, eight years he'd been here by now, it just strikes me as pretty soft. >> it does feel like dawn that we deport anyone

we can't deport anyone regardless of whether a regardless of whether they're a criminal not. it is crazy and criminal or not. it is crazy and i do understand how i do not understand how a convicted sex attacker gets asylum. >> and as for converting to christianity, this is a second time it's happened. remember the maternity hospital? >> the second time that a criminal has been proven? i'm sure it's happened many times. more times? >> absolutely. he claimed that he couldn't be sent back because he'd developed. he become christian. he was now a christian, so he could not be sent back. and you know, the gay excuse is the other excuse. >> yeah. it's just just outrageous. >> reminds me lot of people >> reminds me a lot of people who, kids ten who, when the kids get to ten years old they need to get years old and they need to get into the good school, they suddenly become catholics. >> you know, all very >> you know, it's all very convenient found this >> you know, it's all very convethat: found this >> you know, it's all very convethat meant found this >> you know, it's all very convethat meant he)und this >> you know, it's all very convethat meant he couldn't go thing that meant he couldn't go back afghanistan because he back to afghanistan because he was afghanistan. was from afghanistan. >> of course, if you >> varne. and of course, if you are christian and in afghanistan, is that afghanistan, the claim is that he been persecuted. he would have been persecuted. there this us to there and this brings us on to something else we were something else that we were discussing, which is the returns deal with turkey. yes that does not it's going to be not look like it's going to be happening did ask the happening now. we did ask the home minister, tim

home office minister, tim loughton earlier about all loughton mp, earlier about all this. he didn't seem to know the detail yet because this just came this morning. um, but came out this morning. um, but does raise the question of, well, if turkey's not safe, then can we return people? we can't really return people anywhere besides western nations, other countries do seem to be able to return people. >> why is it such a problem in this country? frankly, why has the eu got a returns agreement with turkey? >> although it's not a perfect returns agreement, many eu countries are complaining that it's juddery shoddy and it's juddery and shoddy and doesn't and whatever. but doesn't work and whatever. but the principle of having one is okay for the eu. but not okay for the british legal system for the home office. >> this is the problem. it's okay for some countries, but not us. our our standards. us. it's us. our our standards. >> just too high. >> just too high. >> our standards are just too low. we need to be tougher. >> but i think this idea that turkey is a safe country is a bit simplistic, because sure, it's safe to go on holiday. it's going to be safe for most people

in turkey who aren't politically active in a particular way. it's probably absolutely fine for tens millions people tens of millions of people in that if you're somebody that way. but if you're somebody who is a political dissident , we who is a political dissident, we know that there is a very dark recent history of torture in prisons , of people being prisons, of people being tortured and criminalised for having political views. >> benjamin. that's all true. i'm sure they're ranked 148. >> i can't have a returns deal because you could take specific cases as and have a right to appeal. >> but why does that mean in principle , we can't have a principle, we can't have a returns deal? because if there are people that are in that political category, we sending them back is going to cause a serious risk. >> and that is different to the vast majority of people who go with know, they've with turkey. you know, they've closed down ngos. they've kicked out politicians. they're out elected politicians. they're one freedom out elected politicians. they're on press freedom out elected politicians. they're on press in freedom out elected politicians. they're on press in the freedom out elected politicians. they're on press in the world. freedom out elected politicians. they're on press in the world. it's freedom out elected politicians. they're on press in the world. it's not dom of press in the world. it's not the country. the safest country. >> complete agree, not >> it's a complete agree, not the safest country. however whether it's a nato ally , it's whether it's a nato ally, it's a member of the echr on that. it's a member of the echr. member of the echr on that. it's

a member of the echr . it's an eu a member of the echr. it's an eu candidate country . frankly, if candidate country. frankly, if turkey becomes a country that is not safe in this general sense, what other countries aren't? i mean, we're basically precluding most of the world as being places that we could send people back to. yeah. >> i mean, frankly, the fact that i don't think it ever will join the eu, not any time soon, that's the kind of lie that people like you put when we had the referendum. it's a fact. the eu referendum. it's a fact. >> it's an eu candidate country. >> it's an eu candidate country. >> no, he was just banging on about regulations. just not about regulations. it's just not going to happen. >> you know, i think >> but look you know, i think the if it were the eu and britain, if it were still in it, god forbid, you know, got hoping uh, should put pressure on countries like turkey say you don't turkey to say that if you don't clear these issues, then you clear up these issues, then you can never get in. but the fact is, in the past of eight is, in the past sort of eight years, turkey has gone backwards in of its rights in terms of its human rights treatment, of treatment, which is one of the reasons i think it's very reasons why i think it's very unlikely to get into the eu doesn't that there shouldn't. >> there couldn't be a default, that you come illegally that if you come illegally from turkey, returned to turkey. >> the bottom line with this

emily, need to do emily, is we need to do something. we saw last night something. as we saw last night in this going to in clapham, this is going to start, hate to say, but start, i hate to say, but i think this is going to start happening more and more because we who is coming over we don't know who is coming over here. don't what their here. we don't know what their backgrounds need to backgrounds are and we need to sort out asylum sort out this asylum system before there more and more before there are more and more injuries more like that injuries and more like that awful that and benjamin. >> this is a point that robert jenrick, the former immigration immigration minister, this immigration minister, made this morning, that this is the distinction and distinction between illegal and legal claims of asylum , legal legal claims of asylum, legal migration versus illegal migration. for example, if we take people directly from , um, take people directly from, um, refugee camps in the middle east, as we have done and as we have a proud tradition of doing, if we take people directly from ukraine directly from hong kong, directly from afghanistan, ukraine directly from hong kong, directwhoym afghanistan, ukraine directly from hong kong, direct who they ghanistan, ukraine directly from hong kong, direct who they are. listan, ukraine directly from hong kong, direct who they are. iftan, ukraine directly from hong kong, direct who they are. if we take know who they are. if we take people who've arrived on boats, who've thrown their documents overboard, we don't know if they've criminal they've got criminal convictions. if convictions. we don't know if they're the kind of person who would a baby the floor would throw a baby on the floor or chuck acid in someone's face, but you don't really know those things coming from but you don't really know those

thinaforementioned coming from but you don't really know those thin aforementioned country, from but you don't really know those thin aforementioned country, tom the aforementioned country, to be and actually, the be honest. and actually, the problem incentivise problem is that you incentivise some of these people to throw away their official documents to claim maybe they're from another country, because there is a lack of legal routes . you know, there of legal routes. you know, there are many countries. i swear it was tim lawton when not a minister who pointed this out. who, whom? there is not who, who for whom? there is not a legal way to get into this country, be it doesn't matter how they will how they arrive here, they will be you know, if you be illegal. you know, if you came on a plane from some of these after couple these countries, after a couple of months, would of months, you would automatically illegal automatically be an illegal immigrant. we don't create immigrant. so if we don't create the legal routes, why we the legal routes, why should we expect them not to lie? we create i the create that problem. i think the problem problem as problem there is one problem as well in how we talk about all this, because there are very worthy to on the, worthy people tend to be on the, on left of, of politics who on the left of, of politics who say not all asylum seekers, as on the left of, of politics who say know,l asylum seekers, as on the left of, of politics who say know, don't. m seekers, as you know, don't. >> is a dog whistle. not >> this is a dog whistle. not all asylum seekers are coming here to anyone or go. and here to harm anyone or go. and of not. course, of of course not. of course, of course we can't have course not. but we can't have such holes in our system that mean that someone who commits a crime in this country, not

elsewhere in this country, can be granted asylum. and this is i mean, it is just crazy. >> this is the problem, emily. it's. we are now being frightened , especially women. frightened, especially women. we're frightened to speak out because you're accused of tarring all as well. >> i'm going to interrupt you. the sentencing of brianna ghey killers has just started taking place at manchester crown court , place at manchester crown court, and in turn , and may never be and in turn, and may never be released . released. >> but you are very young and it can only be hoped that you will work hard at your rehabilitation and overcome what caused you to kill , so that and overcome what caused you to kill, so that you can be released one day before your i pass sentence, i need to explain how i have decided on the minimum terms. how i have decided on the minimum terms . it will take minimum terms. it will take a while to explain everything . you while to explain everything. you may not take it all in straight away , but as soon as i finish away, but as soon as i finish sentencing you, i will give your legal team's written copies so that they and your

intermediaries can explain anything you have missed out . anything you have missed out. rihanna was only 16 years old when she was killed. she had her whole life ahead of her. brianna had some struggles that made her vulnerable , but she was vulnerable, but she was supported by a loving family who wanted nothing but the best for her. sadly, no one will ever know what she would have achieved in her life , even achieved in her life, even though her life was so short. she made an impact. her family remember her for her laughter, for being full of life and as a good listener . their loss is good listener. their loss is unimaginable. but they have bravely and movingly painted a picture of brianna in the statements read today . they have statements read today. they have my deepest sympathy , she , my deepest sympathy, she, scarlett and eddie, you had been

good friends from when you were 11. you were 15 when you killed you. scarlett met brianna when you. scarlett met brianna when you moved school . in october you moved school. in october 2022. you got to know brianna and she believed you were her friend . and brianna suffered friend. and brianna suffered anxiety and was nervous about going out. but on the 11th of february last year , you got her february last year, you got her to meet you in linear park for all her fears, she could not possibly have known you were a danger to her. but you two had been plotting to kill her and did so that afternoon . i do not did so that afternoon. i do not want to dwell on the murder itself, but it was brutal. all the injuries inflicted with the knife eddie had bought a few weeks earlier were awful. there were 28 deep stab wounds to the head , neck, chest and back , some

head, neck, chest and back, some causing bony damage . showing causing bony damage. showing considerable force was used there were also other injuries not themselves fatal, but inflicted while brianna was still alive . defensive injuries still alive. defensive injuries to the arms show that she had. she had tried to defend herself. one wound passed right through the upper arm and another left the upper arm and another left the wrist gaping open. there were other lesser stab wounds and cuts taken together. the injuries point to a sustained and very violent assault , but and very violent assault, but sadly brianna cannot have lost consciousness immediately, and she must have been aware she was being attacked at murdering brianna was a joint plan which you carried out together. both of you told lies to the jury , of you told lies to the jury, which they rejected . scarlett

which they rejected. scarlett you make up stories. which they rejected. scarlett you make up stories . you blur you make up stories. you blur the lines between fantasy and real life . when doctor church real life. when doctor church saw you to prepare a report for today's purposes, you told him that eddie had thrown brianna to the floor and stabbed her 3 or 4 times, then panicked and said he did not want to kill her. so you snatched the knife off him and did it yourself . you have did it yourself. you have repeated similar accounts to others, but with variations . others, but with variations. todayi others, but with variations. today i am now told that you say eddie inflicted most of the wounds, but you admit enjoying your part in the murder. the untested new account scarlett has given since trial. do not change my view of the evidence at trial, which is what i base my findings of fact on. it is simply impossible to believe any account scarlett gives . i am account scarlett gives. i am certain that at least some of

the wounds were inflicted by you, eddie . you had blood on you, eddie. you had blood on your clothing , you, eddie. you had blood on your clothing, as would be expected if you stabbed brianna while she was already bleeding . while she was already bleeding. scarlett's jacket did not appear to have brianna's blood on in her pre—sentence report. she tried to explain that by saying it had been washed, but other evidence suggests otherwise . evidence suggests otherwise. there was conflicting expert forensic evidence . i had the forensic evidence. i had the chance to assess that evidence. ihave chance to assess that evidence. i have weighed it carefully alongside the other available evidence in including the messages that show that you, eddie, were planning to stab brianna with your knife . beyond brianna with your knife. beyond being sure eddie inflicted some of the wounds, i cannot be sure precisely who did what, but that does not matter for today's purposes, i sentence you on the bafis purposes, i sentence you on the basis that both of you played a full part in killing brianna, and both intended she should die

. i must follow the principles in schedule 21 of the sentencing act 2020. me with reference also to the guidelines for sentencing children and young people and those with mental and developmental disorders . i have developmental disorders. i have treated each of you as individuals . i have thought individuals. i have thought about all the evidence i heard dunng about all the evidence i heard during the trial and the many reports i have read about you . reports i have read about you. this case is unusual and it has shocked the public. i have thought very carefully about the features that are relevant to sentencing . one of the most sentencing. one of the most important features is your age. the law recognises that children and young people are to be treated differently from adults . treated differently from adults. the minimum terms that i will impose on each of you will be much shorter than that which an aduu much shorter than that which an adult would receive . the adult would receive. the messages you exchanged,

exchanged and the contents of the notebooks found in scarlett's bedroom show a clear plan to kill brianna and other people, and provide insight into your minds before reaching any conclusions . i have taken conclusions. i have taken account of all the evidence in dividual. messages cannot be viewed in isolation or out of context , but the findings viewed in isolation or out of context, but the findings i make are those i am sure of you. scarlett introduced the idea of killing people . at first this killing people. at first this was fantasy , but it developed was fantasy, but it developed into something real. by january 2023, you had a real desire to kill someone in which you shared with eddie , asking him to help . with eddie, asking him to help. you had a list of people you wanted to kill , mostly people wanted to kill, mostly people you did not like . you did like you did not like. you did like brianna, though you were drawn to her. you thought she was

different and interesting . you different and interesting. you mentioned brianna to eddie and told him she was transgender . told him she was transgender. you talked of wanting to kill her. you tried to poison her by getting her to take ibuprofen tablets , which made her ill. you tablets, which made her ill. you made a plan to kill a boy in linear park by slashing his throat and stabbing him , but he throat and stabbing him, but he did not respond to messages . so did not respond to messages. so he used that plan for brianna . he used that plan for brianna. you knew she was vulnerable and needed friendship. you abused that. you were going to kill brianna on the 28th of january, but her plans changed and she could not come. you made a new plan for the 11th of february, the day of the murder . your the day of the murder. your motivation, scarlett , was to act motivation, scarlett, was to act out your fantasies . the messages out your fantasies. the messages show you wanted to make a real victim feel pain and fear. show you wanted to make a real victim feel pain and fear . when victim feel pain and fear. when brianna did not come on the 28th

of january, you told eddie that you wanted her to die really badly and that you wanted to see the pure horror on her face and hear her scream in pain . you hear her scream in pain. you suggested you wanted to keep some body parts , like a piece of some body parts, like a piece of flesh and an eyeball . two days flesh and an eyeball. two days before the murder , you said you before the murder, you said you were excited . afterwards, you were excited. afterwards, you sent messages to people drawing attention to the murder . you attention to the murder. you told doctor church that you were excited during the murder and that you found it satisfying . that you found it satisfying. brianna's injuries show that she was killed with exceptional brutality and the knife was used to inflict far more damage than needed to cause death . you, needed to cause death. you, eddie, did not show the same interest in killing as scarlett did, or at least i cannot be sure you did . did, or at least i cannot be sure you did. in some did, or at least i cannot be sure you did . in some earlier sure you did. in some earlier messages , you tried to encourage messages, you tried to encourage scarlett to think about other

things, but as scarlett fantasies developed into real plans , as you gave support and plans, as you gave support and encouragement to her, the evidence shows that you were good friends and that you were able to question scarlett and to say no to helping. when it did not suit you . in some ways, not suit you. in some ways, scarlett looked up to you. she saw you as cleverer than her. you saw her as someone who could help you socially , particularly help you socially, particularly talking to the girl you liked . talking to the girl you liked. you seem to have seen scarlett's plans as a project. you were happy to help carry out the plans when you had nothing better to do . you were not better to do. you were not involved in the first effort to kill brianna by giving her tablets, but when scarlett told you about that , you quickly you about that, you quickly offered suggestions about other ways to poison her. scarlett was not the only friend you exchanged messages about death and killing with, you added

details to scarlett's plans , details to scarlett's plans, including the use of code words for when the attack was to start at the day before brianna's murder. you asked scarlett. have you asked it if it can go out tomorrow so we don't repeat last time? so suggesting you also wanted the plan to be carried through so it would, in my judgement, be wholly wrong to treat you as being under scarlett's control . i also scarlett's control. i also reject the idea that you only helped so scarlett would help with your approaches to the girl . on the other hand, i acknowledge that you were not the driving force behind the plan to kill brianna. the driving force behind the plan to kill brianna . scarlett plan to kill brianna. scarlett was in your untruthful account to the police, repeated at trial . you suggested scarlett's motive related to her boyfriend , motive related to her boyfriend, and this was part of your attempt to distance yourself from the killing altogether ,

from the killing altogether, something the jury rejected . i something the jury rejected. i reject your evidence and instead look to the evidence in the messages written at the time . messages written at the time. when considering your motives , when considering your motives, there is insufficient evidence to find that you, eddie, were personally motivated by any sadistic desires . there is some sadistic desires. there is some evidence that you were upset after the killing , but you knew after the killing, but you knew scarlett enjoyed the thought of causing pain and fear in some messaging. you even encouraged that , such as messaging. you even encouraged that, such as suggesting she could derive pleasure from watching someone die by hanging . watching someone die by hanging. you did not know brianna . you you did not know brianna. you knew only what scarlett told you, she said. brianna was transgender and sent you pictures of her. your messages . pictures of her. your messages. about brianna were transphobic . about brianna were transphobic. you consistently referred to her in a way that was dehumanising, calling her it. you also

described her as a femboy