going to do about this? and you know, jimmy carter looks at her and goes, well i guess we've got to do something about it. and, you are in charge. so, there starts rosalynn carter's move to take care of those who are going through mental health challenges, and caregiving. and, she didn't stop. so the rosalynn carter institute for caregivers, i was just speaking with the team of the day, and clearly this is a loss for generations of people who have seen what she has done. i was just with them on thursday, as they were celebrating what she stood for in minneapolis. and so, the work in which she stood for for so long definitely continues, and the idea of rosalynn carter. >> hey richard, when you were interviewing her, what stood out to you about her personality? >> so, this is what stood out. and we talk about the love story. so, they sat side by side when i interviewed them once. and yeah, they walked over

holding hands, and then i think they're the presidential couple with the most pd a. ever, and we can get into that if you'd like. but, what happened when he was answering questions about the middle east, she would go like this. and you know, her -- because we interview. and the mic was on her to, but it didn't pick up. she was so good she was -- she was telling him what the right answer was, and then he gave us the right answer. he corrected himself. so, they were a true couple in politics, and in love. >> a true partnership. >> yes. >> a true partnership. richard louis, thankful for you, appreciate it. that wraps up for everybody, for this hour. i am yasmin vossoughian, i'll be off for thanksgiving week. and i wish you and your family a very peaceful holiday. simone starts right. now >>mone starts right. now >>

and close adviser, in an out of the white house, for more than three quarters of a century. softspoken, politically savvy, and fiercely determined, rosalynn carter was known as

the steel magnolia. and, she made the role of first lady her own. born rosalynn smith in planes georgia, she was a neighbor to jimmy carter three years her senior. >> i was shy, and found out that he was so easy to talk to. and we just kind of hit it off really well. i think i was already in love with. tim >> they married in 1946, when she was 18. >> rosalynn and i have been equally and totally dedicated partners, even when i was still learning living as a peanut farmer. >> jimmy ran the family farm, rosalynn help manage the business. they raised a family, three sons, and later daughter amy. jimmy got into politics, elected georgia governor in 1970. and then running for president with rosalynn's enthusiastic support. >> when i think they got to know, and if they know, hill vote for him. >> thank you both very much. >> she is completely objective and unbiased. [laughter] >> i love politics.

>> the small town girl with a poor family, never finished college, and thrived on the national stage. >> every day i see things that i think i can help with, and things that i want to learn more about. >> jimmy carter won the election, with the rosalynn playing a key role. >> i was involved with the selection of the vice president. >> she was front and center from the start, attending cabinet meetings, leading on policy issues, including mental health. becoming the first first lady since eleanor roosevelt to testify before congress. >> i am here as a concerned citizen. >> there are so many opportunities. and if i don't use the influence i have to help those people who need help, i think it's a terrible waste. >> she served as president carter's -- taking high-profile trips to latin america, and asia. >> i think that i am the closest to the president of united states. and if i can help him and understanding the countries of the world, then that's what i came to. do >> often, more popular than

the president himself, she was his advocate in chief. >> i am proud of jimmy carter and the job he is doing. and he is without a doubt, the best -- in our country, to see us through these times. >> but faced with a troubled economy, and a painful hostage crisis, carter lost to ronald reagan in 1980. and the carters returned to planes. >> they founded the carter center. and together, began a remarkable decades long post presidency, devoted to human rights, international diplomacy, eradicating disease, and year after year, building low income housing with habitat for humanity. >> in 1999, they were awarded the presidential medal of freedom. >> i think -- there is life after the white house. >> through it all, she remained her husband's greatest champion. >> it irritates me when people say he's been a good former

president. he was a good president. i don't worry about his place in history. >> as for her own place in history, rosalynn carter wastes. >> i just hope people think i did the best i could. >> that was nbc's lester holt. joining me now on of the phone is nbc senior white house correspondent kelly o'donnell. kelly, thank you for hopping on the phone. i know that you have covered mrs. carter extensively, in 2004. i mean take it all the back in 2004, and we see did a four part series on americas first ladies. and mrs. carter was one of those first ladies that you covered, and had an interview with her. what, can you just talk a little bit about her legacy and the impact she had, not just on the white house, but on america? >> well i am happy to do that, simone. and it is good to be with you, and to have a chance to talk about her contributions, and her service. what i so vividly remember

about that visit with her in planes, when we were doing that serious about first ladies, is i posed a question to her about the fact that president carter, especially at that time when he was still very vigorous and healthy, and very publicly involved. they were doing their habitat for humanity, they were working to eradicate illness around the world through the carter center. they were working to protect to preserve democracy and the sanctity of elections around the globe. all of those very active things. and i described it in a question to her, about her husband being viewed as one of the finest former presidents. thinking that might be a nice question. well, she voted quite differently, simone. she was very irritated with me about that. and made it clear that she believed her husband was a great president, that history would ultimately judge that. and, it was not any kind of

consolation to her that he was so highly regarded. and he has been highly regarded for his service after the white house. so, i knew in that moment in engaging with her, what a partner she has been to president carter. and, how much she was fiercely loyal, and fiercely involved in his success, and all of the achievements he had. but also, as someone who would not let a narrative about service after the white house diminish his time in the white house. and with that, i got quite a bond with, her because i could feel her passion. i could see the work, and the importance of all of that. and what really stands out to me is that i was there to see mrs. carter, we spent a lot of time together. and as you know from doing interviews, often when you earn in an interview situation, you have the bright lights brought in for television, and then the rest of the room can be quite

dark, as you try to control the lights. and that was the case when i was meeting with her in -- but what i did not know is that standing behind me in the dark was president carter. and when the interview wrapped, and i said my thank-yous, and we were going on to do the next part of that special report, he was there to support her. and i had a chance to speak with him, and to spend time with him, and we've gotten to know each other over the years. and that experience is what i hold so dear about getting to know them. i love covering politics. and presidents and politicians, and it is most exquisite to me when you got to see their public life, and their personal, life and their humanity. and i got to do that in that time of. tim >> he was there for her, and she had always been there for him. and in just the time of doing that story, that was very vivid to me. in the time in the years since when i've gone to, plants and when we have done coverage

related to the carters, what i'm also struck by is how the good works that they talked about, have extended to their home community, where they have lots of organizations where people are looking out for others. and of course, at the carter center, where they had a global impact with work around the world. these are two people who made the most of their very long lives. and, i think in a week of thanksgiving, many americans will take time to thank them for their service, and to remember her. also, a mother of four, a grandmother and great grandmother, someone very involved in her home truck, church in her home community. and, some who tried to make an impact around the world. so, i am struck by all of her gift to the nation, and to humanity, and the humanitarian work that she did. and, she was very much someone who loved being in politics, and that feels very different

in a world where we are today, and where we talk about day in and day out about our politics. they represent a time of nobility in public service, and of contribution, and of treating others, even your adversaries with respect. and so, those are things that i think many people will look to in these days, as we remember roseland harder. >> simone? >> she truly is just one of the great first ladies of this country. kelly, before i let you go, if you just talk about the impact that mrs. carter had on the office of the first lady. she transformed the office, as i said in my opening. not just for herself, but for every first lady after her. it is because of rosalynn carter the office of the first lady is organized into social and personal, and scheduling in advance, and special projects. like, she made a job. can we talk a little bit about her impact in that role for all of the first ladies? >> and it is so important,

because of course it is an unelected in unpaid position. and yet, one of enormous influence. so many of our first ladies are often more popular than the president himself. overtime, over many examples. and they are out in a very special place in american life. often when we can -- . she wanted to do more than, that she was an adviser, she was a juror direct diplomatic and busari for president carter. that was not done, and it is not often known that her birth name is eleanor rosalynn smith. and so, she in many ways was -- a lot like eleanor roosevelt. in that she had an outsized advisor role, and she felt that it was her place to do that. and she had been a partner in life in a family business, and in politics and she brought that approach and sensibility

we them whenever subjects at interest to her. and why was this controversial and she had seen, and some of the types of structured that you mentioned that she had brought to what we prefer to as the east wing, and has other first ladies who have also had prominent and -- influence in the public life of the nation, in their husbands administration and so forth. and so her legacy in that area will certainly continue. and for anyone who is listening to, us who had taken care of an elderly parent, or a sick family member, she really put the notion of caregiving into a whole new level of american investment. and she had a whole institute related to caregiving, to give support to those who do caregiving, and resources and help.

and that is a -- and in those years from 1977 to 1981, in the office, she was an active first lady in a way that resonates today, and advisor, and a person who could really give counsel to the president, when there were big and difficult issues that played out. the election defeat to ronald reagan was crashing to her. but overtime, especially with -- with reclaiming their life in georgia, to that a lot of listening back and really far-reaching thank you thank you, nbc's kelly o'donnell. now i want to go to nbc's chief washington foreign affairs correspondent andrea mitchell. andrea, thank you for joining us. you also covered -- and no you've had the opportunity to interview mrs. carter on a number of occasions.

you, awhile back, sat down with three former first ladies of the same time. mrs. carter was one of them, to talk about their impact and reflect on their time in the white house. i just want to talk about just the range of projects of interest that rosalynn carter had. everything from habitat to humanity, to mental health. but she was also very involved in foreign policy. traveling across the world, really, on behalf of the president, speaking on very weighty issues. >> absolutely. she was a complete partner, a political partner initially -- their life together was so long and extended. such a blessing to them both. in fact, jimmy carter's mother delivered -- which is remarkable. and when she was the infant, rosalynn carter --

three days old. -- the midwife brought jimmy, her son, who was three years old, to see the newborn infant that she had just delivered. so they knew each other all their lives in some way or another. grew up together in a very small town. i covered them -- thanksgivings, christmas says, back up to the white house correspondent, officially covering the white house, but i was just the person who did a lot of holidays with them. first on christmas morning, we've got amiss lillian's house -- we'd often gifts their, and then we would go to -- amy was just a little girl. probably 11 or 12 in those days. rosalynn carter would attend which -- was not done by hillary clinton. and she was just the most, you know, forward first lady and

partner to him and everything that they did together. but she really, and he was so proud of what she did on mental health, that was a lifelong commitment. i remember some years back when a mutual friend an acquaintance, who is a very prominent republican, former reagan chief of protocol, had died, and was at a memorial service, i was speaking at the service and philadelphia. and we saw in the green room, special guests, reverend carter. and i was quite surprised to see one of the close friends of nancy and ronald reagan was being remembered by rosalynn carter. and i asked, how did you know her? and she said, well, she financed my mental health books for many years across the country. we work together on mental health. so she did so many things that were not really known and appreciated at the time, and

traveling around the world, and one of the first interviews we did, in fact the first interview i think i did with her was when jimmy carter in 1978, september 78, was at the camp david we. meaning, the famous camp david accord between egypt wind israel. -- when they find the agreement -- 1979, march of 1979, it was september when they were negotiating. it was labor day. so labor day, 1978, rosalynn carter filled in for jimmy carter, campaigning in texas for a democratic senate candidate. and i was assigned to that. that's the first time that as a correspondent for msnbc, i -- went into the air force space, got on the first ladies plane,

traveled, and did an interview with her that night, on the night before labor day. and we were in san antonio, and i just remember the first lady and how memorable she was, and how to didn't she was to the politics in texas. she said she loved politics, and she did. she was a great campaign partner. some first ladies didn't love politics so much, but she certainly did. she dove right in, and it was that way, of course, when they were running in georgia, when he became governor and she was first lady. we know from history he was in the improbable candidate as the governor of georgia. somehow, you know, he won in the early race in iowa, and the rest was history. so, she jumped right into it. and as my colleague kelly was saying, she really was crushed

when they lost when ronald reagan. and it was during the iran hostage crisis but so shadowed their final year in office. it was so overwhelming, even when he was taking his last trips, last campaign trips across the country and had to rush back, because there was talk of a possible agreement to release the hostages. you mean recall, symone, that's so sadly, and manipulative lee bybee iranians, they didn't we release the hostages until 1 am. -- that night, i was in the air force base again at midnight, when he was taking off for germany to go and greet the hostages in germany, where they were going to ramstein for medical treatment we. he thought it was his duty to do that for ronald reagan. the reagan's were celebrating at the ball, which you can

understand, it was their inauguration, and jimmy carter, and his first active duty, of service as a former president, was going to greet the returning hostages and escort them home. his life of service was just remarkable. my last interviews with them when they were doing habitat for humanity project, and they came on my program from wherever they were doing their home construction on msnbc, and i just always loved going to the carter center and talking to them, and of course, covering president carter when he traveled around the world. >> nbc's andrea mitchell, thank you so much for this valuable insight as we remember first lady rosalynn carter, who died earlier today. the reactions are pouring in, and statements are pouring in. we have the carter center and the former president prior to releasing statements, reading,

in part, about the former first lady, from president carter, it says, rosalynn was my equal partner in everything i ever accomplished. she gave me why his guidance and encouragement when i needed it. as long as rosalynn was in the world, i always knew somebody loved and supported me. we also have reaction from the current first lady of the united states of america, doctor biden. she was at an event today for military families, at thanksgiving, we want to play those remarks for you right now. >> i'm sorry that i have to leave this off with a sad announcement. former first lady rosalynn carter has just passed, and she was well known for her efforts on mental health and caregiving, and women's rights. so i hope that during the

holidays, you'll consider including the carter family in your prayers. >> reaction is also starting to come in from lawmakers, both in georgia, across the country, as well as congressional leadership from senator raphael warnock. he writes, first lady rosalynn carter is a remarkable woman of great faith and her service to georgia and our country is part of an -- important like a city. -- there are also statements down from senator jon ossoff extending his deepest control and says, as well as senate majority leader chuck schumer, who writes, first lady rosalynn carter dedicated her life to serving others. america has lost a passionate humanitarian, and champion for people all over the world. my heart goes out to her family, and statements from house minority leader hakeem jeffries, noting he's deeply saddened by the passing of rosalynn carter. a beloved first lady, and wonderful humanitarian.

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legacy of first lady rosalynn carter. she was a georgia native born and raised down the street from future president jimmy carter, and former first lady of the peach state. for more, i want to bring in téa mitchell. she's a washington correspondent for the atlanta journal-constitution. téa, thank you so much for being here. can you just give us some insight on how this loss is being felt in georgia right now? >> well, it's a loss that really is gonna reverberate in georgia as everyone knows georgia is the home of first lady rosalynn carter and her husband, jimmy.

it's where they were born and raised in rural georgia. she's the former first lady of georgia. and after they left the presidency, the white house, they returned to georgia. they returned to planes, where they lived ever since they made a statement in georgia as far as what you can do in retirement. the carter center, of course, is in atlanta. they are georgia through and through. and again, not just the former president from georgia, but the former first family of georgia that occupied the governor's mansion. of course, first lady cara's with jimmy carter every step of the way. so this is definitely a day that all of georgia is in mourning. >> can you talk a little bit about the impact that the carters have had on their hometown of plains, georgia? i remember just in september, the 26th annual peanut festival in planes, the former first lady and the former president,

they made an appearance in the car. i think it made a lot of -- it was just good for folks in town to see them, given everything that they've done for planes, georgia. >> yeah. and i mean, it's not just planes. places like a tiny, tiny town. it's hard to imagine how small planes is if you've never been there. i don't even know if they have a full stoplight. it might just be like, one blinking light. but it's a very small town. but even the towns near planes, americas, albany, other counties, all of sumpter county, they all consider jimmy carter one of their own. anyone who grew up in that area, in rural southwest georgia, they have a carter story. seeing the carters at the store, where perhaps being taught or

going to school with or playing sports with someone in the extended carter family. but, you know, it's just a big impact. it's more than a hometown hero for them. because again, it goes to show you that even someone from a small, rural town can become the leader of the free world. the president of the united states. so there's so much pride, particularly in that part of georgia. but again, and all of georgia, because the carter center is in georgia, it's far from planes, atlanta is probably a three or four hour drive from plains. so he left his mark, from south georgia all the way to north georgia. >> what can you tell us about first lady carter's win plans for her memorial services? do we know anything yet about them? >> well, we don't have any specifics about the memorial, but what we do know is that their final resting place is

the home that she shared with president carter. they built. when they lived there, they only left twice. when he served as governor, and when he served as president. otherwise, that home in plains is where they lived, it's where they've been convalescing, quite frankly, for the last few months, as president carter entered hospice and then recently, first lady carter entered hospice. and so, they both will be buried on that property. right now, that property is private property, because they lived there. but eventually, after both of them had passed away, whatever that would be, that house will then become part of the jimmy carter national historic park, in addition to things like his firearm, the school that they both attended, and eventually, members of the public will be able to visit their burial

location. but that will be down the road, because again, president carter is still with us. but that is where she will be buried. bio below tree at her home in plains. >> téa mitchell, thank you very much. and now, i want to bring in my friend, richard lui lui. he worked with the carters on the affordable housing work in haiti, and collaborated -- caregivers. richard, i know you have a story about why this is carter's start of the institute for caregivers. can you tell us? give us a little insight? >> yeah. the story is certainly in character of what we've heard so far, symone, and what you and i know of rosalynn carter. when he was running for president, jimmy carter, she was out talking to various citizens of that town in georgia, and she had met a family that was out of luck, if you will, and they were going through, at least the way she told it to her team at the rosalynn carter institute for caregivers, there are mental

health challenges, and they're trying to take care of a sick or disabled loved one in the family. and so she was so taken aback by this, this very consistent in her work professionally as well as an community -- she got in line to talk to the governor, the candidate for governor, happened to be jimmy carter, happen to be her husband. and what she does, simone, is when our turn comes up in line, she says, well, say, what are you gonna do about these folks who need help when they have these mental health challenges? when they're going through taking care of a loved one and they don't have the resources? and he was taken aback for many reasons. and he says, well, i guess we've got to do something about it. and you're gonna be the one, i hope. and that started what she did 40, 50 years ago. at this level, the first person, leader of a country, part of a first couple, that lead on this topic. >> so, richard, the work that

she did uncaring giving is just immense. and i know it's an issue that is near and dear to your heart. have we heard from the institute today? what has the rosalynn carter institute for caregivers side since her passing? >> first off, there are big family. it's not only the great grandchildren, the grandchildren, and the children that are now going through a very emotional time. and we can't forget that. because they're very close knit. but it's also those who are in her community at the rosalynn carter institute for caring for us. i was just with them this past week. i was the -- others who have really worked to carry on her legacy. they just released the statement from the rosalynn carter institute for caregivers. her namesake, and what she stood for. they say, this is coming from jennifer olson, the chief executive officer. she says, like so many people

around the world, we are heartbroken by the passing of former first lady, lifelong humanitarian, beloved founder, rosalynn carter. mrs. carter spent her life fighting for mental health, parity, and lifting up the voice of family caregivers. she founded us 36 years ago, and since that time, she's remained deeply connected to the organization and our work. her voice and vision are at the heart of everything we do, and she will always be our north star. they go on to finish, mrs. carter often reminded us to do what you can to show you care about other people, and you will make our world a better place. there is no doubt that this world is a far better place because of mrs. carter's carrying heart. finishing here, as we mourn her loss, please consider honoring mrs. carter's memory with a heartfelt thank you to a caregiver in your life, just as she would've done. and they just launched this website, by the way, simone. it's rosalynn carter tribute

dot org. it just went up. rosalynn carter tribute dot org. you will learn how to give you our tribute as well, some interesting details about her life, her love of the monarch butterfly, for instance. again, why, symone? because it was endangered, becoming extinct. so she leaned in on it, and said, let's do this together. so very consistent. now, of course, without the former president having his chief caregiver, rosalynn there, we can only think of now what he is going for. he has his fate, as you know, being a sunday school teacher many many years. >> richard lui, thank you very much, my friend. we will be right back with more on the legacy of former first lady rosalynn carter. rter (carolers ♪ iphone 15 pro, your husband deserves it! ♪ (mom) carolers? to tell me you want a new iphone? a better plan is verizon. (vo) black friday starts now. turn any iphone in any condition into a new iphone 15 pro

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who were kidnapped by hamas and its october 7th attack. this would include a possible pause in fighting for several days to get the hostages out. sources, however, emphasize that nothing has been finalized yet, and that any tentative deal could still fall apart. deputy national security advisor jon finer spoke to my colleague, kristen welker, this morning on meet the press about what could be included in the deal, including how many hostages could be released. >> i believe we are closer than we have been in quite some time, maybe closer than we've been since the beginning of this process. we're talking about considerably more than 12. but beyond that, i want to see where this goes, i don't want to say anything that would jeopardize actually the completion of the deal, which is the most important thing. it's not clear if any of the ten americans, including a three-year-old girl, would be among the hostages released. and the timing of this deal, it couldn't be more urgent with the israel defense forces announcing this week that the bodies of at least two hostages have been found in gaza.

joining me now to discuss is new york times white house correspondent katie rogers. former clinton white house aide keep boykin, and former assistant secretary of state -- we're gonna talk about this latest development in a moment. but first, katie, you wrote a book about first ladies. american women, the transformation of the modern first lady from hillary clinton to jill biden. what can you tell us about former first lady rosalynn carter? we've been talking about her impact on the office of the first lady and just how she transformed the role for first ladies after her. >> yeah. i think what was so revolutionary about her is that she was a full partner to her husband, and it was always completely normal with them. it was always seen as a given that she would be alongside her husband, campaigning and delivering messages to the american people, mainly with running -- people with caregiving concerns on the campaign trail, and really tying that into her role

as first lady. she sat in regularly on cabinet meetings and national security council meetings. that's something that was not done with regularity until she was first lady. and it was something about the carters didn't treat as unusual. it was just, they were a package deal, almost. years before bill and hillary clinton would sort of present themselves to the american people stylistically and a very different way. but the carters for completely partners, and the other interesting thing about rosalynn carter was that she established really what we know as the modern -- she was the first first lady to name a chief of staff to the east wing. a woman named edith double. and she really laid the groundwork for what we think of the east wing today we. >> definitely laid the groundwork. she also was very involved in foreign policy. and i previously, earlier in this hour, spoke with my colleague, andrea mitchell, who

talked about how she advised former president carter during the camp david accords. and i cannot help but think of the slight similarities between the hostage situation in iran during the camp david accords, and the current situation that the u.s. and israel find themselves in negotiating the release -- attempting to negotiate the release of 240 hostages. you have some reporting, katie, and you pointed out in your latest report that in john finer's interview that you just played a piece of with kristen welker, he didn't specify if u.s. officials believed u.s. was following -- israel's following international law and how they've been conducting their military operations. what does that signal to you? >> it signals to me that the biden administration is really doing all it can to message and signal that it does not want to be a judge and jury around what israel is doing right now to eradicate hamas. during a pack, i was --

the summit was focused much on the presidents meeting with xi jinping of china. his aides were working pretty much all around the clock on relaying what was going on on the ground in gaza, and i think that the administration really operates from a place of hamas is not going to relent, hamas is going to keep attacking, and that is sort of the decision the president has made regardless of the criticism that has been directed his way. and i think, you know, based on how officials around him are operating, they really don't want to get into questions of international law right now, even as there's so much criticism about what is being done and how israel's operation is being carried out. >> keith, let's just talk about some of this criticism, and how lawmakers are reacting.

you had a number of lawmakers now who are talking about potentially conditioning aid to israel, which is something that has not been done before. a number of lawmakers made the ranch this morning on the sunday show saying just that. how do you think this is gonna play out, keefe? because i do think that there are growing, various factions, if you will, within the democratic party apparatus here at home, but the president is balancing that along with his duty internationally, and trying to ensure that, you know, the united states and israel can still have a good working relationship. that the united states can still be influential, and as i noted yesterday, i think that might be hard for the president to do if he is -- breaking prime minister netanyahu over the coals and public. >> i think this is a very difficult situation for president biden. his support for the israel

offensive in gaza is extremely unpopular, not only in the nation, but also people in the democratic party, particularly among young people. and that poses a problem for him, because he needs people to turn out for him to vote in 2024. so there's a real political issue that he's facing, a challenge he's facing. there's also the question of, what is the endgame here? how long does this continue? even assuming hamas is eradicated, what does that look like? what comes after hamas? and where does the united states stand with a post-hamas gaza, if that's even a conceivable thing? in addition to that, what about bibi netanyahu? does the united states really want to be aligned with netanyahu's government? it's unpopular here, it's unpopular in israel. i think the president has put himself in a bit of a -- he's in a position that is very difficult to maneuver out of with a base that's increasingly more pro palestine than pro

israel. and he's gotta negotiate his way through that. >> in his recent op-ed, president biden reiterated his support for a two-state solution, and the removal of hamas. joel, you served in the state department during the 2014 gaza war. talk a little bit about the obstacles to removing hamas from power while also re-stabilizing the region. is this a realistic goal? >> you've got it, symone. look, this is not a simple process. -- there has to be concurrent activities. and certainly, hamas has been a spoiler. we have to remind everybody about this reality that hamas since the 1990s has been a primary obstacle to peace between israel and the palestinians. hamas, throughout the palestinian authority leadership and gaza in 2007, pushing them to ramallah, and has its own base of corporations -- reconciliation. so a key baseline for any

potential to states pollution is gonna have to be the removal of hamas from a powerful position in palestinian politics. but there does need to be in and state when -- real diplomacy, policy in authority engagement across gaza and the west bank, and that means engaging our allies in the arab world to support that dynamic. as we discussed. look, gaza, 2014, this has been a repetitive series of wars and ongoing vaccine fourths between israel and hamas, related to gaza. and i think what we're seeing now is real determination from the white house to say this is the final one, but we do need to move towards a real diplomatic solution between the palestinians and israelis. >> paul reuben, keith boykin, bank you very much. we'll be right back. connect with an advisor to create your personalized plan. let's find the right investments for your goals okay, great. j.p. morgan wealth management.

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the loss of rosalynn carter, whose impact transformed the role of first lady. she created the office, and work to tie the modern office that we knew today, and worked tirelessly for the american people during her time in the white house, and continued her service for the rest of her life. and i want to bring on nbc news -- historian, michael beschloss, and chief correspondent for the new york times, peter baker. peter, can you talk about the transformation we saw from this first lady and the impact it's had on first ladies today? particularly as it relates to her relationship, her

involvement, within advising president carter. i mean, from the camp david accords, to her work in latin america, she was quite active. >> you're absolutely right about that. and of course, michael knows this better than anybody, but we think about all of nor roosevelt, who a clinton, but rosalynn carter really defined the office in a lot of ways for all the first ladies that followed. she was a life partner for jimmy carter since the beginning. she helped him get into politics, get into the governor's mansion in georgia, get into the white house, and when she was that, she was probably his most trusted advisor. he was at camp david during those negotiations. she was there in cabinet meetings, she was a national security briefings. she traveled the world, and had not just ceremonial -- but substantive role. because of her demeanor, which was shy and low-key, it didn't make the same kind of cultural impact that i think hillary clinton later webb. but she created a real modern office of the first lady.

>> michael, president carter was known to credit mrs. carter with giving him shrewd political advice. as peter said, she took on the role of emissary. just how, exactly, did she impact her husband's legacy? >> well, one way to say it is, i was once talking to jimmy carter, he invited me to come with him to watch him and teach -- university in atlanta, and on the way, he said, my definition of a good day is when rosalynn is nice to me. and that didn't mean that they didn't have a great marriage. they had a wonderful marriage. she was always nice to him. but what he meant by that was, she had such enormous expectations for him that if he gave a speech that was a b plus, she wasn't gonna tell him it wasn't a. he'd listen to her advice the whole time. and i agree with what peter had said, and others. she was the first modern first lady. for instance, you, symone, you know the bidens really well. if you -- went to a cabinet meeting with

the president, people would probably say -- good ideas. but they have such a great parts near ship? rosalynn carter did the starting in 1977, and a lot of people went crazy. even democrats, saying who is this eva perrone? we -- makes jimmy carter look weak. one reason why the difference is because of rosalynn carter changing our expectations we. >> michael beschloss, peter baker, thank you very much. such an important, important legacy that mrs. carter left. and thank you all it home for watching symone on this sunday afternoon. i'm symone sanders thompson. politics nation with the great al sharpton will start right after this quick break. stay with us. with us

>> good evening, and welcome to politicsnation.