that is a national figure. that doubles, triples, even quadruples depending upon what city, what township she lives in. the disparities in health care and the harms in health care are still racialized and always straddle socioeconomic status are important that we talk about and that we never lose sight of that. >> thank you to both of you. i appreciate this. leslie reagan is the university of illinois professor of histy, medicine, gender, and women studies and author of what abortion was a crime and dangerous pregnancies. michelle goodwin is a georgetown law professor and constitutional law and global health policy and author of policing the womb. still ahead, less than one month until the 2024 primary season officially kicks off and the republican party's front runner schedule is jammed with court dates. how donald trump's team plans to deal with candidates and with legal conflicts. plus, white house and senate negotiators are working through the weekend to try to hammer out a deal to pass a massive national security package which includes military aid to

ukraine and israel. republicans are blocking the bill until they get concessions on border security and immigration. we will get the latest from the hill, plus 2023 was the hottest year in 125,000 years. it seems like a good time to convene a nearly 200 world leaders and thousands of representatives of global industry to work on climate change. i am going to be joined by the legendary bill mckibben to talk about what actually gotten at this year's massive u.n. climate conference. another hour of velshi begins now. ence another hour of velshi begin now. >> reporter: good, morning it's not a december 17th. i'm ali velshi. we are now less than one month away from the start of the 2024 primary season, which kicks off on january 15th. with the first-in-the-nation gop caucuses in iowa. january is going to be a busy month, in addition to iowa, new hampshire will also hold its primary, plus there are three republican debates currently scheduled to take place during the month, and on top of all of that, donald trump's civil trial in yorks going to

come to a close just as e. jean carroll's second lawsuit against him gets ing. trump's criminal trials will not begin until later in the year, but according to politico, his campaign is already confronting the scheduling nightmare ahead of them as trump's legal obligations start to clash with his political ambitions. trump's team plans to front load his schedule in 2024, to get him out on the campaign trail frequently, early in the year, in anticipation that is numerous legal cases could disrupt their plans later on. it is a sound strategy, especially considering that trump's criminal proceedings, the first prosecution of a former president in american history, involve some complex legal questions that the justice system has never before had to consider. and there is a possibility the trump legal counsel can and shift as these questions are brought up. a prime example of this is playing out right now, as the trump's court argument considers that they are immune for prosecution for actions committed while president, and for which he was impeached by the house of representatives,

but not convicted by the senate. judge tanya chutkan, who is handling the federal election case in d.c. ruled against trump earlier on that issue this month. saying, quote, the court cannot conclude that our constitution quotes former presidents with absentee unity for any federal crimes they committed while in office, and quote. trump quickly appealed to the d.c. court of appeals, which agreed to take it up on an expedited basis, and because the court of appeals agreed to do so, chutkan acknowledge that the court of appeals now has jurisdiction over the case. which means that chutkan has to pause her proceedings until the court of appeals hands down its decision on this one specifically, the question regarding immunity. all that really means is that the pretrial motions, and the deadlines in chutkan's case are, at the moment, irrelevant. they will be re-once the issue is resolved. but this is not a setback for the prosecution. it does not necessarily mean the trial will be delayed. chutkan herself left the door open to keeping the original

march 4th start date for the trial. at the same time, a special prosecutor jack smith is trying to bypass the appeals process altogether to keep that case moving. he went straight to the supreme court. heasked the justices not to wait for the court of appeals to offer its opinions as would normally be the case. as smith wrote in his filing, quote, the united states recognizes that this is an extraordinary request. this is an extraordinary case, and quote. it is an extraordinary request, but not unprecedented. the supreme court has previously made exceptions, and moved swiftly to resolve issues like the contested presidential election in 2000. smith is asking the court to recognize the paramount importance of this issue. and resolve as soon as possible, because it could have big implications for his case, it's a clever move on his part as well, because it could prevent trump from having further delays down the line. the justices have indicated that they could decide a soon as this week whether or not to take the matter up. they've order trump's lawyers to submit their response to the court by this wednesday,

december the 20th. so it could be a big week ahead. it could have big implications for some of trump's criminal cases. i am joined now by ryan reilly, justice reporter for nbc news and offer of the book's addition of how january 6th broke the justice system. also with, as for united states of tony barbara mcquade. she is co-host of the #sistersinlaw podcast, an msnbc legal analyst. good morning to both of you. barbara, let me ask you about the jack smith issue. the d.c. court of appeals is considering this issue of immunity, and i think they say they want all of their information. they may make decisions around the beginning of january. the supreme court has asked for submissions from the trump side by wednesday. and then they will decide whether to take up the issue. so there are two parallel things going on. what happens if the supreme court says, trump is right, he is immune? >> if trump is immune, then

this case is over. i think that is an unlikely possibility, but it is a possibility. the possibility is that when you are the president, anything you do it within the scope of your duties's president is protected from criminal liability. but with the lower courts have held here before is that, when he was calling brad raffensperger, and when he had people trying to submit fake electors, he was not acting as president. he was acting as a candidate for president. and those are two different things. so i suspected, ultimately, on the merits that's what we will get. if you say, in the meantime, it could bring a significant delay in the trial. >> reporter: let me ask you this. if the issues that he's immune because he was president, or he's immune because he was impeached, but not convicted? >> well, those are both issues. those are both issues before the court, that someone who was impeached, but not convicted is subject to double jeopardy. and that is not permissible.

that is my issue. i think that is probably the weakest of the two. the immunity question is a significant legal issue. but i think, if you look at the facts, that he was acting as a candidate, not within the scope of his duties as president. by the, way which does not include the administration of elections. some people are confused about that. that is a matter solely reserved in the constitution for the states to administer. so that is the strongest basis for saying that he is not immune from suit, and the case should go forward, once they get to decide this issue on the merits. >> reporter: ryan riley, there was donald trump's civil fraud case that was still in the news this week. there was rudy giuliani's case, there was, this the jack smith case. so there is one that has been might entirely missed here, in last, week the supreme court announced that it will take up consideration of a case that could've a big impact on the january six other cases. the people you've been covering for the last couple of years. this involves january six defendants who are challenging the scope and the breadth of

the law that was used to charge them, particularly with obstructing an official proceeding. there's been 300 people charged so far. tell me about this one? >> i think we're still trying to figure the scope. because there are three cases that the supreme court could've taken up in this obstruction of justice card. and it really took up one of them, which involved a man named joseph fischer. and he's a former police officer, he was a police officer at the time of january 6th, in pennsylvania, who took part in this attack, and brought this all the way up to the supreme court. there is another defendant, jacob lang, who was also attached to this. but he did not choose to pick up that case. but it could have this cascading impact on all of these january six cases. because there are a lot of defendants who have been depleted guilty or found guilty of that charge, more than 300 of them in fact. it also involves the statute, the same statutes that are being used against donald trump. so there really could be some major impact because of this.

it has the potential to impact the clock management. and the timing is essential with the jack smith case, as well as all these other cases. and it has the ability to potentially delay it, although probably the other case is the more likely immunity question, the one that could impact it in the short term. ultimately, seeing if that trial date still holds, theoretically, it could be march, but with all of these issues coming up, it seems more and more likely that that could get delayed, a little bit. >> reporter: barbara, as ryan, said donald trump has also been charged with obstruction of an official proceeding in jack smith's election interference case. jac >> reporter: the same charge that some 300 other people have faced. given the supreme court is considering this, among other things, that the supreme court is dealing with, in the jacks mitt petition. if there's overlap, the supreme court's decision on the other january six defendants that ryan is talking about, the 300 of them, have an impact on the jack smith case against donald

trump? >> i think it could. as you say, two of the four counts involve this particular statute. and i'm actually a little worried about the outcome on this one. the immunity, not at all. this one i am. the fact that the court took it up says that it should take on a very narrow reading of the statute, which is amid the roberts court has done, time and time again in the kind of statutes that are used in corruption cases. so jack smith has to think about what he wants to do. he could dismiss the two counts, focus on the other two, conspiracy to defraud the united states, and violation of voting rights, that would be a safe way to go. could proceed to trial. but there is some risk, that even if the other two counts are used for conviction, that there could be an argument on appeal that these other two counts brought in some tainted evidence that influence the outcome of those. so if you get a conviction at trial, and a reversal on appeal. or, you can wait to see how this case plays out, and delay the trial until there is a known answer to those questions,

you could make a more informed decision. none of those options is great. so i think he's going have to make a decision going forward about how he games out with the supreme court is likely to do their. >> reporter: ryan, the coverage you've given to the january 6th rally, the trials, straddles the line between political and the goal. last night, donald trump got a rally, and then on truth social, he repeated what he said at the rally. it is his anti-immigration propaganda line, in which he says, illegal immigration is poisoning the blood of our nation. they are coming from prisons, from mental institutions, from all over the world, without borders, and fair election. you don't have a country. make america great again. one may find that just not nice, there is actually roots in the mix words that adolf hitler used to use before the holocaust. specifically in reference to choose. but donald trump is increasingly, with all of these rallies, riling people up with

more and more inflammatory, anti immigration rhetoric. but it is of a sort. >> yeah. it's import to recognize the importance of these january six defendants, for example. and it's interesting to see rudy giuliani this week, you know, continuing to support these lies that he told about these election workers. he appears to still deeply believe these things that he was spreading back in 2020. and a lot of people are right there with him. a lot of people still are sucked into these conspiracy theories. i see it layup, time, and time again. he has impacted cases as well. some of these bizarre conspiracies that are now going over on the hill. there is a member of congress who brought up the idea of ghost busts, as he called. basically saying that he believes the fbi loaded up people into buses, and infiltrated the mob on january 6th. really bizarre things. and then barrel -- judge beryl hall had to deal this issue in court, because some of these far-right

officials was bringing this, and one of discovery from the fbi about this made-up conspiracy theory, about ghost buses. it's sort of ridiculous. and, she said, you know. we're gonna stick to the facts in my court. and that is where we are going to go down here. we will not go down under these sort of rabbit holes, as she called them. and that is what we have right now. just a justice system that is trying to hold the line on truth, and reality, when the political world is really sometimes seeming like it's on a different planet. >> reporter: barbara, i want to ask you about various criminal trials with donald trump. in the event that jack smith doesn't get his way, and the supreme court does rule that for instance, the obstruction of a proceeding is not something that you can move forward with, how does it affect the other trials? the mar-a-lago documents case is about things that happened, subsequent to his presidency, the manhattan case is about things that happened prior to his presidency. >> reporter: what about the

georgia case? does that get affected by what the supreme court does or does not do? >> yes. i think it does. so you would have to raise it, again, in georgia. but i think is the same thing. if a president is immune from criminal charges that are federal, he is also immune from state criminal charges. so i think that case would go away as well. but as you say, the mar-a-lago case which relates to post presidency conduct, and the hush money case, which relates to pre-presidency conduct, would still survive, even if there is that finding. >> reporter:. thanks to both of you. great to talk to both this morning. nbc's ryan riley and barbara mcquade, for me that states attorney in michigan. coming up, we look at the very latest from capitol hill, where white house and senate negotiators are working through the weekend to try to hammer out a deal to pass a massive national security package that includes military aid to ukraine and israel. then, how yemen's houthi rebels could not only escalate the israel-hamas war, but disrupt global shipping traffic as well. plus, the world's largest climate forum hosted by the ceo

of an oil company, in one of the largest petro states on the planet. this sounds like it could be a major conflict of interest, yeah, you're right. a crucial bit of progress to come out of the meeting. i will explain it, ahead. i will explain it, ahead.

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advocates, spending lawmakers, who i'm told met with the white house yesterday. they made those frustrations known, ali. there are fears that the white house, the democrats, are getting ready to jam. them getting ready to sign off on a deal that would be unimaginably cruel. that is their words. the words of the hispanic leader, for example, in the net bargain, who said that this proposal would be untenable for her members to accept. that said, though the white house and democrats certainly know that it is house republicans that need to move towards. and they, are by all accounts. but still, it is not clear if they can get to a place where they have a framework before the senate comes back into town to vote on this. >> reporter: and i guess republicans understand that this is the leverage they have, in other, words the discussion,

which a lot, of both democrats and russia, ukraine experts have had. is that these two things should not be linked. immigration is an important matter, border security is an important matter. but they should just be discussed separately, from ukraine funding. that is a nonstarter, separate in these matters? >> reporter: absolutely a nonstarter. in republican support to the original supplemental funding request that came from this white house. they themselves have kind of leaned these issues by including funds for border security with that national security aid to ukraine, to israel, to gaza. all of these, needs of, course the administration says, for example, ukraine needs by the end of the year. the problem is, though for example, lindsey graham, who i noticed talk to our kristen welker on meet the press. he just told me this week that he thinks that the border is a bigger issue, and more urgent need than ukraine's. you really can't find republicans in the senate who are more forthcoming about the need to continue funding, and supporting our ally, ukraine, then lindsey graham, and maybe mitch mcconnell. but for lindsey graham to say, that and say that there is no

rush to getting this done now, they can wait until january, something i'm sure the white house is paying attention to. >> reporter: i'm sure, i, hope that they are right about that, given the strategic situation on the ground in ukraine. julie, thank you very, much as always. julie tsirkin, forest capitol hill. still ahead, the brutal war between israel and hamas is not yet effective neutral countries in the region. but with intensifying attacks from yemen, houthi rebels, that could all change. running this kitchen. (vo) make the switch. it's your business. it's your verizon.

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maritime campaign is carried out in solidarity with the people of gaza, and that the strikes are directed at israeli vessels, or those on route to its ports. a strategy aimed at increasing the economic costs of israel's war in gaza. while other rebel militias in lebanon and iraq have engaged in limited confrontations with israel, yemen's houthi's have opened up a maritime front stretching from the red sea to the indian ocean. an area that has become the site of near daily attacks. israel's war against hamas, claiming the lives of more than 18,700 people in gaza, has not significantly affected neutral countries, but analysts warn that that could rapidly change with the intensifying who the assault on global commerce. the effect that shipping route, seen here, is known as the bab-el-mandeb, meaning gate of tears. it is circle towards the bottom of the, map near the houthi controlled area of yemen. it connects european ports to their asian counterparts via the suez canal, which is up north, near israel, in the mediterranean sea.

it facilitates 40% of international trade, including the daily passage of 8.8 million barrels of oil, according to the u.s. energy information administration, meaning that any disruptions here become a global problem. just yesterday, the houthis fired over one dozen drones toward israel, they were all intercepted by a u.s. warship. until late last week, the attacks had caused minimal damage, with israeli u.s., french, and saudi air defense systems successfully intercepting most of the strikes. but the intensifying attacks have begun to pose a serious threat to global commerce, and the oil markets, prompting major shipping companies to suspend operations in the area. on saturday, the world's largest shipping group, mediterranean shipping company, known as msc, announced that it is diverting ships away from the red sea because of an increased threat of attacks. and missy joins three other shipping giants that announced that they were suspending journeys along this route. collectively, these ur companies ranked among the top

five globally, and experts warn that this decision will be costly for the global economy. and sharon's costs for ships passing through the area have also spiked in recent days, reaching tens of thousands of dollars for larger vessels like oil tankers, according to industry reports, and all of this adds urgency to defense secretary lloyd austin's planned visit to the middle east next week, which is part of an event and an effort to prevent spillover from the israeli conflict. meanwhile, the u.s. has beefed up its presence in the area, deploying three additional warships to the mediterranean sea, according to politico. the u.s. is also putting together a maritime coalition to safeguard vessels in the red sea. additionally, the u.s. has engaged in back channel mediation efforts, led by oman, that is according to two u.s. officials who spoke with axios. however, these efforts have failed to deter the houthis, who saturday, stated on x, quote, yemen's position with gaza is not subject to negotiation, it is really ships are those heading to its ports

will remain vulnerable to targeting until the aggression stops. the siege on gaza is lifted, and humanitarian aid continues to flow into the strip. any real steps that address the humanitarian situation by bringing in food, and medicine, would contribute to reducing the escalation, and quote. nbc's ali, resisting, buy in cairo. he is going to help us dig into the houthi developments, and what they mean, after the next break. r the next break. break. whenever you're hungry, there's a deal on the subway app. buy one footlong, get one 50% off in the subway app today. now that's a deal worth celebrating. man, what are you doing?! get it before it's gone on the subway app. ♪♪ >> reporter: joining me now

from cairo, is nbc news correspondent, ali arouzi. alia, tried to sort of give everybody that update on what is happening in the red sea. out of yemen, with the houthis, as it relates to the israel gaza war. but there is a lot of background here that i think people need to explain, why are they involved in this? what are the potential upside's for the houthis, or the downsides for this war? >> well, i think, part of the houthis, i mean, the houthis state that they are supporting palestine. that they are one of palestine's backers, and one of the reasons for that is because palestine's biggest backer is iran. and iran is the patron of all of these a proxies in the region. the so-called, access of resistance. they provide an awful lot of funding, military equipment, training, and political backing to hezbollah, to hummus, to the

acid government, in syria. and the houthis in yemen. now the houthis are probably the loosest string of all of these access, but they still answer to iran. they make a lot of their own domestic decisions within yemen, but when it comes to international operations, they take their direction from tehran. and that is because tehran gives them all of their money, their backing, their funding. and tehran expects whoever gets all of this money and funding from them to take a page from their handbook, to launch attacks, to disrupt shipping lines when iran gifts the objective, because it suits iran's purposes in the region. look,, aly one thing to bear in mind is that iran has shown an uncanny ability to change course of middle eastern, north african politics, when it suits it's political or financial means. they can ratchet up tension, and bring it right back down at

will. they can do all of this without getting their own hands dirty. without bringing the fight onto iranian soil. they do this by bringing their proxies, who are all sort of ideologically aligned with each other, in one way, or another. and the houthis are, very, very important part of that. let us not forget when iran was having serious tensions with saudi arabia, it was the houthis that we're launching attacks into saudi arabia, in 2019, where tensions were at an all-time high between iran and saudi arabia. the houthis started attacking the aramco oil fields, and that direction was in all probability, given by iran. iran has warned, throughout this conflict, about red lines being crossed. about israel launching attacks into gaza. that this war could spread. and, as they increased those threats, you see the houthis have been launching more and more attacks. they have been doing it since the beginning of this war, but

in recent days and weeks, they've seriously ratcheted up hostilities as this part from tehran also gets a lot higher. they have escalated maritime tensions. warning of almost daily attacks in vital waterways, to pressure israel, to pressure the united states. and despite threats of attacks against them, by the u.s., and by israel, they say they are in a very strong defensive position to retaliate against any attacks on them, and part of that is because they've been very well armed, and very well funded by iran. they also say that they are not going to abandon the palestinian calls, regardless of western threats. and they can say that with a degree of confidence, because they know that iran has their back. there are attacks and disruption in the region is having tangible effect on commerce, as you mentioned. and that also works to iran's favor. several of the world's largest shipping companies have suspended vessel passage in the region. they now no longer pass through

the bob almond of straight, which is hugely significant. 17,000 ships passed through their, and 10% of global trade, every, single day throughout that waterway. it is a major shipping line, other major shipping companies have suspended routes to the red sea, and now go through the cape of good hope, in south africa, to avoid the red sea. this has a significant impact on insurance costs, and availability of all sorts of goods. and this helps iran. this helps iran hurt israel. the houthi signals continue this course of action, in preventing ships from reaching israeli ports, until food and medicine gets into gaza. that seriously sounds like a directive from iran. keep applying pressure there until we get our way, until we get what we need into gaza. so all of these accesses are working hand in hand, with iran, to make sure that all of the pressure remains on israel, remains on the united states, without bringing the fight to

iran. as you and i have spoken, ali, about this before. the biggest winner in this conflict has been iran, because they have been able to manipulate all of their proxies to do what they need, at the time they need. and it has really worked out in their favor. iran is probably one of the only places involved in the conflict, that has not had to pay a price for this war. because of their proxies, they put on the front line, whether it is the pressure of israel, whether it's to attack u.s. forces, in the region, whether it's to ratchet up tensions. to change oil prices. they have finally tuned the pressure in the region. >> reporter: and america has implied, it is not looking for direct confrontation with iran, iran has implied's not looking for direct confrontation. but netanyahu has told the united states, if you don't deal with the yemenis, with the houthis, we will, militarily. how bad could this get? w bad co >> look.

from what we can tell, right now, ali. the u.s. seems, even though they've issued threats, they seem reluctant to attack the houthis. because they are worried about widening this conflict, and iran getting directly involved. i don't think that is a real possibility. but that is the thinking in washington, right now. if you hit the houthis hard, then that's gonna aggravate the iranians, and it will bring them into the fray. that's obviously a major calculation, at this point. but the other things that they're thinking right now is forming an international group of maritime warships, and vessels, to protect that waterway, to protect the passage of oil, foods, goods, medicine. and if those were attacked. then iran would then definitely be involved, and that is something they probably don't want to do. >> reporter: an important gushing gonna have to have several more times, ali, thank you so much, as always. nbc's ali arouzi for us in cairo. still ahead, climate change

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united nations climate conference known as cop 28, came to a, close after two weeks, i hardly need to say. this climate change threatens every corner of the globe. 2023 was the hottest year in 125,000 years, and the last time the earth was this hot, 125,000 years ago, sea levels were 20 to 33 feet higher than they are today, according to geological records. we are seeing stronger storms, rapidly melting ice caps, rising seas, crop failures, flood, drought, wildfire, it's all happening at an accelerated pace. it should be a global priority, which is why the prospect of coordination, collaboration, and cooperation, among nearly 212 leaders, and thousands of

representatives from virtually every major industry, sounds very exciting. unfortunately, cop28 was not all it was cracked up to be. from the start, it was difficult to take this conference seriously, it was hosted b the united arab emirates one of the largest oil producers on the planet. it was led by none other than this guy the, ceo, of the, emerati oil company. there were literally thousands of lobbyists from fossil fuel industries and from other major polluters, like the dairy and cattle industries. after two weeks of meetings, and negotiations, cop28 concluded with the new international agreement, this one, called the uae consensus, in the final agreement leaves a lot to be desired. critics have called it, the floor, marked by loopholes, and even a stab in the back. but there is one little piece of this agreement that stands out. it's buried in section two, part a, 0.28 dasha d.. and it says that nations must commit to, quote, transitioning away from fossil fuels and

energy systems, in adjust, orderly, and equitable manner, and quote. environmentalists bill mckibben highlighted that specific sentence, he says that transitioning away from fossil fuels, quote, may not seem like much, it, is after all, the single most obvious thing one could possibly say about climate change. akin to, in an effort to reduce my headache, i'm transitioning away from hitting myself in the forehead with a hammer, and quote, but he continues, the world's nations are now publicly agreeing that they need to transition off fossil fuels, and that sentence will hang over every discussion from now on, especially the discussions about any further expansion of fossil fuel energy. and so, with the spotlight shining on the new the agreed upon global imperative that we transition away from fossil fuel, the first real test from the united states is also already upon us. the biden admistration appears poised to approve a massive foss fl project in louisiana, the project, called c p to, for short, is a liquefied natural gas terminal.

and while natural gas is touted as the cleaner fossil fuel, when compared to particularly dirty fuels like coal, researchers at cornell have found that projects like cp to end up admitting even more greenhouse gases than burning coal. earlier this month more, 300 organizations from 40 countries said president biden a letter asking him to halt the cp to project. and now, some democrats are putting pressure on the biden administration to follow through with that fellow stated goal of moving away from fossil fuels. biden has not yet commented on whether the project will move forward or not. meanwhile, there is no ambiguity as to what will happen to these fossil fuel phase out dreams, if donald trump is reelected. he recently expressed his hope to be dictator for a day, if only on day one, of a hypothetical second term, with one of his top two priorities being, quote, drill, drill, drill. his words. scientists have been clear about the impact of greenhouse gases, and the need to stop brain fossil fuel for decades.

environmentalists, activists, and author, bill mckibben, has been writing about this for decades. he joins me, next. t. t. to a child, this is what conflict looks like. children in ukraine are caught in the crossfire of war, forced to flee their homes. a steady stream of refugees has been coming across all day. it's bitterly cold. lacking clean water and sanitation. exposed to injury, hunger. exhausted and shell shocked from what they've been through. every dollar you give can help bring a meal, a blanket, or simply hope to a child living in conflict. please call or go online to givenowtosave.org today with your gift of $10 a month, that's just $0.33 a day.

we cannot forget the children in places like syria, born in refugee camps, playing in refugee camps, thinking of the camps as home. please call or go online to givenowtosave.org today. with your gift of $10 a month, your gift can help children like ara in afghanistan, where nearly 20 years of conflict have forced the people into extreme poverty weakened and unable to hold herself up, ara was brought to a save the children's center, where she was diagnosed and treated for severe malnutrition. every dollar helps. please call or go online to givenowtosave.org today. with your gift of $10 a month, just $0.33 a day. and thanks to special government grants that are available now, every dollar you give can multiply up to ten times the impact. and when you use your credit card, you'll receive this special save the children tote bag to show

you won't forget the children who are living their lives in conflict. every war is a war against children. please give now. >> reporter: joining me now is

bill mckibben. one of the world's leading experts, a hero, really, i would say, on the issue of climate change. he's the founder of 3:50 dot org, an international environmental organization aims to end the use of fossil fuels as a contributing writer for the new yorker.

bill, great to see you again, thank you for being with us. >> what a pleasure to be with you, friend. >> reporter: one of the previous u.n. conferences, cop 21, the numbering is a little weird. we got the paris agreement. they signed a pledge to limit the planets warming to 1.5 degrees above pre-industrialized levels, scientists agreed that it is a threshold which we might avoid the worst impacts of climate change. now, if you look at the actual global temperature data, and modeling, many people believe we are crossing that limit somewhat regularly, this year, the plan actually passed two degrees above pre-industrial levels. tell me about the goal itself, and whether that is right, and what surpassing it does for peoples motivation. >> the goal itself might as well be just stated as, trying to keep the temperature from going up as much as we can, we are probably going to go past 1.5 degrees, we've already gone past for weeks, and months at a

time. and we've gone past as you say, to degrees celsius for days at a time, and we've seen the effect, as if massive wildfires in canada you know flooding out here in vermont, where i live like, we've never seen before, but in 1000 other places around the planet could jet stream, and the gulf stream faltering and flickering. we are doing serious, serious damage now. the only good news is that 2023 also saw a remarkable moment in the transition to renewable energy, by mid summer, when those high temperatures were coming, we also were having days when the planet installed a gigawatts worth of solar panels, i.e. about a nuclear power plants worth of solar panels every day. half of china, but that still leaves a lot in the rest of the planet. so the race is very much on, and, if we are going to win that race, then the we cannot afford any more backsliding, which is precisely what this massive build out of liquefied

national natural gas from the gulf is about. >> reporter: these agreements, things that cop 28, they have no enforcement mechanism. none of these things have an enforcement mechanism. so what do they do, and who is the best source of accountability. who can hold governments accountability. is it just us is a voters in every country? >> you and me. if we're going to take this language, and make it mean anything, it is only going to be because we are able, through civil society, and depressed to, hold people to account. so, down on the golf, remarkable people, for the last two or three years, head of a scene, james higher, jobs beard, -- a real list of real heroes have been busily documenting what is going on with this massive build out of lng. and now, scientists and policy analysts are crunching the numbers. if we continue down this path, and industry gets everything that it is proposed, and so far,

they've gotten every permit they've asked for, then, within ten years, american exported lng will be producing more greenhouse gases and everything that happens on the continent of europe. we do not need another contents worth of greenhouse gases. it is the last thing we need. the good news is that, that means that joe biden, who already has a legitimate claim to having done more to boost clean energy nativity else, cam, by pausing this permit process, make a pretty legit claim that he's done more to head off this wave of journey energy then in a president for you. he can't actually stop any of these projects, including this agree just cp through -- two thing, all by himself. that would be illegal. what he can do is tell the department of energy to go back to the drawing board, and revamp the criteria by which they find these licenses to be in the public entrance.

right now, department of energy is using numbers and analysis from 2014. 2014, renewable energy, cost 90% more than it does now, and in 2014, the plan it was a degree fahrenheit lower in temperature than it is now. those numbers, that analysis, is so outdated, and so archaic, that the d.o.e. should be ashamed of itself for giving biden those kind of analyses to work with. he tends to be a real hero here, and in the process, recoup some of the support he lost when he did things like, prove these giant willow oil complexes. especially because, when we are exporting the stuff around the world. one of the other effects is not just to drive up the temperature it is to drive up the price for americans who still depend on natural gas for heating, and cooking, this would be a real inflation reduction act, if he did something about this.

>> reporter: let's talk about this. in this country around the world, young people have been a catalyst for some of this change but i want to put up a poll that indicates that i fact this is done by the boston based environment voter project. people aged 65 and older are actually second only to tho between the age of 18 and 34 in naming climate and the environment as their highest potical priorities. in places like new mexico, more than a third of voters over 65 prioritize climate. colorado, more than a quarter of voters over 65 provided and prioritized climate in pennsylvania, where biden won by 1.2%. climate voters over 65 are 5% of the electorate, so this is a broad base there is broad based appeal to dealing with climate. it might not be everybody's number one issue, but it's many people's number one issue, for many people it's at least close to number one. >> well, those numbers did surprise me at all.

for in fact, we spent the last two years organizing people over the age of 60, people like me for work on climate and democracy. and the response has been unbelievable. we've got chapters now in pretty much every state in the country. people just flooding in doing this work. young people care about climate change because they're staring down the barrel of a gun. they know what's coming in the lifetimes. those of us who are little nearer to the exit than the entrance care about it because we don't want to leave behind a planet worse than when we were born on into. that's the most bottom of bottom lines. >> there are those of you, those like you, who have been doing this since you are that young. age now you are in our category. thanks as always for everything you have done for the planet for being with us today. bill is a contributing writer at the new yorker, -- that is for me, stay where you are inside with jen psaki begins right now. psak begins right now >>