gb news. >> good evening. so we learned overnight that it was indeed communist china that hacked the electoral commission's website. and therefore , they had the and therefore, they had the details of million british details of 40 million british voters. what on earth do we do next? dame saira khan has produced a report for the government. and you know what she says? 75% of us are now scared to speak out and say what we really think . is there any we really think. is there any end to this? and the farmers have decided to revolt. and yes, they're in parliament square this evening. i went down to meet some of them earlier on, but what is it? they really want the british government in brexit britain to do? but before all of that, let's get the news with polly middlehurst . polly middlehurst. >> nigel, thank you and good evening to you. well, the top story from the gb newsroom as you've been hearing the deputy prime minister has accused china of being responsible for two

malicious cyber campaigns targeting the electoral commission databases containing the names and addresses of 40 million registered voters were visible to hackers with links to china in 2021 and 2022. but the government says it didn't affect the outcome of local elections at the time . china has reacted at the time. china has reacted angrily to the accusations , angrily to the accusations, branding them fabricated and malicious slanders . oliver malicious slanders. oliver dowden also said national cyber security support will be in place to help political parties make sure they're protected from foreign influence in the run up to the general election. >> we want now to be as open as possible with the house and with the british public because part of our defence is calling out this behaviour. this is the latest in a clear pattern of hostile activity around dating in china, including the targeting of democratic

institutions and parliamentarians in the united kingdom and beyond . kingdom and beyond. >> oliver dowden, now the conservative party, is facing another by—election in a red wall seat after scott benton resigned, the blackpool south mp was already facing a recall petition. mr benton, who's now running as an independent, was found to have broken commons rules when he was caught out in a sting by the times newspaper offering to act on behalf of gambling investors. the offering to act on behalf of gambling investors . the israeli gambling investors. the israeli prime minister has cancelled his planned white house visit after the us's decision, not to block a un ceasefire vote in gaza. the un security council passed a resolution calling for an immediate ceasefire in gaza for the rest of ramadan. the us abstained from the vote, with 14 other council members, including russia , china and the uk voting russia, china and the uk voting in favour. after the vote, the israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu cancelled his planned

visit to washington, saying the us withdrew from its consistent position . well, in the united position. well, in the united states, donald trump will go on trial next month, the first ever criminal trial of a former or current us president. separately, he scored a significant victory today after an appeals judge granted him an extension to pay a fine in ten days time, but also reducing his liability from 360 to £140 million. that means new york state authorities can't now seize his assets in a fraud case dunng seize his assets in a fraud case during which he's been accused of inflating his net worth. republicans overseas spokesperson jennifer ewing told gb news earlier mr trump's legal challenges are having a positive effect on his popularity in the polls, with each one, trump's numbers went up right, so people do not care about this. >> they know that donald trump, especially in this case, has been one of the most well known real estate moguls in new york city for half a century. nothing

like this has ever been brought up. he ran for president , as we up. he ran for president, as we know. nothing like it was brought up during his presidency . and so now when he decides to run again, this is coming out. >> jennifer ewing now for the latest stories, do sign up to gb news alerts. scan the qr code on your screen or go to gb news. com slash alerts . com slash alerts. >> do you remember back in 2016 after the shock brexit vote? and then of course, trump winning in america? we were told it was russia, russia, russia, russia that were damaging our democracy, interfering in the electoral process. well, in the end, after a big high court case in this country, that will prove to be completely untrue . but the to be completely untrue. but the real problem, the real danger to our democracy of course, always was china. and we learn overnight . we'd heard in august overnight. we'd heard in august last year that the electoral

commission's website had been compromised, their database had been compromised, and we learn overnight that, yes, actually the chinese communist party now have access to 40 million voters in this country. and their data. well, to respond to this in the house of commons earlier, we heard from the deputy prime minister, oliver dowden. >> i can confirm today that chinese state affiliated actors were responsible for two malicious cyber campaigns targeting both our democratic institutions and parliamentary organs. that is why the united kingdom has today sanctioned two individuals and one entity associated with the chinese state affiliated apt 31 group for involvement in malicious cyber activity targeting officials, government entities and parliamentarians around the world. >> what a how tough that sounds to you in terms of a response.

but one member of parliament, sir iain duncan smith, was, shall we say, less than impressed. >> whilst i welcome these two sanctions from the government , sanctions from the government, it is a little bit this statement like an elephant giving birth to a mouse. the reality is that in those three years the chinese have trashed the sino—british agreement. they have been committing murder and slave labour and genocide in xinjiang . we have had churches xinjiang. we have had churches broken and in hong kong , false broken and in hong kong, false court cases against jimmy lai >> great quote, elephant giving birth to a mouse. i rather like that, sir. ian's here. i'll ask him about where that came from in a moment. but it's all going to be okay. it's all going to be absolutely fine, because the chinese ambassador has been summoned us lord summoned to meet us lord cameron, foreign secretary . cameron, the foreign secretary. >> we must now enter a new era of relations with china, dealing with the contemporary chinese communist party as it really is, not as we would wish it to be. and today's announcement should

mark moment where mark a watershed moment where the uk takes a stand for values of human rights and the international rules based system upon which we all depend. china should immediately be labelled as a. >> well, we don't get as many technical mess ups on gb news as we used to, but there was one just there. because because lord cameron, we like ian duncan smith, but we were supposed to have cameron, and cameron have lord cameron, and cameron said, you know, really very naughty, very naughty . the same naughty, very naughty. the same lord cameron who was david cameron as prime minister, along with his chancellor of the exchequer, osborne , exchequer, george osborne, decided that we had a great new future with china. indeed even ianed future with china. indeed even invited the chinese president down to his local pub on a sunday lunchtime for a pint. but given this, given the hacking into individuals, given that 40 million people's data is now going to be in the hands of the chinese communists, what next? what do we actually do next? i'd love to hear from you . farage at

love to hear from you. farage at gbnews.com what now? what on earth do we do? because it seems to me that we don't really have a policy. well, i'm joined by sir iain duncan smith, conservative member of parliament for chingford and woodford i'm also woodford green. and i'm also joined luke de pulford, joined by luke de pulford, executive of the executive director of the inter—parliamentary alliance on china . ian, you know, one china. ian, you know, one liners, great quotes. we where did the elephant giving birth to the mouse come from ? the mouse come from? >> well, it just popped into my head as i was watching this tortuous procedure when i couldn't understand why they'd hiked this all up over the weekend, only to discover that it's a tiny thing they're doing. the company, the entity, by the way, is tiny. i mean, it's literally a few few hundred thousand in terms of turnover and tiny of people. so and tiny number of people. so really pathetic and very small when we very well that . and when we know very well that. and here's where luke and i are together, because we both formed ipac, the inter—parliamentary alliance from china together, i've sanctioned . six other i've been sanctioned. six other of my colleagues in parliament have been sanctioned, and your

family sanctioned too, and family are sanctioned too, and all are sanctioned all the families are sanctioned at time. that does at the same time. and that does cause have cause difficulties. we have no idea the foreign idea from the foreign office whether red notices. whether we face red notices. that's a on sight. if we that's a rest on sight. if we enter a country that has an extradition with china extradition agreement with china or , they've been very or hong kong, they've been very slow hopeless. but slow and very hopeless. but since sanctioned three since we were sanctioned three years ago tomorrow, what's actually happened over sanctioning is nothing. they've trashed the sino—british agreement. america sanctioned over 40 people, senior people in hong kong. for that, we have sanctioned no. one and we used to run the place and we're the signatories to the agreement. it goes on and on, isn't the truth of it. >> iain duncan smith, that there are many in upper levels of the british who, british establishment who, when they from politics or they retire from politics or very senior jobs in the civil service, even even the intelligence services, finish up as very lucrative contracts as non—executive directors of chinese companies. >> yeah. so i think you were meaning to say lickspittle and supporters of the chinese communist party , no matter how

communist party, no matter how it looks to me that lot. yes. yeah. well, i have to say that i'm afraid china understands us. perhaps sometimes better than we understand ourselves. they know that galvanises some that what galvanises some people, the great and the good, is somehow, if you pay them a lot of money, they can somehow find how wonderful you are. even though may have been on the though they may have been on the other of the fence. and other side of the fence. and that, what that, i'm afraid, is what effective, oh, yeah. effective, isn't it? oh, yeah. well, out there, well, they're they're out there, you i've attacked. you know, i've been attacked. god many times luke's god knows how many times luke's been many, many times been attacked. many, many times by the very same people who are in the of the in receipt of the of the emperor's yuan. luke, how many members do you have of the inter—parliamentary alliance on china ? china? >> t- t— t 300 now in 35 >> it's over 300 now in 35 countries. and a very disturbing thing that we learned in the past hour was that the us department of justice had identified this big cyber attack as being principally against ipac. so all of our eu members have been attacked and not just four mps in the uk, but apparently well over 40, well over 40 were announced in the us press release. that's where we

learned about it. we didn't learned about it. we didn't learn about it via the uk government , and we certainly government, and we certainly didn't hear about it on the floor of the commons today. >> so the truth of it is, luke, that if a member of parliament in this country, from whatever party right, party decides, right, i'm joining ford's group, joining to paul ford's group, i'm to put my head up over i'm going to put my head up over the parapet. the trouble is, they may well be sanctioned. >> well, right to point >> well, you're right to point out a cross party out that it is a cross party thing. is authentic as it thing. it is authentic as it should be, and one of the lovely things about today was that there unanimity. there was complete unanimity. unanimity and unanimity across the house, and everybody disturbed unanimity across the house, and everdisappointed disturbed unanimity across the house, and everdisappointed by disturbed unanimity across the house, and everdisappointed by distlthed and disappointed by what the government forth government brought forth in response massive cyber response to this massive cyber attack. but yes, they all take risks, and some of them have paid. have been sanctioned risks, and some of them have pathe have been sanctioned risks, and some of them have pathe eu, have been sanctioned risks, and some of them have pathe eu, they'vezen sanctioned risks, and some of them have pathe eu, they've been|nctioned in the eu, they've been sanctioned the and in the sanctioned in the uk and in the us. so we can't tell them that this works. >> how uk members of >> how many uk members of parliament currently part this? >> it's just %l this? >> it's just 55, something >> it's just about 55, something like that. >> okay, it's not an >> okay, so it's not an insignificant number and do you feel privately a lot more feel that privately a lot more agree just too scared, agree but are just too scared, i mean, it's a good question. i i mean, it's a good question. i i mean, it's a good question. i i mean, it's true because if you look at the voting when we put

forward, as luke will recall, the genocide , statement in terms the genocide, statement in terms of the house, the house almost unanimously passed the fact that they believe china is committing genocide , and the british genocide, and the british government refuses call that government refuses to call that genocide and is a result of that. >> parliament believes it is . >> parliament believes it is. the british government doesn't. but an answer to that. most of them agree with ipp. so luke's right. >> so what should we do next, luke? what i mean, i think the government well, there isn't really a policy be absolutely really a policy to be absolutely frank this. what should do next? >> well, i think the security minister has done a pretty decent thing. he brought forward the act last decent thing. he brought forward the and act last decent thing. he brought forward the and it's act last decent thing. he brought forward the and it's got act last decent thing. he brought forward the and it's got somethingt decent thing. he brought forward the and it's got something in year, and it's got something in it the foreign influence it called the foreign influence registration nigel registration scheme. nigel ludicrously , we haven't decided ludicrously, we haven't decided whether put china in whether or not to put china in the enhanced tier of that scheme. still an scheme. we're still having an argument that. amazingly argument over that. amazingly hopefully events will hopefully today's events will finally debate to bed. finally put that debate to bed. we need to have them labelled in the enhanced tier of the foreign influence registration scheme, but we need to sanction those responsible and we haven't done

that today. we've sanctioned a couple of hackers. we didn't sanction the government entities responsible . responsible. >> that's i think that >> i think that's i think that is the point. that's perhaps is the point. and that's perhaps why ian was so upset with what they've ian, what would they've done. ian, what would you see government you like to see your government do?well, that. i think >> well, exactly that. i think china's to go in the hands china's got to go in the hands part the registration scheme. part of the registration scheme. but i want we have this but also i want we have this ludicrous position where we refer as an epoch refer to china as an epoch defining challenge . i mean, you defining challenge. i mean, you can see sir humphrey doing this one, aren't you? and then, of course, apparently we're meant to with but but to deal with it, but but pragmatic, the other pragmatic, what was the other one? pragmatism , i think. one? it's pragmatism, i think. robust. robust pragmatism. that's it. yes. so now you can see them literally. they're on the other thing is right now. so we need them to be called a threat in in that rishi threat in that, in that rishi sunak did once use that word and then rowed back from it. he did his threat. he called his systemic threat. he called it. would like to put that it. i would like him to put that back the integrated back in to the integrated review, because what they review, because that's what they are. everything from are. and everything follows from that in bowels of the that deep in the bowels of the foreign we also foreign office. we also discovered they had been discovered that they had been circulating last year , a

circulating late last year, a policy statement that they would no longer sanction chinese officials. okay, no longer any more sanctions for china. we managed to get a copy of that. i hauled that out last week on the floor of the house, and i said, so, is the policy now no longer sanctioning? at first, they denied the document existed. then to say it does then we were able to say it does and show them that they then got, well, be got, oh, well, it must be a mistake. somebody has written that that's gone that wrongly. that's gone through departments. through different departments. so today was so i wonder what today was really about. was about really all about. was it about actually sanctioning anybody? was yourself was it trying to get yourself off hook where we discovered off the hook where we discovered they planning they weren't planning to sanction all? sanction anybody at all? >> gentlemen, you. and we >> gentlemen, thank you. and we did, course, approach the did, of course, approach the chinese embassy. and we had asked zheng zongyuan , i think asked zheng zongyuan, i think that's how we pronounce his name, and we asked him to come and appear on the show. but the chinese government has denied launching any cyber attacks. and a spokesman from the embassy said this. the so—called cyber attacks by china against the uk are completely fabricated and

malicious slanders . china has malicious slanders. china has always firmly fought all forms of cyber attacks . according to of cyber attacks. according to law. china does not encourage, support or condone cyber attacks. we urge the relevant parties to stop spreading false information and stop their self staged anti china political farce. well there you are never say on gb news that we don't provide balance. but i have to say as far as i'm concerned, too many, too many in our establishment frankly have proven on this issue to be corruptible. that is my view . corruptible. that is my view. now, in just a moment, we're going to discuss a government report produced for the department for levelling up by dame saira khan that says 75% of us are now genuinely fearful in pubuc us are now genuinely fearful in public to speak our minds. i'm surprised the figure is so low. actually

well, i asked the question of you. what now? in terms of china, what should our policy be? one viewer says china are no friend of ours. but i worry as to how we are meant to approach such a dangerous state. steve says china may well pose a threat to us, but let's face it, our own government and security services not only have access to all our personal details, but they are the ones who failed to protect us from such attacks. well, steve, alright, i get that. you know , i get the fact that. you know, i get the fact that. you know, i get the fact that our government has a lot of data on us and we may not like our current government. some people may even find labour people may even find the labour alternative not especially appealing. , they're appealing. but folks, they're not the chinese communist party. they're not carrying out acts that this government is in china. they're not breaking international treaties the way they have over hong kong. you may think our lot are rotten, but i think the chinese lot are even more rotten now. a report

produced for the department for levelling up by dame saira khan came back today with, i think, some quite disturbing conclusions. 75% of us are scared to speak our minds for fear that somebody may be offended. we're still , behaviour offended. we're still, behaviour thatis offended. we're still, behaviour that is extremist behaviour often simply doesn't get called out because people fear reprisals . now, perhaps none of reprisals. now, perhaps none of this stuff is a great surprise to you, but it still says an awful lot about the kind of country we've become over the course of the last couple of decades. i remember being told, as a kid sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can never hurt me. well, goodness gracious me, we've moved a very long way from that. i'm joined by luke tryl, uk director of more in common. luke. was there anything in this report that

shocked you and surprised you, or was it kind of what you expected to hear? >> well, fortunately, actually, lots of wasn't shocking to us. >> us. >> that was my view in common, because, you know, we spend a lot of time talking to people around country, who've around the country, who've experienced some of the things which were detailed in this report . report. >> freedom restricting harassment the phrase that harassment was the phrase that kept coming up. >> yeah. so this is a really important time that sarah khan coined in this report. and this was a sense that there is this new sort of new development of freedom restricting harassment, which is basically when people use intimidation, when they use abuse or when they use threats to basically force people to censor or self—censor themselves. and that can range from she talks about doxing about death threats, about rape threats. and i think there's a bit of a misunderstanding which sarah busts in this report , that sarah busts in this report, that this only happens online. and no, she details examples of where it happens in person and

it doesn't just happen to elected representatives. we know mps face threats. we've seen it recently over the conflict in gaza, but actually it's a whole range of different groups. we're seeing this. it's academics, it's artists , it's teachers. in it's artists, it's teachers. in the case of the batley grammar school, which sarah details in the report . so it's a really the report. so it's a really worrying thing. and you know, she did some polling as part of this report and found that 76% of people were restricting basically what they said for fear of being of being at the being abused. >> is this the logical conclusion of hate speech laws? >> because laws under hate speech laws, it's hate speech. if the person or group you're talking about themselves feel offended. are we are we heading down a path as a result of well—intended , i've no doubt well—intended, i've no doubt well—intended, i've no doubt well—intended, legislation ? that well—intended, legislation? that is that is basically shrivelling

free speech. >> i actually think this is coming from the other end. i think this is what sarah details in the report , is where in the report, is where organisations like local authorities , sometimes the authorities, sometimes the police, sometimes schools themselves think that the best thing to do is to appease those who have the most extreme views or the loudest voices. yeah, to quieten them down. and then that sort of moderate majority ends up being the people who suffer and being restricted because it's those with the loudest views. you know, i used to work in for education ofsted. i was a special adviser in the department for education. and what i saw there, you know, there were those protests in birmingham outside schools for their education and their sex education content. and what was people who what you got was people who weren't school weren't parents of the school weren't parents of the school were coming in or hijacking these protests and were abusing teachers for, you know, just doing their job and teaching and one of the recommendations sarah makes is that perhaps we need a buffer zone now outside of schools to protect 100 and 150m. yeah not for industrial action.

so not strikes, but for things like we saw in birmingham to make sure that teachers aren't facing that abuse, just going into school and doing their job. into school and doing theirjob. so is the big fault line here. >> religion. >> religion. >> it's one of the big fault lines. certainly you know, lots of the examples which, sarah, documents are religious, but there are also examples of, you know, far right activity, but also debates , for instance, also debates, for instance, around, trans and gender critical conflicts there as well. there's a huge range. there's even one example where she talks and i know this will be particularly disturbing to you people, comedians who have sympathy for brexit, not being willing to express their views because they think they'll be ostracised, and look, the truth is we all self—censor a little bit because, you know, british people are decent. >> we don't want to be rude. we self—censor to the point that, yeah, we don't. >> certainly we don't want >> well, certainly we don't want to incite. yeah. and we want to

make our point without doubt. yeah. we don't generally want to wilfully offend exactly that and that, you know, it's healthy because, you know, if we all just said what we thought all the time, bad thing. >> what this report is talking aboutis >> what this report is talking about is something deeper than that. it's where people are afraid expressing their afraid of expressing their beliefs worried beliefs because they're worried about and some about the consequences. and some of be sort of of that might be sort of policing of language. but but a lot and body of the lot of it and the body of the report actually about people report is actually about people facing extremist facing threats from extremist groups. go straight to that. >> and i'm joined down the line by mohammed amin, former chair of the concerned muslim forum. hello there . welcome back on the hello there. welcome back on the program. now, mohammed , the program. now, mohammed, the strongest example in this report is about the teacher from batley in yorkshire. and this was a someone teaching religious education who showed those teenagers cartoons of the prophet mohammed . and you know, prophet mohammed. and you know, we've all grown up with the idea

that we can take the mickey out of the pope or the archbishop of canterbury, as i readily do on this program. but this teacher has literally, through fear, been forced into hiding for the last three years. there is a major problem here, isn't there? >> good evening. nigel. yes, there is. i downloaded the full report today and page through all of it fairly quickly. i read the batley stuff more slowly and i followed the batley story in the media. since it first broke. although i've got no personal on the ground experience and i think the way that this teacher has been treated is utterly deplorable . and as sarah khan deplorable. and as sarah khan criticises the local authority, the school etc. for failing to stand up to him and i think he's been deplorably treated for doing absolutely nothing wrong. >> but you know yourself there are elements and i'm going to be

very careful and use that word elements of the islamic religion in our country that will tolerate absolutely no criticism of the prophet, no criticism of their religion what so ever. and as such, that really runs against what we generally believe to be british values . believe to be british values. >> there are some muslims, as you say, who hold those attitudes as they are. they often end up breaking the law. when you murder somebody, for example, because they are the wrong kind of muslim, that's that's a crime. and secondly, it is fundamentally un—islamic. if we had time, i could point you towards endless numbers of muslim scholars, including a former president of indonesia , former president of indonesia, who are utterly opposed to any kind of blasphemy laws, as they say, and as i say, god needs no defence. but there are some muslims around who hold these attitudes and we should not put

up with them. >> so what do you say? not put up with them? what should we do? >> well, you you can't stop somebody believing that blasphemy is really, really wrong. >> what you can do is stop them trying to act on those beliefs. they are. they should not be allowed to harass people. they certainly are not should not be allowed to assault people. and as sarah khan says, this freedom restricting harassment should not tolerated . and if not be tolerated. and if necessary, we need legislation against it. >> okay, mohammed amin, thank you for joining >> okay, mohammed amin, thank you forjoining me on the you for joining me on the programme. i'll give a last word to luke tryl. you know, i mean, mohammed, i mean very decent chap and all that. as most muslim people living in britain are. but i do worry there's a growing number within that community will no community who will brook no criticism , no open debate of any criticism, no open debate of any kind at all. >> i mean, i think what you saw in that case was the thing which worries me the most is that teacher, that teacher, if you read and i would urge every politician and policy maker to read sarah khan's case study of

what happened in batley, because that teacher was left with post—traumatic stress disorder, his and he his life was ruined and he wasn't supported. the focus was all on how do we defuse this as quickly as possible? speaking again to so—called community leaders who weren't parents, were self—appointed. as the report points out , were self—appointed. as the report points out, and it was all about diffusing. he actually taught a lesson which had been part of the lesson plan for three years previously . and yet three years previously. and yet the school again, reading that report, i just think totally failed. >> i think that's what the sarukhan report above all shows us, is that this difficulty in saying what we think is getting worse, not better. luke, thank you very much indeed for joining me. farmers are me. now the farmers are revolting. they're revolting. yes, they're revolting. yes, they're revolting in parliament revolting today in parliament square. i went out to meet and greet with them earlier, but i wonder, i wonder, what is it they really, really want? and we're also going to have a look at labour's great british energy

well, labour were out and proud today. in every way. with their their new big plan. it's going to be £8 billion a year for their great british energy company. this will be a state company. this will be a state company , and it's all aiming to company, and it's all aiming to get our electricity generation by 2030 to be carbon neutral. well, what was interesting , and well, what was interesting, and i'm joined by tom burke, chairman of climate think tank e3 . g what was interesting, tom, e3. g what was interesting, tom, you know, you've had starmer going out around the country, some relatively junior figures in the labour party appearing on national media. ed miliband was supposed to be the mastermind behind labour's energy policy. nowhere to be seen. oh, i don't think there's nowhere to be seen. >> i think he's been around. right. well, i didn't see him. well, he's not well that begum i wonder he made for that. ed made a speech actually, just the other week. made a big speech on

it. so it's not that he's nowhere to be seen now. does he attract media attention? that's not to him. not up to him. >> no fair point. so the >> yeah. no fair point. so the big thing here, tom, is, is it actually even credible or possible by 2030 we're possible that by 2030 we're going to have if we wanted to do it , is it an engineering possibility? >> yes. could we do it if we wanted to? yes we could. we'd have to do a lot of other things than the engineering. but yeah, we do an awful we're pretty clever in this country. if we set mind to doing something, set our mind to doing something, we so i don't think we can do it. so i don't think that's a question. it's a question. we be able to do question. will we be able to do it and are we on course to doing it? well, i think so far we're not on course doing it. this not on course to doing it. this government has not done a particularly good trying particularly good job of trying to we do if to of doing what we could do if we our mind to it. question we set our mind to it. question remains be whether remains to be seen whether a labour government would do better. >> you see, i wonder whether the only way you can even get anywhere just to anywhere near this is just to import energy, because import more energy, because you look it. and last full look at it. and the last full year we've got figures for 2022. so we import 40% of all energy.

we import 13% of our electricity . and when we import stuff we say, oh, that's that's there's no carbon dioxide emissions. so really i just wonder and it's a bit like steelmaking and many other arguments. aren't we just conning ourselves? >> well, i don't think we're conning ourselves. i think we're not putting in the effort we need to get to where we say we want to get to, and, you know, we can do this stupidly, or we can do it smartly. and you and i have before about, well, have talked before about, well, if nuclear power if you build nuclear power stations, not smart stations, that's not very smart way it. way to do it. >> if you insulated people well, well, you say that. >> yeah. go on. >> well, you disagree me. >> well, you disagree with me. as worry was you as i recall, my worry was you may be changing your mind. you're allowed to do that. look, nuclear fine, but ain't nuclear is fine, but we ain't going have by 2030. no, going to have it by 2030. no, that's absolutely true. we're certainly going to agree about that. thing is what that. the key real thing is what can do fastest quickest can you do fastest and quickest that give drive people's that will give drive people's bills down soonest. and for bills down soonest. and that for an incoming labour government

driving incomes driving bills down and incomes up their priority. up will be their core priority. so well, the so what can you do? well, the first you want to do is first thing you want to do is make every single building in this leak tight because this country leak tight because we're got that sorry new we're we've got that sorry new build, know every single building, all building, a new buildings, all the got. the buildings we've got. they should critical. national should be critical. national infrastructure. they're the leakiest europe leakiest buildings in europe that reduces our that really reduces our competitiveness . i'm talking competitiveness. i'm talking about not just homes. also about not just homes. i'm also talking about all of our small and medium sized enterprises, where going to come where growth is going to come from. less from. we're making them less competitive not competitive because we're not focusing on the thing that would get bills down fastest, be cheapest to do, and easiest to do in terms of all the other, the right houses. >> i get it with old houses it's more difficult. but what about this idea of floating wind this other idea of floating wind farms? i am i really reading this? well floating wind? how does that work ? does that work? >> well, well, well it likes it works exactly the same way as anything else that floats, you know. so how does it work? yeah, the real issue. well, it really helps you with is people do worry a bit i think a lot unnecessarily. but they do worry

about the availability of land for renewables are one of the things. if we're going to do this, we've got to make it a thing about how do we get a technology that we can export, how do that are how do we do things that are actually make britain actually going to make britain a manufacturing and industrial nafion? manufacturing and industrial nation? this exactly nation? again, this is exactly the idea you want to do the kind of idea you want to do it now. is it doable? of course it's doable. have are we it's doable. have we are we going to be short of ocean? not in the future. in the near future. >> no. that's true, but we're still going to need aren't still going to need gas, aren't we? we're still going to need fossil for wind fossil fuels for when wind in particular not doing business. >> again, if we do >> actually, again, if we do stupid things, yes, we will. if we do smart things and what we do is we turn the remember, we turn off about half £1 billion worth of electricity every year because we half a trillion sorry, of electricity because we can't move it south to where it's needed. yeah. if we instead of doing that, the cost of that is massive. well the cost of look, we're going to spend $1.8 trillion in the world next year getting the oil out of the

ground. so doing anything to do with energy is expensive. so there's no will need fossil fuel back up. >> well, when a big anti—cyclone when a big anticyclone over when a big anticyclone sits over the february and wind is the uk in february and wind is producing at the minute 2% 3% on a bad day, even with better interconnectors, it still would be too little. >> interconnectors are important, but actually what we really need to do is make with the electricity we're not using now our farms. current now from our wind farms. current wind forms . when you turn that wind forms. when you turn that into hydrogen and use the into a hydrogen and use the hydrogen run our gas fired hydrogen to run our gas fired power, well, look, look, there are make up for that gap. >> of britain's biggest, >> some of britain's biggest, wealthiest , >> some of britain's biggest, wealthiest, most >> some of britain's biggest, wealthiest , most successful wealthiest, most successful entrepreneurs are working on that project . but we're not that very project. but we're not there yet. tom burke, as ever, an interesting debate. i'll make an interesting debate. i'll make a prediction, folks. the only way labour could get to that 2030 figure is if we start importing ever more electricity. would you believe there's even talk now of importing electricity from the united states of america? you really couldn't make it up . now,

couldn't make it up. now, amongst the protests that we've seen out in parliament square today. yes, of course it's tractors. yes, of course it's all sorts of agricultural issues, but one of them is ulez because on the edge of greater london, where there's plenty of farming going on, a lot of these tractors are being caught by the £12, 50 every single day. but anti ulez protesters have moved on to a new tactic. and i have you know, i generally whatever i think about ulez you've never heard me support blade runners or anything like that because law breaking is not good. but this one probably is against the law. but i think it's rather funny. down in shame, anti ulez protesters have been putting bat boxes over the cameras and you can see one there on your screen . this is a bat box. now of course once the bat goes in there under natural england's rules you can't do anything to disturb bats. so i'm sorry, maybe i shouldn't laugh, but i do actually think it's quite innovative and quite funny . and

innovative and quite funny. and a final point on this segment national westminster bank. now you know, their big plans, the sort of tell sid updated mass privatisation. interestingly when i first came to public blows with natwest , the blows with natwest, the government owned 38.6% of natwest shares. that is now down below 30, just below 30. so the government are selling their natwest shares ahead of what they hope is going to be a big float to the public, starting perhaps in july of this year. all i would point out is that the effective price that we bailed natwest out for was £5 a share, and the government are currently selling shares at around about £2.40. there we are. there's competent economic management for you. well, i promised you we'd talk about the farmers protest. and you know what? in just a moment, we will

well, we've seen farming protests all over europe, haven't we? beginning really in a very, very big way. haven't we? beginning really in a very, very big way . at least a very, very big way. at least this round of it with the netherlands and on, of course, to france and to germany. and then, of course, the farmers turned up in brussels and, well, caused setting caused absolute mayhem, setting fire to vehicles and goodness knows what else. indeed, the farmers blocked the major eight arterial rolls, roads in and out of paris, so much so that the president had to intervene. well, we've had a couple of farming protests. we've seen one in canterbury, a couple in doven in canterbury, a couple in dover. well, today the farmers came to london. now, i have to say , unlike the scenes that we say, unlike the scenes that we saw in brussels , in paris, these saw in brussels, in paris, these were a pretty law abiding bunch, as you would pretty much expect from british farmers. but don't misunderstand their behaviour for the passion that they feel. and they're a pretty angry group

of people. so back to the beginning of this. of people. so back to the beginning of this . we were in beginning of this. we were in the common agricultural policy for nearly 50 years, and brussels dictated pretty much what british farming priorities would be through a system of subsidies. we've left the european union. we're in charge, but net zero and many other reasons are making farmers lives difficult . i'm joined live by difficult. i'm joined live by douglas turner farmer, who is in parliament square on his tractor as i speak . parliament square on his tractor as i speak. douglas, two things. i've lost him, i've lost him. i don't believe it. we had a real live farmer. we had a real live farmer at the steering wheel, and we've lost him. the one thing, though, that confused me is what was the primary motive of those turning up for save british farming? because there was a whole mixture of symbols and slogans. some of them are not happy with the new farm payment system. they say we've gone from subsidy on what you plant to for a variety of

environmental subsidies. some farmers told me those payments are coming through very, very late , and when they're hard up, late, and when they're hard up, thatis late, and when they're hard up, that is quite difficult to deal with. other farmers are worried about cheap imports , worried about cheap imports, worried about cheap imports, worried about what new trade deals we might choose to do around the world. other farmers talking very , very strongly about food very, very strongly about food security and what are we doing ? security and what are we doing? what is this, this, this message we're giving that to stop putting out methane and carbon dioxide . we have to reduce the dioxide. we have to reduce the number of cattle that we farm. so i picked up a series of messages, lots of frustration , messages, lots of frustration, but all being done in the most incredibly peaceful and very i thought, british way. well, liz webster is the founder of the save british farming campaign and joins me live in the studio. i was out there watching. i mean, it was really rather it was well done, but the passion is there, isn't it? >> yeah, absolutely. and i love to meet unite.

>> good to meet you. what confused me. you may have heard what i said. there all sorts of different signs on the tractors. you know, signs about, you know, no no food, signs about no farmers, no food, signs about cheap imports, signs about the behaviour of the supermarkets issue after issue after issue. and, and i think the most i think the commonest sign really that i saw was around food security, this feeling that the government aren't that bothered how much of our own food we produce. >> when i go further than that, then bothered at all, not bothered at all. >> so, so do you feel that agriculture is a very low priority? >> well, when boris johnson took office in 2020, there was a leaked memo. i don't know if you remember, the daily mail reported it that britain doesn't need farmers anymore. and, you know, this day, i think know, to this day, i think that's exactly what is unfolding. but as we know with, you know, the promises to bring in cheaper food for britain, we always had the cheapest food

actually in europe and the highest standards . and now we highest standards. and now we have it's not necessarily cheap imports. they're substandard imports. they're substandard imports. they're substandard imports. they're imports which are of lower quality than we produce ourselves. and they are undercutting us and putting us out. >> is that in terms of animal husbandry or what do you mean exactly by that? yeah. >> everything. it's down to how the are kept. it's also the animals are kept. it's also down food is grown, down to how the food is grown, whether it's, arable or whether it's vegetables, fruits or animals . animals are also, animals. animals are also, regularly administered with, antibiotics. we only use antibiotics. we only use antibiotics if the if the animals are ill. so all of those things mean that for the competition, when they're able to make it make that that product at a cheaper price than we are and we're getting, undercut. and not only that, even within the uk, which is astonishing, the english farmer is the worst off because the welsh farmers and the scottish and the northern ireland farmers

still have food subsidies. the engush still have food subsidies. the english government actually withheld the impact assessment about what sfi and arms is going to do. they started removing our subsidies as soon as we left the european union. and so we are by far the worst off. yeah, i mean, we still welsh farmers and scottish farmers are still getting food subsidy. we are not. >> and as i see it, the uk is spending 3 billion a year on farming subsidy, not 6 billion, but it appears we're not doing it. >> boris johnson promised. it. >> borisjohnson promised. he >> boris johnson promised. he promised us actually, that out of european union we'd be of the european union we'd be well after supported well looked after and supported and end up with well looked after and supported and subsidy. end up with well looked after and supported and subsidy. well, nd up with well looked after and supported and subsidy. well, thatp with well looked after and supported and subsidy. well, that hasn't more subsidy. well, that hasn't happened. far from it. >> i think we're spending pretty much same. but i'll get >> i think we're spending pretty much rees—mogg ut i'll get >> i think we're spending pretty much rees—mogg ut on get >> i think we're spending pretty much rees—mogg ut on this in jacob rees—mogg in on this in a moment's time. jacob rees—mogg in on this in a mo and:'s time. jacob rees—mogg in on this in a mo and no, me. jacob rees—mogg in on this in a mo and no, but jacob likes >> and no, but jacob likes hormone fed meat australia. hormone fed meat from australia. >> no no no no no no. what >> no no no no no no no. what jacob and all farmers. no. you're wrong liz. >> jacob wants is what >> what jacob wants is what i want, which is fair labelling. and one of the other complaints in square was in parliament square today was about food labelling. about was about food labelling. so little red tractor that

so this little red tractor that we see when we buy something, does mean that it's does that mean that it's a wholly british or english product moment? product at the moment? >> what we're is >> what we're seeing is a british flag on imported food . british flag on imported food. and there's the small print saying product of brazil or south africa, or how does it get, how does it get a british flag? because it's processed here or packaged here. right? and absolutely outrageous. and it's absolutely outrageous. and it's absolutely outrageous. and people are picking and a lot of people are picking up packets of food thinking it's british and high quality and it's not. and so we think that's really a simple thing that can be fixed very, very quickly. >> so really, you know, talking to you, being out there earlier on today and i've met the odd farmer in a pub in kent here and there over the years . i know who there over the years. i know who they are. i haven't drunk with all of them, i promise, but it seems there's a whole mass of individual issues. >> everything's related, they're all interlinked. everything is related and is actually quite

simple. >> but for a campaign to be successful, there has to be one big push, one big drive. what is it here? is it to get the british government to listen? >> we're going into an election and the conservatives really are on borrowed time . but how many on borrowed time. but how many of them are going to come back next election? depends on your former party, whether they split the vote, but we're not just talking to the tories. we're also talking to labour because we want to see some flesh in on on the bones of their manifesto. we want to know what's coming. we want to know what's coming. we are not going to rest on our laurels. this is the beginning, okay. >> and what of labour said so far on agricultural policy? >> they have guaranteed that there veterinary there will be a veterinary agreement makes feel agreement and that makes us feel agreement and that makes us feel a happier. we really don't a lot happier. we really don't want to accede to cptpp. it means reg regulation, harmonisation. it means hormone fed meat. and we really don't want that. >> well, very, very i mean, it'll be it'll be cataclysmic for us. >> we won't survive it. i'm going to watch this development. >> liz, liz webster, very, very carefully indeed. now, jacob,

you know, we were spending about 6 year on agricultural 6 billion a year on agricultural subsidy. i used to joke half of it went to france. it wasn't quite half, but a lot. did you know, are spending the billion? >> well, the problem is that we're spending it on encouraging people not to farm, which seems to a great mistake. to me to be a great mistake. we're putting into these we're putting it into these wild, environmentalist causes, rather need rather than saying what we need to back farmers produce to do is back farmers to produce food, strongly in food, which i'm strongly in favour i'm not in favour favour of, but i'm not in favour of protectionism and higher pnces of protectionism and higher prices for consumers because i believe our can compete believe our farmers can compete globally. i visit some globally. if i visit some somerset , they are somerset farmers, they are extremely efficient highly extremely efficient and highly competitive innovative , and competitive and innovative, and we need to encourage the best. >> and it's a high end product . >> and it's a high end product. so high end product, which was one the points, being one of the points, was being made that we have to made earlier that we have to focus what are good at and focus on what we are good at and what our protectionism. what are our protectionism. >> does at the moment is protect our beef farmers. french our irish beef farmers. french beef farmers and dutch beef farmers, as opposed to buying cheaper australia. cheaper beef from australia. i have the problem. have no desire the problem. >> problem is that we live >> the problem is that we live in northern hemisphere and in the northern hemisphere and we a very difficult we have a very difficult

climate. >> w- f— e and we know this >> so actually and we know this because when the corn laws were repealed in 1846, we know darned well what happened to agriculture. >> it led to cheap bread. >> it led to cheap bread. >> it led to cheap bread. >> it made society much >> it made the society much better this enormous. >> this agriculture , this has >> this agriculture, this has been an argument. >> has been an argument >> this has been an argument going on for 150 years. >> yes, it's simply wrong. >> yes, it's simply wrong. >> british agriculture didn't collapse >> british agriculture didn't coll.a se >> british agriculture didn't coll.a glut in the market 30 was a glut in the market 30 years later, which comes much after things were much slower in those days. >> it took a long time for that to do you know the to actually do you know what the principles that debate and principles of that debate and this not dissimilar? this debate are not dissimilar? >> they're dissimilar. >> no, they're not dissimilar. >> no, they're not dissimilar. >> very not always go on >> very, very not always go on about the corn laws is my favourite. no no no no no. >> it was a, it was >> and it was a, it was a wonderful upwelling and grassroots campaign and all the rest it. rest of it. >> em- >> but whether we have a conservative or a labour government, i mean, government, do you feel i mean, do you actually think that a labour government be any labour government will be any closer connected to your closer or more connected to your community this conservative one? >> the labour government is in their to make sure that their interest to make sure that britain food, and with britain has got food, and with the way the world is right now, we're very fragile

we're in a very fragile situation, is why we need situation, which is why we need food and farmer food security. and every farmer i talks food security i know talks about food security because how much because we understand how much less food is being. >> we better have a look at net zero commitments to. but another time zero net zero commitments. >> it'll that's your it'll be >> it'll be that's your it'll be it'll be enough enough enough. >> we can we can argue all night about this. >> yes. i'm up i'm up rocketing all night in net zero evening butter blooming net zero is a part of this problem. >> jacob, what's coming 7 up. up? >> what we're going to be talking well there's this talking about. well there's this report about how report that's come out about how our democracy at threat and our democracy is at threat and how need to limit protests how we need to limit protests and things like that. and i want to stand freedom of to stand up for freedom of speech you have to allow speech that you have to allow freedom of speech when you freedom of speech even when you don't what's said. freedom of speech even when you don' i what's said. freedom of speech even when you don'i think'hat's said. freedom of speech even when you don'i think this; said. freedom of speech even when you don'i think this; hasd. and i think this report has a sort of rose tinted spectacle view of what our nation used to be like . right? always had be like. right? always had vigorous about our vigorous debate about how our country should be governed, a proper debate. >> one thing for certain, >> now, one thing for certain, farmers always , always moan farmers always, always moan about weather. have about the weather. let's have a look see what the forecast look and see what the forecast has store us tomorrow . has in store for us tomorrow. >> looks like things are heating

up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news. >> this is your latest weather update from the met office for gb news. good evening to you. the rest of this week we'll be prepared further heavy prepared for further heavy downpours and temperatures, staying around or little staying around about or a little bit average . low pressure bit below average. low pressure is well and truly in control of our weather and will be for the rest of this week. these weather fronts have been making for a pretty soggy day for much of the uk. rain across scotland uk. the rain across scotland falling snow over the hills falling as snow over the hills that continues in the east through the night. elsewhere, it does little bit drier for does turn a little bit drier for staying fairly cloudy and some staying fairly cloudy and some staying chilly . staying fairly chilly. temperatures down into single figures not far a freezing in northern scotland and small wintry showers into the wintry showers coming into the northern and the western isles as we go into tuesday. still a bit more snow over the grampians, although that should ease further showers though to come east of come on the east coast of scotland, central southern scotland, central and southern scotland looking a little bit

dner scotland looking a little bit drier today. will drier compared to today. it will be wetter though, for the be a wetter day though, for the southeast that rain moves in southeast as that rain moves in through tuesday and that spreads into midlands again into the midlands and rain again for ireland. for northern ireland. but something brighter in the something a bit brighter in the southwest south wales, and southwest and south wales, and for eastern england to some glimmers sunshine. it is glimmers of sunshine. but it is going pretty chilly, going to feel pretty chilly, particularly scotland , particularly across scotland, where and hill snow where the rain and hill snow continues wednesday and continues into wednesday and then elsewhere. it's bands of showers moving in. be prepared for some heavy downpours on wednesday. there will be some brighter spells between the heavy showers, a bit of sunshine . we'll see temperatures up to double digits but generally feeling in the breeze and feeling cooler in the breeze and plenty more those heavy plenty more of those heavy showers come in the up to easter. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> hello. good evening. it's me,

jacob rees—mogg on state of the nation. tonight, the independent review of social cohesion has been published. and it is a damning assessment of multicultural britain . multicultural britain. integration has failed, but we cannot solve the threat to our way of life by abandoning our way of life by abandoning our way of life by abandoning our way of life. the chinese communists have attacked the heart of british democracy . as heart of british democracy. as the government points the finger at the chinese communist party for a cyber on the for a cyber attack on the electoral commission, which gave for a cyber attack on the elaccess commission, which gave for a cyber attack on the elaccess to mmission, which gave for a cyber attack on the elaccess to 14nission, which gave for a cyber attack on the elaccess to 14 million which gave for a cyber attack on the elaccess to 14 million british gave it access to 14 million british people's personal details. the green agenda may have pushed britain to the brink of empty shelves and food shortages, as british farmers are having their arms twisted into turning crop fields environmental and fields into environmental and wildlife projects. plus, as the princess of announces her princess of wales announces her worrying diagnosis of cancer, i'll be giving my view on the endless conspiracies we have seen in the past few months . for seen in the past few months. for someone who once sat at the cabinet table and oversaw a department, i can assure you that governments are seldom so organised clever enough organised or clever enough to execute of conspiracy execute any sort of conspiracy whatsoever. state the nation whatsoever. state of the nation starts now