what he calls violent crackdown what he calls violent protests, with a new policing unit and a gb news presenter. martin daubney was handcuffed while reporting on the event in whitehall last night. we'll speak to them next. the bbc is facing more questions after it was revealed they had paid their presenter, their former presenter, their former presenter huw edwards, £200,000 in licence fee money following his arrest for possessing indecent images of children. plus we will be dissecting my interview with the former tory leadership hopeful suella braverman. all this to come, but first the news with polly middlehurst . middlehurst. >> well, the prime minister today told police chiefs that officers should tackle rioters using the same powers used to ban football hooligans. he's announced a new violent disorder unit in the wake of the southport stabbings and the disturbances that followed across some parts of the uk,

including one outside downing street. last night, sir keir starmer insisted he'll put a stop to the thugs . stop to the thugs. >> the community of southport had to suffer twice. a gang of thugs got on trains and buses, went to a community that is not their own, a community grieving their own, a community grieving the most horrific tragedy . the most horrific tragedy. >> well, in relation to that tragedy in southport, a 17 year old male charged with three counts of murder and ten with attempted murder in southport has been named as axel rudi cabana. three children, seven year old elsie dot stancombe ali agha, who was nine, and six year old b.b. agha, who was nine, and six year old bb. king, were all killed dunng old bb. king, were all killed during an attack at a children's houday during an attack at a children's holiday club. two other girls injured have now left hospital well. the suspect appeared in court this morning and was named after a judge lifted reporting restrictions . he's now been restrictions. he's now been remanded in youth detention, custody . in other news today, custody. in other news today, the bbc says it's considering

legal action to claim back some of its payments to the former newsreader huw edwards . the newsreader huw edwards. the director general, tim davies, says the organisation is looking at all options after the 62 year old pleaded guilty to three counts of making indecent images of children yesterday. huw edwards was the bbc's highest paid newsreader before he resigned in april, earning more than £475,000 in the last year to the united states. now, where donald trump has sparked some questions after he questioned the racial heritage of kamala harris . the racial heritage of kamala harris. speaking to a panel of black journalists, the former president claimed miss harris had changed from identifying as indian american to being black. his suggestion that the vice president was using her for race political advantage drew gasps from the audience in chicago. >> i don't think i've ever been asked a question. so in such a horrible manner, a first question you don't even say hello, how are you.7 do

question you don't even say hello, how are you? do you believe that vice president kamala harris is only on the ticket because she is a black woman? well, i didn't know she was black until a number of years ago when she happened to turn black. and now she wants to be known as black. so i don't know, is she indian or is she black? >> she is always identified as a black woman. >> i respect either one college. i respect either one. but she obviously doesn't . obviously doesn't. >> well, responding to that conversation, kamala harris herself, who's the daughter of a jamaican father and an indian mother, gave this reaction . mother, gave this reaction. >> donald trump spoke at the annual meeting of the national association of black journalists , association of black journalists, and it was the same old show. the divisiveness and the disrespect . disrespect. >> kamala harris, ending that report . well, those are the report. well, those are the latest gb news headlines for now. i'm polly middlehurst. i'm back in an hour. see you then for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning

the qr code, or go to gb news. >> .com. forward slash alerts . >> .com. forward slash alerts. >> .com. forward slash alerts. >> good evening i'm christopher hope. gb news political editor filling in for nigel farage who can't be with us just now. he's stuck in clacton but have no fear, he's on his way to us. so do stay tuned. we'll get his response to keir starmer being asked about him in the press conference in 10 downing street earlier. now earlier, the pm addressed the nation after days of protests escalated across the country following the southport knife attack. let's take a listen. >> i can announce today that following this meeting, we will establish a national capability across police forces to tackle violent disorder. these thugs and mobile, they move from to community community and we must have a policing response that can do the same . can do the same. >> now, the prime minister has

agreed that a new police unit aimed at targeting violent disorder will improve the gathering and sharing of intelligence across the uk on known extremist troublemakers. yesterday's nationwide disorder , yesterday's nationwide disorder, sparked by the killing of three young girls by a 17 year old who now can be named as axel banana, well , nigel now can be named as axel banana, well, nigel has been criticised for his comments about the southend incident, posing a question have we been told the entire truth? the pm was asked in the press conference whether nigel remarks were responsible for any of the violence we've seen this week in relation to the comments of others. >> look, i'm not going to stand here and cast judgement on what others are saying. i'm no what i'm saying and i know why i'm saying it very, very clearly, which is my focus, whenever i'm confronted with any questions about this is on the families. >> nigel farage is the leader of reform. he did very well, obviously, in the election, and he's been accused of spreading conspiracy theories about the

southport tragedy in his response to it. is it enough to say that you just won't comment on what he's said, given that some people, including a former police chief, have linked his comments to the violence that broke out in the riots? >> well, look, i'm, you know , >> well, look, i'm, you know, i'm not going to run a sort of running commentary on the motives of other people. >> what i am saying is my focus is on the families, the victims who are at the heart of this. and i think that that should be the focus for everybody, and anybody who says or does anything that impedes their ability to get the justice that they deserve cannot claim to be acting in their best interests because they're not. >> now, last night saw some of the violence spill out on the streets in london, when a march titled enough is enough resulted in more than 100 people being arrested and one of those who was nearly arrested but suddenly was nearly arrested but suddenly was handcuffed was gb news own presenter , martin daubney presenter, martin daubney martin. you've said on from your

afternoon show, thank you for that here with, with gb news, you were had your handcuffed, one arm was handcuffed by the police. why was that ? police. why was that? >> well, why don't we have a look at the clip first and have a little look and see what you can make of it. have a look in gb news. >> i'm doing my job on the back. conditions have been put in place every day. three till 6 pm. you can't seriously know what just happened. >> i'm a journalist. the gb news recording put it . recording put it. >> de—man. what happened now? i'm martin daubney. >> you say you're saying i'm martin daubney. i heard there now the footage wasn't great. from that clip, it was martin's, phone recording. while he was nearly arrested, but that shows a moment when you were cuffed by a moment when you were cuffed by a policeman as you tried to reason with them, didn't you, martin? >> yeah. so just so everyone's clear. so when i walk out of the studio here in westminster, basically these protests happen

all the time. and i always wander into it because they're on my way home, back to the tube. so i've been to pro—palestine protests. i've been to pro—israel protests. i've been to remain marchers. i've been to remain marchers. i've been to brexit marches. last night i went to this march. now as you can see there, i've just been filming, there were bottles being thrown, smashing around my feet. there were lots of coppers in full riot gear. and by the way, you don't see anything approaching, anything like that. when the pro—palestine march. they have a very different policing approach in terms of what they're wearing. >> you mean the police in terms of what they're approaching, in terms of how they form up? >> they're in lines. it's organised. it's much more hostile. they're carrying batons. they've got, they've got they've got the shields. so it creates a very different environment. i was there, bottles were nothing happened before that to mean that the police had to be all, all tooled up for a bit of a fight. no, i think it's the expectation of what may come. and i think actually, that's the chilling thing about keir starmer's speech today. if they decide a speech today. if they decide a speech or a gathering is of great significance and the

policing response is appropriate . policing response is appropriate. so i was filming at this point, people being arrested literally right next to me on the floor. i was filming it for the channel and i just felt a pair of it's right about this moment. i felt some handcuffs put on my right arm, my back, my arm was around my back and i just was. i was very calm, as you can see in the footage, i said, what are you doing? i work @gbnews. i'm a journalist. i'm just doing my job. they said, have you got a press pass now? i haven't got a press pass now? i haven't got a press pass. probably my bad. but luckily, mercifully, one of the officers there recognised me. as i say, i go there quite a few times. no, no, he's okay. so they release me. >> but this and this kind of policing is what our viewers and listeners describe a double standard policing. they see this happening in central london and elsewhere, but they don't see the same treatment of other, other issues around the country. is that part of the problem? >> it is. i mean, i was at the cenotaph, on armistice day and the batons were swinging in there. i stopped a guy getting severely hurt again. i filmed

that i was covered in blood. i pulled him back. in fact, his daughter thanked me for him not getting a proper pasting. that day, there is a very, very different attitude to policing what they would term and sir keir starmer would term far right protests. but i was in there talking to these people and they all say the same thing to me. nobody is listening to us, nobody understands our frustrations. three girls i was saying, they were saying, you know, how many girls, how many more people must die before we're listened to and they believe the police response is disproportionate . it's harsh and disproportionate. it's harsh and they don't feel they're equal before the law . before the law. >> martin daubney. thank you. with me in the studio now is the former chancellor of the exchequer and tory and former tory mp kwasi kwarteng, and a former labour adviser, stella taoiseach , kwasi kwarteng. do taoiseach, kwasi kwarteng. do you think there's double standards of policing in london and across the country, and is that a problem? i think it is a problem and i think people who are who are dubbed the far right, and that's a contentious thing in itself, rightly,

thing in itself, feel rightly, in my view , that they're being, in my view, that they're being, pushed upon, focused upon , pushed upon, focused upon, victimised in a way that other communities, haven't been, a lot of the policing where we saw with the pro—hamas marches , the with the pro—hamas marches, the pro—palestine marches. >> and they're absolutely right. it is their right to march in that way. but a lot of the policing there was seen to be much more light touch than some of the scenes we've seen just in the last 48 hours. >> and certainly in that press conference earlier, sir keir starmer didn't talk about maybe why people are protesting. of course, the violence was horrific, throwing bricks at mosques or police or bins or appalling and a can agree on that. but there's no attempt. was there by the prime minister to understand why people are upset? is that a mistake by him? >> absolutely not. he has been talking about youth violence throughout and about having knife crime. i want to go back to what you said about double standards in policing. there is a photo that it's etched in my

mind from during the pandemic. after sarah everard's murder in south london. there was a peaceful vigil by women feminists. and there was this photo of this young woman who was handcuffed and put on the floor, by the police officers. yes. and that was a peaceful protest. so when you're talking about double standards, i'm wondering where do are you suggesting. >> but no one doubts that i agree with that. >> i remember at the time i was an mp and people were complaining about that. they were saying that they were being victimised wrongly because they were peaceful. so what are you suggesting that the police is more pro—muslim than they are, >> pro feminism and pro, nationalism or however else you would like to. >> i'm not imputing any motive. i'm just saying there is a mismatch between, as you point out , the peaceful protests when out, the peaceful protests when sarah everard was killed by a

policeman and the protests last yesterday, southport peaceful to you and no, i'm just saying that there was there's definitely a double standard and you were admitting that you're saying that the, the sarah everard protests were harshly policed? >> yes. i agree with that. >> yes. i agree with that. >> the suggestion seems to be that the police is more like touch when the protest is more left coded. and i have to say left, right issue. >> it's not a left right issue. >> it's not a left right issue. >> it's not a left right issue. >> i have an anecdote from yesterday, martin, since we talked about your anecdote, a friend of mine, a black guy, black young, young man, he was walking through the protest yesterday and he was verbally abused by some people because he said something about tony robinson. he wasn't being violent , he wasn't being violent, he wasn't being anything like that. he was just walking past, said something about, tony robinson, and he was called a black beep. i'm not going to say the word. so. and the police intervened immediately to separate that they were right to do that, and they were right to do that, and they were right to do that. but

when you're saying that there is nothing untoward there, people are looking at the videos of people getting drunk. >> those were all across the board in the police. >> i was at the armistice day protest and pro—palestine protesters walked in in masks and they were chased down the street. rightly so. why go to those protests specifically to cause i agree with you, they shouldn't go. >> i agree with you. >> i agree with you. >> i'm not on the side. why go? there should be an equal. there should be equal saying, martin, can i say kwasi is the problem here that you have differently resourced police, police forces? >> so in other parts of the country, manchester, maybe hartlepool , south end, you have hartlepool, south end, you have police less ready to deal with these problems. and so that's why you might just argue the police's case. you may have different levels of policing. >> i think that's a fair point. but i think the suspicion here is that both the pro pro—hamas protests in london, and there were also the scenes that we saw the cenotaph yesterday, and there is a view that they're slightly differently policed, and i can see why people say

that. and i think it's wrong, but they were entirely different. >> orders of magnitude. right. because the, the pro palestine protests where we are talking about mass numbers of people and about mass numbers of people and a much more diverse crowd, but they were placed differently. >> and the thing about policing with riot sticks, with riot shields, with mass formations, it creates a tension that engenders arrests. but the policing wasn't that keen on these protests. >> you don't see anything like that on a pro—palestine march. >> it's soft touch, it's soft soaping, and they don't nick people like they do on martin. >> wasn't that the response to the fact that the protests we saw in in southport turned violent straight away? people arrived there with cans of cider and beer. they got drunk, they attacked the police, they put illegal to have a can of beer on a protest. okay, martin, but you see, it's a very different nature of an event. >> kwasi do you think kwasi kwarteng do you think the pm might regret not trying to

tackle the cause of this and just going after the symptom? >> say, look, it was a bizarre i know keir starmer, i have respect for him, but he's a north london lawyer. let's let's cut to the chase. and so what does that mean. well that means that he is part of a metropolitan elite , that it metropolitan elite, that it hasn't been in touch over the last few years with people in, you know, in outside london. and i think i'm part of it. i mean, i think i'm part of it. i mean, i don't i don't disavow that. i'm just saying that, you know, if i as a constituency mp and as someone who backed brexit, i was very aware of this, this chasm between north london, london and now you believe in identity politics? >> no. >> no. >> and just and people who were backing brexit, who lived a life outside of london and wanted to get on with their lives. and the fact that this tragedy, it's completely unprecedented. i mean, the only parallel i can think of was dunblane. i'm old enough to remember a shooting when many more children died and many more people were killed. children died, children. and this is the only time i can remember there may be other

cases. children dying in quite a large number. and i think it's a very serious issue, particularly when it was regarding its mark. >> is kwasi right? i mean, when you use the words far right and chuckit you use the words far right and chuck it around at people who are just concerned about things, yes, there are far right involved. no question. but is that a fair thing to describe? all people concerned about double standard policing? >> what do you call a. i'm not saying that anyone who is firstly, there is a difference between someone being concerned about the knife violence and all of that, and someone who is going and throwing beer cans and the police . there is the police. there is a difference. sorry. say the question again. oh yes. far right. sorry. yes. >> the far right . there's no labels. >> how do you describe if they're not far ? right. how do they're not far? right. how do you describe, someone who is trying to portray a, the every muslim basically being muslim and being an immigrant? >> it's not about these protests. how do you describe the misinformation , the the misinformation, the misinformation, the people who

were saying that this murderer, who, it turns out was a british born christian, was a muslim who had a muslim immigrant who arrived on a boat. >> what kind of agenda is people who are peddling that misinformation , trying to force misinformation, trying to force the key difference is quite simple. >> and that is the minority of meat heads on a far right march determines everybody who was there and what you did. >> martin, with the participation path today dictates that you're as bad as the worst. you never get that . the worst. you never get that. you never. so you're right. you're absolutely right. what you wanted with the palestine project. >> millions of people. you wanted to say that they are all pro—hamas. >> you're 100% right. no, no. >> you're 100% right. no, no. >> my precise point is, the right wing trope means that everybody in that crowd, everybody in that crowd, everybody in that town, is as bad as the worst people. that's never applied to a hamas march, a pro—palestine march, or harehills. >> the other week. martin, the community leaders were demanding people turned out and protested outside police station like

disgusting things. >> they weren't held to account. they weren't arrested. they weren't clamped down. let's listen to the community. >> you're absolutely right, martin kwarteng. >> if you have one islamist who denounces the west and wants to blow up buckingham palace or whatever it is in one of these marches, keir starmer and others will be the first to say not everyone is like that. not all the people on the protest are like these. >> and he should have said that today, should he, in downing street. >> but it's exactly analogous. it's exactly the same thing. you can't just say that everybody who's concerned about children but keir starmer, age nine, everyone is going to be is part of some far right conspiracy. >> i'm really sorry, but this is not what keir starmer said. it is exactly the same thing as rishi sunak saying we're going to tackle anti—semitism. he wasn't saying we're going to put everyone who goes on a pro—palestine protest in prison, we're going to throw them. >> isn't isn't a missed opportunity here. he could have addressed the people concerned about the deaths. he could have. >> you could say the same about rishi sunak. >> he could have spoken. >> he could have spoken. >> i'm not talking about rishi sunak. >> he's the prime minister. >> he's the prime minister. >> he's the prime minister. >> he could have spoken to

people who are concerned and he didn't. >> he tar them all with the same brush and that is a problem. >> no rishi sunak did rishi sunak rishi sunak the reason why i'm bringing him up? >> kwasi i'm not doing it. >> kwasi i'm not doing it. >> i'm not. i'm not bringing a i'm not bringing an up to avoid the issue. the reason why i'm bringing it up is because people who will be watching this will be seeing a completely different way of dealing with this protest from the way that we dealt with the pro—palestine protest. so the pro—palestine protest. so the problem with freedom of expression, martin, is that it has to appeal to everyone and what the right wingers are realising, right now is that they have spent the last few months demonising muslim people, demonising muslim people, concerned about the deaths of muslims. >> same thing when you're saying all the right wingers do the worst thing, you're not talking about the issue, you're not addressing the issue. >> the issue is three young girls were killed and robbed of their lives by a knife crime. it's not about the right. >> so let's address the issue. >> so let's address the issue. >> oh, forgive me or the muslims or anything like that. we've got to focus on it. and in the prime minister's statement, he did say something about the victims, to be fair, but he spent the lion's

share of his statement talking about the demonstrators and not actually getting to the issue and why these girls were killed this week. >> he has also been saying he has also been talking about labour's knife knife crime, and how one of the five missions of the labour party is to have serious knife crime and how exactly he's going to do that. he has been talking about all of the policies that you're going to be implementing. it'sjust to be implementing. it's just that we're focusing on this just knife crime. >> this isn't just knife crime. i mean, i've got, you know, 30, 40 years of memory on this. this isn't just a normal knife crime that you see, appalling tragedies, though. they are. this is a very unusual case where three innocent, very young girls were killed in a senseless way. it's not something that is, you can say is equivalent for the police to tell us what happened. i think we should have calm, but we should also look at the causes of what happened. okay? this isn't an ordinary thing. that's just occurred. >> stella, kwasi and martin, particularly martin, thank you for joining us today on farage. up for joining us today on farage. up next, we're speaking to a former bbc, producer about how he about the bbc dealt with the huw edwards

we' re

soon. now welcome back . i'm now welcome back. i'm christopher hope in for nigel farage who's on his way to the studio. will hopefully be joining us soon. now yesterday saw the shocking story of bbc newsreader huw edwards plead guilty to accessing indecent images of children. the corporation has come under fire for not pay, only paying a presenter but also increasing his wage and some of that money, £200,000 of it was paid after he was arrested, but before he was charged of course he left the bbc by then. there are so many questions about how much the broadcaster knew and why he wasn't sacked earlier. well, moments ago, the director general of the bbc, tim davie, defended that decision to not sack him. >> when someone is arrested, there's no charges. also, another factor at this point was

very significant duty of care considerations. i think it was right for to us say, look, we'll let the police do their business. and then when charges happen, we will act . happen, we will act. >> joining me now is david keighley, a former bbc producer. david, have the bbc cock this one up or were they in quite a difficult position? they had an individual here who has been arrested but not charged. could they have suspended pay to him , they have suspended pay to him, >> obviously the bbc, as a responsible corporation has to follow due process and due process these days is increasingly complicated and echr, human resources, rules as it were. but the bbc has got long form on this. in the sense that they are their own judge

and jury in terms of deciding what the right course of action is. there's no independent input into how the bbc is supervised, and there is a the result is that there's been a series of the i've been monitoring the bbc professionally for over 25 years now, and there's a long history of them , not being transparent of them, not being transparent enoughin of them, not being transparent enough in these issues. >> there is a board there. there's a board of, of governors. i mean , there's there governors. i mean, there's there is a degree of oversight, isn't there, of tim davie. >> yes, that's that's the way it works. but there's no independent input of those. once those people are appointed, they are part of the bbc structure and most public bodies in the uk when there are complaints about how an organisation behaves, have a system for a public body, an independent body, to be involved in some way. and the bbc's response in these occasions and it happened with

savile, very sadly, it's happened when nigel farage was arrested, were not accused by the bbc of causing the race hate death of a man in in harlow after the referendum. as a couple of examples , it happened couple of examples, it happened with martin bashir and the princess of wales interview. what happens is they go into protection overdrive. they've got over 250 publicity officers to david, the met police. >> they say they informed the bbc's governance department on the 8th of november. now common law police disclosure means there's a mechanism through which an employer is told about an employee who may have committed or not an offence, and it's then the information is given to them in strict confidence to allow the employer to decide what rich risk mitigation measures to take. now, huw edwards was suspended at the time, but they had a choice, the bbc, didn't they? they could have maybe moved to

say, well, we'll stop paying you now until there's a charging decision that wasn't taken, was it by the employer? >> it wasn't. and that that again why why was that? the case? the bbc say simply and glibly in their statement that they introduced before that tim davie interview, that, they hadnt davie interview, that, they hadn't been told he had definitely been charged, of any offence. and there, there he was arrested. >> he was arrested but not charged then, wasn't he, david? arrested but not charged. yes. >> yes. so that's their criteria. but what's emerging in this case. and we have to be careful for legal reasons, is that it seems that this his behaviour was widely known within the bbc. people like nicky campbell, a very respected reporter, have said who himself was a victim of child abuse of the sort that huw edwards has admitted to . and child admitted to. and child pornography is a misnomer. it is. it is child abuse. when

you're talking about children in the age category that were involved here and the category of images and so what, what's important, david, the no one knew about the child abuse claims that the bbc, the claims were about whether he was approaching younger colleagues and asked them questions which were inappropriate. >> that's different. isn't it? >> that's different. isn't it? >> yeah. oh yes, of course. but at the same time, what i'm saying is that what is emerging is there's a pattern of behaviour by huw edwards and the tendency i come back to the point that the tendency of the bbc over the years has been when there are questions about the behaviour of their staff, they , behaviour of their staff, they, they, they tend to go to the line of least disclosure possible and least action possible. this is david. >> david, keith, thank you for joining us tonight to discuss this huw edwards scandal. now, joining me back again in the studio is my panel, a former chancellor of the exchequer and former tory mp kwasi kwarteng and a former labour adviser

stella stella. do you think here the bbc were in a difficult position. they had to really honour the contract until a charging decision was made and by then this individual, huw edwards, had left the corporation. i think they're in a position that a lot of big bureaucratic organisations find themselves in, where they are used to being extremely cautious when it comes to legal matters . when it comes to legal matters. >> however, there is a there is some responsibility there that needs, there needs to be some responsibility taken there about the fact that this is clearly an issue of public interest. how do you excuse this kind of behaviour and who knew exactly? and why did they not? surely that must have been a different way to ask where to act, where they would still be compliant. but where whatever legal hr requirements they have, i completely understand having a contract and all of that. what i'm wondering is, was there some kind of deference that usually is reserved for people who are extremely senior, extremely well

paid, have an extremely high profile, and very often their high profile is tied to the reputation of the organisation. the workforce kwasi kwarteng estella right there, that there was a double standard here. >> everyone knows huw edwards. he commentated on the king's coronation, the queen's funeral. people treated him differently and more reverentially. >> look, i think they were in a very difficult position because they couldn't they didn't know they couldn't they didn't know the nature of the charges, as you pointed out. and as you say , you pointed out. and as you say, he's a big figure and i think they probably did, i met him. what's your like? i think he's an affable i mean, obviously i didn't know about the crimes that he's been convicted of, but he was affable , genial, a good he was affable, genial, a good professional. but of course, he had this appalling, other side to him. and i think for the, for the bbc, i think what david said is right. i think the problem is, is that the judge and jury. so there's no independent commissioner, there's no independent arbiter as to whether they're acting well or not.

>> politically, i think labour have taken a foot off the bbc that we heard from sir keir starmer. he has said they're going to carry on with the licence fee, not reform that at all. your former government had said they would look at maybe a netflix funding model, a different way to keep, to keep bbc reform was something that we mooted, but we didn't really get anywhere with in 14 years, and i don't think it's likely to happen, frankly, under this government. what's the answer here, stella? is it? the bbc should review how it treats individuals if they're arrested but not charged? maybe withdraw paying but not charged? maybe withdraw paying them until they're cleared ? cleared? >> well, they should review the kind of culture that they have that has allowed for something like this to happen. but i'm not going to sit here and say that, you know, the bbc is anything but a national treasure. i've said this before as a greek person, i'm so jealous of the bbc. it is. it is so, so precious. the british people are so, so lucky to have the bbc and we must okay, we must save it. we must reform it. >> it's a great institution, but i want it to compete with other

institutions. no, i don't want you to compete. >> because if it competes privileged, it will no longer. we see what happens, you know, you let capitalism run wild and then you get tiktok. >> that's what happens. okay? >> that's what happens. okay? >> tiktok is a bad thing. is that stella kwasi? >> thank you. now coming up, gps are set to take industrial action over a funding row. we'll talk to former chairman of british medical association's gp committee

next. welcome back. i'm christopher hope , standing in for nigel hope, standing in for nigel farage. now earlier today it was announced that the gp's family doctors have voted to take collective action for the first time in 60 years. now it's not strike action, it's more like work to rule. they'll take a number of steps to limit what they normally do during working hours. joining me now is doctor lawrence buckman, a former chairman of the bma's gp committee. doctor buckman, thank

you for joining committee. doctor buckman, thank you forjoining us committee. doctor buckman, thank you for joining us tonight on farage. why on earth are gp striking or not or slowing down their work ? their work? >> they're stopping doing things they're not paid for and they are reducing work to safe limits . are reducing work to safe limits. that's two separate things. one is the sort of headline . they're is the sort of headline. they're going down to 25 patients a day, which is recognised as the european safe limit from harmony, from how many? >> 40 or so, something like that . >> 40 or so, something like that. >> 40 or so, something like that. >> yeah. i mean, it was a quiet day when i had only 36 people, so, so 40 is more like it and 50 is not unheard of . and that is not unheard of. and that isn't safe for patients, particularly at the end of the day, they're not getting as good a deal as they did at 9:00 in the morning. and that has to stop. we've been talking to government about that for years. this is not a new thing. the other things are unresourced work. and part of the problem with unresourced work is that we don't have the staff to do it,

and we haven't got the money to pay and we haven't got the money to pay them. so this is not about gp pay, because there won't be more gps if you double my pay. it's not going to work like that. but you have to do is take away the things that are not necessary. and some of the things that really are barriers for patients. and one of the actions a gp can take if they wish is to stop referring people through this special, filter electronic filter that stops people getting to the consultant of their choice. and we think that should stop. we think it's a complete waste of time for patients. it's certainly a waste of time for doctors. it's second guessing people getting access to specialists. and we don't think that should go on. and there's loads of other stuff which is unresourced and to an extent has no great value, and we are certainly not paid for and gets in the way of patient care. >> but those are improvements which the last government were looking at consulting, talking to consultants directly , to consultants directly, allowing pharmacies to triage things that shouldn't go through a gp. but you have got i mean,

the viewers , listeners to gb the viewers, listeners to gb news tonight will be thinking, i can't get hold of my gp now when they are dealing with more patients and how on earth will he get any better this way? i mean all you want, you want more money and is it not the case? you've you've seen how much junior doctors are getting and you're thinking, i want a bit of that pie. >> no, this thing's been going on for 20 years. this is not new. it's got much worse in the last few years because i was talking to the previous labour government about this, and telling them what would happen. the retirement bulge of the 2010s and 20s has happened, and people are retiring, as you would expect , people are would expect, people are retiring early, which is much more worrying . retention has more worrying. retention has become an issue which it never used to be, and we don't have enough doctors and nurses and other health care professionals in the workplace to deliver the care. and that's because a very large amount of nhs resource goes to hospital. and i'm not suggesting you should reduce what they get . it's purely that

what they get. it's purely that we need some in primary care to enable us to provide care for patients. it's not right that patients. it's not right that patients should have to wait more than 24 hours to see a gp. that's absolutely wrong , and the that's absolutely wrong, and the only way you can improve that is to get more people into working into primary care and that needs a plan. of course, no government's going to wave a magic wand, and even if they were to dump a load of money, which i don't think we would object to, actually that won't solve anything. what you need is, is workforce. that's the real problem. we've got to stop people walking away from the service because they can't cope, my job now is looking after doctors and nurses who can't, who have mental illness within the nhs because they can't go on with the workload. and that problem is, has grown from nothing to an enormous number of people and young doctors, ones who've just qualified, instead of saying, oh, i want to be a gp or i want to be a hospital doctor, they say i want to emigrate. and that problem now is a large problem.

>> look, doctor buckman, thank you for joining >> look, doctor buckman, thank you forjoining us >> look, doctor buckman, thank you for joining us tonight on farage. we really do appreciate it. now joining me again, my panel it. now joining me again, my panel, a former chancellor of the exchequer, kwasi kwarteng, and a former labour adviser, stellar. well, thank you for again, isn't he right though, doctor buckman there kwasi kwarteng. he's saying that the reason why they're going to do a work to rule is to force the government to give them more gp's. >> so, look, i think he's partly right. i think it's true that this has been bubbling for a long time. it's also true that a lot of people have left the profession, partly because their pension pots have been have been capped. so it makes economic sense for them to leave probably slightly earlier. and this was a problem i saw in government. however, i do think the fact that junior doctors got, i think , that junior doctors got, i think, 22% just a few days ago, 20%. that's right . it 22% just a few days ago, 20%. that's right. it was a couple of days ago, it's not a coincidence that in the same week that they've got 22%, the gp's are taking the first collective action in 60 years. i think you said i don't think those two facts are unrelated .

facts are unrelated. >> he's right, isn't he? kwasi kwarteng ? essentially, you've kwarteng? essentially, you've got this problem, caused by the government , by paying, government, by paying, overpaying the junior doctors. they want back pay 20% of back pay- they want back pay 20% of back pay. and now other, other individuals, other groups in the economy want the same. >> the conservatives have taken doctors and our medical staff for granted for such a long time, even after all they did for us during the pandemic. and we are saying we want to reduce immigration and we want to stop being dependent on medical staff for abroad. and how do we treat our medical staff here? what's the signal that we send to young people who want to become doctors? we are telling them, just go in the private sector, become a consultant. you're going to make more money there. i completely agree with the guests that you just had, and i think that it is entirely reasonable for doctors to work to rule and leave people suffering and unable to get just exactly what they're doing. how is a doctor who is so stressed that they need to go to they need mental health, health

support themselves? a doctor thatis support themselves? a doctor that is going to be productive and that is going to provide good service. >> and there are wider issues here. i mean, i think the gp's probably have some cause, but i don't think it's a coincidence that they're doing this immediately after the junior doctors have got 22%. >> and you do you think more will come forward? >> i think the risk, the fear is that the former chancellor i was, i was and i was i was business secretary as well. and i could see that the effect of the public sector pay what used to be called the public sector pay to be called the public sector pay round. so if you give junior doctors 22%, there are lots of other people in the public sector who will be thinking, well, if they get 22%, why don't well, if they get 22%, why don't we try and get more from the government? and with inflation at 2%, you're going to you're very likely to get above inflation. settlements, which will have an effect on the pubuc will have an effect on the public finances. >> kwasi suella. thank you. and thank to my panel. next we'll be discussing my interview with former home secretary suella braverman, the she's done since out of the tory

soon. welcome back. i'm christopher hopein welcome back. i'm christopher hope in for nigel farage, who i'm very sorry to say now can't make it in time. so apologies for that. i spoke to the former home secretary, suella braverman, for my podcast. chopper's political podcast is available now. it was the first interview since she pulled out of the race for tory leadership last weekend. suella braverman was as punchy as ever as you might expect. i asked her about the european convention on human rights and multiculturalism. here's a snippet of what she had to say. >> years ago, i was the first cabinet member to publicly call for us to leave the european convention of human rights. i was demonised then. people said i was mad and crazy for saying that. i was mad and crazy for saying that . two years on, we've got, that. two years on, we've got, you know, so—called one nation candidates in the leadership contest, like tom tugendhat leading with a pledge to

potentially leave the european, hasn't gone further than rishi sunak. >> i mean, if you look at the wording there, he's done it in very caveated wording. >> but i thought that was quite telling that someone from the one nation wing of the conservative party would even want to embrace that subject. but i think the fact that he has chosen that subject, you've changed the weather. something to talk about is a reflection of how we've moved the debate and shifted the overton window. when i said multiculturalism wasn't working last year, i did so because it was the important thing to describe and observe in our country. again, none of the members of the cabinet backed me up and i was shunned . but, you up and i was shunned. but, you know, six months on, you know, a lot of people, i think would agree with that analysis. when i said that the police were being too soft on the pro—palestinian protesters, i lost my job for it. >> that was the opinion piece appeared in one of the newspapers, the telegraph. >> yes, it was the right thing to do because the police had to step up and be more robust with, you know, antisemitism and racism running rife on our streets . streets. >> suella braverman they're talking to me off my podcast out

now. now, former chancellor of the exchequer and former tory mp kwasi kwarteng and former legal adviser stella steph takyi , adviser stella steph takyi, still are still with me, kwasi kwarteng, is she wrong not to stand? >> i think she is. i think she should, make her case, try and make it to the mps first and get the nominations, which she said she had, which only ten mps required. that's right. i mean, it's a diminished party. we have to remember. but, yes, ten. and then she she could if she'd got those nominations which she claimed she had, then she could have had made a wider case not only to more mps, but to the country. i think it's a shame that she isn't standing. i think it narrows the debate somewhat. and she's got support. but isn't she reflecting the fact that the parliamentary party is now very centrist? >> there's not a lot, not a lot of right wingers. you're not there for a start. >> well, lots of people. i mean, jacob rees—mogg and others aren't, aren't there either. but but i think she has to make the case. and there are some pretty

good strong right wing candidates actually in the field . candidates actually in the field. and i think it's disappointing that she hasn't taken that step . that she hasn't taken that step. >> stella zigi don't you think it's a good thing maybe that suella braverman may not now be won't be leader of the tory party. are you relieved she's she's left the scene. >> no. it would have been very good for the labour party if she was the leader. actually, she would have been a very easy leader to take down. but if i can offer some advice from the point of view of someone from a party which was until very recently in its wilderness years, i think it is very important that the parliamentary party is represented by a leader thatis party is represented by a leader that is somewhat close to them. it doesn't have to be exactly the same. yes, sure, someone who can command the confidence of the parliamentary party, and in that i think suella would have a very, very big problem. >> in that interview, though. kwasi kwarteng isn't she laying down a challenge to the next leader? there are six of your former colleagues standing, and she's saying to them, unless you take on reform and neutralise

nigel farage, you cannot win the election in 2029 because the temptation might be to go into the middle ground where the lib dems and labour are. >> so my view on this is that you've got to do both and it's got to be sequenced. >> that's not easy. >> that's not easy. >> no, it's very difficult. but in america, traditionally they would always say, you know, you run to your base at the beginning and then you go to the centre. and i think effectively that's what david cameron did. i mean, when i remember when he stood, he stood on a, on a fairly classically right platform. i mean, he talked about george osborne, talked about george osborne, talked about flat taxation, flat taxation when he was shadow chancellor, and michael howard was still the leader , and david was still the leader, and david cameron pledged to leave the european people's party, the epp and the referendum on the lisbon treaty, all of that which they didn't do. and that was very much playing, dare i say, to, to the right of, of the party. and then, of course, having won the leadership, he moved, gradually i would say to the centre and some sort of form of that i think needs to happen. but the idea that you can somehow, after reform have got 4 million votes,

pretend that, you know, that didn't happen and just doubled down on on being a liberal democrat. yeah. doesn't make any sense to me. >> well, who had to ask that question then? jacob rees—mogg. now coming up, jacob, on the state of the nation, what have you got planned? >> well, we're going to have more of your fantastic interview with with suella and discuss that and get into the nitty gritty of what she's been saying. and i think it's really important her analysis of where the tory party is, we're also going to be talking about freedom of speech and how a privacy law that's been brought in by judges has stopped the newspapers reporting wrongdoing. and it turns out that the wrongdoers are then committing crimes, and we need more freedom of speech, less privacy. so important that the name of the suspect in the case in southport has been revealed, because that thing hurts the gossip out. >> jacob, i'll be tuning in. i've been christopher hope in for nigel farage. thank you for joining us here on the show tonight. apologies that nigel couldn't get back on time. he's back on tuesday. next up , state back on tuesday. next up, state of the nation with jacob rees—mogg first. so the weather with annie shuttleworth .

with annie shuttleworth. >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news >> hello. good evening. welcome to your latest gb news, weather update brought to you from the met office. warm and sunny for many of us into tomorrow. some further heavy downpours though across eastern england at first and through this evening. we could still see some heavy downpours into friday, though we will see a weather front arrive from the north—west that's going to introduce much fresher air, but before then, still a fairly muqqy but before then, still a fairly muggy night to come. and as i said, it's the risk of thunderstorms first thing this evening across eastern areas of england. but those should die down as the night goes on. so a dry night for many of us, but still feeling quite humid and muqqy still feeling quite humid and muggy as i mentioned, temperatures quite widely in the mid to high teens across england and wales, a little bit fresher further north, but still fairly mild for the time of year. now into friday morning there'll be some wet weather arriving into the far north and west, spreading into parts of western

scotland, bringing cloudier skies. some outbreaks of quite heavy rain. the winds will also start to pick up to southwesterly breeze on friday morning . eastern areas of morning. eastern areas of scotland, north eastern england, though still a bright start. temperatures already 16 or 17 degrees by 8:00. another warm and sunny start to the day across wales, many areas of england, but it's in the south—east where we've got that risk of some further heavy downpours through friday morning. be quite as widespread as we're expecting through the rest of today , however, and then rest of today, however, and then once they clear away, for many of us it will be a dry and sunny afternoon. however, wet weather is spreading into parts of northern ireland, much of scotland. we could see some quite heavy outbreaks of rain. so through friday afternoon, turning a bit fresher behind this band of rain. but ahead of it, still quite a humid feel. temperatures widely in the mid to high 20s now into saturday. that band of rain sinks into southeastern areas, so there's potential for some quite heavy rain across southern areas of england and the southeast, particularly as we head into saturday afternoon. further north, dry across northern

england. some showers, though, across the north and west into sunday, looks a bit drier across eastern areas of england, but there will be further wet weather spreading in from the south and west and temperatures staying around average. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on

gb. news >> hello. good evening. it's me, jacob rees—mogg on state of the nation. tonight. the southport suspect's name has finally been released . but does this, along released. but does this, along with the huw edwards scandal, show that it's time to roll back? the judge invented privacy laws which restrict free speech to extinguish the culture of fear. meanwhile, tonight we will be airing the second part of gb news exclusive interview with suella braverman, her first since bowing out of the tory leadership race is the right thing for me to bow out.

>> hopefully gracefully at this stage . stage. >> she's also discussed who she's backing. >> who are you back now? >> who are you back now? >> oh gosh, i don't know and why the tories were toast . he lost the tories were toast. he lost fundamentally because people didn't trust us anymore on the big issues like my immigration and taxation . and taxation. >> and finally, as a judge overturns a decision that forced a young girl sudiksha into end of life care. i will be speaking to her family about her wish. that was never granted to die trying to live state of the nafion trying to live state of the nation starts now . nation starts now. i'll also be joined by my most intellectual panel gb news senior political commentator nigel nelson and former adviser to boris johnson, lord moylan. as ever, let me know your views. i always want to hear them mailmogg@gbnews.com but now it

is your