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narrator: pediatric surgeon. volueer. topiary artist. a raymond james financial advisor tailors advice to help you live your life. life well planned. brook: these are people who are trying to change the world. startups have this energy that energizes me. i'm thriving by helping others everyday. people who know, know bdo. narrator: funding was also provided by, the freeman foundation. and by judy and peter blum kovler foundation; pursuing solutions for america's neglected needs. announcer: and now, "bbc news". ♪ lewi hello. i'm lewis vaughan jones. you are watching "the context"

on bbc news. >> i'm very much lookingorward to this meeting, and you have the support of the united states is your take on this terrorist threat. >> we are not dictating terms to the israelis about how long it has to take. it has to take as long as they feel they need to take to eliminate this threat. obviously we all wanted to be over as soon as possible. >> so much has to go right to move from war to peace. so much has already gone wrong that peace might be impossible. lewis: the u.s. national security advisor is in israel with a warning about the growing number of civilian casualties i gaza. we will hear from two veteran diplomats about what they think it will take to end the fighting. also tonight, we will focus on brussels. eu leaders are talking about more money for ukraine.

will they be able to convince hungary's viktor orbán to sign off on the much-needed military aid? coming up, our weekly focus on artificial intelligence, "ai decoded," where we will get up to speed on the latest developments. we are going to start tonight in israel. u.s. national security advisor jake sullivan is there. he's been meeting with prime minister netanyahu, talking about protecting civilians and a possible timetable for ending the war. back in washington, white house national security spokesperson john kirby an update on what happened behind closed doors. >> one of ththings jake did talk to him about was progress in the war and where the israelis think it is going to go. he did talk about possible transitioning from what we would call high-intensity operations,

which is what we are seeing them do now, to lower intensity operations some time in the near future. but i don't want to put a timestamp on it. i think you can understand the last thing we want to do telegraph to hamas what they are likely to face in the coming weeks and months. lewis: also today, israel's ambassador to the u.k. says israel would not accept a two- state solution when the war in gaza ends. let's take a look at the situation on the ground in gaza. bombing anfighting continue. this is the aftermath of a strike in rafah south of the gaza strip. the hamas-run health ministry says at least 24 people have been killed in airstrikes and two hoes in rafah. we start with a special report from international editor jeremy bowen. and a warning, you may find it distressing. jeremy: jerusalem, a historian wrote, is the only city where the debt are more important than the living. he meant the weight of its

bloody past. but it is the last two months and more of killing that absent palestinians and israelis into new and unknown territory. here in the holy city, which both sides claim as their capital, they are tense watchful, waiting. choices lie ahead. a cease-fire will come eventually. will it just be a pause before the next war? or will israel and the palestinians decide that the only way to avoid more sorrow and death is to try again to make peace? arabs and jews have contested the land between the mediterranean and jordan river for more than a century. this is hebron on the israeli-occupied west bank. you have many families left you. -- left here. and this is a palestinian activist. since the seventh of october, palestinians who live near hebron's illegal jewish sediment have been mostly under curfew.

the army is coming. what do you think they want? >> everything they do is about intimate think the palestinian population -- intimidating the palestinian population. jeremy: the army regard him as a troublemaker. they don't want us to film, but we did when one of the soldiers butted into our conversation. >> you don't know what it is like with neighbors like this. i know them, i live with them. i want peace, they don't want peace. they hate me. >> take your mask off. take your mask off. i'm not your enemy. jeremy: confrontation is built into israel's military occupation of the palestinian territories. peace is impossible while it continues. can you have peace? >> with them? no, we should force them to peace. jeremy: pressure them? >> yes.

international community and international law mostly implemented. international community must make israel seek peace. jeremy: do you think that the shock of the war in gaza and everything that's happened, the hamas attac, everything israel did in response, do you think it will change things or just make them deeper and worse? >> i think it is to opportunities, either we choose to make it deeper and worse, or we make it an opportunity to solve the conflict, so the occupation, make living together possible. the security solution failed. jeremy: israel says it has a right to be in hebron and this is security, not apartheid. this was the kibbutz just before e seventh of october. the government years is the only response is to destroy israel's enemies. vivian lived at the kibbutz. she was one of israel's

best-known peace campaigners. she believed israelis would never have real security until palestinians had their own state. on the seventh, she was at home in the place she had brought up her two sons. the bodies of israelis killed by hamas were still being recovered when we went there to find vivian's house. her family hope she was a hostage inside gaza. as hamas shot their way in, she texted her son that she feared a ssacre. her house was burned. a month later, vivian's remains were identified in the ash left by the fire. >> you were there, i was there afterwards, and her bones were in the safe room. jeremy: he believes the war lacks a political objective. >> war, if we are not naïve, it should be a means, right?

but it feels like this war was a cause in itself. of revenge, of making a point. jeremy: you are still a believer in peace even though these people came over into your country and killed your mother. >> they came into my country and killed my mother because we didn't have peace. to me, this just proves the point that we need it. jeremy: after the war, the americans want israel's walls and fences between jerusalem and bethlehem to go from a security measure into an international frontier with an independent palestine. the current israeli government says the two-state solution will not happen. when the war is over, what needs to go right to give peace a chance? first of all, a change of later on both sides. there is too much bad history and they don't trust each other.

next, there has to be evenhanded mediation, something the americans have never managed to do. as well as that, both israelis and palestinians are going to have to accept painful compromises on things that really matter to them, especially territory. so much has to go right to move from war to peace. so much has already gone wrong that peace might just be impossible. jeremy bowen, bbc news, jerusalem. lewis: jeremy there raising several questions. we are going to dig into them now. a former u.s. assistant secretary of state for near eastern affairs, and the u.k.'s consul general in jerusalem in the mid-1990s, responsible for dealings with the palestinian authority after the oslo accords. thank you both very much for coming on the program. >> thank you. >> thank you. lewis: if we could start, david,

with you, i will come on the relations and the role of the u.s. in a moment. picking up some of the broad themes of jeremy bowen's report, where things stand now, what do you think has to happen to move towards peace? >> well, i think first of all, hamas can't be in control of gaza. these are not going to be a potential peace partner. but certainly i think the israelis are going to have to accept ultimately that there will have to be a palestinian partner out there that they can do business with. that's not this palestinian authority under mahmoud abbas, a guy going into his 19th year of a four-year term. but ultimately it will be the plo, and they are going to have to get beyond the raw feelings in the aftermath of october 7 and the intervening more. -- intervening war. lewis: interesting, so a partner with new personalities,

effectively. can i ask the same question to you, sir richard? >> i agree with david, and i agree and my heart goes out to s ilva for stating the obvious, that peace is the absolute necessity. and jeremy bowen is right to require major compromises from both. i would add that gaza is going to be really difficult over the next period, and envisaging a transition to a plo-based government there is going to take a long time. palestinian unity is going to be needed, that will mean, considering the views and stances of the leaders of hamas which will emerge, because not all hamas fighters are going to be killed and a new leaders will be there and will have to be reckoned with.

secondly, there is going to have to be very extensive aid agency presence in gaza to assist with the formation of a new government. there is going to have to be recruitment and training of a palestinian police force, maybe with some arab security presence. but that's for the medium term. in the short term we are going to have more war, well over 20,000 civilian deaths, we are going to be approaching the test for genocide, namely intend to destroy in whole or in part, taking into account the deprivation of food, the destruction of utilities. and it is going to take a long while to get to a situation in which israel and the palestinians are content to work with each other in the context of an emerging palestinian state. in the west bank it should be

quicker. lewis: david, let's pick up on i suppose the idea that sir richard raised possibly in the short term about happens in gaza. in your eyes, in the short term, when the fighting stops, what role does israel play? what role possibly an international force? how does it work before you got that unity of palestinian governance? what happens before that? david: even if the war ends and israel pulls out most of its troops from gaza, it will still play a heavy security role. hamas will not be entirely eradicated. there will still be hundreds if not thousands of gunmen wandering around. there will have to be some sort of international force. i think we can rule outhe u.n. after the sort of anemic, feckless role they have played inebanon, allowing hezbollah to rearm in contravention of the

security council resolution 1701. i don't think israel would deign to accept the u.n. -- lewis: so what kind of international organization is there if it is not you and-- the un? david: i think the united states is thinking of some kind of arab force. there are arab forces out there. the rapid reaction force in the gulf has 40,000 troops in it. this could be reconstituted with troops from countries that have relations not only with the palestinians, but with israel. i'm talking about bahrain, uae, saudi arabia, jordan, egypt. egypt has expressed some willingness to do this if there is a political horizon out there. this is something that is feasible. lewis: ok. let's move to specifically the relationship with the u.s. what do you make of the language change we have seen the last few days?

david: i think the state is getting increasingly concerned with not only the high number of civilian casualties, but with the timetable that israel has put forward. there is an understanding that hamas has to be degraded, that they have to lose power in gaza. there is also an understanding that there cannot be a return to the status quo. if hamas emerges from this war in control, there will be another war in a short time. but the united states understands that israel is going to have to complete the vast majority of its work and with less intensive airpower, something that results in less civilian casualty. and that is what the discussion is about right now, how israel is going to move to a different phase of operations. i would anticipate we are talking in terms of the united states' patience weeks, not

months. lewis: is that some thing you agree with, richard? sir richard: no, because the u.s. is weak. it hasn't used any leverage so far. it is bleating about potential strategic defeat for israel or criticism of indiscriminate warfare, not backed up in any way. israel is reading united states ' intentions quite differently. i am deeply pessimistic. i think that one of the key difficulties for making peace -- and i hope this is something where the united states will be able to take a lead -- is to rollback current israeli mythmaking. we hear statements that it is not possible to find a partner for peace cause they want estate from the river to the sea -- that is the palestinians. we hear that it is fighting for its existence.

clearly its existence is a state not under threat. the conclusion which has been drawn from these and other myths in israel is that it is they who should have the state from the river to the sea. it is time for a much more robust attitude by all israel's allies to make clear that the two state solution requires fundamental change, more change in israel, then in the arab side -- lewis: david, you are not here to represent the u.s., but just in 20 seconds as a right of reply -- i'm afraid we are nearly out of time, but if you want to respond to anything there. david: there are people on the right in israel that don't envision a two state solution, but i think the vast majority of israelis probably do. and it is a problem right now

with gaza being ruled by a group that doesn't believe in israel's right to exist. that is not going to be a piece partner for the palestinians or for the israelis. lewis: former u.s. assistant secretary of state for near eastern affairs, and sir richard dalton, the u.k.'s consul general in jerusalem in the mid-1990s, thank you both very much. so sobering and enlightening conversation. thank you. >> thank you. lewis: around the world and across the u.k., this is bbc news. let's look at some of the stores making the news now. new cctv footage has been release of the last known movement of a woman who has been missing since friday. dana lord, 55, was reported missing after failing to return home from work. police say there is a high probability that she went into the river in the city. specialist divers are continuing to search.

the father, stepmother, and uncle of a 10-year-old who died in her home have pleaded not guilty to her murder. they appead at the old bailey by videolink. french police say they found a british boy who disappeared in spain six years ago. alex batty from oldham near manchester disappeared along with his mother and grandfather while on holiday. police i a town near toulouse said a minute matching the description was brought to them wednesday morning. right, you are live with bbc news. next we are going to head to russia. vladimir putin held his first major press conference since he launched the full-scale invasion of ukraine. he said russia's objectives hasn't changed and peace

with ukraine will only take place "when we achieve our objectives." our russia editor steve rosenberg was there. steve: there haven't been many, actually any opportunities for western media to get anywhere near vladimir putin since his full-scale invasion of ukraine. but today, the kremlin invited us and other foreign media to the president's end-of-year tv extravaganza, half press conference, half phone-in. on the war in ukraine, he is sending confident. pres. putin: there will be peace when we achieve our goals. they haven't changed. practically along the entire line of contact our armed forces are, to put it modestly, improving their position. they are in an active stage of operation. steve: there was a definite military theme to the show, which was broadcast by every main tv channel in russia and

went on for hours. the public had plenty of questions about what the kremlin's still calling it specialist lori operation, like with their beat -- would there be a new wave of mobilization in russia. mr. putin said no. this didn't happen following the full-scale invasion of ukraine. the fact that the four-hour tv marathon is back reflects his growing confidence nearly two years into the war. he was asked about two americans being held in russian jails, "wall street journal" reporter evan gershkovich and former marine paul wheeling. is a prisoner swap possible? pres. putin: we want to do a deal, but these agreements should be mutually beneficial. we're in contact with our american partners on this

matter. dialogue is underway. it is not easy. i won't go into detail, but in general i think we understand each other, and i hope that we will find a solution. steve: irina was lucky, she got a question about big prices. "you're my favorite president," she says. all i got after four hours was a sore arm. pity that. i have so many questions for vladimir putin. another day perhaps. steve rosen, bbc news, moscow. lewis: good stuff from steve there. we will move to ukraine, because the priority for president zelenskyy is getting more money and supplies to keep the fight going. earlier this week he tried and failed to convince hard-line republicans in washington to approve $60 billion in funding for his war effort. today he turned to brussels.

eu leaders met to discuss a 78 billion-euro aid package and the opening of a formal negotiations for ukraine to join the eu. they have agreed to start those proceedings, but just like in washington, there are hold outs when it comes to funding. hungary's leader viktor orbán gave the green light to ukraine's e.u. membership talks starting, but he has suggested he could potentially block funding plans. let's speak with kurt volker, former u.s. ambassador to nato and former u.s. special envoy for ukraine. thank you very much for coming on the program. >> thank you for having me. lewis:et's start with the latest funding round, as it work. what is your assessment of zelenskyy's efforts? >> it was unrealistic to think he was going to get a vote on in washinon this week without the administration and congress agreeing on what to do about the southern border, nothing to do

with ukraine at all. you have a majority of republicans in both chambers, majority democrats in both chambers who want to ukraine. but the republicans feel they need political cover to show they are doing something about u.s. security on the southern border first in order to justify the spending for ukraine as well. it sounds now like the administration and congress are close to a deal, and this will probably happen, but not until january. lewis: moving to the eu? ah, you just froze -- kurt: it was a bit uof a surprise that the open -- can you see no? lewis: carry on. kurt: thank you. it was a bit of a surprise that they agreed on the a session talks already. special agent just a few days ago was that they would cut a deal with hungary on funding,

re-leasing some fun in a change forgetting the ukraine funding, but maybe that he would hold out on session talks. i think it is positive that they agreed on session talks already. i suspected the next thing will be in agreement on funding as well with the release of funds for hungry and the approval of the budget for ukraine. lewis: interesting. let's move on to the bigger picture. presuming you are right about the money and the funding and military aid and the supplies, what is your view of the status of the war right now, and i am not going to ask you for time skills or anything like that, but the real worry of a stalemate kicking in? kurt: i do think you are going to see some fairly little movement right now on the front line. i don't think the russians are able to advance. they keep throwing wave after wave of people at the front lines, especially around hadith got, but they are not getting anywhere.

the ukrainians have decided to shift to more defensive posture and you will not see a lot of movement. what is needed is for better technology and longer-range equipment to get to the ukrainians so that they -- lewis: kurt, we heard everything up till you started talking about better technology and then you froze, so that is the perfect note to end, and i'm afraid we will leave it there. thank you very much for your time, thanks for coming on the program. that was kurt volker there. do stay with us. plenty more to come. i am back in a couple minutes. i'm lewis vaughan narrator: funding for this presentation of this program is provided by... narrator: financial services firm, raymond james. man: bdo. accountants and advisors.

narrator: funding was also provided by, the freeman foundation. and by judy and peter blum kovler foundation; pursuing solutions for america's neglected needs. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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