we used to them. we've seen them before. there were four arrests. one of which was for suspicion of a terrorism related offence. is it time we ban these so—called peace marches altogether, though? and scotland's new hate crime laws have come into force today. we've seen scenes of protest in edinburgh and the likes of jk rowling has dared police to

arrest her, saying the legislation could stifle free speech and fails to extend these protections to oh yeah, women. do you agree or do you think it'll be a roaring success and plus tea room, scone gate, people in tea rooms everywhere are outraged. do people in tea rooms get outraged, outraged with the national trust for making all of their scones vegan ? is it a big fuss about nothing or an attack on a humble british scone heritage and finally, have you, like me, had enough of april fools day? is it an annual annoyance or just a bit of harmless fun? you tell me. i know what i think. any case, that's all to come in the next hour with a cracking panel, by the way. but first, let's get the way. but first, let's get the latest news headlines with tatiana sanchez.

>> dawn, lovely to see you. and good evening. the top stories are. campaigners in edinburgh have delivered a coffin outside the scottish parliament, symbolising what they say is the death of free speech. it's after the introduction of a new hate crime law, which makes it a crime law, which makes it a crime to stir up hatred against people with protected characteristics. that includes disability , age, sexual disability, age, sexual orientation or people who are transgender. gb news scotland reporter tony mcguire says there's widespread concern . there's widespread concern. >> earlier today we spoke to susan smith, the director of four women scotland. her concerns are that this bit act will be weaponised against trans gender critical feminist movement. we have heard from a few pastors who are concerned that the churches work will be impeded because they will not be able to provide sermons and services in the community. and perhaps the biggest shock is that one of the largest critics of this is the police themselves , those who are actually charged with upholding this law . they with upholding this law. they are that officers are

are concerned that officers are already stretched and that this bill is sorry , this new law is bill is sorry, this new law is so divisive that it will actually go further to turning the public against them . the public against them. >> plans to find rough sleepers are provoking outrage , with more are provoking outrage, with more than 40 conservative mps said to be preparing to rebel, the new criminal justice bill would allow police to fine or move on. so—called nuisance rough sleepers. it was intended to replace the vagrancy act from 1824, which currently criminalises both rough sleeping and begging. but reports suggest the new has been paused the new bill has been paused while ministers negotiate with mps who are concerned about the consequences of issuing fines to homeless people. the plans were introduced by former home secretary suella braverman, who branded rough sleeping a lifestyle choice . the head of lifestyle choice. the head of nurses union has accused the government of packing hospital corridors with patients, and says the quality of care is not only undignified but fatally

unsafe. it comes as new estimates suggest more than 250 patients a week in england may have died needlessly last year because of long waits for hospital beds, a report by the royal college of emergency medicine revealed. more than 1.5 million patients waited in emergency departments for longer than 12 hours last year. the department for health says. it added thousands of hospital beds and insists it's making progress on waiting times . the on waiting times. the government's compensation scheme for victims of the windrush scandal has been branded a failure. five years after it started, it was set up to compensate british citizens who were wrongly threatened with deportation, despite having the right to live in the uk. however, campaigners are warning the number of people dying before getting payouts is increasing. they're calling on ministers to overhaul the process and speed up payments , process and speed up payments, with the home office replaced by an independent body. more than

5400 migrants have been intercepted crossing the channel intercepted crossing the channel in small boats during the first three months of this year. it's a record figure for that quarter, up 43% compared to the same time in 2023, official figures from the home office show 442 people made the crossing in nine small boats yesterday. that's despite difficult weather conditions, with lifeboats scrambling to assist some of the arrivals today. strong winds have now made the journey completely impassable . some households will impassable. some households will feel the effects of a cash boost from today, as new economic policies come into effect. the national living wage is increasing to £11.44, giving a pay increasing to £11.44, giving a pay rise to around 3 million of britain's lowest paid workers. small businesses will also benefit from a raised vat threshold and fully funded apprenticeships for young people . energy bills are due to fall

to their lowest rate in two years after the regulator, ofgem , cut its price cap by 12.3. it means the average household bill for gas and electricity will fall by around £238 over the course of a year , or about £20 course of a year, or about £20 a month. however, around 10 million households are still being urged to submit metre readings to avoid overpayment . a readings to avoid overpayment. a pink dress once worn by marilyn monroe has sold for a record setting price. the long sleeved silk jersey frog was owned and worn by the world's most famous film star. it sold forjust under £300,000 by auction house julien's in los angeles. under £300,000 by auction house julien's in los angeles . there julien's in los angeles. there was also a smoking jacket and slippers worn by playboy founder hugh hefner, which went under the hammer for more than £10,000. and for the person who truly has everything, there was the chance to pick up a crypt near both of those iconic stars. the price just under £155,000.

and although that's no joke, it's been a day of brave and bizarre pranks as tricksters got creative this april fool's day, dartmoor search and rescue announced their newest innovation, mountain rescue ducks ready to keep watch by air and sea. meanwhile, ant and dec told fans that they were giving up their telly careers to launch a tell all cookbook and supermarket chain aldi released a teaser for its new dating show love island. meanwhile, in switzerland , police unveiled switzerland, police unveiled their new secret weapon to unmask covert criminals sniffer chickens . that one was chickens. that one was especially verdoorn. for the latest stories, you can sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen. or you can go to gb news .com/ alerts. >> thank you very much, tatiana.

i love that pink dress story. tatiana resplendent in pink. i'm wearing pink. she's more likely to look like marilyn monroe than me, though. that's a problem. in any case, welcome to dewbs & co. any case, welcome to dewbs& co. hope you're having a wonderful bank holiday monday out there. i'm neesom standing in i'm dawn neesom standing in for the lovely michelle and brilliant for a brilliant panel for you, a deputy leader of reform ben deputy leader of reform of ben habib. and political habib. hello, ben, and political commentator joe phillips. habib. hello, ben, and political commentatorjoe phillips. hello. hello, dawn. joe, thank you for joining on a bank holiday. joining me on a bank holiday. it's hope you're still it's easter. i hope you're still eating i can't any eating eggs. i can't eat any more, to honest with you, but more, to be honest with you, but this show isn't about how many eggs it's about you. eggs i've eaten. it's about you. so touch with us about so get in touch with us about everything that we're talking about what want to chat about or what you want to chat about or what you want to chat about gbviews@gbnews.com or on twitter. at gb news. twitter. even easier at gb news. okay, well, it's the same story every weekend , isn't it? now, every weekend, isn't it? now, thousands of pro—palestinian protesters calling for peace as they march through the streets over 200,000 march this weekend with four people arrested, including one man on suspicion of a terrorism related offence.

so as police reveal that the cost of police in the gaza related protests in london have reached over £32.2 million, is it time that we now found ban these demonstrations all together? it's a tricky question. first of all, let's have a look at the video. that's caused all the controversy this week and you'll probably be very annoyed to walk with me because i can point these people out to you. >> and again, i was told when i asked that a swastika was not necessarily anti—semitic or disruptive to public order. >> that doesn't seem right to me. >> everything needs to be taken in doesn't it ? in context, doesn't it? >> right. okay. well, that was if you if you couldn't hear or if you if you couldn't hear or if you're listening on the radio, it's a metropolitan police officer telling a jewish woman swastikas displayed woman that swastikas displayed dunng woman that swastikas displayed during a pro—palestinian march needed to be taken in context. now, a met police spokesperson has said this clip is a short excerpt of what was a ten minute

conversation with an officer dunng conversation with an officer during the full conversation, the officer establishes that the woman, the person was concerned about has already been arrested for a public order offence in relation to a placard . so, i relation to a placard. so, i mean, the statement they actually issued said this. the officer then offered to arrange for other officers to attend and accompany the woman to identify any other persons she was concerned about amongst the protests. but after returning to speak to his supervisor, she had unfortunately left . now, i have unfortunately left. now, i have to admit i don't blame her. i think she was an american tourist. she happens to be jewish, but basically she was on houdayin jewish, but basically she was on holiday in london, saw a protester waving a swastika at a peace demonstration , and was peace demonstration, and was upset and went to ask a police officer how that was allowed, ben , i'm going to come to you ben, i'm going to come to you first on this one. i'm a bit shocked by this. still, i've seen it several times now, and i still can't get my head around

what i actually heard, especially seeing as the officer concerned actually said, it depends context in which depends on the context in which you're a swastika . you're waving a swastika. >> mean, if it did >> well, i mean, if it did depend on the context, you would have this was have thought this was a perfectly, example of where perfectly, good example of where the context would prohibit it. i mean, there's civilised mean, there's no civilised circle in which i move, where the swastika would be justified in any context and in fact, people, you know, when i was a member of the brexit party and now that i'm a member of reform uk, often they replace, they replace the symbol of the, the brexit party, you know previously inaya reform uk with a swastika to indicate that, you know where some kind of extreme far right party actually, what's interesting is that this is essentially a left wing march and the swastika actually is the symbol for the national socialist party, which was famously left wing . and i know famously left wing. and i know we're going to be talking about free speech later , but this kind free speech later, but this kind of totalitarian shut down of debate, the insistence of a particular ideology over

another. it's the preserve of the left, and the left are on the left, and the left are on the sort of they're on the march, literally at the moment. and the fact that this police officer could have had any form officer could have had any form of debate with this woman, it should have been taken as read that the swastika is unacceptable. i mean, for goodness sake , this is, you goodness sake, this is, you know, a march effectively against jews . and he's got swastika. >> the context wasn't difficult to understand there. i mean it, the swastika is offensive . yes. the swastika is offensive. yes. and certainly in those circumstances and we have seen now so many times, so many offensive things going on on these marches. our own reporter , these marches. our own reporter, katherine forster, is now so worried about going back for her own safety to these a peace march, by the way, that she's thinking twice about whether she should them person. should cover them in person. again, journalist being again, a journalist being terrified to do her job in the terrified to do herjob in the streets of london. isn't it time that we just stop these marches in particular? >> why should we stop these

marches any more than stopping any marches? if you go any other marches? if you go down path, you're going to down that path, you're going to say, right, you can't march because are peaceful for because they are peaceful for people. you just said it. four people. you just said it. four people were arrested out of 200,000 people, but maybe more should arrested. should have been arrested. >> well, we don't know, ben, because weren't there. because we weren't there. >> say that about any >> you could say that about any event, whether a pub or a event, whether it was a pub or a party or a football match or anything, there were arrests made. think that police made. i think that police officer perfectly officer engaged in a perfectly polite way. the polite and civilised way. the person this this woman had allegedly seen had apparently been arrested, presumably one of the four people charged. so it's been dealt with. the fact that he engaged with her. and i read somewhere else that he'd said, you know, if you want to, and offered that somebody else, you know, you can't have it both ways. you can't say, oh, we can't have this march. i don't agree the fact that this is agree with the fact that this is agree with the fact that this is a left wing march. it is people who are appalled and horrified at what is happening to civilians in gaza. i mean, the fact that and i'll read you the

quote from a holocaust survivor, stephen kappos , who attended stephen kappos, who attended wearing a badge with the colours of palestine , the palestinian of palestine, the palestinian flag. and he said, we need to put pressure on our government and on the official opposition. so they speak up, act, stop arming israel and stop supporting genocide. now, you know, he's a holocaust survivor. he's got more, right? >> did he have to say about the swastika? >> well , we swastika? >> well, we don't swastika? >> well , we don't know, ben, >> well, we don't know, ben, because we weren't there. >> he would have been. >> he would have been. >> well, he might have been, but the person arrested and the person was arrested and i think the point i'm trying to make is that there, there is a valid debate to be had over whether israel's continued bombardment is justified bombardment of gaza is justified or not. >> and i think the debate does need to move on from the principle of israel having a right to defend itself, because it seems to me that netanyahu's own domestic position is now promoting him into keeping this war going. and i was actually quite pleased to see i was quite pleased to see earlier the israelis having struck a target

in syria, taking out an iranian, army officer because i think the issue here, i'm digressing. but i'll come back to the point the issue here is really a conflict between iran on the one side and saudi for hegemony over the middle east and the proxy battle being fought out is between israel and gaza. >> but the problem i have with this, ben, is why is it being fought out on the streets of london in 2020, where we have jewish people terrified to come into the city? >> that that i think that's a different debate, but one which is absolutely relevant . and the is absolutely relevant. and the debate there, i think is evidence of multicultural multiculturalism not working. we've taken on far too many people into this country . we, people into this country. we, encourage them to maintain their own cultures, their own language, their own way of living , encourage them. orthodox living, encourage them. orthodox jews encourage them to live in silos, celebrated their positions, taken our own culture

has taken the knee to it. and our culture which joe supports. and i support the right to protest . it's fundamentally part protest. it's fundamentally part of british culture is in certain cases , being abused. here. there cases, being abused. here. there are prescribed groups who are going out under the cover of these anti—war marches to actually spread hate . and the actually spread hate. and the swastika is a very good example, is one example that has been deau is one example that has been dealt with. >> we believe, by the police. according to that statement, out of 200,000 people. yeah, but but ben would you then ban the countryside alliance? would you ban . no, no. ban. no, no. >> hold on, hold on marches. i completely agree with you. the right to protest must be protected. >> and these people are protesting peacefully. >> but in my opinion, having been to a couple of these, there is two tier policing going on. if you had turned up with the saint george's flag on your face and on your shirt, you know you're more likely to be arrested than if you carry a

swastika and something's gone fundamentally wrong with the way we're behaving as as we're not a settled culture anymore. we're multi cultures in the united kingdom. sadly, we haven't got a settled social, you know, social construct. we are a nation struggling now to identify what its culture is. and, and part of the problem there is the police now not knowing how to enforce the law. they come across as saint george's flag. it's perfectly valid if you've got saint george's flag painted on your face, lock the guy up. well i'm just going to say i'm. >> i'm so glad you mentioned the two tier policing things. i think we saw it. i personally think we saw it. i personally think saw it with the blm think we saw it with the blm marches where the police were frightened in frightened to get involved in case were of case they were accused of racism. know they've got racism. and we know they've got issues racism. and, you issues with racism. and, you know, example, regardless know, for example, regardless of what his politics, what you think of his politics, if like tommy robinson what you think of his politics, if turned like tommy robinson what you think of his politics, if turned upe tommy robinson what you think of his politics, if turned up withnmy robinson what you think of his politics, if turned up withnmy ihisinson what you think of his politics, if turned up with nmy ihis face had turned up with with his face painted england flag or painted an england flag or wearing a swastika draped over his goodness, his shoulder, oh my goodness, how the police how do you think the police would reacted that, joe? would have reacted to that, joe? >> would imagine they

>> well, i would imagine they would arrested him. in would have arrested him. and in fact, he was arrested at one of the because one of the marches because he's one of the marches because he's one of the of people that comes the groups of people that comes in try and sow yet more in to try and sow yet more division like we need it. i mean, you know, we've had liz truss, the former prime minister, remember sharing minister, remember her sharing a platform was a bit platform where that was a bit weird . you know, tommy robinson weird. you know, tommy robinson was praised as a hero by steve bannon. was praised as a hero by steve bannon . we've had i don't think, bannon. we've had i don't think, you know, hang on. you know, tangentially . yes. you can tangentially. yes. you can implicate. yes ben. implicate. yes you can ben. because actually you've got you have now got lee anderson who told in an interview with a national newspaper, a newspaper that if people didn't like going on the bibby stockholm bob, but they could eff off. that wasn't a recording. well, he said it in sympathy with lee on the. you might have, but but if you have people in senior positions and at time he was deputy at the time he was deputy chairman of the conservative party, got hester , who's party, you've got hester, who's donated millions to the conservative who , you conservative party, who, you know, said appalling, repugnant, appalling things about diana. but it took 48 hours for the

government, the prime minister, to say that's racist and misogynist. well, i mean , and misogynist. well, i mean, and you had ministers going on the television and the radio going. >> i mean, we have digressed. i'm glad we've digressed. >> i know, but you can't digress too much. >> i mean, basically, no, no, no, is that these no, the problem is that these marches in our city, people are terrified come into town. and terrified to come into town. and the police, i'm sorry, but they seem have lost control. the police, i'm sorry, but they seei| have lost control. the police, i'm sorry, but they seei the have lost control. the police, i'm sorry, but they seei the police)st control. the police, i'm sorry, but they seei the police are :ontrol. the police, i'm sorry, but they seei the police are encouraged. >> i the police are encouraged. look, got be we've got look, we've got to be we've got to understand what's going on. woke isn't social fad that's woke isn't a social fad that's just out of the blue. just emerged out of the blue. woke something has been woke is something that has been actively government actively promoted by government through legal through the regulatory and legal framework in the united kingdom. with this. well, i'm coming to it. and part of that is diversity, equality and inclusion . it's a fundamentally inclusion. it's a fundamentally erroneous regulation that has now found its way as a virus into every organisation in the united kingdom, including the police, which requires the police, which requires the police to promote the interests of minorities over and above and, if necessary, to the detriment of the majority and

that's why you are seeing two tier policing, partly because they're scared, i suspect, because there are 200,000 palestinian marchers, well, they're not palestinian marchers, though. palestinian. they're anti—israeli, whatever war they're marching against. >> do you disagree? >> do you disagree? >> there is two tier policing in this. >> i don't think there is. i mean, all marches, all demonstrations are policed entirely. i'm not saying that, but we know perfectly well that the metropolitan is the metropolitan police is institutionally racist, as written large by dame louise casey , by an independent body casey, by an independent body for which there was no democratic accountability or scrutiny. >> i mean, she writes a report and it becomes absolutely sacrosanct that we can't challenge it. if i were to say any the institutions of the united kingdom used not to be racist , but they are now racist, but they are now encouraged to practice what i call reverse racism. >> i think they used not to be racist. >> no, i, i, i really grew up in this country as a brown individual . well, my dad's individual. well, my dad's pakistani, my mum's english. i

never have encouraged experience racism against myself from any institution. i've experienced, racism from individuals , but racism from individuals, but never institutional racism. >> that astonishing . >> that astonishing. >> that astonishing. >> and now we have regulatory requirement for reverse racism and that is racist. >> you need to write some of the wrongs. and it's not just racism. look at what happened to sarah everard. look at the fact that wayne couzens wasn't racism. it doesn't matter whether it's racism in your view. >> corrupt police officer who was allowed to carry on woke him raping a woman is completely unacceptable. >> in your view. that's about if somebody had said, you know, oh, it's just a bit of office banter . david carrick was known as the rapist. >> no, come on, that's not fair , >> no, come on, that's not fair, joe. you're you're you're putting words in my mouth. the only and you're conflating those words else. words with something else. >> people who are using >> the only people who are using woke as something to be divisive are the right wing, who are

saying that anything tries saying that anything that tries to make a more decent, tolerant society is wrong. >> the regulatory framework >> no, the regulatory framework encouraged, and encouraged, encourages and embeds in our in the embeds division in our in the united kingdom. i was going to say in our society, i can't claim that we have a society. >> as much as i'm loving this division currently in the studio because brilliant because you're both brilliant debaters, running out of debaters, i'm running out of time on this one. sorry, sorry. you're brilliant, right. coming up. do you hate scotland's new hate crime laws, or do you think there'd be a roaring success, get thoughts ahead of get your thoughts in ahead of another fiery debate. we've already started well, already started quite well, haven't a few haven't we? in just a few minutes.

a cracking start? this is dewbs& co with me. dawn neesom , keeping co with me. dawn neesom, keeping me company until 7:00. well, unless they storm out of the studio, anything's possible. and he's deputy leader of reform uk, ben habib and political

commentator joe phillips, who did have a little bit of a group hug in the break. it has to be said, now i'm just going to read out some of your views. and a lot of you, not surprisingly, are on team ben. sorry, joe. >> it's okay. i'm used to it. i can take it. >> she's she's a she's a grown woman. >> wait till we get to scones. oh, scones. >> there's going to be bloodbath. >> there's such thing as >> there's no such thing as a scone. it's a scone. >> the state of started already. nike. >> scone . >> scone. >> scone. >> hold. keep your powder dry. sorry i'll keep jam dry, sorry to. i'll keep you jam dry, okay. your message is okay. right now your message is coming kathy , they're coming in, kathy, they're talking i've just talking about what? i've just been just been debating. kathy. just a reminder peace marches reminder that peace marches don't have participants screeching the annihilation don't have participants sc|an:hing the annihilation don't have participants sc|an entire the annihilation don't have participants sc|an entire nation. nnihilation don't have participants sc|an entire nation. prettyation of an entire nation. pretty much. what? what i've been thinking, with you, thinking, to be honest with you, it's scary , phil says, it's just scary, phil says, referring to the police officer concerned who didn't quite understand the context of the swastika. he says, i would suggest the police officer didn't understand the law. he got it horribly wrong. and sandra echoed by lot of sandra again echoed by a lot of you. well, the police should send bill for policing to send the bill for policing to the organisers so—called the organisers of the so—called

peaceful and glenda and peaceful marches and glenda and yeah, we all had the right to protest peaceful protest marches must be allowed. but i don't believe these weekly marches are peaceful anymore. when people are afraid to visit london. lots of you echoing those thoughts. but this program is all about you. gb views at gb news you sit on your screen, get in touch what you're talking about, and the scones come as well. the scones to come as well. so let us how you even let us know how you even pronounce i mean, i'm team pronounce it. i mean, i'm team joe on this one, i don't know if you're posher or what. you're posher than us or what. i can't work it out. any case. right. okay. be careful what you say. there's a seamless say. see, there's a seamless link today. the scottish link there today. the scottish government's hate government's controversial hate crime has crime and public order act has come and it's come into effect, and it's ruffled feathers . ruffled plenty of feathers. scotland's first minister, humza yousaf the law will yousaf has insisted the law will empower victims of hatred whilst maintaining public freedom of expression. yeah, so is this a new law? a threat to free speech? and most importantly, will it actually work , joe, from will it actually work, joe, from what i can work out,

will it actually work, joe, from what i can work out , this law what i can work out, this law could basically criminalise the likes of ricky gervais and j.k. rowling for basically telling jokes and standing up for what women are. >> and women are not protected under this new law. >> that was the which is a tncky >> that was the which is a tricky thing, isn't it? >> you know, it's not weird. >> you know, it's not weird. >> it is very, very concerning, isn't it? >> i mean, this is joking aside or, you know, facetiousness aside, this is a sledgehammer to crack a nut that actually doesn't exist. and, you know, we talk about the police a lot on this programme. we talk about them being under—resourced or being sent in the wrong direction. how are you going to police something when somebody can anonymously phone up and report that? ben habib i overheard him on the phone saying something that i don't like and i'm really upset. no, i'm not giving you my name because that's how it stands at the moment. >> you can report it as a third party, utterly, utterly ludicrous. >> so this is this is sorry to interrupt, but this is what i

meant earlier when i said the left is on the march. this is a left is on the march. this is a left wing shutting down of debate . that's what the scottish debate. that's what the scottish parliament is. it's effectively shut. >> the whole thing is utterly ridiculous. and you know, we've got laws in place across the united kingdom that protect people for discrimination against disability , gender, against disability, gender, race, ethnicity, age, etc. all of those, all of those things. and this thing about, i mean, i think it goes back to what ben and i hopefully try to do, which is to disagree agreeably. and i hopefully try to do, which is to disagree agreeably . yes, is to disagree agreeably. yes, and to have civil conversations where we are completely opposite. absolutely. on so many. >> of course, you go off on one. well, i know, i mean, i mean scots, i mean, come on, wait for it people. >> wait for it. there's going to be clotted cream and jam all over the television screens around the country. >> i've just had jacket dry >> i've just had my jacket dry clean. on, jack, it's all clean. come on, jack, it's all right. >> it's pink, but but i think, you whole point about you know, the whole point about this is who and what do you want 7 this is who and what do you want ? are ? the police, who are under—resourced do . and, you

under—resourced to do. and, you know, i'm with j.k. rowling on on this stuff about misgendering. i'm, you know, and she's put out tweets or whatever they call these days today saying, yeah, come on, arrest me. >> i mean, basically her tweet today basically saying that women don't have penises is now potentially an arrestable offence in scotland. i mean, what is this really absurd? >> you know, we spent we spent 100 odd years or we spent the last 100 years in hating women, giving them rights, protecting women, making it possible for them only because we fought in protest at it, only because we fought in protest. >> it was very generous of men to allow us to have that. >> we gave you know. >> we gave you know. >> but what this is now doing is setting that entire movement back in, in, ostensibly in the promotion of transgender ideology. and we had this ridiculous thing last week. i don't know if you saw it with the employees , female employees the employees, female employees in the ons, the office for national statistics being threatened with legal action if theyif threatened with legal action if

they if they complained about transgender, i call them transgender, i call them transgender men because they're still men. i know some people call them transgender women, but men who want to be women going into their loos and they were threatened with legal action. i mean, it's absolutely absurd. but the other thing in this bill, this this act that worries me is the protection of religion as a debating point . now, we as a debating point. now, we ditched blasphemy laws 100 years ago, in theory, for very good reason , because blasphemy laws reason, because blasphemy laws again can be used to shut down debate and to cower parts of the country to prevent people from being able to talk openly. >> would you want a chat with that bloke at the reteach in batley in yorkshire, about blasphemy laws? were you in hiding? >> well, exactly. and you know, if , if you give succour to if, if you give succour to people like humza yousaf with this kind, if you allow them this kind, if you allow them this kind, if you allow them this kind of indulgence, they'll be shutting down debate right across the board. >> i think what is so alarming

about this, and it's been knocking around for, i think, since been going a long since 2021, been going a long time going around. there's time going around. so there's been time it to be been plenty of time for it to be debated and discussed and picked over entrails all the over the entrails and all the rest of it. but in every interview that i've read and heard of, of ministers in scotland trying to defend it, they've had they've had to sort of back to the point. well, of row back to the point. well, well then that be up to well then that would be up to the police to decide. no, the police to decide. well, no, of couldn't be of course you couldn't be prosecuted this, that and of course you couldn't be pro:other.i this, that and of course you couldn't be prosother. wellthis, that and of course you couldn't be prosother. well what hat and of course you couldn't be prosother. well what ist and of course you couldn't be prosother. well what is thed the other. well what is the point then? point of it then? >> let's devil's advocate >> let's play devil's advocate very on this. very slightly on this. obviously, know that, you obviously, you know that, you know, whole transgender obviously, you know that, you know, which role transgender obviously, you know that, you know, which ise transgender obviously, you know that, you know, which is theansgender obviously, you know that, you know, which is theansgertoxic thing, which is the most toxic debate you can possibly have at the moment, now there are people debate you can possibly have at the thereent, now there are people debate you can possibly have at the thereent, ruse there are people debate you can possibly have at the thereent, ruse very are people debate you can possibly have at the thereent, ruse very hateful)ple out there that use very hateful language transgender language about transgender people and lots of other people and lots of other but as and lots of other people. but as you pointed out, joe, lots of other people are already protected. mean, age, protected. i mean, race, age, sexuality, but i mean, sexuality, etc. but i mean, there isn't anything specific until this in scotland to protect transgender people from being insulted in this way.

>> but it's also there cannot be a law against insulting someone. >> it's almost could they calling it they're stirring up hatred by by by what? by what? by hatred by by by what? by what? by passing a law like this. >> no, no, no, the law has got this clause in it which now extends from the laws that we've got in england, wales and northern ireland, which is still bnng northern ireland, which is still bring up hatred. yeah. well, thatis bring up hatred. yeah. well, that is very subjective . it's that is very subjective. it's impossible. but the other thing is that it seems to me that, you know, we're either infantilizing ourselves as a country or as a society, that we have to go to the police and expect them to intervene when we are not able to hang on, ben, i find to say, hang on, ben, i find that really offensive. or dawn, that really offensive. or dawn, that was really out of order. we should be able to do that. you know , and we should be able to know, and we should be able to call out the blokes who say , oh, call out the blokes who say, oh, it's just the importance of this act. >> this is in no doubt is infantilizing us. but what it is fundamentally doing is shutting down free speech. this is the thing of dictatorships. it

should we should be allowed to offend each other. how do you have diversity of thought and progression in in thought? if you're not allowed to really challenge robustly someone else's ideology and beliefs, you've to be able to go head you've got to be able to go head to head and you will be offended and i'll be offended. and we may throw our toys out of the pram, but that shouldn't result in an arrest. >> do you think we should have picked up on this happening first the universities first with the universities where it was the thought police? you can only think way. you can only think one way. we've university lecturers we've had university lecturers hounded jobs, hounded out of their jobs, mainly the trans issue . i mainly for the trans issue. i mean, george orwell's mean, sort of. george orwell's 1984 was a work of fiction. i mean, is it now literally real life? >> but it is, and i'm sorry to go back to it, but the heart of all of this is in diversity, equality and inclusion. the promotion of transgender rights is just one of the promotions thatis is just one of the promotions that is now advocated for and promoted by the regulatory framework in which our educational establishments work . educational establishments work. so it is it is absolutely

encouraged that they should promote trans gender. the regulatory framework says please promote transgender rights, please promote ethnic minorities , please promote minority religions and if necessary , set religions and if necessary, set christianity aside. set the rights of the white majority aside, and set aside the rights of women. that's what we're seeing. >> i think, you know, and to go back really to the point you were saying earlier, well, both of you actually, about the sort of you actually, about the sort of two tier policing, i should think there are quite a lot of police officers and quite a lot of members of the public who would the police be would prefer the police to be investigating other things, and i think, you know, it is absolutely fundamental that people shouldn't be offensive or cause alarm or fear , but we cause alarm or fear, but we should always be running to the police to sort it out. >> let us know if you live in scotland in particularly how you feel about this gb views at gb news. i mean, we know our prisons are overflowing, if you report a burglary, it's not

getting investigated. rape, crime, rape and sexual assault in london is more or less legalised because it's not investigated and not prosecuted, etc, etc. but what do you think? especially if you're in scotland, really keen to hear from you because, you know, comedy act, want to go and comedy act, you want to go and see because, you know, see them because, you know, ricky gervais's is getting ricky gervais's face is getting nicked. basically case, move nicked. basically any case, move on. the one you're on. this is the one you're waiting coming up, waiting for. i know coming up, the trust has divided the national trust has divided opinion every opinion in tea rooms every where. after making all of its scones, roll please vegan scones, drum roll please vegan about time or an attack on our humble british scone heritage. this is dewbs& co with me. dawn neesom on gb news. put the kettle on, grab a scone, but don't go too far.

this is dewbs& co with me. dawn neesom and keeping me company until 7:00. no. sorry. joe

phillips and ben habib. and we. we've got scones basically. now. okay. we are going to do scone gate and for once , the debate is gate and for once, the debate is not what comes first. the jam or the cream. we've done that for decades, haven't we? but it seems there's outrage all over britain. might be egging that one a bit, over the national trust admitting its stones have all gone vegan. secretly, they didn't tell us national didn't tell us the national trust failing to protect the humble scones heritage. humble british scones heritage. now again, we've now this is again, we've discussed pretty much most of discussed it pretty much most of the show so far. this is a tiny minority, in this case, the national trust, dictating the national trust, dictating to the majority all the scones in 280 national trust cafes and you know, of their on site tea rooms. that's mine . their on rooms. that's mine. their on site tea rooms and everything, have gone vegan without telling us. and people are complaining

because they don't taste as nice. now, unfortunately, we couldn't get a vegan scone to do a taste test, but we're going to do cream jam test in do the cream jam test in a minute. but i mean, this is outrageous, ben. i'm sorry. it's going gay. not happy with going gay. i'm not happy with this. mean, why should this. i mean, why why should everyone because everyone be vegan just because a tiny in this country tiny majority in this country are you know, it comes back are so, you know, it comes back again to what saying before. >> this is the national trust is famously hate the famously woke. they hate the expression and there expression woke. and there have been about how been articles written about how the trust kicks at the national trust kicks back at it. national trust has it. but the national trust has embraced promotion embraced this promotion of minorities again, taking it completely the completely to heart, to the point actually stand point where actually they stand against almost the buildings that charged to that they are charged to protect. for example, they protect. so, for example, they unked protect. so, for example, they linked house, winston linked chartwell house, winston churchill's house, to the slave trade, colonialism and slavery, colonialism. marvellous. and they're pro blm. they came out pro blm and they and they've and they and put up placards they and they put up placards across their properties taking down that had been down placards that had been there for decades, putting up new explaining how the new ones, explaining how the property linked to the slave property was linked to the slave trade. this this is trade. this is this is this is an institution which is charged to the heritage of the to protect the heritage of the

united . kingdom. but they hold united. kingdom. but they hold the heritage of the united kingdom in contempt. so how it is that they can continue to discharge that function is utterly beyond me. >> they also part of the >> they were also part of the group that recently accused the countryside of being racist. absolutely. and from buildings, >> and apart from buildings, they're in charge famous they're also in charge of famous landscapes. british landscapes. you know, british landscapes. and they and they accused being accused the countryside of being racist, think racist, presumably. i think that comes think comes about because they think white people seem to have the preserve of the countryside and, you know, urban communities tend to be multi—ethnic band. >> i'm sorry, ben, you are slightly you can't go to slightly brown. you can't go to the countryside. this is the countryside. i mean, this is pathetic. should pathetic. i mean, why should we all vegans? all have to put up with vegans? >> to say, dawn, that >> i have to say, dawn, that when holly, your producer, talked to me on phone about talked to me on the phone about this, said, oh, is that the this, i said, oh, is that the april fool's because april fool's story? because i honestly thought it was. it's a story in the daily mail. outrage and umbrage, you know, across 39 pages. and actually, frankly, i couldn't give flying couldn't give a flying whatsername . flying scone a

whatsername. flying scone a flying scone. exactly but and i can see from a catering point of view, it's a lot easier to go just make them all vegan because it stops that endless. have you got a vegan or a vegetarian version? obviously you couldn't have clotted cream . you have the clotted cream. you probably couldn't have the jam. >> you can have vegan but >> you can have vegan cream, but it's foam. it's just like shaving foam. >> know, and if people >> well, i know, and if people don't they won't eat don't like them, they won't eat them. and then, you know, the i mean, i don't think on the scale. i just don't understand why they've done it in secret. >> can i just read a quote from a, from from national trust a, from from a national trust spokesman may spokesman who said they may taste different the taste different to the traditional version, the traditional version, but the whole about the national whole point about the national trust to preserve tradition. trust is to preserve tradition. so how dare they go against their charter changing the scones. scones. >> national trust, in case you're confused, you're not funding them, by the way. they're not taxpayer funded. they're not taxpayer funded. they so you could they are a charity, so you could always just, you know, pay your money pay your money. any always just, you know, pay your monethis pay your money. any always just, you know, pay your monethis their your money. any always just, you know, pay your monethis their statement,y. any case, this is their statement, right, millions right, our cafes serve millions of year. and we work

of customers a year. and we work hard to accommodate dietary needs and allergies. as scones are made with vegetable based spread. this means iconic spread. this means our iconic plain scones can be plain and fruit scones can be enjoyed those dare those enjoyed with those dare those with dairy allergies and vegans. however, all scones can be enjoyed or cream . enjoyed with butter or cream. but but that doesn't make them vegan for a start. and how many vegans national trust have actually complained to you that they're struggling? there must be another option if you're a vegan.i be another option if you're a vegan. i mean, i'm pretty much a vegetarian. you like cheese? vegetarian. do you like cheese? that's my problem. >> it's i just >> i just think it's i just think it's a, you know, it is a storm literally in a teacup. yeah. isn't it? >> i'm on the side of a teacup or side of a of a teacup, or on the side of a of a teacup, and all done is made. and all it's done is made. >> people who want hate >> the people who want to hate the national for all the the national trust for all the reasons ben outlined, reasons that ben has outlined, do more, which is do so even more, which is a shame, because actually, the places they look after, you places that they look after, you know, they're wonderful. >> and they testified to the terrific history, the united kingdom has, which they're ashamed which they're ashamed of, which they're ashamed of, which they're ashamed is that? ashamed of. why is that? >> what's wrong? what's wrong with british heritage and

history? >> but i think there's nothing wrong to wrong with in trying to encourage, other people, different to different people to come to places that they might. yeah, have thought was not their thing. i mean, we've talked about the racism in the countryside before, and, you know, a farmer's i know, i'm a farmer's daughter. i grew the countryside , that grew up in the countryside, that makes you racist. i know it does. it? but, you know, does. doesn't it? but, you know, it's not, but you . know, if you it's not, but you. know, if you are in a small village and you know, actually people in villages and in the countryside are unbelievably and understandably suspicious of incomers . yeah, strangers, no incomers. yeah, strangers, no matter what skin they've got, because might be, you know, because they might be, you know, stealing their tractors, they might be the sort of i'll give you a fabulous vegetarian story, okay, so my family are sheep farmers . anyone who's got a dog farmers. anyone who's got a dog watching this, i hope knows that dogs should always be kept on a lead when they are near sheep. yeah, and a member of my family

challenged, some people who were walking their dog through walking with their dog through a field of pregnant ewes and, and the woman said, well, the dog's not going to bother them. and anyway, i'm vegetarian . anyway, i'm vegetarian. >> that's that is a true story. now, talking of which , we have now, talking of which, we have food in front of us. now i just want looking one want you not looking at one another prepare another to just prepare your scone you were going to scone as if you were going to have a lovely bank holiday. easter holiday monday cream easter bank holiday monday cream tea. don't look at each other. there is only what you do. >> there's only one way to. >> there's only one way to. >> no cheating, is though, >> no cheating, is there though, ben? one way? is ben? is there only one way? is there way? oh, no. there only one way? oh, no. oh, this fascinating . this is fascinating. >> i tell you, this is like michael portillo's program, isn't it? >> yeah, but i'm. the >> yeah, yeah, but i'm. the jackets are similar. i know, but they get truffles on his. >> there we go. >> there we go. >> how's that. that's right. >> how's that. that's right. >> that's fascinating. >> that's fascinating. >> have we done it the same. no, no, we've done differently . no, we've done it differently. that's be expected. that's only to be expected. >> this is the great debate that's only to be expected. >who's this is the great debate that's only to be expected. >who's right?; the great debate that's only to be expected. >wlo's right?; the great debate that's only to be expected. >wi think ht?; the great debate that's only to be expected. >wi think it?; the great debate that's only to be expected. >wi think it dependseat debate that's only to be expected. >wi think it depends whetherte >> i think it depends whether you devon or cornwall.

you come from devon or cornwall. yeah. someone will tell you. >> yeah, well, i mean, devon is cornwall, remember, cornwall, i can't remember, i can't which way round can't remember which way round they go. but who's right on this one? you tell me. gb views ag gb news. right. i'm not going to do mine yet because you go on. i'm keeping it secret. you're allowed to eat. find out. you're allowed to eat. find out. you're allowed to eat. yeah. as long as you can talk at the same time. right. now, still to come. right. okay. now, still to come. has day its day? has april fools day had its day? have had enough? yes should have you had enough? yes should we ban it entirely? well, it's have you had enough? yes should we [an it entirely? well, it's have you had enough? yes should we [an it of |tirely? well, it's have you had enough? yes should we [an it of harmlessll, it's have you had enough? yes should we [an it of harmless fun,'s have you had enough? yes should we [an it of harmless fun, but just a bit of harmless fun, but we about we don't know about pronunciations. no scone. pronunciations. oscar no scone. you in with one as you can join in with that one as well. is not fool. well. this is not an april fool. this right? we have this is real, right? we have scone are in trouble. scone gate. we are in trouble. people let us know what you think, yeah. have a go and have a cup of tea or even a glass of champagne. it's bank

an. >> hello. welcome back. i

haven't got a mouthful of scone or scone. actually, i've been corrected on that. okay. lots of you getting in touch. i love your views. right sheila? hi, sheila. she says i've heard king charles say scone, so i'm just basically coming in working class talk proper, class and can't talk proper, meanwhile. alan, you agree meanwhile. yeah alan, you agree it's scone, as it's scone, not scone, as confirmed by the queens scone maker at windsor castle and mary berry end of. all. right, well, we're just coming , aren't we, then? >> common as muck. but what i would . just add to that one in would. just add to that one in the village of scone in scotland , where the stone of scone, since we're talking about the royal family actually comes from, they say scone. >> oh, so i mean, there you go. going i'm very going too far now? no i'm very confused. anyway, i should probably properly probably i should have properly spotted are still with spotted my panel are still with me. joe and the me. the lovely joe and the lovely jenny. now she's got jam all around her face, a quick message on the scottish situation . and the diane. hello,

situation. and the diane. hello, diane. as a scot, i hope it's the final nail in the coffin for the final nail in the coffin for the snp and gareth says, quite rightly, actually forgotten about this. forward to about this. look forward to 50,000 celtic 50,000 rangers versus celtic supporters this supporters getting arrested this sunday. luck with that sunday. yeah good luck with that one. fool. good thing. one. now april fool. good thing. bad thing drives me nuts . it's bad thing drives me nuts. it's a national newspaper. always banned them because i just think they're deeply unfunny. good thing, bad thing. >> think some in the past have >> i think some in the past have been really clever. spaghetti and sanserif . and sanserif. >> yeah, spaghetti. i think we've got a clip of that at some point. >> the spaghetti thing. >> the spaghetti thing. >> i think we've got to all laugh at ourselves. be prepared to be humiliated we believe to be humiliated when we believe something shouldn't. was something we shouldn't. this was it's this was dimbleby. >> this was richard dimbleby. this everyone this was the one everyone remembers. this was the one everyone remembthis is back in the dark >> and this is back in the dark ages. i mean, quite literally, spaghetti. >> spaghetti growing on trees . >> spaghetti growing on trees. >> spaghetti growing on trees. >> and that actually fooled the nation. but of course, we forget in those days , spaghetti only in those days, spaghetti only came in tins. >> didn't know about >> we didn't know about spaghetti , you know. spaghetti, you know. >> you think no one had been to italy? yeah. >> exactly. and the >> no. exactly, exactly. and the sans was the sans serif, which was the guardian did a double guardian did they did a double page on island of

page spread on the island of sans which anybody knows sans serif, which anybody knows is script. is a yeah, yeah script. >> exactly , so . right. okay, you >> exactly, so. right. okay, you we've got , we've got some april we've got, we've got some april fool quizzes for you now, plane forced return to airport after foul smelling waste from broken toilet leaks into the cabin. joe, is that an april fool or genuine? >> i think that's true. >> i think that's true. >> true, ben, i think it looks so true, okay. i think the we'll reveal all afterwards, right? simon cowell's quiet life in the country is ruined by moles as the furry creatures infest. is £8 million cotswold mega mansion . after after leaving london, he was leaving london. not the furry creatures, so is this real? these are all from the papers today, right? by the way, joe, is that one april 4th, or is that real? >> i think that might be true. >> i think that might be true. >> real, too. >> i think that's real, too. >> i think that's real, too. >> interesting. >> okay, interesting. >> okay, interesting. >> like , would i lie to you?

>> like, would i lie to you? >> like, would i lie to you? >> the last one and the last. i'm really rubbish . chris i'm really rubbish. chris o'shea. that job on mastermind i'm really rubbish. chris o'definitelyt job on mastermind i'm really rubbish. chris 0' definitely not on mastermind i'm really rubbish. chris 0' definitely not mine,astermind i'm really rubbish. chris 0' definitely not mine, is:ermind i'm really rubbish. chris 0' definitely not mine, is itmind i'm really rubbish. chris 0' definitely not mine, is it ,1ind is definitely not mine, is it, meanwhile, one to meanwhile, this one germany to invoke 1895 rule to stop harry kane, who . plays in germany, by kane, who. plays in germany, by the way, playing for england at the way, playing for england at the euros, which are coming up. joe, is that april fool? joe, is that an april fool? >> i think that's an april fool. >> i think that's an april fool. >> that's demonstrably wrong, isn't imagine isn't it? can you imagine germany ancient germany invoking an ancient law to player? germany invoking an ancient law to yeah, player? germany invoking an ancient law to yeah, well, player? germany invoking an ancient law to yeah, well, i player? germany invoking an ancient law to yeah, well, i mean,ar? >> so yeah, well, i mean, actually it could be true. i mean, you know, the germans are anything possible , they have anything possible, they have also the swastika, the also banned the swastika, by the way, around a bit here, way, jumping around a bit here, but, yeah, simon and but, so, yeah, simon cowell and is were moles in his is there were moles in his garden, weren't they? that is true. yeah, yeah, the aeroplane one was. that's true . you got one was. that's true. you got that right. yeah. and so you're both at but the one that was on april 4th from the papers today was you were both right, harry. >> i see harry kane. >> i see harry kane. >> yeah, yeah, he is allowed to actually act. have you ever been caught out by an april fool?

>> i'm sure i have, yeah, i mean, i've, i've been around for a few years, so i'm sure i have joe, but same as ben. >> i mean. yeah probably. and working as a news editor and a reporter and things like that. i'm sure i've seen some. and then. no, hang on a minute. that can't be right. >> i can't remember, but i fell for spaghetti on trees. >> probably. you know, for spaghetti on trees. >don't probably. you know, for spaghetti on trees. >don't think probably. you know, for spaghetti on trees. >don't think they're y. you know, for spaghetti on trees. >don't think they're as(ou know, for spaghetti on trees. >don't think they're as goodiow, i don't think they're as good as they be. so much of they used to be. but so much of life like that. life is like that. >> is as good as used >> nothing is as good as it used to apart school and to be, apart from school and scones, scones, whatever, thank you lovely you very much for my lovely panel you very much for my lovely panel. nigel panel. and up next is nigel farage. possibly in a scone. who knows? too far. you'll knows? don't go too far. you'll find thank you for watching. >> brighter outlook with boxt >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar on . gb news. >> hello there. welcome to your latest gb news weather. >> over the next 24 hours or so, we'll see the heavy showers fade away. it will often remain quite cloudy, will some cloudy, but there will be some brighter into tuesday. brighter spells into tuesday. low dominating low pressure dominating the weather at the moment,

weather pattern at the moment, but a slack area of low pressure. so we've had some slow moving heavy showers, these slowly through this slowly fading away through this evening time. we do have a frontal system well across frontal system as well across parts scotland . the far north parts of scotland. the far north of england, giving some spells of england, giving some spells of rain into the early hours. we could see some clear spells through this central swathe of the uk, and here temperatures dipping low single figures dipping into low single figures and showers and some further showers running across southern coastal counties of mixed of england too. there's a mixed picture tuesday. some bright picture for tuesday. some bright sunny . sunny spells across this. central part of the uk wales into the midlands, for example, this frontal system across eastern scotland eastern parts of scotland continues to give outbreaks of rain into the rain through the day into the afternoon. we'll see some showers bubble up for many areas, but there'll be plenty of sunny spells, in the sunny spells, some rain in the southwest. temperatures in sunny spells, some rain in the sou�*sunshine temperatures in sunny spells, some rain in the sou�*sunshine reaching eratures in sunny spells, some rain in the sou�*sunshine reaching around; in sunny spells, some rain in the sou�*sunshine reaching around 15| the sunshine reaching around 15 or 16 celsius. still cold under the for . scotland the cloud and rain for. scotland into wednesday. the next area of low pressure moves in, pushing rain north and eastwards across

the country. some of this could be heavy times. behind it, be heavy at times. behind it, some in but also some showers falling in but also some showers falling in but also some . and towards some brighter skies. and towards the end of the week it turns wetter and windier, but with winds from the south, temperatures rise . temperatures start to rise. >> like things are heating >> looks like things are heating up

gb news. >> good evening. new hate crime laws come into place in scotland today. but could they be a danger ? or could innocent people danger? or could innocent people perhaps not get jobs as a result of it? there's a huge row as a police officer in the met tells a jewish woman that a swastika has to be taken in context. really? and migrant crossings so far this year are up by 43. where is the home secretary, james cleverly? he was boasting so much at christmas