gb news. >> a very good evening to you. i'm sam francis in the gb newsroom. 7:00. and a quick recap of the headlines this houn recap of the headlines this hour. russia's black sea fleet is now functionally inactive, according to the uk's defence secretary. that's after a massive ukrainian missile strike on sevastopol . for those on sevastopol. for those watching on television, this was the moment that two russian navy vessels were targeted and then struck . security sources have struck. security sources have told gb news that uk supplied storm shadow missiles were used in that strike, and we understand a major military communication centre was also damaged . it marks the largest damaged. it marks the largest attack on the russian controlled port in the war so far, as tensions in the region continue to escalate. meanwhile, four

suspects have been taken into russia's investigative committee headquarters today following friday's terror attack in moscow . the islamic state group has claimed responsibility for the shooting , which we now know has shooting, which we now know has killed at least 130 people. the us, meanwhile, has backed that claim. but russia is continuing to suggest that ukraine was involved, allegations that kyiv has denied . and we've heard has denied. and we've heard tonight that a boy aged just 12 years old has been charged with attempted murder after a teenage girl was stabbed in kent. the incident happened in sittingbourne shortly before 4:00 on friday afternoon. the victim, we understand , was taken victim, we understand, was taken to a hospital in london to receive treatment . she is now, receive treatment. she is now, though in a stable condition. the boy, who cannot be named for legal reasons, will appear in court on monday. in other legal reasons, will appear in court on monday . in other news, court on monday. in other news, simon harris has been confirmed as the new leader of the fine gael party, paving the way for him to become ireland's youngest premier. it follows the surprise

resignation of leo varadkar on wednesday of this week for what he described as personal and political reasons . mr harris is political reasons. mr harris is expected to become ireland's youngest taoiseach after the easter recess. he said today that politics should be a force for good hope, enterprise, equality of opportunity, integrity and security . integrity and security. >> i have been in this party since i was 15 years old and those values mean and meant everything to me because i believe in public service , i believe in public service, i believe in public service, i believe in public service, i believe in the power of politics to make a difference . i believe to make a difference. i believe that politics as a profession can make people's lives better. >> in london, the british museum was forced to close today as hundreds of pro—palestine and environmental protesters gathered outside. activists were seen waving banners and palestinian flags and shouting hands off the middle east! the group calling itself the energy embargo for palestine, say they

will keep targeting the museum until it ends its £50 million partnership with the oil giant bp . eight people have been bp. eight people have been rescued after their fishing boat sank off the coast of shetland, triggering a major rescue effort . a lifeboat and two helicopters, one from norway, were scrambled to the scene after the 27 metre vessel activated its distress beacon early this morning. it had started taking on water in rough seas and sank within a matter of minutes . the seas and sank within a matter of minutes. the early morning call out did save all the crew on board, who were safely airlifted from their life rafts, and we understand they are reported to be in a good condition . and be in a good condition. and finally, fast food was given a new meaning in paris today as cafe staff took part in a traditional waiters race. the famous challenge returned this afternoon after a 13 year break. around 200 waiters raced through the city streets, carefully balancing a tray with a pastry, a cup of coffee and a glass of tap water on board. it was first

held in 1914, and even today the running waiters are still expected to dress for the occasion. this year's winners went home with a complimentary meal and tickets to the paris olympics . those are the olympics. those are the headlines. i'll be back in the next hour. in the meantime, you can sign up to gb news alerts just scan the qr code there on your screen or go to our website, gb news. carmelites. now, though, it's time for free speech nation. >> the countdown begins towards scotland's new hate speech law . scotland's new hate speech law. a government adviser calls for bans on protests outside of schools , and trans activists get schools, and trans activists get violent again. this is free speech. nation . welcome to free speech. nation. welcome to free speech nation with me , andrew speech nation with me, andrew doyle. this is a show where we take a look at culture, current affairs and politics. and of course, we'll have the latest from those lovable culture warriors busily try warriors as they busily try to

suck joy from facet of suck the joy from every facet of human existence. coming up on the tonight, we're to the show tonight, we're going to be to counsellor who the show tonight, we're going to be into to counsellor who the show tonight, we're going to be into trouble counsellor who the show tonight, we're going to be into trouble when sellor who the show tonight, we're going to be into trouble when she )r who the show tonight, we're going to be into trouble when she hadio ran into trouble when she had the to ask why gender the audacity to ask why gender critical campaigners were blocked a stall a blocked from having a stall at a women weekend. i will also be joined the studio by sal joined in the studio by sal grover , who has been taken to grover, who has been taken to court in australia for not allowing a male to use a female only platform. and we'll hear from parents and clinicians who are challenges are issuing legal challenges this to the controversial this week to the controversial new treatment for young new treatment regime for young people questioned their people who questioned their genden people who questioned their gender. and of course, i've got a fantastic comedian panel here tonight to answer questions from this lovely studio this rather lovely studio audience and comedians audience. and the comedians joining josh joining me tonight are josh howie lewis schaffer . thanks howie and lewis schaffer. thanks for joining me both . for joining me both. >> forjoining me both. >> how are you.7 >> how are you? >> are you having a good week? >> are you having a good week? >> i'm great. yeah just getting my flat ready to sell. >> oh, you're selling your house and you're going to use tonight to plug it. yes. >> if anybody wants to move to hornsey. yeah let me know. >> how going all >> how are you going to get all the games of your the board games out of your house? got thousand

house? you've got thousand people this about house? you've got thousand peopiit's this about house? you've got thousand peopiit's got this about house? you've got thousand peopiit's got thousands about house? you've got thousand peopiit's got thousands andit josh. it's got thousands and thousands of. >> have a mental health issue. >> i have a mental health issue. yes. and, i'm storing them in a in a friend's loft. >> are you. is that right? okay. and you? lewis good week. >> i never board games. >> i never played board games. no, got mental no, i've got a mental health issue. wouldn't disagree with >> you wouldn't disagree with that. think you should try that. but i think you should try and some board games. and play some board games. >> i'll get invited over >> maybe i'll get invited over to josh's house. to me. >> i'm afraid that's >> no, no, i'm afraid that's been ruled out. we got some been ruled out. we have got some questions the audience. questions from the audience. let's question helen. let's get a question from helen. hi, helen. hello. >> is it right that protests >> hi, is it right that protests outside schools should be outside of schools should be talked about being banned? outside of schools should be taliyeah, out being banned? outside of schools should be taliyeah, this 3eing banned? outside of schools should be taliyeah, this is ng banned? outside of schools should be taliyeah, this is this�*anned? outside of schools should be taliyeah, this is this official >> yeah, this is this official review which has come this week from government saying that review which has come this week from should vernment saying that review which has come this week from should vernnand saying that review which has come this week from should vernnand this1g that they should ban. and this is because batley grammar because of the batley grammar school. if you school. i don't know if you remember this story. there was a teacher at the batley grammar school in west yorkshire who showed of the prophet showed a cartoon of the prophet muhammad free muhammad in a lesson about free speech. that's speech. and of course that's relevant he was talking relevant because he was talking about happened about what happened at the charlie magazine. charlie hebdo magazine. but there protests. you there were protests. do you remember those images of people outside school? remember outside the school? you remember that was into hiding? that he was forced into hiding? that years ago. that that was three years ago. that teacher at

teacher is still in hiding at the this is the moment, and this is a special independent review by dame sarah khan. you've seen the review, josh, you're familiar with this story? >> yeah, it's very upsetting. even when you read it. still, three years later , the he was three years later, the he was failed by the school who suspended him ? yes, initially he suspended him? yes, initially he was failed by the police. who didn't defend him, and he received death threats. and him and his family and he was failed by the council, who didn't step up at all. so this i would argue, is a good step. i think there's 15 points in this report, one of being that report, one of them being that you shouldn't be able protest you shouldn't be able to protest outside intimidate outside schools, intimidate teachers the teachers unless it's the school's, on strike. >> but, helen, can i ask you, what do you think about this? do you think we should have protests outside of schools? >> well, yes, i do, actually, because i think children learn through observing and experiencing and through observing and ethink ncing and through observing and ethink ncingneed and through observing and ethink ncingneed to and through observing and ethink ncingneed to be and through observing and ethink ncingneed to be able and through observing and ethink ncingneed to be able tod i think they need to be able to see what goes on. >> so this is a question, isn't it, about the nature of the protest? because, louis, when it comes to schools, do you think it's about protecting children?

do you think there needs to be a space where they don't get intimidated by this kind of thing? >> well, i mean, when you think about what this protest it's about what this protest is, it's basically the basically i mean, i know the teacher there anymore. teacher isn't there anymore. yes, it's basically a threat yes, but it's basically a threat to every single teacher in the entire school. >> the people protesting, >> well, the people protesting, didn't threats . the guy didn't send the threats. the guy didn't send the threats. the guy did threats from other did get threats from other sources, even so, it's a sources, but even so, it's a it's an angry mob outside a school. i mean, is there you see this? is that my, i'm torn on this, josh, as you can imagine, i think peaceful protest is really important and that we should it. should never crack down on it. but you take of helen's point? >> well, i just, but i think it's inter sedation. and in terms of what the children are learning, they're learning that a people, a group of people, can intimidate in this a group of people, can intimiblasphemy in this a group of people, can intimiblasphemy laws, in this a group of people, can intimiblasphemy laws, which case, blasphemy laws, which i think is wrong. >> well, i would suggest that the problem actually isn't the protest. problem the protest. the problem is the school, the unions, the government, police government, the police capitulating. what should have happened should happened is that school should have , he doesn't lose have said no, he doesn't lose his job. can protest all you his job. you can protest all you like. he did the right like. but he did the right thing. we're going to allow him to what and

to do what he does. and for people know, stand for people to you know, stand up for him that. him with that. >> yeah, just the real >> yeah, but but just the real world lesson that they learned is very vocal voices, is that a few very vocal voices, can shut down our freedoms. >> problem, isn't it, >> this is a problem, isn't it, louis? i mean, the point is, we had same with the lady of had the same with the lady of heaven, the film that was deemed to blasphemous, there to be blasphemous, and there were outside various were mobs outside of various cinemas, there was that cinemas, and there was that awful of the cinema awful footage of the cinema manager out grovelling, manager coming out grovelling, basically saying, no, i would never anyone's never want to offend anyone's religion. course we won't religion. so of course we won't show course we should show it. no, of course we should show it. no, of course we should show it. no, of course we should show it. you know, as soon as that happens, that film should be shown everywhere. >> you what >> well it's not you know what the problem like death the problem is? it's like death by thousand cuts. it's like, by a thousand cuts. it's like, this is just one incident where the and the state the the police and the state and the people haven't backed up. so, you what is the guy the you know, what is the guy in the movie he supposed you know, what is the guy in the molike, he supposed you know, what is the guy in the molike, be he supposed you know, what is the guy in the molike, be the he supposed you know, what is the guy in the molike, be the singleupposed you know, what is the guy in the molike, be the single guy)sed you know, what is the guy in the molike, be the single guy that defends? >> that's it. no, no, i sympathise with that because, yeah, the is real. you yeah, the threat is real. you know, like people do get hurt and killed by extremists. but if everyone did, that's my whole point. everyone the point. if everyone did it, the threat spread. mean, threat is then spread. i mean, that's point. that's my point. >> so at what point do we say it's going to that

it's not going to happen, that there isn't going to be a defence of liberty in this country? at point? but country? yes. at what point? but if could say this thing if i could say this thing because i it the other day, because i said it the other day, is he he he he is that he was he he he shouldn't have. everybody knows you just say islamist. >> come on, man, every single time he he can't say the word. >> yeah. he can't say the word. i don't agree with i actually don't agree with louis i think a lesson louis here. i think in a lesson about speech with of about free speech with one of the free speech issues the biggest free speech issues of the murder of of our time, the murder of cartoonist for lampooning a religious figure. course, religious figure. of course, you should show the right? should show the images, right? >> course you should. and >> of course you should. and a and was and a french teacher was beheaded before. yes. beheaded the year before. yes. so this person is in so that's why this person is in hiding, as as actually hiding, as well as actually receiving threats. and but receiving death threats. and but i agree that, louis, it's i do agree that, louis, it's death by a thousand paper cuts. hopefully the government are hopefully now the government are trying to put some gloves on. maybe. i don't know if the analogy continues . maybe. i don't know if the analogy continues. i'm not sure. we'll see what happens. >> move to a question >> let's move on to a question from kai. okay k hi k, should we be concerned about scotland's new crime laws? scotland's new hate crime laws? scotland's new hate crime laws? scotland's new laws? it's one of new hate crime laws? it's one of my subjects, my favourite subjects, kai. okay. that

okay. sorry. do you think that these are draconian? i think they are, but, yeah, it's basically policing people's thoughts. >> and from what i understand, the definition of hate is hate. so it's a circular definition. >> yeah, it's a real problem at the moment in scotland. i mean, so it's actually weirdly so april the 1st. so april fools day when these laws come into day is when these laws come into effect . don't know if the effect. i don't know if the scottish government is trolling us whatever, these have us or whatever, but these have been the pipeline a been in, in the pipeline for a few years you know, they few years now. you know, they were developed in, into early 2020 by yousaf, who was 2020 by humza yousaf, who was then secretary. he's 2020 by humza yousaf, who was then first secretary. he's 2020 by humza yousaf, who was then first minister. atary. he's 2020 by humza yousaf, who was then first minister. ofy. he's 2020 by humza yousaf, who was then first minister. of course, now first minister. of course, the hate crime bill in the new hate crime bill in scotland is really, really draconian. effectively says draconian. it effectively says that that anyone perceives that that anyone who perceives that that anyone who perceives that has been that some offence has been caused regarding the protected characteristics, race, gender, sexual orientation, the other one is actually trans gender identity, which deviates from the equality act, which doesn't have that. but noticeably, the scottish government has not mentioned sex, which suggests to mentioned sex, which suggests to me , josh, that this is really me, josh, that this is really a hate speech law to criminalise people who want to call a man a

man. you know , like when trans man. you know, like when trans activists who are the most ferocious, and the most hateful, group at the moment when it comes to you, certainly to me, when they put up signs saying decapitate terfs and stuff like that, if the hate speech law doesn't say anything about sex as a protected characteristic, it's almost like saying you get a free pass, no one else a free pass, but no one else does. yeah, of course it's hypocritical. >> fair. they are saying >> to be fair. they are saying that they're to in that they're going to bring in some but some misogyny laws later, but you at time, you would think at the time, with all other protected with all these other protected characteristics, that they would go, women, they also go, oh, women, they also get hate, just have hate, but shouldn't we just have no laws all? no hate speech laws at all? >> shouldn't be able to >> shouldn't people be able to say they want? i mean, say whatever they want? i mean, this this, crime, this crime, this, this crime, they're effectively criminalising opinions. i think the saying they the police are saying that they will obliged to investigate will be obliged to investigate every so any activist every complaint. so any activist and face it, this is the and let's face it, this is the activists, modus operandi . they activists, modus operandi. they will phone up and make vexatious complaints about people they don't will say, i was don't like. they will say, i was misgendered. do something about don't like. they will say, i was mi isn'tiered. do something about don't like. they will say, i was mi isn't that. do something about don't like. they will say, i was mi isn't that what's mething about don't like. they will say, i was mi isn't that what's going1g about don't like. they will say, i was mi isn't that what's going to about it. isn't that what's going to happen here? well that's what we're see is what's

we're going to see is what's going to happen. >> we've seen the police receiving this training. that is ridiculous. they said when they were laws the were forming the laws and the bill that they they wouldn't apply to art and but now suddenly going, suddenly they're going, oh, we're going to look we're actually going to look into comedians well, into comedians and go, well, they say that. they didn't say that. >> actually. didn't say >> actually. they didn't say that bill used to have that the bill used to have a section called public performance so they performance of a play. so they always they were going always said they were going to go arts, what they're go after the arts, what they're now is they won't target now saying is they won't target comedians and actors, the comedians and actors, but the training police has shown training to police has shown that preparing for such that they are preparing for such a scenario. they might not a scenario. so they might not target for an target a comedian for telling an offensive what they offensive joke. but what they will they will investigate will do is they will investigate a complaint about a comedian for telling joke. telling an offensive joke. >> say that what we're >> can we say that what we're doing? >> yeah, what we're >> yeah, because what we're doing go for it. >> well, there's >> okay, well, we're, there's going show up on that going to be a show up on that day, april 1st, with a bunch day, on april 1st, with a bunch of comics, trying to incite a lot of hate. okay, i should probably clarify my feeling. >> i have a comedy night >> so i have a comedy night called comedy unleashed in london, i london, and i thought what i would up to would do is take that up to edinburgh the 1st of april edinburgh on the 1st of april with problematic comedians, with some problematic comedians, including and lewis. and

including josh and lewis. and we're going see what happens. we're going to see what happens. i is it is possible we'll i mean, is it is possible we'll get arrested, but i don't think so . 50. >> so. >> you don't think so? but the way, you know, you come on this program think you're way, you know, you come on this prograto think you're way, you know, you come on this prograto arrested. ik you're way, you know, you come on this prograto arrested. i you're way, you know, you come on this prograto arrested. i don't; going to be arrested. i don't want go. and lewis, you've want to go. and lewis, you've promised . promised. >> you said you would do it. >> you said you would do it. >> now, promise, because >> now, i promise, because you're boss or my income you're my boss or my income comes you. andrew. could comes from you. andrew. we could share comes from you. andrew. we could shawhat are >> what are you. >> what are you. >> yeah. what >> yeah. what >> you were very offensive, a lifelong dream. >> i don't i don't think i'm that expensive. what's what's horrible is, horrible about this? this is, first this has to do first of all, this has to do with scotland. not my with scotland. it's not my country. even. i'm not country. i'm not even. i'm not even british. i'm from america. what do care? it's not none of what do i care? it's not none of my not good my business, but it's not good to an opinion on it. i to have an opinion on it. i could have an opinion, but if you know what, if they want to be that's their business. be crazy, that's their business. that's what going tell that's what i'm going to tell the audience. sorry. you the audience. i'm sorry. you should. shouldn't have should. you shouldn't have brought but if they if brought me there. but if they if they want to be ridiculous like that. the basic core that. but the basic the core belief is something that. but the basic the core beli haven't is something that. but the basic the core beli haven't talkeds something that. but the basic the core beli haven't talked about,thing that. but the basic the core beli haven't talked about, which you haven't talked about, which is have people should is maybe you have people should be to hate. i believe be allowed to hate. i believe that. believe should. that. i believe you should. you're saying, oh, this person

hated well, i've been hated me. well, i've been hated my entire life. >> and lewis, you this. >> and lewis, you say this. i have actually written about this recently shouldn't. recently saying you shouldn't. the going to be the police are not going to be able criminalise,criminalise able to criminalise, criminalise an a human emotion. an emotion, a human emotion. you would thousands of would have to undo thousands of years human evolution to get years of human evolution to get rid idea . rid of hate. the idea. >> josh, can i just make one more point? >> can you're brave. >> you can if you're brave. >> you can if you're brave. >> organisation called >> the organisation is called police that is the police scotland. that is the that the league, that is the league, whatever. that's department of that's the police department of scotland. police scotland. it's called police scotland. it's called police scotland and that's basically an imperative. basically imperative. they're basically telling the police would you police scotland please. yeah. do something other than this. >> explain to me this though, josh.i >> explain to me this though, josh. i mean, one the issues josh. i mean, one of the issues ihave josh. i mean, one of the issues i have with all of this is that the seem to be essentially the snp seem to be essentially authoritarian. they seem authoritarian. i mean, they seem to that citizens to believe that the citizens that looking after that they are looking after apparently their like their apparently are their like their parents. they parents. you know, they introduced named person introduced the named person scheme. that every child in scheme. so that every child in scotland have a state scotland would have a state guardian. thankfully got overturned. they're overturned. but now they're basically to. basically they're trying to. well, let me give you a very good example of this. so the scottish police created a thing

called the hate monster. and this is like kind mask this is like this kind of mask that adults of that to teach the adults of scotland that they mustn't say nasty things or hurty words. i think we've got a clip of this, have we. >> you make you want to have a go at somebody, a neighbour, somebody on the street on a night out, security guy on the doon night out, security guy on the door. some day in the chippy. your taxi driver, you make you want to vent your anger. just because folk look or act different for you. the hate monster wants you to feel that you need to show you're better than them . then, before you know than them. then, before you know it , you've committed a hate it, you've committed a hate crime . crime. >> i think this says an awful lot about the way the snp see the public. they see them as children. they need to be coddled. they need to be told what words they can say, what they what they can't. and lewis is right, isn't it? you if you're to criminalise you're going to criminalise hate, try and hate, you should try and criminalise, and wrath and criminalise, envy and wrath and other human emotions that you don't like. don't happen to like. >> i mean, that that makes >> yeah, i mean, that that makes

me want to some cereal. yeah me want to eat some cereal. yeah yeah, yeah, i can see that from that. but yeah, it's, it's patronising, it's this whole patronising, and it's this whole idea also of offence, of course, being taken , not given. yeah, being taken, not given. yeah, it's like they can't trust people to be able to read between the lines. what is genuinely hateful or not or who cares? no. >> well, if people say something hateful about me, as they often do, i don't call the police about it. i just block them. yeah, and then they get really upset and they say, can you tell andrew to unblock me, please? well that's their problem. >> they shouldn't they shouldn't have they have been hateful. they shouldn't had the hate shouldn't have had the hate monster them. monster inside them. >> thing of >> yeah, but the thing is, of course, think they're course, like they think they're doing good intention. doing it with good intention. but this stuff actually but when this stuff actually comes and it's not comes out in law and it's not properly codified, it's just like their 1d. laws and like with their 1d. laws and whatnot, immediately whatnot, then you immediately they people would, know, they people would, you know, said, this men are going said, look, this men are going to female prisons. to self id into female prisons. and no, no, and they're like, no, no, no, this wouldn't happen this stuff wouldn't happen as soon as passed. that's soon as it gets passed. that's exactly what happened. and they're say, oh no, they're going to say, oh no, we're going arrest

we're not going to arrest comics. and people in their homes anything that. and homes or anything like that. and as this stuff goes as soon as this stuff goes through, going to have through, you're going to have some stupid policeman who thinks they know better than everybody else, use else, and they're going to use these laws wrongly. >> i mean, activists are >> well, i mean, activists are already online about already boasting online about how the 1st, they're how on april the 1st, they're going to all complain about jk rowling, for the crime of misgendering, and we'll see if anything in anything happens. she's based in edinburgh, what edinburgh, so we'll see what happens, scary scary stuff. next question from heather. question is from heather. >> this is another question >> hi, this is another question about violent protest. this about a violent protest. this time, protest time, this violent protest took, took medical took place outside a medical conference yesterday in central london. i mean, why why is violent protests are okay outside of a medical conference, including an nhs gp. >> yeah. i mean, this is so a lot of footage has been going around online, which we can't show at the moment because there have been some arrests, but there were effectively a group of, trans rights protesters attempting disrupt a attempting to disrupt a conference issues. conference on gender issues. this advisory this was the clinical advisory network on sex and gender. and they were it was just a bunch of medical practitioners discussing issues about the dangers of drugs children on puberty

drugs for children on puberty blockers, cross—sex hormones, all those kinds things all of those kinds of things which we've discussed on this show awful lot, which the bbc show an awful lot, which the bbc haven't discussed all. josh, haven't discussed at all. josh, very quickly on this, and we want to talk about this in an abstract way, i think, because we shouldn't talk about what specifically happened because there arrests, and we there have been arrests, and we don't prejudice any don't want to prejudice any trial happen. why trial that might happen. but why is activists, trans is it that activists, trans activists getting more activists are getting more violent time i see footage violent every time i see footage of one of protests, of one of these protests, there's more punching, there's more there's more punching, there's mo i actually disagree with you. >> i actually disagree with you. i been violent from i think it's been violent from the beginning. i think the very beginning. i think one of the clips that got me of the first clips that got me to examine what was going on here was maybe five years ago or something, where trans something, where a trans woman punched basically punched punched a man, basically punched a lesbian in the face, and everybody was blaming this woman and saying that she was a bigot. and i'm like, that's a bloke just punched a woman in the face. and then we saw the same in new zealand and that guy just got off. >> i think what i'm suggesting is hasn't been there is not that it hasn't been there from start, but that it's

from the start, but that it's escalating. and i think it might be because of the revelations of the files, of the warpath files, because of the warpath files, because of the the tavistock, the closure of the tavistock, because more are because more and more people are seeing opening their eyes to this. i think a cornered rat this. and i think a cornered rat lashes they're lashes out. i think they're getting they're seeing lashes out. i think they're gettdeath they're seeing lashes out. i think they're gettdeath of they're seeing lashes out. i think they're gettdeath of theirey're seeing lashes out. i think they're gettdeath of their movement and the death of their movement and they're going to get more aggressive, desperate, more aggressive, more desperate, more desperate, do you desperate, maybe. what do you think, lewis? >> think so. i don't >> i don't think so. i don't think, they're think, i think that they're going and i think going to win. and i think i think we're screwed, basically. can the word screwed? can i say the word screwed? we're screwed. >> say it too often, >> try not to say it too often, okay? that is that is that's your limit. now is that number one is that is that the people who think in a certain way, everything's been siloed, as you know, and this silo, which is which like saying, which is sort of like saying, you know, men are men are men and women women. and women are women. >> and, know, is you think >> and, you know, is you think they're going to win. >> i mean, it's interesting because young people have because the young people have the to hitler . the future belongs to hitler. >> remember that. remember that song? don't remember that song? and i don't remember that in, no, no, in, i cabaret. in cabaret. yes. is the young people were a lot these people are very young audience, but

generally speaking, i refuse to believe the younger generation are going along with all of these authoritarian ideas. >> well, i think there's a contingent that are. but i would suggest, i suggest when it comes to just men punching i to just men punching women, i would think younger would like to think the younger generation with generation aren't on board with that, younger that, because the younger generation the trans generation feels for the trans people , we don't. people, we don't. >> a lot of times we don't or we don't feel as much. and will you feel like you feel equal ? feel like you feel equal? >> how are you defining trans people? trans people? are we talking about guys just like talking about guys who just like wearing dresses? and then suddenly them more? wearing dresses? and then suddewe them more? wearing dresses? and then suddewe talk them more? wearing dresses? and then suddewe talk about them more? wearing dresses? and then sudde we talk about people nore? wearing dresses? and then sudde we talk about people with? when we talk about people with gender yes. gender dysphoria, yes. >> people are thinking >> the young people are thinking that genuinely >> the young people are thinking th.risk genuinely >> the young people are thinking th.risk . genuinely at risk. >> i think what they're doing is they're confusing what we used to call old school transsexuals with transvestites, cross—dressers, fetishists and i'm putting them all in one umbrella, including violent men who want to punch women and go along these events as an along to these events as an excuse for violence against women. clearly. women. quite clearly. right. >> there's i mean, it's >> i mean, there's i mean, it's an incredible misogynistic undertone, even undertone. undertone, not even undertone. it's overt. yeah. know, it's overt. yeah. you know, we're talking jk rowling

we're talking about jk rowling earlier the death earlier to see the death threats, threats. and threats, the rape threats. and the of course, is that the irony, of course, is that you've a of people you've got a bunch of people saying that they're women, but behaving like the worst men. saying that they're women, but beiyeah, like the worst men. saying that they're women, but beiyeah, it'se the worst men. saying that they're women, but beiyeah, it's ane worst men. saying that they're women, but beiyeah, it's an interestingnen. >> yeah, it's an interesting one, it? if if you one, isn't it? if you if you want people to believe that you're a lady, send rape you're a lady, don't send rape threats threats to threats and death threats to people because it's just not very i'll honest. very ladylike, i'll be honest. okay. next free speech okay. next up on free speech nation, we're going to speak to a councillor who into a councillor who ran into trouble when had the trouble when she had the audacity gender audacity to ask why gender critical campaigners were being blocked stall a women blocked from a stall at a women weekend. don't go anywhere

>> so we can we can show the arrest images, please . arrest images, please. >> five seconds. oh, are any of them ? lask linzer the prince's trust. >> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle. >> there was a noteworthy incident earlier this month at chester storie house's women weekend. a number of campaigners had been disinvited from holding a at the event on the a stall at the event on the grounds that their gender critical views were intolerable and local councillor mandy clare asked an explanation and

asked for an explanation and let's have a look what ensued. >> this event and this event is called the storey house weekend for women, not men , for for women, not for men, for women. so aren't you being hypocritical saying that you hypocritical in saying that you defend the right of freedom of speech and protest, and yet lying about the women who've been from this event been disinvited from this event who peacefully protesting been disinvited from this event wh> so when i say i, i agree with the freedom of speech as long as you're not hurt in anyone and what people are doing is being transphobic and perpetuating ideas that are dangerous and lead to trans people being murdered. >> please leave nazi germany for me if you believe me. thank you so much. are you? thank you so much for the question. >> i see why what what reason? >> i see why what what reason? >> this event to celebrate women. i break the law. what you do is celebrating women. okay. did anything to my did i say anything to my followers anyone to followers or anyone who's had to deal this today ? deal with this today? >> because it's important. when i was first arrested and councillor clare from the councillor mandy clare from the

party of women joins me now , party of women joins me now, mandy, welcome to the show. >> that's an astonishing clip, you stood up and you asked a legitimate question, you know, can you give us some context about what happened there? sure. >> so i'm kind of known locally as a councillor who raises concerns and issues around women's rights, women's dignity , women's rights, women's dignity, our language, child safeguarding concerns, etc. for in relation to the debate around sex and genden to the debate around sex and gender. so the women got in touch with me. they had applied for a stall at an event called the women story house women weekend. so story house is a local theatre in chester where, i'm a local councillor in cheshire west and chester and i felt it would be good to go along and support the women when they got in touch and said that they'd been disinvited because they'd been disinvited because they'd declined to go on a panel with patsy stevenson , i was kind with patsy stevenson, i was kind of even more interested in going along to support them, but they were very concerned that it wouldn't be interpreted as them causing any kind of disruption.

they just wanted to go and hand out leaflets, which is what they'd intended to as part of they'd intended to do as part of they'd intended to do as part of the stall holders at event. the stall holders at the event. in place. yes, just to in the first place. yes, just to let women that there is an let women know that there is an organisation out that does organisation out there that does centre locally that they centre women locally that they can and get involved in if can join and get involved in if they so there were some they want to. so there were some women outside the women outside leafleting, the police called three times police were called three times in by story house. in total by story house. i attended patsy stephenson's panel event and whilst i was in that event, i noticed that she tweeted and described the women as , gc. she didn't say gc women as, gc. she didn't say gc women or people. she said there's a group of gc outside the event , group of gc outside the event, really sorry to any of my followers. please don't speak to or engage with them, that she'd understood it, that they were there to aggressively challenge and create media, social media content, which they weren't. >> by gc, you mean gender critical. and she's effectively smearing these people and saying they're to cause trouble they're there to cause trouble to your reaction to get films of your reaction to post social media. yeah now post on social media. yeah now we should say so. this is odd, isn't because this is a isn't it? because this is a women weekend, women are

disinvited. stephenson disinvited. patsy stephenson became well known because of the sarah everard vigil. vigil, isn't it? yes, she did so she because she was taken away by police. i think we've got some images of that we can maybe show and you'll recognise these images because they went viral at time. she's standing at the time. but she's standing there saying that you need to get thrown mean, did there saying that you need to get that, n mean, did there saying that you need to get that, didn't mean, did there saying that you need to get that, didn't she?an, did say that, didn't she? >> did. yeah. so basically >> she did. yeah. so basically i just her some reasonable just asked her some reasonable questions. i asked her because she'd earlier commented she she'd earlier commented that she was favour of freedom of was in favour of freedom of speech the right protest, speech and the right to protest, regardless of whether people agreed or she agreed with her views or she agreed with her views or she agreed theirs in principle. agreed with theirs in principle. she support of that. but she was in support of that. but then denigrated these women then she denigrated these women and about them. yes. and so and lied about them. yes. and so i her, you know why? i asked her, you know why? given that did do that? that basis, why did you do that? and aware that they're and are you aware that they're just outside leafleting because they women have to they don't want women to have to refer their rapist as she in refer to their rapist as she in court. they don't want disabled women to have women to be forced to have intimate if that's intimate care from men if that's not want , they don't not what they want, they don't want women to intimate and want women to be intimate and strip by male police strip searched by male police officers who are claiming that they're these you know,

they're women. these you know, that what the women have that that's what the women have been disinvited for. and her response was that she's in favour freedom speech , but favour of freedom of speech, but not if it hurts people and that people are being transphobic and that people could end up that trans people could end up being by dangerous questions. >> i guess it's quite unbelievable that the leap that she's making there, what about this? i mean, you had a then you had the run in with the security guard. they were quite bullish, weren't they? i think we might even have a clip of that if we can show that would can perhaps show that that would be helpful. no. maybe it's pardon? >> you need to leave the premises. >> you're choking me out of the premises. >> i will take that off. you will. you will not. >> no, you won't take the camera. i will, you can't. and i'm right. you take it i'm all right. you can't take it off you are not breaking any off if you are not breaking any laws. all means, get the laws. by all means, get the police here. i'll do it on the way. >> so i think mainly what a lot of people are going to be surprised at is, you know, you're there to defend women's rights. are there rights. these people are there to and defend women's to protest and defend women's rights as well. >> and a women weekend. so >> yes. and a women weekend. so what's wrong i mean,

what's going wrong here? i mean, you've this. you've had you've faced this. you've had to raise these with the raise these issues with the council before, haven't you? >> on one level, it's >> i mean, on one level, it's not surprising because as a councillor, whenever i try and raise important raise really important issues, including are impact, raise really important issues, inclu

know which councillor it is. that's asking these that's been asking these questions, and we're not going to because we believe to answer because we believe that motivated. and that they're hate motivated. and so asked the council to so when i asked the council to get involved, said, no, if get involved, they said, no, if you need to take up with you need to take it up with them, need to lawyer up. them, you need to lawyer up. basically was was response. basically was was the response. and had striptease in and then we had striptease in front you know, an front of, you know, within an audience that were in audience that children were in and that tent. it was and out of that tent. it was called the glitter tent all day and etc, in and sale of sex toys, etc, in that environment. so the that same environment. so the precisely concerns that you'd raised ended up coming true. they happened. and i had photographic evidence of it. yes i mean, the rest of the event was fantastic. apart from there was fantastic. apart from there was a sign that was sexist and that was hostile to women that wouldn't shared, you know, wouldn't have shared, you know, a activist viewpoint , if a trans activist viewpoint, if you want to put it that way. but when i tried to take a motion to council, they just slammed it closed, as always. >> and they say it's hate and of course, this isn't where it's safeguarding is not hateful. >> not. and when i ask >> no it's not. and when i ask questions and i send emails questions and when i send emails to leader and the chief to the leader and to the chief exec these things,

exec about these things, including child safeguarding, quite i'll either get no quite often i'll either get no response you've response or they'll say you've already when already had an answer when i haven't an answer, and then haven't had an answer, and then they won't debate local they won't let you debate local media. cover it. so it's media. don't cover it. so it's really difficult to try and get this out publicly. this stuff out publicly. >> unfortunately, we're >> well, unfortunately, we're almost of time, but i think almost out of time, but i think it'd finally it'd be worth just finally mentioning fact that you're mentioning the fact that you're the first councillor the the first councillor from the party women. would you party of women. so would you like tell us a bit more about like to tell us a bit more about what you're doing? >> so this is so >> sure. yeah. so this is so standing for women kelly standing for women is kelly jenkins organisation. she set up a political party a brand new political party which for women. about which is for women. it's about women's rights, dignity, women's rights, women's dignity, our of our freedom of speech. all of these things that we've found have been crushed in this way. and i am going to be doing and what i am going to be doing is with kellyj to try is working with kelly j to try and you and encourage ordinary, you know, come forward as know, people to come forward as candidates, that it's candidates, not think that it's something them, something that's beyond them, because i'm one 70 because i'm one of 70 councillors and there's only two of us in that chamber who over the last say , 12 months, 18 the last say, 12 months, 18 months have been prepared to actually up on these actually speak up on these issues. if you are someone who cares about these issues and you are on it, are willing to speak up on it, we're to support you and we're there to support you and

you're better than you're already better than anyone else that's your local anyone else that's in your local council in all council chamber, in all likelihood. fantastic. council chamber, in all like mandy, fantastic. council chamber, in all like mandy, claire,:astic. council chamber, in all like mandy, claire, thanks so council chamber, in all likemandy, claire, thanks so much council chamber, in all likejoining claire, thanks so much council chamber, in all likejoining me ire, thanks so much council chamber, in all likejoining me .e, thanks so much council chamber, in all likejoining me . stillanks so much council chamber, in all likejoining me . still to :s so much council chamber, in all likejoining me . still to comenuch forjoining me. still to come on free speech nation , sal grover free speech nation, sal grover will be here to tell us about how she has been taken to court for not allowing a man onto her women only platform. but next, i'm going to be rejoined by josh howie and lewis schaffer. we're going to get more questions going to get some more questions from studio from this wonderful studio audience. not go audience. please do not go anywhere.

>> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle. >> later in the show, i'm going to be turning agony uncle as usual, with the help of my panel usual, with the help of my panel, josh and lewis, we're going to help you deal with your unfiltered going to help you deal with your unfilte|got any personal you've got any personal problems, email at problems, email us at gbviews@gbnews.com. okay, let's get questions. we're get some more questions. we're going start question from going to start question from peter. peter, hello. >> evening , should the church >> evening, should the church embrace anti whiteness. >> this is the arch

>> yeah. this is the arch archdeacon of liverpool, miranda threlfall homes. it's a posh double barrelled sounding name that one. now she hit the headunes that one. now she hit the headlines this week because she posted that she said what the church needs is more anti whiteness. there's the tweet. she said i went to a conference on whiteness last autumn. it was very good. was it? she said whiteness is to race as patriarch is to gender. so yes, let's have anti white whiteness. let's smash patriarchy. let's smash the patriarchy. i think a quote from john's think that's a quote from john's gospel, isn't it? it's from the bible. >> it's definitely jesus. >> it's definitely jesus. >> jesus said it on the sermon on the mount. yeah, he smashed the patriarchy. >> too much wine. demolish, demolish whiteness. >> too much wine. demolish, derthe;h whiteness. >> too much wine. demolish, derthe anti 1iteness. >> too much wine. demolish, derthe anti whiteness. >> the anti whiteness. >> the anti whiteness. >> yeah, yeah, he famous for >> yeah, yeah, he was famous for it. yeah . this is, the it. yeah, yeah. this is, the i mean, look, i don't want to get too involved in the church. why not? well, no, just i don't want to tell them how to run their business, but they seem to this is not good stuff. this is. >> it's odd. it's very anti anything. >> yeah, but isn't it weird, though, that the kind of woke ideas, they really do infect

religious organisations ? i mean, religious organisations? i mean, i was speaking to a baptist minister and evangelical baptists in america. you think of them as being immune to this. they're saying talking they're saying they're talking about the about intersex readings of the bible, bible . bible, decolonising the bible. >> it's inside. >> it's inside. >> it's inside. >> it's at my synagogue. >> it's at my synagogue. >> it's at my synagogue. >> it's your synagogue? >> it's at your synagogue? >> it's at your synagogue? >> it's , because people >> yeah, it's, because people want people want to be good, right? i get it, but also some people don't want to read. yeah. so they just want the good feeling of like, oh, i'm doing some stuff. she gets to go to some stuff. she gets to go to some conference and get fed a whole load of tosh and then come back and go, look, look at me. i'm a really good person. anti whiteness, blah blah blah. and not read where this not actually read where this stuff to do are people stuff goes to do are people still at this point where they think equals think that wokeness equals good positive, not positive, liberal and not racist, regressive, divisive live? >> how have they not just read my book? yes. i don't understand that. if you just read my book, you will get this. i mean, surely you've read surely you i mean, you've read it. ibought a surely you i mean, you've read it. i bought a book. i didn't >> i bought you a book. i didn't read it. no, but at least you bought it, i bought it, i bought

it on kindle. i regret it because at least i have nothing to for it. i can't bring it to show for it. i can't bring it in can you autograph in and say, can you autograph it? bought the other one too. >> and you didn't read that either? >> didn't read that one either. i mean, but but but that doesn't mean it's not a great book. the point the point is every dog point is, the point is every dog has day and white people, has its day and white people, people who are white or europeans, had their day. europeans, have had their day. l, europeans, have had their day. i, spent no, i've spent i, i have spent no, i've spent my entire life wanting to be white. weren't white. i'm a jew. we weren't white. i'm a jew. we weren't white. we were raised as black people. you know what, people. but you know what, louis? >> t- louis? >> told this story w told this story to me >> you've told this story to me before. still confuses me, before. it's still confuses me, but do want to black people. >> we're not black. >> we're not black. >> no, i don't think you are. >> no, i don't think you are. >> but it is. no. but we >> but what it is. no. but we grew up in a post nazi world. i was born 12 years after the holocaust, and we wanted to fit in my name in with white people. my name louis schaefer , was chosen louis james schaefer, was chosen because it was a white name that my mother. >> no, i understand the point that you're making. >> i used to go shop in brooks brothers to be to be white. i'm dressing like a white man now.

and i'm just i'm trying to pass. and i'm just i'm trying to pass. and i'm just i'm trying to pass. and i picked a losing team . and i picked a losing team. >> okay, you heard it here first. whiteness is losing . first. whiteness is losing. let's get a question from joe. where's joe? hello. hello hello. >> hi, my question is, do you think the scottish police are trolling jk rowling and will that impact us? let women speak on the 6th of april. >> interesting, joe, well, let me explain that very quickly because there was a there was a we've talked about this hate crime that's coming in in scotland, and police scotland held a hate crime event. and at the event they were given this fictional scenario and they said, look, there's this gender critical campaigner joe, critical campaigner called joe, but saying who is, but we're not saying who it is, but we're not saying who it is, but know, jk rowling but it's, you know, jk rowling is joe her friends is known as joe to her friends and insisted this campaign and she insisted this campaign is fictional. campaigner says sex is binary, says all the things gender critical things that gender critical people and says oh, people say. and then says oh, and trans people should be sent people say. and then says oh, antheans people should be sent people say. and then says oh, anthe gas3eople should be sent people say. and then says oh, anthe gas chambers,jld be sent people say. and then says oh, anthe gas chambers, which sent people say. and then says oh, anthe gas chambers, which ofnt to the gas chambers, which of course, no gender critical person ever said. it's person has ever, ever said. it's a kind horrendous smear, a kind of horrendous smear, isn't joe? against people

isn't it, joe? against people who just wouldn't endorse that kind of violence ever. it's neven kind of violence ever. it's never, ever happened. it's just de—man . let me ask you this. is de—man. let me ask you this. is it possible that under the new hate speech laws, the police could be arrested for that? because that seems quite hateful to me. >> yeah. i mean, anything can be hateful if it's interpreted as hateful. >> w- e you're >> and you're you're doing an event on the 6th of april. and can you tell me a little bit about that? >> a little women about that? >> event a little women about that? >> event in little women about that? >> event in edinburgh.an about that? >> event in edinburgh. it's speak event in edinburgh. it's enough. >> mean, do you think >> and i mean, do you think because i know that at those events you say things like, you know, biological sex is real and matters for women's rights, will you get arrested for that? >> potentially. yeah. mean >> potentially. yeah. i mean potentially could i mean, if potentially we could i mean, if we say a man is a man. yeah, and someone is standing there and thinks he's a woman . yeah. maybe thinks he's a woman. yeah. maybe he perceives that as hate speech , you know? and, you know, we could be reported . could be reported. >> and isn't that interesting that this is in a sense, people have to test the law. that's what's so scary about this, is that you're having to go there to do that. we're going up there

with a comedy show again. what we're really is we're all doing really is testing the here. testing the law here. >> i as well. they'll end >> i think as well. they'll end up getting in such a mess because other people will do it back. you know, you're fight fire with yes. they'll fire with fire. yes. so they'll be in a mess. be in such a mess. >> the police will have somebody that's very interesting point, that's a very interesting point, i you know, i think, because, you know, obviously can make obviously anyone can make a complaint the police are complaint if the police are saying investigate all saying we will investigate all complaints, maybe complaints, well, then maybe we'll the police. we'll complain about the police. >> i want to >> yeah, well, i just want to say one thing. >> i've been to some of these events they've been in events when they've been in london, great. they're london, they're great. they're incredibly inspiring. hearing women and their women talk and telling their stories. the only stories. it's also the only place that ever been where place that i've ever been where they identified a they have identified me as a man. that's quite man. and that's quite encouraging. good. encouraging. it's good. >> yes. josh very >> yes. josh that's very important for josh. >> to say one more >> i just want to say one more thing about this very quickly. the why so the other thing is why it's so offensive that offensive as well is that equating, jk or anybody equating, jk rowling or anybody or saying they, or the trans saying they, they're trying to make this create this narrative that trans people do with create this narrative that trans peo holocaust. do with create this narrative that trans peo holocaust. they do with create this narrative that trans peo holocaust. they don't. do with create this narrative that trans peo holocaust. they don't. and ith the holocaust. they don't. and it's incredibly offensive to jews. the holocaust specifically refers extermination refers to the nazi extermination of been a lot

of jews. and there's been a lot of jews. and there's been a lot of online about this where of stuff online about this where and they were not targeted. there were four people who were killed, people killed. killed, trans people killed. they because they were not targeted because they trans. were they were trans. they were targeted. gay targeted. two were gay and two were jewish. >> but knowing about >> yeah, but knowing about history get you anywhere history doesn't get you anywhere these are. they these days. they are. they do revise one revise history. that's one of the that they that's the tactics that they do. that's a topic do want to come back a topic i do want to come back to. not now, but we haven't got time. but i do want to discuss that later on because that's a very interesting topic, but look next free speech nation, i'm next on free speech nation, i'm going be here by sal going to be joined here by sal grover, who has been to grover, who has been taken to the court australia

welcome back to free speech nation. next month . sal grover, nation. next month. sal grover, founder and ceo of giggle, a female social network, is being taken to australia's federal court for alleged gender identity discrimination. this has occurred because she did not allow a male who identifies as female to use this female only

platform, a trans activist , platform, a trans activist, roxanne tickle, is seeking damages. a written apology and complete access to the platform, and the case could have major implications around the world. and sal grover joins me now to tell us more. sal, welcome to the show. >> thank you so much for having me. okay. >> it's a long story, and a lot of people here won't have heard of people here won't have heard of it because of course, the media aren't covering this generally. so let's start with what happened. giggle? what happened. what was giggle? why up? why did you set it up? >> basically my and i >> so basically my mum and i created a female only social network. we wanted women to just have a female only space in the palm their hand. i no palm of their hand. i had no idea gender identity idea of this gender identity ideology time. is ideology at the time. this is 2018, 2019. i'd come from hollywood . i was sort of in that hollywood. i was sort of in that me too world, and we laugh quite frequently of like, what are the odds of creating a female only platform at the one time in human history when anyone's having any kind of debate over what that is? it was a place what that is? but it was a place for women to find roommates, freelance connect for freelance work, connect for lesbian or just to have lesbian dating, orjust to have

a and speak freely. a voice and speak freely. >> you had sense. was >> you had no sense. this was controversial. quite controversial. no, i mean quite the opposite. because of i thought there would maybe thought that there would maybe be men, know, there's be some men, you know, there's always men. >> like, don't women have >> i'm like, don't women have enough? like, i thought there'd be bit that, but be a little bit of that, but i literally not think that literally did not think that anyone men women, anyone would go. men or women, you have let them on. yes. you have to let them on. yes. never occurred to me. >> and so this is one particular activist, have activist, roxanne tickle. have i got that right? yeah. got that name right? yeah. >> tickle. >> roxy tickle. >> roxy tickle. >> okay. just sounds made >> okay. it just sounds made up. doesn't it? >> the giggle. >> but tickle the giggle. i mean, like like, yeah. >> previous life as >> my previous life as a screenwriter, if i was writing a screenplay about the sex versus gender made the gender debate, and i made the central court case tickle me giggle, the first script i would have gotten too the have gotten was it's too on the nose, on the nose. nose, it's too on the nose. >> it's not. >> it's not. >> it's not that no one's going to believe that. that to believe that. but that literally is how did it get literally is what how did it get to the court situation, though? >> because surely, like if you're aren't you're saying men aren't allowed, this tickle you're saying men aren't allojust this tickle you're saying men aren't allojust say, this tickle you're saying men aren't allojust say, okay, this tickle you're saying men aren't allojust say, okay, well, tickle you're saying men aren't allojust say, okay, well, thise guy just say, okay, well, this isn't for me. >> yeah. you'd think, so >> yeah. you'd think, no. so basically, onboarded >> yeah. you'd think, no. so bas app, , onboarded >> yeah. you'd think, no. so bas app, i onboarded >> yeah. you'd think, no. so bas app, i removed onboarded >> yeah. you'd think, no. so bas app, i removed him,�*arded >> yeah. you'd think, no. so bas app, i removed him, irded the app, i removed him, i didn't, i don't remember removing him. was quite removing him. it was quite thousands men. frequently

thousands of men. frequently would get on the app. if would try to get on the app. if you would through, we'd just you would get through, we'd just remove and it should be remove them, and it should be noted. i did not know that this person was transgender. had a gender identity. nothing. i saw a picture of a man, and i acted accordingly. yeah, and how could i know that someone has a gender identity? yeah. of course. i mean, is that you could tell me right now that you have one. either i believe you or i don't. yeah you know what i mean. you could say it. >> it's like telling an atheist ihave >> it's like telling an atheist i have a soul. yes. and so do you. and insisting that you believe. >> yes. >> yes. >> it just so happened it's been legislated. >> so this is the problem, isn't it? it's australia's federal court. it's gone that high. so what? is this going now with what? how is this going now with the case. the court case. >> basically he did an >> so basically he did an australian human rights commission complaint against me at giggles . so commission complaint against me at giggles. so was at me and giggles. so it was sort things at the same sort of two things at the same time, for gender identity discrimination settle it discrimination and to settle it in the australian human rights commission, which is basically a place you can settle things before they escalate to court. but i would have had to sit like

let on. let all men who let him on. let all men who claim to women on the app go claim to be women on the app go to sex and education, to sex and gender education, which only re—education which could only be re—education and not and moderate all content. so not to men claim to be to offend men who claim to be women i was like, no, a lot women and i was like, no, a lot of apps are doing that. >> there are there are >> i mean, there are there are lesbian dating apps have lesbian dating apps which have people yeah. who people with beards. yeah. who say there she her men with beards. >> yeah. well, they're men and they're not even making the slightest effort not look they're not even making the sligimen.affort not look like men. >> i mean, it's odd. not >> so. i mean, it's odd. not that would excuse it. yeah, that that would excuse it. yeah, it's like. it's exactly like. >> i mean, i don't have any distinction between a man who makes effort and a man who doesn't. but doesn't. a man is a man, but but, , because by me but, basically, because by me saying no to all of that, he filed in federal court, and that's where we are now in two weeks, two weeks, on tuesday, we go to federal court to find out what a woman is. it's the first big what is a woman case. it's sex versus gender identity. >> but i think a lot of people will be shocked by this because they said, okay, you they would have said, okay, you might you know, there's might say, you know, there's a there's a debate going on in

london the garrick club. london about the garrick club. should women into should women be allowed into that of thing? you're that kind of thing? but you're talking you talking about a dating site. you know, gay male friends know, i have gay male friends who on grindr who say it's who are on grindr who say it's full women now. i mean, you full of women now. i mean, you know, sexual orientation is a form discrimination. form of discrimination. >> completely. i mean, it's >> no, completely. i mean, it's it time for, think, gay men it is time for, i think, gay men to and create a new space. i to go and create a new space. i mean, grindr is it's gone like, you you can't get it back. you can't you can't get it back. it's been infiltrated by this it's been so infiltrated by this nonsense like, sort it's been so infiltrated by this no let nse like, sort it's been so infiltrated by this no let ite like, sort it's been so infiltrated by this no let it go, like, sort it's been so infiltrated by this no let it go, them ke, sort it's been so infiltrated by this no let it go, them have)rt it's been so infiltrated by this no let it go, them have it of let it go, let them have it go and create a new one. i think that with that, all of the institutions, i think that that's has to happen, but that's what has to happen, but that's what has to happen, but that said, am the person that being said, i am the person who did go and create a new one. and so this is what you're for. in >> okay. so i want to just broaden this because this broaden this out because this has across the has ramifications across the world but before world doesn't it? but before we get into that, you just get into that, can you just explain to me about the australia there are australia situation? there are certain areas in australia at the moment is illegal the moment where it is illegal for to gather without for women to gather without without know, can't without men, you know, you can't have woman, gathering, have an all woman, gathering, is that have an all woman, gathering, is tha basically, i mean, >> basically, yeah. i mean, there an organisation called there was an organisation called there was an organisation called the action group the lesbian action group who appued the lesbian action group who applied australian human applied to the australian human rights an

rights commission for an exemption a, female only exemption to hold a, female only lesbian event, which, like there's any other kind of lesbian, of course, like it's just implied lesbian would be female only. but because of all of this nonsense and the australian human rights commission said no. i commission said no. and so i knew that they were going to say no because australian human no, because the australian human rights intervened rights commission has intervened in yes. in tickle in my case. yes. in tickle giggle. as it does sound funny every time you say it. >> i'm sorry . >> i'm sorry. >> i'm sorry. >> it's like a pub, but my last name is grover. like, it's literally it's a pantomime, but no, basically, the ahrc intervened as amicus curiae in tickle. google. yes. and they're on the side of gender identity. so basically they intervene, saying there's a conflict here, we understand between sex and gender identity, but we're going to solve it with gender identity. >> well, people don't understand how far it's gone in australia , how far it's gone in australia, i don't think because it's in all the political parties as well. know it here, well. i mean, i know it is here, but it's in australia, but it's worse in australia, isn't it? >> it's worse in australia because estate is because the fourth estate is completely captured. we don't

completely captured. so we don't really have this. yes. so i'm really have this. yes. so so i'm in the uk because australia in the uk because in australia i have journalists. kid have emailed journalists. i kid you day for a year no you not, every day for a year no one will platform me, no one will talk about this case. >> so the main news channel over there is abc isn't it. yeah. won't even mention that this is happening. >> no, i mean the abc. it's even worse than the bbc. they're beyond like the band playing with the titanic sinks. like they're in the kitchen making breakfast, thinking that there's going to be meal the next going to be a meal the next morning, like they are going going to be a meal the next morniwithike they are going going to be a meal the next morniwithike 1ship.|re going going to be a meal the next morniwithike 1ship. but oing going to be a meal the next morniwithike 1ship. but what's down with the ship. but what's interesting is they interesting to me is that they don't even, platform it from the other . no, you would think other side. no, you would think because usually they're celebrate like, you know, it's either anything a trans person does, celebrate or does, they'll celebrate or they'll this person so they'll say, this person is so oppressed, but they're not saying it. saying anything about it. >> that interesting? we've >> isn't that interesting? we've got thing with the bbc got a similar thing with the bbc here, w path files, here, ignoring the w path files, which spoken about before. which we've spoken about before. listen, we've more to talk listen, we've a lot more to talk about. sal, going about. so, sal, we're going to come sal grover after come back with sal grover after the so please don't go the break. so please don't go anywhere. >> a brighter outlook with boxt

solar sponsors of weather on gb views . news. views. news. >> hello. here's your latest weather update from the met office for gb news. we saw a quiet day weather wise across the uk on sunday, but things are turning more unsettled once again during the week ahead, with wind and rain at times. a ridge of high pressure brought a quieter day sunday, but low quieter day on sunday, but low pressure gathering pressure is already gathering towards and will towards the west and that will move during week ahead to move in during the week ahead to return to unsettled conditions. wind already arriving wind and rain already arriving across southwest of across the west and southwest of the the overnight period, the uk for the overnight period, some of that turning quite some of that rain turning quite heavy places, whereas towards heavy in places, whereas towards the and east it's clearer. the north and east it's clearer. just 1 showers lingering the north and east it's clearer. just certainlyowers lingering the north and east it's clearer. just certainlyowers lirofering the north and east it's clearer. just certainlyowers lirof frost and certainly a touch of frost possible north and east. possible in the north and east. by early hours of monday by the early hours of monday morning. whereas out towards the west those west and southwest those temperatures west and southwest those temperathor monday itself, climb. as for monday itself, with very days in store with a very wet days in store cost some western and southwestern particularly southwestern areas, particularly across of across the south—west of england, some heavy rain england, some very heavy rain developing at times, developing here at times, whereas and developing here at times, wherit's and developing here at times, wherit's a and developing here at times, wherit's a bright and developing here at times, wherit's a bright at|nd east it's a bright picture, at least for time, before wind

least for a time, before wind and starts to move in from and rain starts to move in from the south—west, turning to snow and rain starts to move in from theitouth—west, turning to snow and rain starts to move in from theit reachesest, turning to snow and rain starts to move in from theit reaches colder ning to snow and rain starts to move in from theit reaches colder air; to snow and rain starts to move in from theit reaches colder air acrossow as it reaches colder air across parts of scotland, especially on the north of the central the hills north of the central belt and particularly on belt and particularly later on in temperatures peaking belt and particularly later on in celsiusemperatures peaking belt and particularly later on in celsius down atures peaking belt and particularly later on in celsius down towards eaking belt and particularly later on in celsius down towards the ng at 12 celsius down towards the south—east, colder though south—east, a bit colder though towards the north and northeast. as tuesday, very as for tuesday, what a very unsettled across unsettled day is expected across scotland. snow at scotland. rain and snow at times. on the times. snow chiefly on the hills, but some of that rain and some that snow could be quite some of that snow could be quite heavy elsewhere. it's a pretty unsettled rain showers? unsettled day. rain or showers? never far and those never too far away, and those temperatures struggling, never too far away, and those temperatans struggling, never too far away, and those temperatan average .ing, never too far away, and those temperatan average figures at reaching an average figures at best, pretty best, and staying pretty unsettled ahead with unsettled in the week ahead with showers or longer spells of rain. again, those rain. and again, those temperatures into temperatures struggling into the low figures that warm low double figures that warm feeling inside from boxt boilers sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> there's plenty more still to come on. free speech nation this

week, including alba mp neale hanvey on the scottish hate crime bill. and more from sal grover. coming right up. but let's get a news update first from sam francis. >> andrew, thank you and very good evening to you from the newsroom. just gone 8:00. and we start with news from moscow, where two suspects in friday's deadly shooting at a concert hall have been charged tonight in court with an act of terrorism. earlier footage from the russian capital showed four suspects being taken into custody following that terror incident, which we now know has claimed at least 130 lives. the islamic state terror group has claimed responsibility for the attack. however russia is continuing to link ukraine, an allegation kyiv has denied. well, tonight, russian security officials have published a statement saying they will hunt down and kill those who masterminded the attack, saying that wherever and wherever they are, wherever they are from and whoever they are, they will be

found . meanwhile, ukraine is found. meanwhile, ukraine is working to restore power suppues working to restore power supplies after russia's biggest attack of the war so far on the ukrainian power grid. the president, vladimir zelenskyy, says more than 200,000 people in kharkiv are still in the dark. it's after russia pounded ukrainian power facilities on friday, striking the country's largest dam. that attack killed at least five people and put europe's biggest nuclear station at risk . it europe's biggest nuclear station at risk. it comes as more than 30,000 civilians have now been killed in ukraine since the start of the invasion . simon start of the invasion. simon harris has been confirmed as the new leader of the fine gael party, paving the way for him to become ireland's youngest premier. it follows the surprise resignation of leo varadkar on wednesday for what he described as personal and political reasons. mr harris is expected to become ireland's youngest taoiseach after the easter recess. he said today that politics should be a force for

good.the politics should be a force for good. the chancellor has defended the government's record on affordable housing after claiming £100,000 a year is, he says, not a huge salary. jeremy hunt said it doesn't go as far as people may think. for those in his surrey constituency because of how higher house pnces because of how higher house prices and the rising cost of living comes as the average price of a house in the uk is now around eight times the average income, and it was half that in the 1990s, the chancellor told camilla tominey on itv news this morning that lower taxes will make a difference to average house pnces difference to average house prices in that part of the world. >> £670,000 if you've got a mortgage, if you're paying child care, what looks like a very high salary doesn't go as far as you might think it would. if you look at the average salary in this country , £35,000, they have this country, £35,000, they have been feeling the pinch. and those people will see their tax bills go down by £900 this year.

if you look at people on an even lower salary, the lowest legally payable salary, the national living wage, because i've increased that to £11.44, they will see if they're working full time. their income go up by £1,800. >> in other news, chilling levels of harassment are posing a serious threat to social cohesion . that's according to an cohesion. that's according to an independent government adviser. a review led by dame sara khan will be published tomorrow, showing that more than 75% of the public feel that they can't speak their mind. it suggests many people feel society has become more divisive and cites the case of a teacher who went into hiding after showing a caricature of the prophet muhammad during a class. it's understood the report tomorrow will recommend a series of measures, including a ban on protests within 150m of schools , protests within 150m of schools, and china is believed to be targeting britain with a wave of cyber attacks aimed at interfering with the upcoming general election. the deputy prime minister oliver dowden, is

expected to warn mps tomorrow about escalating state backed threats from chinese hackers. mi5 threats from chinese hackers. m15 have also revealed an exponential increase in their investigations into chinese hacking activities. it comes after a report found that britain is unprepared for a large scale ransomware attack, due to what's been described as a lack of investment. and finally, eight people have this morning been rescued after their fishing boat sank off the coast of shetland, triggering a major rescue effort. a lifeboat and two helicopters were scrambled to the scene in the early hours after the 27 metre vessel activates its distress beacon, it had started taking on water in the rough seas and sank within just a matter of minutes. the early morning call out saved all of the crew on board. they are now safe and were airlifted from their life rafts . those are from their life rafts. those are the latest headlines from the gb newsroom. for more , you can sign newsroom. for more, you can sign up to gb news alerts. just scan the qr code on your screen. or

if you're listening on radio, go to our website gb news. common alerts. >> welcome back to free speech nation. now i'm going to continue my discussion with sal grover, founder and ceo of giggle, a female social network who's been taken to australia's federal for alleged gender federal court for alleged gender identity discrimination. sal can you tell us a bit more about why this is going to have ramifications for the world, not just what's happening in australia? >> okay, so part of our defence in it is a constitutional challenge , and this is because challenge, and this is because australia put gender identity into our sex discrimination act into our sex discrimination act in 2013, the julia gillard government, australia's first female prime minister put gender identity into the sex discrimination act and took out the definitions of sex, man and woman . woman. >> right. you would have thought

that's quite fundamental to a we're basically in the situation where we're supposed to believe that the sex discrimination act has concrete definitions for like discrimination and act, but not sex, basically. >> right. but gender identity has the definition of basically gender identities , gender gender identities, gender identity. it's circular. >> it's mannerisms or something. well, always ask trans well, i always ask trans activists what they mean it, activists what they mean by it, and no one can give me a successful definition. >> a few weeks ago, you had , >> a few weeks ago, you had, robin, i think his robin, moira white, i think his name a trans activist name is a trans activist barrister, no less, who you asked him what a what is gender identity? and he couldn't explain it. i'm being taken to federal court for discrimination of a gender identity that someone, even who claims to have a gender identity can't even, define what it is. >> well, helen joyce says it's something a sex soul. something like a sex soul. >> exactly. so imagine legislating a soul, basically, right? mean, how would right? i mean, and how would anybody know ? i mean, don't anybody know? i mean, we don't this is made up concepts . this is just made up concepts. >> but but this doesn't just i mean, you know, in australia so. well, let's firstly , if you were

well, let's firstly, if you were to lose this case in a couple of weeks, what would the ramifications australia? >> well, so it's not just australia, it's it is globally because basically australia's sex discrimination act incorporated cedaw very much in full. >> so cedaw is the convention of the elimination of discrimination against women. it is a un convention and it is signed by 189 countries around the world, the uk being one of them. the only countries that haven't signed it are the countries you'd expect not to sign it. yes, but all the good ones have and so cedaw is a document that is based in biology. in reality it is females that men are not women . females that men are not women. you could very much say that it is , against any form of what we is, against any form of what we were seeing. now as gender, because it's actually against any sort of sex stereotype discrimination of women, which i would argue that a man claiming to be a woman is a sex stereotype. discrimination against a woman .

against a woman. >> so if you lose the case, then cedaw has to be updated. is that right? >> so if we lose the case, if we lose the case, it basically means that in international law, woman is not defined as an adult human. female women's rights cease to exist. it women is a legal category that any man can identify into. now in a way, that's how it is at the moment. but what we're doing is we're going in and defending cedaw and re—establishing that. that's not how it should be. that it is very clear that cedaw is female and a woman an adult human and a woman is an adult human female. and once we've established that other countries like canada, like the uk, canada, new zealand, countries in zealand, many countries in europe that have all signed this can go and cite this case and this precedent and go, here we go. please give us our sex based rights. so the stakes are pretty high. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> i just wanted to create an app >> i just wanted to create an app for women. i was not expecting to do this. so i'm like, oh gosh, is a lot of like, oh gosh, this is a lot of pressure. yeah. >> do you think it will go? >> how do you think it will go? >> how do you think it will go? >> on a good day i think >> well, on a good day i think like it's a slam dunk. it's a woman an adult human. female woman is an adult human. female

men course. men can't be women. of course. i mean this is just the truth. it's reality. this is objective. it's reality. this is objective. i mean, can go and claim to i mean, you can go and claim to be a woman if you're a man, if you want. like, that's freedom of belief. whatever you want about don't really of belief. whatever you want aboutbut don't really of belief. whatever you want aboutbut ifion't really of belief. whatever you want aboutbut if you really of belief. whatever you want aboutbut if you are lly care. but i care if you are forcing me to believe it. yes. and so that's why where i go like this like this like this case, like this situation general is even situation in general is even bigger just women's rights bigger than just women's rights because is freedom belief. because it is freedom of belief. and it's men should care and it's why men should care about it. it's why even about it. it's why anybody, even even trans, you even if you are trans, you should care about it. you should care about having your right to freedom of belief. yes because if you if you don't imagine, not imagine. imagine not being able to believe that you're a woman. imagine that being legislated against. well, that would be your being taken away. your rights being taken away. well, rights actual well, our rights of actual reality away. reality are being taken away. i understand the point right now. okay >> so stakes are very high. >> so the stakes are very high. we'll see it goes. it's a we'll see how it goes. it's a couple two weeks time. yeah good luck with hopefully it will luck with it, hopefully it will go right way. yeah, you have go the right way. yeah, you have a crowdfunder? >> do? >> we do? yeah >> we do? yeah >> and how can people help you with this? >> basically, basically,

with this? >> equivalenty, basically, with this? >> equivalent of)asically, with this? >> equivalent of £250,000 is the equivalent of £250,000 is how much it costs. it's 500,000 aud, if we have to go to the high court , it will be another high court, it will be another 500,000 aud. so we have a crowdfunder, it's google crowdfund.com and more information about the case, just about the legislation , about about the legislation, about cedaw, the constitutional challenge. it is it's all there. >> it's all there at giggle giggle crowdfund.com. okay, well we'll see how it goes. thank you very much for joining we'll see how it goes. thank you very much forjoining us. >> thank you so much for having me. >> fascinating stuff. now next on free speech nation, we're going to hear from parents and clinicians who are issuing legal challenges this week to the controversial new treatment regime for young people who question their gender. please don't go anywhere

welcome back to free speech nation. so so, parents and

clinicians will be this week legally challenging the new treatment regime for young people questioning their gender. nurse and psychotherapist sue evans, who blew whistle on evans, who blew the whistle on practices the discredited practices at the discredited tavistock clinic, seek tavistock clinic, will seek a judicial of the judicial review of the government's of the government regulators decision to register gender plus health care, which can refer patients between ages of 16 to 18 for cross—sex hormone treatment and anna cassell, the mother of a teenager with adhd who wanted cross—sex hormones and a mastectomy, will be at the high court this week seeking increased safeguards for teenagers referred to adult gender services and sue evans and anna cassell join me now, along with paul conrath of sinclairs law, who is acting in both cases. welcome to the show everyone. thank you. sue, i want to come to you first because you were one. you were the earliest whistleblower at the tavistock, which i believe is about to close. finally, this week. close. now. finally, this week. yes, but you know, you you yes, but but you know, you you sounded the alarm, you raised concerns. you weren't listened to, really, were you? >> well, they did do a small

internal report. and in fact , internal report. and in fact, doctor david taylor, who did the report at the time, found many of the concerns that actually, if you wound forward 15, 16 years, yes. then became obvious in the more recent episode of whistleblowers at the tavistock. yes but my concerns back then was actually around a 16 year, 16 year old child that i had seen referred after four sessions for a hormone therapy treatment, and i was just shocked by it because my way of working and my long experience in mental health work has always been that it takes time. certainly with adolescents and younger people, that it takes time to gain trust , to develop time to gain trust, to develop a relationship. and so an assessment in my view, could never be done in such a short penod never be done in such a short period of time. >> and we've talked a lot about on this show about how, you know, hannah barnes's findings about and of about between 80 and 90% of adolescents referred the adolescents referred to the tavistock, sex tavistock, where same sex attracted. there other

attracted. there were other things in these things going on in these people's it's not people's lives. it's not necessarily about a mismatch of gender body, there's gender and body, is it? there's other things. gender and body, is it? there's oth that'sgs. gender and body, is it? there's oth that's right. and think >> that's right. and i think i think the difficulty with what we're facing the moment is we're facing at the moment is and what people finding it and what people are finding it so to come together to so difficult to come together to think about that if you look think about is that if you look holistically at most of the children, many, all of the children, many, all of the children that i've met, in fact there are complexities to their life. there may well be adhd, they may be on the spectrum. autism spectrum , neurodiverse in autism spectrum, neurodiverse in other ways. they can have mental health difficulties. they can experience trauma. so you have to really explore all of that to understand the presentation. and in my view, and my clinical experience has been that if you help children come to terms with who they are and the sort of identity issues that they're struggling with, actually those intense feelings of hatred for themselves and their body does tend to desist or die down. yes, bearable. >> but the labour party's official policy now is they're saying that what you're just

describing that therapeutic approach is trans conversion therapy . that's what they're therapy. that's what they're calling there is a real concern >> well, there is a real concern around the conversion therapy bill, glad that it's bill, and i'm glad that it's been put on hold a bit been put on hold for a bit longer. i think what people don't is they don't understand is they get confused between, quite rightly, the of law that was against the sort of law that was against the sort of law that was against the idea that you would try and convert homosexuals to being heterosexual. i mean , i think heterosexual. i mean, i think now we would clearly say we were all against that. and but but actually, you know, i don't think i know of any single clinical, event where there has been conversion therapy cited and a complaint made. but the difficulty, again, is when you try and think in this area and, and talk about it and explore it and talk about it and explore it and try and get to what is the best treatment for these children. that's what i'm about. i want to give them the best opportunity. is that you get shouted down or you get told that's conversion therapy. i never tell a patient what they should or shouldn't think. i

just try and work with them to understand where they're coming from, and then gradually unfold the difficulties that they're experiencing. >> so, paul, we've learned that the puberty blockers are dangerous, that they are connected to bone, bone problems and brain development problems. and now the nhs has banned them, except for clinical trials and except for clinical trials and except for, well , certainly, but except for, well, certainly, but there are private clinics who will be able to exploit this loophole use anyway, but loophole and use it anyway, but then what does that where does that leave people who are over the age of 16, 16 to 18, in other words. >> so if you're over 16, you can still go to the nhs for cross—sex hormone treatment. and if you that at the moment, if you do that at the moment, there's been a change in policy last week. so you'll be assessed by your treating clinician. but then that has to go to an independent body who will then assess whether or not that has been the correct decision to prescribe cross—sex hormones. yes. so that in fact is a move in the right direction by the nhs in the private sector, of course, we've only got one

private clinic at the moment, recently been approved by the care quality commission. there is no such independent oversight in that respect. so and the concern is as well, is that the evidence for the treatment really is very, very sparse indeedin really is very, very sparse indeed in terms of its safety and in terms of its effectiveness. >> yes. so, anna, tell us a bit about this legal challenge, because that's there is that dangen because that's there is that danger. there is that concern of those young people who are in that age bracket that they can through, through very few consultations, jump straight to this kind of potentially irreversible medication . irreversible medication. >> i think it's insane because there's no other area of health care where there's such little safeguarding. preliminary investigations for such a massive decision that these children, young people , very children, young people, very vulnerable, autistic, probably gay ' vulnerable, autistic, probably gay , probably lesbian people are gay, probably lesbian people are making. i don't think that it should be ignored. i really

don't think it should be. >> and is it your hope that a legal challenge will resolve this in some way? that it needs to to that point? to go to that point? >> hopefully, all the, >> hopefully, with all the, everything been pointed everything that's been pointed out, lack of evidence ? out, with the lack of evidence? yes, the evidence yes, the negative evidence that's showing all the, risk factors of the surgical procedures, the hormonal procedures. yes. everything. there's no beneficial, nothing beneficial for it. >> yeah, i understand. well, i should say the government regulator is the care quality commission, a spokesperson said best practice guidance for gender identity clinics was considered by internal specialist advisers during the registration assessment, and the registration assessment, and the registration was granted subject to the condition that the regulated activity must not be delivered under 16 year olds. delivered to under 16 year olds. si sukh has not yet carried si king sukh has not yet carried out an inspection of gender plus health care limited , and the health care limited, and the gender plus hormone clinic said at a time when the nhs pathway has collapsed with four years of waiting time, is important

waiting time, it is important that have the that young people have the opfion that young people have the option referral to an option of a referral to an alternative national, multidisciplinary team of experts. does not experts. our service does not practice in any way that contradicts current nhs protocols services . protocols for gender services. but can i come to you on this, sue? isn't that the point that if someone wants hit 16, it's if someone wants to hit 16, it's almost as though they go almost as though they can go straight i mean , some of straight into i mean, some of the about puberty the concerns about puberty blockers that they blockers was, were that they always lead cross—sex always lead to cross—sex hormones virtually cases, hormones in virtually all cases, but can just go but now people can just go straight to it in sort of straight to it in that sort of danger zone. >> what's so bemused to >> yes. and what's so bemused to me is that, you know, everyone knows that teenagers are in a penod knows that teenagers are in a period of development. we've acknowledged that throughout time. you know that. so it is strange that such a powerful medication could be given on such a small level of assessment. yes, to children that are still developing. and these are powerful drugs. they are irreversible . you go are irreversible. you go straight on to them and they will harm your body. we know that. yes. we don't yet know that. yes. we don't yet know that there's any evidence to suggest that they'll be effective. yes. for the large

majority of these children. >> and obviously you've been through this in a very personal capacity. mean, you have capacity. i mean, you must have spoken people who are spoken to other people who are in situation . there's a lot in this situation. there's a lot of out who are of people out there who are seeing that they love go seeing people that they love go through something they through something which they know very damaging know can be very, very damaging indeed.i know can be very, very damaging indeed. i mean, how does that feel, think, to there's feel, do you think, to there's hundreds thousands, feel, do you think, to there's hun more thousands, feel, do you think, to there's hun more than thousands, feel, do you think, to there's hun more than thatusands, feel, do you think, to there's hun more than that ofinds, feel, do you think, to there's hun more than that of families not more than that of families in identical situations to mine? >> daughter . in identical situations to mine? >> daughter. yeah, >> yeah. my daughter. yeah, yeah. and there's no research going into it. we're just left, our children are left and indoctrination is ignored. >> and it's almost as though the medical facilities are certainly like the tavistock are just on board with an ideology, and they're pushing an ideology. and it doesn't matter about it doesn't really matter about the much. the kids so much. >> doesn't. everywhere is >> it doesn't. everywhere is against us parents and our children wanting or our children's need to have a quality life . quality life. >> yeah, well, i should say that an nhs spokesman did say nhs england has said that a planned review of the service specification for adult gender

services take place this specification for adult gender servi yeah. i mean, there's two issues here. there's to issues here. there's capacity to consent. you understand consent. so do you understand what's on. yeah. and then what's going on. yeah. and then there the treatment safe and there is the treatment safe and effective now the nhs have done , effective now the nhs have done, you know, through commissioning the cass review, doctor hilary cass, an independent review looked into this and said for under 18 seconds, the evidence simply isn't there credibly to say that in the long term this is safe and effective treatment? remembering this is a treatment that affects the rest of your life. yes. and so if you're 16 or 17 and you go to the doctor, you want to be assured, in fact, that this is going to work. yes. but in fact, we don't have the evidence. so this this is the evidence. so this is this is the problem and the extraordinary thing is the nhs have changed the children adolescent the children and adolescent approach, and approach, which is up to 18, and

you can only get hormonal treatment if you've gone through an in—depth assessment, psychological assessment. but the specification takes the adult specification takes young people from 17. and if you're 17, all you need young people from 17. and if you're17, all you need is young people from 17. and if you're 17, all you need is two appointments. no need for a psychological assessment and you can move straight onto the drugs, drugs, medication , given drugs, drugs, medication, given that, that will affect you for the rest of your life. and it simply doesn't make sense. >> this is incredible, isn't it? because we've been so focused on what to do with minors and we forget that as soon as they hit that age, they can just bypass all that. what we do all of that. so what do we do here, sue? >> it's a hot potato to discuss. i mean, i think really if i mean, i don't know if you're aware, but yesterday there were aware, but yesterday there were a large group of professionals came together to discuss the evidence base for the treatment of people with gender dysphoria or gender incongruence. yes, and they got shouted down. they got protested against and threatened with violence . and so it's a

with violence. and so it's a real problem. i i certainly, in my clinical experience would like to see some special consideration given up to the age maybe of about 24, 25, because there is also a recognition that that the brain is still developing and that maturity is sort of perhaps not finished, maybe until we're in our mid—twenties. so and of course , you get shouted down, course, you get shouted down, yeah, but why is that? >> why, you know, why are people ignonng >> why, you know, why are people ignoring the cass review? why are people ignoring what medical experts are saying? >> yes. again, i think there's a clash of the ideological, with the clinical . right. and i think the clinical. right. and i think if we could get back to medicine and clinical science and evidence base, i think we would be in a much better place to establish actually , what is the establish actually, what is the best care for the patients that we see, because ultimately doesn't everyone who is experiencing this want to know that the medication they're about to be prescribed by their

doctor is evidence based in any other area? you wouldn't want to just get something from your gp that was risky or hadn't been proved to work. yes. and so why are we playing so carelessly really with with young people's lives ? lives? >> okay, well fascinating stuff. i'm sure we'll we'll come back to this story . i'm sure we'll we'll come back to this story. thanks very much for joining me. sue, anna and forjoining me. sue, anna and paul forjoining me. sue, anna and paul, thank you very much . next paul, thank you very much. next up on free speech nation, neil hanvey mp is going to be here to discuss the scotland hate crime bill, which is due to come into force at the start of next month. plus more questions from this lovely studio audience. do not anywhere.

>> on mark dolan tonight, the theatre venue. telling white. audience members to check their privilege at the door. covid lockdowns . four years on. never lockdowns. four years on. never again. labour to hand more power to the unions. my reaction and do the tragic events of the last

couple of days remind us just how loved and important our royal family are. plus, mark meets my pundit ann widdecombe and tomorrow's papers. we're live at nine. >> welcome back to free speech nafion >> welcome back to free speech nation with me, andrew doyle. scotland's new hate crime law, which comes into effect on april fools day, criminalises threatening or abusive or insulting behaviour which is intended to stir up hatred against people based on age, disability, religion , sexual disability, religion, sexual orientation and transgender identity. the act has proved controversial. the head of complaints at the police watchdog says it could have a chilling effect on freedom of speech , but the bill's defenders speech, but the bill's defenders say it is nowhere near as draconian as is being suggested. and protecting people from hate is long overdue . so joining me is long overdue. so joining me to discuss this, the alba mp for kirkcaldy, neale hanvey . welcome

kirkcaldy, neale hanvey. welcome to the show neil. now humza yousaf has come out and said there's been a lot of disinformation about this. people are overreacting. this bill is absolutely fine. is he right? >> well, i made a bit of a >> no. well, i made a bit of a light hearted comment on his claim that there was disinformation being spread about this legislation by saying he'd misspelt information because what's really happening is that people are spreading the truth about this legislation and it's, you know, nobody is saying that hate crime should be given a green light, but the way that this bill has been or this act has been constructed is deliberately intended to prevent freedom of speech, freedom of thought, freedom of belief. there are certain elements that are excluded from the bill, particularly around gender critical beliefs and most importantly , sex as a as importantly, sex as a as a class. so women's sex based

rights are not covered by this bill, sex. the bill is silent on the definition of sex, and therefore same sex attraction is effectively meaningless. and it really has a chilling effect on political discourse. and i'm very concerned about it. you know, the official line is there's nothing to see here, but actually there's a huge amount of concern about this legislation . for all of the legislation. for all of the reasons i've just covered. >> well, we've invited the snp onto the show. they haven't got back to us yet. so fingers crossed for next week. but i would like to ask them. and so i'll just ask you instead, can you give me an example of a crime or an incident that would be covered by this legislation that isn't already by that isn't already covered by existing criminal law ? existing criminal law? >> well, i mean, all of the, the standard hate crime, offences that we would ordinarily expect of inciting racial hatred, inciting , hatred

of inciting racial hatred, inciting, hatred against any religious minority , all of that religious minority, all of that already exists. what the scottish government has done is they've reinterpreted the protected characteristics within the equality act. and so, instead of it being a gender reassignment, they called it gender identity, which is not a protected characteristic in law, and in my certainly in my experience over the last five years, there have been a number of occasions where, you know, i've been spuriously accused of trans phobia because i've spoken out in support of women's rights or i've spoken up for lgbt rights. and because i haven't spoken about transsexuals , which spoken about transsexuals, which is a completely separate, protected characteristic . again, protected characteristic. again, i've been accused of all kinds of terrible things. and what this legislation does is it emboldens those queer theory radicals , those those people who

radicals, those those people who are intent on promoting queer theory. and that includes the scottish government, to stamp down on those of us who are in touch with material reality and feel that our, sex based rights contained in the equality act are directly under threat because of this legislation. >> now , the police have come out >> now, the police have come out and said, you know, we're not going to target performers, we're not going to target comedians because there was some unked comedians because there was some linked materials from a police training where were training session where they were clearly preparing for the situation, they might situation, where they might have to comic for offensive to arrest a comic for offensive speech. they're saying speech. so they're saying they're targeting, but are they're not targeting, but are they're not targeting, but are they not saying that they will investigate? absolutely. every complaint that is made? >> well, allegedly . so, but >> well, allegedly. so, but they, you know, the, the kind of complaints that i would be interested in the police investigating are the, the types of assaults that have been happening on, on women in

scotland that have been dismissed as irrelevant and that was, you know, i'm thinking of one particular situation in aberdeen where a woman was assaulted in broad daylight, in full view of many bystanders and the police just effectively ignored that. but hearty words are being pursued , vigorously by are being pursued, vigorously by the police. and it's that , the police. and it's that, incongruence in the way that the law is being interpreted that really is giving everyone such a cause for concern. >> and didn't they just put out a recent statement saying that they were going to, reduce the number of crimes that they investigate? they're not going to certain forms of to bother with certain forms of vandalism theft if they think vandalism or theft if they think they can't be solved. so in other words, they'll leave actual crime and they'll go spend on offensive spend all this time on offensive words . words. >> yes. so i mean, that's absolutely correct. so the police are in scotland. the police are in scotland. the police are in scotland. the police are under an enormous pressure, and i know that firsthand. i've met with, local senior commanders and inspectors

, and i know that they are under massive pressure. but they are now being instructed that they have to investigate these types of, non—crime hate incidents. i know that that's been something that's been remedied down south because there was a, a rash of, police activity around those types of non—crime events, but there's no such, protection or prevention of those , those kinds prevention of those, those kinds of events being investigated. and you, the individual being placed on some form of register or list which could impact on their employment , their future their employment, their future employment, their, you know, their , their general livelihood their, their general livelihood and the most important thing is, even if there is no crime and even if there is no crime and even if there is no crime and even if nothing comes of the charges that are brought, the process of being investigated , process of being investigated, of having to go through a criminal trial, of having to defend yourself, there's a

saying in scotland that we've all become very, very used to even before this came in, into effect, is that the process is the punishment and that that that intrusion into your life, the loss of your it equipment confiscation, you know , the, confiscation, you know, the, having your name plastered all over the newspapers, drags through the media have been there. my myself. that's all part of the punishment that these vindictive , queer theory, these vindictive, queer theory, extremists want to inflict on people. and you know the wrong target has been, is being protected by this law. there is nothing to prevent this type of extremism being stamped down upon by this legislation. and there is nowhere for women to seek protection for their sex based rights or indeed, sex based rights or indeed, same sex attracted people to be protected for their, sex based rights in

this legislation. and that omission tells you everything that you need to know about the real motivation behind this legislation. >> neale hanvey, thanks very much for joining >> neale hanvey, thanks very much forjoining me. and = y, say, i'm very keen to should say, i'm very keen to have someone on next week who will defend the bill. i really want to hear the other side of that argument. so hopefully that will happen, let's get some more audience questions one audience questions now. this one comes where's iris ? comes from iris. where's iris? hi, iris. hello. what's your question, we know that the bbc lift, stonewall's , lift, stonewall's, indoctrination. indoctrination. last year or maybe just a little bit before. yeah. does stonewall still influence bbc policy ? still influence bbc policy? >> well, so john humphrey said that, hasn't he. he, he said that, hasn't he. he, he said that, because the there was this situation i don't know if you saw this on, on, on, on the news about justin webb and justin webb had referred trans webb had referred to a trans woman the today woman as male on the today programme. was then an programme. there was then an internal investigation. there had a complaint

had been a complaint and the complaint upheld, the complaint was upheld, by the bbc, josh , haven't they bbc, josh, haven't they officially severed links with stonewall? i mean, yeah, but this stuff goes deep, right, and it , what was there's this stuff goes deep, right, and it, what was there's a this stuff goes deep, right, and it , what was there's a deeper it, what was there's a deeper problem within the bbc that they mark their own homework anyway. yes, but yeah. and this is also, there's been a lot of complaints from senior female journalists who have said, what does this mean in terms of us actually reporting the truth, which the bbc is meant to be impartial. yeah. and on these matters now, the matters they've proved that they're when tim, they're not. and then when tim, david goes the board this david goes before the board this week sort says, we're week and sort of says, oh, we're just be mean, just trying to be kind, i mean, that's the problem all along. >> says that the trans >> he also says that the trans issue isn't really that important, but he says it's been they always want that they always want to say that it's like some culture big it's like some culture war big thing, used the thing, and it's used by the right to of bash the left right to kind of bash the left and everything. >> like they need to >> it's like they need to grapple with this stuff. yeah, because important. because it is important. >> well, just ignoring >> well, they're just ignoring it. report on it. i mean, still no report on the website about the the bbc news website about the w path files, of the biggest path files, one of the biggest medical scandals of the century.

not a peep. that i think is just dereliction journalistic dereliction of journalistic responsibility. it otherwise? >> they're saying >> yeah. and now they're saying that their journalists that seeing their journalists getting for calling getting shut down for calling a trans male. yeah. well trans woman male. yeah. well then is that going to then what's how is that going to inspire other journalists to take this stuff? >> well, this is issue, >> well, this is the issue, isn't i just don't isn't it, lewis? i just don't think bbc can credibly say think the bbc can credibly say that impartial anymore. that they are impartial anymore. they be impartial when they might be impartial when it comes politics, or at comes to party politics, or at least to be. but they least strive to be. but they make no effort whatsoever to be impartial it comes to impartial when it comes to ideology. they're part impartial when it comes to idethe gy. they're part of the cult. >> not part of the cult. >> they're not part of the cult. it's the propaganda it's the state propaganda network. not a real network. they're not a real broadcaster. the broadcaster. you don't have the you have state you don't have the state reporting itself . so reporting news on itself. so you're asking an impossible thing. you're asking for someone who's is has who's deep, who who is has a position to be. no. >> but the bbc is not just there to defend the government. the bbc, bbc, no. they hold the government to account, or at least meant but when it least they meant to. but when it comes to this issue, because i'm not saying they are the not saying that they are the government, i didn't the government, i didn't say the government, i didn't say the government, that tum. >> i said that the deep state, they are there from this is you know, something andrew i'm

know, something and andrew i'm andrew, to i'm going andrew, i'm going to i'm going to to you in a minute. to come to you in a minute. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> no, i think this is the main sorry. >> i want to sorry. »| sorry. >> i want to say it's >> i just want to say it's propaganda by omission. >> propaganda omission >> propaganda by omission is probably there. probably the key phrase there. >> doing the >> and who is doing the propaganda and fact propaganda to be. and the fact is, why you care about it? is, why do you care about it? you care about it because it's paid for by us. if it wasn't paid for by us. if it wasn't paid for by us, you'd say, well, fine, let them say whatever they want. >> you say that, then everyone's trying to down news trying to shut down gb news and no pays us. no one pays for us. >> yes, and that's also wrong. they shouldn't shut us. i'm they shouldn't shut down us. i'm not should shut down not saying you should shut down the but we should say we're the bbc, but we should say we're not paying for it. and then? the bbc, but we should say we're not pyoug for it. and then? the bbc, but we should say we're not pyou wouldn't nd then? the bbc, but we should say we're not pyou wouldn't nd th let them then you wouldn't care. let them spend money. if spend their own money. if there's rich know there's some rich guy you know who wants to front that kind of ridicule. >> i do want to get another question in. so go to question in. so let's go to justin. where's justin? oh, he's over here. we'll get the over here. we'll just get the mic you, justin. you mic to you, justin. and then you can ask your question. >> hi. it fairto, can ask your question. >> hi. it fair to, to cast >> hi. is it fair to, to cast maggie thatcher as a contemporary villain? >> and maggie thatcher has >> yes. and maggie thatcher has been alongside been bracketed alongside adolf hitler in a hitler and osama bin laden in a display the and display at the victoria and albert museum. the caption

albert museum. and the caption is this, victorian punch is next to this, victorian punch and judy puppet thing. it describes how the evil character has shifted over the years from the devil to what it describes as contemporary villains. and the v&a says the v&a is always open feedback from our open to feedback from our visitors. response to some visitors. in response to some concerns around a caption in the punch case of our punch and judy case of our laughing matters display. telling of british telling the story of british satire comedy, we will satire and comedy, we will review label update the review the label and update the wording. being wording. were they being satirical then? wording. were they being satino,l then? wording. were they being satino, theyi? wording. were they being satino, they won't be satirical. >> no, they won't be satirical. they were being ideologically dnven they were being ideologically driven been proven by driven as as has been proven by other issues with v&a in the other issues with the v&a in the past. but it's weird, isn't it? i grew up where she was the villain, so she they're correct, but to put them to put her within that context of two of the most evil people, she wasn't the most evil people, she wasn't the villain to everyone. >> she was the villain. >> she was the villain. >> yeah, but she but, well, in my household, she was the villain, i'm sure. yeah, but but the point is, that's just. she was like a by—product of punch line. literally she. she line. she was literally she. she was used. >> but wasn't osama bin laden. >> no, that's what i'm saying. so context here is

so the context here is incredibly offensive. so the context here is incrediblthatensive. so the context here is incrediblthat weird. so the context here is incrediblthat weird again, lewis? >> well, the fact is, is that people paying for it. the people are paying for it. the people are paying for it. the people are paying it comes people are paying for it comes $67 million. go to the victoria and albert museum . and albert museum. >> pounds in this >> pounds and pounds in this country, right. >> pounds? pounds. whatever >> what pounds? pounds. whatever whatever currency you're whatever dodgy currency you're using. it's and it's, it's using. and it's and it's, it's because. and you want to know something andrew. this is the thing about you as a british person, you're always missing the big issue. you're always talking about freedom. but what kind of freedom do you have when you're forced to pay for this kind of dodgy stuff? okay. and number two, you're always missing the other point, which is a lot people who is there's a lot of people who think is evil. think margaret thatcher is evil. okay? because i'm okay? i don't, because i'm an american . grew loving the american. i grew up loving the woman, i'm aware that lots woman, but i'm aware that lots of i'm aware of the strength of feeling. >> but anyway, let's quickly get one more question from natalia. where's hello did where's natalia? hello hi. did she shakespeare make a theatre, to, men, white men. and this is

genden >> okay, so this is the arts and humanities research council, which has funded a study by academics at the university of roehampton. and they've said that basically , shakespeare was that basically, shakespeare was what white, male, cisgender and shouldn't really be bothered with anymore. >> his £800,000 of more of more taxpayers money going towards this stuff. they've still got two years. i feel like this study should be stopped straight away and regain money that away and regain any money that they from this, and it's they can from this, and it's ridiculous. like you're judging him hundreds of years him of a time hundreds of years ago you know what, there ago where, you know what, there were a of white men back then. >> it's odd, isn't it? it's odd. and they're to impose and they're trying to impose queer onto these plays. i queer theory onto these plays. i mean, completely mean, it's completely anachronistic what they were doing with joan arc, joan of arc. >> yeah, yeah. and all. anybody dodi who any female in the past who wore a pair of trousers is basically non—binary. >> yeah. suddenly non—binary. okay free speech okay look, next on free speech nation, takes nation, lee anderson takes on the brigade. and jeremy the fire brigade. and jeremy hunt £100,000 not much hunt says £100,000 is not much of salary . it's almost time of a salary. it's almost time for social sensations. do for social sensations. please do not anywhere.

welcome back to the final part of free speech nation. it's time for social sensations. that's the part of the where we the part of the show where we look at what's been going viral this week on the dreaded social media. now, up, reform mp media. now, first up, reform mp and host lee anderson and gb news host lee anderson tried to find out from the head of the dorset and wiltshire fire authority her force had been authority why her force had been branded racist branded institutionally racist and have much success. and he didn't have much success. let's a look. and he didn't have much success. let'i a look. and he didn't have much success. let'i think a look. and he didn't have much success. let'i think you ok. and he didn't have much success. let'i think you was in agreement >> i think you was in agreement that your was that your force was institutionally racist. is that is that correct? >> i agreed with the with the report. the independent report, and so did the chief fire officer accept the findings? >> could you please tell me, councillor, what unfair advantages white people have in your force ? your force? >> i would hope not. none. not advantages . did i hear you? advantages. did i hear you? >> do they have any advantages? >> do they have any advantages? >> no . >> no. >> no. >> then how can you be

institutionally racist , i sorry , institutionally racist, i sorry, i might have to get back to . i might have to get back to. >> i mean, this happens all the time, but didn't it happen in america, where princeton university said we are? they confessed we are institutionally racist. so the department of education said, okay, well, we'll not we'll investigate you and not give you your funding. then you can't have a race. against can't have a race. it's against the law, they don't really the law, but they don't really mean do they? mean it. do they? >> no, they just want to. >> no, no, they just want to. virtue signalling going yeah, we're baddies and we're we're baddies and we're going it's going to do better. but it's like, are you better. like, well how are you better. and that's he he called and that's what he and he called them on it. and it was quite them out on it. and it was quite clever of phrasing it in a clever way of phrasing it in a way that she suddenly sort of revealed the whole thing be revealed the whole thing to be emperor's clothes. >> want know. i want >> well, i want to know. i want to know. but, louis, there are such things racist such things as racist institutions, racist systems like crow a racist like jim crow was a racist system. it was built in. but when a university when a modern day university says, are says, yes, we are institutionally racist, i want says, yes, we are insknow, nally racist, i want says, yes, we are insknow, okay, racist, i want says, yes, we are insknow, okay, what, i want says, yes, we are insknow, okay, what aspects of to know, okay, what aspects of your racist? your institution are racist? who put there? do you have put them there? why do you have these systems in place? they these systems in place? and they don't because not. no,

don't because they're not. no, they've got a conflicting view. >> hand, think >> on one hand, they do think they're institutionally racist. they yes. they hate themselves. yes. that's with the that's the problem with the western that people western world, is that people hate so when hate themselves. so when they they think i'm bad, i'm against they think i'm bad, i'm against the patriarchy. i'm against white like that woman in white people like that woman in the other story, which he's like anti—white. they do believe it, but at same time, they want but at the same time, they want their funding. >> i'll tell you what the >> well, i'll tell you what the american universities are institutionally american universities are institdiscriminate against asian they discriminate against asian pacific they pacific people. yes, they they have to get much higher marks to get in because they all do so well. yeah, but that's not considered racism. >> but is racism. i know it >> but it is racism. i know it is. this >> but it is racism. i know it is . this is the thing about you, is. this is the thing about you, andrew. god bless you. you see hypocrisy. yeah. you see that? and some people don't see it. some people don't see it as hypocritical when i was a kid, they didn't let jews in to these universities because were universities because there were too jews. now, too many smart jews. now, obviously, declined . obviously, we've declined. >> speak for yourself, louis. okay. we're going to move on now, next up, chancellor jeremy hunt appeared on the camilla tominey show this morning, tried to his surprising claim

to defend his surprising claim that £100,000 is not a huge salary. let's have a look . salary. let's have a look. >> 100 grand isn't a large amount of money to earn . amount of money to earn. >> well, i was talking to a lady who was explaining to me the average house prices in that part of the world, £670,000. if you've got a mortgage, if you're paying you've got a mortgage, if you're paying childcare, what looks like a very high salary doesn't go as far as you might think it would . would. >> oh, no. i mean, if the average is, what, 35 grand? yeah, 100,000 is more. it's three times as much, right? yeah. >> and it's so ridiculous that in an election year you have a chancellor speaking this way. >> yeah. read the room out of touch. yeah. i mean, for goodness sake, even if you think that double down on it. >> i know it's insane. >> i know it's insane. >> 100,000. i mean, i know you earn a lot more, but, you know, from your other projects. yeah >> from this, not from >> not not from this, not from this mugs the calendars. >> yeah. you make a lot, but £100,000. do you think that's enough would happy with

that? >> you know what? i understand that in a place, that i grew up in a rich place, in a rich town, in a rich city, in a rich town, in a rich city, in the greatest country, in the world. and you want more money. and the problem and maybe that's the problem with the british people they with the british people is they don't have high expectations. they expectations. they just us low expectations. >> bring this back to >> you always bring this back to the problem with british the problem with the british people you hate us, you people because you hate us, you hate country, don't hate hate our country, don't hate you. >> i think you could have >> i just think you could have you to be much you could be modified to be much better. go. better. okay there we go. >> let's now through some >> let's now talk through some of your unfiltered dilemmas. i'm going to clip that and going to clip that bit and put it perfect okay. it online. that's perfect okay. our dilemma from our first dilemma comes from seb.seb our first dilemma comes from seb. seb says i was out for dnnks seb. seb says i was out for drinks with friends this week and was turn to buy and it was my turn to buy a round. i ordered and the bartender asked me to pay before round. i ordered and the baihadier asked me to pay before round. i ordered and the baihad made ed me to pay before round. i ordered and the baihad made ed rdrinks.ay before round. i ordered and the baihad made ed rdrinks. myiefore he had made the drinks. my friends normal, but friends say that's normal, but surely you pay once you've received the service you paid for. doesn't like for. it doesn't seem like a great dilemma. i guess bartenders just different, procedures. >> yeah i used procedures. >> yeah iused work procedures. >> yeah i used work in a >> yeah, i used to work in a bar. no, you pay, and then you make drinks. yeah. it's just make the drinks. yeah. it's just like that bit out like you just get that bit out of is right? yeah. of the way. is that right? yeah. >> especially if it's >> and especially if it's a cocktail. yeah >> what's what 10s would

>> just what's what10s would make that much of a difference. >> what do you think, lewis? >> what do you think, lewis? >> well, it depends if the patrons were black. >> what do you mean? >> what do you mean? >> it depends. if black, >> it depends. if they're black, it's racist. they're white, it's racist. if they're white, it's racist. if they're white, it's not racist. obviously, these are white. these are not white. >> this isn't issue of race. >> this isn't an issue of race. we're talking about. >> no, i'm saying what i'm saying. that worse than >> no, i'm saying what i'm s meant. hat worse than >> no, i'm saying what i'm smeant. hat not worse than >> no, i'm saying what i'm smeant. hat not going se than >> no, i'm saying what i'm smeant. hat not going to than >> no, i'm saying what i'm smeant. hat not going to clip i meant. we're not going to clip that okay. that bit. okay. >> quickly. we've got to >> very quickly. we've got to have another one. our second dilemma from kelly. kelly dilemma comes from kelly. kelly says, i on first date says, i went on a first date this week, and said had this week, and he said he had tickets to comedy show when he tickets to a comedy show when he failed was it. it was failed to mention was it. it was at the royal albert hall. how on earth top for our earth do i top this for our second date? well, palace of versailles, something versailles, probably something like you think, louis? >> when i miss the first part, i'm thinking. >> when i miss the first part, i'm oh,iking. >> when i miss the first part, i'm oh,ikingweren't >> when i miss the first part, i'moh,ikingweren't listening. >> oh, you weren't listening. >> oh, you weren't listening. >> i thinking what >> no, i was thinking about what i before, which could be i said before, which could be horrendous, suggest, i said before, which could be horrego>us, suggest, i said before, which could be horre go to , suggest, i said before, which could be horre go to josh suggest, i said before, which could be horre go to josh then,uggest, i said before, which could be horre go to josh then, because let's go to josh then, because he was listening. >> the first place >> what is the first place i think if i just may be so bold, a threesome? >> you are being bold. i don't think a good idea. think that's a very good idea. i think that's a very good idea. i think that's a very good idea. i think that's terrible advice. i think that's terrible advice. i think just do you know what?

don't about topping the don't worry about topping the other date. they take other person's date. they take you hall. take you to the albert hall. take them to a little chef. it's not about that. it's about the company. about being good company. it's about being a good human being, isn't it? no, no. ignore ignore ignore him, ignore him. >> paying, so they took it >> i was paying, so they took it to hall. now to the albert hall. and now where go? because the where do they go? because the first was there. but it's first play was there. but it's the hall. there's 5000 the albert hall. there's 5000 seats such a special. >> it's very impersonal, isn't it? well, thanks it? okay, well, look, thanks for joining speech joining us for free speech nation. was week when nation. this was the week when shakespeare denounced shakespeare was denounced for ruining thatcher ruining theatre. maggie thatcher was villain. and was branded a villain. and jeremy 100 grand jeremy hunt said 100 grand wasn't that much a wasn't really all that much as a salary. thanks my panel, josh salary. thanks to my panel, josh and to of my and lewis and to all of my guests this evening. if you guests this evening. and if you want us, live the want to join us, live in the studio and part of our studio and be part of our wonderful you can wonderful audience, you can easily at easily do that. you can apply at sro .com. tuned sro audiences .com. stay tuned for tonight that's for mark dolan tonight that's coming and don't forget coming up next. and don't forget headliners night headliners is on every night at 11:00. the night 11:00. that's the late night paper preview show, where comedians the comedians talk you through the next news stories. next day's top news stories. thanks much for watching thanks ever so much for watching free nation. farewell . free speech nation. farewell. >> that warm feeling inside from

boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news. >> hello. here's your latest weather update from the met office for gb news. we saw quite a day weather wise across the uk on sunday, but things are turning more unsettled once again during the week ahead with wind and rain at times. a ridge of high brought of high pressure brought a quieter sunday, low quieter day on sunday, but low pressure already gathering quieter day on sunday, but low pressurethe already gathering quieter day on sunday, but low pressurethe westiy gathering quieter day on sunday, but low pressurethe westiy gathat ng quieter day on sunday, but low pressurethe westiy gathat will towards the west and that will move the ahead to move in during the week ahead to return unsettled conditions . return to unsettled conditions. wind already arriving wind and rain already arriving across southwest of across the west and southwest of the for the overnight period, the uk for the overnight period, some rain turning quite some of that rain turning quite heavy , whereas towards some of that rain turning quite hea north , whereas towards some of that rain turning quite hea north and , whereas towards some of that rain turning quite hea north and east'hereas towards some of that rain turning quite hea north and east it'szas towards some of that rain turning quite hea north and east it's clearer. rds the north and east it's clearer. just 1 or 2 showers lingering and certainly a touch frost and certainly a touch of frost possible north east possible in the north and east by the early of monday by the early hours of monday morning. out towards morning. whereas out towards the west southwest those west and southwest those temperatures west and southwest those tempeiasires west and southwest those tempeias for itself , climb. as for monday itself, with a very wet days in store, cost some western and southwestern areas, particularly across of across the south—west of england. rain england. some very heavy rain developing here times, developing here at times, whereas towards and whereas towards the north and east picture, at east it's a bright picture, at least time, before least for a time, before wind and starts move in from and rain starts to move in from

the turning to snow the south—west, turning to snow as reaches colder air across as it reaches colder air across parts especially on parts of scotland, especially on the north of the central the hills north of the central belt, particularly later belt, and particularly later on in the day. temperatures peaking at towards the at 12 celsius down towards the south—east a bit colder though towards and northeast towards the north and northeast as for tuesday, what a very unsettled day is expected across scotland. rain and snow at times snow chiefly hills, but snow chiefly on the hills, but some rain and some of some of that rain and some of that snow could be quite heavy elsewhere. pretty elsewhere. it's a pretty unsettled or showers unsettled day. rain or showers never far away, and those never too far away, and those temperatures struggling , temperatures struggling, reaching figures at reaching an average figures at best pretty best and staying pretty unsettled week ahead with unsettled in the week ahead with showers spells showers or longer spells of rain. again, rain. and again, those temperatures the rain. and again, those tem doublezs the rain. and again, those tem double figures the rain. and again, those tem double figures looks the rain. and again, those tem double figures looks like the low double figures looks like things are heating up. >> boxt boilers sponsors of weather on

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this is mark dolan. tonight in my big opinion, this weekend sees the four year anniversary of the first covid lockdown. we're still paying the price for that madness. never again . my that madness. never again. my mark meets guest is the legendary us politician bob mcewen, whose traditional conservative views led him to be described as a textbook republican . he'll be talking to republican. he'll be talking to me about joe biden, donald trump and the race for the white house, one of america's politics, most colourful figures. he joins me before the end of the hour in the big story. do the tragic events of the last couple of days remind us just how loved and important our royal family are? i'll be joined in the studio by one of the country's leading royal authors, and it might take a ten. sir keir starmer is to hand more power to the unions , with more power to the unions, with even blairite mastermind peter mandelson worrying it will hurt businesses. can britain afford a

labour government? i'll be deaung