that question seems to be the welsh first minister, vaughan gething , who has literally just gething, who has literally just lost a vote of no confidence in the welsh parliament. whoops. let's discuss . also, what do you let's discuss. also, what do you think to this? do you reckon we should be offered mental health minutes? that is a new lib dem proposal. is it a good one though or not? and a poll out today. though or not? and a poll out today . get this. everyone says today. get this. everyone says that more than half of young brits that's aged 18 to 24, if you're wondering, think there is real shouldn't exist, your thoughts on that ? also tonight thoughts on that? also tonight i really want to talk about the

state of the justice system. let's face it, it's an absolute mess. people let our prisons early and backlogs almost as long as the magna carta. lord blunkett, though, has some solutions and we like them, he says. let's create nightingale courts and a network of new mini prisons. do you agree with that ? prisons. do you agree with that? look, aaron bastani and peter hitchens keeping me company over the next hour. but before we get stuck in, let's cross live to the legend. that's polly middlehurst for the 6:00 news. >> michelle, thank you and good evening to you. well, the king has said today that the uk is eternally indebted to those who fought and lost their lives on d—day. events have been taking place in france and in portsmouth, where 80 years ago, 150,000 men set off for the largest seaborne invasion in

history . hundreds of personnel history. hundreds of personnel parachuted into normandy to remember those who did the same eight decades ago . well, eight decades ago. well, speaking a little bit earlier on, his majesty paid tribute to those veterans, saying their stories couldn't couldn't fail to inspire the nation. >> let us once again commit ourselves. always to remember, cherish and honour those who served that day and to live up to the freedom they died for. by balancing rights with civic responsibilities to our country . responsibilities to our country. for we are all eternally in their debt . their debt. >> his majesty the king speaking there. well as michelle was just saying, the welsh first minister, vaughan gething, has lost a vote of no confidence in the senate today . it's happened the senate today. it's happened in the last half an hour. the conservatives were the ones that brought the motion. after a series of rows, including a

controversial donation, the sacking of a minister and the collapse of a cooperation deal with plied comrie. mr gething, who's only been first minister since march, was visibly emotional during the debate and had to be comforted and speaking just moments ago, he said he would continue to put wales first. >> today was an exercise in muck throwing. the range of different things that were said that members know are simply not true is really quite disgraceful. i'm going tonight to normandy. i should have been in portsmouth today honouring our d—day veterans. i will go to normandy to do my duty for my country , as to do my duty for my country, as any first minister should. that means a long drive overnight to arrive, to do the right thing tomorrow . that's how i feel tomorrow. that's how i feel about serving my country and that's my intention now and for the future. >> vaughan gething short time ago now politics and sir keir starmer's accused rishi sunak of repeatedly lying during their

television election debate last night over labour's plans for tax. the statistics watchdog is looking into the prime minister's claims that labour have a £38 billion black hole in the financial plans, as stated by the conservatives. they insist it followed independent treasury analysis. but the labour leader says it's all a lie . lie. >> you saw last night was a prime minister with his back against the wall, desperately trying to defend 14 years of failure , resorting and it was failure, resorting and it was a flash of his character and insight into his character to lies . i don't say that lightly lies. i don't say that lightly to lies about labour's plans , to lies about labour's plans, about health, waiting lists, about health, waiting lists, about , you know, the tax lies about, you know, the tax lies from the prime minister >> well, the conservatives have hit back with the energy secretary, claire coutinho, reiterating the prime minister's claims keir starmer couldn't do

is he couldn't rule out the fact that his policies, as set out by the labour party, would cost families £2,000 in extra taxes and he couldn't rule out the fact that pensioners, for the first time under labour plans , first time under labour plans, would have to pay tax on their state pension next year . state pension next year. >> and actually that's the substance of what people are choosing between . and i really choosing between. and i really thought actually it was quite shocking that on all of those major issues, keir starmer was woolly . he major issues, keir starmer was woolly. he didn't have any clear plans or proposals to address some of the challenges that the country is facing now away from the election. >> liberal democrat leader sir ed davey has apologised for speeding , saying he ed davey has apologised for speeding, saying he missed ed davey has apologised for speeding , saying he missed the speeding, saying he missed the temporary signs on the m1 in bedfordshire when it happened. he says he quite rightly paid a fine and had three points added to his licence. he was caught doing 73 miles an hour in a 60 mile an hour zone. he also said the failure to provide documentation had been a genuine oversight , with the case brought oversight, with the case brought

before magistrates in march . and before magistrates in march. and lastly, the first banknotes carrying a portrait of king charles will go into circulation today. charles will go into circulation today . notes that still feature today. notes that still feature the image of the late queen elizabeth ii will remain legal tender, and kosaku plate alongside those bearing the king's image. the new notes , king's image. the new notes, though, will only be printed to replace those that are worn out or to meet any overall increase in demand. in order to minimise the environmental and financial impact of the change. that's the news. for the latest stories, do sign up to gb news alerts, scan the qr code on your screen or go to gbnews.com/alerts . to gbnews.com/alerts. >> thank you very much for that, polly. i am michelle dewberry and i'm keeping you company until 7:00 tonight alongside me reuniting two of your favourites. peter hitchens, the columnist for the mail on sunday, and our ambassador a&e, the co—founder of novara media.

good evening. >> good evening. >> good evening. >> if you're a regular viewer , >> if you're a regular viewer, this won't make much sense to you. but last time you was on, i think it was last week, i got an email from a viewer saying we never got to the bottom of which of the two were the cuddly teddy bean of the two were the cuddly teddy bear. do you remember that ? bear. do you remember that? yeah, one viewer wrote in when these two chaps was on my programme and said, oh, i'm so happy you've got the cuddly teddy bear on tonight. and i put the appeal out and said, who is it that you're referring to? i never got a straight answer. so you see that mystery hangs over the programme. it's like a it's like a bad smell. we need to get to the bottom of where it's coming from. so who is the cuddly teddy bear on this panel? if it was you that said that, get in touch and, please put me out of my misery so i know the answer to that. but beyond that, there's lots more in town to discuss. i want your thoughts on it all. we've got a packed programme for you, and you can get in touch with me all the usual ways. you can email gb views @gbnews. com you can tweet or me or of course you can go to the website gbnews.com slash your say and chat there. anyway,

look it's all going on today. i promise you that we'll always keep you across the goings on on the campaign trail. let's just get stuck straight in cross. live to our political editor, christopher hope. good evening to you. >> where are you, michelle? yes it's been a well, i'm coming through south london now. we've been a long journey on this labour party battlebus today we've been started the day in manchester, near salford , and manchester, near salford, and we've driven down to the south coast, to portsmouth and where we've been with sir keir starmer, who met with a war veteran there, and we just asked questions about the fallout from last night's election tv debates. the big battle here has been about a big number, rather like in the 2016 general election, when the number was about this £350 million money going to the nhs. about this £350 million money going to the nhs . this time it's going to the nhs. this time it's about a figure, a figure of £2,000, which the tories say labour would impose on britain's if they win power in less than a month's time. that's been challenged by labour saying it's

a lie. we heard from keir, sir keir starmer saying the figure was a lie. the tories have hit back, they've gone through the number for us. they say that there's of the 28 different lines of numbers in that 21 are official treasury figures. they are 100% certain about that figure. what's irritating , figure. what's irritating, michelle, for labour is we're discussing a tory number about their policy, the impact of their policy, the impact of their on taxation, more taxation required if labour win power. and that's deeply irritating, i think, for sir keir starmer and his team. i also asked him, by the way, for gb news a question i thought was quite interesting, he said on the debates last night up in salford on itv that he wouldn't pay for any private health care for any family member who was seriously ill, waiting for to be treated on the nhs. he said he wouldn't do that and i think that's quite interesting. and he and i asked him again today and he said, look, he comes from a family where his mother was treated extensively on the nhs and he wouldn't use it even if a family member was in pain, he wouldn't use it. it shows a degree of

principle in him. i wonder how many of our viewers would think the same if you could be paid as much as he's paid £120 if you asked me, and i'll ask my panel about that in a second. >> anyway, carry on. >> anyway, carry on. >> well, yeah. well, you might say it's nonsense. i mean, he believes it, but it's a good debate to have if you are paid £120,000 a year from the state and even then you wouldn't use some of that money to pay for a sick child or a sick relation to get to get, well, more quickly. that shows a degree of principle, he said that as director of public prosecutions, michelle, he never he never paid for private health care. so that's that battle with the tories and labour elsewhere. you know about vaughan gething and that's a big deal in wales. just we just moments ago he lost a no confidence vote in the welsh senate. elsewhere, ed davey has been fined for speeding and quite interesting. on the reform uk front, the reform uk party is now just two points behind the tory party labour on 40 reform

uk on on 19 points. lib tories on 21 and that that to me shows is fascinating. i'll read that again. forgive me. the tories on 19 points reform on 17 points. and that to me is interesting. it shows this bounce that nigel farage looks like it's given that party. and are we about to reach the point called crossover when reform uk become, in polling terms, the challenger party to labour? if that happens, maybe next week it could happen with the direction of travel and the polls, that will be enormous . will be enormous. >> interesting stuff. i was desperate the whole time he was talking. i was listening, obviously, but i was also hoping for you to stop at a red light because we all talk about these battle buses. you're on this bus. but i think many viewers will be fascinated. they've never been on a battle bus. what is it like? i wanted the cameraman to be able to. i don't know if it's very professional or the normal thing, but i want you to stop so i could get him to just pan around. i mean, look

at that. let me have a good nosey. what's going on there? so. so when we say battle bus. so. so when we say battle bus. so that's like basically a normal it looks like a national holidays coach trip. who are these people? are these journalists or they're there are some journalists from national newspapers, essentially what happens is sir keir starmer travels separately to us. right. there's a branded battle bus run by angela rayner. she's a deputy leader and that goes around other parts of the country. we're on this this national press bus. we've been following slightly cheap seats, but there is a branded bus. and in fact, when with the tory party as with that on monday, that was a branded bus. and at the back of it there's a of the bus. michelle, if we do this again, i'll take you around the back of it because there's a, there's a, a table and some and some sort of sofa where you can discuss politics. >> oh. mrs. it'sjust politics. >> oh. mrs. it's just gone under a tunnel. it was just getting interesting. then he said, it's going to take me around the back of the bus next week. goodness gracious me, i can tell you where i'm from. that means something entirely different to what christopher was suggesting. anyway. look, let's bring the

conversation into the studio, look, this much i want to unpick. should we start on this vaughan gething situation? ian? aaron, where are you on this? >> happily. very. kenneth williams, frankie howerd from, your man on the battle bus there with the double entendre. anyway, on vaughan gething. i mean, i don't know if your your viewers have seen this elsewhere. i think it was on, some footage of it earlier on of him crying. i can only presume he's crying because he might have to give the £200,000 back, but it is. it is amusing, but it's also quite serious. on the one hand there, you guys getting a consoling rub on the shoulder? it's £100,000. a lot of money, on the one hand, i just find it ridiculous. he's saying he's going to do his duty, go to portsmouth. as if, you know, as if his actions and who he is commensurate with people fighting for their country. absurd and outlandish. on the other hand, i do feel like this is perhaps a flash of the future with all of these , candidates with all of these, candidates being parachuted in by the labour party , some of them not labour party, some of them not having particularly clean hands. and i wonder if we'll have similar scandals after july the 4th. if labour get a thumping

majority, because quite frankly, some of these people who will become mps, the due diligence has not been done by the media. you can blame the media, but actually there's a hell of a lot of them, that under normal conditions would have been scrutinised but haven't been, on the senate. >> by the way, you might be familiar with the fact that gb news is actually banned from the internal screens. i don't know why i'm laughing because i actually it's not funny. it's pretty serious. i just found it the height of ridiculousness, they took that decision , they took that decision, remember? after the goings on, i think it was with the laurence fox stuff and all the rest of it. absolutely ridiculous. that was a stupid excuse. that whole situation was resolved. i think i should start a mini campaign. i'm sure that all the people in the senate, they want to and should be able to hear what you two delightful gents are talking about on the show tonight. anyway, what do you make to the goings on? >> a very little. oh, i'm sorry, i do try to maintain an interest in an awful lot of things, but welsh politics is one that i've never really succeeded. >> oh, i can hear all the welsh

viewers switching off. >> well, i'm sorry about it, but it's true. i can't. i can't sit here and try to speak knowledgeably about a subject of which i know absolutely nothing, so i won't. well speak knowledgeably. a reasonable thing to do. people should do it. more on television. actually, i don't know. >> i got to be honest. it's a bit rubbish for a debate programme, but i appreciate it actually, because if some people did actually say it, it's not my forte. i'll move on, actually, the society might be a better place. well, i shall move on then. and i'll ask you about the leaders debate last night. yes, i assume you watched it. who do you reckon won? >> oh, i think there's no doubt at all that rishi sunak won. it was quite interesting to see that a prime minister, actually put dishing it out to a leader of the opposition when it should have been the other way around. i wasn't particularly surprised by that. it's not because sunak is so good, because he's not particularly good, though. anybody who's been educated at winchester should be reasonably good. but because keir starmer is so bad, i mean, he is an awful debater and he doesn't have any presence and he really

wasn't managing at all. well, it's not an occasion where he was ever going to do well, but i was ever going to do well, but i was surprised how badly he did . was surprised how badly he did. one just wonders how much impact it will have on anything, but i don't think there's any doubt that that sunak came out of it better. whichever one you like or don't like, or if, like me, you're indifferent between them, it's beyond question . it's beyond question. >> i also think it took a very long time to report this £2,000, it was kind of like a bit of a right hook there. rishi sunak saw it landing and kept repeating it, repeating it. we was watching it. i was shouting at the screen, well, if it's not true, say it's not true, then say it's not true. say it's not true. but it took him ages to actually come back and say that that wasn't true. what do you make to that? >> well, starmer is rather robotic, and i think if, if there's a variable that's thrown into the field, which he isn't prepared for, it's almost like it doesn't exist, he won't respond to it. i, i disagree with peter and so much i felt it was a bit of a score draw. you know, a split decision. you could go one way or the other.

but the point is that given starmer is allegedly polling so well and labour have such momentum, and rishi sunak had such a terrible week , the fact such a terrible week, the fact he annoyed avoided a knockout punch, i think is very good for rishi sunak. and i agree, starmer came across as somebody with no presence. there's a poll out today giving labour a majority of more than 330. he doesn't look like a man who's about to win a parliamentary majority of 330. very strange, very strange political moment we're living in. >> how good are these polls? >> how good are these polls? >> and we just had everybody saying for weeks that narendra modi was going to score a gigantic victory in india, and then he didn't. and i went back last week over some of the polls of some years ago, previous elections, particularly the 1971, where they just got it completely wrong. i'm baffled as to people say, well, polling has got better since then, but has it? people are much harder to find at home than they were before. you can't ring them up because hardly anybody answers the phone. how are they doing the phone. how are they doing the polling? and what's more, the polling? and what's more, the numbers of people who say to pollsters, look at the raw work

from polls, it's always worth doing. number of people who say, i'm not telling you or i'm not going to vote is quite large. so the what? apparently huge shifts in figures are actually quite small. i ijust in figures are actually quite small. i i just of course i don't know what the outcome will be and it would be reasonable for the government to be more unpopular than the opposition at the beginning of a general election. i just think people should stop saying it's over before it started. apart from anything else, it makes it all very dull, but i just think it's wrong, particularly for anybody in a position of public responsibility , to say it's responsibility, to say it's oven responsibility, to say it's over, it's already settled. it is actually true that there is a vote that's going to happen, and we don't know how it's going to 90, we don't know how it's going to go, and we shouldn't close off the options by saying, no, it's already settled. it's very bad for for politics, people to do it. some countries ban opinion polls during general elections and i'm not at all sure they're wrong. >> i have often asked you guys this at home, but have you ever been polled in anything like this? i have never been polled in all of my life i have. have

you? well, i found some one. have you ever been polled on one of these official, political for a general election? no, i've neven a general election? no, i've never, look, andy just got in touch about a comment that i made. christopher hurt was saying, keir starmer during that debate last night, he was asked, would you essentially. i mean, i'm paraphrasing the question, but would you ever use private health care if indeed the health of a family member depended on it and the nhs wasn't able to serve them, he categorically said no. i said that was nonsense. and he said, are you saying that keir starmer is a liar? then yes , on that matter. liar? then yes, on that matter. i've got to be frank with you, yes i am. he's not to here defend himself. he would push back and absolutely dispute that. but i don't believe anyone who would sit there and look me in the eye and say, if my child, was , i don't know, dying or was, i don't know, dying or whatever. and there was aware that he needed health care that wasn't available to me, i.e. by the nhs, and we can dispute the rights and wrongs of that. whatever. but if you had an opfion whatever. but if you had an option to provide health care to your child, you might need to beg, steal, borrow, crowdfund whatever. tell me, tell me the

truth. as a parent, would you not try and save your child's life by using private health care? and if you genuinely say no, please tell me why? because i don't believe you. >> what is the principle in this? >> so we look at his clip, by the way, just in case anyone didn't see it. and then you can tell me the principle of el—sisi. let's have a look at him. in case you didn't see that debate last night, we know if your loved one was on a waiting list for surgery. >> no, thank you very much. >> no, thank you very much. >> i don't use private health. i use the nhs . that's where my use the nhs. that's where my wife works. in one of the big hospitals. as i say, it runs through my dna. okay >> the only way i would believe that, by the way, andy, is if he gets some special treatment. so because it's him or his family, he would be put to the front of the queue and therefore he wouldn't have to wait for potentially years? >> no, he may have. he may have had as many people of his generation would have had an experience with the nhs as it was when his beloved mother was very ill. he may from that have gained an impression about it, which is now no longer valid. it's one thing, the other thing

is what is the principle here involved? we pay, i pay for the nhs. i pay a lot of tax to the nhs. i pay a lot of tax to the nhs. it's no different, in my view, to the amount, to the amount of money i pay for any private insurance that i have. it's a functional, simple thing. it's a functional, simple thing. l pay it's a functional, simple thing. i pay for it. i don't expect i'm happy for the money that i put into into the nhs to be used for other people less well off than i am. and in fact delighted that that happens. but but when i use the nhs, i expect that the money that i paid into it will mean that i paid into it will mean that i paid into it will mean that i get reasonable treatment if i don't, or if somebody very dear to me didn't, and particularly if they were in pain, i wouldn't hesitate to pay- pain, i wouldn't hesitate to pay. and quite honestly, i think a lot of people would borrow to do it. and i think it's a strange, dogmatic answer. >> i just don't think it's true, i'm going to carry on my appeal. are you in that camp that you wouldn't pay for it? get in touch. tell me why i'm going to our ambassador and response to it all after the

hello there. i'm michelle dewberry with you till 7:00 tonight alongside me, peter hitchens and aaron bastani remain. i love you guys at home, i must confess. and i'll tell you for why. at the start of the program, christopher hope was sitting on the so called battle bus for labour. we've got him , bus for labour. we've got him, got the camera to pan around and give us a cheeky little look at what that battle bus was. gareth has been in touch and says, excuse me, i thought it was all obsessed with things like the climate change and emissions, he said. that was a massive battle bus for sir. many vacant seats. yes, gareth. you see, you see, people just don't preach . they people just don't preach. they don't practice what they preach, don't practice what they preach, do they? anyway, look, before, the break, we were talking about keir starmer reckoning he would essentially let a family member die rather than breach his principle of going private on the nhs. i personally don't believe him, andy thinks that that's appalling. definitely does believe him. where are you? aaron? bastani >> i think he's lying, isn't he? i know, i'm not meant to say that. i meant to be the sort of left winger who says. of course

he's saying. he's saying what he believes. and it's true. i think it's obviously nonsense for many people, many labour voters, actually, because of the state of the nhs, will now pay a few hundred pounds to a private consultant to get a diagnosis to basically speed up the process. they can get back into the nhs after getting that diagnosis for whatever kind of health condition. and by the way, it's very emotive . when we talk about very emotive. when we talk about children, i think it could be his great grandmother. i think he'd probably still use private health care if he could. i think you'd be remiss, as a family member to not help somebody who's suffering. if you can help them. and that's not an endorsement, by the way, of private health care. it's just an acknowledgement of the situation we're in. so, no, i don't believe him. what this does do, however, is, i think, underscore the fact that lie—in comes to him incredibly easily. >> obviously, i've got to say he would dispute that he's lying. let me just i've got a clip of him actually responding to this. so let me just in fairness to him, let me just play this. >> i grew up with my mum suffering. she was extremely ill. she nearly died several times. and she was treated on every occasion by the nhs on an

urgent basis. i have 100% confidence in the nhs and that is why i wouldn't use anything other than the nhs. when you dpp, you did you have it then private health care? >> no, i didn't, you can have 100% confidence in the nhs as much as you like, but the reality is that waiting lists are huge at the moment, and that's not going to change, don says. >> can i just say i believe keir starmer 100. >> can i just say i believe keir starmer100. his wife works for the nhs and so he knows firsthand what a good job they do. he's not like rishi sunak, who's got more money than god. what's that got to do with the price of fish, it's extraordinary how many people in the nhs, i think are an awful lot of doctors. >> you'll find now who work for the nhs, use private health care because they know what's going on. i also make one other point about left wing people and state health care in the soviet union. the politburo, the chiefs of the communist organisation, had their own private hospitals surrounded by a 15 foot wall with its own park and gardens

and doctors brought in from abroad to treat them, and special access to drugs which other people didn't get. there's nothing actually particularly left, left, left wing about, about not having special treatment when you're in power. i think this is you're all such bilge, actually, but also it's just it, isn't it? what is the principle involved? the nhs does what it can, but almost nobody can now get nhs dental care and it has completely collapsed with social care of the of the very old. so almost nobody can get that either. so no one can stand up and say i will always use the nhs, it's in my dna because they can't. it simply isn't available when you want it. >> and if you do say that, you might have it on your gravestone. so be careful what you wish for because surely i repeat myself. but surely if any loved one, was needing something. and this is a point, susan, you're saying why are you all being anti keir starmer for the nhs is one of the best things about britain and our likely next prime minister would always use it if possible. quite

right. but this is the point of course he would use it if possible and it was available. but the question was essentially if it wasn't there and you needed care and you couldn't get it, what would you do then? so i'll ask all of you at home, make it fair. if your loved one needed care and they couldn't get it on the nhs, would you or would you not do everything possible to pay for care, to try and save their life if necessary? i don't know, get in touch and tell me your thoughts. look ed davey, he is coming up with different ideas today. mental health was on the radar. let's take a look. >> the evidence shows that certain times of your life, people get under mental health stress. sometimes when they become a parent for the first time when they retire, and other stages. and if we could provide special mott for their mental health at those moments, i would also look at children and young people actually as a priority. then you can really turn things around . around. >> is that how we really turn things around? mott mental health. well, i really object to the way in which normal doses of unhappiness, discomfort, failure

and all the things which we go through at various times of life are being medicalized and referred to as mental health episodes. >> sometimes you are unhappy, sometimes you're you're sunk in grief, sometimes you're worn out and tired. sometimes you feel that that your time at work is particularly unpleasant. that doesn't mean you're mentally ill. it just means that you're going through the normal experiences of humanity over thousands of years, and the classification of it as mental illness. it seems to me to bring it into the area where people then start making you take drugs to make you feel better, and there's an awful lot of that in our health system at the moment, but i'm sure and i think it's i'm very much against it. these, these, these drugs are not the answer to the problems which people have . and the people have. and the classification of unhappiness as mental health is a mistake. >> and i'm sure as well, i've got to say that i'm sure suicide is one of the biggest killers of men under the age of 50. i'm

sure it is the biggest, i think. is it the biggest? yeah. i mean, so there's well, it would be, wouldn't it? >> because people don't die young. >> well, certainly. but still it's very striking. >> that's why that's not a significant statistic as you, as you think it is. but also there's, there's quite a lot of suggestion that, that, that suicides may be influenced by the drugs that people have been taking before they commit suicide. our ambassador renee. >> so i don't think it's a bad idea. and the small print is really interesting. so new parents, children and young people, men in their 40s, carers and retirees. so i quite like the idea of that certain periods in your life, the nhs will check in, for instance, when you're a new parent, check in on your mental health or when you've lost somebody. i think that's really smart. and if you have a well funded health care system, it's exactly the sort of thing you want to see. i think this idea of a mental health mot is just a gimmick where it's kind of worded. it's going to cost £70 million in terms of the nhs, not a huge amount of money, but who's going to fund it? tax evasion, the magic tax evasion tree. i don't believe in the money tree, the magic money

tree. but there is definitely a magic tax evasion tree. if you want to argue for improved services in the nhs or indeed any public service, you're going to have to be serious about how it's funded . and yes, we can it's funded. and yes, we can clamp down on tax evasion. yes, it would probably get a fair whack of money, but i, i am hesitant with this kind of stuff where actually tax evasion can do everything . we don't need to do everything. we don't need to change anything. we don't need to increase any taxes. i don't really like that kind of politics. >> what do you think about the labour policy? i mean, obviously i've not seen a manifesto, so i don't know if it's still a thing or will be in the money in their next manifesto. but about mental health, professionals in every school. is that a good idea? i'm not opposed to it. >> i think mental health is costing this country so much money at the moment. people will hear numbers and proposals and they say, we can't afford that. i think in some instances, actually we can't not afford it. if you're looking at lost days to work now, ill health is rocketing and it's particularly mental ill health and it's particularly amongst younger workers. >> now, i think there might be a few people swinging the lead.

they're telling their boss that they've got mental health challenges because there's absolutely no way of proving it whatsoever. >> well, that's your read on it. but what i would say, it's not my read. >> i didn't say that's the case or not. i'm just asking you. well, that's one read. >> okay. my apologies michelle. that's one reading mental health very seriously. >> no i know you before because people will get in touch and go, michelle, tell michelle i've had my own mental health challenges and i wouldn't wish them on anyone. so i'm not flippant about mental health when it's actual proper mental health issues. >> my apologies. that's one read on it and many people have that read on it. what i would say is, well, right now, because there's such poor mental health provision with the nhs, it's so inconsistent. we don't know. i think if you've got top quality care available to people, then if it is an excuse and i actually think a lot of the time it isn't an excuse, that's not really going to work. so i think we lose a hell of a lot of value, productivity, good people to mental ill health. and i think we should be spending more money on it. and i think we've got a bit of a false economy where we say we can't afford to spend money on it. >> let me ask you this. and i

almost don't even want to ask it, because i know that people will start getting in touch. they know michelle's really heartless. i care about people's mental health. i've had my own and i've spoken publicly about that. so i'm not undermining it. do you think we're resilient enough as a nation? piece of lie—ins? >> no we're not. i think that we've we've become far too inclined, as i say, to medicalize things which are, which are normal to, to, to show too much of our emotions and to be less stoic . and i think we be less stoic. and i think we should be more stoic. i think we were a better country when we were a better country when we were more. and i'm everyone says, oh, stiff upper lip, what was wrong with it when we just took it? we, as we are today and tomorrow, is celebrating the d—day invasion . the kind of d—day invasion. the kind of people who went on those landing crafts and ran into actual gunfire on those beaches were stoical people of the kind we don't really bring up anymore . don't really bring up anymore. they were the same people as us physically, but they they grew up in a different culture. and i think in many ways it was a better culture than . better culture than. >> but those people struggled

deeply. and i would argue that, i mean, we have many veterans getting in touch with this program. actually, we covered this last night, didn't we, about a young veteran that had died through ptsd. and a lot of people got in touch and said, so whilst we might have had a stiff upper lip mentality, so people might not have talked about it, didn't mean say that they weren't suffering massively. but what do you think about resilience? >> that's true. and also look, alcoholism, domestic violence, you know, today that would be pathologized. and i think it's good that we pathologize it. there's some there's some truth to what peter is saying. but i think, oh, thank you, i think, i think, oh, thank you, i think, i think , i think it's good to think, i think it's good to probably over pathologize these things and under pathologize them. what i would say is that actually with mental ill health today, as with physical ill health, a lot of it isn't because of the hardships we're enduring, but because of our lifestyle. so, for instance, sitting at a desk for eight hours a day, not seeing the sun, not walking under a tree, not eating, eating fresh food, these are the kinds of things which can make people miserable. what are you talking about? >> who sits at a desk for eight hours a day, not even seeing a

single glimmer of sun and not eating any food? >> that's that's that's that's winter in england. >> they probably eat food, but the other things are more and they don't. >> what i would say is they don't get much exercise because the way in which we live is dnven the way in which we live is driven normal exercise out of people's lives. >> and in many cases, fresh air. and it's true. but if you say actually walking a lot and being out in the fresh air is good for you people again, laugh it off as if you're some kind of some kind of freak. the truth is, is that the whole mental health apparatus in this country, and indeed the western world is based on subjective assessments, not objective. and yet it gets the same treatment and it's given is given the same reverence as physical medicine, which is based on objective diagnosis . i which is based on objective diagnosis. i think it's time we stopped equating the two and gave a much, much harder inquisition to the mental health people. >> you two will have strong opinions. you too. i was talking about you to andy and karen. i want you to read yours out. andy. karen you said we're very disappointed you're not discussing the welsh first minister. we did at the start of the programme, grant you that it

was a short debate and if you watch it back, you'll see why. but we did cover that at 6:00. i give you my word. after the break. i want to talk a couple. i want to talk about a couple of things. i want to talk prisons and what we do about the problems there. but i also want to ask, why are over 50% of britain's young people saying that they don't believe that israel has a right to see you in two.

hello there. michelle dewberry 7:00 aaron bastani, co—founder of novara media and peter hitchens , columnist for the mail hitchens, columnist for the mail on sunday. alongside me, two things a i'm still searching for the person to describe one of these two as a cuddly teddy beani these two as a cuddly teddy bear. i want to know who you're talking about, and b, there was something else, but i actually now can't remember what it was, so i will just move on because a majority of britain's young people get this. 54% of people have said that they do not believe that israel should be able to exist as a state. this is to according a website called

unherd and a poll that they have done. unherd and a poll that they have done . what do you think to this? done. what do you think to this? aaron bastani i think any polling question, which is just seven words is problematic. >> i think if you had, should the state of israel, give way to a two state solution, or should there be a unified single state encompassing both palestinians and israeli jews, then that would be more interesting . i would be more interesting. i think sometimes polling, particularly with leading questions like this, can actually make a question more ambiguous rather than clarify things. i suspect many people saying , saying that it shouldn't saying, saying that it shouldn't exist amongst that 54% simply support a two state solution. i don't know that. of course, that's just my suspicion, apparently this poll as well. it also asks young brits about their interest in different wars around the world. i found that young brits are more interested in the war in gaza than, for example, they are in what's happening in ukraine. for example, peter hitchens , your thoughts? >> well, first of all, on the israel thing, i think it is the inevitable result of the refusal of israel's government to

understand that it depends the country's future existence depends on how people in the western nations think about israel. and the conduct of the war. in the past few months has has infuriated and distressed huge numbers of people who were probably previously indifferent on the subject or may even have beenin on the subject or may even have been in favour of israel. i think they've done immense damage to themselves and i can't believe that they are. they are so foolish as to have done it. i'm not at all surprised. i think that there is a very grim future for israel. unless unless it finds some way of undoing the damage that it's done over the past few months . it cannot past few months. it cannot survive endlessly unless it has the support of major western countries. and it's also losing that support in the united states, where it's completely indispensable , aaron talks about indispensable, aaron talks about the two state solution as far as i can see, a two state solution would mean the end of israel, because it wouldn't israel would not survive a two state solution. it's an unworkable plan which people fall back on

to try and avoid discussing. what else they might do. but it's not really the issue. the thing is, there are all kinds of things which people used to understand. they used to understand. they used to understand the reason why israel existed in the first place, namely the unique massacre of jews by hitler to which there is no parallel in human history. and the other thing was that they understood that israel, if it didn't, if it wasn't strongly defended, would be destroyed by its neighbours. but these, these, these things have gone. and as a result, we have growing indifference or hostility to israel in western public opinion , it's very bad news. >> and social media are obviously plays a huge part in this. you've got that big campaign. we've discussed this before, the all eyes on rafah. i mean, that has become i mean, i, i want to say it's become the latest thing and that makes it sound really disrespectful. and it's not, you know, i don't intend it in that way because what is going on, the imagery coming out of gaza is just beyond anything. it's horrendous. you cannot fail to be moved by that. but what i

meant by my comment is, i bet a lot of people are putting that as their profile, and when you ask them questions about it, they probably wouldn't know much of the detail behind it. >> well, they'd want hardly anybody knows the details. >> they'd want the killing to stop. and the point is, it's not stopping . it's not stopped for stopping. it's not stopped for months. and i think what peter said there is very astute. you cannot have members of the idf destroying homes, putting on women's underwear , murdering women's underwear, murdering children and vast reams of this being uploaded to tiktok and to instagram and to telegram and expect there to be no political overhead. clearly, there's going to be a massive political overhead. and the point you were saying about israel depends on western support that's now been forgotten by many israeli politicians , particularly on the politicians, particularly on the right. they think they can do this without the support of the us and the support of the european union. and i suspect they're going to find out that's not the case in a very, very hard way. >> yeah. and social media, of course, many people often don't really know what to believe because like you said, the images are so heart wrenching. anyone i mean, unless you're made of stone, you're going to be moved by what you're seeing.

but some people, the images of the images of the hamas attack in october were heart rending as well. >> indeed. and if israel had left it at that and not and not retaliated, then i think the world might have a wholly different . different. >> well, as i said, this poll comes out on the website on the head.i comes out on the website on the head. i think it's released tomorrow. in a separate question, these people were also asked, who do they think is more to blame for the war in gaza? half of the people blamed the israeli government. a quarter said hamas , and apparently only said hamas, and apparently only 19% responded all equally. there you go. what do you think to that? get in touch and let me know after the break, my favourite topic law and order. what do we do about the absolute mess that is prisons in this country? david blunkett says we need, like nightingale courts to get rid of the backlog and we need a network of mini prisons. is the answer? see you in

hello, everybody. i'm michelle dewberry back with you till 7:00

tonight alongside me. aaron bastani and peter hitchens remain. let's just crack straight on with one of my favourite topics of all time law and order. and what on earth do you do with criminals? i always say it's a good job. i'm not prime minister you don't want to know what i would do with them. but anyway, the former home secretary, lord blunkett, he has got involved. we know that the prison system is a mess. we know that in some cases now, our own we're having to release people early, he's suggesting two things. one, nice and gale. courts essentially pop up courts to deal with the backlog. and two, a network of so—called like mini prisons. two, a network of so—called like mini prisons . what do you think? mini prisons. what do you think? >> well, in terms of the courts, i mean , the first thing i would i mean, the first thing i would say is you just need to reverse austerity that came after 2010. so cuts to legal aid cuts, the cps, that all needs to be reversed. and when people talk about pop up anything, i start to sort of break out in a rash. it tends to mean you're not really serious about a problem and solving it in the long term, because of course, pop up means short term temporary get rid of the backlog. >> yeah. the backlog under control. >> yeah yeah. but again again it's a gimmick. i think you

could just say look, the government after 2010 made a serious error by cutting legal aid, by cutting funding to the court system, as they did. we're going to reverse all of it. that, to me, would be more sensible in terms of prisons. i mean, one way of reducing the prison population and creating some space. and i know peter won't like this one little bit. is decriminalising cannabis , is decriminalising cannabis, peter hitchens? >> well, on the contrary, if you do that, you'll have fuller prisons because there will be more violence and more very severe violence committed by people who've gone out of their minds on that unpleasant drug . minds on that unpleasant drug. but that's not really the point. you can't do anything about this quickly. the destruction of the british criminal justice system has been a long, slow business, and one of the key problems of it is , is that now people don't it is, is that now people don't go to prison until they've already become habitual criminals. the idea of prison is that you encounter it on a second offence very early in a criminal career, and that is it is a shock enough to persuade you that you don't want to go back there. what happens now is that people commit many crimes before the police, even pay any attention to them. then there are the fines. they don't pay .

are the fines. they don't pay. then there are the suspended sentences which are not activated and the community service they don't do. and after several years of this, the system finally runs out of opfions system finally runs out of options and sends them to prison, by which time it's far too late. if you if you do a google search of local newspaper headunes google search of local newspaper headlines for the headline, the phrase in spare jail. each week you will find dozens and dozens of cases where people are spared jail by magistrates or judges for offences which 20 years ago would have seen them sent straight there. it's not new that we're we're keeping people out of prison . the sentences, out of prison. the sentences, which are pronounced by judges are invariably dishonest, almost invariably dishonest. there are 1 or 2 which are not. they say that someone's going to prison for nine years. they're going to prison for four and a half. they say they're going for three. they're going for 18 months. the sentences are deliberate lies. they're automatically halved on passage. so all this is going on. you can't in in a in a few months of nightingale courts or p0p up months of nightingale courts or

pop up prisons do anything about it. where is david blunkett going to put these prisons? are you going to go down to your local recreation ground and find that someone has put a mini prison up there , and how long is prison up there, and how long is it going to be before it goes away? it may be, may be proclaimed to be temporary, but most temporary things in this country, especially the bad ones, tend to last for years, if not becoming permanent . it's not not becoming permanent. it's not serious. and i'm sorry, david blunkett, he's a likeable man and has much to be said for him. but i think this is actually no use at all, i've got, like i say, it's always a good, reason . say, it's always a good, reason. it's a good job that i'm not the prime minister of britain, because i would have a few suggestions as to how you would reduce the prison population, that's for sure. i would start with those people where it's absolutely beyond any doubt whatsoever . they've done things whatsoever. they've done things like tortured children. those two, those people. i can tell you they wouldn't be in prison, i'll leave you to guess what i would do with them . one of my would do with them. one of my viewers, he's got in touch is not happy, that peter hitchens wouldn't debate welsh first minister. he says we represent all of the uk, not england. so i'll give you the final closing words on vaughan gething. aaron

bastani. >> well, it is called gb news peter and i'm. >> i don't disagree twice. >> i don't disagree twice. >> braverman says at the end of the program, sparing the audience of gb news my completely worthless thoughts and something about which i just know nothing. >> i can't say anything interesting about it. so i shall . i shall hold my tongue. >> well, there you go . do you >> well, there you go. do you want to say anything about him before we go quickly? >> no, ijust before we go quickly? >> no, i just think. >> no, i just think. >> i think i tried really hard there, dear viewer, that's just tuned in. >> i will i will say something very quickly, which is that, he had a rather dodgy resume before taking a very important job, and i suspect that will be the case for a fair few labour mps who enter the house of commons after july the 4th, i tried really hard actually, to try and find a viewer that would do as keir starmer says , and absolutely starmer says, and absolutely refuse to use private health care. if nhs care wasn't available in a timely manner. i've not actually been able to find anyone who has told me that you would follow that principle, that literally out of principle , that literally out of principle, you would let a loved one die if

nhs care wasn't available to you. i'm laughing, but i am taking it very seriously . i taking it very seriously. i promise if you are out there and you do, inhabit that same island as keir starmer on that issue, get in touch with me. was absolutely fascinated by the mindset of that, lots of people obsessing by how little you smile, peter. so i'm going to make it one of my missions in future programmes to try and make the great peter hitchens smile a bit. i smile a lot now. >> i'm starting him off now. smile a lot, but only when only when only when called for. >> only when called for. there you go. me. no need to. >> russia, where i live, in russia where i live for two years, starting off. >> smile all the time. don't go anywhere. i finish starting , anywhere. i finish starting, i'll twang. his braces are up next. it's the farage show. as was. see you later . was. see you later. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on gb views. who's . views. who's. >> hello. welcome to your latest gb news weather update from the

met office. tomorrow's going to be another fairly cool day across the northwest, with a risk of some further heavy showers, and we could see some further heavy showers this evening with a north westerly wind pushing showers into similar areas. it's northwestern scotland where we're going to see the highest rainfall totals through the next 24 hours or so. we could see a mix of hail, possibly some hill snow in there as well. we could also see some showers as far south as southwestern england overnight tonight. many western areas seeing a bit more in the way of cloud tonight compared to last night . so it will be a bit of a night. so it will be a bit of a milder night for some of us, but i think still where skies stay the clearest, there's a risk of a rural grass frost. so potentially another chilly start for some areas, particularly across eastern scotland, where it will be a bright start to the day. plenty of early sunshine, but notice we've got some bright colours on those showers showing the heaviness of them through tomorrow morning. we could see some spray on the roads because of that. across western areas of scotland in towards northwest england, as well as parts of wales, the midlands as well

potentially seeing some fairly heavy showers. but most of us getting away with a dry and bright start despite the chillier feel to things at the moment. so another fairly cool day to come tomorrow, especially for the time of year. and if you are further north and west, where it will be another showery day, there's another risk of thunderstorms, potentially some hail as well in those showers, especially as we head into thursday evening here. elsewhere across wales, central areas of england and across the south coast in particular, they still feel fairly pleasant in the sunshine . feel fairly pleasant in the sunshine. highs of feel fairly pleasant in the sunshine . highs of 18, possibly sunshine. highs of 18, possibly 19 degrees, so that's too not bad for the time of year. now into friday we start to see a band of more persistent rain push across the uk, so that will bnng push across the uk, so that will bring a greater risk of some showery outbreaks of rain. a bit more widely across the uk. so a bit more in the way of cloud and it will still be another fairly cool day. but looking ahead to the weekend, does it like there's been more in the way of sunshine, more widely across the country, and temperatures returning to the low 20s? >> for some of us, looks like things are heating up. boxt

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gb news. >> good evening and welcome to vote 2024. the people decide with me. camilla tominey coming up on tonight's show. we're going to be reflecting, of course, on the tv debate between sunak and starmer. particular those comments on private health care and the tax row. we'll also be crossing over to ellie costello in normandy to give us the latest on the d—day commemorations , which today commemorations, which today featured a very heartfelt speech by the king, and we'll be reflecting on that. no confidence vote in welsh first minister vaughan gething . but minister vaughan gething. but first, here's the news with polly middlehurst