story tonight we have a shocking story for you this evening. ministers are planning to release 2000 prisoners in less than three weeks time. and we've been looking at who might be set free. our analysis shows that it will include those convicted of violent crimes and even manslaughter. in one instance, a killer on early release has been identified as a foreign national. how will labour ensure that public safety can be guaranteed on our streets? and bombshell claims in a newly released book, say our late queen thought the former president, donald trump to be very rude when they met. plus, welsh librarians have been advised to avoid holding meetings in racist buildings. that's one which has an association with britain's historical involvement in the slave trade. this is all part of a plan by welsh labour to eradicate systemic racism by

2030. all of that to come. so do get in touch with your thoughts on tonight's topics by going to gbnews.com forward slash yoursay. but first, here's the news with mark . white. news with mark. white. >> good evening. at just after 7:00. the latest news from the gb news centre. new video has been released showing the moment a british super yacht disappeared from view in a storm of sicily early on monday morning. the grainy security camera footage shows the 75 metre tall mast of the bayesian , metre tall mast of the bayesian, just visible through the torrential rain, and storm force winds. the mast eventually disappears after the vessel tipped over and sank. efforts by dive teams to reach inside the wreck are being hampered by

significant amounts of debris that are inside the yacht . the that are inside the yacht. the body of one man recovered by dive teams on monday has been formally identified as the vessel chef canadian ricardo thomas. among those unaccounted for is british businessman mike lynch and his daughter. david tabizel is a friend and former business partner of mike lynch. he spoke exclusively to michelle dewberry and said if anyone can survive, his friend can. >> any chance of him surviving this? he has the strength , the this? he has the strength, the strength to do this and i hope that we aren't talking in the past tense. he is a remarkable man and if you've had the blessing and the honour to have worked with him or known him, this is he's a force of nature and somebody who i think, will become a business, an intellectual and scientific legend in the decades to come .

legend in the decades to come. >> emergency services in lincolnshire are at the scene of a rescue operation at a seaside pleasure park. the incident at bottom's pleasure park in skegness follows a malfunction of one of the rides. it reported up to 20 people have been stranded for a time in mid—air as fire service personnel attempted to get them down safely. there are no reports of any serious injuries. at least ten palestinians have been killed in an airstrike on a school in gaza. israel claims hamas was using the school as a command centre. meanwhile the israeli military says it's recovered the bodies of six hostages who were captured in the 7th of october attacks. it comes as the us, egypt and qatar are calling on hamas to agree to are calling on hamas to agree to a ceasefire proposal after it gained the backing of israel last night .

gained the backing of israel last night. king charles has visited southport today to meet survivors of last month's stabbing attack, which left three girls dead and others injured. his majesty also took time to meet members of the pubuc time to meet members of the public who showed up for the visit. earlier, he spoke to some of those who provided support in the aftermath of the attack. and he also thanked emergency service personnel who dealt with both the stabbings and the riots that followed . the final 31 ted that followed. the final 31 ted baker stores across the country have shut their doors for the last time today, after the company was left behind. the fashion chain went out of business, so those stores were at heathrow and gatwick airport , at heathrow and gatwick airport, london's regent park and also in bath and york. london's regent park and also in bath and york . well, those are bath and york. well, those are the headlines for the moment. i'm back in an hour for the very

latest gb news direct to your smartphone, sign up to news alerts by scanning the qr code or go to gb news. >> com forward slash alerts . >> com forward slash alerts. >> com forward slash alerts. >> welcome back to gb news tonight with me, christopher hope. tonight with me, christopher hope . some shocking news for hope. some shocking news for you. now, labour's plans to release 2000 prisoners next month to ease jail overcrowding could see those convicted of violent offences and even manslaughter freed . in one case, manslaughter freed. in one case, a teenager, lawson natty, was sentenced to two years and eight months and he'll be released early. it's been reported that he's also a foreign national. the victim, 14 year old gordon gault, died after sustaining wounds from a machete. his mother, john barrett, said this is his unnecessary death was devastating . the ministry of devastating. the ministry of justice has said that anyone released will be strictly monitored on licence by the

probation service, but if criminals like this can walk free, the streets in in barely three weeks time, it begs the question why have, of course, been so keen to jail? keyboard warriors for putting posts on facebook after the riots around the country following the southport killings? joining me now is barrister rebecca butler. rebecca, thank you for joining us on cbn tonight. is this mass prisoner release a worry for pubuc prisoner release a worry for public safety. >> well it was announced in early july that they were going to do this because of prison overcrowding. and in fact alex chalk the last justice secretary had also announced similar plans. rishi sunak hadn't signed them off by the time he announced the election. and i'm sure you're aware of that, to be honest. no, i don't think it is a big worry because 25% of the prison population would be due for half time release anyway . so if time release anyway. so if you're a one year sentence, that's a month early than you

would be entitled to. and if you're, you know, between 4 and 12 years on a determinate sentence, then you're looking at a matter of months difference. i actually think that what labour is doing here is they're headlining and grandstanding over the southport problems and the what they like to term the far right problems. i think they are grandstanding over that because this was always planned and would have happened whatever government was in charge, frankly. >> what do you think victims might say, rebecca, of someone jailed for a crime against someone in their family like we saw earlier and then released early as well ? early as well? >> yeah, i think this is always a hard one because victims feel that they are not heard adequately enough in the criminal justice system , and i criminal justice system, and i feel a great deal of sympathy for them . and, you know, a lot for them. and, you know, a lot of the, you know, victims families do want to see retribution, frankly, for their losses. and who could blame them

for that? it would be very, very difficult for them to swallow that. however a two year sentence for causing death is actually a very low sentence. anyway, it's probably a manslaughter. plea or a manslaughter. plea or a manslaughter case. so there will be other factors around that. i think this is one example that doesn't actually represent the whole, because where you've got 25% of the population in prison who would be eligible for release early, very few of them are going to be in that level of severity of offending, to be fair. and, you know, they're going to have to come out on probation. they're going to be effectively subject to recall if they do anything wrong when, when they're released. so i think that there's a lot of headlining here by the labour party. but actually, i do think they're making a mountain out of a molehill. and they are making

a molehill. and they are making a very, very clear point here. >> but it's risky , isn't it, >> but it's risky, isn't it, because were any to reoffend then that would be a real political problem for this government . government. >> yes it would. but then people weren't really saying the same when there was a mass release of prisoners during the covid pandemic. now there was a reduction in crime as well, because people were really locked in their houses for a lot of it. but we did do a lot of releases. then we had the problem of course, of remand prisoners who whose cases weren't coming to trial . and of weren't coming to trial. and of course, there are custody time limits that the courts have to comply with in respect of remand prisoners as well. so, yes, there is a risk, a, a background proportion of criminals will convict on release anyway, that's probably 30%. so you know , that's probably 30%. so you know, yes, you would have to worry what the 1 in 3,1 in 3 will

will commit crimes again on release. >> i mean, that's if you release 5000 early as the plan is over 18 months. that's quite a lot of offences that will be committed that shouldn't have been committed because they should be inside. >> well, or you might say that prison doesn't work for certain types of offenders . and that is types of offenders. and that is one of the statistics that people who seek reform of the criminal justice system will quote back at you at one point in the blair years, it was 40% were re—offending. and so there had to be a rethink on our offending. sorry, on our sentencing policies. so arguably you know, releasing these are the lower level of , of severity the lower level of, of severity that are going to be released. as i said , you know, out of as i said, you know, out of a population of 98,000, 25% of them, they can they can release fairly safely . they've got 1400 fairly safely. they've got 1400 albanians in prison. and with the agreement that sunak , the agreement that sunak, reached with the albanian

government, they could actually all be deported fairly rapidly as well. so, you know , there are as well. so, you know, there are things there are strings that shabana mahmood could pull and i suspect she will pull them. but the headlines is what the labour party wants because they want to seem to be punishing people and they're making space. that is what they're saying. they are making space for the rioters. well, as far as i've heard , very well, as far as i've heard, very few people have been charged with riot , there's been 1 or with riot, there's been 1 or 2 cases for social media posts and attending the violence, which obviously we condemn . and it's, obviously we condemn. and it's, you know, the highest terms. but what they're saying is we're making for space to put more people in prison. that's actually not the case. this space was going to be made anyway . anyway. >> rebecca butler, a senior barrister. thank you for joining us tonight on cbn tonight. thank you very much to my to my panel. now joining me joining me now is

bill rammell a former armed forces minister. and under both tony blair and gordon brown's government former labour mp and michael brown a former tory mp and also a journalist. thank you both for joining and also a journalist. thank you both forjoining me. bill rammell does the labour government have any choice here apart from to release these prisoners early? >> er, bluntly, no, i mean we can have a debate about how much of the legacy that labour has inherited is the responsibility of the last government. but this is emphatically the tories problem . sunak was repeatedly problem. sunak was repeatedly told by his justice secretary, alex chalk, that he had a choice. he either overrode local objections and built more prison places, or he agreed to early release. he shamefully did neither and said let the labour party deal with it when they come to power. it's also the case that we had to tackle the riots by early trials and early sentencing. bluntly that was the only way we were going to stop the riots and we did it effectively. so we've had to agree to this . but there are

agree to this. but there are safeguards in place that i think can give the public reassurance. >> michael brown, though, you've got maybe some violent thugs being released next month and people being banged up for tweeting or putting remarks on facebook that they say they regret putting there. >> well, look , at the end of the >> well, look, at the end of the day, it's with a heavy heart that i have to agree with what bill has just said. the fact is, the tories in 14 years didn't build any new prisons to any extent that was required. the whole criminal justice system from cutting the police to a lack of probation officers, a lack of probation officers, a lack of probation officers, a lack of prison officers doing a thankless task . the fact is, it thankless task. the fact is, it was broken and even if the tories had been re—elected, you would have found that the tory government would have been doing the same thing had it have been re—elected. so i don't i don't dissent from what they would have been criticised too for it, which is why i mean but but rebecca butler there said bill rammell that a 30% of these individuals go to on reoffend

typically now if they re—offend, when they should be inside, they'll be victims created by that. >> re—offending will be really, really cross and worried. >> that's a much wider problem than this early prisoner release scheme. you know, we have 30% of criminals who come out of prison and do reoffend, and that's a big challenge and we've got to tackle it. but i think we need to get the scale of this into context. it's not a dramatic change. people can already be be released after 50% of their sentence. this is just 40%. no prison will be able to release more than 100 prisoners. so you're not going to flood the local area and people will be released under licensed and will be able to be tackled through curfews and tagging, and the people who are being released predominantly are not those who've been guilty of crimes of violence . violence. >> but the pressure will put on probation officers will be huge, won't it, michael? >> oh, utterly. i mean, the probation service barely works. it's not probation officer's fault. we haven't got enough of

them. relatively poorly paid. where i do think that the i don't know whether to blame the government or the criminal justice system is this the presumption that you have got to hold in custody awaiting trial? all all of those that have been arrested for the riots ? what arrested for the riots? what this means is that apparently about half are not granted bail when they go before the magistrates court but the there has to be room in the prisons in case the magistrates say you are going to be remanded in custody pending trial. now, i think that whether there has been some leaning on by the government, the prime minister, the home office, on saying to the police, keep them in custody when it comes to appearing at the magistrates court, first of all, because apparently what that means is if there's no room in the prisons, then they go in the prison cells, in the prison, in

the police stations and police have to therefore double back. and i think that that's something that if that has happened, i frankly think that was the right thing to do. >> you know, for nine days in this country, i've never seen such shocking scenes of violence on our streets. and i think we were never 81 riots in toxins in britain. not not on this scale , britain. not not on this scale, with people throwing bricks at the police firebombing hotels, storming mosques. it had to be tackled and without detaining rioters and those involved. i don't think we would have stopped it. >> but it's not a judgement for the politicians, for the politicians anyway. so you are causing mayhem and the police arrest you and put you in a cell and they put you before the magistrates the next day . now magistrates the next day. now some are released on bail, but there has to be a prison place available for them in case the magistrate denies them bail pending trial. so i do. it's a small point. i'm not dissenting from from the generality of what bill said. any government, any government. if sunak and his mob

had got re—elected , they would had got re—elected, they would have handled it in probably exactly the same way, in the way that cameron did, which is the same parallel that starmer's done.i same parallel that starmer's done. i can't fault the government for going. it's not going hard on it. it's not a great place to be and the government are going to be able to successfully get away with saying, look, this is the mess that we inherited. we all knew that we inherited. we all knew that the previous government was going to be releasing prisoners, riots or no riots. >> labour's a great place to be. but as someone once said, events, dear boy. events. >> quite right. well, bill bill rammell and michael brown, thank you for joining rammell and michael brown, thank you forjoining us rammell and michael brown, thank you for joining us for now. now coming up, shocking revelations made in a new biography of the late queen elizabeth ii claims she found former us president donald trump very rude. she also allegedly has some thoughts on mr trump's marriage to melania. plus, can a building be thought of as racist? let me know your thoughts by visiting gbnews.com/yoursay

welcome back to gbn tonight with me , to gbn tonight with me, christopher hope. now, donald trump once claimed that he was a confident that he was the queen's favourite guest ever. well, today, revelations about the presidential hopeful have painted him in quite a different picture. a new biography written by critic craig brown, entitled a voyage around the queen, has hit the headlines by claiming the queen once found trump very rude. brown writes a few weeks after president trump's visit for instance, she confided in one lunch guest that she found him very rude. she particularly disliked the way he couldn't stop looking over her shoulder. yeah, that is annoying, isn't it? as though in search of others. more interesting . she others. more interesting. she also believed, according to craig brown, that president trump must have some sort of arrangement with his wife melania, or else why would she have remained married to him?

well, joining me now to discuss these damning revelations is former royal butler grant, harold grant. great to have you on gb news tonight. great to see you. is this the kind of thing the queen would have said ? the queen would have said? grant. harold, can you hear me there? >> thank you very mo mowlam. sorry about this difficult line. >> i'll keep going , but if it >> i'll keep going, but if it drops off, let me know. is this the kind of thing the queen would have said? would she have remarked her views privately about donald trump? >> a pinch of salt. because what i noted . yes, i can, i'm going i noted. yes, i can, i'm going to take i'm kind of taken with a. >> i think that line is not good enough. we'll try to get back to grant harold shortly. michael brown, you met the queen. i'm sure you did. >> i met her once when she came to open the humber bridge, which was promised by barbara castle to win a labour by—election, which prompted the 1966

landslide victory for labour. it was opened on my watch in barton on humber in my constituency in 1981. 12 days before the charles and diana wedding . and diana wedding. >> and what did she say to you about the wedding? any indiscreet remarks? >> i should think if it lasted seconds. your majesty, this is mr michael brown, member of parliament. very nice to see you, mr brown. you must be so pleased. blah blah blah. she moved on after, i think about 15 seconds behind her was the duke, and he said to me, why are you here? and i said, well, why aren't you in the house of commons? and i said, i apparently do less damage when i'm up here than in the house of commons. >> your royal highness bill rammell you met the queen. was he ever indiscreet to you? >> no, i met her a number of times, most memorably on the night that the olympic committee came in advance of london 2012. we hadn't yet won the bid, and she hosted the most wonderful reception at the palace for the olympic committee. and she was an absolute star of diplomacy. and she was also a very sound

judge of character. and i'd like to think she said this about trump, but i don't actually believe it because she was absolutely inscrutable with her personal and political views all the time. she was on the throne. i don't actually believe she said this, but she wouldn't have said this, but she wouldn't have said those remarks about because i don't think so. >> she'd be. would she be aware that she is the head of state of our country, meeting america's head of state? and it's not really personal any more. it's the kind of that kind of political connection between the two individuals. >> yeah. and she absolutely got that. she had a diplomatic duty on behalf of her nations to fulfil. and i think in all the times she was on the throne, you never got any sense of her personal and political views. that's why the story just doesn't ring true with me. no. >> what's your take on it, michael brown? would the queen have said this kind of thing if she said it? >> it was probably in a private conversation some years ago, obviously. and of course, the last 3 or 4 years. yes. and if she said it, it would have been

in private and maybe somebody blabbed to somebody who blabbed, who blabbed ultimately to craig brown. but i, like bill, would agree that it would not have been meant for any onward transmission. >> there was a drama, wasn't there, when it emerged, reports in the sun newspaper that the queen backed brexit. do you remember that? >> yeah. i don't think that had any substance. the only time she came close it may have done that was the scottish referendum where she did and i forget the exact formulation. >> well, i was up there covering it for a different newspaper back then and she allowed she spoke to somebody outside the crathie kirk on the sunday before the voting of back in that day , and she said something that day, and she said something like, think very carefully. i hope everyone thinks very carefully about leaving the uk. that i think, is the nearest she ever came to expressing an opinion. >> and if you. oh, and the other occasion which got the prime minister into trouble a few days later, after the referendum, was when david cameron was overheard on a microphone at the united

nafions on a microphone at the united nations saying she was purring down the telephone. >> but that was david cameron. >> but that was david cameron. >> it was david cameron, not the queen. no, i mean, the cameron had and that was a mistake by cameron because he not meant to really disclose what you say to them. but i am quite sure that in the privacy of those moments with her prime ministers, all of whom all of whom, without exception are kept absolute confidentiality, i'm quite sure that maybe the question of mr trump's rudeness could have cropped up, and i can absolutely assure all your viewers that none of those prime ministers would have. >> but also the comments from trump are just revealing of his narcissism. exactly. you know, i'm the best president the queen met. >> i know she met jfk. i mean, she met she met every single president during her reign with the single exception of lyndon johnson. >> did she? yes. yeah. >> did she? yes. yeah. >> that's a lot. i mean, and that connection, that relationship between prime ministers and the queen is so valuable and sure, it will be with the king now, because it's

the one that won't leak. it's the one that won't leak. it's the one that won't leak. it's the one where you can have a conversation with someone who's a bit of not even your equal above you, really, with the monarch and interesting chief executives of large organisations have personal counsellors that they can go to where in a private space they can offload. >> and in a sense, i think that's what the monarch does with the prime minister. yeah. >> and it's quite emotional. >> and it's quite emotional. >> alleged that during the one i think, i think trump came twice to the united kingdom during his four years as president. it is alleged. and i think this was in one of the banquets or something where trump asked her majesty, her late majesty , who was your her late majesty, who was your favourite prime minister? and she replied and this was overheard. i loved all of my prime or i liked all of my prime ministers. >> it's not liking all of your children. if you ask who's your favourite child? they're all my favourites. there's no other answer, really, i suppose. i mean, i guess even now, looking now with the king, we know what the king's views were with those letters he used to write when he was prince of wales. but he he has maintained a kind of reserve, hasn't he hasn't really

got very involved in politics as some feared he might do when he became king. >> well, it's interesting because the minister, who was on the receiving end of one of those letters once the black spider letters. yeah, i did have a reservation about the then prince charles that he would be more political once he became king. and actually, he hasn't at all. no, he's adopted the manner, the tone and the substance of his late mother. >> he stepped up. he was in southport today, meeting families. and of course, he asked to be kept abreast of what was going on. >> he's a very, very, very compassionate man. has been all the way down the ages ever since he was because there's no manual in that role, is there? >> i mean, you make it yourself, right? >> i mean, there's a monarch for i was born in 1951. i am so old. i was born in 1951. i am so old. i was born in 1951. i am so old. i was born in the reign of george vi for about seven months. bill, of course, is elizabethan. i think the whole of his life has been under just of his life has been underjust one monarch until two years ago. are you a monarchist , bill rammell? >> i'm a pragmatic monarchist. i mean, i have a problem

intellectually with a hereditary monarchy. but then i stumble at what the alternative is , what the alternative is, >> president tony blair is the alternative. well >> or whoever boris johnson or bofis >> or whoever boris johnson or boris johnson. god help us. so, you know, i think the monarchy works well as long as it sticks to the rules it did under the queen. and i think it is doing so under the only time there was a very allegedly dangerous affair was front page of the sunday times. >> i think it was decades ago when there was alleged to be a problem between the queen and the prime minister, thatcher, over south africa. commonwealth prime ministers conference in south africa. yes, that's an allegation that was tense. we'll leave hanging there. >> michael. michael brown bill rammell, thank you for staying with us today. coming up, there's been more fallout to labour's decision to scrap winter fuel payments for pensioners. the government has today launched a new drive to get pensioners on low incomes to sign up for a benefit scheme, as energy bills are forecast to rise by £150 in october.

i'll be speaking a charity boss to see how this will

us. welcome back to gb news tonight with me, christopher hope. now, last month, chancellor rachel reeves shocked many by removing the winter fuel payment from millions of pensioners. today, the government launched a drive to persuade pensioners on low incomes to sign up for benefits to help with their heating costs this winter, in a move described as tokenistic by critics. the chancellor had hoped that removing the winter fuel payment would save £1.4 billion. however, a report now suggests that with 880,000 more pensioners set to sign up for the pension credit, it will cost maybe two and a half times more than it predicted saving. this comes because you can qualify for other benefits when you sign

up for the pension credit. all this comes as ofgem gets ready to raise the energy price cap this week for the winter. a report from cornwall insight forecasts average bills will go up forecasts average bills will go ”p by forecasts average bills will go up by £147. joining me now is caroline abrahams , charity caroline abrahams, charity director at age uk. caroline welcome to gb news tonight. great to see you . there is great to see you. there is putting more pensioners on benefits. better than paying everyone a lump sum to keep warm this winter , this winter, >> well, i don't think that's the choice we're looking at, unfortunately, because we think that it's great that this drive to get more people to claim pension credit is happening. >> it's absolutely the right thing to do. but the problem is all all the evidence suggests it won't be anything like enough because the rate of take up has stayed stubbornly. at about two thirds of older people for more than a decade, despite there being lots of publicity about the advantages of claiming pension credit. when the bbc tv

licence shemozzle happened in 2015. as you may remember, even then. sure take it went up a little bit, but not by very much . little bit, but not by very much. so our concern is that actually, even despite this drive, which we'll do everything we can to support at aj, lots and lots of pensioners who are entitled to pension credit still won't get it . it. >> and that's where the 880,000 figure comes in. and if they do sign up, they may be even more costly because other benefits might might accrue towards those pensioners. do you see a double standard in the treatment of pensioners and other groups since the election? you've got these big pay rises for public sector workers, 5.5% or so, and they're taking money away from pensioners. >> well, i think older people want decent public services too. and obviously having the people to run them is a big issue, particularly in the nhs, where we know that isn't enough staff to go around . and certainly we to go around. and certainly we find older people very sympathetic to the needs of nurses and doctors and people

like that . so i'm not bringing like that. so i'm not bringing those two issues together, although i recognise some other people are. the fact is, though, we know that means testing the benefit is going to hurt maybe as many as 2 million older people who are either on very low incomes or living in vulnerable situations. and we just think that's the wrong policy choice . policy choice. >> and this week we could say we could see that energy price cap go could see that energy price cap 9° up could see that energy price cap 90 ”p by by could see that energy price cap go up by by £150 or so this winter at the same time as you lose this £300 pension payment. i mean, it's going to be very, very difficult time for pensioners. >> absolutely . and it's not even >> absolutely. and it's not even only that because also last yeanin only that because also last year, in the year before pensioners received cost of living payments that you might remember, which were brought forward because of the cost of living crisis. so they're losing that as well . so it's all adds that as well. so it's all adds up to a perfect storm really, for older people who are on very low incomes or you know, who are facing very high energy bills because they're ill at home and they have to have the energy, they have to have the energy, they have to have the energy, they have to have their heating up high, or they have to run the

washing machine every day. so that's what worries us. and that's what worries us. and that's why we hope the government will reconsider. >> is there anything political here? i'm a political journalist. i've got to ask the question, i'm afraid. but the average age of turning from, into a tory voter is now 63. judging at the last election. so it suggests that pensioners are more likely to be tory voters. is that part of the equation? do you think, in whitehall? >> well, as you'd expect , you think, in whitehall? >> well, as you'd expect, i work for a charity. so you're quite entitled to ask that question. but equally, i'm perfectly entitled not to answer it. i think really, that's a question for you to ask the politicians, not us. what we're focusing on is actually the impact on older people. that's what matters to us. and we think actually matters to the vast majority of people in this country shouldn't really be about politics at all. i think we're better than that. >> well, caroline , given you >> well, caroline, given you said ask the question, i will ask my panel that very question. >> thank you forjoining me >> thank you for joining me tonight on gbn tonight. and still with me in the studio here is michael brown, the former tory mp and journalist, and bill

rammell, the former labour minister and labour mp. of course, bill rammell is that right? is there a political calculation here, do you think? the fact is that the average age of turning into a tory voter is now 63. therefore, pensioners suffer under a labour government? >> no, i don't think there's a political calculation, but i think there is a reflection that over the last 14 years pensioners have been protected, where younger people and people in work have not been. the reality is, let's have some historical context. the winter fuel allowance only came in under the last labour government in the late 1990s, because of a one year , £0.75 increase in the one year, £0.75 increase in the bafic one year, £0.75 increase in the basic state pension, which itself was embarrassing for gordon brown. absolutely. and i'm amazed that the winter fuel allowance hasn't been means tested before now . so, you know, tested before now. so, you know, this is about rebalancing. since the winter fuel allowance, we've had the triple lock on the basic state pension, which actually today means you're less likely today means you're less likely to be in poverty if you're a pensioner than if you're in

work. so, you know, i think it was the right decision. but i also think that we need to do more to target pensioners genuinely in need . and the bit genuinely in need. and the bit i'm frustrated about is not just an advertising campaign. so they can get access to all sorts of benefits, including the winter fuel allowance. but why isn't there? the wit between hmrc and there? the wit between hmrc and the department of work and pensions, where you can virtually automatically make that payment? >> i think it's computers probably say no on that side of it, but michael brown, i mean, why won't pensioners claim their benefits? there's a third of pensioners not claiming this credit. they can get . is there credit. they can get. is there an embarrassment about claiming an embarrassment about claiming a benefit? what is it? >> yes. look, i have an interest to declare a pensioner an old age pensioner for the last eight years. yes. however now this is where i think the government is going. is going to come unstuck. the new state pension came into effect in 2015. 2016. today, the rate for the new pension is

which bill will be getting in a couple of years. time is 220 £221 a week. i'm on the old state pension, which is £159 a week. so if you are 73 or over, for all those people who are in their mid to late 70s, all those people who are in their 80s and 90s, they are not getting the £221, they are getting £159. now, if you are living on the bafic now, if you are living on the basic state pension, not the new state pension as i am, i don't need the £200 i've been bunged and i think caroline said this just now. last year sunak bunged me in addition to my 200 winter fuel allowance. he bunged me £300 cost of living allowance. the previous year he bumped me £400 so i think there is every case for the labour government to take away from people like me who don't need it. i have a private pension, an mps pension

as well. i think it's perfectly reasonable for the government to deal with them, but those are the people that i've just described on the basic state pension who are going to be affected. the government says in your report just now, 880,000 are not claiming the pension credit. it's a horrendous form , credit. it's a horrendous form, though. well, i looked at the form knowing that you were going to quiz me about this tonight and it is a horrendous form . and it is a horrendous form. it's complicated. no normal person in their 70s or 80s or 90s could claim it without somebody helping. so the government needs to bill rammell its own complex and i think it is over complex and that needs reform. >> but do you know what i regard myself as very politically literate? i wasn't aware of what michael had just said. and in terms of the age differential of the basic state pension, and i think that's a political time bomb ticking for this. >> just finally, is there a choice they've made here by rewarding public sector workers and also on the same day, deaung and also on the same day, dealing with this issue of taking away the winter fuel allowance? it's not a great look. >> no, no, this is this is about

getting britain working again. and as the woman from age concern said, you know, pensioners are in receipt of pubuc pensioners are in receipt of public services and they need to be working. >> what you could do, i think, is to say all who receive or are in receipt of a private pension should be looked at closely. i think the bill is right. i mean, it's £169 that i will get. i'll get all the cost of living increases for the rest of my life. but there is a £50 differential which will get wider as every year goes by. for those above my age. >> well, michael brown bill rammell, thanks for that great chat there about the issue of the pension. it's a bit worrying for many, many viewers. coming up shortly, librarians across wales have been advised by decolonisation experts not to hold meetings in racist buildings. but what is a racist building? and how does the welsh government plan to eradicate systemic racism by 2030? more on that next. and a reminder let me know your thoughts on this. can a building be thought of as racist? gbnews.com/yoursay let me know your

welcome back to gbn tonight with me, christopher hope now racism is a term normally reserved for people , not buildings. however, people, not buildings. however, in a push to end systemic racism, librarians are being warned not to hold meetings in buildings which are considered racist. training is being given to librarians in critical whiteness studies on how to deal with issues like the dominant paradigm of whiteness. it seems that any historical building which has a connection to slavery and in turn the british empire might be guilty as charged. i've been getting your questions here. on to our our our chat here @gbnews. depher says racist building. what's racist next? snow and tracy says no, a building cannot be racist.

how absolutely pathetic. the country has gone mad . well, to country has gone mad. well, to test that, i've got my panel still with me. michael brown, former tory mp and journalist, and bill rammell, the former labour mp and minister in two labour mp and minister in two labour governments. to you first, bill rammell. it's a labour government doing this in wales. has the country gone mad? is tracy right? >> i get exasperated by this story. i mean, look, i understand, don't blame me for it. no, no, no, i understand the rationale of race awareness training and advice. it's been going on in the public and private sector for donkey's years. i also understand the case for renaming buildings , as case for renaming buildings, as long as you consult people. colston hall in bristol, when , colston hall in bristol, when, when, when they're associated with slavery or racism. but there's a real risk of going too far, too fast and not taking people with you and you know, effectively prescribing buildings that librarians can use. come on. it's crazy. and the point here, isn't it ? the point here, isn't it? >> michael brown. there's

150,000 quid's worth of public money, i think, from memory going on this, that's a lot of money which could be spent restoring a welsh chapel which is going falling into the ground. it could be anything. >> yeah, exactly, exactly. this was a report in the daily telegraph i think, this morning. and it says that, buildings are problematic if, for example, they have links to people like gladstone. now, i've got a problem. i'm a member of the reform club, 104 pall mall. the reform club, 104 pall mall. the reform club, 104 pall mall. the reform club was invented in the early 20th, in the early 19th century, to celebrate the passing of the 1832 reform act to widen the franchise. it's basically a liberal and today left of centre club. it doesn't have an overt political view, but it's basically people like bill roy hattersley, those types of labour members. there is the spouse of a former prime minister who is a member in the reform club . now we've got reform club. now we've got gladstone everywhere. yes, we have a library, we have a

librarian. are we going to avert your gaze, michael brown? i salute gladstone, and the reason for that is because gladstone's father was a slave owner and gladstone made one of his early speeches in the house of commons defending slavery. and so the reform club is going to have to be shut down at this rate. and what are all those delightful lefties like, bill? very civilised people going to do? well, bill, if they he may not be a member of the reform club and i'm sure he's been there. >> so it's a bill is it £130,000 of taxpayers money going into this? i mean, there's, there's somewhere called the goronwy owen primary school, named after a welsh poet who owned slaves. that's a so there are no renaming buildings, is right. is that right? because it's a but when you've got you can't go into a library then i think i think it goes too far. >> and the use of public funds for this campaign as well. i think one of the problems is what is well—meaning by the welsh government. they then commission an organisation who goes way beyond the remit and

the bit i find really inexplicable is i went to university in cardiff very well and wales as a whole, and the welsh labour party are actually what i would describe as conservative with a small c. i do not understand how the welsh labour government has ended up at the vanguard of this kind of campaign, these culture wars. >> they're quite, i mean, the reform club issue there, michael brown, but they're all dangerous, dangerous ground to tread on. >> waste of time. i mean, the report says that pubs in wales with names like the lord nelson and people, people of that ilk, can't chop down nelson's column. well, exactly. i mean, are we going to bulldoze nelson's column in in trafalgar square? i mean, where does it stop? it is just utterly ridiculous. >> and the bigger problem is we do have a serious problem of racism in this country. and things like this underline the undermine the importance of that. >> and bill and bill, this is where our colleague and friend, my friend nigel farage, for whom

i voted at the recent general election allowing the labour party to win westminster before the fact, is this is meat and dnnk the fact, is this is meat and drink to the reform reform club, the reform party. when they go after the labour vote, that is , after the labour vote, that is, it's the very people who have hitherto historically voted laboun hitherto historically voted labour. this is bad news for laboun labour. this is bad news for labour. well, there is there is polling out this week showing a big swing in labour. >> labour voters towards reform uk bill rammell. >> yeah, and also i think there's lessons from across the pond as well. it's i was reading some stuff today. it is very interesting that kamala harris is not going down the road. lock, stock and barrel of identity politics in the way that hillary clinton, trump tried to force her down. >> that route by questioning her. >> and i think people on the left need to be careful with this. it does. >> it undermines racism is appalling . but a building can't appalling. but a building can't be racist and they're using that language undermines the seriousness of racism. >> just one further point. the barbados parliament is one of the oldest parliaments in the world. the current building was built in the 19th century, and

the people of barbados still used to go to mine. >> our next host of gb news, jacob rees—mogg , coming off his jacob rees—mogg, coming off his state of the nation all the way tonight from god's own county. he made me say that of somerset. jacob, can i ask what's on your show before i ask, what's your show before i ask, what's your show tonight? jacob is your library racist ? my library show tonight? jacob is your library racist? my library is definitely not racist. >> and we did go and speak to some people in the great city of wales and asked them if they thought buildings were racist, and i'm afraid they thought it was a lot of old baloney. so we're going to be talking about that. we're going to be leading on the government saying that working from home is all great and presenteeism is a bad thing. so if you turn up to work, that's probably not popular with sir keir starmer and his troops. it's the idleness. the new idleness of new labour that we will be talking about. to start with. and then we've got one of somerset's leading baronet, sir benjamin slade , on last year he benjamin slade, on last year he was in search of an heir and wanted to see if he could get one. and lots of people mailed in to say they would like to

help sir benji provide an heir, so we're going to get an update on his status. >> i wonder, did you, jacob, do you regret now putting post—it notes on those desks in whitehall saying, i'm sorry you're not here? i'll come back when you're back in the office? >> no, i wish i'd put more. when you're back in the office? >> no, i wish i'd put more . i >> no, i wish i'd put more. i only put three out and that had a bit of an effect. but nobody watching this programme ever gets through to hmrc. if you need to deal with dvla and you're not doing it online, you don't get answers that public services where people aren't in work aren't working. and for the government to want to carry on encouraging people to stay at home is idiotic. >> and but do you blame your government for this? you're in charge until last month . charge until last month. >> well, when i was government minister for efficiency, government efficiency , we were government efficiency, we were beginning to get people back in and we published the information which labour has now decided is worth publishing. >> that's jacob, and end their state of the nation next. but first, though, it's the weather

with alex burkill. thank you for joining us. great show. >> looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on gb news. >> good evening. here's your gb news weather update from the met office. most of today's showers are going to ease and clear away as we go through this evening, and overnight, but our attention is turning to a weather system thatis is turning to a weather system that is out in the atlantic and is actually the remnants of hurricane ernesto is heading towards the uk and is going to bnng towards the uk and is going to bring some wet and windy to weather north western parts tomorrow. but for the time being, like i said, many of today's showers will be easing, some continuing though, especially across parts of scotland and western parts of england and wales. otherwise, a lot of dry and clear weather around. and with those clear skies , temperatures turning skies, temperatures turning a little bit on the cool side, particularly towards the east southeast, towards the north and west a bit more cloud here and some brisk winds. so temperatures holding up that

little bit higher perhaps as we go through tomorrow morning, then it is going to be turning quite quickly, quite cloudy and a bit wet. across the far west of scotland, a brighter, drier part for eastern parts of scotland and north—east england. two cloud quickly spilling across northern ireland. so a grey start here and a bit damp in some parts as well. some showers down the western side of england and wales, some more central and eastern parts. it is going to be a mostly bright start, though there could be some high level cloud making the sunshine a little bit hazy across central eastern parts of england. it is going to turn a bit cloudier as we go through the day, but staying largely dry. however towards the north and west we have that feature i mentioned at the start and this is going to bring some very wet and windy weather turning. really pretty unpleasant feeling unpleasant then towards the north—west, but in the southeast , north—west, but in the southeast, temperatures getting into the low 20s. so warm enough in any sunshine. more wet weather to come as we go through thursday, the system will gradually make its way southeastwards, but it breaks up, diminishes a little bit as it goes. so in the

southeast, just seeing a bit of cloud, bit of rain, it won't be as intense or as impactful as the wet and windy weather we're going to see in the north west. another spell of wet weather coming through on friday, but signs of something drier through the long weekend. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> hello. good evening. it's me, jacob rees—mogg, live from god's own county of somerset on state of the nation. tonight sir keir starmer has nailed his colours to the mast of the shirking ship of working from home. britain now faces a future of low productivity, high taxes and stagnant growth. librarians are not hold meetings in racist buildings. what, you may ask, is

a racist building. well, we may all need a lesson in critical whiteness studies to find out . whiteness studies to find out. this time last year, the great baronet of somerset , sir baronet of somerset, sir benjamin slade, joined state of the nation in a quest to find an heir to his title. the nation in a quest to find an heirto his title. did the nation in a quest to find an heir to his title. did he find one? find out in a moment. plus, is it 2024 or 1984? can silent prayer amount to a crime? well, on this occasion , freedom of on this occasion, freedom of speech has won after a payout and an apology from the police was issued to isabel vaughan spruce, who will be joining me shortly. state of the nation starts now . starts now. holding the state of the nation flabellum for this evening is the former conservative mp neil parish. but as ever, i want to know your views. it's a crucial

part of the programme. mail me mailmogg@gbnews.com.