gb news. >> away . >> away. >> away. >> hello. >> hello. >> good afternoon. it's 3:00. welcome to gb news live on tv , welcome to gb news live on tv, onune welcome to gb news live on tv, online and on digital radio. i'm nana akua , and for the next few nana akua, and for the next few hours, me and my panel will be taking on some of the big topics hitting the headlines right now. this show is all about opinion. it's mine. it's theirs. and of course it is yours. we'll be debating discussing and at times we will disagree, but no one will be cancelled. so joining me today is former adviser to boris johnson. oscar redrup . also johnson. oscar redrup. also former labour adviser james schneider . former labour adviser james schneider. right well on the menu. home secretary yvette cooper has pledged to crack down on people pushing harmful and hateful beliefs at the scale of the migrant crisis. is getting out of control and labour's is labour's approach. working and, as robert jenrick lays out, ten principles for the future of the conservatives, are they already dead and buried? but before we

get started, let's get your latest news headlines . latest news headlines. >> good afternoon. it's 3:00. >> good afternoon. it's 3:00. >> i'm sophia wenzler in the gb newsroom. >> your top story this hour. >> your top story this hour. >> it's understood dozens of people have been killed in israeli airstrikes in gaza and lebanon . lebanon. >> iran backed hezbollah has continued firing rockets in retaliation. it comes as israel's prime minister expressed cautious optimism about a ceasefire deal with hamas, including for the release of hostages. >> the militant group isn't present for the talks, but a senior officials claim there's been no progress in reaching a deal. deal >> meanwhile, president biden claims he's remaining optimistic that an agreement is closer than ever. that an agreement is closer than ever . in other news, there are ever. in other news, there are concerns that the safety of the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is deteriorating after a drone strike. it caused an explosion

just outside the site's protected area . although no protected area. although no casualties have been reported, the facility the facility, the largest of its kind in europe, has been occupied by russian soldiers since the early stages of the war. it comes as ukraine's incursion continues into russian territory. former head of counter—terrorism at the ministry of defence, major general chip chapman, says british donated equipment is helping ukraine push back vladimir putin. >> one of the things that the offensive does is establish momentum and initiative and gives more willingness to continue to support ukraine, because what you can say previously is that they were losing slowly and initially the provision of support equalised the battlefield, and now at least the momentum and initiative is with them in a tactical sense. >> a biotech firm that produces an mpox vaccine is ramping up production after a new strain was found in europe. >> the clade one b strain has

been confirmed in sweden after first being detected in the democratic republic of congo. it's believed to be the most dangerous version of the disease so far . dangerous version of the disease so far. official figures reveal almost 500 people crossed the engush almost 500 people crossed the english channel yesterday. at least nine small boats made the journey following two days of no reported migrant arrivals . it reported migrant arrivals. it bnngs reported migrant arrivals. it brings the total number of migrants reaching uk waters so far this year to 19,000. the home office insists it's creating a new border security command to tackle the problem. the home secretary is promising to crack down on people she says are pushing harmful and hateful beliefs in a new approach to fighting extremism. yvette cooperis fighting extremism. yvette cooper is launching a rapid sprint to look at how best to tackle the extremist threats, including rising radicalisation among young people online. the initiative follows violent riots across england after the southport stabbings, with over 460 people appearing in court,

including more than 70 minors. in northern ireland, a convicted murderer who was on the run has now been apprehended after an urgent manhunt. david mccord was sentenced to life in prison in 2004 for the murder of his girlfriend. over the weekend , girlfriend. over the weekend, police worked to trace his whereabouts. he was considered unlawfully at large and issued an appeal for the prisoner to turn himself in. police located mccord in the belfast area and he's been returned to prison . a he's been returned to prison. a don't swim alert has been issued for a popular devon seaside town because of a sewage leak. south west water says it can't keep up with the spill, caused by a burst pipe at a nearby pumping station in exmouth. it's apologised and insists engineers are working around the clock to fix the problem. it comes after the regulator, ofwat, announced water bills will rise an average of £94 over five years to cover the cost of upgrading victorian age infrastructure. it was also

revealed that three water companies, not including south west water, are facing a combined fine of £168 million for failings including over sewage treatment. around 30 people have been left injured after two ferris wheel gondolas caught fire at a music festival in germany. pictures showed the ride in flames at highfield festival at storm tal lake near leipzig. festival organisers say 18 people are being treated in hospital. the cause of the blaze is unknown. and donald trump went on the attack at a campaign eventin went on the attack at a campaign event in pennsylvania last night, twice telling supporters he was better looking than his election rival. the former president was delivering a speech focused on the economy when he asked supporters if they'd mind if he went off script. i'm a better looking person than kamala . person than kamala. >> no, i couldn't. >> no, i couldn't. >> his opponents are planning a bus tour starting in pittsburgh

today. americans head to the polls in november. those are the latest gb news headlines for now. i'm sophia wenzler more in half an hour for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone , sign up to news smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code, or go to gbnews.com forward slash alerts . slash alerts. >> hello! good afternoon. it's fast approaching seven minutes after 3:00. this is gb news live on tv, online and on digital radio. coming up, the home secretary announced a new crackdown on extremism, pledging, pledging , pledging to pledging, pledging, pledging to tackle harmful ideologies and address gaps in the current policies. but should extreme misogyny be treated as terrorism? i'll also be joined by lawyer stephen barrett and political commentator rebecca reed.thenis political commentator rebecca reed. then is labour's approach to the small boat crisis working? gb news can confirm

that more than 19,000 small boat migrants have now crossed the engush migrants have now crossed the english channel this year, with over 5000 of them crossing the channel since labour came to power. have they lost control in world view? we'll get the latest on the presidential race. and could kamala harris beat donald trump? i'll bring you the latest polling stats are labour's policies of false economy, scrapping the winter fuel payment , scrapping the winter fuel payment, minimum service levels repealed and private schools at risk of closure. what is starmer bringing to the table ? right. so bringing to the table? right. so the government has announced extreme misogyny will be treated as a form of extremism under the new government, plans to home. the home secretary, yvette coopen the home secretary, yvette cooper, says there's been a rise in extremism both online and on our streets, and we'll review the uk's current counter—terrorism strategy and determine how best to deal with the situation . joining me from the situation. joining me from outside the home office is that

gb news reporter ray addison ray . gb news reporter ray addison ray. so tell me a little bit more about what yvette cooper is proposing . proposing. >> well, some people are saying that this seems like a rather extreme way of tackling this problem. under the proposals involved in this scheme, teachers would be legally required to refer pupils that they suspect of extreme misogyny to prevent. of course, that's the uk government's counter—terror programme, the aim being that they would then help to counter and address violence against women and girls. but of course , prevent is girls. but of course, prevent is well known for dealing with and trying to intervene with young people who are showing an interest or getting involved with terror organisations, or showing some kind of sympathy towards terror groups and causes, and to then use the same organisation to deal with young people who are saying things

which are deemed to be extreme, extremely misogynistic , could extremely misogynistic, could be, and has been argued to be a misuse and sort of a downplay of the seriousness of the terror threat to the united kingdom. now, of course, this this organisation, this scheme that they're introducing is being called sprint home secretary saying it's a strategic reset on how the government will tackle hateful or harmful activity. and they are keen to stress as well that as part of this review , that as part of this review, they will be looking at how they tackle , the far right ideologies , tackle, the far right ideologies, extreme islamist ideologies as well . but extreme islamist ideologies as well. but this extreme islamist ideologies as well . but this is extreme islamist ideologies as well. but this is the one that's kind of really caught people's attention. this idea that extreme misogyny could be tackled and that people's children, when they go to school, they might say the wrong thing and they could get referred to this counter terror organisation . now, i took a organisation. now, i took a quick look, and we haven't had a comment so far that i've been able to find from the shadow home secretary, james cleverly . home secretary, james cleverly. remember, he's also the candidate, a candidate to become

tory leader as well. and so one wonders why he hasn't sort of waded in on this , because it's waded in on this, because it's really catching the attention of the public. >> i think they've forgotten. the tories have forgotten that they are the opposition party. they're too busy navel gazing. i think. but there is a category within this prevent strategy called incel . and that, that called incel. and that, that that does cover, involuntary celibate is what it means. it refers to male subculture and includes violent feelings towards women as a result of feeling rejected and stuff like that. surely there's enough to encompass, within the legislation without needing to do to add something more ? do to add something more? >> well, arguably, i posted this up on on social media this morning and the main comment seems to be from my followers, who gets to decide that something is extreme? who gets to decide that something is misogynistic ? and, and obviously misogynistic? and, and obviously we've we've seen debated in the

public, haven't we, in recent weeks this sort of argument that there is the concept of two tier policing, depending upon what calls you follow. and we have seen for a very long time , seen for a very long time, haven't we, we've seen labour politicians referring to, conservatives as, as right wing, which i think previously we could all agree was a term that we might only use to refer to the most extreme, sort of far right beliefs and agendas and so this seems to be the key argument that people are making right now. who determines these terms, and, and how will they how will they do so and how will that affect us? of course, labour did say they were going to do this in their manifesto. so it shouldn't be too much of surprise. >> well, it will be interesting. and what does extremism mean? what does the definition ray addison. thank you very much. really good to talk to you. that is ray addison gb news reporter. well, joining me now to discuss this is barrister and writer

stephen barrett. stephen, thank you so much forjoining me. welcome to the program. i want to start with ray did actually pose a very valid question. who gets to determine where the line is drawn for that word? extreme. what is extremism mean when we come to this ? who is the come to this? who is the arbiter? yes. >> and that is the crucial point. and it's also the word hate. >> and it's who's going to be defining these lines, who's going to be deciding what is and isn't hate, what is and isn't extreme hate just means intense dislike. nana. now, i've noticed that i've taken the precaution that i've taken the precaution that you are already sitting down, so i. i hope you don't faint. from the words that i'm about to say, but i hate oysters and i should have the freedom to hate oysters as long as i want to. i'm a i'm an adult in a free democratic country . democratic country. >> why are we seeking to police intense dislike of things by other adults ? other adults? >> it strikes me as impossible to do. >> i think that's why the scottish government got

themselves into such a mess. i don't know if you remember their nonsense cartoon character and the absurd situation they appear to be in. >> it does seem that all across the west we are returning to this idea that maybe we should, you know, censor and police everybody's thoughts and feelings, which we got rid of in the 16th and 17th century because it was a really bad idea. >> and if that's if that's where we're going, it's just going to get bloody and messy and it's going to be awful. but really, nana, i suspect that the reason for this is that substantive politics is dying. we don't seem to debate or talk about real policies anymore, and instead what you get is performative or declarative announcements designed simply to signal virtue. i think your reporter was right to immediately sort of pounce on what they want. as a response from the conservative party that they can then turn around and say, oh, you're pro misogyny because you don't you don't support this. you must, i mean, and this is just infantile. this is this is very, very childish way of doing non—substantive politics. but in

the final. >> oh, go on, go on. no. go on, make that point, please. >> i'd like to make is that we are a developed democracy and we have bucket loads of laws. absolutely bucket loads of them. so we have a finite number of police officers. so every time you do something like invent a new law or push forward a new strategy, you are effectively calling for less policing of what already exists. you're saying the other things that are crimes police them less in order to police this thing. and it does. it does feel as though the priority of this government is our thoughts and feelings. by the way, our private thoughts and feelings and not really things like has somebody broken into my house? has somebody stolen something from me? you know , the old days when i was know, the old days when i was young and property was, was very taken very seriously and mattered seems to have gone and we seem to be meandering towards thought crimes, and everybody, you know , making the right you know, making the right mantra and saying the right thing in order to not get

arrested. >> stephen. but hasn't yvette cooper got a point? because the point that she's making is regard with regard to, you know, extreme misogyny that is leading many men to commit heinous crimes against women and girls. and those those numbers of crimes seem to be, you know, they're almost excessive. but i can't say the word, but there are loads of them. so yvette is trying to tackle that. >> if that's true , if that's >> if that's true, if that's true. but we need to be very careful about seeking to police ideas and thoughts. nobody wants crime against women and girls, and there are a huge number of strategies in place already to reduce it. i mean, if far better from a policy point of view to simply review how those are working and if they're not working and if they're not working well, then invent better ones that do work, because we all want crimes against women and girls to, to go down. but classifying i mean, i, i heard a point this morning which i think is right to be terrorism. it has to be a broad a broad political

practice. does anybody truly want to erase women? i mean, is that what's going on? i don't think that that well, i think that's an interesting question that's an interesting question that you say and as you as you asked that i think actually there are quite a few crimes that i could potentially put under this category, including some forms where people are saying that a woman cannot be a man and a man cannot be a woman. >> we find ourselves stuck in the gender debate as well, i think, on this one. >> yeah, well, until we return to truth and simple, clear laws, we will keep walking into these traps, into these cases. >> it's not the role of law, really, to police every aspect of people's lives. the role of the legal system is to create a broadly functioning state that we can all live and prosper in peacefully. and i think that too much pressure is being put on the legal system, too much expectation is there. i was doing something recently for a project i've got on on free speech laws and we have huge numbers of law laws that police all of this already. i mean, the idea that there's a need for a

new one is, is, i think, simply wrong as law. i mean, what we're not doing is enforcing the laws that we have . that we have. >> that would be good. that would be good if that could happen. would be good if that could happen . stephen, we've run out happen. stephen, we've run out of time. really good to talk to you. that's stephen barrett. he's a barrister and a writer. always a pleasure to talk to him with his thoughts. joining me now, author and broadcaster rebecca reed. rebecca reed, thank you very much for joining me. in theory, this sounds like, a positive move with protecting women and girls , but the worry women and girls, but the worry is that the legislation or if it does become legislation and it does become legislation and it does become legislation and it does become a thing, could then sort of start encompassing other things that it wasn't meant to encompass. >> i don't think that's a real or realistic risk. i have to say. i have found listening to stephen speak just then very, very difficult to tolerate, because this suggestion that there isn't a problem or that we're not sure if there's a problem or we don't know if there's a problem, is risible. as of march , 50 british women as of march, 50 british women had been murdered by a man in this country. that's only march. we're now in august, and 2

million women a year are victim of violence from men in this country. and even mark rowley and i have no great love for the for the police service. but even mark rowley, who is a fairly old school copper, said that we should be treating violence against women and girls as a national emergency in this country. there is no question from any of the data that this is getting worse and worse, and we have to do something. you can't just sit there and go, yeah, it's awful, isn't it? and then do nothing. there is a reason this is happening and there that reason is twofold, partially domestic violence gets dramatically worse in times of low economic prosperity because people are unhappy. people are more stressed. so therefore relationships are under more tension. and that tends to come from that side of it. that's always been true throughout history, however, there is a new strand which was not previously a problem, which is the radicalisation of young men , and radicalisation of young men, and that comes from different strands. there is a there is a strands. there is a there is a strand of radical islam and islamification, particularly the, the side of the internet that wants to groom people for isis, that absolutely despises

women. and then there's also a more predominantly white side of this, the meninist manosphere. andrew tate side also absolutely hates women, so the amount of radicalisation of young men onune radicalisation of young men online is now staggering. and of course, the prolificness of the internet in our lives is dramatically higher. so all this is aiming to do is bring prevent in line so that whether you are hating people because they are brown, because they are muslim, because they are catholic, or because they are catholic, or because they are female , all of because they are female, all of those strategies for radicalisation are roughly the same. and it basically empowers the law to be able to treat it as much of a problem. if you hate someone because they're a woman, as if you hated them because they were hindu, sikh or south asian, but but also , ray south asian, but but also, ray raised a good point that who gets to determine what is extreme in these situations? >> do you take that that that is a that could be a problem . a that could be a problem. >> so the word extreme has not previously i've been doing that. i've been doing this debate for like since i was, since i was basically a teenager. and i've never heard extreme attached to misogyny before. it always used to be should misogyny be a hate

crime? and that, i think, does run into a bit of a tricky ground because saying a woman commenting on a woman's body could be misogynistic, saying a woman is ugly could be misogynistic. so there, i think we could have had a problem, but they've been very specific to call it extreme misogyny. so just calling somebody a fat cow is not extreme misogyny. it's not nice. it's not polite, but it's not extreme misogyny. >> somebody could think that thatis >> somebody could think that that is like somebody i might think, well, that is extreme. >> you might, but i think we would use much the same. the, the good thing about this is that you can effectively do a copy and paste when it was brought into law that someone's race or religion were a protected characteristic. so in the same way that you could sit in a pub and say, i think there are too many immigrants in this country now, i personally would find that i might, i might go and sit at a different table, but you have a right to say that. but so that's not hate speech.i that. but so that's not hate speech. i might not like it, but it's not hateful. whereas if you said there are too many n words or p words in this country, that is hate speech and that is a protected characteristic. so you have to do a certain amount of agreement and research, and hopefully it could be a

cross—party consensus, because the tory party has actually had a pretty good track record over the years on this. you know, david cameron in particular really did push for this. and so i trust the at least the centre part of the tory party and the tory party, you know, kemi badenoch for instance, i think has previously written some very sensible things about the maternity gap and, and those issues. so there are a lot of tories i would trust to do a cross—party consensus about what constitutes extreme misogyny. but the core of it is if you are inciting violence against women because they are violent, because they are violent, because they are women, rather than because you're inciting violence, that is a different crime. hating someone because they're a woman is different from just hating them. full stop . from just hating them. full stop. >> all right. rebecca, thank you so much for your thoughts. that's rebecca reed. she's an author and broadcaster. well, what do you think, gbnews.com/yoursay? you're with me. i'm nana akua. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. coming up is labour's approach to the small boat crisis, working as 19,000 people have already crossed, 5000 of which in the last month since sir keir starmer was in charge. next extreme misogyny should it be treated as terrorism? this is

gb news. i'm here. i'm not here. i am here 25 after three. welcome. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. it's time now for the great british debate. this hour i'm nana akua and i'm asking you, should extreme misogyny be treated as terrorism ? home treated as terrorism? home secretary yvette cooper is vowing to crack down on the spread of harmful and hateful beliefs, and the government is launching a new initiative to tackle extremist ideologies across the uk and this rapid sprint project aims to fill gaps in the current system, addressing the growing threat posed by ideologies that incite violence and undermine democracy. so for the great british debate this out, i'm asking should extreme misogyny be treated as terrorism? joining me is former adviser to boris johnson, oscar redrup and also former labour adviser james schneider. right. well i'm going to start with you, oscar. it's

your first time with me. what what are your thoughts on this ? what are your thoughts on this? >> it's a really, really tricky one. i think if we just zoom out very quickly before we really get into it , it's very quickly before we really get into it, it's august, >> there isn't a lot of. >> there isn't a lot of. >> well, there is no parliamentary scrutiny at the moment. there is a need to fill column inches. yvette cooper has been incredibly front foot . been incredibly front foot. obviously the riots kind of took up a lot of her time. why she's in them? well hopefully not, hopefully not. that would be a good story , good story, >> but she's being very, very, very front foot with her language and aggressive. >> and she was on the riots and she is on this issue as well. i think that if it was to have to really be stacked up and stand up to parliamentary scrutiny, i'm not sure how far it would get . it's a really, really get. it's a really, really difficult one, because if people are you know, inciting it, first of all, they've got a massive majority, so it's not that difficult. >> and if they convince everybody in their party or put a whips underneath it and tell everybody to behave in a certain

way , i could see this sailing way, i could see this sailing through because i think the definition point here is really, really complicated. >> i think there's a balancing act that i think we just about get right in this country, just about. however, i'm not going to sit here and say that we shouldn't have serious conversations because it does happen. it completely happens whereby, people incite violence that end up with people dying. and so you can't just ignore, sit back and ignore that. and i think rebecca made a very good point just before the break on that. but the 1984 kind of stuff that. but the 1984 kind of stuff that you focus is on women and girls. >> what do you think james schneider so we have a real problem with violence against women and girls. >> but i don't think this is going to do very much for that at all. i think overwhelmingly our responses should be to do with dealing with actions first rather than words. and where we have you're saying wait till it

actually happens and then no, no, no, no. i'm saying, for example, where rape has been in effect decriminalised, i think deaung effect decriminalised, i think dealing with that is going to be a much more significant thing for dealing with violence against women and misogyny in society, then trying to legislate what firstly, what types of language do or don't fall outside of this thing, which is going to be legally complex and then bolstering prevent, which is a program which, you know, doesn't work probably at best it doesn't work that way, right? doesn't doesn't work at best, which also puts on that way, right? doesn't doesn't quite strange legal. positions on teachers and so on and so on and so forth. so it's like it's using, i think, the wrong device, the wrong framework. terrorism is the wrong framework. prevent is the wrong tool to deal with a very real and serious problem. and it's like saying we're going to legislate away this social issue rather than we are going to actually tackle it, and actually tackling it is going to be a lot more difficult than saying, oh,

teachers now need to refer some extra pupils to the local council. >> i think . sorry, anna. no, no, >> i think. sorry, anna. no, no, i think there's about 52,000 people on the watch list at the moment from counter—terrorism in this country, which is a huge amount vast. and i think, you know, in terms of terrorism, which is a very, very specific word that brings out very specific feelings in people. and i think maybe adding to that and overburdening, probably the security issues that our security issues that our security services deal with expertly, that we don't even know about. i think you have to be really, really careful what you what you throw into that term of terror. >> this is that it is almost like a form of grooming online, where you've got people like andrew tate, suggesting things that are very misogynistic and lots of young boys all going along with it or hearing something in it that sort of relates to them. so what she is ultimately saying is that stuff like that should be put in the bag of this. but then i thought they did have incel, which was involuntary celibate, which refers to a male subculture that involves violent feelings towards women as a result of feeling rejected and stuff like

that. that's already within prevent. so why does i'm just wondering whether we do actually need more legislation. >> i mean, i don't think that we do. we need to do other things to tackle the real big problem. and as we're hearing from your previous guest, the number of women that are killed in domestic violence and so on is absolutely terrible. but isn't that the beginning of it? >> like this, this bad language treating women badly? it's to do with how you've been educated with how you've been educated with how. >> so? so let's take the andrew tate example . what is going to tate example. what is going to counter some of the things that he's saying to young boys? i don't think it's going to be banning some of his content, which is going people will find it another way and it will give it another way and it will give it another way and it will give it a certain allure. the way you're going to deal with that is having like counsellors in schools that are showing good role models for as men to younger boys mentoring, helping people into work. all of these like much broader, softer things. so the way in which you build a cohesive and inclusive society, you can't just have a society, you can't just have a society that's fractured and then try to it's playing whack a

mole all the time saying, there's this problem over here. someone said something bad over here. we're going to stop that, stop that, stop that, and it doesn't deal with any of the underlying things. so i think it's a good it's good that the home secretary is thinking about violence against women. that's that's really good. but i think using this existing framework, using this existing framework, using prevent using counter—terrorism as the frame gets us going in the wrong direction, it doesn't deal with. i mean, if rape isn't being deau i mean, if rape isn't being dealt with properly, which it isn't, and if there is structural misogyny within some police forces which we have seen, those are the things that really the home secretary should be for dealing with. as the first order of business. >> even mark rowley, the met commissioner, says that violence against women and girls should be treated as a national security threat. so this is somebody who's head of the police commissioner who actually sees the problems and is dealing with them on a daily basis and they've accused andrew tate of radicalising boys . and i do radicalising boys. and i do believe there is a point to that, even though radicalisation is not happening in the form of terrorism in terms of as we know

it with, you know, bombs and things like that. this is still a similar thing, isn't it? >> surely? >> surely? >> well, look, i mean, and to address the slight elephant in the room, we are both blokes and so to a degree , i. and i don't so to a degree, i. and i don't know if i'm speaking for you here, but i have the benefit of being able to walk around a city like london, let's say, and by and large, feel totally and utterly safe and never concerned about my personal safety . about my personal safety. >> well. lucky you. >> well. lucky you. >> well, exactly. so, in a way. and even though i'm the panellist here, i'd be interested to know your direct thoughts on this matter, because in some ways you. so because of that. >> so my thoughts on this are that something does need to be done. that something does need to be done . and i think that we done. and i think that we actually already have the legislation within the prevent. if i even look at it, i can see reading there. i do believe that we have the legislation necessary. my only fear with this sort of thing is that where who determines where the line is for the word extreme, and at that point, then there's a lot of things that can be encompassed in it. but i do believe that there is something that needs to be done. i don't know, but i'm with you, james,

that perhaps the framework is not prevent. and perhaps there is another framework that could be set up specifically for misogyny towards against women and girls. that's what i think. >> yeah, that seems very sensible. and if we're talking about dealing with putting more stress on teachers , then maybe stress on teachers, then maybe they should be supported to help kids not have misogynistic views rather than sending them to off counter—terrorism watch list. >> but to be fair, this is a start. i mean, it's a start, but i'm not so sure that you know, it does feel a bit 1984, but what do you think? gbnews.com/yoursay next is labour's approach to the small boats crisis working. but first, let's get your latest news headunes. headlines. >> good afternoon. it's 333. i'm sophia wenzler in the gb newsroom. your headlines. it's understood at least 24 people have been killed in israeli airstrikes in gaza overnight, including some women and children. it comes as the israeli prime minister says he's

cautiously optimistic about a potential ceasefire. however, a senior hamas representative says any deal is still a way off. in ukraine, safety at the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is deteriorating, according to the international atomic energy agency. an explosive detonated just outside the site's protected area, which has been occupied by russian soldiers since the early stages of the war. official figures show nine migrant boats were brought ashore from the english channel yesterday, carrying almost 500 people. hundreds more have made the crossing this week, bringing the crossing this week, bringing the total number reaching uk waters so far this year to 19,000. the home secretary is launching a major crackdown on misogyny, saying it will be treated as a form of extremism. yvette cooper has ordered a review of the uk's counter—extremism strategy to determine how best to tackle threats posed by harmful ideologies . the analysis will ideologies. the analysis will

look at hatred of women as one of the allied logical trends that the government says is gaining traction . a don't swim gaining traction. a don't swim alert has been issued for exmouth beach in devon after south west water admitted it was struggling to contain a sewage leak . the firm struggling to contain a sewage leak. the firm has apologised for a burst pipe and insists engineers are working around the clock to fix the problem. and there are fears a new strain of mpox is already in the uk after emerging first in africa. the clade one b strain has been confirmed in sweden and is thought to be the most dangerous so far. symptoms include a fever and a painful rash, which produces blisters. those are the latest gb news headlines. for now, i'm sophia wenzler more in half an hour for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code or go to gbnews.com forward alerts

>> 39 minutes after 3:00. if you've just tuned in. welcome. i'm nana akua. this is gb news. we are britain's news channel. don't forget as well you can download the gb news app. and also remember you can vote in my poll on x. right now i'm asking will labour's plan to crack down on hateful beliefs threaten the free speech? right now though, it's free speech? right now though, wsfime free speech? right now though, it's time for the great british debate this hour and i'm asking is labour's approach to the small boat crisis working as more than 19,000 migrants have crossed the english channel, this year, the scale of the challenge facing the new government is clear to see, and on saturday, courtesy , get the on saturday, courtesy, get the pun. on saturday alone, more than 450 people made the dangerous journey from france, with border force intercepting multiple boats and processing hundreds of migrants at dover. home secretary, our home security editor sorry mark white brought us this report.

>> there are probably a slightly fewer coming across than we would have expected . now that would have expected. now that we're in the height of summer. but there have been some days where it's been a bit windy in the channel, including this week. so i was in dover earlier in the week on the cliff top there reporting on another milestone that 5000 migrants had crossed the channel illegally since labour came to power. and then we had 2 or 3 days of windy weather. and it's only now this weekend that things have calmed down enough to allow more boats to come. and sure enough, we heard just after 11:00 this morning, the border force vessel rainbow ranger coming in with 50 odd migrants. it returned again with another 40 migrants. then the border force vessel defender was in as well, with 135 migrants on board. and so it continued throughout the day with our , producer down in dover

with our, producer down in dover estimating that at least nine small boats came into uk waters, carrying more than 450 people, taking the total for the year to now more than 19,000. and of course, that milestone as well to 5500 since labour came to power , promising to smash the power, promising to smash the gangs they scrapped the rwanda deal on the first day in office. it was, to according sir keir starmer, a gimmick. instead, what he wants to do is go after the people smugglers. but that's going to take some time. they haven't even managed to appoint a new senior officer in charge of this new border security command. and that's what, over six weeks since labour came to power . so they've got some way power. so they've got some way to go to achieve this goal of supposedly smashing the gangs. and while they don't do that, then all of the time when the weather improves, we'll get boat after boat load coming to the

uk, right? >> that was our homeland security editor, mark white joining me now, oscar redrup. he's a former adviser to boris johnson and also james schneider. he's the former labour adviser james schneider i'll come to you first. labour's approach to the small boat crisis. we've got the border command control and i don't know if there's anything else. what else have they got? >> i think new bloke in a new shiny suit, which is, it's pretty consistent with what the previous, i guess three prime ministers were, were all doing, which is, have a lot of theatre around the channel. fly planes over put journalists on, embedded into boats, lots of high drama, and really, you rwanda. >> don't forget rwanda. well, yeah. >> which never happened and was a nonsense anyway, so. well, you think that, but. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> anyway. but it's. i think it was a nonsense. and also it's not happening. so it's, it never happened and it's gone . but i

happened and it's gone. but i don't really think that this is a crisis. and the reason why they're talking in this sort of tough way, in the same way as the previous ones were, speaking in a tough way , is because it's in a tough way, is because it's theatre, it's performance, it's not really aimed at dealing with the issue that most of the people who are coming across are, are needing a place of safety and our refugees. oh, come on, some a lot of them are coming here as economic migrants. so the main countries that i am being honest, i'm also backed up by evidence which is the rates at which they are granted. refugee status. >> refugees who are suffering with this, this crisis and the women , 84% are men. women, 84% are men. >> yes. if you want, if you want, if you want the numbers, that's the point. >> so it's mostly men coming on these boats and as i say, fighting age men. i'll use that because they are usually young, fit men. so if there are really such crisis in their country where are the women? why are the

women not on these boats? >> i mean, it's a dangerous and difficult journey to get here. and most if you look at the biggest countries where people have been sent come from are afghanistan , iran and so on, afghanistan, iran and so on, where there are countries where they they aren't refugees, which was albania. that was that that's dealt with by having a grown up agreement with another government at the moment, the one i have a question about because i don't i don't know what the driving factors are this year for some reason, vietnamese nationals are going on in vietnam. well, i don't know. but so the answer to that might be that the government needs to have an agreement with the vietnamese government. but this is not but by in saying that, you've literally discounted your first point. >> the point? no, i haven't, but the overwhelming bulk of them are from afghanistan , iran, are from afghanistan, iran, turkish, kurdistan , syria, turkish, kurdistan, syria, because we're running out of time. but i do appreciate that. >> so on your half of the labour party, i have to say i have a degree of admiration because they have the belief system to talk about immigration as only a

positive thing . and, you know, positive thing. and, you know, you can then look at someone from james as part of the labour party and go, i don't like it. i disagree, but ultimately you can respect it. the problem that keir starmer has got himself into is he does all the tough talking. he's called out rwanda as a gimmick , smashed the gangs as a gimmick, smashed the gangs to me, sounds pretty gimmicky and now they're in government. i think they're going to start seeing that actually smashing the gangs . seeing that actually smashing the gangs. this new seeing that actually smashing the gangs . this new controller the gangs. this new controller controlled border force team command control. it's not going to deliver. it's not going to do it. and then all of a sudden, you know, the gimmick that was, you know, the gimmick that was, you know, the gimmick that was, you know, rwanda was called for so long by the labour party, it'll be back. they are now accountable. you're in government now. these numbers are down to you. and lastly on it and this is just an objective fact. immigration is one of the top issues for the general pubucin top issues for the general public in this country. rightly or wrongly. that's the fact. and the government will have to deal with it. all right. >> well, listen, what are your thoughts? gbnews.com/yoursay next is world view . professor of next is world view. professor of us politics, david dunn will be joining me to give us

the latest on the

race. well, love him or hate him, donald trump and of course, kamala harris. the presidential race is heating up as the democratic national convention kicks off tomorrow in chicago . kicks off tomorrow in chicago. and it's good news for kamala harris, as a new poll has actually got her leading ahead of donald in several key battleground states, including arizona and north carolina, and chasing trump in georgia and nevada. if you're just joining me, i'm nana akua. this is gb news. let's speak to professor of us foreign and security policy, david dunn. david, it seems that kamala , supposedly on seems that kamala, supposedly on these polls is actually ahead of trump in some of these key states . states. >> yes. what we've seen is a dramatic turnaround in this, this race from when biden dropped out, his poll numbers were plummeting . he was in

were plummeting. he was in danger of losing formerly safe democratic seats. and what we've seen is the polls narrow considerably where as you say, there are some polls giving kamala harris a four point lead. it's important to say , however, it's important to say, however, these are more or less within these are more or less within the margin of error. and importantly, also to say that they are nowhere near as good as hillary clinton's lead at this stage of the polls 7 or 8 years ago. so, you know, this is still very much a neck and neck race. and it's not clear that all the movement, the trajectory of harris is on the up. it's not clear that that the election will be hers. this is still a very tight race. >> but the tactic that donald trump appears to be using is one of he's been slagging her off. he was saying how he's better looking than her and all this kind of thing is that does that appear to be working in his favour? >> one of the extraordinary things is that we're hearing from his team, who are very frustrated about the way in

which he actually goes on these personal attacks, which he said, by the way, actually, he said he said, i'm entitled to attack her. i don't think she's very bright. and he mispronounces her name deliberately. and actually, his team are telling him that this is really bad politics. you're more likely to alienate centre ground voters by doing so, and they're asking him to stick to the policy issues. but he's not great on detail on policy questions, so he prefers to go on the personal attacks. and that's probably contributing towards him losing support in the opinion polls. there's some people say that actually he's lost his focus. he's lost his mojo, he's lost his energy. and the speculation that he's suffering from ptsd or maybe actually he's just missing biden as an opponent. he keeps referring to biden, even though biden isn't any longer in the race, almost as if he would like to be running against biden rather than harris, he seems unable to actually get to terms with the fact that he's dealing with the fact that he's dealing with someone 20 years younger, and who is black and asian and female. he seems to be wrong

footed by that. so it's interesting. even the wall street journal are criticising the republicans and saying maybe they have the wrong candidate . they have the wrong candidate. they have a really good case to make. but actually this candidate for once doesn't seem to be doing it for them. >> but kamala, she's what is she best known for in terms of her political leanings? >> well, i mean, she comes from a background as a prosecutor in california, where she was most famous, perhaps for opposing the death penalty. that's part of her political background, which is highly controversial, of course, in the american context. and she is someone who is a the many people argue that she was adopted onto the ticket following the george floyd , following the george floyd, episode in minnesota, and therefore she is someone who is therefore she is someone who is there to balance the ticket rather than to be at the front of the ticket. and many people are speculating that she may not be as good in debates, or indeed on the stump. and of course,

famously, she hasn't given any interviews, 1 to 1 interviews. she's relying on, rallies rather than anything else . so a lot of than anything else. so a lot of people are saying that there's a honeymoon period here. but actually, when it comes down to later stages in the campaign, when she's put on the spot, whether she can contain that lead , maintain that lead is an lead, maintain that lead is an open question. but others are saying that actually the momentum is with her and trump similarly, actually isn't able to focus and isn't able to actually give good accounts of himself and detailed policy terms, compared to her. so it's an interesting narrowing of the race, and it really is anyone's to play for with three months to go. >> it is quite interesting, isn't it? and i wonder, so what's what's your predictions on it then? if you were to be a betting man, who would you say you think believe would win this, >> a betting person wouldn't wouldn't want to spend any money on this because it's really too close to call, actually. and what we've seen in the last, 4 to 8 weeks is a huge turnaround in these things. i mean, who could have predicted predicted a candidate dropping out an

assassination attempt? the democratic party and not actually having a process whereby they went for the best candidate, but instead just going with what they had , the going with what they had, the heir apparent, even though many people had had concerns about that. and then her actually using that sense of momentum and energy and newness and freshness gaining hugely in the polls. >> we've got david. we're running out of time. we do have to go. david. done very good on the way. my monologue on knife crime now though, your weather with amy bokota . with amy bokota. >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news. >> hello and welcome to your latest gb news weather update from the met office. sunny spells continuing through sunday with a couple of showers further north, but it is all change as we move into monday with some rain arriving. and that's from these frontal systems out in the

atlantic. but first, we do have a ridge of high pressure firmly across at least the southern half of the uk. it's across at least the southern half of the uk . it's having half of the uk. it's having quite a settled afternoon, so plenty of sunshine around. there is some cloud around, but that will generally start to melt away through this evening. but further north we do start to see the beginning of these frontal systems, bringing some cloud and some rain across northwest scotland. we also do see some drizzly showers moving into the southwest for southwest and parts of wales as well. cool though ahead of this, temperatures down into single figures in some eastern parts, and there may be a few mist and fog patches to start the day on monday too, and fairly bright and sunny if you're starting the day in the far north—east of scotland , but it is already scotland, but it is already going to be quite a cloudy picture with quite persistent rain. some of this quite heavy at times, particularly in western parts as well. northern ireland seeing a very cloudy start to the day. rain already very close by and quite drizzly conditions, wales and the southwest holding on to these very drizzly showers moving through this morning, but the central and southeastern half of england will be seeing sunshine to start the day on monday, and

quite a pleasant morning, but it won't last too long. we're going to see this cloud and rain steadily moving westwards. we're going to see drizzle and rain ahead of it, and then heavy rain arriving into the afternoon. strong southerly winds as well, particularly through the irish sea where we could see some gales as well. but ahead of that warm and humid air and we could still get 26 degrees in the far east of england, but cooler underneath this rain at best into the teens. and we do have a rain warning out as well. there could be some very difficult driving conditions with the strong wind and spray on the road as we head through the evening for south—west scotland. unsettled. then, as we head through the rest of the week with some particularly wet and windy weather across the north on wednesday and thursday, that's all from me. catch you later. >> that warm feeling inside from boxt boilers , sponsors of boxt boilers, sponsors of weather

gb news. >> good afternoon. it's 4:00. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. i'm nana akua over the next few hours, me and my panel will be taking on some of the big topics hitting the headlines right now , hitting the headlines right now, including the home secretary's new crackdown on extremism. do you believe clapping for the nhs put them on a pedestal? but first, let's get your latest news headlines . news headlines. >> good afternoon. it's 4:00. i'm sophia wenzler in the gb newsroom. it's understood over 20 people have been killed in israeli airstrikes in gaza and lebanon. iran backed hezbollah has continued firing rockets in retaliation. it comes as

israel's prime minister expressed cautious optimism about a ceasefire deal with hamas, including the release of hostages. the militant group isn't present for the talks , but isn't present for the talks, but a senior officials claim there's been no progress in reaching a deal been no progress in reaching a deal. meanwhile president biden claims he's remaining optimistic that an agreement is closer than ever. that an agreement is closer than ever . there are concerns that ever. there are concerns that the safety of the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is deteriorating after a drone strike. it caused an explosion just outside the site's protected area, although no casualties have been reported. the facility, the largest of its kind in europe, has been occupied by russian soldiers since the early stages of the war. it comes as ukraine's incursion continues into russian territory. former head of counter—terrorism at the ministry of defence, major general chip chapman , says general chip chapman, says british donated equipment is helping ukraine push back vladimir .

helping ukraine push back vladimir. putin. >> one of the things that the offensive does is establish momentum and initiative and gives more willingness to continue to support ukraine, because what you can say previously is that they were losing slowly and initially the provision of support equalised the battlefield. and now at least the momentum and initiative is with them in a tactical sense . tactical sense. >> in other news, a biotech firm that produces an mpox vaccine is ramping up production after a new strain was found in europe. the clade one b strain has been confirmed in sweden after first being detected in the democratic repubuc being detected in the democratic republic of congo. it's believed to be the most dangerous version of the disease so far. to be the most dangerous version of the disease so far . official of the disease so far. official figures reveal almost 500 people crossed the english channel yesterday. at least nine small boats made the journey following two days of no reported migrant arrivals. it brings the total number of migrants reaching uk waters so far this year to

19,000. the home office insists it's creating a new border security command to tackle the problem. the home secretary is launching a major crackdown on misogyny , saying it will be misogyny, saying it will be treated as a form of extremism. yvette cooper has ordered a review of the uk's counter—extremism strategy to determine how best to tackle threats posed by harmful ideologies. the analysis will look at hatred of women as one of the ideological trends that the government says is gaining traction in northern ireland. a convicted murderer who was on the run has now been apprehended after an urgent manhunt. david mccord was sentenced to life in prison in 2004 for the murder of his girlfriend over the weekend. police worked to trace his whereabouts. he was considered unlawfully at large and issued an appeal for the prisoner to turn himself in. police located mccord in the belfast area and he's been returned to prison . a

he's been returned to prison. a don't swim alert has been issued for a popular devon seaside town because of a sewage leak. south west water says it can't keep up with the spill, caused by a burst pipe at a nearby pumping station in exmouth. it's apologised and insists engineers are working around the clock to fix the problem. it comes after the regulator, ofwat, announced water bills will rise an average of £94 over the next five years, and that's to cover the cost of upgrading victorian age infrastructure. it was also revealed that the three water companies, not including south west water, are facing a combined fine of £168 million for failings including over sewage treatment, and donald trump went on the attack at a campaign event in pennsylvania last night, twice telling supporters he was better looking than his election rival. his opponent, kamala harris , is opponent, kamala harris, is planning a bus tour starting in pittsburgh today. the former president was delivering a speech focused on the economy

when he asked supporters if they'd mind if he went off script . those are the latest gb script. those are the latest gb news headlines for now. i'm sophia wenzler more in half an hour for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code, or go to gbnews.com forward slash alerts . forward slash alerts. >> good afternoon. it's fast approaching six minutes after 4:00. this is a gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. i'm nana akua knife crime . it's rampant in knife crime. it's rampant in this country with over 50,000 offences in the past year. since the horrendous, heartbreaking southport attack where three beautiful, defenceless children were brutally killed. there's been a litany of other attacks. only the other day we had an apparent attempted murder on an 11 year old tourist in leicester square, which, had it not been

for the quick thinking and the actions of this hero, 29 year old abdullah, who works at the tea shop near where the attack took place. we would be adding this poor soul and potentially her mother, to the death tally . her mother, to the death tally. on thursday, a 53 year old man was stabbed to death in luton. and this week the families of barnaby webber, grace o'malley—kumar and ian coates have been fighting for justice after the killing of their family members. a review published by the care quality commission or cqc, on tuesday regarding the case found a series of errors, omissions and misjudgements by mental health services. a litany of errors basically allowed a knowingly dangerous, mentally ill, sick man to roam the streets without any serious supervision. in a statement, the victims families said that the organisations involved must bear a heavy burden of responsibility . burden of responsibility. remember notting hill carnival last year? youths actually running through the streets in sadiq khan's london, brazenly carrying zombie knives and

machetes. how can you even be allowed to buy these things, let alone get away with carrying them openly? it's frightening. well, one answer to all of this you'll need to take a seat for this one. police are asking owners of zombie knives and machetes to hand them back in exchange, and give them the holder of such an object, the market value as compensation if they turn them in before the knives are banned on september the 24th this year. i mean, are you having a laugh? you heard it here, folks. cash for knives. you couldn't make it up. the police are going to be giving out cash in exchange. now i get that maybe the idiots that purchased these things are potentially of low iq. perhaps some may be mentally challenged and to carry one of these weapons, most are scared. but why pay for them to hand them back ? if when if caught after back? if when if caught after the ban the punishment should be the ban the punishment should be the deterrent. surely an amnesty before the deadline with no compensation should suffice. after all, they're not being bought for fun. i mean, why

would you want one? these knives are usually over eight inches long with serrated blades and often with some sort of arty graffiti emblazoned. the ban was put in place by the previous conservative government, one of the very few things they actually completed. and if you own one of these knives , then own one of these knives, then you've got from the 26th of august until midnight on the 23rd of september to hand it in and claim your compo. but you'll need to provide a receipt . need to provide a receipt. without that, you'd only be entitled to a tenner. honestly, apparently handing out compensation is standard practice, but because the knives were legal before the ban . but were legal before the ban. but in what clown world do we live in? where knives like that were ever allowed ? right. eight ever allowed? right. eight minutes after 4:00, before we get stuck into debates, here's what else is coming up today. home secretary yvette cooper announced a new crackdown on extremism, pledging to tackle harmful ideologies and addressing gaps with current

policies . but should misogyny be policies. but should misogyny be treated as terrorism, then are labour's policies a false economy? scrapping the winter fuel payment for pensioners, minimum service levels. repeal for strikes and private schools at risk of closure due to the vat that will be charged next yean vat that will be charged next year, as the prime minister got any answers , then the former any answers, then the former immigration minister, robert jenrick, has laid out the ten top principles for the future of the conservatives. one of them, should we get back to work as he looks to crack down on and get the party back on track, including functional nhs, seeing an end to mass migration and a total prison overhaul. all of that coming up as ever. get your thoughts, post your comments gbnews.com/yoursay . right. so gbnews.com/yoursay. right. so joining me today , a former joining me today, a former adviser to boris johnson, oscar redrup and also former labour adviser james schneider. james, it might never happen. or maybe it might never happen. or maybe it has . it might never happen. or maybe it has. right. i want to ask you your thoughts. okay. so knife

crime handing back a knife, we're going to give you money if you give back a knife. i mean, this is the beginning of a policy. this is what they're going to do. i just beggars belief that that's actually a thing. >> it does beg a belief. it sends out all the wrong signals. i know in the capital city, here in london, knife amnesty bins were often around. you can find them around kind of churches and youth clubs . and that to a youth clubs. and that to a degree makes a little bit of sense i get it. and you can just drop it off and but to actually incentivise people and kind of reward and they were technically legal when they got them. but to reward people who have purchased zombie knives, which is a very specific type, is complete insanity sends out all the wrong signals. i have to say, i work quite closely with shaun bailey , quite closely with shaun bailey, who was the conservative candidate here in london, and you know, he would have been on this issue a breath of fresh air for the city of london. and it could have been, you know, his, his absolute like zero tolerance

kind of, you know , targeting, kind of, you know, targeting, would have been a breath of fresh air, you know, places like london, you know , with sadiq london, you know, with sadiq khan's kind of, you know. well, he's laissez faire. >> he's scared. he said he's scared being a muslim in london. >> conversations. you have to be tough. you have to be so, so tough. you have to be so, so tough on it. it is genuinely scary. and it does link to the debate that we had. you know, it's, you know, the two people who were stabbed in, in leicester square. terrible. they were they were women, you know, so, so all these, you know, so you hear yvette cooper talking tough on language. okay, fine. but actually, should we not be absolutely doing everything we can to get, you know, knives out of people's hands because there is a feeling and wrongly, rightly. and i know the media have a role and these things get slightly, but there will be a feeling in certain communities of slight lawlessness in this sense. you know, you just see it. you see videos of people just wandering around the streets with these zombie knives. >> well, i mean, notting hill carnival. they were running through the streets with the knives as if it was just like

nothing. no, we're just walking. it's like . what? yeah. james. it's like. what? yeah. james. >> yeah. it's really good that these weapons, which are extremely dangerous, are being banned. and it will be illegal to sell them. and to buy them, i don't think it sounds sensible to buy them off people. i mean, i don't know, maybe there's a whole wealth of evidence that shows that actually, this is a really good thing. and it's been tried in other countries and it works. but on the face of it, it seems completely unnecessary. it's like you have this offensive weapon that we think is an offensive weapon. we don't think they should be sold because their only use is causing suffering or fear or, you know, you don't necessarily have to use the thing. you could just frighten someone with it, but it's not a good thing. and so, you know, people should get rid of them and pay the cost of having bought one in the first place. of course, if there's some evidence which suggests it's actually for reasons that we can't understand, a really good thing, then okay, i would listen to that in terms of the broader issues with youth crime

and knife crime, i think we should be looking at. yes, the tough things like banning these knives and making sure that they're not in people's hands or they're not in people's hands or they're harder to get into people's hands. and then also looking at other things, which we've got rid of basically over the last 14 years, like neighbourhood policing, like having a regular police officer that knows the area that the that knows the area that the that people in that area knows them, that you that the criminal justice system isn't. so, you know, stark black and white, that there is someone who can put a hand on someone's shoulder and say, you know, watch out. we know that you're, you know, you're starting to misbehave. speak to your family. speak to community also, all those things, you know, boxing clubs , things, you know, boxing clubs, kids and youth centres which have all been cut back . and if have all been cut back. and if we're going to talk about the tough stuff, we also need to talk about the soft stuff that goes that goes with it , because goes that goes with it, because otherwise you've just got more people who are potentially going to either be killed or kill someone or seriously injured because you're actually doing them a favour by telling them, handit

them a favour by telling them, hand it back and you won't be in trouble up till the 24th of september. >> after that, you will be in trouble for possessing it. that is the deal. there's no extra bonus for bringing it back on time. >> it's the wrong messaging. and when you accompany that with, you know, a lot of people would deem you know, quite soft policing and stuff like this on knife crime, which is why we see the instances that we do see. it's just another kind of, it's another additional point where people just look at it and go, we're not actually as a country, we're not actually as a country, we're not actually taking this particularly seriously. >> i don't think they are at all. they're not seeing it's almost like knives are not that bad. these knives are very bad. they are scary to look at. they're like the length of your arm. why? it's like a pirate knife . knife. >> and banning them and banning them does work. i mean , one them does work. i mean, one thing we're very lucky about in britain is that we have very low levels of gun crime, because guns have basically never been. we have knives. well, no, the reason why there's knife crime is because there isn't. there isn't gun crime. that's right. and as you know, we don't have

large levels of gun crime because there aren't lots of guns around. it's very hard to get hold of a gun. it's illegal and so on. and so forth. if you do the same thing with these really horrific types of knives, it should reduce the reduce the amount. >> i would do that for knives and crossbows. you know, there's no the crossbow as well. >> yeah. those case a couple of weeks ago were horrendous. >> you'd absolutely need some form of license to own such a thing if it were a crossbow, because i know that there are some people use them for performative reasons, and i know a woman who stands on her hands and she can do things with a crossbow. and i don't know, i don't know why she can get a special license for standing on her head and shooting the crossbow with her feet or whatever. there should be a licence for something like that if there is some sort of reason. but there's no reason to possess a zombie knife anyway. what do you think? gbnews.com/yoursay? 15 minutes after 4:00 here with me. i'm nana akua . we're live on me. i'm nana akua. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio at next. it's time for the great british debate this hour. and asking, are labour's policies false economy

good afternoon. 19 minutes after 4:00. if you've just tuned in, where have you been ? no. where have you been? no. welcome, welcome. sorry, this is gb news. we are britain's news channel. you can also stream the show live on youtube. i'm nana akua now. remember to vote in my poll as well on x. i'm asking will labour's plan to crack down on hateful beliefs threaten free speech? so please vote in there. we'll see what the outcome is at the end of the show. but right now it's time for the great british debate this out, and i'm asking, are labour's policies a false economy? let's start with some of them. we can address those labour plans to repeal the strikes act, which could lead to more frequent and disruptive industrial action without guaranteed service levels during the strike. and that's what the focus is on. they're removing minimum or guaranteed service levels, and at the same time, the cuts to winter fuel payments are expected to hit the most vulnerable . that is one of their

vulnerable. that is one of their plans. they're going to cut the pensions winter fuel, particularly older pensioners who do not claim pension credit. this could effectively reduce their income by 3.3%. and then we've got labour's proposal to impose 20% vat on private schools, which risked many schools, which risked many schools closing and then putting other pupils back into the state section sector, which does not have the capacity to absorb the influx. so are these policies sustainable or are they short term fixes with long term costs? the great british debate this houn the great british debate this hour. i'm asking, are labour's policies a false economy? well, joining me now former editor of the labour is peter edwards. peter, thank you very much for joining me. he's the former adviser to oh no, you're not the former adviser to boris johnson. of course you're not. right. so let's let's do this peter . let's let's let's do this peter. let's stick with the three policies for now. and then we can add other stuff in if you like. okay, let's start with the we'll start with the winter fuel allowance. everyone's talking about that. well the new government has a mandate. the deficit is over £80 billion yeah >> and they've got to make some

savings. >> and jeremy hunt, the former tory chancellor, said whoever won the election would have had to make savings and tax cuts. >> so labour has set out why they're doing it. and of course , they're doing it. and of course, you'll remember and i'm sure you've covered it. there are many millions of middle class households who were receiving a payment of 2 or £300. >> it's age dependent. it varies. once you pass the age of 80. >> and who didn't need it? now, that's not to take away from pensioner poverty, which is a very serious issue. and while we have pension credit, which works as a top up, on your income. but why would we pay the winter fuel allowance, at a time of great fiscal pressure to households that don't require it? listen peter, that's all very well, but a lot of people , the majority of a lot of people, the majority of people probably are claiming it and do need it. so for the very few very wealthy pensioners who don't need it, i doubt it will amount to the amount that they're expecting. and the other line is the problem here is that those people will then go on and claim pension credit, and i

think on that, that will cost the labour party more. and i think it was that they're likely to be, it would cost them about a 4 billion as opposed to costing them about 1.3 or 4 billion. i think it was . billion. i think it was. >> well, anyone who's concerned about inequality , which is about inequality, which is certainly me and probably most of the labour party wants the maximum number of people to claim pension credit because if you're if you're a poorer person , you're if you're a poorer person, you're if you're a poorer person, you have access to benefits. >> and if you're not taking them up and you've paid in your whole life, then that's very sad. >> and you wouldn't want someone to suffer financially . and in to suffer financially. and in terms of heating and eating, because they don't have all the facts , they need to claim what's facts, they need to claim what's owed to them. so i actually want to see pension credit claimed legitimately to the maximum, but by the poorest people rather than the middle classes claiming a benefit which they may not need. >> this is always this assumption that the middle classes are wealthy. it's just not not even true. and in particular, when it comes to social care later on. but let's move to vat on private schools, and we've got about a minute on that one with regard to that, where do you sit with that?

>> oh , well, i support the >> oh, well, i support the policy at the minute. it's not not very long to cover it. but if you think about other types of business and other types of services that are subject to vat, why would independent schools be exempt? and if something is exempt from a tax thatis something is exempt from a tax that is elsewhere in the free market economy , then it's market economy, then it's ordinary folk like me and you subsidising that. >> it's not quite true, is it? because i, you know, i'd pay a price for each pupil of about 7500 pounds that we all pay through our taxes. 7500 pounds that we all pay through our taxes . and then through our taxes. and then obviously, if our child is not going there, then we are then paying going there, then we are then paying for a private school. i would say that arguably that i deserve some sort of subsidy. listen, i'm running out of time. i've got to go. peter elle edwards, a pleasure to talk to you.thank edwards, a pleasure to talk to you. thank you so much. right. well, that's peter thoughts. what are you what are yours? what are you what are yours? what are you what are you joining me now? former adviser to boris johnson oscar redrup and former labour adviser james schneider. james schneider coming to you first. a couple of those policies, we listed three. we'll stick with those for now because those are the ones that we know they're planning to initiate the winter fuel allowance .

allowance. >> yeah, cutting. that's a big mistake. and there's in part of the labour party , especially the the labour party, especially the kind of blairite bit of the labour party. there's this obsession with means testing, which means exactly as peter said, you have to have all the information available. so if people know exactly what they're entitled to, they know how to fill in the forms, then they can then they can get everything that they, that they should get versus universal things, which covers everybody. and the idea is, if you are a higher earner or you have more money and you're getting it, you're paying that back in your taxes overall. so it reduces the inefficiency of having to have a means testing system. and you don't get cases where people who really need something but they don't know basically how to fill in the forms in order to get the support. so i think that's a that policy is a big mistake. and it's basically because there was this big black hole in the pubuc was this big black hole in the public finances which we knew about, we knew about in the election campaign. just neither party wanted to talk about it and nor did the media. then straight afterwards, we find out it's there, and there you can see the choices and the choices you could have to fill. that

would be you could either for example, have a wealth tax of the very wealthiest people in their financial assets, and you could protect other things. politics is about choices, and the choices that have been made here aren't a very good one. >> okay, oscar, on that, on that . >> okay, oscar, on that, on that. >> okay, oscar, on that, on that. >> it's i think labour kind of economic policy at the moment is a complete mess. i mean, they're fortunate they don't have a real conservative party in opposition at the moment. so stuff like the winter fuel allowance, you know, they can just kind of whack it through. it doesn't really there's no real opposition. and i know i'm not talking about the numbers in parliament. i mean, we don't i mean, yes, rishi sunakis we don't i mean, yes, rishi sunak is still well, technically , sunak is still well, technically, but we don't have a true voice to take that on. it's a complete mess. it was kind of always going to be you're seeing the stifling of ambition we all have. you know, with the vat on private schools, we have this image of, you know, the eton lads, you know, like, no, this is this is actually about, you know, working class, middle class. keir starmer is unable to define what a working person is, by the way. well he did. it's incredibly loose. it's incredibly loose. it's incredibly cringe watching him trying to do that. but but but

these are people. these are families who absolutely work tooth and nail in the name of ambition and betterment and getting their kids that private education. okay. so you know, the mess has been created there from a labour perspective. and the other thing that people, i think are going to get really sick and tired of, particularly if taxes start going up here and there, is that the and it's slightly strategically sensible for the time being. i'll give them that. but pointing at things and saying, oh, it's so much worse than we ever thought it would be. oh, the conservative mess they don't they when you're in government now and actually does that when they come into power, it's not just i get it, but when you see growth figures like last week slightly improving, when you see inflation slightly improving , inflation slightly improving, that's also going to slightly ring a little bit death on a few people, particularly on top of all of this, when they're having to they're also talking very hard on austerity . it just hard on austerity. it just doesn't match up. it doesn't make sense. it's a mess. it's

going for growth one minute. and, you know, there was a huge plinth of their electoral campaign in the summer. and at the same time austerity. and i honestly and i think i'm glad that we agree on this, james, i think the winter fuel stuff is , think the winter fuel stuff is, is just it's horrific and it's unnecessary. >> well, i'll tell you, he did actually define working person. i'll just read it to you. this is his definition on lbc. he said people who earn their living, he said, who rely on our pubuc living, he said, who rely on our public services and don't really have the ability to write a check when they get into trouble . check when they get into trouble. sorry, i'm struggling with that. i don't really nobody writes checks anymore anyway , so sorry, checks anymore anyway, so sorry, but how would he define the, you know, the middle class slash working class family who are battling, as i said, to get their kids to a good private school and spending so much of their time and money on achieving that so well. >> well , he's achieving that so well. >> well, he's one of them, is he not? >> because his dad was a toolmaker, you know, james on on

vat on private schools. oscar's made some very good points. i think . think. >> yeah i mean here i support the policy. i don't think that we should be subsidising private schools and that's what it is. it's ending the subsidy. you have vat on most things. and private schools had this exemption and now they don't. and that money will go into education for everybody. that seems like a perfectly sensible small scale reform. i mean, the thing i would say about the three policies you've picked, you've picked up. they're all they're all pretty small scale in terms of numbers relative to the economic issues that we're but little. >> no, no, no add up to be the no. sorry. >> i'm not i'm not criticising you for your selection. that's all you have to choose from. >> that's what i've done. >> that's what i've done. >> that's what i've done. >> that's right. yeah no i agree, but but this is my point is we're coming in with a new government after 14 years where most people's living standards are lower and public services are lower and public services are in a worse state, and the macro global economic outlook is

not very positive . and even if not very positive. and even if you support all three of these policies, they don't add up to they don't touch the sides to deal with what's going on. they don't touch the side to deal with. >> the point that we're making is that if this is just what they do to things that only literally don't touch the sides. god help us when they're doing deaung god help us when they're doing dealing with the in fairness, me and james in the green room beforehand, we were saying they do not at this moment in time, and yet we'll give them the benefit of the doubt because it has, you know, they haven't been in long enough, but they don't have an overarching vision or strategy. >> and if they're just over time going to talk about, yeah, we're going to talk about, yeah, we're going for growth. never going to explain to you how the hell we're going to do that. yeah, we're going to do that. yeah, we're going to raise taxes here. we're going to pick something off here. you know, x, y, z people. the electorate will get incredibly frustrated. >> well, it's like they're offending small bunches of people one at a time. so you've now upset all the pensioners. now you're upsetting a lot of people who worked really hard, who are working people actually,

who are working people actually, who have worked very hard to send their kids to private school. and obviously the schools are many of them are closing some of them are closing already. we've had two schools closed and a lot of the pupils, the a lot of the state sector is actually full. so they're not actually full. so they're not actually put anything in the state sector to accommodate for these new pupils that are now entering it. the plan was for that one to raise. i think it was 1.6 billion or 1.7 billion, and the overall education budget is about 116 billion. but that relies on a certain percentage of those kids still at those schools. and as those kids pull away, the amount they're going to make is becoming less and less. and even the obr were looking at this policy and saying, look, if it doesn't raise the money, then you really should stop it. >> well, it's as i say , it's >> well, it's as i say, it's a pretty small policy, i support it, it's a pretty small policy. i mean, i to be clear, i completely support it. i think it's a very sensible thing to remove that subsidy and put the money into the private school. yeah, i did , and i think that my yeah, i did, and i think that my parents who made that decision not me, should have not received a subsidy to do that. i think

that money should have gone back into the rest of the education system. >> don't get a subsidy for doing that. they're already paying for what they did when they paid for everything else. >> they were paying vat when they paid for this, they didn't pay they paid for this, they didn't pay vat. that's a subsidy. >> i don't believe that that becomes a subsidy. i actually think ultimately what should happenis think ultimately what should happen is that they should be they should be given some sort of benefit for spending. first of benefit for spending. first of all, the seven and a half grand which will come out of their income for other people's kids, and then also for paying all that to money send their own child to school as well. they're actually paying twice. that's what i see if i think as a government, if you're not, if you're if you're stifling ambition and at the same time you're not protecting, you know, those who are, you know, you know, old age pensioners, you get into a really sticky wicket there because at both ends of there because at both ends of the spectrum, as you said, you're you're kind of hacking people off. >> and i know these are small things and it's august and it's a new government. there isn't a real opposition to properly take it on at the moment, but if this is a pattern that emerges, they will really start to hack people off and they might be small

things, but they have real world consequences to those who they affect, in particular the children. >> and they're starting that policy in the middle of like in the middle of the school year rather than the beginning, which makes no. >> and it's slightly shape shifting as well, because to be fair, you know, and you know, as someone who worked for corbyn, lump it all, you know, like it or lump it, you you know what that ideology is and there's a belief system behind it. this is just tinkering around the edges. >> well, you've heard what they're saying and it does sound to me like politics of envy. but what do you think? gbnews.com forward slash your say i'm nana akua. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. coming up, what does the future hold for the conservative party as robert jenrick reveals his top ten priorities? maybe one of those could be perhaps get involved in what's going on in the political scene right now instead of, you know, navel gazing. but first, let's get your latest news headunes let's get your latest news headlines with sophia . headlines with sophia. >> nana. thank you. it's 432. i'm sophia wenzler in the gb newsroom. your top story this

houh newsroom. your top story this hour. it's understood at least 24 people have been killed in israeli airstrikes in gaza overnight, including some women and children. it comes as the israeli prime minister says he's cautiously optimistic about a potential ceasefire. however, a senior hamas representative says any deal is still a way off. in ukraine, safety up the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is deteriorating, according to international atomic atomic energy agency. an explosive, an explosive detonated just outside the site's protected area, which has been occupied by russian soldiers since the early stages of the war. official figures show nine migrant boats were brought ashore from the english channel yesterday, carrying almost 500 people. hundreds more have made the crossing this week, bringing the total number reaching uk waters so far this year to 19,000. the home secretary is launching a major

crackdown on misogyny , saying it crackdown on misogyny, saying it will be treated as a form of extremism. yvette cooper has ordered a review of the uk's counter—extremism strategy to determine how best to tackle threats posed by harmful ideologies. the analysis will look at hatred of women as one of the ideological trends that the government says is gaining traction . a don't swim alert has traction. a don't swim alert has been issued for exmouth beach in devon after south west water admitted it was struggling to contain a sewage leak. the firm has apologised for a burst pipe and insists engineers are working around the clock to fix the problem. and donald trump went on the attack at a campaign eventin went on the attack at a campaign event in pennsylvania last night, twice telling supporters he was better looking than his election rival. the former president was delivering a speech focused on the economy when he asked supporters if they'd mind if he went off script. >> i'm a better looking person than kamala . no i couldn't. than kamala. no i couldn't. >> his opponents are planning a

bus tour starting in pittsburgh today. >> americans head to the polls in november . >> americans head to the polls in november. those are the latest gb news how. now. i'm sophia wenzler.

>> good afternoon. it's 38 minutes after 4:00. welcome. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. i'm nana akua and it's time for the great british debate this houh the great british debate this hour. the second one of the houh hour. the second one of the hour. i'm asking, are the tory party neglecting their brief robert jenrick has laid out the top ten principles for the future of the conservatives, as he looks to get the party back on track. warning that the tories must rebuild far more quickly than after their previous landslide election defeat in 1997, and some of his top priorities include a fully functioning nhs saying we must make it deliver an end to

illegal migration and a total prison overhaul, focusing on putting away repeat offenders for longer to and cut crime rates. and in principle, these are good. but can they actually deliver them? does anyone really care? joining me now is former adviser to boris johnson , oscar adviser to boris johnson, oscar red drop. also former labour adviser james schneider. red drop. also former labour adviserjames schneider. i want adviser james schneider. i want to come to you, oscar, first of all. and ask you that that question directly. are they neglecting their brief, >> i think the nhs, in terms of. sorry, sorry. i think look, the tory party are i think we described it again off air. it is inevitably a little bit navel gazing at the moment they're talking to. i mean, these candidates are literally talking to the people who ultimately would make them leader of the party. i think robert jenrick stance on stuff, i think one, there's early momentum with him. he his critics and this is really interesting, his critics in the media, and they're always anonymous sources and blah blah blah, saying he's quite chameleon like in terms of all

of a sudden he found these, you know, right wing virtues. and, you know, on immigration, actually, that chameleon quality is often something that is actually in some ways what the party needs. and because you can look at it very negatively, that but that's actually quite unifying and actually for opponents and maybe a future, you know keir starmer across the despatch box, if he is quite hard to pin down. that's quite a powerful thing in politics, i'd argue keir starmer has has a similar quality to him, i think that this is a first public test. >> well, it's a quality in terms of the fact that he never seemed to answer a direct question, so he seemed to get away with never answering the questions. but for the electorate, it's no, it's a bad thing. >> but he can marry. he has shown that one nation side to him. and you know, recently he's talking much tougher on things like immigration. and so there are parts of the party that could probably lend him a bit of trust. i think, however, and this is a slight this is a more general challenge for the party. one, the country isn't really

ready to listen to the conservatives yet. they have to accept that that takes humility, and secondly, this leadership contest, they have to get it right. they have to do it again with humility and get on with it. exactly. get on with it. do it. exactly. get on with it. do it sensibly. do it calmly. because if we fail this test as a party, it's over. it's over. and it could be quite even in the short term, getting this contest all wrong. and you know, it looks unprofessional. it could be quite embarrassing. >> it's all, well, i don't know how much more embarrassment you can get. well, quite. james james. >> well, no one's really paying attention. which tells you almost what you need to know about it . after 14 years of about it. after 14 years of government and, you know, to be honest, probably the worst 14 years we've been governed in terms of people's pay and living standards and services , i think standards and services, i think oscar is right. they'll need some humility. but they also do. i mean, from a like basic politics point of view, they need to be clear about what they're from and where they're what they're for and what their dividing lines are, and maybe

it's because it seems like it's only taking place in the pages of the, of the telegraph and nowhere else, this leadership campaign at the moment, i'm not really seeing it, but i haven't seen what the different candidates stand for, what marks them out as a different option relative to keir starmer. and then from a tory point of view, i imagine you've got the elephant in the room, which is you've got the conservative party and you've got reform. and if they are divided going into the next election, then they won't win. and if they come together in some kind of way, well, either the voters or the parties , if keir starmer carries parties, if keir starmer carries on with this, this stuff that he's doing, he might haemorrhage, for example, in the election, in the 2019 election, when the conservatives won reform, voters voted for the conservatives in 2024, reform voters didn't vote for the conservatives, they voted for reform. the conservatives fell back massively and lost. you know, an epic number of epic number of seats. ukip you what? >> sorry ukip voters. >> sorry ukip voters. >> you whatever didn't exist. >> you whatever didn't exist. >> i'm just, you know, they were

ukip voters, wasn't it? >> no. i mean, in 2024, they voted this one. yeah. and this one.the voted this one. yeah. and this one. the one that we the one that we just had. and also, yeah, you can see the difference between 2015 and 2017 and 2015. there were i can't remember the number, but it might have been 4 million people who voted ukip , million people who voted ukip, something like that. by 2017. those had all cohered within the conservative party. so they need to have a strategy that is able to have a strategy that is able to look in both directions, look to look in both directions, look to how they can cohere the right and to look out to the country, which requires some political skill. and from the ones that i've seen so far, i can't really see any of them doing it. >> there are enough voters for all of these parties to exist . all of these parties to exist. and i would say, i would argue that the brief of form is not the same as the brief of the conservatives, because the conservatives, because the conservatives are not towards the right at all. in fact, i would say that they are more like liberal democrats and they are close to the left . so i j are close to the left. so i j i think they are . think they are. >> i love, i love, i love, i

love how we're always saying no. the representatives of our side, they've got nothing to do with us. i'm saying no, this is a centre right labour government. you're saying, oh yeah, rishi sunak, he's a left winger. boris johnson, basically a communist, you know. >> well, i wouldn't go as far as what i think a lot of conservatives and let's not forget and this might sound like a controversial thing to say, but it shouldn't be. >> by and large, the united kingdom is a small c conservative country, so the votes are there. james doesn't like that at all. >> no, no, no, i completely disagree. >> if he thinks we're a communist country, we're a small communist country, we're a small c conservative country in terms of our values generally speaking. >> so the people are out there. the votes are there. it can be very, very doom and gloom to be a conservative right now. but i think what a lot of people want these leaders to candidate leadership candidates to eventually get to a place of is the labour party in 2019 were decimated . and, you know, it was decimated. and, you know, it was it was it was a really, really tough election for them. they had a good 1 in 2017 and the wheels did fall off. and look at it now. politics is a little bit

more volatile at the moment. and so a leader once they once they can let the membership and you know, the general public think i can unify this party. i think we want to see the vision. i want to see the vision, at least to actually, you know what, next election, we can win it. >> yeah. well, that that may well be the case, but right now well be the case, but right now we have issues and the conservative party are not talking about them. they're navel gazing about who the leader will be. and even though they have, what is it, 124 seats or something like that? why they are not engaging in politics. and rishi sunak, the leader of the conservative party right now, is off somewhere in america. i guess i do get it that it's the recess and a lot of them are. but, you know, i think the country needs some sort of opposition and some sort of something else, not just the labour party just literally doing whatever they want , which doing whatever they want, which they can effectively do. but still, we want to hear something. >> well, i mean, that is our system. i mean, i think our system. i mean, i think our system should change, but that is our system. labour have got an absolute enormous majority and can do near enough what they

like and keir starmer has a pretty free hand. the issue is what is he going to do with it? and from everything that we've seen so far, it's a pretty i mean, in fact, i think the analysis showed it was the smallest manifesto in terms of tax and spend changes that there being from any of the major parties for decades. so you've got a government with a huge majority with a small programme. and that's where the political space is, i think both normally to its left and to its right, to give some kind of alternative. and if the conservative party isn't doing it, something to its right will. and i think forjust right will. and i think for just to come in just quickly, briefly 20s, we get very, very obsessed about right, left and elections have to be won in the centre ground. >> you know, iain duncan smith put it very, very well, quite recently. it's actually the common ground. that's what we have to focus on as a conservative party. >> you need to focus on common sense. and i think that you'll win. that will win hands down right . well what do you think, right. well what do you think, gbnews.com/yoursay? i will read some of those in just a moment.

coming up in the next hour, my interview, i'll be speaking to emma webber . she's the mother of emma webber. she's the mother of nottingham attack victim weather. webber. you will

good afternoon. welcome. it's just coming up to ten minutes to 5:00. i'm nana akua. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. don't forget as well, you can stream the show live on youtube right now. before the break, we were discussing robert jenrick top principles for the future of the conservatives. but are the party's neglecting their brief? while this show is nothing without you and your views, let's welcome our great british voice, their opportunity to be on the show and tell us what they think about the topics we're discussing today. i've got dan bryan in hull. dan bryan, what do you think the conservative party, are they neglecting their brief? i mean, i haven't heard anything really from them apart from who's going to lead it . to lead it. >> well, exactly. and i've been

saying this for a while now, >> that the conservatives haven't been conservative for many, many years. >> they've had 14 years to reduce the size of the state, and the state has grown, interferes into our lives more than it ever has. they've had 14 years to do the levelling up thing that said, they were going to do. and yet still there's this disparity between all the cities and they like prince harry and that woman. they look down the camera and lie through their teeth and as, as a viewer watching them. when they're in interviews, they just lie and lie and lie, and we're absolutely sick to the back teeth of it , because they've had teeth of it, because they've had 14 years to implement these policies, and they never have, >> yeah. but some people might say that they do need to get the leadership and the candidate right. so they should take a bit of time on that. but in the meantime, can they not multitask? >> well, yes. but what have they been doing for the last 14 years is my point. yes. we go through different leaders. >> yes they change. i mean,

we've had five different leaders, haven't we, since 2010, given given what was going on politically. so yes, that that does happen within parties. but there's no reason why the party itself can't actually stick to itself can't actually stick to its principles of conservatism. small c conservatism , like what small c conservatism, like what your guest was saying, i do believe this country is a small c conservative country, and many people on the right and many people on the right and many people on the left agree with those principles. and there is the votes there for it. however, nobody is there representing us. >> well. yeah, exactly. and rishi sunak, he's somewhere in la in a five star michelin restaurant. thank you so much dan brian really good to talk to you. that's dan bryan. he's our great british voice. he's inaya. what a lovely smile . right. well what a lovely smile. right. well lots of you have been getting in touch with your views. let's see what you've been saying. anne marie says nana if misogyny is to be treated as extreme ideology, we're talking about misogyny. who gets to decide what is extreme and what is? what's the ideology is i was the victim of abuse for years, and even i'm not sure whether he hates women in general or me in

particular. also, much violence is often learned behaviour , say is often learned behaviour, say a violent father or school bullies, which i would say is not a terrorist nature as is suggested. there is no need to reclassify the crime, the laws and sentencing are there. if only they would use them properly. also, if this is reclassified , which group next? reclassified, which group next? pretty soon we could all be branded as terrorists for misgendering. i think this idea belongs in the well—intended but stupid idea pile. thank you for that. that's right, richard says typical new conservative. i don't want to hear their one nafion don't want to hear their one nation party. i want a party that has the policies that the conservatives used to tell us they had, and that is now reform, what else have we got ? reform, what else have we got? oh, here we go. catherine says these people were regarding private schools. catherine says these people that choose to send their kids to private schools free up space for the rest. so to lump vat onto them is just pure jealousy. and very quickly, this one, if james's argument

this one, if james's argument this from john, if james's argument were to be applied to the whole education sector, that would be payable on nursery school and university fees. yes. very good point. well, thank you so much for your comments. keep them coming. gbnews.com forward slash your say we're live on tv, onune slash your say we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. next the interview with emma webber. she's the mother of nottingham attack victim barnaby webber . nottingham attack victim barnaby webber. please nottingham attack victim barnaby webber . please stay nottingham attack victim barnaby webber. please stay tuned for that one that is on the way in a couple of moments. time but first, let's get an update with your weather with amy carter. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on gb news . news. >> hello and welcome to your latest gb news, weather update from the met office. sunny spells continuing through sunday with a couple of showers further north, but it is all change as we move into monday with some rain arriving. and that's from these frontal systems out in the

atlantic. but first, we do have a ridge of high pressure firmly across at least the southern half of the uk. it's having quite a settled afternoon, so plenty of sunshine around. there is some cloud around, but that will generally start to melt away through this evening. but further north we do start to see the beginning of these frontal systems, bringing some cloud and some rain across northwest scotland. we also do see some drizzly showers moving into the southwest for southwest and parts of wales as well. cool though ahead of this, temperatures down into single figures in some eastern parts, and there may be a few mist and fog patches to start the day on monday too. and fairly bright and sunny if you're starting the day in the far north—east of scotland, but it is already going to be quite a cloudy picture with quite persistent rain. some of this quite heavy at times, particularly in western parts as well. northern ireland seeing a very cloudy start to the day. rain already very close by and quite drizzly conditions. wales and the southwest holding on to these very drizzly showers moving through this morning, but the central and southeastern half of england will be seeing some fine to start the day on monday, and

quite a pleasant morning. but it won't last too long. we're going to see this cloud and rain steadily moving westwards. we're going to see drizzle and rain ahead of it and then heavy rain arriving into the afternoon. strong southerly winds as well , strong southerly winds as well, particularly through the irish sea where we could see some gales as well. but ahead of that warm and humid air and we could still get 26 degrees in the far east of england. but cooler underneath this rain at best into the teens. and we do have a rain warning out as well. there could be some very difficult driving conditions with the strong wind and spray on the road as we head through the evening. for southwest scotland, unsettled then as we head through the rest of the week with some particularly wet and windy weather across the north on wednesday and thursday, that's all from me. catch you later . later. >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> good afternoon. it's just coming up to 5:00. this is gb news. we're live on tv , online news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio for the next hour. me and my panel will be taking on some of the big topics hitting the headlines right now, including the home secretary's new crackdown on extremism. do you believe that clapping for the nhs puts them on a pedestal? joining me oscar redrup and also james schneider. but first let's get your latest news headlines . news headlines. >> good afternoon. it's 5:00. i'm sophia wenzler in the gb newsroom . your top story this newsroom. your top story this houh newsroom. your top story this hour. it's understood over 20 people have been killed in israeli airstrikes in gaza and lebanon. iran backed hezbollah has continued firing rockets in retaliation. it comes as israel's prime minister expressed cautious optimism about a ceasefire deal with hamas , including for the release

hamas, including for the release of hostages. the militant group isn't present for the talks, but a senior officials claimed there's been no progress in reaching a deal. there's been no progress in reaching a deal . meanwhile, reaching a deal. meanwhile, president biden claims he's remaining optimistic that an agreement is closer than ever , agreement is closer than ever, and us secretary of state antony blinken is due to arrive in israel shortly. in his latest effort to push for a ceasefire and hostage release deal . there and hostage release deal. there are concerns that the safety of the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is deteriorating after a drone strike. it caused an explosion just outside the site's protected area . although site's protected area. although no casualties have been reported, the facility, the largest of its kind in europe, has been occupied by russian soldiers since the early stages of the war. it comes as ukraine's incursion continues into russian territory. former head of counter—terrorism at the ministry of defence, major general chip chapman, says british donated equipment is helping ukraine push back vladimir putin.

>> one of the things that the offensive does is establish momentum and initiative and gives more willingness to continue to support ukraine, because what you can say previously is that they were losing slowly and initially the provision of support equalised the battlefield and now at least the battlefield and now at least the momentum and initiative is with them in a tactical sense. >> in other news, a biotech firm that produces an mpox vaccine is ramping up production after a new strain was found in europe. the clade one b strain has been confirmed in sweden after first being detected in the democratic repubuc being detected in the democratic republic of congo. it's believed to be the most dangerous version of the disease so far. to be the most dangerous version of the disease so far . official of the disease so far. official figures reveal almost 500 people crossed the english channel yesterday. at least nine small boats made the journey following two days of no reported migrant arrivals. it brings the total number of migrants reaching uk waters so far this year to 19,000. the home office insists it's creating a new border

security command to tackle the problem. the home secretary is launching a major crackdown on misogyny, saying it will be treated as a form of extremism. yvette cooper has ordered a review of the uk's counter—extremism strategy to determine how to best tackle threats posed by harmful ideologies. the analysis will look at hatred of women as one of the ideological trends that the government says is gaining traction in northern ireland. a convicted murderer who was on the run has now been apprehended after an urgent manhunt. david mccord was sentenced to life in prison in 2004 for the murder of his girlfriend over the weekend. police worked to trace his whereabouts. he was considered unlawfully at large and issued an appeal for the prisoner to turn himself in. police located mccord in the belfast area, and he's been returned to prison. a don't swim alert has been issued for a popular devon seaside town because of a sewage leak. south

west water says it can't keep up with the spill, caused by a burst pipe at a nearby pumping station in exmouth. it's apologised and insists engineers are working around the clock to fix the problem. it comes after the regulator , ofwat, announced the regulator, ofwat, announced water bills will rise in average of £94 over the next five years to cover the cost of upgrading victorian age infrastructure. it was also revealed that three water companies, not including south west water, are facing a combined fine of £168 million for failings including over sewage treatment. and donald trump went on an attack at a campaign event in pennsylvania last night, twice telling supporters he was better looking than his election rival. his opponent, kamala harris, is planning a bus tour starting in pittsburgh today. the former president was delivering a speech focused on the economy when he asked supporters if they'd mind if he went off script . i'm a better looking script. i'm a better looking person than kamala .

person than kamala. >> no, i couldn't believe it, she said. you know, i had never heard that one. we're not going to let this socialist lunatic and she's a socialist lunatic. that's the other thing. please, sir. please don't call her a lunatic. i said, but that's what she is. she's a lunatic. >> those are the latest gb news headunes >> those are the latest gb news headlines for now. i'm sophia wenzler more in half an hour for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code, or go to gbnews.com forward slash alerts . forward slash alerts. >> good afternoon. it's just coming up to six minutes after 5:00. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. i'm nana akua and for the next hour, me and my panel will be taking on some of the big topics hitting the headunes the big topics hitting the headlines right now. this show is all about opinion. it's mine. it's theirs. and of course it's

yours. we'll be debating, discussing and at times we will disagree, but no one will be cancelled. so joining me today is former adviser to boris johnson, oscar redrup and also former labour adviser james schneider. still not smiling. still to come, the home secretary has announced a new crackdown on extremism, pledging to tackle harmful ideologies and address gaps in the current policies. but should extreme misogyny be treated as terrorism? then for the interview, i'll be joined by emma webber, the mother of the victim of the tragic attack in nottingham in june 2023. stay tuned for the great british debate this hour. i'm asking, do you believe clapping for the nhs? put them on a pedestal? health ombudsman has warned that treating the nhs like a national religion during the pandemic may have had a dangerous repercussion and as ever, send me your thoughts, post your comments @gbnews dot com forward slash kwasi . so the government slash kwasi. so the government announced extreme misogyny will

be treated as a form of extremism under new government plans. home secretary yvette cooper says that there have been a rise in extremism, both online and on our streets , and she'll and on our streets, and she'll review the uk's counter extremism strategy to determine how best to deal with it. well, gb news reporter ray addison brought us this . brought us this. >> well, the home office is calling this new initiative sprint, and it's been described by the home secretary as a strategic reset on how government tackles harmful or hateful activity. now, that could be online, or it could be something that you've overheard in the street. basically, it's anything that promotes violence or undermines democracy. and the home office is very keen to stress that they will be looking at things such as the rise of what they call the far right, and also islamist extremism here in the uk. however, what's really caught the attention of the public is this concept of

the public is this concept of the clampdown on extreme misogyny. now, of course, that is the dislike, contempt or prejudice towards women and girls. now under these proposals, teachers could be legally required to refer pupils that they suspect of extreme misogyny to prevent. of course, thatis misogyny to prevent. of course, that is the government organisation that tries to intervene and deal with young people who could be involved or getting involved in terrorism or extremism. and the hope is that by doing that, they will help to address violence against women and girls in society. now, the pubuc and girls in society. now, the public has been asking a number of questions related to this story. they're saying, well, who would define whether these comments are classed as misogynistic? who would define whether they are classed as extreme? and of course, there have been concerns we've seen them in recent weeks. related to

this term. two tier policing, depending upon what side of the argument somebody might find themselves on. this was a labour manifesto, manifesto commitment, so we shouldn't be surprised that it has been brought in and the home secretary says it's badly needed because the government's countering extremism strategy has not been updated since 2015. >> so i'm asking will labour's plan to crack down on hateful beliefs threaten free speech thatis beliefs threaten free speech that is on x right now? let's get the thoughts of social media expert alan stevens. alan, a lot of people are pointing out, welcome to the programme. thank you for joining welcome to the programme. thank you forjoining me. thank welcome to the programme. thank you for joining me. thank you. good afternoon. a lot of people are pointing out that where the line is, where is the line for extremism? and if that is the case, then is there a chance that ultimately what you'll end up doing is policing free speech? >> well, effectively, yes, that is a risk. nana because, you know, someone's got to make a judgement on this. i mean, a lot of this is on social media,

which is what i, what i observe a great deal. >> and what does it mean if somebody looks at something, if somebody looks at something, if somebody retweets a joke, for example, could that be misogyny? i mean, there is a serious problem here. we do know that a quarter of 13 to 15 year old boys are. >> see, andrew tate in a positive light. >> he is currently awaiting charges, as we know, in romania, on various serious charges . on various serious charges. >> so there is an issue here. >> so there is an issue here. >> but at the end of the day, somebody's got to make a judgement on it. >> well, that's the thing. but the question is who's going to make that judgement and will they be leaning more to the left perspective. which means that, as somebody pointed out on gbnews.com/yoursay, they pointed out that what if you misgender someone that could suddenly be seen as some form of hate speech and extremism? if you do not subscribe to the certain ideologies that are the accepted narratives of the day. >> well, you're right, of course. i mean , extremism course. i mean, extremism literally means taking an extreme view and having an extreme view and having an extreme view and having an extreme view doesn't necessarily mean a bad thing. >> you could be just extreme about something. >> however , somebody needs to >> however, somebody needs to draw a line. i think what we need are some examples, and we need are some examples, and we

need people to say, for example, this is misogynistic, this is not this is hate speech. this is not this is hate speech. this is not because people don't know where they are. and i think it's particularly true on social media with people retweeting or reposting content that they think is okay, and suddenly they find that they're the people in trouble. >> yeah, i think that's going a bit far to me, that is extreme. if somebody retweets something in particular because you don't know what's on the thread of that retweet. so it's difficult to then, you know, you retweet one thing, but on the thread it could say something misogynistic, something hateful and all this stuff. so i actually don't think that's fair. someone retweets something i think we need to just let it go. depending on how severe the retweet is. but again, here we are in the same place working out what is allowed and what isn't. do you think that perhaps. sorry. go on. >> no, no. go on. the thing is, we're always in the same boat, aren't we? >> that somebody's got to draw a line. someone's got to make a judgement. is retweeting a hateful post a hateful act in itself? well it certainly is. >> if you add something to it, like i agree or i endorse this, or i would say this is a good thing, but if you're retweeting

it, it might be because you dislike it and you want your friends to comment on it. >> you're starting a debate. so we've got to be very careful how we've got to be very careful how we police this. >> well, yeah, i think elon musk has taken away the ability for you to see who's liked what. i think he's done something like that. so you can't work out if somebody liked a post, which i think is fair because a lot of people make a mistake, you read a post one time and you go, oh, hang on, and then you've liked it, and then you may lose where you are. and that's not right. but so what? what in your view should would be a better approach in terms of dealing with misogynistic content and people, because there is a level ihave people, because there is a level i have a level of agreement with yvette cooper in terms of radicalisation of people online, and i have a level of agreement with her that andrew tate is somebody who appears to be quite misogynistic and does appear to have sort of garnered a view of a lot of young people. so what do you think should. what would you propose as a different approach? >> well, i think we do need the approach. >> i think we need people to be policed. >> what i would suggest is that we have we have some examples. so obviously it takes a while to

build up case law. once you've built up case law, then you know where you are. but certainly we're going to have to see some prosecutions. we're going to have to see some cases brought to court and judgements made about what is and what is not misogynistic, because unless people see where that line is, it's going to be impossible for them to avoid stepping over it from time to time. so i think examples and case law are the way forward. >> and in your view then are the policies or the review that yvette cooper is putting together. do you feel there's a level of really attack on free speech? do you feel? because if you look at some of the other labour party policies, some of those things require for require. sorry, i've lost my train of thought. now where was i going with that? sorry. what were we talking about? who are you? what's going on? oh. go on. just, just just tell me what you want. >> i think, yes, to some extent, it could be seen as an attack on free speech. i mean, i don't want to get into the political left and right side of this, but nevertheless, there is there is a sense that people aren't allowed to say things that they want to say or things that they

used to be able to say, and that doesn't mean that everything we said in the past was great. there were some terrible things that people said back in the day, but i think that there does need to be a certain amount of freedom, of latitude, of allowing people to, to make something clear, to say without actually they're not actually causing hate. they're really making a comment, you know, and the line is difficult to draw. but i think we need to be a bit careful about where that line is at the moment and allow people maybe a warning rather than take them straight to court. >> all right. lovely. thank you so much, alan stevens, social media expert. really good to talk to you. well, joining me now, my panel to get their thoughts on on that. so joining me now i've got oscar redrup and also oh we talked to panel about no all right. fair enough. let's go for a break

not. good afternoon. 17 minutes after 5:00. welcome this is gb news.

i'm nana akua. we're live on tv , i'm nana akua. we're live on tv, onune i'm nana akua. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. next. now it is time for the interview. and this week i'm joined by the mother of the victim from the tragic attack in nottingham june last year. so joining me now is emma webber. emma, thank you so much for joining me. really good to talk to you now, emma. so this week was a very important week because we had the, the event with the care quality commission, the review when we got the results of that. so can can you talk us through what happened and what the outcome was . was. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> so it's called a section 48, >> so it's called a section 48, >> which was requested by the then health secretary, victoria atkins, back in, gosh, january of this year, there were three parts to the section 48, which is an urgent review, and two parts were the trust itself and

how they were dealing with adult mental health patients. their secure unit at rampton or repton, something like that. it's called. and then the third part was, was, for the very first time, actually, this has never been done before. was into the care of a patient, which is, a valdo calocane. so the outcome was on monday. it was utterly damning, the, the now health sukh. excuse me, the now health secretary's words , it was secretary's words, it was catastrophic and alarming , with catastrophic and alarming, with failures throughout . so we've failures throughout. so we've known for a few weeks because we did have prior knowledge of it, but it was still i think it was worse when it was when it was live in the public, aware of the horror as well. and it just never stops. and then on the back of the previous night, panorama had done a, a half hour special with without any, prior contact or, use of us as families. it was it was calocane's family. so yeah, it's been a, been a bit of a week. >> how do you feel about what

you heard there? because as you and i would agree with you 100%, you said that these people, these these people are supposed to be keeping calocane in check. they've got blood on their hands. because this seems to be a narrative in terms of mental health that we don't seem to be realising. well, it's somebody in charge knows how dangerous someone is, but they let these people out and they let them run riot. >> he he was discharged, >> he he was discharged, >> at the end , towards the end, >> at the end, towards the end, in the autumn of 2022. and he was discharged with no risk assessment, no face to face intervention, or meeting him , he intervention, or meeting him, he was discharged on the basis that he hadn't turned up for, i think it was two appointments, and therefore he was he was discharged back into the community, to the gp, and nothing was done. so like you say, he was left and he did go on that rampage , but it's been on that rampage, but it's been escalating since his diagnosis in 2020. it wasn't that one failure. it was, catastrophic on

so many levels. this is an individual that had been sectioned four times for violent offences, and at least two of those sections weren't at the right level. they were a section two. and it should have been a section three. so that makes a very big difference apparently to the treatment and the length of stay, this is a manipulative person. as we've spoken before, we firmly believe he's a he's he's a dangerous, evil person, and he's calculated and he knew what he was doing. that being said, he was also very seriously mentally unwell, but it was his choice not to take his medication. and that's another thing that's come out of it. in the horrific sentencing hearing we had to sit through in nottingham, we had the eminent expert doctors, particularly the one from the crown prosecution, service, state that he was treatment resistant . therefore treatment resistant. therefore it was inappropriate that he would be in a prison because he wouldn't respond to treatment. what? and therefore we had to go to where he is now in a secure

unit because he would need this next level of intensive drug, this sort of anti—psychotic drug, would it actually transpire is another thing we found from from this week's report was that he wasn't treatment resistant. he was just resisting taking treatment. so he didn't take his medication. he stockpiled them. he lied and he manipulated . but he now that he manipulated. but he now that he's in the secure unit, he isn't on the said extreme level, one that he's needed. he's on the one that he was prescribed before, and now his violent tendencies have abated somewhat. so you know, we are just it's hard to put into words. it's such failures and it's so heartbreaking and it's so tragic, but it's not isolated to him. i think it's endemic and it's systemic failures in our mental health services. and it's, you know, when it happens again , not if, well, well, it's again, not if, well, well, it's always happening, isn't again, not if, well, well, it's always happening , isn't it? always happening, isn't it? >> i mean, literally the day i think it was that on, on the

tuesday somebody was attacked by someone with a knife in london and it just seems to be that this is just a continual crime. and i, we don't know what kind of person this was in terms of his mental state. but there's an argument that anybody who does thatis argument that anybody who does that is not mentally well. now were there not also, was there not also one of the medical professionals who said that this man will kill with regard to calocane and yet nothing was done? >> yeah. and i would question that medical professional. well, if you were so concerned, what did you do? we've asked for much more detail which the nhs, are undertaking an independent, investigation, which they , which investigation, which they, which is sort of outsourced. so it's not internal, and we've now appued not internal, and we've now applied an awful lot more questions and that's one of them, i think we, you know, we understand, the mental health aspect we've never disputed.

well but we are hearing the family say on monday evening in panorama that they weren't aware of his diagnosis, until after. i mean, this is somebody who's been mentally unwell for. well, it's three it's over three years, by the time he murdered my son, and his mum's a registered nurse, so i struggle to believe with four sections and everything that was going on that they didn't know as well. so there's, so there's so there's never one single point of failure in a disaster. it's a culmination of many different errors and failures. and yes, of course, it's the it's the nhs, it's the mental health trust that have failed most catastrophically. but i think there are questions to be had much further. there are so many missed opportunities within the police to police forces that we're still struggling to get, proper terms of reference for their investigations. it's overwhelming and it's hard to know to where begin when talking

to you and talking to the media. it's everywhere. there were horrific mistakes and failures and poor errors of judgement. that has led to my 19 year old boy being brutally murdered . and boy being brutally murdered. and there he is. >> oh, beautiful young man as well . it's >> oh, beautiful young man as well. it's just great. yeah, they're such good people. just taken for no reason other than sheer incompetence by professionals who know , who knew professionals who know, who knew the reality that this man was not safe on the streets of this country or anywhere. >> no. and the it's there's so much more is going to come out. and thank god we've got the support of an amazing legal team because i don't i don't know how we would continue the three families with all we've had to suffer in the last year, but the sheer levels of incompetence and policing in investigations, in the criminal justice system, in the criminal justice system, in the cps, within the nhs, it's,

it's utterly overwhelming. and |, it's utterly overwhelming. and i, i really do hope that we actually will be able to make a difference with this tragedy, because it's happened and it's happening again and again and we've been contacted. i've personally been contacted by, lots of people this week, with one exception. they were all very positive, very supportive, but but in particular, one of the families from one of the girls in southport asking emma, how do you cope? how do you deal with this horror? it's awful. but also quite a number of people who have got mental illness , mental health, illness illness, mental health, illness themselves or family members who are very worried about their about their loved ones who are not being treated properly. so, you know, it's i can't i can't carry cases for anybody else. but what i can do is try and use this tragedy to highlight it and give any pointers that i can, because it has to be addressed because it has to be addressed because it has to be addressed because it will happen again. that's the worst thing .

that's the worst thing. >> now, what are your thoughts on this particular issue? the police are asking people to hand back knives and zombie knives and things like that , and then and things like that, and then they're going to give them money for the knives or whatever the person paid for the knife. there's sort of a knife amnesty where you get cash for knives, do you think that then after september 24th, then these knives will then be illegal? do you think that that is an efficient and effective way of partly trying to get knives off the street ? the street? >> i think that there are so many strands. it's such a complex, problem. we have an epidemic of knife crime in this country. america has gun crime. we have knife crime , and the we have knife crime, and the legislation has to change. i think that there has to be some very challenging searching questions about stop and search, it's all parts of, of society that are affected. you know, my son was walking home from a night out, and this is somebody who, had stockpiled his weapons

and had planned the attack, and he hid in the shadows for ten minutes, waiting for my son. he then used a van an hour or so later to, to use it as a murder weapon, but then we've also got on the other end of the spectrum, we've got, you know, young people carrying knives because they feel scared, because they feel scared, because they feel they can't leave the house without them, because they're in county lines or it's drugs or it's gang related. so i think that that was the last, that was that was 20, 21 new years eve. bless his heart , but it's so hard to see heart, but it's so hard to see his pictures, but it's such a it we have to do something about it because i don't have the answers. and i think changing the law is one thing. it must be illegal to carry a knife. absolutely. every household in this country has a lethal weapon in their kitchen. and that's the. and that's the scary thing is, is how how do we how do we go back and how do we unwind. so

i'd welcome any change because if it saves one life, then it saves one life. but, it's not something we can just talk about. and the government take urgent action. you we hear words, we hear sentences, and they almost. they're like white noise. i think it's actions that are counting. and we're we're expecting to meet with yvette cooper over the next few weeks. we've already met with the attorney general who's promised attorney general who's promised a public inquiry. and we've met with wes streeting. and obviously in the past we've we've met with, keir starmer himself. so we need to continue that. but it's hard because it's, you know, when, when do we begin to grieve? i don't know, but i'm not prepared to stop until the people that are responsible are held to account, but also until the public, in our country are made safe. and as much as possible. >> emma, thank you so much for talking to me. i really appreciate that you are amazing, as are all the families , and i as are all the families, and i think that you we need justice and something needs to happen

about the whole criminal justice system because it's abhorrent. it's very disjointed . and we it's very disjointed. and we will if we do not do something about it, we'll we will carry on having people like that awful man just roaming our streets. emma webber, really good to talk to you . thank you so much for me. to you. thank you so much for me. that was, of course, emma webber. she's the mother of barnaby weather webber, who, along with grace o'malley—kumar andian along with grace o'malley—kumar and ian coates, was tragically killed in a knife attack by valdo calocane in nottingham. the families of the victims say they will continue to fight for justice and lasting change, but right now it's just coming up to half past five. this is gb news. we're live on tv, online and digital radio still to come, the great british debate. i'm asking, do you believe clapping for the nhs put them on a pedestal ? you'll hear the pedestal? you'll hear the thoughts of my panel, james schneider and oscar redrup. but first, let's get your latest . news. >> it's 530. i'm sophia wenzler in the gb newsroom. it's

understood at least 24 people have been killed in israeli airstrikes in gaza overnight, including some women and children. us secretary of state antony blinken has just arrived in israel to push for a ceasefire and hostage release dealin ceasefire and hostage release deal in gaza. it comes as the israeli prime minister says he's cautiously optimistic about a potential ceasefire. however a senior hamas representative says any deal is still a way off. in ukraine, safety at the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant is deteriorating, according to the international atomic energy agency. an explosive detonated just outside the site's protected area , which has been protected area, which has been occupied by russian soldiers since the early stages of the war. official figures show nine migrant boats were brought ashore from the english channel yesterday, carrying almost 500 people. hundreds more have made the crossings this week, bringing the total number reaching uk waters so far this year to 19,000. the home

secretary is launching a major crackdown on misogyny, saying it will be treated as a form of extremism. yvette cooper has ordered a review of the uk's counter—extremism strategy to determine how to best tackle threats posed by harmful ideologies. the analysis will look at hatred of women as one of the ideological trends that the government says is gaining traction. a don't swim alert has been issued for exmouth beach in devon after south west water admitted it was struggling to contain a sewage leak. the firm has apologised for a burst pipe and insists engineers are working around the clock to fix the problem. and donald trump went on the attack at a campaign eventin went on the attack at a campaign event in pennsylvania last night, twice telling supporters he was better looking than his election rival. the former president was delivering a speech focused on the economy when he asked supporters if they'd mind if he went off script. i'm a better looking person than kamala . looking person than kamala. >> no i couldn't.

>> no i couldn't. >> his opponents are planning a bus tour starting in pittsburgh today. americans head to the polls in november. those are the latest gb news headlines for now. i'm sophia wenzler. more in half an hour for the very latest gb news direct to your smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code , alerts by scanning the qr code, or go to gbnews.com forward alerts

>> good afternoon. if you've just tuned in, where have you been? what have you been doing? it's just coming towards the end of the show. it's 36 minutes after 5:00. i'm nana akua this is gb news. we're live on tv, onune is gb news. we're live on tv, online and on digital radio. it's time now for the great british debate. this hour. it's time now for the great british debate. this hour . and british debate. this hour. and i'm asking, do you believe clapping for the nhs puts them on a pedestal? now, a health ombudsman has warned that treating the nhs like a national

religion during the pandemic, including widespread clapping . including widespread clapping. we all did it. did you? i did. may have had dangerous repercussions by potentially shielding the service from criticism. the ombudsman is calling for a radical overhaul of the nhs and urges health leaders to pay attention to the growing number of patient complaints, which have surged by 50%. so for the great british debate this year, i'm asking, do you believe that clapping for the nhs had put them on a pedestal ? well, joining me now pedestal? well, joining me now is former adviser to boris johnson. oscar redrup and also former labour adviser james schneider. oscar, we'll start with you. did you clap for the nhs? >> i did actually, i think i banged a few pots. did you, you know, the wooden spoon and the i can imagine it was all very middle class. well, yeah, maybe a little bit. well, no, look, i think at that moment in time, i think at that moment in time, i think if we were to criticise the nation getting together at what was a very traumatic period of time for us all and showing support for frontline workers who were sacrificing often their

lives to keep people safe and treat people with covid. i think if we're criticising that, where there's a slight overstretch , there's a slight overstretch, nonetheless, the nhs is broken and oddly, that i think that we're in a place of pretty much political consensus on that. i think wes streeting on his, you know, day one of, you know, i'm in the department and i think he declared it broken, i think, you know, you'll see all the leadership candidates talk about from a conservative perspective , from a conservative perspective, talk about, you know, wide sweeping reforms that it needs. so he's got that bit, right, sorry . so keir starmer wes sorry. so keir starmer wes streeting. and i think all the conservative candidates will identify the nhs as being broken. i think clapping at that moment in time and also it hasn't escaped criticism because of that clapping. so you so you don't believe that this this this is correct. >> this comment. >> this comment. >> no, not at all. not at all. like we have to be. look, we have to be measured with these things, you know, like i think

the nhs being named broken. i think is right. i think that is accurate, but i think then kind of being quite lazy and assigning that to the fact that assigning that to the fact that as a nation, we went out and clapped for the nhs. i don't think the nhs is on this pedestal anymore. i think it's an outdated viewpoint. it's just not there. >> well, that's what her name is. rebecca hilsenrath , and she is. rebecca hilsenrath, and she warned against reading the health services for national religion. she is from the. she's a health ombudsman . she's part a health ombudsman. she's part of that. well, look, i'll be honest, when i started @gbnews about three years ago, i did do monologues that would criticise the nhs and i would say that it was it's a rip off because even my own private medical cover would be actually less expensive than the amount that i each person contributes per person towards the nhs, which i think is just over £3,000. so in my view, i did criticise it and said and i used to get so much backlash for it. people say, how can you say that? yeah, yeah. and i knew if i did a monologue on it that i would be attacked. now, if i do a monologue on it,

totally different things have changed. what do you think, james? >> well, i think this ombudsman needs to give their head a wobble. i think the, the idea that showing gratitude to the people that were keeping us and our loved ones safe is, is wrong or is putting they should have been put on the pedestal at that time. the nhs, care workers, people who were keeping us safe and keeping the country going. as for this kind of national religion thing, the nhs is the most civilised thing in our country. the fact that you don't have to worry about going bankrupt or anything like that if you get sick that you can. >> you do need to worry about the nhs. if you get sick. have you seen the queues? >> i said you don't have to worry about going bankrupt and so on. now then we look at what is going on in terms of how it's performing and in loads of cases it's not performing well. you'd see the complaints in some cases it's still really is. i had some experience with the nhs this year and it was great. it all went extremely well, but i know

that, there are lots of complaints and there are there are lots of issues. then we have to look at why. why is that? what's going on? and i think, yes, you can look at funding and there's been a slower increase in funding than relative similar countries over the last few years, last couple of decades. and that's one thing. but also we've had the breaking up of the thing which makes the nhs effective, which is that it's a single national entity, which means that it can negotiate with drugs companies for cheaper drugs, for medical equipment at a cheaper rate, and all of those things which has been broken up and part privatised over the last couple of decades with the breaking up of the nhs into supposedly competing trusts , supposedly competing trusts, which is a nonsense. if you're going to have a national health service, it should be national and the introduction of private health care into parts of it which can take the easier end, the more profitable bits, which sucks money out of frontline services. so of course there

are, but it also relieves pressure as well, doesn't it really. >> so on one side well no no no. but on one side it might do that. and i don't disagree with that. and i don't disagree with that. but on the other side it does alleviate a little bit of the pressure as people get out of the nhs waiting list and go private. >> well, if , for example, >> well, if, for example, a doctor who is an nhs doctor but is also doing private shifts and the bits that are easier to do and are lower cost to do are being done private, then the net effect of that is to suck resources from the nhs to the private. that doesn't mean that the private person is doing anything wrong. that is the that is the net. that is the net effect in aggregate. and we're seeing we're seeing more and more of that. so if we want the nhs to be secure, which i think everyone knows, the reason why people love the principle of the nhs is because it says healthcare is a human right in a civilised society. we provide it for everyone and that's why people love that idea . because people love that idea. because it is. it's a really wonderful idea. we're going to need to go back to the principles that it was set up with, which it should

be national, it should be public, and it should use the strength that we have with that. >> listen, i'm not sure that that's a realistic model, especially if you factor in mass migration and you factor in that the amount of money that's required to, to, to facilitate that. >> yeah, i think i think the worry is, is that, you know, we all hark and james did it then and i get it when we hark back to, you know, when the nhs began and we live in an entirely different uk now. demographic change, you know, migration has had an impact, but more than anything , an had an impact, but more than anything, an ageing population like we have to completely rethink how the nhs is going to survive long term . again, really survive long term. again, really interesting hearing you say that when you said that, you know, a couple of years ago, let's say, all the vitriol and hate in the world came your way and now we're actually, i think, a healthy moment in time where both political parties from across the spectrum actually understand that it is going to have to change and it is going to have to change quite drastically, because we can sit in tv studios and we can all say

really lovely, warm things about the nhs . and you know what it the nhs. and you know what it was like back, way back when. and those founding principles, which are great, don't get me wrong . but ultimately, if on the wrong. but ultimately, if on the off, if you know, if that frontline service that people are not able to or want either you know, their way back of the queue treatments are delayed. you know, unfortunately , those you know, unfortunately, those principles can result in people dying if we just solely protect and kind of put them on the pedestal . i think we have to pedestal. i think we have to make a distinction, though, between the frontline workers, the nhs, you know, nurses , etc. the nhs, you know, nurses, etc. and then there's this other slightly hidden tier from the public, which is the managers who are probably on crazy lovely salaries and they sit in an office all day and they kind of stretch back. i think they're i think if wes really wants to, you know, cut his teeth and show i'm actually quite serious about it, that's where it needs to go. that's where some of the net zero d.e.i all of that needs to go. >> they need to manage it better. they need to start spending the money properly. i'm

just going to quickly read one of these, richard says richard hill says i don't think he's very good at maths. if he thinks people are going private, doesn't save the nhs money. he's talking, referring to you. if people going private doesn't save money, that's what richard is saying. >> well, the provision is being trained by the public that we've paid for the training of the doctors and the facilities and then the, the cheaper end of that type of practice is then being done at a profit by the private, which has been subsidised by the public. now i just want to make another a couple of other points. well no no, no. >> when, when let me just come back to that point that, that doesn't really work out because the training would have been paid for irrespective of whether people go private or use the nhs. >> so a doctor can either be delivering things in the nhs or in a or or in a private setting. no, no, no. but at the same time, of course many of them do both, but at the same time they can only be in one of two places. >> but usually what they'll do is they'll work full time for the nhs and in their spare time,

do other jobs. that's the nhs and in their spare time, do otherjobs. that's how it do other jobs. that's how it usually works. they don't go, i'm going to take a day off to go private. that's not how it works, right? >> so what i'm saying is the more things that are moved into private, which will be which the private, which will be which the private companies don't want the complicated , difficult to do complicated, difficult to do bits because they're not profitable. yes your your hiving off the easier to do bit still relieving pressure . relieving pressure. >> whether you hive off the easier to do or the harder jobs easier to do or the harderjobs are still relieving pressure. it isn't from the easier to do jobs. no it isn't relieving pressure because it's the same. >> no, it's the same doctors and the same facilities in their spare time. it's the same doctor. it's the same doctors. >> it's the same hospital. >> it's the same hospital. >> when the reason why we should be very alarmed about about where's about 20s. >> and then i've got to go to when the, when members of the political class talk about changing the nhs, what they're talking about is cutting your maternity services, making it further to go to a&e and reducing services overall. >> that is what it has meant . >> that is what it has meant. whenever people from the cameron end of the conservative party or the blair end of the labour party mean it, that's what

they're talking about. and that's what wes streeting is talking about. and that's what the tory party is on the labour side of things, actually. >> and if that is part of the equation, then it has to happen. otherwise everything suffers. so sometimes you actually have to cut off one thing to allow everything to thrive. >> so i don't think we should be cutting maternity services. >> a&e let's just decide they'll determine that. but the bottom line is absolutely they shouldn't cut maternity a&e. but that's not the point. they can cut other things and they just have to work out what it is. but the bottom line is i don't think they can carry on with this model of absolutely free for absolutely everybody at the point of need from anywhere in the world, because i think that is a problem. that is a problem. and i've got to go to a break. but we will come back to that. coming up, those supplements sunday, my panel and i will some of the news that caught their eye. do not go

next. welcome back. this is gb news.

it's time for supplements sunday, the part of the show with the panel and i talk through some of the other topics that have caught the eye. but before we do that, i'm going to read some of these views. peter says, we thought the nurses were sacrificing for us when we clapped. never again. they had plenty of time to learn dance routines, as there was no one in hospital. we were lied to. that's what he says. they did a lot of work as well, and when many of us wouldn't have gone, richard said the nhs is completely broken model. no criticism of hard working nurses and first responders. but it is the absurd soviet system which is not fit for purpose. we should have a social insurance model, as is in most of europe. i'm inclined to agree with that, but right now, let's find out some of the stories that have caught my eye. joining me, former adviser to boris johnson, oscar redrup and also former labour adviser james snyder. james schneider, what have you found? >> i found this very interesting story that a diplomat in the foreign office called mark smith resigned on friday over what he said was possible complicity of the foreign office with israel's

war crimes committed against the palestinians. he was an expert or is an expert in arms sales policy , and his view is that we policy, and his view is that we should have banned arms sales to israel because our bombs and our bullets are involved in war crimes and crimes. >> very small proportion of our arms that are sent to israel, though, isn't it? >> even if that were true, what it is true, even if that were true, is true. >> even if that were true what it is, i'm just saying it is. >> okay. well even if that were true. but it is true. what? i'm. what? i'm what i'm saying is that would still make us complicit if our parts that go into f—16 jets and f—35 jets, which then end up, laying gaza to rubble, then we are complicit. it doesn't matter the size or the scale. i mean, actually the scale is larger than you're suggesting, but that doesn't matter. we are complicit. we are complicit through our bombs, our bullets and our diplomatic cover. we are complicit with could be literally complicit with everything. >> you can be complicit with the slave trade for wearing that shirt. you can be complicit for this.

>> well, if we're sending weapons, that's pretty. >> that's we're not giving. >> that's we're not giving. >> that's we're not giving. >> that's buying. well, the reason why we have a whole legal structure set up for whether arms sales are within international law or not, and within our own domestic law, is because we don't want to be complicit in in human rights abuses around the world. >> with your supplement now, oscar, what's yours about ? oscar, what's yours about? >> again, sticking with foreign policy. britain's leadership on ukraine has slowed down. and thatis ukraine has slowed down. and that is according to zelenskyy. and he told that directly to keir starmer. i find that thoroughly depressing, and i find it depressing for a number of reasons. i'd be interesting to hear the views of your viewers in terms of support for ukraine, perhaps that has dried out. perhaps people are more sceptical about the money. we've, you know, pushed into the into the war. i get it, however , into the war. i get it, however, there is a war on our continent and the fact that , our support and the fact that, our support from that country may be seen to be drying up is, i think,

completely. >> thank you, oscar. dangerous. stop talking. sorry. i've been giving him the wrap up sign. he's still gabbing on. i'll do my stopping very quickly, prince harry. he's still going on. looking back, feeling sorry for himself. still at the age of 40. grow up. harry. right. on today's show, i've been asking, will labour's plan to crack down on hateful beliefs, threaten free speech? according to our twitter poll, 93% of you say yes, 7% of you say no. i've got to say a huge thank you to my panel to say a huge thank you to my panel. former adviser to boris johnson, oscar redrup and also former labour adviser james schneider and as a very huge thank you to you at home for your company, i look forward to seeing you same time, same place tomorrow for breakfast. up next it's neil oliver. >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news. >> hello and welcome to your latest gb news weather update from the met office. a fine evening of weather ahead. some hazy sunshine, but it will be turning cloudier from the west

with rain arriving tomorrow. and that's because we've got some low pressure system out towards the west. but first of all, we do have a ridge of high pressure across most of the country and we have fairly settled conditions through sunday evening. so fairly dry and clear for much of the country. but we do start to see that frontal system pushing into western scotland overnight. that rain turning more persistent here. and we do still have this strengthening southerly breeze arriving from the west as well. cool though. first across the east, or perhaps down into single figures in some rural spots as well, but it will be quite a bright start to the day across eastern parts, particularly for the north—east of scotland at first. but we do have quite a lot of cloud and rain across western parts, and that will be turning more persistent as we head through the day again. some sunshine for the day again. some sunshine for the far east, but northern ireland are very much a cloudy day, with that rain becoming more persistent through the morning , wales will start to see morning, wales will start to see some showery, drizzly showers moving up from the southwest, but central parts and the southeast of england will be

seeing sunshine to start the day on monday, and we'll continue with that very much. east west split sunshine for the far east, but very cloudy and we've got some increasing and strengthening southerly winds. and that rain will be turning heavy as we head later on into monday . a rain warning is in monday. a rain warning is in force for south—west scotland . force for south—west scotland. difficult driving conditions here. cool underneath this cloud and rain. best into the mid teens but still some warmth for the south east of england. by tuesday, most of that rain will have cleared away much of the country still lingering on in the far north—east, and it'll be a breezy day with blustery showers, particularly across parts of england. and there'll be some strong winds across the far northwest of scotland too. heading into the rest of the next week, it will be staying unsettled with particularly wet and windy weather into wednesday and windy weather into wednesday and thursday. that's all from me. bye for now. >> that warm feeling inside from boxt boilers , sponsors of boxt boilers, sponsors of weather on

very good evening to you. welcome to neil oliver's show with me, bev turner. tonight, while neil is on his holidays, we are of course, on tv, radio and online now. i'm sorry about the red and the red. i didn't get the memo. if i look like a disembodied head. i'm so sorry. tonight, though, it's been a terrifying week. if you believe in free speech, one man's charges for social media posts included the reference to his anti—establishment rhetoric. i'm not joking. we're going to be asking a leading barrister what all of this might mean. the boxer at the centre of the olympic gender controversy is suing elon musk and j.k. rowling for aggravated cyber harassment.

what