[000:00:00;00] van people don't go along, well we say they don't go along , are we supposed to deal like this, aren't we supposed to deal like this in the law, no, by the way , the new hijab bill and afaf all such deals with the level of the scarf, which is nothing even a bit more than a bad scarf. removed means that according to this law, the police will intervene in the square and arrest those who are naked or semi-naked, who are now naked and semi-naked. from the moment you say

don't even wear a scarf, it means don't wear a scarf. where do you get that from? okay, by the way, i am you say, if we want it like this, i say that the government should retreat from this stage, what is religion, what is religion , what is governance, that is, they tell you to come and be an opponent, for example, you didn't get my point, the next point, we will go to another place, if you agree, let's go together, a report that cooperation let's meet together, we will come back, we will continue the conversation, we will be at your service , the issue of hijab and... social control of some anomalies in the society by using the tool of financial penalty is one of the topics that has brought different analysis and opinions in the past months. is. majid ansari, a rouhani and politician in the scope of the afaf bill hijab and financial fines are such that it will definitely cause tensions and conflicts between the classes and members of the society, and in this way, the harmful effects of this law are far more than the good ones

. or it will be mandatory for a few. hossein suzanchi, professor of the field and university. this law is cultured. but the meaning of this culturalization is not that if someone violates, he will not be punished. its focus is not punishment. do you remember that at first the police would hide to fine them, but then they themselves announced that they no longer have the right to do so and should be exposed. it means that we don't want to take a wrist this i think the difference between civil and criminal laws is very important. bahar arvin, professor of sociology at tarbiat modares university. hijab is a cultural conflict, and you are using this exclusive tool of state violence, whether it is a fine, fine, or prison, in a cultural conflict that has unfortunate consequences for society and the social arena. mohsen

mahdian, ceo of hamshahri media institute. if removing the requirement of hijab does not contribute to non-hijab, why do we insist on applying the hijab law? the answer is simple. the reason is that the story does not end here to be culture changes over time. if it is not taken care of, there is no reason for tomorrow to be better than today. ahmed bokharai, sociologist. the decision -makers and authors of the modesty and hijab bill are looking to kill people so that people will be satisfied with fever. but the point that maybe they didn't pay attention to and don't pay attention to is that this is to death. catching the fever has only one result and that is social collapse. jalil mohebi, member of the faculty of majlis research center. fines are the experience of many countries. for example, in some countries , first-time unarmed robbery only has a fine. camera it is registered and a fine is charged from the person who regrets what he does. the thing that is the pillar of punishment in the whole world and the world

governs itself with it, imprisonment and... you agree with mr. hosseini who says that this method that you mentioned, from the beginning of the discussion until now, this entry with a financial fine and entry with the police force, do you think it will reduce the social capital of the system or not ? do you think it is a review of what has happened so far regarding the hijab of the government ? it has fallen and is going to happen god willing , it will be implemented in order to restore social capital . see where these oppositions to the hijab law and the issue of the mandatory hijab got their joy from a somewhat unprofessional behavior of some police officers in the form of guidance, which we are also critical of. of course

, farajan complex police. in this process , they act very professionally and very committedly, but in any case, for example, one officer in one place, because we live in the age of media, it is a violation. for example , if he makes a mistake, he creates an image , affects the mentality of the society, and it causes this a mentality should be created that the police arrests, arrests , kills , etc., you know, this mentality is created by the media. the reality of the police's behavior is not like this, but this bill happened by chance. the police's behavior was like this, as you say. for example, it means, for example, you saw, for example, two months. once a clip was found somewhere, while the police were present in the square, they were giving thousands of warnings every day, and i don't know if it was the same mohseni story that happened, maybe it was the first time

they hit some women. take them to a training class they put it somewhere that something happened to someone, for example , he had an underlying disease, this happened to him , even though it was not a process, but now the mentality has prevailed that the police is doing this, hitting , killing so-and-so. because it was thought that it was too much , we removed it, that is, in the hijab law, this kind of behavior will be removed. the police no longer have the right to arrest, take him to muqreed and teach him. no, mr. hosseini said that it should be revised. do you think that this revision has been revised at all? exactly, we don't have all the previous problems, no, by the way , it has become more efficient and more inhibiting. and also how can you do that, for example , now you were saying that this didn't happen once in two months , now, for example, it doesn't happen once in two months, because it's not happening on the street when you meet anymore, so i believe that there is no border and tension

anymore. he is not going to arrest anyone, so there will be no fighting, tension, filming, etc. anyone who discovers hijab will be intelligently identified, he will be fined , mr. hossein, don't you agree? the thing is, sir, i won't fight this outside, well, now i have the technology, i'll take a picture of it for example, he will receive a text message that says, for example, you have to go and pay a fine of 10 million tomans . for example, i just had a short question for you . do you think that these problems will not happen now ? it happens, people have that feeling, it is created in them, you see , the person who is shamed due to wrongful behavior will definitely be upset. what

red light are we passing right now ? if he works, his social capital will decrease he finds out what this means in many things , for example, you go to property, for example, you pay taxes, taxes are cut for you, for example, a million tomans , well, you worked, you did economic work, you made a business, you have to pay taxes, when you want to pay taxes, you are unhappy, everyone is like this, often like this, well, this dissatisfied means you because of this dissatisfaction , because social capital does not come, or for example , you don't like cursing, you must have your laws , you must have your social regulation mechanism , you must have a social order in any case as a government, now this order is definitely . social there are opponents, especially those who are going to pay because of this social order. the issue is whether you should withdraw, no, you should have a red line somewhere

, like i say. they are doing that , for now, we will not put officers in charge for a while , for example, to control the traffic and control the people, for example, angry , what does that mean, you should go to those roots instead. sir, it is embezzlement that we don't supervise the textbooks . what does that mean? i don't know. it is injustice. we supervise the movies that are produced. let's not have it. these are illogical and unjustified words. you have

to monitor the elements of the cultural and social order of the theme, and basically the trustees of this field are also different. this is not compatible. here , someone else is the trustee, and there, i am the trustee of six. everyone should do their own work. another point that regarding the doctor's statements, it should be noted that who said that you should make decisions based on the opinion of your people for the details of your decisions? there is no such thing at all , it is not like that anywhere in the world. all over the world they say, sir, you agree that we, for example, about cultural work, for example, about the field of culture of control let's have it. yes, some liberal countries say no, don't apply any control. let them themselves. some say no, control should be applied. regarding the details, for example , how should i apply an audit on the books that the ministry of guidance authorizes , i should ask the opinion of the people, not the people. they say that we trusted you here. finally , we voted for a government. that government came based on

the standards that the expert's work determines. you say that we should take these limits from the bottom of society . i say no, we should take the limits from the expert's work. let's take elite work from the research work that happened in this layer mr. hosseini, you agree, no, i don't agree. now , if i want to say a few things quickly, one is that you see, i am a father, i want my son to pray, so i can do this. if i do it or not , there is a possibility that i will be able to hit him again. he may bend and straighten. if i cut off his money, he may bend and straighten. well , but can i necessarily make him pray for blood? no, probably even if, for example, the child bends and straightens later because of the fear of my fine. that i didn't have that fine anymore , for example, he starts cursing a lot of things away from them , well, in fact, the pressure i put on him to change his appearance is hurting him inside, so we we have to pay attention to the inside of our society. pay attention to this. punishment and punishment are not

supposed to educate people on a social scale. you educational systems are something else. it is a school. we are not supposed to disbelieve that the punishment should be the punishment for the conformity of citizens with the norms. this is the mission. well, what are the characteristics of the norms? your fundamentals in the islamic system determine islam, listen , hanjars, we get the norms from where the people do not decide, we are not going to make the norms based on the people's vote, the people do not decide whether the hijab is or not in the islamic society. kenna, well, hijab was not talking about punishment at all, we are talking about whether it is financial or otherwise . i say, i say yes

, i say that educational systems are supposed to make people believe , punitive systems are supposed to make people conform , this is the difference, i have to ask you one question , then we will have mr. hosseini, do you think that or your investigation shows if we have this type of financial penalty, how much can it be a deterrent, how much can it be the stratum that you mentioned in different percentages from different think tanks. i believe that financial fines are one of the most effective and simple methods of deterrence . it is a deterrent punishment. the richest people living in the upper city of tehran also forgive a lot, for example, money for

their dog's food. the historical experience is the scientific summary behind it in detail. we take the norm from islam, well, even assuming that we take the norm from islam we have to measure the method of applying that standard with the bottom of the society , that is, self-view. religion also says that the prophet , when he became an emissary, came step by step with orders

, it was not like that until he became an emissary, he said that you should do everything, sir, as if this is an educational logic, every teacher knows this, every mother and father knows this. take a survey with the people, for example, of course, no, they say that this is a characteristic issue , the religious ruling should be applied , this is their opinion. . one let me give you an example

, it's you , me, now you are saying that the survey of the people is necessary, we should also say it is necessary , and we did it . in our opinion , we have a method in sociology, the delphi method. well , how many experts do they take to come up with a questionnaire ? it is useful, so to speak , friends. we did not see from them, i saw that they invited professors to come and comment and so on but the floor is characteristic. in our opinion, our problem with this law is that we are in the academic context of this system and we know and see the opinion of sociologists, educational sciences and even some jurists in this field. sir, there are not many of these things in this discussion. in fact , the bill has not been seen in this discussion. the problem is that they

are talking about cameras, for example, driving directions. by the way, you are a good example. raised because it is in a place where it should be stand, but if you stand in a place where you shouldn't stand, this is my capital and how much i have . in fact, i emphasize the social capital. you see, we had a story of unrest last year. perhaps the most violent type of unrest that iran had actually experienced last year was from stripping. it finds a place where it can emerge. once it becomes visible, it is the social capital that has decreased. it is true that on the surface it seems like a calm society, but underneath it has a secret , it has complications, it has a secret anger that is waiting.

this is actually an opportunity to get out i don't want to say that this is for everyone , it may be for a section of the society, this is causing this . yes , i can't afford it. according to the current law, the fine from my account will decrease by itself, as if it means that you don't even have to pay from the central bank. it should be deducted from your account, you are from the bank that is there, this word of the text seems to me , well, you took my money, you didn't have any money at all, i became a debtor in this islamic republic, i would be a bad person if i just catch you somewhere, well, see what i do. i will become a person where there is no camera, i will be somewhere where you cannot recognize my face. see this. the hidden eye of this what do you want to do? look at this dualization of society . it happened to me recently. i was walking in a pasashi. a lady came back once and you are taking a picture of me . well, look at a society where it's like this is in front of him, this is in front

of him , this one wants to take a picture of him , what does he want to do ? he doesn't see a connection with you , he doesn't feel a sense of belonging to the islamic republic he can migrate whenever he wants. we were children once and they used to say that running away is a crime. now it's all about the hands and feet and the heart, and everyone is running away if they can. well, the statistics say that the rate is actually. but it is clear that the people's view is different from the people's rule and they can definitely give their opinion

. in any case, you, for example, if there is a representative who can have the opinion of mr. iqbaliu , a representative can have your opinion. we will vote for two points of view. an hour means thousands of hours of undergraduate work with different opinions, and i don't know what that means for you to say there is no special intellectual spectrum to come to writing , and you can publish this , that is, make it public, not the results of your review, your research, anyway, because you mentioned some of the decisions that have been made, the questions that have been asked. in any case, the target community that has been asked can help people to have a better understanding of this issue , exactly that now. of course, i 'm not too busy to want to publish this because i don't have access to some of them, but i

agree. we did it, it is on our website and friends can have access, but the point that mr. doctor says is that this anger is social anger, as i said, when a person goes to the office for any reason, the client wants to do his job. this is, for example, god's servant, what are they saying, he has gone to the bathroom for a minute, or, for example, he has gone , i don't know, a phone call and he is the person who is finally in a hurry, he wants his work to start quickly , so he starts cursing, i don't know you guys, your system is broken. sir, this social anger is after all a natural thing, we have to say it drinking water in the workplace is prohibited by the attendants , what does this mean? well, he should pay a certain amount of money for the social order, sir. you say that the citizens do not pay anything for the social order

. the citizens have absolute will, sovereignty, absolute passivity . what does it mean, where in the world does it say this? nowhere in the world really confirms this. we say yes, if your way. the logic of your law is distorted, let's talk about it , but every law has its opponents, especially those who are the target of the law. especially for those who, for example , you went to build a tower on the border of the sea, the river, i don't know, the judiciary has come to destroy your tower. well, you are known to be anti-revolutionary . you are obviously cursing this system from head to toe. well, you should not do it. say, sir, this anger will get you somewhere, it will take your head. if your treatment is unfair, yes, it is your opinion. it's true , but you have to deal with the truth, speak the truth, the truth is bitter, some people oppose the truth, you

have to back down from the truth about the hijab , it's clear that the person who chose to be without the hijab should discover the hijab, he will oppose his behavior by dealing with it he will get angry and catch you somewhere urban is making a fool of you, sir, you should point your arrow at him, you should tell him, sir, you have no right. if you oppose the law, you have to follow it, but you say that you are pointing your arrow towards the government and saying, "look at the social anger of the people , come back. well, i'm telling you , okay , you'll back down from this." he wants to take the social anger somewhere else. what should we do there? let's sit back . how long should we sit back? answer this. well, we have four minutes less time

to have your summary, mr. hosseini. anyway, you. some of the countries in this region don't say this , the countries in which the hijab is not mandatory are also muslims, and really, their red lines are not violated much, and their order in the field of sexual and social life is much better than ours. and these words, but you see that, sir, this social requirement does not exist legally, but there are other social monitoring systems, but regarding your statement, we do not believe that in fact. for example, people always say that the ruler should be passive, no, we don't really see it as one-sided.

what we are talking about should be seen in the bed , the same way, it should be seen in this way, this and this should be seen in the bed. what i am talking to you about is influenced to some extent by this current text of the hijab layer. i am asking the dear viewers to read this text now , they will get angry at all, probably at the bottom of the text , which means that you are not a good person at all. i would like to tell you that with men, what kind of crimes should be used and the employment of these people is embedded from i don't know and i will come to your order. you can be a bit more precise. we are not against the fines at all

if it is applied correctly, it should be applied in the right amount in the right model. it is not and we don't see it. well , as a researcher specialized in this field, i have not yet seen any survey that says, sir, that the people in this area are supported by their social capital, please do this. there are all these collections on the survey of the majlis research center. all this research karde and the think tank are making a living with the budget of bitalmal agha . tell me, sir , we have reached this point in this field, in this field, in this research, with support. if we reach that point, what should we do with the penalty mechanism? it is a problem for me to finish, that i won't take up your time. another problem we have with this work is that this ashhod is really strict, which of course the authors themselves have emphasized that, sir, we have made a kind of law that someone

don't dare to reject it. we put a fine so that no one dares to reject it. as a strategy of their legislation in this law , sir, one is a little surprised, why should we deal with it in such a strict and dense manner , so a fine can be the way to go, in the right amount and in the right form, but this is what is happening now. thank you very much to both the guests of the program, all the good viewers of the higher program , yes, our time has ended because i had started with you, i was nearing the end of the discussion with mr. hosseini . thank you very much to all the viewers who have been with us until this moment.

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