hey, everybody, back with you on this second hour of "chris jansing reports." i'm yasmin vossoughian. at this hour, george santos out of congress.

the overwhelming house vote to expel him, and the competitive special election to fill his barely cold seat, and the country now mourning the loss of the first female supreme court justice known as an undenial swing vote on the bench, sandra day o'connor, that's coming up. and overseas, fighting has resumed inside of gaza with israel launching terror strikes across the territory and dropping leaflets with a warning to civilians to move further south. one palestinian telling nbc news this, every ten to 15 minutes there have been strikes. it has been all around us. we begin with that historic breaking news on capitol hill, new york republican george santos now the sixth house member ever to be expelled from congress, the first in over 20 years. more than 2/3 majority, 311 of his colleagues voted to remove him from office following a scathing house ethic report and 23 count indictment on fraud

charges. his seat is in the hands of new york governor kathy hochul. the governor gave her reaction to the expulsion earlier today. >> when you look at his lack of ethics, and the fact that he has not served the people of our state, particularly new york 3 where he resides, it's been abysmal run for him. and he has not done what he has to do for new yorkers, and i'm glad he's gone. i need people i can work with to fight for new york, to bring federal money to our state, to create jobs and opportunities and george santos just took up space. >> joining us now, nbc news national political correspondent steve kornacki, and carlos car bello of florida, what stood out to you? >> first of all, there's the fact that it happened. this was the third attempt this year to have an expulsion vote for santos. the first one got referred to

the ethics committee in the spring. there was one a month ago that did get a vote. it failed at that time, as you can see here. what changed between then and today, it was that ethics report that came out in the middle of november. as you can see an overwhelming number. there had been talk before the vote that republican leadership was sending signals to members to vote against this, but that didn't really materialize on the floor. so clearly ahead of the 2/3 majority needed for expulsion. he is the sixth member of the house in the history of the country to be expelled. just to put this in perspective. these three in the top row here, oh, let me go back to that one here. these three in the top row. try this one more time. there it is. these three in the top row were expelled in the 1861 because they were fighting for the confederacy. they took up arms against the union. there was michael meyers from pennsylvania in 1980, undercover

fbi agents, they offered him a $50,000 bribe. he was convicted of bribery charges. refused to leave the house, they expelled him, and in 2022, jim trifecant of ohio, refused to leave the house. they expelled him. george santos to join the list. he hinted at this, the third district of new york that santos won a seat in in 2022, this was that election, the third district of new york voted for joe biden in 2020 by eight points, so this special election that's going to play out sometime in the next three months, democrats are feeling very bullish about their chances. just think of the overall balance of power in the house. it started today at 222-213. if democrats win the special election, there's a distinct

possibility, 221-214, and the other wrinkle is who was leading the expulsion push, who was introducing this expulsion motion, other republicans from this area of new york because right down here in this district, republican district, anthony d'esposito, this district voted for biden by double digits in 2020. biden district held by a republican. biden district held by a republican. you see how narrow that republican majority is. these republicans come from very similar districts in new york, and i think fear that this scandal is going to sort of spread beyond the boundaries of ny3, and potentially cost them what were very closely won seats by republicans in 2022, where they made the difference in getting them the house, could cost them the house in 2024. >> steve mentioning d'esposito, the first to speak when the debate began ahead of the vote that happened earlier today. how excited does it make our

viewers to be seeing you doing math on the screen. looking forward acceptable to an election year, which is you around the corner. get those khakis ready, steve kornacki, thank you. carlos, let's talk about the numbers that steve laid out for us, and i want to ask you as to which number we should be focusing on here when it comes to looking at the state of the republican party. 112 voting to keep him and two democrats, which numbers are you focussing on and should we be focusing on as well? >> i do think it's pretty extraordinary that that many republicans voted to expel santos. this is remarkable. anytime a member of congress gets removed, it's rare, but he was removed despite the fact that he had not been convicted of any crime. that will probably happen in a few months, but that has been

the standard in recent years, in recent decades. members of congress tend to be very generous with each other, very patient when they're embroiled in scandal, but the degree of embarrassment and the degree of revulsion that's a lot of members felt in reaction to santos' conduct really did convince them to take this step. so, look, i think everyone should have probably voted to remove him, given his record. but given the standards we're accustomed to seeing in the house and senate, this is extraordinary, and to have that many members from his own party reject them, that was also a big deal. >> so i asked mike murphy a similar question in our last hour about speaker mike johnson voting to keep george santos. he said it would set a precedent. he said vote with your conscience. he voted essentially on his own along with the 111 other republicans that voted to keep

him. that being said, what does that say about republican leadership in the house? >> i think it says that republican leadership continues to worry that they have such a narrow majority and it's so difficult to get anything done, and that a handful of members can topple a speaker of the house. so i think that on the one hand there's some principled arguments as to why, perhaps, members shouldn't been expelled until they're convicted of a crime. but on the other hand, there's a very practical consideration of this narrow margin that republicans have in the house, and speaker johnson and his leadership team certainly can't afford to lose any members. so i'm sure that was part of the calculation as well, but at the end of the day, if this had been a priority for leadership, speaker johnson would have whipped it. he decided to take a step back. i think that everyone, especially those members from the long island area that steve highlighted, everyone was done with george santos. >> if i'm hearing you clearly,

much of it was about keeping a bigger majority, keeping more power. former congressman, carlos curbello, thank you. justice sandra day o'connor has passed at the age of 93. what a life and legacy. i want to bring in chief washington correspondent, host of "andrea mitchell reports," thank you for joining us on this. she was the first female supreme court justice. what message did her time on the bench send to women? it was extraordinary. i cannot overstate when he was appointed and confirmed she was the most powerful woman in america, clearly. she was a role model. she was very strong, you know, shy when she arrived. i was there when she arrived at the airport, assigned to cover her on the way in, surrounded by people, always very polite.

she gradually became such a force for women in particular. she was a mentor for ruth bader ginsburg, helped her navigate her way when she was first on the court, and she was just very strong, very determined. she was a key vote on that court on major decisions, upholding race-based affirmative action, which has since been recently overturned. upholding roe v. wade, also overturned. campaign finance reform, in an earlier era was overturned. so all of these things that were key issues in states rights decision, she upheld. just trying to think of this last example. which -- oh, gender, i'm sorry, gay marriage, before it became a federal issue, it was a states

rights issue, and she upheld that. she was very social, she was always entertaining, joining a previous all male club, the alfalfa club. she rose to be their president and gave a hilarious speech. i was there in attendance, after she left the court, probably too early, in her mid-70s but left to be the full-time care giver for her husband, john o'connor who was suffering from alzheimer's, which was what according to the family was the cause of her own death, related to dementia or alzheimer's. for many years, she had a full role as board member, as an activist, in favor of civic education, and she's established a foundation or her own work to educate kids. also memorably, her relationship with ruth bader ginsburg was so

important to give ruth bader ginsburg the confidence, and i remember ginsberg, shortly, weeks after her beloved husband, marty, died at an aspen institute event for sandra day o'connor's 80th birthday, she applauded what senator day had done for her, giving her the confidence when she was first assigned by the chief justice to do the first majority opinion in her first year on the court, and she was so nervous and went to her mentor, you know, sandra day o'connor and said what should i do, how will i do this? and she then imitated sandra day o'connor said do it, put 1 foot in front of the other, and do it, get it done, and gave her the confidence to write that first majority opinion, and ruth bader ginsburg became such an important justice by creating coalitions, by influencing others. she became really a leader who could bridge divides and change

votes in conference on the court. she was just -- sandra day o'connor, she grew up on the ranch that she wrote about lovingly in her memoir. she graduated first in her class at stanford, and eventual chief justice rehnquist was in the first class. she was first in her class, couldn't get a job as a lawyer in california, took a job as a law clerk at a receptionist table in a law firm, so she could be close to the law. >> i love the advice and that story, andrea, that you just retold. don't we all need that sometimes? that type of advice, just do it, and the advice that was given to rbg, i know was a close friend of yours, the late justice, the g.o.a.t., as many refer to her as well. and the courage it takes for sandra day o'connor to be the first, to be a first. >> absolutely. >> is unbelievable to even think about, and the path that she has paved for so many women behind

her. andrea mitchell, as always, we are thankful for you. >> thank you. still to come, the cease fire is over, explosions in gaza and a call for another truce. we're live in tel aviv in just 60 seconds. we'll be right back. econds we'll be right back. (christina) with verizon business unlimited, i get 5g, truly unlimited data, and unlimited hotspot data. so, no matter what, i'm running this kitchen. (vo) make the switch. it's your business. it's your verizon. ♪ shelves. shelves smart enough to see, sense, react, restock.

so caramel swirl is always there for the taking. the white house is working hour by hour right now to try and secure a new cease fire in gaza in response to the resumption of fighting. unicef says this, quote, the war on children resumes. hospitals, they're crumbling under the pressure, the gaza health ministry and agency run by hamas saying that major hospitals are out of service and the wounded are lying on the floor of emergency departments. nbc's aaron mclaughlin, as always, it's good to talk to you, seeing more images, destruction, fighting, reemerging in gaza after the pause was ended. what more can you tell us? >> reporter: well, yasmin, today there was an intense bombardment, not only in the northern part of gaza where most

of the fighting had been concentrated in the first phase of this war, but also in southern gaza where neurosurgeon a million gazans have been told to evacuate. a resident on the ground telling nbc news that the bombs were dropping every 10 to 15 minutes. our crews on the ground reported seeing the wounded and the dead being brought to hospitals both in central gaza and southern gaza. the israeli military dropping leaflets over the city of hahn unis, warning residents to evacuate further south. i was on the phone with a spokesperson from the united nations telling us not a single truck of aid entered gaza today, fuel or otherwise, and it's not just gazans who are suffering. there are also the families of 136 hostages that remain in hamas captivity. i was speaking to the uncle of 38-year-old etay.

he was kidnapped, visiting his parents. his parents were killed, he was kidnapped. his uncle calling on the israeli government to do more to secure his freedom. take a listen. >> we expect the government, the israeli government to do whatever it can to save more and more lives, with all costs. we believe that, you know, the israeli nation, the jewish nation was built after the articles, under the main purpose is to save jews' lives, israeli lives, and that's our expectation from the government, to do whatever it can to save lives. >> reporter: and he said that there is one ray of hope for the family. he told me that some of the hostages that came out of gaza reported seeing etay in captivity. it's the first proof of life that family has had in more than

50 days. hamas has refused to allow the red cross to visit any hostages in captivity. yasmin. >> erin mclaughlin, thank you. i want to bring in the former director of the hostage recovery for the united states government, christopher o'leary to talk more about what is happening on the ground in gaza and this continuing israel-hamas conflict. thank you for joining us on this. the last hour i spoke with udi goran. i want to play what he said about the resumption of the war and the worries he has for his cousin's safety. >> today we've heard because of the people that got back, we've heard that at least four more people that were taken to gaza alive are confirmed dead, and that means that every day, including today, including right now when we're talking, my cousin's life is in danger. >> christopher, what do you make of what this resumption of war

means for the 100 plus hostages that are still being held in gaza, for their safety? >> i have real concerns on a number of levels. yes, for their safety, you know, this unbridled urban assault that the u.s. has been trying to sway israel away from, they have gone back to t and frankly it could potentially put the hostages in danger, but also more importantly or as importantly, you know, the two stated goals that israel has to dismantle hamas, and to rescue the hostages, this approach is ineffective at either of those. it's frankly not the approach the united states would take at all. and, you know, i can point back to when general glenn was sent over there early on in the conflict, and people are highlighting the fact that he had experience in fallujah as a marine leader, and he is a terrific marine leader and good

combat leader. more importantly, he's a special operations leader, former head of marine special operations command and the deputy commanding general in iraq during the dismantling of isis. he knows how to do special operations, counter terrorism, and hostage recovery. it's that kind of mentorship that the israelis need to listen to, additionally, the sent com commander has a history of this worked. i worked with him in afghanistan a decade ago. we have the right kind of leaders to help them do this right. the united states has 20 plus years of experience doing this well. unfortunately for the global war on terrorism, and i would hope the israelis would rely on us for mentorship. >> i want to dig in on that a little bit. you're talking about essentially from what i can understand and correct me if i'm wrong, if they want to bring home more hostages safely, aamid the resumption of

this war, they should look at the possibility of targeted strikes, and special ops getting involved and extracting the hostages without additional pause. are you not necessarily confident an additional pause could be negotiated? >> i'm not sure that an additional pause could be negotiated at this point. perhaps it can. but you're negotiating with yahya sinwar, who is the head of hamas and the military wing. he approved the attack on a bus stop yesterday, you know, so part of this negotiating, you know, process is you're dealing with a terrorist organization who has a stated goal of destroying israel, so it's going to be day by day. i would hope we could have another negotiated truce to get the remaining women and children out, and the wounded and, you know, sickly or people who don't have their medication because

there are categories like that. and i do know the administration is pushing towards that, and i know the qataris are, but, you know, the other side has got to be willing to do that, and israel has to exercise some tactical patience and maturity as well. >> christopher o'leary, thank you, appreciate it. we're looking at live pictures, folks, inside the fulton county courthouse where there are new efforts today by former president donald trump's lawyers to quash election charges. what they're now arguing and is the judge going to buy it? that's coming up next. oming up . d it's just walking, right? [dog barks] oh. no it's just a bunny! calm down taco. sit duchess. stop! sesame no no. archie! walter don't, no, ahhhh. ahhhhh! you're lucky you're so cute. only pay for what you need. ♪liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty.♪ (bobby) my store and my design business?

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georgia, former president donald trump's lawyers are making their first court appearance seeking the dismissal on the first amendment. with me now is ken dilanian, and msnbc legal analyst to talk through all of it. i know you have been following what's happening in the courtroom. if you will, walk us through it. >> yeah, there was some interesting arguments made about the first amendment. what was most significant is an exchange that happened between trump's lawyer and the judge over the question of scheduling, when this trial can take place and whether it could take place at all if donald trump is elected president in the fall. i think we have that sound. let's take a listen. >> can you imagine the notion of being republican nominee for president not being able to

campaign for the presidency because he is in some form or fashion in a courtroom defending himself? >> with all do respect to everybody, and i know what the court is attempting to do is to give justice and due process, and i've heard that, and continue to say that, that would be the most effective election interference in the history of the united states. >> so let's just understand what donald trump's lawyer is saying there, and they're going to make this argument in the federal cases too that going forward with a dually prosecuted criminal case against former president trump constitutes election interference, and went on to say, he was asked by the judge, if donald trump is elected president in the fall, what happens to this case in fulton county. he said under current doctrine, i don't think it could go forward and would have to be suspended until donald trump completes his term as president.

that's not fully settled in the law. it remains to be seen whether a sitting president could be prosecuted in a state case like this. seems like it's unlikely. this is high stakes here that goes to all of these criminal cases against former president trump. he's going to argue that he's campaigning for president, and that makes him different and the prosecution is arguing not at all, he's just like any other citizen. what's interesting is the prosecutors in fulton county did not weigh in on the question. they were asked by the judge, what's your opinion about whether the trial can go forward if he's elected president. they didn't weigh in in part because it's a complicated legal question, and they want to make sure they have their ducks in a row before they do. the judge said there will be a lot more debate and talk about that question in the new year. >> what do you make of this defense? ken touched on it a little bit. they're obviously mounting this first amendment defense that we have known about, we have been talking about quite a bit. also the sound ken played there as well, and this idea that that is ultimate election interference if you have someone

campaigning to be the president of the united states, the former president of the united states, once again, campaigning for reelection, that's if he wins nomination, by the way, and what that could do when it comes to election interference, does it have legs? >> i don't think so because the state's position is we indicted this case because we allege, and we believe that we have evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that these criminal defenses occurred in our county. whether they decide to run for elected office, no matter what the elected office is a personal decision and should not impact the state's ability to move forward with those charges. i don't think the court will agree that pursuing an indicted, a case that was indicted by the grand jury, a criminal case is election interference because the person who is indicted chose to run. >> what about this defense of the first amendment right.

this was mounted by chesebro and powell, before of course they pled guilty. the judge does have to view this independently, so important to note that, but do you expect a similar outcome as we saw there? >> well, the argument post in this morning's hearing is a little bit different. the court really didn't reach the issue of whether or not that conduct was, in fact, free speech. such that it was prosecution. what he said was it's not bright. we can't decide these issues pretrial. the attorneys today presented a case or argued to the court that because they're saying as applied, even if you take the facts by the state, you can still decide pretrial whether or not that violates their free speech rights to contest to voice their displeasure, voice their disbelief in the results of the election. so judge mcafee will have to decide whether or not he can request that pretrial.

>> thank you, ken dilanian, keep watching, let us know if anything else happens. thank you. still ahead, an agonizing wait, what the families of those still being held in gaza face as the fighting resumes. someone who has had nine family members kidnapped joins me next. . 'r business. it's your verizon. hi, my name is damion clark. if you have both medicare and medicaid, i have some really encouraging news that you'll definitely want to hear. depending on the plans available in your area, you may be eligible to get extra benefits with a humana medicare advantage dual-eligible special needs plan. all of these plans include a healthy options allowance, a monthly allowance to help pay for eligible groceries, utilities, rent, and over-the-counter items. the healthy options allowance is loaded onto a prepaid card each month. and whatever you don't spend, carries over from each month. other benefits on these plans include

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now that fighting has resumed in gaza, any immediate plans for hostage releases are on hold for the families of 137

people in captivity. it means return to an agonizing limbo, waiting, hoping for a deal to free their loved ones, and those fortunate enough to welcome home, the journey of processing the trauma is only beginning. joining me now is someone experiences both, martin fletcher, former nbc correspondent, bureau chief, eight of martin's family members were taken hostage on october 7th. all but one have been released. martin, as always, it's a pleasure and honor to speak to you. thank you so much, my friend, for joining us on this. i want to talk about what your family is going through, and i'm going to have you put on your reporter hat for a moment, to talk about the reporting coming out of "the new york times" and the revelations there. let's talk first about your family. eight of your family members were taken hostage. all but one have come home. and three members of your family were killed. how are the family members that

were able to make it home, how are they doing? >> trying to deal with it. none of them have spoken to anybody beyond their immediate family. you know, we're hearing about what they went through, what other hostages went through from their family members who have said what they told them. our family specifically, no one has said a word outside of their immediate family about what they experienced. obviously it was so traumatic, they have a lot to deal with and they still want to deal with it privately. >> one is still in gaza. the resumption of fighting has now happened. the pause is no longer. what are your fears, having reported in the region for so long. and having lost three family members as well. what are your fears for this one remaining family member that is still being held. do you know how they are? >> i think it's pretty clear that the moment they -- it's pretty clear that only

negotiations would actually get the prisoners free. the idea the israelis, the calvary is going to come over the hill, and free loads of hostages is unlikely. now that fighting has resumed, we're all feeling really bad. i don't think that the lives of the hostages is going to be the number one priority when israel is fighting a war against hamas. not a good time to be a hostage. there was a lot of hope that the humanitarian pauses could be extended and that more hostages would be released, but then when hamas today failed to provide a list of the ten hostages they would release, israel concluded, okay, time to go back to war, and that's what they have done. so the hostage families are devastated. that's what they are. this is a kind of water torture, if you like. hamas is playing with psychological warfare, drip feeding hostages out. drip feeding information about the remaining hostages. it's like an emotional roller

coaster from hell frankly. >> if i'm hearing you right, are you disagreeing with christopher o'leary who essentially said now they need to be more engaged in targeted strikes or special ops that would go in and extract hostages because it seems as if another pause in fighting is going to be difficult to negotiate. do you think that's not possible? >> i hope it's possible. everybody hopes it's possible. first they need the correct information and intelligence about where they are in the tunnels, mostly by now, probably in the south, maybe some still remaining in the north. yeah, it's going to be a matter of special ops and based on intelligence, but, you know, it's been, what is it now, seven weeks, i believe it is, since october 7th. and the israeli military has actually only managed to go in based on intelligence and with special forces, and rescue one israeli, a female soldier, pretty close to the beginning. so they've only managed to use

military forces and intelligence so far to rescue one person in seven weeks. the odds are not great that they're going to rescue another 117 or whatever it is still remaining. >> you know better than us about the timing of these segments, so we don't have much time. i want you to weigh in on the "new york times" reporting about the possibility and nbc news has not seen these documents that israel had a heads up on the plans hamas had to carry out, but did not think they could do it. >> i was astonished when i read the report, frankly. we knew all the time the israeli people whose job it was to observe day by day, week by week, what hamas was up to. they were reporting on training methods. the idea that israel had information, they must have had terrific intelligence reports to get the plan from hamas, and the idea that the government and military and everybody simply failed to recognize the significance, and believe that actually hamas was not capable

of carrying this out, that is such a major failure by israeli intelligence. by israeli politicians, and probably it's the final nail in the coffin of the prime minister because netanyahu until now has been saying, oh, i didn't know about it. the military and intelligence didn't tell me about it. guess what, they knew the plans. the prime minister must have been privy to those plans obviously, and they all failed to act. a spectacular failure that led to the worst day frankly in the state of israel. >> on the right side of the screen, you're looking at live pictures over gaza, amid-the resumption of the war. as always, thank you. the 2024 battle for the latino vote has officially begun. how one unlikely player in a key battleground state is placing themselves as purveyor of truth. the reporter behind that joins me next. me next.

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we're talking about latino voters. all of that feeds off of this deeply rooted sense of mistrust a lot of latinos carry. the disinformation feeds off this generational trauma. what we found in arizona is all of that is creating this environment where there's a lot of apathy, a lot of disenchantment, mistrust. the question leading into 2024, how can you reinstate that mistrust, and who can do that. and so we found this one radio station, and they're trying to do exactly that. take a look. >>. ♪♪ about to record their morning show, today's theme is mis and disinformation. they will be dispelling themes and narratives that latino voters are exposed to hearing. [ speaking in global language ]

>> with the swing state of arizona up for grabs in the 2024 election, campesina, has emerged as a purveyor of truth amid a landscape filled with misinformation. [ speaking in global language ] the radio station is an effective mobilizer for a community whose relationship with politics has been strained by the past. the station has been a consistent and trusted messenger for decades, ever since it was founded by labor activist, cesar chavez in 1983. it was meant to serve as a voice for the spanish speaking community, including in arizona. this state has been home to some of the country's most anti-immigrant policies from racial profiling, to the papers

in 2020 to senate candidate kari lake who says an invasion is happening at the southern border. the biden campaign has launched spanish language radio ads on campasina, and other stays stations in arizona and nevada. so far, the trump campaign has focused more on the early primary states. they didn't respond to our questions about their plans for arizona. >> misinformation and disillusionment can feed off the deeply rooted mistrust many latinos feel, and that's why radio campasina has connected with its audience in a unique way. it's saturday night in phoenix,

arizona, and we're at this rodeo community event. there's a political strategy. this is their way of building trust with the community. they know the community, and it's through outreach events like this. >> here there are people trying to have fun. they're here for the rodeo, to drink, to be with their families, yet you all on stage were talking about politics and disinformation. was that strategic? >> yes, because, yes, we are here to celebrate, enjoy a day, but this is the way you do it, by registering to get out to vote and understanding that you can not allow any misinformation stop you to vote. >> we were curious, just how deep does that misinformation and mistrust go.

[ speaking in global language ] there's a lot of mistrust in the community, information they're hearing. >> they trust the brand. we have been there next to them at the front line. they need us more than ever. >> with millions of dollars spent courting latino voters, with countless digital initiatives set up to counter the big lie and drive voter turnout, the answer may lie in the trusted messenger and the voice that has always had the ear of the community. so i think the point is, yasmin, there's so many big media

players out there. there's so much dis and misinformation, the point is do not underestimate these small entities, like radio campasina. they have a lot of power. >> so obvious and simple. and fascinating that it was found by cesar chavez. thank you, that was a great piece. a battle not even for second place, the governors of florida and california going at it in a dramatic fox news debate. that's coming up. at's coming up w that bank of america had approved my loan... it was important to me. we not only just provide the financing piece, we do everything that we can to surround them with the right people. all you need is a perfect, amazing team that will guide you through the right steps to be successful. and that's what bank of america was for me. (bobby) my store and my design business? we're exploding. through the right steps to be successful. but my old internet, was not letting me run the show. so, we switched to verizon business internet. they have business grade internet, nationwide.

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trump. she walked out you. >> he should not be running. he is not up to the job, and it is dangerous for this country. >> i will take joe biden in a hundred versus ron desantis any day of the week at any age. >> nbc's dasha burns following all of this for us. my gosh, was it a debate. and only one of them was running for president of the united states. and then there was the tail end of the debate that ended quite abruptly. what happened? >> reporter: well, look, the candidates were apparently having so much fun battling it out that they decided they wanted to keep the debate going even longer than planned. for the end of the debate, newsom said that he was happy to keep going. hannity said he had more questions and time, and they agreed to extend the debate. but then when they came back from break, there were no candidates. hannity said that they had other commitments and the whole thing

ended pretty awkwardly. now, turns out that off screen, things were not so jolly. there were a lot of arguments about rule break, and we learned from multiple sources in the desantis campaign and one source that was unaffiliated with the campaign that newsom's wife ended the debate on behalf of her husband coming into the room, and saying we are done. the newsom campaign denies that that happened, and the newsom team is accusing the desantis campaign of breaking multiple rules, including talking to his wife multiple times. they also accused fox of putting a teleprompter in the line of sight of desantis to where he could see the questions that hannity was going to ask. fox news denies both of those allegations. so a whole lot of mess behind the scenes there, yasmin.

now, in terms of why this debate was happening at all, given that one of the candidates isn't running, one of the debaters isn't running, take a listen to what we heard from both of the debaters after the debate. take a listen. >> i'm in a race where one candidate gets a disproportionate amount of media coverage, and so i have to be able to get my message out. to have 90 minutes on national tv where i'm able to go and box somebody who's on the far left, that is good exposure for me. >> why do you think governor desantis agreed to debate you? >> i think these are last gasps. >> are you laying the ground for 2028? >> i was trying to make the case for 2024 and joe biden. >> newsom there saying it's the last gasp of ron desantis. we will see, and we will be watching. it was quite a night