gb news. >> good evening. the government says we're going to need new gas fired power stations . otherwise, fired power stations. otherwise, the lights are going to go out. gosh, who knew? the home affairs select committee hears today about a conveyor belt of people crossing the english channel and converting to christianity so that they can stay. it's a level of abuse that is almost unbelievable. and a backbench conservative member of parliament suggests that the work shy those that are refused three jobs, should be conscripted and put into the army for two years. well, it's an idea, but does it have any chance of flying at all? well, before all of that, let's get the news with sophia wenzler. >> nigel. thank you. at 7:00, i'm sophia wenzler in the gb newsroom. your top story this

hour. newsroom. your top story this hour . a newsroom. your top story this hour. a spokesman for the prime minister has said comments allegedly made by a tory donor about diane abbott were racist and wrong, but he was greatly to apologise for causing offence. it comes as the police are understood to have been contacted over the frank hester's alleged remarks. the conservative party's biggest donor reportedly said miss abbott made him want to hate all black women and she should be shot. mr hs2 has now apologised and says he abhors racism. miss abbott, who's now an independent mp, described the comments as frightening and worrying . lee frightening and worrying. lee anderson made his first appearance in the commons this afternoon since defecting to reform uk. he took his seat on the opposition benches next to george galloway. mr anderson was stripped of the conservative whip last month after refusing to apologise for saying islamists had got control of the london mayor children in england who identify as trans will no longer be prescribed puberty

blockers . the government said it blockers. the government said it welcomed the landmark decision, which they say is in the best interests of children. puberty blockers , which pause physical blockers, which pause physical changes in young people, will now only be available to children as part of clinical research trials . in other news, research trials. in other news, social media influencer andrew tate insisted that he's innocent of the charges laid against him as he was released from custody in romania this afternoon . a in romania this afternoon. a court in bucharest ruled that he can be extradited back to the uk to face charges once his trial in romania ends. he was arrested after lawyers representing four of his accusers told british police that he was planning to flee romania, where he and his brother tristan now live. they're accused of sexual offences and human trafficking allegations they've both denied . allegations they've both denied. speaking after his release from custody, andrew tate said western countries were run by satanists. >> i want to give absolute credit to romanian justice for making the correct decision today. unfortunately, i don't think many people in romania

understand, but in the west and the countries that are owned by the countries that are owned by the satanists, get to a the satanists, we get to a certain level of fame. you either on dress or you go either put on a dress or you go to jail. and i'm happy to make my choice, which is jail every single my soul is for not single time. my soul is for not sale, neither are my principles. we men know we're we are innocent men know we're very men, and in time, very innocent men, and in time, everybody's going see that. everybody's going to see that. and very excited to finish and we're very excited to finish this process clear this judicial process and clear our names. >> power plants will >> and new gas power plants will be to protect britain's be built to protect britain's energy security. despite concerns potential concerns over the potential impact change, the impact on climate change, the government says stations government says the new stations are needed avert what are needed to avert what ministers described as a genuine prospect and prospect of blackouts and provide backup for the growing provide a backup for the growing electric economy. it's understood they're replacing existing facilities, many of which are old and due to be retired . the prime minister retired. the prime minister insists the uk's net zero plan is still on track, but says it must be met in a sustainable way . and for the latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen, or go to gb news. com slash alerts. now it's back to .

nigel. >> the government is very proud of the fact that we have cut our c02 emissions more than any other country in the world. they're down by almost 50% since 1990. in fact , some claim that 1990. in fact, some claim that our c02 emissions are now the lowest they've been since the middle late industrial revolution . but of course, all revolution. but of course, all of that has come at a massive cost. we've lost huge chunks of our manufacturing industry and effectively what we've done is we've exported the c02 emissions to other countries who manufacture goods. they now sell to us. but the other side of the equation, of course, is energy . equation, of course, is energy. so we wake up today to the news that the government is going to need to build a significant number of new gas fired power stations . means otherwise are stations. means otherwise are reliance wind and solar could reliance on wind and solar could mean the lights going out. well who knew? i wonder , have you who knew? i wonder, have you ever heard that before on this

programme? well, i tell you what, if you've seen me chatting with clive moffatt, former government energy adviser on energy security, have energy security, you'd have heard times. well heard it a dozen times. well clive, welcome back to the program. you . so just program. thank you. so just looking at all of this, and i, i read some of the figures that electricity usage is due to rise by 50% between now and 35. as we as we move to more evs, whether we do or don't is a separate issue, that the amount of wind energy we've got under this government's plans has to triple by 2035. and yet, of course, as you've said all along, overreliance on renewables doesn't always work, does it? >> no, no, no it doesn't . i >> no, no, no it doesn't. i think today's announcement is long overdue and is a recognition , finally, that recognition, finally, that natural gas has a critical role to play in the provision of both heat and power in the foreseeable future. and the government are being forced into that situation by the stark

realities of the fact that the planned increase in offshore wind will not materialise from 156w to 50 wind will not materialise from 15gw to 50 gigawatt by 2035, and that the nuclear provision of power, which is 15, will decline to six as the retirement of the existing fleet goes underway and the hinckley . so even if be the hinckley. so even if be delayed even further, if it ever happens. >> that's the point, isn't it? even if we say, right, that's it, we're going nuclear, we're really going to do it by 2035. none of this will be on stream, would it? >> no, no. i think it's becoming increasingly apparent to government target, government that that target, they were she was the they they were she was the minister was at pains today to say this hasn't distracted us from our net zero target. but the reality is has it means it is in effect a cancellation of the intention to decarbonise the electricity system by 2035 and that it electricity system by 2035 and thatitis electricity system by 2035 and that it is not possible . it's

that it is not possible. it's neither feasible nor is it affordable. labour's target of 2030. >> i was going to come to that. so labour are promising to decarbonise the electricity market by 2030. yeah. is that simply impossible ? simply impossible? >> gmb union, who used to be one of the founder members of my energy security group in 2017, have said that it's impossible and there is a just distinction , and there is a just distinction, distinct difference of opinion within the labour party about what exactly can be done by 2030 and what can't be done. we are short of detail, nigel. >> we're short of detail. but here's the funny thing, clive. you know, we have two parties, one in government, one in opposition . at least that's what opposition. at least that's what we used to call it, 120 odd points ahead in the polls and looking likely to win the next election. and yet, actually, other than the timelines of 2030 or 2035, you correct me if i'm wrong, please. but it seems to

me their stance is almost identical . identical. >> yes, that i can't see at the moment , and >> yes, that i can't see at the moment, and i've been heavily involved in it in the last. certainly the last three months. i've written briefing papers, both for government and also for the select committee, which has both representatives from both sides and, and everybody in principle agrees with me that there is a for case actually investigating more closely whether there is feasibility and affordability associated with those targets . but i feel those targets. but i feel there's been a conspiracy of silence descended upon us in the case of this , net zero target in case of this, net zero target in that both parties don't want to be seen to be in public, to be contradicting the fact that it might not be achievable in the time scales prescribed. and that was also a silence about exactly what the costs will be and who will pay those costs. >> correct. which ultimately always has to be the taxpayer, doesn't it?

>> yeah. and i think that the it's we're talking here about the only way it can be funded. i mean the fact that labour basically rescinded its objective to spend £28 billion on green technologies . it's on green technologies. it's a drop in the ocean, nigel, compared to the actual cost of de—carbonising, the electricity system. and yet labour maintained the latter target and forsook forsook, you know, gave up the first target. but very few of them in the main media picked up on the fact that they're still persisting with they're still persisting with the idea they can achieve a 2030. and the tories are basically saying that they can achieve the 2035. there's there is seriously three issues why this isn't going to happen one, there will be not be enough wind capacity. they can't get from 15 gig to 50 gig by 2035 or 2030. it's simply not going to happen even if you give them, as they did last week. give offshore

developers an extra billion pounds more subsidy in contract payments fee payments . even payments and fee payments. even if you did achieve that target of capacity for offshore wind, you've still got the intermittency problem. whereas we've got 30 gigawatt of wind at the moment. but there are times when it's only operating 4% of the time in terms of contributing. so you have that, if you like makeup to , to, to be if you like makeup to, to, to be made up. the nuclear issue is again , again, something which again, again, something which people don't want to get into the detail on, but it's clearly not going to happen. >> but again, both again, both parties agree in principle. exactly. now ofgem the regulator you you've you know i know you've criticised them quite a lot in the they did yesterday the past. they did yesterday actually for the first time say realistically have to be realistically we have to be careful about the cost being pushed on consumers. pushed on to consumers. >> beginning to dawn on >> it's beginning to dawn on ofgem, that in fact ofgem, finally, that in fact there will be. it's interesting that the price of gas has fallen from £5 a firm in 2022 to £0.60 last week, and yet ofgem are saying we're going to have to

have slow, steady and probably firmer electricity prices . and firmer electricity prices. and you have to ask yourself, well, what's driving that concern ? what's driving that concern? well, it's two reasons. one is that the ofgem have increasingly, since the embarrassment of losing consumers, billions of pounds in bailouts for suppliers has gone over a way out of its way to ensure that suppliers balance sheets are liquid. and so you've had compensation for late you know, delayed payments, non payments. and now increasingly in the last press release that came out a realisation from ofgem, the electricity prices will rise . and the reason for will rise. and the reason for the root cause of that is decarbonisation costs and the levies that will have to be paid increased, both in terms of standing charges to fund networks and also build usage charges to fund the billion poundsi charges to fund the billion pounds i was referring to fund offshore wind . offshore wind. >> clive moffatt, as ever, thank you for coming in and folks , you you for coming in and folks, you know, this is the point. we're

not having a proper, full, honest debate on this vital issue. that's why i love clive coming in. you can agree with clive, disagree with clive , but clive, disagree with clive, but at least what we're doing here on gb news is trying to have a proper debate, and i'm absolutely certain that those targets of 2030 for labour and 2035 of the conservatives simply cannot be met. now, there was a piece appeared in the daily express last night online, backed up by the home affairs select committee today, and i guess it was the abdul ezedi alkali attack in clapham that kind of brought this issue back to the fore. he was somebody, remember, who pretended to convert to christianity, having come into this country illegally and was then allowed to stay. but remarkably, one of the witnesses this morning, the reverend matthew firth, described to the committee a conveyor belt and veritable industry of asylum, baptisms. well gb news home and security

editor mark white joins me. mark, i think it was the clapham incident that got us talking about this again, but give us some idea of the scale of people who claim they're gay or claim they've converted to christianity . christianity. >> well, we suspected for some time, nigel, that this was a significant and growing problem. remember we spoke back in 2021, at the time when emad al—qarawiyyin, the suicide bomber who tried to blow up the liverpool maternity hospital, luckily only killed himself in that particular bombing. but remember, he had also applied and become a christian in an effort to try to, enhance his ability to stay in the country through the various, attempts he made to try and stay in the uk. and of course, he was allowed to stay or he was. they tried to get rid of him, but never did. right up until the moment he blew that device up outside this

hospital. and then just very recently, we've got the bibby stockholm barge with reports that 43 of the residents there all asylum seekers, have tried our currently attempting to convert to christianity as well. so we understood it to be a significant and growing problem. today we have heard from a member of the clergy who was there at a parish in darlington for two years, and he saw this up close. he said that every few weeks, 6 to 7 young asylum seekers were taken to his church by someone he described as a fixer , to try to get the church fixer, to try to get the church to convert them to baptism. he obviously smelt a rat, he said that what he did then was to try to intervene , to try to halt to intervene, to try to halt this process. this is what he told the home affairs committee. >> i honoured the baptisms that were all the baptism requests that were already in the system, but then you spot a pattern and

then you think, hang on, there's something going on here. and then you, you try to press a pause button, which is to make sure that people are requested to come to church and start getting involved and attending church regularly and events and so on. and at. and that was the thing that kind of made the numbers fall off a cliff in a sense, because those people kind of melted away, really . of melted away, really. >> well, the committee also heard from some other leading figures within the christian church , in the christian faith church, in the christian faith in the uk today , including the in the uk today, including the bishop of chelmsford. now, the good bishop tried to suggest that if there was any kind of increase in the number of asylum seekers who were trying to claim or convert to christianity , then or convert to christianity, then perhaps it was down to what she described as the increasingly hostile environment for asylum seekers, and that the church, in

contrast to that, offered a warm welcome. but she said in her answer to the committee that she didn't recognise this claim by the reverend firth off a conveyor belt of conversions to christianity. this is what she said. >> you know , our churches >> you know, our churches respond to, to local need. however it presents itself. that's a totally separate issue to saying that we are kind of quickly and easily and freely baptising large numbers in order to scam the asylum process. i think that the notion that the church of england is currently being a conveyor belt for baptisms in order for people to gain their asylum status , i gain their asylum status, i don't recognise that comment . don't recognise that comment. >> and nigel, as shocking as the evidence was from reverend firth in terms of what he encountered dunng in terms of what he encountered during his time at that parish church in darlington. i think for me , one of the biggest

for me, one of the biggest surprises of the afternoon was the admission from the immigration minister, tom pursglove, who was also giving evidence to this committee that the home office has no idea how many asylum seekers have ever converted to christianity or are currently have converted to christianity . this currently have converted to christianity. this is what he told the committee. >> we are actively working to improve the data set that we have around this issue. so one of the challenges is that the legacy it systems that we have been working on do not capture data in this area very effectively. the home secretary and i have been very clear in asking officials that we want to see greater itemised data in that area , and we are currently that area, and we are currently working through publication around that. and i think that you're absolutely right to touch on the data point. i think all of us want to see an improvement in terms of the quality of data that we have around decision making in the asylum space. >> so they claimed that legacy

issues mean that they can't really give us any indication of how many past asylum seekers have converted to christianity , have converted to christianity, but we know that there are still, what at least 130,000 asylum seekers in the system waiting on a decision. surely the home office can, as a matter of urgency, check and determine how many of those asylum seekers have switched from the faith of islam to christianity . islam to christianity. >> mark white, thank you very much indeed for that. and i have to say, folks, i don't know how you feel at home watching that or listening in your cars, but what a complete and utter joke. what a complete and utterjoke. the minister hasn't got a clue. the minister hasn't got a clue. the home office haven't got a clue. they've no statistics whatsoever . and even when we whatsoever. and even when we get, you know, somebody coming forward, a priest coming forward and explaining how this conveyor belt works, we get some naive bishop from essex on, you know, who doesn't recognise it, doesn't understand it. and it is

the naivety not just of the church of england. it's happened in the baptist church and in some cases in the catholic church as well. don't they understand that in the religion of islam, leaving it to join christianity is called apostasy, andifs christianity is called apostasy, and it's considered to be a terrible, terrible sin? i would bet very, very few of these so—called conversions are genuine. very, very few indeed . genuine. very, very few indeed. in a moment, yet another new plan to release prisoners early. but does any of this actually work and make our streets safer

? you would 7 you would have ? you would have thought. with an exploding population and therefore , logically more therefore, logically more criminals, that the answer would to be invest and build more prisons. but no. and this story

is one we've heard before. but it's back again. the idea that prisoners could be released up to two months early to prevent overcrowding. i wonder, does that actually make any sense at all? well, i'm going to ask mark first, national chairman of the pfison first, national chairman of the prison officers association . prison officers association. mark, i know and understand that conditions in many of our prisons are truly awful. i'm also told by prison officers that morale in your service is perhaps not as good as it could be, but tell me, does it really make sense to keep reducing sentences just because we haven't got enough prison places ? >> well, this 7 >> well, this is exam 7 >> well, this is a situation, nigel, that was both predictable and preventable. their own advisers three years ago told them that they didn't have enough spaces to satisfy demand in the future. so they could have reacted years ago to prevent this. since this government came to power, they've closed over 20 public sector jails and built only six. so it's entirely on their watch

that this crisis is now a tipping point. and some people have said by easter will be full. well, i think that's really optimistic. by the end of next week, the adult close male estate will have no spaces left and no spaces left. >> overcrowded prisons tends to mean prisoners loitering for long periods of time, not being given constructive things to do. and we had our widikum in the other week. former prisons minister, and she said that inactive prisoners are less likely to reform or to learn something and to go back out as better members of society. >> well, that's correct. and a prime example is ones where prison, which is built to hold just over 970 prisoners, which is currently housing over 1600. so a prison that's built to house 900, built to house 900 prisoners with activity spaces to cater for them. when you've

got nearly double that, what hopeis got nearly double that, what hope is there for rehabilitation? and prisoners get frustrated? and who bears the brunt of their frustrations and anger and boredom ? the staff and anger and boredom? the staff on the front line. so it is a boiling point. it is a tipping point. it is something that the government need to put right, and they need to look at not only centres and policy, but freeing up spaces for people who really could be released back into society. so, for example , into society. so, for example, we currently have about 3000 prisoners serving ipp sentences, some who are ten and 15 years over their tariff, their release date, but not all the danger to society. why can't we free up spaces there and release? some of them may be on their home, detention, curfew type thing with an ankle tag. you know, we've got a lot of people who are serving sentences for ridiculous things like non—payment of fines or not paying non—payment of fines or not paying your licence. yeah. paying your tv licence. yeah. could give them a could we not give them a community sentences? yes. £47,000 a year. nigel, to keep someone in prison . and we're someone in prison. and we're sending him to prison for not

paying sending him to prison for not paying fines or not buying a tv licence . licence. >> yeah. no, i agree with that completely. and as as the completely. and as far as the bbc concerned, it's bbc tax is concerned, it's mostly course, mostly women, of course, who finish up in prison for this and not men. and i with you. not men. and i agree with you. there are areas like that that are clearly ridiculous , but is are clearly ridiculous, but is there not? also, mark fairhurst, an argument that says we actually need to build newer, modern prisons ? modern prisons? >> well, the problem with building new modern prisons is when you build a prison, you always fill it. and nine times out of ten the, you know, the majority of prisons go to the private sector to run for profit . now, we disagree with that. we've got members in the private sector , and we look after them sector, and we look after them the best we can, and we have positive relationships with the private if the you private sector. but if the you know, the state incarcerate know, if the state incarcerate someone, the should be someone, the state should be responsible to look after them. can we not look at sentencing policy ? can we not do things policy? can we not do things better? it's good that alex chalk, who i've got sympathy for, by the way, he inherited this mess. he didn't create it.

it's good he said there's it's good that he said there's a presumption on sentences of 12 months or less where he's encouraging judges not to put people into prison, who are sentenced to 12 months. but the pubuc sentenced to 12 months. but the public have got to be confident that they are serving robust community sentences with the correct supervision. and as you know, nigel, it's not just the prison service which is under pressure, it's the probation service which are overworked and understaffed as well. and we're relying on them now to not only supervise these new releases in our communities, but relying on them to process the release and do the risk assessments. so i'm hoping it's not a rush job and the public is not put at risk. >> well, mark, first, thank you for giving us your frank views and, you know, i completely understand everything mark is saying. remember, folks saying. but also remember, folks , we're even decriminalising effectively things like shoplifting . we have a problem shoplifting. we have a problem now staying with the law and order theme. andrew and christian tate, who of course have been in romania, may well now be extradited to the uk on

charges of rape and human trafficking. and this is all happened because the british government has issued to romania to a european arrest warrant. karen todner, human rights and extradition lawyer, joins me. karen, i'm just a bit confused about one thing. the european arrest warrant came through our membership of the european union. so clearly we're still part of quite a lot of eu architecture , this warrant is architecture, this warrant is actually issued under the trade and cooperation agreement, which is still part of the extradition act, but it's not actually a european arrest warrant under the old system . but the reality the old system. but the reality is, yeah, okay. really not changed very much since brexit. >> okay. i mean extradition of course existed with some countries going back for many, many years. so what is tell us what it actually means in practical terms. the british government say we want these guys government say we want these guys to come back to the uk to face charges, although they also face charges, although they also

face charges, although they also face charges, don't they? in romania as well. i mean, is it now is it now because it was part of our brexit agreement? is it now law that the romanians have to do this, or do they have the choice as to what to do , the choice as to what to do, essentially it's law. there's very little that can be done to object to an extradition request to the united kingdom, despite what was been said earlier, our prison conditions in europe are considered to be very good. our judicial system is considered to be very good, i think the thing to remember about this particular, matter today is that the tate brothers will not be coming back to the uk any time soon. the domestic proceedings in romania take precedent, and they they will have to be completely exhausted before any extradition will take place. >> okay. so that's that really that's really what matters. so they will have to go through and face the charges they're facing in romania first. so frankly, the chances of them coming back

to the united kingdom, realistically it's going to be a year or two, isn't it, if not more. >> the, the if they're convicted in romania and they serve sentences there, they won't be extradited until after the conclusion of those sentences. so there's a long time to go yet. >> yeah. and tell me you know, in terms of extraditions, what sort of numbers are we talking aboutin sort of numbers are we talking about in terms of people, you know, people that we want to get back in this country every year? how successful are we at bringing people back from all around the world? >> we don't actually make that many other many requests compared to other countries. poland, for example, makes requests probably five a day to us, and romania, the same bulgaria, but we actually make very few, but in comparison. but when we do make them , we're when we do make them, we're relatively successful. >> yeah. and of course, the most controversial of all are the extraditions to america, where as a result of that treaty that mr blair signed, you know, without the production of any prima facie evidence of any kind

in court , you know, a british in court, you know, a british businessman or woman could be extradited to america . i mean, extradited to america. i mean, surely within your industry , we surely within your industry, we there must be people who see how grossly wrong and unfair that is. is there no prospect of reform of the american treaty ? reform of the american treaty? >> well, after the gary mckinnon case, which i did in 2012, theresa may did actually make some changes to the extradition act, but nevertheless, it's still a very one sided and unfair, treaty that we have with america. and i lobby all the time for changes for it, but they're not forthcoming. >> no. well, you and i agree on that point 100. thank you for explaining the situation in which the tates find themselves. thank you . well, in a moment, thank you. well, in a moment, we're going to have a big debate about evs because a report out says, no, no, whatever says, no, no, no, whatever numbers the manufacturers tell you, they don't really go that far. let's debate evs. what is their future? are they really up to scratch all of

? we've been 7 we've been there before. we're here again. it's the great ev debate. are they really up to scratch ? well, let's start with scratch? well, let's start with a critical case. and it's steve huntingford who joins me down the line. the editor of whatcar, who has produced a report suggesting that the mileages, the manufacturers tell me we can get from a full charge are not quite correct. steve, please make your case. >> good evening. yes. well it's not so much the figures that the manufacturers claim it is the fact it's the figures that the official figures claim. so basically, manufacturer basically, the manufacturer figures, the figures that are published brochures published in brochures are figures are obliged figures that they are obliged to pubush figures that they are obliged to publish they no choice. publish. they have no choice. those tested to a those results are tested to a worldwide standard. but unfortunately, that worldwide standard isn't very realistic because or at least it's not very realistic for all weather conditions. it's done in in quite relatively light driving, andifs quite relatively light driving, and it's in summer weather and it's done in summer weather conditions. all batteries conditions. now all batteries unfortunately, your unfortunately, whether it's your phone, or your phone, your computer or your car, less efficient cold

car, are less efficient in cold weather. so what we're weather. and so what we're saying think it's we think saying is we think it's we think it's test should better it's the test should better reflect the yes optimum. reflect the yes the optimum. well what get in summer. but well what you get in summer. but you need winter figure so you also need a winter figure so that when people are choosing their or choosing their electric cars or choosing whether or not they want to go electric, it them, electric, whether it suits them, so they have realistic, realistic that car realistic idea of what that car is to capable of . is going to be capable of. >> and you're saying that the disappointment can be up disappointment level can be up to 30% the number that's to 30% of the number that's given ? given? >> yes, indeed. so we tested 12 current cars, ran them current electric cars, ran them until they were basically ran them fully charged till them from fully charged till they ran of they completely ran out of energy on private test track. energy on a private test track. and we found is that none and what we found is that none of them got within 20% of their official figures, and some of them away. them were almost 40% away. >> and sort of remind >> okay. and just sort of remind me i'm going up the m1 me if i'm going up the m1 tonight and i need to stop and charge my ev provided i can find a free stand, what's that going to cost me compared to putting unleaded in a well, that is, thatis unleaded in a well, that is, that is that is the problem. >> if you are relying on public charging, it often will be more expensive than actually than it

would be more expensive than if you're running a petrol car. however, the counterpoint to thatis however, the counterpoint to that is that most people who run an car will do the an electric car will do the majority of their charging at home. you charge at home home. if you can charge at home overnight, can get overnight, if you can get yourself overnight yourself a cheap overnight tariff, electric still tariff, then electric cars still can a of sense. we're can make a lot of sense. we're not saying that electric cars don't make sense. what we're saying to saying is you have to think about going to about how you're going to use the car. you can't charge at the car. if you can't charge at home you're going to spend home and you're going to spend all charging on the all your time charging on the motorway, it's going to motorway, yes, it's going to cost you more than running a petrol car. if you can charge at home and you're not and you're not to not regularly going to use pubuc not regularly going to use public actually public charging, then actually you will save money. >> yeah. i mean, you know, >> yeah. and i mean, you know, the idea that, you know, there'll be manufacture there'll be no more manufacture of diesel cars and of petrol and diesel cars and we've that date five we've slipped that date by five years. but you live on the years. but if you live on the fourth floor flat, it's quite difficult charge an ev, isn't it? >> that is the problem. so yeah, at the moment, about probably about 70% people in this about 70% of people in this country an at country can charge an ev at home. and those home. and though for those people, an can make a lot of people, an ev can make a lot of sense unless they're doing a lot of mileages and they're

of high mileages and they're relying heavily still relying relying heavily on still relying quite the public quite heavily on the public charging then charging network, because then you can rack you do it does the cost can rack up. actually, for vast up. but actually, for the vast majority of people who can majority of those people who can charge home, there is charge at home, there is the potential to save a lot of money. but yes, the problem is the charging infrastructure is not of people not there for 100% of people to do to ask 100% of people do it. so to ask 100% of people to electric until we've got to go electric until we've got that charging infrastructure right, until got right, can't be done until got the that's the problem. the cost. that's the problem. >> huntingford, thank you. >> steve huntingford, thank you. well, chief vehicle well, sam clark is chief vehicle officer for gridserve, a chargepoint and he chargepoint operator, and he holds record holds the guinness world record for the longest distance ever dnven for the longest distance ever driven car on a driven in an electric car on a single charge, sam, you know, i mean, i think in many ways, steve a view of steve gave a balanced view of the and downside of the upside and downside of electric you're an electric vehicles. you're an enthusiast, know, enthusiast, but, you know, here's problem. and on here's the problem. and on friday, live in on friday, i live in kent. on friday, i live in kent. on friday, to drive down to friday, i had to drive down to tiverton it's quite tiverton and back. it's quite comfortable on a tank of diesel to that . if i'd comfortable on a tank of diesel to that. if i'd had an ev and to do that. if i'd had an ev and i've had to stop twice, wouldn't i? well i can give you another example, nigel, you like. example, nigel, if you like. >> that's tonight. >> that's mine tonight. this evening, was kindly evening, you know, i was kindly ianed evening, you know, i was kindly invited and i left invited to the show, and i left my house not expecting to come

here today. right. >> pleased to see you. >> thank you for. thank you for the invitation. but, you know, my car wasn't full when i left. i stopped reading services. i stopped at reading services. a quick of the report quick read of the of the report that steve's just articulated. put couple of miles in put a couple of hundred miles in my, my car while doing it, my, in my car while doing it, and then i am, perfectly comfortable. >> and how long did you stop in reading for? about 20 minutes. haven't for that. i'm haven't got time for that. i'm a busy person. we've all got busy person. well we've all got to and refresh and recharge to stop and refresh and recharge ourselves as well. >> there is an element of >> and there is an element of planning that is that is required drive evs. but required when you drive evs. but then is with with petrol then so too is with with petrol vehicles. so i much got the vehicles. so i very much got the volition now on my daily routes that don't stop to charge. i that i don't stop to charge. i charge because stopped. charge because i've stopped. so when the when i'm travelling around the country, do in ev and country, as i do in an ev and have done for many, many years, i bake in that that lifestyle into so i'm into what i'm doing. so i'm doing at the same doing other things at the same time. stood like time. i'm not stood there like which of you be filling up which of you will be filling up with i'll be my with diesel? i'll be checking my emails using facilities, grabbing a coffee, eating some lunch charging lunch and charging simultaneously. and good. >> i mean, you know, i've got. so driving volvo, so i'm driving an xc60 volvo, you mid—range you know, mid—range size wise, i can get miles to a

can probably get 500 miles to a tank diesel. what am i going tank of diesel. what am i going to i go electric? to get if i go electric? >> interesting what >> well, it's interesting what steve about his report. steve said about his report. i mean, again, my own mean, again, using my own example, around example, my vehicle does around 300 the 300 miles now in, in the in the summertime that be as high summertime that can be as high as 320 in the winter maybe, maybe two 8290. but the discrepancy it's discrepancy is not huge. so it's very often the way discrepancy is not huge. so it's very we often the way discrepancy is not huge. so it's very we pick often the way discrepancy is not huge. so it's very we pick upyften the way discrepancy is not huge. so it's very we pick up on n the way discrepancy is not huge. so it's very we pick up on thee way discrepancy is not huge. so it's very we pick up on the worst that we pick up on the worst case scenarios of the of these, these and i the these tests and i think the tests that were done with, with whatcar thorough. you whatcar are very thorough. you know, it's good. it's good testing range of testing in a, in a vast range of vehicles. we can't just vehicles. but we can't just focus the ones that the focus on the ones that did the worst. got to focus on the worst. we've got to focus on the ones that did the best. and there vehicles out there there are vehicles out there that overperforming that are actually overperforming against their their state. >> doing across >> but he's doing a mean across a different modes. >> but he's doing a mean across a witherent modes. >> but he's doing a mean across a with respect,des. >> but he's doing a mean across a with respect, you highlighted >> with respect, you highlighted the rather the worst case scenario rather than know that anything. >> i'm just here to have a debate now. now they weigh they weigh lot. these cars, weigh an awful lot. these cars, they're lot they're going to give us a lot more wear tear on our roads. more wear and tear on our roads. there's of particulate there's talk of particulate material from, material being released from, you weight tires. you know, heavy weight on tires. there's feasible means of there's no feasible means of recycling they're recycling the batteries. they're not green , really, are not that green, really, are they? oh, god. >> there's so many things wrong with those statements.

with with those statements. for a an awful a start, there's an awful lot more that out more particulates that come out of exhaust than it of your exhaust pipe than it does from from the brake ducts of electric vehicle, of an electric vehicle, especially basis you especially on the basis that you barely brakes an barely use the brakes on an electric vehicle. the electric vehicle. anyway, the information we've got from, information that we've got from, from well from the industry as well demonstrates isn't huge demonstrates there isn't a huge amount between amount of difference between tyre vehicle tyre wear and the vehicle weights. vehicles are weights. all vehicles are getting and and getting bigger and heavier and part the. part of the. >> these a lot heavier. >> but these are a lot heavier. >> but these are a lot heavier. >> well, not not hugely mean >> well, not not hugely i mean there's there's a few vehicles there's a there's a few vehicles that north and a half that are north of two and a half tonnes, but most of vehicles tonnes, but most of the vehicles are less if i get puncture. >> living on the country lane that i do. >> what happens then in your diesel in electric diesel car? no in an electric car. the difference? >> well, because it takes an awful lot more to tow away. changing a at the roadside changing a tire at the roadside for is not very easy, is for an ev is not very easy, is it? it no difference. >> it makes no difference. i mean, the vehicle comparison will same. will be the same. >> clark , evangelist for but >> sam clark, evangelist for but also practical as well. also practical and real as well. no, no. look, if people want to buy electric cars, they can. i am not yet convinced. it doesn't mean won't be, but i'm yet mean i won't be, but i'm not yet convinced. but thank you for coming having that debate. coming in, having that debate. my farage moment my what? the farage moment today

was page the times. was the front page of the times. could believe it. probably could not believe it. probably in lee anderson. the in response to lee anderson. the front of the is boris front page of the times is boris to return campaign in the red to return to campaign in the red wall rishi sunak . well, one wall for rishi sunak. well, one reason why he won't do it is he doesn't really like rishi sunak very the second reason he very much. the second reason he won't be won't do it is there'd be nothing in it for him. and the third reason he won't do it is because last time it was because the last time it was polled, 50% of in the red polled, 50% of those in the red wall who voted boris in 2019 now had confidence had no confidence in him whatsoever . it isn't going to whatsoever. it isn't going to happen, folks. it's conservative central office putting out a story to try and get rid of what they saw as bad news as their former deputy chairman left the party yesterday . in a moment, party yesterday. in a moment, a backbench tory member of parliament says that the work shy those who won't accept the third job offer should be put in the army for a couple of years. well, i wonder, is that even possible and practical in 2024? we'll debate that in just a

moment.

well, in some ways, it's a bit of a cliche, isn't it? country's gone to the dogs . of a cliche, isn't it? country's gone to the dogs. bring back national service. well, something like that is being suggested richard drax, suggested by richard drax, conservative member of parliament south dorset. parliament for south dorset. and, of course, a man serves and, of course, a man who serves on the defence select committee. and richard drax joins me the and richard drax joins me in the studio now. it's not national service as such that you're advocating what is it you're saying? >> i'm just saying that there are there would be some cases, particularly amongst the young , particularly amongst the young, of course, who are listless, rudderless , often from rudderless, often from challenging backgrounds, who can't work, won't work. and i'm suggesting that they are put into an institution like the armed forces, where they are within an infrastructure, where they can learn about camaraderie, about friendship , camaraderie, about friendship, about leadership, and about service, which i'm afraid to

say, many people don't seem to understand that you serve your country. you don't take from your country . and i think the your country. and i think the evidence from the office of national statistics shows that this figure is rising . and i'm a this figure is rising. and i'm a conservative. i do not like the state interfering where it shouldn't, but in some cases, i'm not saying everyone should be called up and put into the armed forces. no, i'm not saying that i'm one of the problems here, richard, of course. >> and the number of people i mean, this isn't about the unemployed. about work unemployed. it's about the work shy, it it's shy, isn't it? yeah, it is, it's about those that three about those that refuse three jobs are not on jobs and of course, are not on the disability for the disability register for mental health or stress or whatever be. you know, whatever it may be. you know, you find if you try and do you might find if you try and do this, that even larger number this, that an even larger number claim an of claim they've got an illness of some and get out of some kind and try and get out of it. >> well, i think that would be challenged, of course. i mean, they'd seen and they'd have to be seen and people would have to go and see them are will? and them and say, are you will? and checked? well, i don't think we just allowing a just can't go on allowing a generation the generation to fall through the employment . that's not

employment hole. that's not going to lead to their happiness in the future , not going to lead in the future, not going to lead to the country's happiness. and unfortunately, the welfare bill is likely to get bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger as more into this. no, more people fall into this. no, i despair. i know of despair. >> know and of course, one of >> i know and of course, one of the ways, perhaps, is to make work genuinely pay by lifting the which people start the rate at which people start paying the rate at which people start paying tax. and that would help. i richard, you know , this i mean, richard, you know, this idea that you're putting out there, i mean, can say there, i mean, people can say drax is an old fogey. this is the sort of thing people talked about back in the 1950s. is it really stick in 2024? and can you get any support for the idea ? >> 7. >>i ? >> i think it 7_ >> i think it is 7 >> i think it is realistic. i doubt >> i think it is realistic. i douth >> i think it is realistic. i doubt i get support . >> i think it is realistic. i doubt i get support. i think the prime minister has already slapped down, if i recall, the head of the army who suggested something similar to this, mind you, joining army. you, that was joining the army. i'm these young i'm saying that these young could . yes. could join any institution. yes. >> and not just the army. >> and not just the army. >> not just the armed forces. no. >> so. so they could join perhaps the care sector or something else, like sector, the border sector, any sector which

has infrastructure within has an infrastructure within which guided, which they can be guided, nurtured achieve their aspiration. >> now , i trained young men for >> now, i trained young men for two at the guards depot two years at the guards depot when they arrived. in many cases they from very deprived they came from very deprived backgrounds. six months later, their parents were saying to us on the pa side square, what have you done to my son? >> in a good way, in a good way and a good way. >> and these men, in this case it was men went on and i went on to serve with them, and i was proud to serve with them. and in the event of a war, i would have been equally proud to die with them. they became the salt of them. they became the salt of the earth. and what's so sad, nigel, is how think nigel, is how small they think it was turned these men it was that turned these men around. interesting >> made the case for >> now you've made the case for very well, i'm joined >> now you've made the case for very the well, i'm joined >> now you've made the case for very the line well, i'm joined >> now you've made the case for very the line from i'm joined >> now you've made the case for very the line from washington, down the line from washington, dc braw, senior dc by elisabeth braw, senior fellow atlantic council fellow at the atlantic council and author of goodbye globalisation. now elisabeth in a rich has made a very powerful case there that there are young , case there that there are young, rudderless, listless people not doing any good, not doing themselves any good, not doing themselves any good, not doing themselves any good, not doing the country any good, and

that something like this might just improve them and be a good thing for the nation . thing for the nation. >> i, the general premise is, is not a bad one, but why just take the workshop? why not test everybody and select the most able and, mentally, physically and those people may well be the work shy that you just mentioned, but if it's just the work shy, who who are, told to go and do national service, then it will be seen as, as a punishment, turn it into a reward. so if everybody is tested, if you are good enough, you get to do national service . you get to do national service. >> so open it up to everybody aged 18 or 19 or whatever it is, and they can sort of serve for a year and help their country in some way, and don't allow everybody to serve , assess them, everybody to serve, assess them, test them and select the best. >> what norwegians >> that's what the norwegians do. every 18 year do. they assess every 18 year old. you're one of the

old. and if you're one of the best, 17, then you are selected for national service. which means even if you come from disadvantaged and underprivileged background, even if you might have become work shy otherwise, if you have the right attitude and the right mental and physical skills, then you are selected and it's the best possible entry you could have on your cv. >> and what happens to everybody else , they are like. like you else, they are like. like you and me and me. nigel they don't get to have that that entry on their cv. and they have to they have to, get other good entries on their cv elsewhere. but the point is that this is the best, the most meritocratic system you can ever have. it's much better than than, being selected for university because it really doesn't depend on on your educational background. it depends on your attitude, your mentality, and the qualities that you may need in the armed forces. and that's why the armed forces. and that's why the armed forces get the soldiers they need , and many of them then need, and many of them then choose to stay on for a

professional career. and others then join the private sector and do well there. >> fascinating, elizabeth. i'd never heard that before . utterly never heard that before. utterly fascinating. trouble with this drax fellow. he's not. he's not radical enough. i mean, he's saying this scheme wasn't that interesting, . interesting, though. >> is norwegian, >> well, my wife is norwegian, and exactly what they do. and that's exactly what they do. yeah. you've got to think about the of yeah. there the cost. of course. yeah. there would hugely expensive. would be hugely expensive. >> our tiny army, we'd >> and with our tiny army, we'd need to build the army up in size first before we can even do it. >> well, we certainly do that. but i doubt that for but i have no doubt that for some, for everybody, that some, not for everybody, that this would be benefit. this would be a huge benefit. and i the nation would be and i think the nation would be hugely grateful. >> very loyal >> actually. you're a very loyal conservative, richard, and you know, on the know, you're there on on the defence select committee. just how disappointed were you by the budget last week in terms of defence spending ? defence spending? >> i mentioned it in my speech today and i said i was very disappointed. i mean, we're told by secretary state it's by the secretary of state it's pre—war . we're spending 2% pre—war. we're spending 2% probably just just and in my day it was over five in the 80s. and

the kits now are more expensive. and the army's windows, as small as ever, been since the napoleonic days. so it's a crisis. and we have got to get a grip crisis. and we have got to get a grip of this and start spending more money on our armed services. >> i think you're right. i think many think you're right. richard drax, thank you very much indeed. i'm joined sir indeed. well, i'm joined by sir jacob rees mogg, and that was really wasn't it, really interesting, wasn't it, about the norwegians and what they do and selecting the absolutely fascinating. i know richard is married to a norwegian. he that i'd norwegian. he knew that i'd never heard that. >> no, had but i thought >> no, nor had i, but i thought it a really interesting it was a really interesting idea, the idea, though. so i think the able she was talking able people who she was talking about will get jobs anyway. yeah. and what you really need to do and actually going to to do and i'm actually going to be about this later, is be talking about this later, is the 4 who are not in the 1 in 4 people who are not in work who aren't even looking for work, don't seem to care. absolutely. to absolutely. and you've got to persuade them that they can't just everybody else. just live off everybody else. that's not fair on other taxpayers. no. >> and you do wonder, don't you? at point the paying, at what point do the tax paying, you there sort of you know, folk out there sort of rebel about this? i mean, i

wonder, i wonder, i wonder who really knows the figures. i mean, you just said 1 in 4,1 really knows the figures. i mean, you just said 1 in 4, 1 in mean, you just said 1 in 4,1 in 4, and was even reported on 4, and that was even reported on the bbc. >> i know , a right wing >> i know, i know, a right wing point the bbc. point on the bbc. >> i think about right wing. it's about right and wrong, i think. and that's really the point. i think all these right wing, left wing things, nonsense. jacob, what can we nonsense. so jacob, what can we expect news? expect after the news? >> main i'm going to >> the main thing i'm going to be about is that we have be talking about is that we have to indefinitely postpone net zero, we're announcing more zero, but we're announcing more gas stations gas powered electricity stations . we need that. we should actually as well. are actually have coal as well. are electricity is more than double that the us. yeah. it's five that of the us. yeah. it's five and a half times that of the people's republic of china and india. and this is crippling our industry and it's making people cold and poor. yeah, well change, but we've cut c02 emissions more than any other western country by dna realising. >> and they say that's a success.i >> and they say that's a success. i don't really think it is. well that's it over and out from me. back with you tomorrow evening at 7:00. but first let's have look at the all important have a look at the all important weather with burkill .

weather with alex burkill. >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news. >> good evening. here's your latest gb news weather update brought to you by the met office. whilst in the south southeast of the uk, it is actually going to turn largely dry as we go into wednesday. it's a different story towards the north and west. that's because we have a frontal system here is eventually going to here that is eventually going to start edge south start to edge back south eastwards, we go through the eastwards, as we go through the night, that is going to bring some persistent rain some heavy, persistent rain across scotland, across much of scotland, northern ireland and then later into england and wales. into northern england and wales. as through early hours as we go through the early hours of further south and of tomorrow further south and east across the rest of england and wales, a drier picture , but and wales, a drier picture, but and wales, a drier picture, but a one and a windy story a cloudy one and a windy story for so temperatures for all. and so temperatures really aren't going to drop much. staying in much. many places staying in double figures as we go through tomorrow then this tomorrow itself. then this band of does gradually push its of rain does gradually push its way further south way a little bit further south in but doesn't make in eastwards, but doesn't make

much progress. so it is going to unger much progress. so it is going to linger and bring quite a bit of rain across northern england and some north wales to some parts of north wales to a dner some parts of north wales to a drier further south, drier story. further south, the limited bright or sunny spells here, but temperatures rising to highs around 15 celsius. highs of around 15 celsius. windy for most us, the windy for most of us, but the strongest winds will be across northwest scotland, where there's the risk gales. but there's the risk of gales. but also some sunshine. we go also some sunshine. as we go into and again staying into thursday and again staying mostly dry towards the southeast. but elsewhere they'll be quite a bit of rain around, outbreaks of rain feeding up from the southwest many from the southwest across many places, a of more places, with a band of more persistent rain across northern ireland pushing ireland and scotland pushing northwards. to come as northwards. showers to come as we go through friday. some of them could heavy and then them could be heavy and then saturday likely to turn saturday is likely to turn wet again. i'll you again soon. again. i'll see you again soon. bye bye. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsor of weather on

gb news. away.

>> hello. good evening. it's me, jacob rees—mogg on state of the nation. tonight, as the energy regulator , ofgem has warned net regulator, ofgem has warned net zero will hit the poorest households hardest. the prime minister has announced new gas power stations to ease the risk of blackouts tonight. how disgusting. it's time to postpone indefinitely the 2050 net zero pledge. an asylum seeker whistleblower has exposed migrants falsely converting to christianity to gain entry into the united kingdom, which mocks our asylum system . but will the our asylum system. but will the home office crack down on false conversions ? british prisons are conversions? british prisons are overflowing with criminals, which means prisoners guilty of theft and burglaries will be released two months early. will this put the law abiding british pubuc this put the law abiding british public at risk? after two decades of talks, a film recreating the notorious 1967 rolling stones drug bust resulting in what could have been the end of the band before it even started. later exonerated thanks to a leading times article written by my own

late great father, has