things to do today. then follow all the twists and turns of the campaigning. worry not, we will bnng campaigning. worry not, we will bring you up to speed on it all. and i've got to say, one of the strangest goings on is all the confused mixed messages re whether diane abbott can stand as a labour candidate or not. do you think she should be able to also another one out of the hats literally pulling them like rabbits? new tory pledges, i mean. but this time it's about the so called mickey mouse degrees. apparently the tories are going to scrap them and invest instead in a hundred thousand new apprenticeships. would that get your vote? >> you're joking. not another one. >> yes, brenda. love another one. a junior doctors strike i'm talking about. this will be the 11th one in just over a year. iith one in just over a year. for five days. this time right up until the 2nd of july. it's definitely not political though. honest. do you support this move or not? also, a protest last night have seen multiple police

officers heard the issue that they were protesting in the assault on rafah. tens of millions of people now joining the calls for the violence to stop. what's your take on it. all? i've got all of that to come and more with the dream team, aaron bastani and peter hitchens. but first, let's cross over to the legend polly middlehurst for tonight's latest news headlines. >> michelle thank you. good evening to you. your news at just after 6:00 is that the prime minister has hit out at plans by junior doctors to stage yet another strike next month . yet another strike next month. members of the british medical association will walk out for five days, starting from the 27th of june. speaking at a campaign event just this afternoon, rishi sunak said it was politically motivated and not in the interests of staff . not in the interests of staff. >> today's action by the junior doctors on the same day as the

labour party are having a health day does slightly ponder the question as to whether this is politically motivated. it's hard to escape that conclusion, given the timing and to call a strike in an election campaign, especially as we found a constructive resolution with the remainder of the nhs workforce. >> rishi sunak, speaking earlier well, nhs waiting list targets would be met within five years of a labour government. that's according to a new pledge by sir keir starmer. the plan would see an additional 40,000 appointments in england each week, taking place during evenings and weekends. and, he says bringing wait times within the 18 week target . the the 18 week target. the conservatives have called it more copy and paste politics and pointed to its plan to invest in nhs technology instead. but sir keir starmer says it will help health workers get on with their job, not the only thing that we do for the nhs, but just the

first thing, which is to have 40,000 extra appointments and operations every week. >> so that means using operating theatres in the evenings and the weekends . so 40,000 will pay for weekends. so 40,000 will pay for that by getting rid of the non—dom status completely. that's the special tax status for the super rich. that means they don't pay their tax in this country. i think if you live here, you should be paying your tax here. so we'll get rid of that. we also want to get in the money that isn't being paid in tax by those that are avoiding it. >> sir keir starmer now gb news, can reveal that environmental activists are planning to target the uk's busiest airports this summer. in fact, over the last two weeks of july, just stop oil have said they've got plans to target airports, including heathrow and gatwick, at the height of the summer getaway , in height of the summer getaway, in order, they say, to cause maximum disruption . the group's maximum disruption. the group's also running a series of online courses aimed at encouraging and informing volunteers on how best

to carry out protests . now, to carry out protests. now, labour hasn't taken any decision to bar diane abbott from standing as an mp for the labour party, it says. the mp reportedly told media outlets that she had been blocked from running for the party. but sir keir starmer said this afternoon those reports weren't true. she had the whip withdrawn in april last year following comments she made about jewish people not suffering racism. but after an internal labour party investigation, the whip was restored just yesterday , miss restored just yesterday, miss abbott apologised for those comments and had been sitting as an independent mp. in the meantime . miss abbott was, of meantime. miss abbott was, of course a close ally of the former leader of the labour party , jeremy corbyn, and served party, jeremy corbyn, and served as his shadow home secretary it's unclear now whether she will or she won't contest her seat in hackney north and stoke newington . an inquiry into newington. an inquiry into crimes committed by paediatric nurse and serial killer lucy letby will not be live streamed

to the public. letby was sentenced to 14 whole life orders for murdering seven babies in her care and attempting to kill six others. lawyers for the families of her victims had argued for the inquiry to be streamed in an effort to counter the spread of what they called grossly offensive conspiracy theories. but the inquiry's chairwoman says there's a risk of breaching court orders which prevent the identification of several people involved. it comes after articles appeared in us media questioning some evidence being put forward in the case. and in new york, jurors have begun their deliberations in donald trump's so—called hush money trial. prosecutors alleged that a payment was made to a former aduu a payment was made to a former adult film star, which could have contributed to trump's election victory . a conviction election victory. a conviction would not end his bid to return to the white house. however polls are suggesting it could cost support among independents and some republican voters, though these charges are rigged,

the whole thing is rigged . the whole thing is rigged. >> the whole country is a mess between the borders and fake elections, and you have a trial like this where the judge is so conflicted he can't breathe. he's got to do his job. and it's not for me that i can tell you. >> donald trump's reaction about an hour ago. now, if you like volcanoes , there's one in volcanoes, there's one in iceland at the moment that's erupting rather beautifully. the fifth time since december. we understand if you're watching on tv, you can take a look as well. here it is spewing lava and smoke. the outburst happening on the reykjanes peninsula that's home to around 30,000 people just south of the capital, reykjavik . previous eruptions reykjavik. previous eruptions have forced people to be evacuated from their homes, closed roads and even razed houses to the ground in grindavik , a nearby fishing town grindavik, a nearby fishing town on the coast. nearby that's the news. for the latest stories, do sign up to gb news alerts. scan that qr code on your screen right now or go to gb news.

common alerts . common alerts. >> thank you very much for that, polly. fascinating stuff. there's just stop oil people in those bulletins. would you want your summer holiday disrupted by those protesters? honestly, i think the best thing media can do sometimes is just ignore them, deny them the oxygen of publicity. and then you know what? maybe, just maybe, they might go away. what do you reckon i am, michelle dewberry. and i'm with you till 7:00 tonight, alongside with my panel back by popular demand. i get so many emails asking about these two. when are their next back on? well, here they are. tonight is the answer to that. the author, a mail on sunday columnist peter hitchens, and alongside him, the co—founder of novara media, aaron bastani. good evening to both of you. you've made many people happy tonight just with your presence alone. i know, because i'll relax in that case. yeah. you can. i know you'll get in touch with me already and tell me that. lucy, let me. what do you think to that in the headlines

they're saying that there were live stream that inquiry, peter. not on the agenda for tonight, but kicked my ears up. >> it's impossible for me to talk about it because there is a there is a pending trial and it makes any kind of discussion of it impossible. i'd love to talk about it and to long be able to do so, but for the moment we just can't. >> what do you make to it all at home? have you been following some of those articles that they've just been referencing there in the headlines that you weren't freely able to access in the uk? but fascinating stuff in there, your mind, has it been changed in any way? get in touch and let me know your thoughts. i've got a packed show coming up with you tonight. i want to talk, of course, all about the goings on and the campaigning. i want to look at the situation in russia as well. protests here in london, which resulted in police officers getting injured last night. also, the latest policies out of the hats. we've got nhs stuff, extra strikes there, we've got apprenticeships. it's all going on. we've only got 36 days to the general election, quite frankly, you've had better things to do today than follow the twists and turns of the campaigning. worry not because we will be bringing you up to speed and it is about you as

well tonight. so get in touch all the usual ways you can email gb views @gbnews. com you can go on twitter aukus and get me there. or of course you can go onto the website gb news. com slash yourself and have a chat amongst yourself. and of course to me too, wherever you are, you're very welcome tonight, but let's get straight into all of the campaigns going on, shall we? let's cross live to our political correspondent olivia utley. good evening to you, olivia. what have we been missing today ? missing today? >> well, it's been an absolutely huge day on the campaign trail. labour wanted to spend the day talking about the nhs and health care in general. wes streeting has plans to clear the nhs backlog entirely and cut that waiting list of, thousands , waiting list of, thousands, hundreds of thousands, down by 92. but labour didn't really get to talk about it at all. now, why was that? because diane abbott took the headlines. now diane abbott, the veteran labour mp who was the shadow home secretary under jeremy corbyn, was suspended from the labour party a few months ago because

of a letter she wrote in which she said that jews, irish people and travellers don't face racism in the same way as black people . in the same way as black people. now that was considered anti—semitic by the labour party and she was suspended. rumour had it that the deal, the back behind the scenes deal between keir starmer and diane abbott was that she could have the party whip restored , and if she party whip restored, and if she then stood down and decided not to stand at the next election, she's now in her 70s, so that wouldn't be unusual at all. what happenedin wouldn't be unusual at all. what happened in recent days is that it seemed to emerge that keir starmer had actually banned diane abbott from standing that robbed her of the dignified exit, which she apparently wanted. but then that's what diane abbott herself said. but then the waters were muddied again today, when keir starmer said that diane abbott had not been banned from standing at all. it's all very confusing at the moment, and it isn't clear at all whether diane abbott will be allowed to stand for her hackney constituency either way. in the long run, it doesn't seem

like it's going to too be difficult for labour because diane has already said that she will be campaigning for the labour party, and it doesn't sound like she's going to be kicking up too much of a fuss. meanwhile on the conservative campaign trail, the prime minister has been talking about apprenticeships. he wants to expand the number of apprenticeships and to do so he wants to cut down on what's called mickey mouse degrees, what he's calling mickey mouse degrees. now, those degrees are, you know, degrees which which graduates end up in worse jobs than they would have ended up in if they hadn't gone to university at all. but when pressed, rishi sunak was unable to say to name a single mickey mouse degree or name anyone who had done one. so that's sort of put that policy on the back foot a little bit. the conservatives , a little bit. the conservatives, as you said in the headlines there, michel, have been pulling policies out of the hat like rabbits. labour, meanwhile, have been pretty quiet . today was been pretty quiet. today was their first big announcement about the nhs. but it very, very much got clouded over waters

totally muddied by this complicated and quite difficult. diane abbott story. >> it certainly did. olivia utley thank you for that update. now, one of the tweets that caught my eye, aaron bastani about the diane abbott situation was yours. in case you don't follow, if you're not a tweeter or an excel, let's look at what he said. aaron bastani was quoting keir starmer and basically said a bigger liar than johnson and blair is about to become the prime minister. why >> i think it's just beyond doubt. frankly in 2020, keir starmer said that he would end any impositions of candidates into seats which is to say that unelected, they're elected as el—sisi candidates to go on the national executive committee, but they're not parliamentarians . they would not determine who candidates would be in seats. members would fast forward to 2024. not only is the nec impose paying 2024. not only is the nec impose paying candidates, the nec members are the candidates . so

members are the candidates. so apparently four members of labour's nec are going to be parliamentary candidates. again, the nec chooses those candidates . there's something of a conflict of interest there on starmer in particular, this gentleman. i use that word guardedly said that he was sticking broadly to his ten pledges. even yesterday. speaking to beth rigby, he said most of them are still there. of those ten pledges, i think at a push you could say maybe one is still there. i think this man is the most mendacious, deceitful person we've seen at the elite level of british politics ever. and he's not even in downing street yet. at least with blair. it took a couple of years to get going. so i think we are seeing a whole new level of lying and deceit in british politics with keir starmer. if and when he becomes prime minister, i wondered if you were talking about because he was saying, wasn't he keir starmer? >> not that long ago about diane abbott, that no decisions had been made. the investigation was still ongoing. well, there's claims now that actually apparently that investigation had wrapped up quite some time

ago. she's been on some anti, anti—semitism training and all the rest of it. i don't know if he was referring to that. >> i'm referring to all of it michel. you know, the thing is my baby girl, she's seven months old now. you know, she turns oven old now. you know, she turns over, she she sleeps and it's not the end of the world because she can breathe. you know, breathing comes quite naturally to human beings. lying comes quite naturally to keir starmer. and the thing is, he said, like you say with regards to diane abbott, i think as recently as last friday, there's still a process. it's not been completed. the process is completed. the process is completed last year. so he was lying to beth rigby. he was lying to beth rigby. he was lying about diane abbott. today. we've just had news out that lloyd russell—moyle is now being administratively suspended. who's the brighton kemptown mp for labour this man and the people around him really lie to an extent, which i think really your viewers out there , people your viewers out there, people listening might think, well, all all politicians lie . no, this is all politicians lie. no, this is this is something quite new actually. >> obviously keir starmer is not here to defend himself. he

would, i'm sure, say that he's not the biggest liar at elite level of politics. just got to get that out there, peter hitchens, what do you make of it all? >> this is called triangulation. >> this is called triangulation. >> it's a very clever trick by which this is the simplest way of explaining it. you pretend to be right wing by attacking somebody on the left. you attack somebody on the left. you attack somebody and therefore you differentiate yourself from them. keir starmer is a man, very much of the left. he doesn't want people to understand this, particularly dunng understand this, particularly during the election. but so he wants to distance himself enormously from jeremy corbyn, who of course , is no longer in who of course, is no longer in the labour party and isn't standing as a labour candidate. although keir starmer once sat around the same shadow cabinet table as jeremy corbyn, and he also wants to distance himself from diane abbott, the problem he's run into with this is that a lot of labour party members see this as an injustice here. i am not going to be the person acting as advocate for diane abbott, but she has, in her time in the labour party, made major contributions as as the first black woman mp to an important cause and in actually fighting

against and getting rid of racial prejudice, which you can't take away from her. and he's he comes up against people who respect her for that. he also comes up against people who say, well, hang on a minute. you've recently welcomed into the into the labour party a conservative mp, mrs. elphicke, who is who is about as far from being labour's as i am from being labour's as i am from being labour. and this this is hypocritical. so he's got into difficulties by trying to be clever and i don't sympathise with him very much. both the major political parties have, for a very long time now. i think michael howard got it going in a big way back in 20 years ago, have been ambushing local political parties, local political associations, preventing them from selecting the mps they want. increasingly, mps are centrally selected employees of the party who will, if they become members of parliament, be employees and servants of the executive in downing street. and they won't

stand up for us, which increasingly they don't. this is one of the reasons why parliament is such a dead body. but fundamentally, what keir starmer is about is pretending to be something he's not. and by by trying to be tough with people who the public think are the ultra left he himself , as the ultra left he himself, as i say, as a man, very much of the left. i've written about this and gone into the details of his past, a past which, to his credit, he has not denied. >> sir, the candidate selection deadune >> sir, the candidate selection deadline for labour is the 4th of june. do you think diane abbott should be able to stand as a labour candidate? >> i think it's up to her. it ought to be up to, to her whether she wishes to stand. she's she is apparently now restored to the labour party and up to her constituency labour party as to whether they want to select her. that's that is the rule. i don't think it should be. that should be blocked by any kind of outside force . any kind of outside force. >> do you think she should be able to stand as a labour candidate? >> most certainly. bear in mind. look, this is a seat where i think a 35,000 majority, it's a massive majority and if we are to call ourselves a democracy

with the two party system, there are very few options for people to actually participate in the democracy of safe seats. if you don't allow members to participate in selection. and i'm actually worried with laboun i'm actually worried with labour, i you know, i think diane abbott's the cutting edge of this, but i disagree with what peter said there because, look, lloyd russell—moyle nobody's heard of that guy, right? he's not synonymous with the 2019 general election. they're getting rid of him because they want a favourable apparatchik to have another safe seat in brighton. kemptown in. and i think i don't think starmer's on the left . you think starmer's on the left. you think he is. that's fine. we can disagree. >> but no he is. >> but no he is. >> well, but it's possible to be on the left. >> he is i know he is. >> my point is this it's possible. possible to be on the left and a liar. >> you know, we can we can i can agree with you on that. >> we can we can agree or disagree about ideology. the man lies compulsively. he was talking to beth rigby, as i said on sky. she said, you've not kept your ten pledges. >> you're just saying that, though, because you have an issue with him. because obviously you were on the side of the fence of more the

corbynistas, keir starmer's essentially worked very hard to purge the labour party of that and reinvent the labour party in lots of ways. so have you just got sour grapes? >> no. when he won the when he won the leadership, i said, you know, he's running on a really interesting platform. pluralism wants to bring people together, be a unified, wants to change the culture of the labour party, which was a disaster under corbyn, not because of jeremy corbyn. it's been a disaster for a very long time. the labour party's culture. i don't like him because he constantly deceives people. he constantly lies. beth rigby said. >> did you like him when he was supporting jeremy corbyn? >> i've never really liked him because i don't. he's i mean, peter says he's on the left. i think he's a sort of he's a he's a city liberal and i don't really think he believes in very much that he says, you know, now he supports hs2. in 2015 he opposed hs2. i don't think he believes him very much. and i think sadly, we don't have many people in british politics who believe in these are superstructure icing on the cake issues. >> his his fundamental direction as a person has been since he was in his late 20s, making his way in the legal profession has been as a man of the of the very

dogmatic left, the red green pabloite left, which he which he served a very loyally , and the served a very loyally, and the and that is where he is. served a very loyally, and the and that is where he is . and and that is where he is. and he's said publicly in his famous interview with the new statesman that he has not he's not broken with those positions, and he's still very much the person he was then. i think this has to be understood. i this is a this is a new blair government in the making . we're going to have if making. we're going to have if he wins the election , which is he wins the election, which is by no means certain, by the way. but if he does win the election , but if he does win the election, we're going to have a government as vigorously, actively , as vigorously, actively, radically reforming and revolutionary as the blair government was in its first 18 months. and a lot of things which it is going to do, we don't know. we didn't know the blair government. it's easy examples. we didn't know the blair government was going to appoint alastair campbell to order civil servants about, though he wasn't elected to anything, a huge constitutional change. we didn't know about bank of england independence, and we didn't know about gordon brown's raid on private pensions. huge policy decisions

already taken before labour came into office in 97. what is it about this government? we don't know. lots. >> well, there you go . >> well, there you go. >> well, there you go. >> what do you think one of my viewers, ian, says you want diana back and you want her as chancellor of the exchequer. you're saying she couldn't do a worse job than what we currently have now? harsh words. ian, get in touch and let me know your thoughts on all of that after the break. we've got some big policies. we've pulled out the hat. you've seen talk about mickey mouse degrees and apprenticeship. i want to look at that. but i also want to ask you as well, junior doctors strikes the 11th one about to occurin strikes the 11th one about to occur in the run up to the general election. do you support that or

not? hello there. i'm michelle dewberry keeping you company until 7:00 tonight. alongside with the author and the mail on sunday columnist peter hitchens. and the co—founder of novara

media, aaron bastani. welcome back , everybody. these new back, everybody. these new policies, they are being pulled out of a hat like nobody's business. the latest one today we've seen . did you go to we've seen. did you go to university? do your kids grandkids go to university ? and grandkids go to university? and if so, did you find it worthwhile because the tories today are focusing on what they call mickey mouse degrees ? call mickey mouse degrees? they're having absolutely none of it. they want these universities to be able to scrap up these courses and use that money instead to invest in 100,000 more apprenticeships schemes. i've got to say, you heard earlier on from olivia utley , rishi sunak did come utley, rishi sunak did come a bit unstuck earlier on when he was asked to define an example of a mickey mouse degree, and he struggled a little bit . anyway, struggled a little bit. anyway, peter hitchens, what do you make to it all? >> well, i have been two things. ihave >> well, i have been two things. i have been a student and i've been an apprentice. i was an indentured apprentice for three years when i first started out in the trade of journalism. i'm all in favour of apprenticeships and not just in journalism, but the problem with them is you have to have industries for people to be apprentice to. and i think the reason why the schemes which we have at the

moment don't do as much good as they should is because we don't have very much industry into which to apprentice people. i think the germans do it much better. students. i have no doubt at all. there are far too many universities and far too many universities and far too many students, and something has to be done about it because people are being encouraged to go into lifelong debt. so that they can get qualifications, which won't do them much good. if we want an educated population, we should concentrate on making the schools better. and i'm amazed listening when the political obhuanes.i listening when the political obituaries . i know he's not obituaries. i know he's not dead, but he's politically closing down the political obhuanes closing down the political obituaries for michael gove over and over and over again. claim that he solved the school's problem in this country. he just has not. the education in the schools of this country is still extraordinarily bad. you don't make up for it by keeping people on at school for an extra three years at the end, which is what we do under current arrangements, the universities do need to be shrunk. people shouldn't have to have to get into debt to go to them. if you're if you're really good enough to go to university, the taxpayer should pay for your tuition and for your maintenance

while you're there. and you should then pay that back in what you do after you've qualified and the rest of your life. but the idea of hundreds of thousands of people going into enormous debt year after yean into enormous debt year after year, after year for degrees, which in many cases don't change their lives for the better, has been a grave mistake, and i'm glad to see some signs in politics that that's coming to an end. >> aaron bastani. >> aaron bastani. >> yeah, i think the fact that he can't explain what a mickey mouse degree is probably something of a problem. you know, i'm from bournemouth. yeah. and bournemouth arts college and university is very famous for animation, computer game design. now 20 years ago, that would have been called a mickey mouse degree, but actually today, in 2024, computer games are a bigger industry than film . that's now industry than film. that's now a very valuable degree. so i'm worried about that kind of loose language. if he specifically said these courses at these universities, at least it's something people can agree or disagree with. if you look at the most popular degrees for men, for instance , for men, it's men, for instance, for men, it's business, engineering, computer science , biological sciences and

science, biological sciences and then social studies. i presume he means some social studies degrees women, medicine, business, biological studies, the top three. so this idea that, you know, everybody's doing pointless degrees is simply not true. the most popular degrees are engineering, law, medicine, business. we need those kinds of people with those skills. what i find, really, you don't need to go to university for years on end to study about business. >> you could get in as an apprenticeship, start at the bottom, work your way up. bob's your uncle. you're the ceo. before you know it. >> do you think when he says mickey mouse degrees, he means business? no. >> but you see, i should do his comms for him. because if someone asked me that. what do you mean? i thought he'd already defined what he meant. i thought he meant. and we can debate this premise because what they're doing is they're basically valuing the degree based on opportunity, employment opportunities off the back of it, future earning capabilities off the back of it dropout rates. that's their classification as to if you meet all of those criteria. so you're not getting your earnings. people are dropping out and your employment prospects are below par. then tick mickey mouse

degree. that's how we should have answered it. but then that leads me to the interesting question about is the measure of what constitutes a valuable degree measured on, for example, salaries afterwards , job levels salaries afterwards, job levels afterwards. because what if someone came along and said, i want to pay my own fees, and i just want to do this for a bit of fun. i'm happy i work, earn loads of money. i work going to a top profession, but it'll fulfil me as an individual. i'm not borrowing money on loans. >> but, michel, universities aren't supposed to be vocational schools anyway. they're supposed to be for higher education. they're supposed to educate an elite which is capable of serious thought . and they've serious thought. and they've been they've been changed into into semi vocational schools, especially since john major began the merger of the polytechnics with the universities and the expansion which blair then hugely accelerated. they've become something completely different. they've ceased to be universities, as we understood them when i was at university. they're not that at all. so the difficulty is not so much the degrees of mickey mouse is that they're not degrees at all. and

in some cases they may be occasionally useful. in some cases they may not. but it's not what they're about. they're far too big. and also they are they've become rapacious businesses which rely increasingly on foreign students to keep them going, which pay their vice chancellors and other senior staff colossal sums of money and as i say, the people who go to them have to borrow a very heavily in ways which make big differences to their future lives, to go to them and are not getting much of a deal in many cases. as a result, i think that's obviously wrong. someone has to do something about it. i don't think talking about mickey mouse degrees is the best way of doing it. because as you say, it's clearly the statement wasn't properly prepared. they should have known that they would be asked that question. what do you mean by a mickey mouse degree? they should have had a prepared answer or they shouldn't have said it. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> arin and on the point of apprenticeships, what peter says is so true. you know, people think of apprenticeships, meaning you're going into a big shipyard or you become a mechanical or an electrical

engineer or, you know, nursing. no, we don't have much industry in this country now. and therefore most apprenticeships aren't what people think. if you look at, for instance, apprenticeships, i think in even 2010 they've gone down from about half a million to around 330,000. every single prime minister i can remember for the last 15 years gordon brown, david cameron, now rishi sunak , david cameron, now rishi sunak, probably boris johnson and theresa may too said that we need more apprentices is. but look, it's easy to say if there isn't the industry then what kinds of apprenticeships are we talking about ? kinds of apprenticeships are we talking about? i mean, i know people who've done apprenticeships for marketing and it means work from home two days a week and they're on a laptop. and i don't think the average punter out there thinks that's an apprenticeship. you get to know people, get to know the trade, get to know a workplace, get to know the culture. >> germany does it well because they still have a lot of basic industry. most german cities will have substantial number of small but but flourishing industries in them in which people still work. we've lost that or in or you might say we've destroyed it. we just don't have it. also, there are companies which refer to what is basically rebadged training as

apprenticeships. it isn't really apprenticeships. it isn't really apprenticeship at all. so it looks better than it is in the statistics. as is so often the case. >> after the break, i want to talk to you about the nhs strikes. we'll come on to that. so hold your horses, that'll got many of you guys talking today. also, aaron, on this apprenticeship thing , i can't apprenticeship thing, i can't help but notice how many job adverts, and i'm not being, you know, disparaging towards certain jobs, but you look at these jobs, you think you don't need to be a rocket scientist to do that. but at the bottom, it will say candidates must have a21 or something. so a lot of employers have this blanket filtering out of people based on having these degrees when they absolutely don't need them. i find that nonsensical. but let me ask you this because another policy, another one that was pulled out of the hat, was all about this national service. that was over the weekend, i saw rishi talking about that again today, was asked about that. he was in devon or wherever. all the things that we've just been talking about then you're saying about people working from home and all the rest of it, do you think these kind of schemes is national service thing is a good idea? that might stop some of those problems?

>> no, because it would just be run by g4's or serco. it would be a complete catastrophe. it would lose the taxpayer money. nobody would turn up for half the staff. it would just be another scam on the taxpayer. so, you know, and i know people have strong feelings about this, i support it. i'm against it. we don't need to go that deep. you know, it will just be run so catastrophic really. >> you know, why have you got so little faith? >> because that's what governments do now. >> everything is everything is contracted out. as soon as you mentioned serco, i thought, yeah, serco, serco, capita, all the others. that's that's what it would end up as. i don't think there's much danger of it ever actually happening. really. well, the far more interesting policy, which was announced at roughly the same time as keir starmer, was planned to give votes to 16 year olds and much more significant, much more likely to happen. farmer i don't know why the basic rule of war and politics don't interrupt your opponent when he's making a mistake. when keir starmer said votes at 16, he made a grave mistake which everybody has forgotten because rishi sunak then started announcing national service. >> did you think votes for 16 is a grave mistake ?

a grave mistake? >> no, i support votes for 16, but i support votes for 16 because i think we need to we need to from a very early age, enable young people to think that they should be active citizens, be politically involved, care about their communities , be deeply invested communities, be deeply invested in those communities. and i don't think that giving them the vote is, you know, a silver bullet for that. but i think that i'm certainly not opposed to it. no, do you think there's an element that labour want this? >> because they know that a lot of young people are more sympathetic to the left and the right, and therefore politically vie it stands to benefit the likes of the labour party more plausibly. >> but, you know, debates around expansion , expanding the expansion, expanding the franchise in the 19th century, everybody said, well, this will help the left more than the right. and, you know, the second reform act, i think, of the 18605. reform act, i think, of the 1860s. peter, i know this better than me. i think that was the birth of working class conservatives, like voting en masse. so people say that. but i wouldn't be so sure. you know , wouldn't be so sure. you know, those people could end up voting green or, you know, single issues and whatnot. so, no, i don't think statistically don't rated that the and the research

has been done that the big divide in british politics is now not class but age. >> the younger you are, the more left wing you are. so i think there's any doubt that i don't think they'd vote labour necessarily. well they're not going to vote tory that's for sure. >> no, that is for sure. >> no, that is for sure. >> but 1.5 million people would be, would be enfranchised and quite a lot of them would, would, would, would certainly not vote tory. and i think he sees that. the interesting thing is that at the same time all this is going on, actually, labour has been instrumental in lo in actually raising the age of consent for other things. for instance, the age of consent for marriage in england went up with labour's support last year. labour's support last year. labourin labour's support last year. labour in two thousand and seven raised the age at which, from 16 to 18, at which you could buy cigarettes. it seems the general view of the left is that you should be making more things harder to do when you're 16, so how they square that you can't get a tattoo till you're 18? even in the army, which can recruit at 16, it's now the case that that young soldiers can't go into combat until they're 18.

everything is moving in the opposite direction. so for keir starmer to be moving things down to 16, you have to ask him what's his attitude going to be when his children start saying, well, why can't i? why can't i get a tattoo? why can't i buy cigarettes and buy drink in a pub at 16? >> well, lots to be getting in touch, about this degree situation, lots of you think that actually the definition of mickey mouse versus none is whether or not it contributes to the economy, what you do afterwards, john says , what afterwards, john says, what about scrapping degrees for things like nurses , they should things like nurses, they should be on apprenticeships. i have a lot of you writing as well, that many of you said about the push to get police officers, doing more degree type stuff. you feel that that is wrong. i've spoken to you guys about that before. keep your thoughts coming in all the usual ways. by the way. happens all the time. i'm a lone voice on this panel. i actually don't think that national service idea is all that bad. do you agree with me or not, get in touch and let me know your thoughts. after the break. i want to talk to you about junior doctors. the 11th walkout since march last year, planned right before the election, is that

politically motivated? you tell me

hello there. i'm michelle dewberry till 7:00. the author of mail on sunday columnist peter hitchens alongside me . as peter hitchens alongside me. as is the author, the co—founder of what am i doing today? i'm just getting myself all confused and discombobulated. of course, the co—founder of novara media, aaron bastani, remains alongside me. we've just been having a debate in the break there. i'm saying i don't think that national service is a bad idea. quite frankly, i think too many young people in our society lack a little bit of gumption, a little bit of resilience, and quite frankly, they need a good shake. and if that policy could perhaps enable some of that, then it gets a high five from me. tell me your thoughts on that. but for now, junior doctors in england there are again everyone striking again . again everyone striking again. it's the 11th time that they will be walking out since march last year. you know the drill by now. they want pay restoration ,

now. they want pay restoration, which is essentially a 35% pay increase. they want it backdated to rates as they should have been, they would argue, since 2008, this strike will be five days from the 27th of june to the 2nd of july. peter hitchens, do you support this? >> no, it's quite simple for me. i don't have any difficulty with this at all. doctors should never strike. it's simply not possible to be a doctor and to strike. it contradicts everything that being a doctor is about. you're withholding mercy from someone who's in pain and distress, and you can't do that. and if you don't want to, if you if you don't want to be paid what junior doctors are paid, then don't be a junior doctor. but if you are going to be a junior doctor, you have to understand that people rely on you more heavily than they do on practically anybody else on earth, and you cannot go on strike. so either you don't go on strike or don't be a junior doctor. but there are no two ways about this. i don't have any time for it at all. and i am any time for it at all. and i am a i've been on strike. i think

it was 50 years ago. for one day. i am a trade unionist. i support the freedom to strike. but in the case of doctors and nurses alike and also firemen and police officers, i'm just against it. they can't do it. >> prison officers as well. they can't strike. aaron bastani you shouldn't either. >> well, i think when you've got a single organisation administering healthcare, which we do with the nhs in england and wales, we don't have a private health care system. i mean, i have to disagree because then people literally have no means of improving their income in most industries, let's say mish falls out with itv, she's a presenter. she can go to gb news, she can go to the bbc to channel 4. in the nhs, you don't have that. so i think they do have that. so i think they do have to have the right to strike. there can be certain protections, but i think they need that right. and in terms of what they're asking for here, it's not that much. and we've had a 5. well, actually, when you look at the numbers involved, i think it's about £1 billion a year. >> you and i know i think at all. >> well, no, no, but we've had this conversation a few times, a question here, whenever anybody says i want such and such amount of money out of the tax, out of

the tax income of the government, you have to ask them, where is it coming from? >> well, we you proposed. >> well, we you proposed. >> do they propose to take the billion pounds away from some other government activity? which one or do they or do they propose to impose taxes on other people so they can pay the problem? >> how do they have the nerve to make sure the problem with junior doctors is we pay a hell of a lot to train these people. they earn very good money as consultants. yeah, there's this terrible pinch point where they don't earn great money. it's pretty hard. and actually they can learn a lot more money elsewhere. and we're losing lots of people who we invest in. and i think if you were a business, even if you didn't agree with what they were doing, you'd say, look, we're losing loads of really valuable stuff at this crucial pinch point over several years. just give them what they want. yeah. >> or if you as a business, to quote your analogy. and again to quote your analogy. and again to quote yourself back to you, you're saying we invest all this money in this stuff, then off they go. well, if you as a business, you sit there and you say, right, i'm going to invest in training and developing you and there's going to be a

retention clause. we'll spend all this on developing you, which, by the way, you're going to make an absolute fortune down the line in your own career. you're going to get fabulous pensions and perks and all the rest of it. but for now, there's a retention. you have to stay locked into the nhs, and if you 90, locked into the nhs, and if you go, no problem. but now you have to start repaying x percent of your training. >> i mean, a retention clause if you didn't have to pay tuition fees, for instance, particularly for nurses, i think that's that's reasonable. but we don't have that. i mean, this is the kind of conversation we need. we've talked about this many times. you know, the average nurse is graduating with around £55,000 worth of debt. nursing shouldn't be a career where you are scraping by. i'm not suggesting it should be incredibly lucrative, but it shouldn't be something where you think you know what? if i was at lidl, i'd actually be earning more money, which by the way, for some nurses is the case. so i think with this particular issue and by the way, because of the strikes, it's already cost more money than they would have had to spend on it. we are seeing waiting lists go up primarily because of industrial action. is this political? >> the timing of this? >> the timing of this? >> well, industrial action is always political. >> yeah, but come on, we're in

an election period, so the government won't even really be able to meet with those doctors dunng able to meet with those doctors during that period anyway. so you're not going to develop your cause with the current sitting government. you're now directly impacting people's health and their safety. do you think it's just a step too far? >> no. i think a general election in in the summer is probably a quite a good time to do it. i think it's better than doing it around christmas when people have coughs and colds. i think it's a perfectly sensible time to do it. >> what do you make to it all? because i know a lot of you have been very much in support of the junior doctors, and i, of course, say i would love to see them paid more money. but is this the way that you achieve it and is there a line for you? i've told you it's the 11th walkout now since march last yeah walkout now since march last year. of course, in scotland they've accepted a pay offer that's much lower than the 35% on disputes here. let me know your thoughts. all the usual ways. you can email gb views @gbnews. com or of course go on to the website gb news. slash your say and tell me what you think. coming up after the break, i want to discuss the goings on in rafah. have you seen the social media campaign

all eyes on rafah? let's discuss in

hello there. i'm michelle dewberry with you till seven. aaron bastani and peter hitchens remain along side me, lots of people getting in touch about the junior doctors strike, saying it's political, but aaron bastani says, well, what's strike isn't , clear. the nhs strike isn't, clear. the nhs backlog and the new patients will come forward and form a new queue. there's never going to be a scenario where there's zero waiting lists. there's lisa, dave says junior doctors should be ashamed of themselves. and one of my other viewers says, if you don't kneel, if you don't want emergency sectors going on strike, set up a panel to set their pay rises like the mps have. they already have peer review boards in lots of these sectors, but they rejecting those proposals. look, there's another story i want to talk to you about before we go. we've seen protests in london last

night started off quite peacefully. many people have said, and then they did descend into something a little less peaceful, i've got to say, which saw , multiple police officers saw, multiple police officers hurt. the essence of it is the situation in rafah. there's a huge social media campaign now, all eyes on rafah. tens of millions of people have interacted with it, huge strength of feeling about what's going on there. your thoughts? >> yeah. the scenes coming out of rafah are about absolutely horrific. i don't know if you're viewers and listeners have seen some of those images. i mean , some of those images. i mean, like things from a horror movie involving children , frankly, involving children, frankly, i don't need to go any further. >> you're talking about the doubt that came out, carrying a child that had been decapitated. yeah. >> and it seems that that was probably from shrapnel, so there was a israel, its air force dropped two. they say two bombs, 17 kilo bombs on a building. dropped two. they say two bombs, 17 kilo bombs on a building . and 17 kilo bombs on a building. and they then claim that that then blew up because there were weapons stored there. they

didn't know that. which is strange, because they'd previously said that location was one of the sites where there had been attacks launched on october the 7th. so either they knew there were weapons there or they didn't, but anyway, 50, around 50 innocent people died and what israel says is, well, they weren't in the safe zone thatis they weren't in the safe zone that is rewriting the laws of conflict. you know, you don't just say, well, civilians have died because they weren't in the safe zone. that's suddenly okay. no they are not legitimate targets. they're not legitimate collateral damage, and as i've said so many times , every single said so many times, every single child in particular that is killed by the idf in gaza is a recruiting sergeant for hamas . recruiting sergeant for hamas. this will echo for decades. and it's just an appalling, appalling thing. >> let me ask you about this, because there's some people that refer to the images that you've just described and they will say, oh, pallywood, it's all propaganda. they're all fake. what would you say about to that ? >> 7- >> it's just ? >> it's just nonsense. ? >> it'sjust nonsense. i mean, >> it's just nonsense. i mean, we know that tens of thousands of people have been killed and i would invite you to at least search some of the terms you

mentioned, and you will see the images and come up to your own conclusions. and i think, frankly, millions of people who weren't particularly invested in this have seen what's happened in rafah and hence this this graphic on instagram has gone absolutely wild. >> tens of millions of people have seen and engage that peter hitchens well, the bombing and bombardment of populated areas is flat out wrong. >> it's always been wrong. and it no civilised country should do it. and yet we do . and people do it. and yet we do. and people are prepared to look the other way. if these scenes are which have also, i have to say, taken place under the under the bombardment of western countries such as the united states and britain, in iraq and of russia in aleppo, about which there was some protest because it was russia some years ago. if these scenes were now taking place in european cities , i think we european cities, i think we would understand the horror with which they're regarded in the arab and muslim world rather better. i don't want that to happen because and one of the

reasons i constantly urge people against the whole idea of supporting bombardment of populated areas is the more that we do it, the more that eventually we risk the danger of it coming to us. i think it really we really have to realise as civilised countries this is not something that we can do. it is always wrong . it cannot be is always wrong. it cannot be justified by military or political terms and i would add that for those who like me, who try and make some sort of case for the continued existence of israel, it makes that task incredibly hard. >> look, i know there's a huge sense of emotion around this topic. there will be divided opinions at home. i'm absolutely sure there'll be many of you getting in touch saying, well, michelle, why aren't they releasing the hostages? and then much of this will stop. i can hear you shouting that, but look, whatever side of the fence you're on, we can all conclude that actually. what everyone. can i say something? there a peaceful solution. if it's about two seconds, it's very fast. >> the idea that this or this action is going to get the hostages released seems to me to be discredited by experience. thatis be discredited by experience. that is not happening. they know

it just it just it doesn't work on those terms. you cannot fight hamas by bombing them. >> there you go, look , talking >> there you go, look, talking about national service, daryl says, we live in a free society . says, we live in a free society. your life belongs to you, not the state. compulsory national service is appalling . one step service is appalling. one step away from a dictatorship. come off it, daryl. these kids get them out of bed and put them to work. make them contribute to society. that's what i say. but look, that's all i've got time for. thanks, chaps. thanks to you at home. don't go anywhere. farage is up next night. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar , sponsors of weather on . solar, sponsors of weather on. gb news. >> hello. good evening. welcome to your latest gb news weather update. it's going to be another showery day tomorrow. the showers will be much more focused across eastern areas and it should stay a bit drier across the west. that's as high pressure is slowly building in from the west, but in the east low pressure is still in charge and that will continue to bring some pretty heavy outbreaks of rain to parts of southern

scotland, northeastern england, through this evening. that's where there's a weather warning in force until the early hours of thursday. heavy rain will push into parts of wales, possibly the southwest of england as well, by tomorrow morning, so risks of outbreaks of heavy rain by tomorrow morning. a fairly mild night, though temperatures only dipping down as low as 11 or 12 degrees for many towns and cities. so a mild start to the day. but it will be quite a cloudy day and there will be some heavy rain around across the northeast of scotland. actually, it will turn much drier than it has been today through tomorrow morning. some brightness across parts of the central belt as well . but the central belt as well. but elsewhere further south across northern ireland, northern england as well. cloudy, with a risk of some showery outbreaks of rain. it's particularly this band across central england into parts of wales where it could be quite a wet start to the day. there's also a risk of some heavy showers breaking out across the south coast. first thing some areas will stay dry and i think across the west it will get drier through the becomes m across central and southeastern

areas . pressure still not too areas. pressure still not too far away from the east coast and that will be dragging in more in the way of cloud and onshore breeze as well. so that will bnng breeze as well. so that will bring a cooler feel tomorrow for many of us. but still in the sunshine, temperatures climbing up to the high teens, that's not too bad at all. it will still feel fairly pleasant. there'll be more in the way of sunshine to start the day on friday, particularly across western areas in the east. it's still going to be a fairly cloudy day , going to be a fairly cloudy day, with some outbreaks of rain that could turn heavy as we head into the afternoon, but signs of things improving for the weekend . much more in the way of sunshine to come and temperatures climbing towards the low 20s. >> looks like things are heating up boxt boilers as sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> good evening and welcome to farage with me. camilla tominey back again. night two. hoping it all goes to plan. what's labour's plan for the nhs ? we labour's plan for the nhs? we heard all about that today from wes streeting in keir starmer . wes streeting in keir starmer. i'm also going to be speaking to nigel farage. he's taking on his remain nemesis, michael heseltine , and going to be heseltine, and going to be discussing whether reform will do a deal with the tories. and would you believe it? protests have broken out in the sunny houday have broken out in the sunny holiday spot of majorca over , holiday spot of majorca over, you guessed it, tourism. we'll have more on that story in just a moment. but first, here's the news with polly middleton first in the gb newsroom . in the gb newsroom. >> camilla, thank you and good evening to you. well, the top story this hour. the prime minister's been hitting out at plans by junior doctors to stage another round of strikes next month. members of the british medical association will walk out for five days starting from

the